To eat meat every day?

(136 Posts)
Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 13:58:47

And ask you for easy alternatives?

Theres just me and DH. I would happily go without meat most days but he prefers meat. Not that he would dare complain....

We do have fish once a week, and omlette once a week but that sometimes has ham or bacon in it.

I do all the cooking and am late home weekdays so tend to go for grilled meat with new potatos and veg as its quick and easy. Or chilli/bolognaise

Any suggestions?

ThatBloodyWoman Thu 01-May-14 14:03:09

I am veggie, but dh is a dedicated meat lover.

I think that we should all cut down on meat consumption.yanbu as you are considering cutting down your meat.

Everyone(ish) likes jackets and beans.
There's a simple healthy meal!

I don't think it's unreasonable to eat meat every day if it works for you and your family. A lot of the time I have grilled chicken and veg.

I tend to make a lot of veggie stir fries. I also like egg noodles with beansprouts in a nice tomato and chilli sauce

jacket potato with salad, salsa and boiled egg yum

I also make a lot of soups too, pea and ham is a quick cheap and easy one, or veg soup if you want no meat...

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 14:05:17

Meat-eaters all die. So do vegetarians. Enjoy your food and your life.

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 14:06:08

Thanks, they are good suggestions for me but DH considers a jacket and beans as lunch. Or accompaniment to meat! He is very slim but has a big appetite.

EverythingIsAwesome Thu 01-May-14 14:10:09

No ideas here as I love meat and eat it every day, usually in every meal.

ThatBloodyWoman Thu 01-May-14 14:11:36

Buy pizza bases and do your own toppings.

Veggie curry.

All day breakfast with veggie sausages.

All good for a bigger appetite.

I honestly see no problem with you eating meat everyday. What brought your doubt on OP?

Some good veggie ideas here spoonful.com/recipes/vegetarian-no-meat-meals-gallery

ThatBloodyWoman Thu 01-May-14 14:14:25

Or could you have a jacket and beans and do meat for him as an addition?

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 14:15:50

YANBU, of course.

fluffyraggies Thu 01-May-14 14:17:04

I was thinking jacket potato and beans ...

then remembered DH always asks for a pile of crispy bacon with his grin

We eat meat every day pretty much too.

Davsmum Thu 01-May-14 14:20:53

Get a vegetarian cookbook - or google recipes. There are loads of lovely tasty meals without resorting to plain old Jacket spuds and beans.

I eat meat - but try to limit it to only once or twice a week.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 14:21:49

I think everyone should cut down their meat consumption for the sake of the planet, it simply isn't sustainable to eat meat every day, especially the lean meat we all buy repeatedly. So DHIBU. But I understand that it takes a while to change your palate and adjust to the feeling of being full without meat, which is different. Make high fat veggie meals in the interim, yoghurt, cream or cheese will go some way to replacing that feeling - you say your DH is slim so fat shouldn't be a problem. You can also get really tasty veggie sausages now - a favourite quick meal here is a veggie hash with onions, potatoes, cabbage and veggie sausage fried together (much nicer than it sounds on paper!). Or a veggie curry with cubes of paneer, a firm, high protein cheese.

I had a moussaka made with lentils the other day that was delicious, incredibly 'meaty' and filling thanks to the lentils. But it wouldn't be very quick (about half an hour to prepare, another 40 mins to cook). Perhaps one for the weekend!

1. cook firm green lentils in stock according to instructions (don't let them go to mush)
2. fry garlic / onion/ carrot / celery / veg of your choice (courgette, peppers, whatever) in a little oil, add drained lentils (discard stock) and tin of chopped tomatoes, simmer
3. slice aubergine into thick discs and soak in cold water for 20 mins. Pat dry and shallow fry til somewhat soft (only a couple of minutes)
4. layer aubergine and lentils lasagne style
5. cover with a mix of natural / greek yoghurt and a couple of beaten eggs
6. top with grated cheese and bake til bubbling
7. serve warm (ie let stand for 20 mins if possible) in very large portions with salad!

Tofu is an incredibly quick meat substitute - I fry in sesame oil til crispish and add to stirfries with noodles and veg. But dyed in the wool meat eaters tend to baulk at it.

Eggs are also good - years ago on my travels in Thailand I discovered how delicious a fried egg is on top of spicy vegetarian fried rice - it's still a favourite!

I am not vegetarian smile

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 14:25:33

Gosh I was half expecting a flaming!!

Foxsticks Thu 01-May-14 14:28:35

We've cut back on meat a lot, mainly because it's so expensive. If you want to try a veg cookbook we have River Cottage Veg every day, I'd really recommend it.

Lanabelle Thu 01-May-14 14:28:42

I don't think its unreasonable to eat meat everyday. most of ours are classic meat and two veg and I work on a farm so I know where it comes from (rather fussy like that) however I do find my slow cooker a godsend for cooking when I have to work. just bung it in before I leave and it cooks all day by itself and nearly done when I get in

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 14:31:13

Even one meat free day a week is better for you and the planet - why not start there and build up?

