8 year old dd, constant damp pants and often soiling

(17 Posts)
stickchildren3 Fri 10-May-13 18:39:18

I am beyond the end of my tether with this problem, and it is making me even more cross now my dd2 (2 years old) is constantly totally dry and clean. My dd1 has always got damp pants which by the end of the day are yellow with wee (sorry, tmi). I have tried everything for years to try to get her to stay dry and so far teachers, doctors etc have said that it's just because she's so 'busy' and involved in what she is doing that it is not a priority for her to get to the toilet in time. On and off we also have not getting to the toilet in time when she needs a poo and the obvious consequences and this has started again. But at what age, does this problem of 'can't be bothered to keep oneself clean' stop?

I have looked back at old threads and constipation is often cited as the cause but I know that she is definitely not constipated. She has a easy, carefree, happy existence - no issues she would be worrying unduly about. I have tried to explain patiently about personal hygiene but it seems to go in one ear and out of the other.

If anyone has any practical advice, please post. I don't want her to end up being teased at school, or by her siblings. TIA

Sorry, I don't think it's normal for an 8 year old to just be "too busy" to make it to the loo for a wee, on a really regular basis. Unless she has other SEN or something, which you've not mentioned.

To be honest, it's not the province of teachers to be telling you their views on what they think the problem is. What doctors have you seen? Has she actually seen a urology team? Has anyone ruled out neurological issues? Leaking, rather than full flood (which is what her wetting sounds like) can indicate neurological issues, as could some faecal soiling (I've been down this route with my DD, who had an MRI to rule out neurological issues re constipation).

If she just was procrastinating going to the loo, she'd have proper opening of floodgates - this sounds like leaking, which is something else.

Please, if you haven't had decent, specialist medical input, get some asap.

Feel free to PM me if you want more info... smile

Sorry - not "other SEN" - I meant "other issues, like SEN"

Littlefish Fri 10-May-13 19:04:16

I agree with keepmum. When you say she's soiling, what form does this take? A whole poo, a smear, loose bowels, pebbles?????

stickchildren3 Fri 10-May-13 20:02:21

thanks so much for your replies. I agree that 8 year olds shouldn't be too busy to go to the loo keepmum which is already making me feel like I'm not being overly dramatic about this issue so firstly thank you for that! She hasn't got any SEN. When she's soiling it's mostly loose bowels. She claims she can't feel it coming, which I guess might back up what you're saying re neurological issues, but then runs to the loo to finish off her bowel movement by which time it's partially too late. I'm going to take her to the doctor again (it has been a while since I last took her and she has never been referred). I might PM you keepmum over the weekend [if I can work out how to do it] but in the meantime, thank you for your advice.

PJM18 Fri 10-May-13 22:50:00

Hi. My 6 yr old son is currently having similar issues with soiling. When he has an accident it is soft and he usually has a large bowel movement after. He also claims he can't feel it. We have been to go and I have read a lot and I think it is constipation overflow even though he doesn't seem to be constipated, ie large bowel movement every few days. If you read a bit about it, the large poo can block the bowel and looser bowel movements leak past and this is why they can't feel it. As a result the bowel gets stretched.
Keep mum, when your dd had an MRI, what neurological issues were they wanting to rule out? What was the outcome?

soupmaker Fri 10-May-13 23:22:53

Hi Stick. Our DD who is 5 has never been dry and also has soiling problems. I was back at the hospital with her today.

After almost 18 months of going back and forth to HV, GP, consultants, and specialist nurses it was suggested today that she subconciously holds in her poos.

We have battled with soiling for over a year and like you I wasn't convinced she was constipated as she pooed most days and didn't have any pain, is happy and thriving.

DD has also been diagnosed with an irritable bladder and urge incontinence.

I would be very surprised if at 8 there wasn't something more than being 'too busy' to this.

I'd start pushing for a referral to see specialists at your local children's hospital.

Good luck.

Good for you - you're not being overly dramatic! Most likely is probably constipation, I'd guess, though I'm no expert. Though TBH, she'd prob not seem very well if she was very blocked up. I didn't mean to worry you with the neuro stuff - just that it's worth making sure someone sensible rules it out!

