Our childminder's aggressive kids seem to be rubbing off on our daughter

[shinyshilling]

Our dd is no saint, but she is an easy going generally well mannered kid. She has always gone to the same childminder who has a son who shows signs of Aspergers (no prejudice here...I work with kids with learning disabilities) but he has demanding behaviour. She said once that she would tell us about him one day, but never did and we have never asked. She also has a 5yr old daughter who currently seems to be showing much the same behaviour and is getting increasingly more violent towards our DD. I know kids are kids and our DD is 2 and probably going through all sorts of learning curves, but I'm a bit worried about the affect the CM's kids are having on our DD.

We have just been away on holiday for 3 weeks and at the beginning of the holiday DD was sharp, rude and lashed out with a hit if she didn't want to do something which is very clearly not the way we deal with things. Over the 3 weeks this behaviour diminished. This makes us think it is clearly learned behaviour.

Today was her first day back, and when I collected her the CM's DD was seemingly irritated with our DD for what appeared to be very petty things and on a number of occassions slapped her. After a number of hits our DD slapped her back for which I 'spoke to her firmly and explained that that was not kind behaviour' I made her appologise, which she did. I would like the CM to intervene a bit more and ask her DD not to hit our DD. On one occassion I shielded a slap and it hurt me, so would probably hurt a 2 yr old.

The CM seems very passive about this kind of thing. Her son slams glass doors and I hold my breath every time it happens. I don't want to seem as though I am being over protective or just taking the side of my own DD, but I feel that I want to address this behaviour as I think it could be threatening to one so small. I don't want to have to take her away, as we are happy in general with the CM, but I don't like this aggressive behaviour or the lack or addressing it. Does anyone have any advice or suggestions please?

[andiem]

I think you need to be very frank and discuss it with the cm
there is no point in beating about the bush you need to explain the effect it is having on your dd and see if you can come up with some strategies for managing it together it's a toughy if it was me I would probably do this and monitor it for a month if there was no improvement I would look for other childcare

[LittleBella]

I would get a different childminder.

If she doesn't realise this is a problem, then frankly she's not very good at her job. I know you say you're happy with her in ohter ways, but tbh this is such a major thing that if it were me, it would outweigh whatever I was happy with. For whatever reason, whether it's because she's under a lot of stress, not getting good support, or whatever, she's not dealing effectively with this very rough sometimes violent behaviour and while I would feel sorry for her on a personal level, I wouldn't want to leave my DC's in her care. But I am a bit ruthless about things like this, you sound very tolerant.

[Miaou]

I'm sorry but I would remove her. She is undoubtedly learning the behaviour from the other children and it's a lot to expect her, at the age of 2, to know what's acceptable and what isn't if there is no reinforcing adult (ie, the CM) on hand.

There is a woman who goes to the same playgroup as I go to; she is a childminder but only has one child, for a couple of hours a week. Having seen the behaviour her ds exhibits (and gets away with) I am not surprised (in which I include hitting, spitting, swearing and shouting, and no he doesn't have SN!).

[ElenorRigby]

Im with littlebella, Id find alternative care for your DD. Regardless of not wanting a child around kids like that, quite frankly I would not my DD cared for by someone who has raised badly behaved kids, it shows a want for their care imo.

[KaySamuels]

I am a childminder and I agree with everyone else who has posted.

If you like your cm you could have an honest talk and tell her your concerns, but TBH if she isn't bothered by this behaviour I can't see that changing. There are lots of childminders with gentle kids who manage negative behaviur and wouldn't let a 2 yr old be repeatedly slapped in front of her mother!

[avenanap]

I would also find a different childminder. Being tolerant of her childrens needs is one thing, having your child hit by one of her children is another. Physical abuse should never be tolerated, even if it is the act of a child. Your daughter is impresionable. You need to take the side of her, you are her mother. You need to be protective here. As much as you may like the childminder her children are harming your child. Their behaviour will not improve without the correct professional support, I think that the CM will need help with this and it will not be a quick process. You owe it to your daughter to find her somewhere safe. Sorry for being blunt.

[shinyshilling]

Thanks - at least you've made me feel as though I'm not being over protective. I do think 2 is a vulnerable age and it's not right to expect a child of that age to know what is apppropriate behaviour.

The CM's DS is always off school with various ailments and our DD said on holiday "I don't really feel well Mummy. I might have to go home at break". We were quite shocked, but she must have picked this repeated behaviour up.

Although the CM is quite passive and non-emotional, we have really been pleased with the way she looks after our daughter. She does good stuff with her and DD clearly likes going otherwise. I wouldn't really want to take her away if at all possible, but I certainly don't want her to grow up in the middle of shouting, slamming doors and slapping. Thanks for your help.

[CallSignCharlie]

I'm with littlebella, you should change childminder. Any loyalty felt towards the cm is misplaced as keeping your dd there is doing her no good at all. I would be ruthless too.

[ElenorRigby]

Just to add, my partner has a 5yo DD from a previous relationship. She lives with her mum and dad. When she is here is sweet as anything and mostly well behaved.
Our DD is 8 months old, her big sister would never ever hurt her or slap other children. She is a caring child becuase that is what she has been taught.

[NotABanana]

I wouldn't talk to the CM. I would be removing my DD straight away tbh.

[lucyellensmum]

i agree, change childminders, not only would i do this due to the hitting etc, but your DD is clearly not happy there, hence the behaviour calming down on the holiday - i would think it was a reaction to being miserable rather than learned behaviour. I know its very awkward due to the CMs childrens needs but if that is going to affect her mindees adversely then she shouldnt be childminding, as harsh as that sounds. This would go the same for anyone who felt it ok for their children to hit the mindee. A friend of mine is going through a very similar situation just now - although it is her dd that is doing the hitting, she feels it is because the two older children of the CM are picking on her. The CM is not handling it well so she is thinking of looking elsewhere.

[NotABanana]

Any developments?

[shinyshilling]

Well, yesterday evening when I collecter DD, the CM's DD thrust a note into my hand in a rather embarrassed way which said "Sorry for hitting M on the head last night". The CM seemed rather sheepish and eager to please, so we have agreed for the time being to monitor the situation and see how it goes. We are fully prepared to address the situation should the need arise in the near future. I think I made my feelings of shock quite clear on the night and perhaps that was enough?

[colander]

I wouldn't leave my child there for a minute longer.

[NotABanana]

Me neither.