my 5 yr old over boistrous for his piers in school

(106 Posts)
littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 12:14:27

My 5 year old boy started a new school at the end of January and is apperntly beginning to settle. But other children are saying he is naughty and the teacher told me yesterday that he is being to boistrous for his piers and hurting them. He is big for his age, some of the children one child in particular is half is size.

A lot of the time he is joining in with rough play with the other boys one group in particular because he is the biggest the smaller ones generally end up being pushed over although he is doing the same as them (at lunchtimes) and other times he has pinched another child to stop them hurting a girl. he does that quite a lot he gets involved where he shouldnt.

he pushed over the small child in roleplay in class and he fell onto a plastic box resulting in a cut bottom. My child has had run ins with this boy previously where this boy was playing boxing and seeing who was the strongest and they grabbed each others face. The other boy got a scratch, apparently the apologised at the time to each other.

This is the one side of the problem he isnt hurting children out of anger or spite, but out of some misguided protecting them or because he is not playing gently enough and not thinking. (Not justifying what he is doing) we are constantly explaining/taking toys/early to bed etc to try and get the message through. He just does not think of the consequences, and it will begin to effect his friend making . He is really sensitive and his behaviour will spiral if he thinks he is being told off unfairly or if he is worried about getting into trouble he gets nightmares and cant sleep so we tend to have patches where he gets into a cycle of being overly boistrous and gets in trouble which increases the behaviour.

The other side is a maternal side where the mum of the small child is running to the school and have heard her forcing and leading explanations out of her child, when he clearly knows they were both playing. Because my son is so much bigger than hers i think she thinks he is bullying him when from what I can tell they are playing games they probably shouldnt be and they are both at fault.

It makes me feel isolated at the school gates and embarresed. I do speak to a couple of the other parents, but i feel like i constantly being watched. The other mum hasnt said anything to me and to be honest i wish she would so i could put people right. He has a baby sister and he is wonderful with her , he does what i say at home and is helpful, He is brilliant academically. He is mischievious and although does what i ask can struggle to stop when i tell him to stop doing something.

I dont know what to do. How can i make him be more mindful of his actions ?

WeAllHaveWings Fri 22-Mar-13 19:38:50

Dh has always wrestled and play fought with ds(9) but always made sure he knew when things hurt, this taught him the boundaries in physical play.

IMO kids will and should play physically, its fun! but they need to do it at home first, from an early age, where they can be taught the boundaries. This includes not being physical when upset and not being physical with someone who doesn't want to join in.

Ds's friend was over last night (after karate) and they were both play wrestling on the floor, it was very physical and competitive but not once did they hurt each over/lose their temper and cross the line. They were aware of not hurting each other, know the boundaries and know if they cross the line there will be consequences.

He knows I would come down on him like a tonne of bricks if he hurts someone else intentionally or because he wasn't thinking,especially if that person didn't want to play.

This is better than just not playing physically all. It did take time for ds to learn not to hurt or get carried away, especially when he was desperate to win when wrestling with his dad, but eventually it clicked.

Like others, also recommend karate which ds has done since he was 5.

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 19:39:42

yellow - i dont think they are fine with i think they are doing things in house, in the mean time i need to try and encourage my ds not to get involved etc which is what i had been asking advice for.

BeaWheesht Fri 22-Mar-13 19:43:08

Do you complain to the school about the incident with him pushing the boy! I'd have written a formal letter of complait.

Also, do you make him apologise? Whether or not he has already done so in school I'd be making him do it in the playground too.

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 19:46:00

thanks egg basket and merci and wings. Im glad it doesnt seem to be a problem im just having and i have had some great advice i think the karate is well worth a look into. he hasnt started a football club yet he plays with his dad etc. thinking of sending him though. he does ice skating and swimming at the minute . but i think karate and football will get him interacting a bit more and help him control his strength

YellowandGreenandRedandBlue Fri 22-Mar-13 19:46:57

It is not hard to ensure a particular game is not played, they just ban it.

I am pretty hmm at the idea of a school in 2013 not coming down hard on boxing.

BeaWheesht Fri 22-Mar-13 19:49:57

I think you're missing the point a bit tbh - he needs to control his strength why? Because he's involved in 'play ' fighting. He shouldn't be play fighting therefore shouldn't need to control his strength. If all the other boys are doing it you need to do 2 things 1/ teach your ds not to follow the crowd and 2/ kick up merry hell with the school

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 19:51:27

bea yes i make him apologise , as i say he doesnt like to hurt people he is really remorseful and he gets really upset about it if he does.
I spoke to the school directly.

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 19:59:46

bea and yellow yes it is not on that these games are going on. the school are aware and dealing with it. however the situation is that they are going on and i dont want my ds following the crowd as i have said numerous times and i can tell him till i am blue in the face take all his toys etc but i cannot police him in the playground which is why i have been asking advice on his self displine. as for the strength this is needed to prevent an incident like the role play and where he has hugged his friend to hard or where he pulls his toy to hard or puts a plate down to hard. there are so many he reasons why he needs to learn to control his strength. which is why i have been asking for advice on that. and with all due respect all i have been doing is repeating myself to you both. and you havent offerd any usefull advice whatsoever.

purples Fri 22-Mar-13 20:03:56

I'm sure the karate teacher will encourages him to learn control, but the lessons may teach him how to be more aggressive, there is a very fine dividing line between the two. Is he mature enough to know the difference?

