Please help, extremely worried about disturbed (? not sure) 8 yo who isn't sleeping well, but don't think this is just a sleep problem

[WideWebWitch]

Please help. The background is that I've been working away during the week for the past six months. This comes to an end in 3 weeks time, the 9th Feb. Dh has been coping admirably but understandably, it's affected the children, ds, who's 8 (and not dh's, he's from my first marriage) and, less so, dd, who is 2.

Over Christmas, when I was here for nearly 3 whole weeks without working, ds started waking up at night, which he's never really done before. He doesn't just come for a cuddle, I could live with that and it would be understandable, he shouts and screams at the top of his voice, wakes dd up and calls us names. He sits on the floor and refuses to move if we're downstairs or, last night, he stood outside his room and shouted so loudly he woke dd up. Dh is knackered and pissed off and so am I after the past few nights. (I've been at home because I've been off sick) I've asked ds if there's anything bothering him and he says not, I've asked if anything's wrong at school and he says not, I've asked if there's anything he's not telling me and he says not. He likes his school (although the last 6 months have been odd as he's gone to after school club for the first time but he does like it there), he has plenty of friends, sees his father every other weekend, loves his sister and gets plenty of positive attention from me when I'm here and dh when he's here and in charge.

Just typing this has made me realise it's almost certainly about my being away isn't it? So maybe it'll change once I come back (although there may be a perm job and it will mean relocating about 150 miles if I take it, maybe he's worried about this, we have told him it's a possibility, is this what we've done wrong? Probably.)

We have tried a star chart and it's not working after 2 weeks - I was briefly hopeful but its effects were short lived. ONE night he managed not to wake us when I bribed him with a comic but then he's reverted to waking again. We've threatened taking things away, it doesn't work. Sometimes, at first, he seems half asleep and then I can sometimes get him to go straight back to bed without properly waking but more often he wakes and screams at us. We're at our wits end and dh asked me to post. What can we do? In the middle of the night he is so HORRIBLE, calling us idiots and worse, it is unbearable. We have tried cuddles and gentle encouragement back to bed, we've tried getting cross, what else? Has anyone else experienced this and what did you do? Aplogies for length of post. TIA for all and any words of wisdom or advice.

[emkana]

WWW, that sounds terrible, don't really know what to say but wanted to express my sympathy!
What about trying something unusual for a few nights - something like suggesting to ds that he can sleep in your bed - with our without dh being there as well, depending on space?
Sorry, don't really know what to advise, it sounds horrible - hope you get better advice soon!

[katierocket]

Oh www, poor you, how difficult. It's definitely to do with feeling generally unsettled isn't it. I'm sure when your current contract comes to an end it will help. When do you find out about the perm job? What does he say in the morning about it? If you ask him why he shouts and calls you names what does he say? (I know he probably won't tell you the real reason but would be interested to hear his take on it).

Do you have any specific one to one time with him? Maybe set up one time in the week when it's just you and him and you go off and do something, just the two of you. I'm sure your continued positive attention will pay off and also, once he does know what is happening re: jobs/moving etc, he will settle down naturally.

[Beetroot]

I was going to suggest the same. Could you put a bed in your room for a few nights as a treat?
If he sleeps throghone night thenext night he can come in with you, that sort of thing?

Marbles? Is working with my ds3 who is 8 (but for school work)

When he wakes get into bed eith him?

Gawd, it sounds like heis unhappy about something and has now got in tothe habit of waking.

sorry not uch use

[WideWebWitch]

He says 'I don't know' when I ask him why he does it. Emkana, maybe that's worth a go. He's at his dad's this weekend and then I'm away again next week and the week after and the week after. Then we're going on holiday for a week. Otherwise I would suggest he could come in with me temporarily and dh could sleep in his bed. But I'm not even here often enough to do that I'd do anything, have even considered taking him out of school and taking him with me as I stay with this grandmother (ex mil) in the week and she'd happily have him in the day but I think that would be wrong. Plus I'd still be at work and there are no rules for him there so it would prob make matters worse tbh.

[katierocket]

No, dont' take him with you, I think that would be more unsettling for him.
What are you doing this weekend?

[Beetroot]

www, it might work as a treat though. He coudl come with you for a couple of days? If he sleeps well??

[paolosgirl]

Oh you poor thing . I haven't got any experience of this, but as an outisder looking in, (I'm trying to word this very carefully, so if it comes out wrong, and I apologise), it seems as if he's got a lot of anger and worry in that little head. Your working away has probably been hard on him, and although they are very resilient, it could have been that the 3 weeks over Christmas has maybe made him realise that he just wants you back.
On top of that, you've mentioned you might be moving - so not only does he probably feel very resentful of your job for taking you away for 6 months, but now the job is probably going to be taking him away from everything he knows - school, friends, home - everything. And on top of that, the job meant he had to go to an after-school club that he doesn't like. Even as an adult, I think we'd find that lack on control over our lives hard to take, or the absence of someone we love so much.
It's a tough one - it sounds like your job is really important to you, but it also sounds like your DS is very upset at the amount of uncertainty that he's coping with.
I'd echo the previous post that having some time for the 2 of you might help; also, would it help to look at other after-school arrangements (not always poss, I know). Good luck - this is a toughie.

[NotQuiteCockney]

I don't know how much I can help, but I do have a question. Is he awake when he does all this? Or is this a sleep-walking sort of thing?

