8 month old still waking despite controlled crying

[LUCIA22]

DD is 8 months old and we have been doing controlled crying for just over a week now as she was waking for a feed in the early hours every night. The first couple of nights took an hour and a half to get her to go to sleep then it went down to about an hour. I thought we were winning then but hasnt got any better. She stops crying when I pick her up and usually refuses water but starts again as soon as I put her down. Last night after an hour of going back to her every 5 or 10 mins I left her as she was just grumbling rather than crying. She went on like this for 45 mins until she eventually went to sleep. I thought is was only supposed to take a few nights to work but I dont feel like we are getting anywhere other than exhausted. She goes to sleep without any problem at bed time. I cant work out what it is she wants, do I just keep going and hope it pays off in the end?!!

[PrettyCandles]

If it's taking so long without showing good progress, then it is not working and you should stop and rethink your strategies. CC should show good results within a week at the longest. It is very stressful for the baby - and for the parents - so shouldn't be dragged out.

Are you picking her up when you comfort her? That could be confusing the issue. It sounds from your post as if you are trying to do a combination of CC and Pick-up-Put-Down. Doesn't work.

You must also bear in mind that she may not be ready yet to go through the night without a feed. You may fidn it helps to shift the small hours feed to your bedtime, as a dreamfeed.

[DaddyJ]

What has she been like during the day in the past week?
More alert and happy due to getting more sleep
or the opposite?

When she finally drops off, does she sleep through until 5/6/7am?

[fairylights]

lucia i expect you will get lots of replies on this.. CC being a bit controversial in MN and all.. of course you have to decide what is best for your LO but the guy who came up with the idea of CC (Ferber was his name) think that it isn't suitable for babies until they are one. So it might be a case of just grinning and bearing it for a few more months..? Sorry!

[EffiePerine]

I found 8/9 mo v tricky as it coincided with abig growth spurt. If CC hasn;t worked I'd leave it for now and come back to it when she's 10 mo maybe? That seems to be a good slot.

[EffiePerine]

(btw I dodn't try CC until DS was 15 mo and it worked within a night)

[DaddyJ]

Fortunately, Dr. Ferber has said no such thing
(apart from on Mumsnet ) but I have agree with the others,
if the rate of improvement is so poor
it would be worth giving her the feed until
you get much more firm signals from here
that the night feed is no longer needed.

[tori32]

How much food and drink does she have during the day. Self weaning or traditional method? i.e. look at the actual amount that gets into her stomach, not the amount you put on her plate IYSWIM. Snacks?
Lots of self weaning babies throw most food on the floor, therefore need to make up calorie difference with milk. This can lead to a need to night feed due to hunger.
I would suggest feeding at least 1 meal to ensure a full meal is eaten and finger foods for the other IYSWIM.

[tori32]

PS Does she have regular nap in the day time as if not she may be over tired, which leads to poor night time sleep as well.

[DaddyJ]

Jesus, what's wiv ma spelling!

One more suggestion:
if she is down to one night feed only
(and by the sound of it still very much wants it)
you could try a dreamfeed between 10-11pm.

[seeker]

are you sure she's not hungry?

[LUCIA22]

She eats really well during the day, has her tea at about 4.30/5pm and then a milk feed at about 6pm. She is not self weaned, I feed her homemade mashed food and she is eating about 200g for her evening meal. She pretty much always eats everything she is given but I was worried about giving her more and overfeeding her. Do you really think that she could be hungry? She usually wakes at about 6am and is not always desperate to be fed then. She sleeps during the day, usually for at least at hour in the morning and then about 40 mins/1hour in the afternoon. She is in a good routine and in a good mood during the day,really the only problem is this nightime waking. She has slept through for a few nights but then she starting teething and I gave in and fed her when she woke to comfort her and that was it really. My HV is adamant that she should be able to go all night without a feed by now and cc is the answer but to be honest I get more sleep when I give in and feed her!!!!

[bubblagirl]

i actually rememember same problem with my ds and used to feed him thin k it to do with growth spurt he always went back off and eventually just slept through the feed

although went through another satge when about 19 mths of needing feed that he also grew out of again

just give the feed all children are different and if your dd appears to need it then give it to her she is only 8 mths after all

[krugerparkrules]

lucia, my dd is 8 months old, feeding well during the day, but still wakes up usually around 4 for a feed - i figure she must be hungry and breastfeed her! (I would love her to sleep through the night, but i'm hoping at some point it will just stretch through! She dropped all the other feeds on her own, so i keep hoping for this one to go as well - like you she also doesnt wake up hungry!) I havnt the heart to try cc, and because she has a feed at 6 i think it has been almost 10 hours, so perhaps its just what she needs and she is hungry. No help to you, but you are certainly not the only one with a lo feeding during the night! (Our routines sound pretty similar as well with eating and sleeping ...)