BeaWheesht Fri 22-Mar-13 20:08:24

I have offered advice actually. I have Said what I'd do. I have told you I have a tall son, I have said I can see both sideS. I can't just tell you 'boys will be boys ' though which is what you seem to want.

You can say you want advice on x/y/z but people are allowed to ask questions you know? To get the full picture?

How are his motor skills in general?

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 20:10:45

purples in a controled enviroment he will. and ive done karate myself when i was younger . it wasnt aggresive at all. it taught disipline and respect which is why im quite keen on the idea. i do see what your saying though and the first signs of any trouble because of it he wouldnt be doing it any more

YellowandGreenandRedandBlue Fri 22-Mar-13 20:15:06

I am very confused. At the start you said it was normal for boys to play rough, in fact said I was ridiculous for suggesting you should teach your child not to. You said all boys play these rough games, normal part of any play ground.

Now you are saying the school shouldn't let them play these games and you don't want your son to play.

This all sounds rather odd.

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 20:15:30

bea you have said you wouldnt accept it or allow it. you havent said how you would go about it.
his motor skills are fine heavy handed but that comes back to the strength thing. in fact he walked etc really early

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 20:18:57

yellow keep up . it is normal as i have previously said for these games to be played as is clear by the other people posting. it is however not desirable. i said you was ridiculous for saying children should never touch each other , other than holding hands hugs etc, and saying your children would never play rough games which you later said they did.

BeaWheesht Fri 22-Mar-13 20:21:07

Interesting - my ds walked very early and is very tall but also what I assumed to be just clumsy. Turns out now there may be other issues.

I did say what I'd do eg apologise etc am not a mind reader so couldn't tell you'd already done this.

Do you have this attitude with other parents at the school gate? Perhaps that's why you feel isolated.

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 20:27:22

no bea but i had already said i had made him apologise and again you havent actually said what you would do just that you wouldnt stand for it and you have presumed that i am just happily allowing him to carry on and not actually reading what i am saying or asking. you got up into your ivory tower and seem pretty comfy. so yes you have annoyed me. no i dont take this attitude i speak and say hello to most of the mums down there the majority are fine. I just feel awkward

littlelyon Fri 22-Mar-13 20:35:35

any way thanks people for advice on getting him into karate , the roleplay and play dough. and the stickers idea. thankyou thse who have said about there similar situations. and thankyou bea and yellow if nothing else i have more strength in my convictions and wont feel so awkward at the school gate.I feel much better and in control. thanks

purples Fri 22-Mar-13 20:45:10

If your son gets a reputation with the other Mums, then you may find his social life outside school diminishing, as Mums may be reluctant to have your child round. Ultimately this may actually aggravate the situation as your son has to learn how to behave appropriately around his classmates. ( I know thats very easy to say and much harder to change).
Maybe karate is worth a shot....but I'd let his teachers (both school and katate teachers) know what you are trying to achieve, so that they can monitor how he is coping with it and give you feedback on any improvements/issues. Just be prepared to listen to what they have to say.( as I said easier to say than do)
Atleast you are trying something....

KeepCoolCalmAndCollected Fri 22-Mar-13 20:52:05

BeaWheesht
Which planet are you on? From my observations most normal boys play fight. Unless they have very controlling of character mothers of course.

purples Fri 22-Mar-13 21:07:19

But....I think there is a difference between play fighting and actually hurting each other....

EggBasket Fri 22-Mar-13 21:13:12

Here is my thread from a year ago when I was going through the same with DS1 - some more good advice on it. It finally started to click about halfway through the summer term and he has had no problems since then.

Littlelyon i can totally understand you feeling uncomfortable at the school gates but try not to feel that way. Like you say in your Op you are doing the right things to let your son know that your not happy with some of his behaviour. I hope the mother of the smaller child is telling her son it's wrong too but i suspect that she thinks he is always the victim.

It is so hard when your son is seen as the problem when i'm almost sure that most of the children are doing the very same, the difference is they don't have his strength. My sons school has really had to monitor the games the children were playing because they were all getting too rough. Your son's school needs to deal with this, make an appointment and tell them how you feel. They need to help you deal with this.

As for people saying children shouldn't put their hands on each other! Thats impossible, all the children i see love playing tag, run along grabbing each others hoods, grab arms, laughing as they do. They can get rough but it's mostly excitement . It's not bullying we are talking about here, its rough and tumble that is not being monitored properly.

Redbindy Fri 22-Mar-13 21:22:05

I'd worry about him being too boisterous for his piers. We live on the Isle of Wight and Shanklin Pier got washed into the sea a few years ago by a boisterous sea.

YellowandGreenandRedandBlue Fri 22-Mar-13 21:35:02

I never said they played roughly. I said 'they were not allowed to be rough'. Yes they pretended to be superheroes but that meant flying around and shooting laser beams.

My kids didn't play fight and were taught never to grab, push, kick, hit, wrestle.

You keep trying to,claim all kids do it. They don't.

YellowandGreenandRedandBlue Fri 22-Mar-13 21:37:48

Ilovechocolate -I don't mean not to touch, I mean no hitting, pushing, grabbing, wrestling, kicking.

Tag etc is not rough play even in my sensitive eyes!

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