Why is he waking in the night? How is his diet? Is he getting enough exercise?

(Would he sleep better if he had something special from you in his room/bed to help him sleep? Or is that not something big boys go in for?)

[WideWebWitch]

Dh has had him in with him a couple of times and he does at least sleep there. I wonder if it's to do with not feeling safe? I couldn't sleep one night recently when it was just me and dd and dh and ds were away (in diff places), I just found it so odd and scary. I doubt marbles would work just because a star chart doesn't but I guess it's something different so maybe worth a try. Maybe I could make the rewards daily ones just to break the habit? BTW, interestingly, he DOESN'T wake up at his Dad's OR ex mils and he's there every other weekend. OTOH they let him stay up til 10pm - I don't approve - so it's not surprising I guess. I won't be trying that one, that's for sure.

[ponygirl]

Hi WWW. Sympathy, that sounds horrendous. What's his behaviour like during the day? Is it otherwise normal? Have you talked to him about it during the day (I'm sure you have!) in a calm, positive moment (!) and what does he say about it? Have you spoken to the school about how he is there, maybe he's given some clues or they've noticed some altered behaviour. Or his real dad? Maybe he's noticed something/something's been said.

Sorry, I have no experience of this, other than it reminding me of my ds1 having a night terror, but this doesn't sound like that. I assume your ds recognises you, isn't asleep with his eyes and mouth open? If my ds (just 7) started doing this I think I'd swing between anxiety about what's causing it and the urge to scream and shout at him in full blown bad-mother mode.

[NotQuiteCockney]

Oooh, another question, how does he fall asleep? Does he fall asleep with the light on, and then someone comes in and turns it off? Or with radio/whatever on? That sort of thing can make a real difference.

Does he always wake at the same time, or does it vary?

I'd be tempted to put a white noise machine in his room, but then I'm gradually getting everyone in this house used to white noise machines. They really help when you go away, as you bring the sounds from home with you, iyswim.

[WideWebWitch]

Paolosgirl, your post made me cry - you're right, it is all about the unsettledness of it. I told him this morning that I wouldn't take the job if he didn't want me too and I've told work I will NOT work beyond another 3 weeks (they wanted me to do at least another 2, I've said no). My job isn't remotely important to me, I took it because I'd been out of work for 8 months and we were nearly destitute, honestly, this was about survival, not career, I don't have one. NQC, he's sometimes sort of sleep walking at the beginnig but then is often awake properly.

[katierocket]

I think paolosgirl has made some very salient points. Personally I think you really need to give him some quality one to one time and also try to reassure him about the whole moving issue.

Maybe make a calender and put a big star on the day when your current contract ends, then get him to tick off each day. That way he can actually see that it's getting nearer to mummy always being at home again.

[WideWebWitch]

Ponygirl, I swing between those 2 people you describe He goes to sleep on his own, in his bed, after a cuddle from me and a story and hot chocolate, with the lights out but the downstairs hall light on so it's not completely dark.

[katierocket]

posts crossed.

[NotQuiteCockney]

Ah. I will look for my copy of Ferber.

I don't know if you've ever sleepwalked yourself, but I have (just once!) and being woken really really messes you up. It just puts you in the worst possible mood. I was 15, and I was shouting and screaming at everyone.

He may be sleepwalking every time (at the start)? If so, you just want to get him back into his bed. And you might want to consider some sort of stairgate across his room, so he can't get out while asleep and get hurt?

[WideWebWitch]

Kr a calendar is a really good idea.

[NotQuiteCockney]

If it is sleepwalking, I don't think rewards and punishments work, as he's not aware he's doing it. Ferber goes into sleepwalking, but I don't remember what he recommends.

[katierocket]

Yes, perhaps it will give him a little feeling of control?

[puff]

Maybe a rocket style countdown chart to when
Mummy is back permanently and you all go on holiday.

Also, perhaps sitting down together and do some drawings about how you are both feeling -it can be a good way to help children express how they feel.

You could start off with a picture of yourself, showing you feeling sad about having to spend so much time away from him, then another picture focused on you being back home permanently with him. It might encourage him to draw and help him work out his feelings.

What about sending him letters for these last few weeks you are away? Maybe be "penpals".

Don't know if you have access to webcam where you are staying - another possibility.

[paolosgirl]

Oh WWW - I am so sorry . I honestly didn't mean to make you upset. I probably worded it all wrong . How did he take your news about your job not going on past the 3 weeks?

How about making up a calender, ticking up the days left til your job finishes (if you're sure it won't go on). The for every 2 nights (or whatever) on the calender that he stays in his bed he gets a treat. Then a big family celebration at the end - a nice meal (DH could cook!), say?

[WideWebWitch]

NQC, he sometimes seems like he's sleepwalking at the start but just as often he seems completely awake and lucid. I've told him I really really don't mind him coming down for a cuddle but I can't abide the shouting and horrible behaviour and waking dd up.
You're right about the possible upheaval probably worrying him too kr.

[paolosgirl]

Penpals idea is fab, Puff

[WideWebWitch]

No, it's ok Paolosgirl, sorry, I wasn't trying to make you feel bad, you were just right I think!

[paolosgirl]

Got to go and do the food shopping now, or it's toast for dinner tonight. I'll check in here again later. Good luck, WWW