Veggie chilli is slow to make but freezes well and really filling. Buy black beans and aduki beans (dried in bags like lentils), soak overnight in cold water and cook til soft (you can freeze at this stage - if you do that, and take out to defrost in the morning, it will be as quick as a meat chilli). Make your chilli as you usually do, but throw them in instead of meat. Plenty of spice. Serve with rice, grated cheese, sour cream. The leftovers are delicious in a veggie breakfast burrito (warm flour tortilla, salsa, avocado, scrambled egg, hot sauce)

MrsD0nnaLyman Thu 01-May-14 14:33:45

We are big meat eaters too, but try to include a couple of veggie meals a week.

Tonight we are having a warm salad of roast butternut squash, field mushroom, shallots, Gorgonzola and pine nuts. If you want to make this a bit more substantial you can make a tart with a sheet of ready made puff pastry.

The other night I did www.southyorkshirefood.com/recipes/low-cal/griddled-courgettes-with-feta-lemon-mint-puy-lentils/ then made a salad with remaining ingredients plus pancetta and spring onion for lunches the next day.

Really like a good veggie chilli filled with root veg and chickpeas

Mushroom risotto is scrummy and filling. Jamie Oliver 30min recipe is best I've used, packed with flavour

Roast red pepper and halloumi burgers or skewers

For a fish alternative I always have a pack of frozen prawns, which you can chuck in stir fry, pasta etc.

We have a treat night of fresh fish grilled or pan fried once a week as it's pricy! My favourite is split between seared tuna steak or sea bass studded with garlic and rosemary

Hope that's helpful and you like some ideas!

kentishgirl Thu 01-May-14 14:38:11

I'd like a meat free day or two as well, but OH thinks they aren't proper meals. We have fish a couple of times a week though (which he likes).

one night a week I make sure we only have 'minimal' meat just for show and a touch of flavouring, so a little bit of bacon and tons of veg in a pasta sauce, for example. Or I'll make chicken, cauliflower and veg curry and it's mostly cauliflower and veg with a couple of bits of chicken each. It's my way of weaning him off the idea that meat has to be the main part and sneaking my way towards fully veggie. But even if we keep the meat in, it's reduced the amount a lot. These nights are when I'll use up a little bit of meat leftovers - I don't buy extra, I just serve a little bit less one night and use the other bit for this meal. It's reduced the amount of meat purchased by one meal a week. So the same effect overall as having a veggie night.

MaidOfStars Thu 01-May-14 14:40:51

I think YABU to eat meat every day. A large part of my vegetarianism is down to concerns about how the livestock industry is ruining the planet.

Switching to chicken is apparently better for the planet. I'm not sure I can advocate eating fish, an industry I hate with a passion.

Puy lentils can sub in for mince in anything I've tried. Paneer is a good texture in curries, tofu is good texture in stirfries.

Davsmum Thu 01-May-14 14:41:59

If you always eat meat meals - it takes time to get used to veggie meals. People probably give up - but if you stick at it - you will probably find after a few weeks you start to prefer meals without meat.
That is what happened to me.
I also lost weight without trying.

everlong Thu 01-May-14 14:44:18

That's a lot.

I would aim for every other day.

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 14:48:27

Ah so some views more along the lines that I expected.

Yes the environmental issues are the reason I thought we should cut down, and health. I buy as much free range as i can but am also on a budget.

I think the main issue is replacing the grilled chicken/pork steak etc with something. Its a different sort of meal. A good start would be the chilli/curry/bolognaise i guess.

BlackeyedSusan Thu 01-May-14 14:49:32

we have cut back on meat. one of the things I have done is cut down on tha amount of meat in each meal, (which is why I can make 60 million meals from one chicken) so make a chicken soup with butter beans for extra protein. bolognaise/chilli etc with meat for flavouring and tinned beans or a mix of lentils added.

some meals are completely veggie and the occasional vegan meal.

batch cooking helps.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 14:50:57

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 14:55:29

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 14:57:50

Replacing the grilled meat is an issue for people who want to be wholly vegetarian OP. Do the stuff that is easy to adapt, if you just want to cut back.

manicinsomniac Thu 01-May-14 15:23:26

Not excessive or unreasonable at all! I have both meat and fish every day and I still fit it (easily with lots of room to spare) within a 1200 calorie meal plan so hardly excessive!

I eat a chicken wrap for every single lunch and salmon or tuna vegetable stirfry for every single dinner (unless I'm going out for either of course but I'd still have chicken or fish).

Personal choice. I don't see any problem in it.

SlimJiminy Thu 01-May-14 15:28:38

How about making cottage pie, lasagne or chilli with veggie mince instead of normal mince? You could do it without telling DH and see if he notices?!

