im finding dd (5) infuriating!(56 Posts)
i dont know if its me being really intolerant or dd being a nightmare but im struggling to keep my cool.
when we go upstairs to get ready for school, i put their clothes on their beds and ask dds to get dressed. dd2 is 2 and will take her pjs off run to bathroom as ask for help washing, which i do. dd1 sits on her bed and stares about doing nothing. i offer help, she sits there. i end up nagging and nagging. she will make silly comments "i cant get dressed as im in my pjs" so i say get your pjs off get a wash and il help if you struggle with tights or whatever. i end up shouting and removing whatever toy she is aimlessly fiddling with and forcing her to get washed.
i have tried no nagging, just getting on with getting myself ready and helping dd2 a bit, i looked in after 15 mins hoping she would take it on herself to get dressed. she was stil sitting looking at an ornament
at dinner, we ask her to sit on chair, facing table, eat with cutlery. every day she kneels up, sits down, kneels up, sits down, swings her legs, sits sideways, eats with her fingers, swings her arms round, sings loudly, asks for pudding when noone has finished so dd2 then starts wanting pudding. at least once a week at dinnertime she falls off her chair. at least once a week she spills her milk everywhere. every day she drops food all over the floor as she eats while facing sideways/kneeling up.
today after being reminded to sit down, she knelt up, leaned to fiddle with her shoe, slipped off chair and smashed her face/nose into dps chair causing a massive bruise on her nose and her screaming.
last week she wobbled off a chair while watching tv and smashed her mouth off the tv unit. she doesnt learn.
bathtime, every night she runs off and hides and is hysteriacl laughing, despite us telling her its naughty behaviour and just get in the bloody bath. tonight i left her hiding and just bathed me and dd2. after we got out she came in demanding a bath, i said she was too late so she screamed the house down.
i know she wants the attention of being nagged, told to stop petty stuff, found at bathtime, but its past a joke and she gets plenty of attention.
am i being intolerant? is this normal for a 5 yr old?
I have a white board with number 1, 2 and 3 on it and I write every time my daughter does not do what she is told to. But only after having given her a warning that she'll go on the board. If she has nothing on the board at the end of the day she gets to choose 2 stories that we read to her. If she has only d to she gets only 1 story at night time. If she has twice not done what she was was told to she gets no stories and sfter the 3 times she goes to bed 5 minute earlier and if she keeps on not listening or doing what she is told to we just increase 5 minutes every time. She once went to bed at 6.30. Also we have a jar and she gets a plastic coin in everytime she does her homework or is good at school or help around the house. when she gets a certain amount she gets to do something she wants to. Right now she can't wait to go and see the new tinkerbell. She is 5 also.
im trying to think of things to remove as sort of punishments. i dont want to remove stories as i think they are important and i always listen to her read. i dont want to remove trips to park cos exercise is important
sounds like encouragement/praise/noticing the good stuff might be a much better tack than punishment.
Read How To Talk So Kids Will Listen by Faber.
My daughter aged 10 still does a lot of the fidgeting, and falling over, and she has no dyspraxic issues. I wonder whether it is to do with tiredness and just generally growing...not judging how tall you are etc. All her friends are equally fidgety, so it may be a natural stage rather than your daughter being especially tiresome.
In our house, telling off did not work AT ALL. Btw your daughter sounds lovely, all that reading to herself is very good.
First thing in the morning is a badtime in our house, sugar low for dd, needs a lot of coaxing to get into the routine, but then once she has slowly surfaced she is v organised... When you chivvy children they have a tendency to switch off. When you encourage them, they want to engage.
Btw the board thing sounds absolutely horrible. Like some Victorian schoolroom
DD2 (also 5) is horrid at the moment and it's mostly down to sheer exhaustion - she is SO ready for the end of term! I am getting her dressed in the morning for now to save meltdowns (she has never been a morning person at the best of times) and save the battles for after school. Also trying to get her into bed half an hour earlier than normal. Lots of chanting "only 7 more school days to go" under my breath...
sorry about earlier.
