What age does the 'Terrible Twos' begin?

[Rebi]

I have looking through Behaviour / development to find anything about tantrums and came across Dinosaur's recent question about her two year old having tantrums, and at what level were they normal.

It very much relates to what is going on at the moment in our house - except that dd is only 14 months old.

Like Dinosaur, my ds is on the autistic spectrum and I am probably always acutely aware of anything astray. dd does everything else she should be doing and is very social and independent, good eyecontact, understands LOADS of what we ask / say to her (we think she is advanced but then we are her parents!). But boy can she scream.... and scream...and scream.... and scream......

We cannot work out what it is about. Yesterday was the day from hell (would have to be Mother's Day!) she seemed to scream for the entire day.

So, advise/reassurance very very gratefully received. Can the terrible twos start this early (has been going on for about 2 weeks now, although she did go through this before)?

Please please help.

[smellymelly]

My Ds was 16 months, and my DD was 11 months when they had their first tantrums !!!!!!

They are perfectly fine, DS is now 4 and still has the odd tantrum, and DD is 18 months and we are looking forward to years of them to come !!!!!!

[Crumpet]

My dd is 14 months too, and recently has developed a nice line in throwing herself backwards and howling when really upset. I think this is frustration when we do something she doesn't want (eg try and put her nappy on when she wants to be off), but can't talk yet to tell us what it is she does want...so far it's not that regular, but I'm sure there's more to come!

[coppertop]

Could it be that she has reached a stage where she knows she wants to do something but realises that she isn't physically able to?

My ds1 is also on the autistic spectrum and ds2 is 13mths old. Ds2 is probably the world's happiest baby/toddler but he's just getting to the point where he's frustrated when things are out of his reach. He was delighted when he realised that he could reach more when standing than he could when he was crawling. The novelty is starting to wear off a bit and he wants to be able to do even more. Could your dd be the same?

[CountessDracula]

Rebi my dd is 18 months and she's been having tantrums for a while, probably 3 months. Her nanny said to me that she didn't know why it was called the terrible twos because in her (considerable) experience it usually started at 1 or about there!

(I asked her when it finished - she said "when they leave home" LOL!)

[hmb]

DD was one. Before Christmas and her birthday she was a child who would just watch the world go by. After her birthday.......WOW! She is 100% NT, and carried on having them until she was a long way past 4. In fact she has a whopper on hoiday last year when she was 6.5....2 hours long! I had to appologise to the other campers round us, they all thought I was talking about ds who was 3!

Ironicaly I was worried about ds being on the spectrum, as was his nursery. He has few problems now that his language problems have resolved, and yet he hardly ever had tantrums.

[Rebi]

Thank you so much for your reassurances. She did get very 'screamy' before she walked and it did seem to calm down. Maybe she wants to talk and is frustrated? It is just the intensity of the 'tantrums'. Yesterday I felt at the end of my tether. It felt like she screamed all day. ds would scream at times (at beginning of school year, did have a few weeks of intense screaming in January when Classroom Assistant changed), but as he hadn't done it for a few months, don't think it is copying, but maybe it is - if so how do we overcome it?

Also I feel really sorry for ds, as he finds it really hard to listen to and retreats to his room.

[MeanBean]

Rebi, my DD isn't two for another fortnight, but she has been having the terrible twos for at least eight months now. She is actually beginning to calm down, it's getting better, and I think it is because her vocabulary has expanded and she can express herself better. As you suggest, the lack of language might be the issue, and as she learns to talk better she'll be less frustrated and less screamy - that is what I'm finding.

[nutcracker]

Erm i think DD1 was about 18mths when she went through a phase of sqealing at you if she didn't get her own way. Other than that she was pretty good really. DD2 was always a handful right from the start and had tantrums from about the age of 2. She still has big tantrums now, but we have just about accepted that thats how she is. My Ds is 15mths and does sometimes scream and throw himself on the floor when he doesn't get what he wants. I think he has learnt this from DD2 as he finds her behaviour hilarious. I'm hoping that when DD2 goes to school in september, that Ds will then calm down a bit.

[Rebi]

Thank you for all your replies. I do have one more question if anyone could help?

How do you cope with the tantrums. I have been trying really really hard to just let her get on with it and ignore it, but I do feel so mean and horrible. She just seems so young and she is screaming for so long, and holding her breath and at times nearly being sick.

Our ds came down yesterday afternoon (after hours and hours of this on and off) and started to try and comfort her. He was looking at us as if we were the worst in the world. But she even rejected him.

I have been thinking that I should go into our next door neighbour and explain that we are not abusing the child. Last Wednesday night at 1am she had one for about 1 hour before she fell back to sleep from exhaustion.

Sorry for going on but are we doing the right thing by ignoring her behaviour? I should be used to screaming after the last 8 years with ds, but I seem to have less patience this time.