[fairylights]

daddyj - you may be right, but i am just quoting a friend who is a clinical psychologist and who studied him recently.

[DaddyJ]

I'd say go with the flow for the time being.
You have given CC a proper try and it's not working at the moment.

fairylights, can you find out from your friend where Dr. Ferber said that?
He doesn't in his revised book nor on the website of the hospital he works at.
Even Dr. Sears (not a great fan of CC he) suggests from 6 months not 1 year.

[hunkermunker]

Very interesting article, I think

Ferber says it's not appropriate for all babies. How do you feel about co-sleeping? Is it possible for you?

[seeker]

Most sleep for the greatest number of people is my motto. And there are no "shoulds" when it comes to babies. If you can settle her back to sleep quicky with a feed why not do it? She may be hungry or thirsty - or she may just be looking for a bit of comfort - whatever it is, why not give it to her? I think the most important thing to remember about babies is that they are a completely different person next week!

[weeamoomoo]

i did CC with my DS2 at 7 months. i was really desperate. he was sleeping with me and waking every hour but wouldnt feed or be settled by anything! poor wee guy was just knacked and didnt know how to get himself to sleep cos we had always picked him up at the first sound for fear of waking up DS1! anyway, if you are doing CC, then DONT PICK THEM UP!! i also found that going in every 10 mins or so was making it worse not reassuring him, so eventually i just bit the bullet and left him to cry (he fell asleep after about 45 mins and he's 20 months now and laughs when he goes to bed and does not appear to have any long term damage...)sit in the next room and read a book. good luck. i'm expecting no.3 in march and have vowed not to do the same with this one. if the other 2 wake up then tough! but you know what they say about the best laid plans...

[BlueberryPancake]

There are specific ways of doing control crying, even though I don't agree with it, I think that it can be less damaging if it's done the right way. There are many books on the market, and iwh CC you shouldn't pick up your baby. You go in the room, and say some reassuring words, reassuring but firmly (something like 'it's night time now, time to sleep, good night) and you check that everything is OK, and you walkk out. You do this at regular intervals (every 2 minutes to start wit and every 5 minutes afterwards, or whatever you choose but you ahve to stick to it and don't pick up!) Anyway, I have a good book ere called Sleeping Through the Night: How Infants, Toddlers, and Their Parents Can Get a Good Night's Sleep and se explains how to do CC as a 'last resort' but gives plenty of tips on how to get your child to sleep well oter then CC.

[Lulumama]

My HV is adamant that she should be able to go all night without a feed by now and cc is the answer but to be honest I get more sleep when I give in and feed her>>

there is your answer, lucia22

your baby is hungry

your HV is talking bolleaux

babies develop at different rates, some sleep through without a feed at 6 weeks, so at 12 months ... 8 months is a perfectly reasonable age to still require a feed in the night

what is the point of you and LO being up for ages , she crying and you ending up exhausted when a feed will solve the problem

control crying won;t work on a hungry baby

feeding her will!!

honestly, it is not giving in, it is giving her what she NEEDS!

[Lulumama]

• some at 12 months

[BlueberryPancake]

You are absolutely right Lulu, DS1 was still feeding at night at 12 mnths and I felt that he needed it (slept through at 18 months), but DS2 hasn't had a feed at night since he was 4 months old.

[countryhousehotel]

my HV was adamant my exclusively breast fed dd didn't need a night feed at FIVE months...needless to say i ignored her and dd stopped night feed at 6 months and dream-feed at 9 months of her own accord. You know your daughter and whether or not she's hungry - you and you only will know whether she's genuinely hungry in the night (ie taking a good feed be it breast or bottle) or just using it as comfort or as a way to get back to sleep.

[LUCIA22]

Thanks for all the advice. Last night I made sure that she had a really good milk feed before she went to bed. Sometimes she becomes distracted and i have always asumed that she has had enough so this time I kept putting her back on until I felt she had a good amount. After what everyone had said I had decided that I would feed her in the early hours if she woke but she slept right through until 5.30am!!! I was so pleased. I fed her then and we got up. I dont want to speak too soon but maybe she just wasnt taking enough at bed time. I will do the same tonight and will feed her if she wakes. I usually take my HV advice but in this case what everyone says makes more sense to me and it is so much less stressful. She has dropped alot of her other feeds of her own accord so maybe she will do the same with this one.

[Piffle]

sounds like she is hungry, or maybe teething
FWIW my 10 mth old goes down well at 7pm wakes at 11pm and 3am for feeding, So I feed him.