so i've only read the first section of the book which is about descriptive praise, but it's basically that old argument that children want attention and if you give them negative attention that they'll behave to get that and if positive they'll behave to get that, so it's about giving them positive attention whenever you can, but avoiding phrases like brilliant! wondeful! amazing! and instead using very specific, descriptive phrases like, I noticed that you used your knife and fork really sensibly at dinner. That was polite. Or I noticed you walked down the stairs without whingeing. That was helpful. etc. In other words giving the child very specific cues about behaviour that pleases you, even if you are struggling to find the examples, it helps you to look closer. She argues that within two weeks of descriptive praise you will see cooperation about 90% of time. There are four other strategies that i haven't read yet but looking forward to it, as so far i've been impressed by what she says. SHe lists all those things we all try that don't really work: distraction, bribery, etc. She says it's about getting your child's cooperation because actually without that you can't MAKE a child do anything!
Your DD sounds exactly like my DD1 was at 5. I had her assessed for ADHD in the end but she sat good as gold for the doctor.
At age 11 she STILL has to be told, told, told, told countless times to do something like getting dressed. Often I will creep back upstairs after the familiar call "I AM getting dressed!" has rung down the stairs and she will be standing there in PJs, playing with lego then she will just look at me as I rend my clothing and gnash my teeth.
The biggest motivator here is discomfort; if she doesn't get ready in time she misses her lift to school with a friend and has to walk a 20-25 min walk instead. A month ago she was ambivalent but now it's freeeezing and she gets her arse in gear!
My DS 5 in Feb is very similar. Has good coordination and balance usually but sometimes runs or wanders around as if almost in a trance, tripping into things etc. He is horrendous at getting dressed for school, it's a daily battle. What I have resorted to doing, against my better judgement as I don't like him to have it in the morning, is if he is dressed by 8am and not a minute later he can watch a TV programme before we leave for school. He rarely helps so i end up dressing him to stay on track but I'm sure he doesn't realise that I will stay true to my word and not let him watch it if he's late. The mean mummy in me almost wants him not to meet the deadline so he will learn natural consequences. We have take him to school in his pjs (screaming all the way) then dressed him in the boot - whatever you threaten you must be prepared to carry through.
At school he has trouble sitting still without fidgeting, concentrating and listening/doing as he's told so school have designed a token reward system - at the end of the day how ever many tokens he has correlates with what 'thing' he can play with. If he gets dressed in time he can take a token for the teacher at the start of the day and we also have our own reward chart - for every 5 stickers he gets something, usually some time playing cbeebies games on my laptop.
I agree that negative attention is still attention and so although its difficult to ignore sometimes, it really is the best thing to do. Good luck!
That's soooooo familiar I wondered if in a moment of exhaustion I namechanged and wrote that post.
But I have news. I have found something new that worked at least twice.
After a particularly wretched morning I came back from school sobbing and swore I was going to stop yelling at my lovely little girl who is quite magic really. This is what I came up with: instead of saying "get your pajamas off by the time I count down from five" I just talked about the day ahead. "So, when I've dropped you off at school, you've got your play rehearsal, have you got PE this afternoon? And you're having a school dinner - it's macaroni cheese today. Does best friend have dinner or sandwiches today? oh that's nice, you can sit together. And while you're at school I'll put on a load of washing and mend the cupboard door. Think I'll have macaroni for my lunch too. And I'll go to the shop and get milk and eggs before I get you from school."
At that point, she interrupted me to show me how she could do up her own tie. Bedtime, similar tactic, similar result. The trance was broken.
Please please please let it keep working...
i am trying to praise lots and have promised a trip to a xmas fate tomorrow if she listens and does as asked.
i have seen her at school in assembly and she sits still and listens and sings along. the teachers have no problems with her sitting and listening and behaving at school, just general slowness.
even at the weekend, as soon as you mention getting dressed/getting out to do a fun activity, she runs off or goes and plays and ignores me?? she has missed events before and then cries but does the same thing again.
oh and ive tried talking about the day and fun events coming up while getting dressed myself hoping she will also get dressed, she just sits there.
this morning she was stood in the porch in her uniform and coat and i said shall we go now, yes she said, are you sure youre ready, yes she said, she had no shoes on.
I think my DD is the same at school. Her teacher has commented on the way she has to think for ages before acting on instructions, needs a lot of encouragement to start any child-led-activity, and is strangely not at all keen to be independent.
Sometimes I do worry.