[nutcracker]

I know ignoring them is horrible but it is the only thing that works with my dd2. The only other thing that worked when she squeals is to copy her, she hated that and shut up staright away. Not very useful if you are out in public though i know.
I have become quite good at ignoring dd2 and ds sometimes. I sometimes catch people looking at me wondering how i can just let them scream like that, but they never offer to help, so i just smile and walk away.

[Rebi]

Thanks Nutcracker! It definitely helps when you realise your not the only one! Can I ask you what you do 'in your head' when your dd is off on one?! At times I find it really hard just to switch off...

[Rebi]

Thanks Nutcracker! It definitely helps when you realise your not the only one! Can I ask you what you do 'in your head' when your dd is off on one?! At times I find it really hard just to switch off...

[hmb]

Ignoring was the only thing that worked for us. Worked better on ds than dd. Not easy I know. I'd be walking from room to room and dd would be following me , checking that the floor was clear before she threw herself to the floor. We circuit the house. Kitchen to dinind room, to living room, to hall and back to the kitchen! Funny now but grim at the time.

[nutcracker]

Erm, anything really. Try to have a coversation with someone else, come on mumsnet
I find it very hard when i'm out and DD has a tantrum, as i never quite know what to do then. I usually try to distract her then, by saying " i know shall we go and look at" or something similar. Failing that i just say, right thats it and go home.
Your dd is a bit young for you to that though i suppose.
With my ds who's 15mths , i will try to distract him by making himlaugh. HTH
I don't always stay calm though, sometimes i will scream and shout too

[Rebi]

hmb - lol!!
That's the thing though, isn't it? When you are going through it, you just can't see any light at the end of the tunnel, but when its over, it is amusing.

(Note to self: This WILL pass!)(and it is nt)

[Rebi]

Thanks Nutcracker - I'm not the only one in the world to lose it then!!!

[misdee]

my dd2 started having tantrums around 10months old. now she has full on wobblies at 18months, feet stamping, throwing herself on the ground and being a madam. She screams at me, screams at night, screams when she wants to play with knives and i wont let her (i'm not that bad a mum thjat i'll let her play with knives), yells when we take dd1 to nursery and its not drop-in group day as she wants to stay. but when she isnt have a tantrum she is lovely. i tend to ignore it now, can switch off and go have a cuppa or come on here. I will deal with her if she is in danger of hurting herself or someone else but other than that i tend to try and let her scream it out. distraction doesnt work as she will hit, throw things or scream louder. i'm not a perfect mum and do have days when i have to leave the room/area as she gets far too loud or i cant cope, and just come back when i know i can deal with her without risking losing it and harming her in frustration. anyone feel like this at times?

[hmb]

I would also steap her in the push chair and go for a high speed walk. This was before I had ds, so could do this easily. I'd walk very fast, so the tension would ebb away, and yelling doesn't seem so bad when you are both out in the open air!

I was grim at the time, and I do sympathise as it must be hard for you to deal with, esp with ds being sensitive to sound.

[hmb]

That was strap, not anything sinister BTW

[CountessDracula]

Ignoring or distraction works for me. Must say her tantrums only last for a minute or two, occasionally 5 or 10, not hours!

I can normally distract her with some stickers or water to play with or the TV.

[Posey]

What a timely thread this is
Ds is 15 months and has just started throwing huge wobblies. For example today I needed to go inside (I'd been hanging out washing and ds was playing in his new favourite toy, the sandpit). So I picked him up to go in and he arched his back, lifted his arms right up over his head making it really hard to keep a good grip, and did he scream! I put him in the living room, lying on the floor and let him get on with it. Dd and I went in the kitchen (I could still see him as they are joining rooms so I knew he was safe.) He didn't stay angry for long, soon wandered in to see what we were doing. First time I did this dd thought I was very cruel to him ("but mummy, he's really upset"!)but now she realises its the best way.

BTW dd didn't have any tantrums til she was 3 and then they were few and far between. But if she did I treated her exactly the same, even leaving her on the floor in Woolies and making a big show of stepping over her and having a GREAT time helping my friend's ds choose his toy
As many of the others have said, keeping calm and more or less ignoring it, keeping your voice firm and level rather than shouting, seems to be the best way to make tantrums short and sweet (well not quite sweet, but more bearable)
HTH

[Hulababy]

I think DD's first tantrum was the day after her first birthday - think she was over tired from her party. She is now 23 months and, although she doesn't have that many really, they have steadily increased in frequency amd intensity.

[Galaxy]

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[Rebi]

Thank all so very much! I am so relieved that it is not unusual for this to start so early.

One thing I have noticed with all the replies that it mostly seems to be dd s who are throwing these early tantrums. Wonder are girls more prone to this? I have noticed that my dd is very determined when she wants to do something (eg walk) and I think this is a brilliant trait to have for the future. My ds gets frustrated instantly when he can't do something. So I suppose maybe the downside of this determined streak is tantrums.

Sorry for rambling on. On Sunday I couldn't see the wood for the trees. Thank you again wonderful MNetters - as usual all your advice hits the spot!