Feel free to PM me - if you're on the computer, just go to my posts, and on the right hand side there's a "message poster" option. I have no idea how to make it work on phones confused

PJM - MRI was to check for tethered spinal cord - DD had constipation that was unresponsive to all laxatives, and some wetting too. She has a large sacral dimple, which can be an indicator of spinal issues. We had to fight very hard for the MRI, with the GP's backing, but when we got to the lovely neurosurgeon, he agreed it was a good idea. Anyway, turned out negative, and bowel probs turned out to be caused by other health stuff, which we're starting to get on top of. I won't go into too much detail here, as I'm foolishly not using my alias reserved for discussion of bowel issues grin

CointreauVersial Fri 10-May-13 23:44:49

I can see elements of DD1 in your description, OP. She could also be described as happy, but slightly "away with the fairies", and too busy having fun to actually go to the loo.

She also doesn't seem to have much of a gap between the first urges to go, and the "omg, I'm going to wet myself" feeling, and we have suffered the odd accident because we can't get to a loo in time, and she regularly has damp/skiddy knickers at the end of the day. It has improved in the last year, but guess what, she is 12 in a month's time shock

I was pretty certain in her case it wasn't medical. It was for the same reason that I wouldn't let her cross the road by herself until fairly recently - she just has her mind on other things. She loses stuff as well- I think it is all linked.

What I'm trying to say is, it may be in your DD's nature to just "forget" to go to the loo, and may not be medical.....

CointreauVersial Fri 10-May-13 23:45:56

Oh yes, and she's oblivious to the personal hygiene thing as well. A complete soap dodger, and really not bothered.

Turnipinatutu Sat 11-May-13 00:00:40

Cointreauversial- you have just described my dd who's 14!
I made an appointment with the gp when she was about 11 to try and pin point the problem. After talking to the gp by myself initially, when she seemed very supportive, I made another appointment to talk things over with dd there. Dd was obviously reluctant to discuss the issue and the gp then turned to me and said "this seems to be more of an issue for you than her" shock
The problem is still persisting and now I'm not sure what, if anything I should do about it sad

CointreauVersial Sat 11-May-13 00:05:48

I just accept it as a quirk of DD1's character, I guess.

I still have to check she's been to the loo before a long car journey. I haven't bothered asking DD2 for years.

cory Sat 11-May-13 17:18:22

The loose bowel thing does sound like constipation/impacted faeces. A friend's ds had this and it took quite a while to sort out.

I'd definitely go to the GP and ask for referral to a specialist. Dd also wet at this age but due to weak connective tissue; she was on medication for a few years until her body had firmed up.

Being busy wouldn't explain the sudden leak of faeces as far as I know; but could easily result from a blockage of old poo obstructing the passage.

stickchildren3 Sat 11-May-13 18:50:27

It's interesting reading these replies and sort of reassuring that even older children are having similar issues (although not for the posters obviously!). cointreau my dd is also a bit away with fairies! Infact she writes to various ones regularly! Maybe I should invent the toileting fairy and ask her to write to my dd as these fairies seem to have more impact on her than I do!! Seriously though, I think a trip to the doctor would help make her realise that it is a problem and I am slightly concerned re the neurological side because her dad has neurological issues.

Stick - she sounds really sweet smile I hope I haven't worried you too much on the neurological side - I certainly wouldn't presume to say it was anything neurological anyway, but just think that you're right to be taking it seriously and wanting more investigation. Do PM me if you want to....

soupmaker - your DD's symptoms sound quite similar to my DD's, but we're a lot further along in terms of treatment etc.

I just wanted to flag that we've discovered, after 2 years of treatment along "functional constipation" lines, that actually there are other forms of constipation it can be, particularly if she's pooing every day and not in pain. Anyway, if you're interested in knowing more, pm me. No probs if not - I won't hijack the thread further with our own lengthy issues grin

soupmaker Sun 12-May-13 22:55:23

Hi Keep. Will do. I am on the iPhone but will try and pm you tomorrow. We've had a clean weekend - so nice for a change. Not counting my chickens though.

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