I have trouble getting my DS (4) moving in the morning and eating rather than messing around at mealtimes. We use the kitchen timer a lot to get him going (also from 1, 2, 3 Magic) as making anything into a game works well with him. So each morning task he has a set amount of time for. If he beats the timer he gets a sticker for his chart and if he gets a full set of stickers he can have a reward. If we're late his punishment is usually not watching his fav programme in the evening. Similar at dinner time, he gets 20mins to eat his dinner, if he doesn't there's no dessert.
it's the end of term everyone esp 5yo'd are exhausted. She'll be fine after the Christmas break
Oh and bad behaviour gets counted and 3 counts means time out or if this isn't practical some other punishment - no TV in the evening, earlier bedtime etc.
TBH DS1 would much rather spend his whole weekend in his PJ's faffing about on the computer and watching telly than actually do stuff. Give her a break!
My 5 year old is exactly the same - can't/won't get dressed, always spilling things, falling over. Her elder sister aged 9 has dyspraxia & has recently been diagnosed with ADHD so I suspect my younger daughter has the same conditions? Add to that end-of-termitis and you have this daily routine which is exasperating & exhausting so I do sympathise.
6 more school days to go, 6 more school days of sorrow
this morning, while me and dd2 got dressed, dd1 lay under her duvet saying she was cold. i checked, she wasnt ill. she kept shouting dd2 to get in with her. as we went downstairs to go, she ran round and quickly got washed dressed and got her hair done.
it seems she likes to chill and then get ready at last minute.
I think you are doing exactly the right thing by ignoring the negatives and then praising her when she does get ready (just!) on thime.
I'd also second the thing about children ( and reception children in particular) being shattered at this time of year. They are so ready for a rest but everything at school is exciting and christmassy
and out of routine
Its been interesting reading all these. My ds is 5 and is currently driving me crazy. He speaks to me and dh in a very short way, and it's his tone. He doesn't do it to his friends and he doesn't at school, and his younger dd doesn't get the treatment either. He also makes faces at me and rolls his eyes about if I insist on him saying please - I get an eye roll and a bad tempered "please"
When he is being ok he is fabulous company but when he is in this mood, it's horrible. I know to take him food after school, but whatever it is, even if i discussed with him what it would be, gets moaned about in a really grumpy and ungrateful way, for example.
He knows he is doing it, but doesn't really care. It really upsets me he reserves this for me and dh- who says he has no respect and gets really angry. I am hoping it's a phase until a few months he wasn't like this. It is really only when he is tired and stressed, but everyone gets like that and it's not ok to behave badly- its not an excuse - at what age is good to expect it?
I praise all the good stuff, ignore the bad as much as I can, but It carries on. Perhaps after school hols it will get better.
had a lovely morning and dds got ready together
dd1 is year 1, one of the younger ones as only 5.5 as struggles emotionally sometimes.
Hi there, tricky 5 yr old dd here too. Although we have different flash points, she is good at getting ready but rubbish at mealtimes.
We also found the descriptive praise thing fab. I suggests you just do that for 2 weeks then bring in other techniques. The next bit of that book is getting them to talk through things in advance ie you ask at a calm moment when no rush questions like
"what will you do when it is time to get up?"
"how will you get ready?"
"where will you get dressed?"
The idea is to use lots of question words (where, why, what, who, how etc) and get them to talk through in advance in detail what they need to do.
Also your comment about liking to chill and getting ready at last minute rang a bell with me, my family are all like that! Dsis has elevated it to a fine art...
It suggests not I suggest!
careful, this morning before they got dressed i said quietly to dd1, what are you going to do now, and she said get washed and dressed, and she did
we were all singing and laughing and having fun, feels like we havent done enough of that lately, we have been rushing about oo much to school plays, fetes, church, parties and need to just be.
This was my dd at 5. Everything was a battle, I was exhausted all the time. Don't ever ever remind me of those evenings when she wouldn't get ready for bed. <shudder>
I found: asking her why she behaved like she did was helpful. But most helpful of all was praising good all the time. Really bigging it up, and ignoring bad. This was the most helpful.
When she turned 6 the fairies bought me another child overnight . This coincided with her starting to sleep through the night at last. I often thinks she was chronically sleep deprived despite everything we did
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