RiffyWammal Thu 01-May-14 16:01:19

I eat a paleo diet so enjoy meat every day, often twice a day. The paleo diet has proven health benefits, and eating meat is not harmful - it's what we are designed to eat after all. I don't eat great heaps of meat though, my plate is about 1/4 meat and the rest vegetables, nuts and fruit. Fair enough if you want to risk compromising your own health because of concerns about the environment/animal cruelty, but I think those beliefs are mistaken. Here is a good article explaining why.

Since starting paleo I eat no processed food, the manufacture of which has a big impact on the environment, and I also throw less food and packaging away. I don't eat any dairy either, the production of which emits greenhouse gasses. I wonder if people who advocate eating less meat also purposely consume less dairy?

Veggie pizza is delicious, quick and easy. Mushroom risotto. Baked portobello mushrooms with garlic butter (these are quite "meaty" in texture). All sorts of lovely veggie pilaffs. DH does a fab couscous with roasted butternut squash. All sorts of nice soups (home made leek and potato is our favourite) with crusty bread. Nigella does a great recipe of roasted squash with blue cheese - very rich and perfect for a meat eater. Tofu is great i things like Thai curry or stir fries. I like the Linda McCartney vegetable pies that can be served with mash and veg for a more traditional and easy meal in the week.

We're not completely veggie but many of our friends are (and vegan) and we only buy meat/game when it's high welfare so in practice we tend to eat it at the weekend or very occasionally midweek, and we eat fish occasionally too. There are so many lovely veggie recipes around now and it's easy to find great ingredients.

MaidOfStars Thu 01-May-14 16:07:54

it's what we are designed to eat after all

Really? You could take down a gazelle with your mighty claws and razor-sharp canines? wink

TulipOHare Thu 01-May-14 16:22:53

I have meat or fish most days, but find a jacket potato with hummus a perfectly good dinner if I'm looking to spend less.

I read somewhere (don't know where) that some Asian cultures use meat more as a condiment than as the basis of the meal. So for example, they'll have a rice-and-veg based meal with a few slivers of beef or pork to add flavour and protein. Thought that seemed like a good compromise.

Using bone broth / stock is also a good way to give a meaty flavoursomeness to rice, noodles or even pasta. I like to cook brown rice in stock for 45 minutes or so, then quickly stir-fry it with a beaten egg and some veg. It's delicious.

BolshierAyraStark Thu 01-May-14 16:37:06

We too eat mainly meat & fish with an occasional veg pasta bake or mushroom risotto etc.

Loverdose Thu 01-May-14 16:55:13

I eat meat most days. I try to eat healthily though so it's usually white meat or fish. When I make chilli or lasagne I use quorn mince. It tastes just the same! I made a chilli once for ex (Who is of the opinion that all veggie food is crap) using quorn and I pretended it was beef mince. He couldn't even tell the difference! ;)

ginaschmeena Thu 01-May-14 17:15:16

Lanabelle
You put dead bodies in your mouth
You really can't call yourself fussy I'm afraid.

dead bodies grin jesus

ginaschmeena Thu 01-May-14 17:16:36

riffy
Humans weren't designed to eat meat - sorry
www.rense.com/general20/meant.htm
One of many studies that show we aren't natural carnivores
Just because we can kill animals and eat them it doesn't mean we should.

ginaschmeena Thu 01-May-14 17:17:03

Dead bodies, yes. That's what meat is. Sorry.

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 17:19:04

And other food is dead plants. What can we bloody eat?

Humans weren't 'designed' we evolved so that's one point.

And we're not carnivores, we're omnivores.

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 17:31:23

Of course we are omnivores - our bodies benefit from eating meat as well as fruits & vegetables.

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 17:39:27

From that Rense link:

"Dr. Neal D. Barnard, PCRM's founder and president, says humans lack the raw abilities to be good hunters. "We are not quick, like cats, hawks or other predators," he says. "It was not until the advent of arrowheads, hatchets and other implements that killing and capturing prey became possible.""

Dr Bernard needs to read a book called Born To Run and learn about something called 'persistence hunting'. Does he think the human race survived on berries and grass until arrowheads etc were invented? hmm

Food for thought.

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 17:46:08

We evolved the intelligence to make arrowheads and hatchets. And to make and control fires to cook meat. Let's all enjoy what we enjoy and not attack or jeer at people whose tastes lie in other directions, ffs.

We tend to have meat about 3 times a week and eat vegetarian the rest for both health and cost reasons.

I make a lovely green lentil sauce which DH prefers to meat bolognese which is very tasty and planning on having North African butternut squash and chickpea stew next week from Hugh F-W veg book which is very substantial.

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 17:49:51

Well thanks all.

I would like to reduce the amount of meat we eat so will make a start with replacing mince and see how we get on.

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 17:50:40

Sounds like the Hugh F-W book is a good start too.

motherinferior Thu 01-May-14 17:50:40

We are ominvores, but daily meat-eating isn't a sustainable pursuit. Even if you're only eating the most ethically sourced meat and have no qualms about the fact it is, after all, an animal corpse.

I do eat meat these days but certainly not every day; and yes, in answer to a previous poster, I also make a fair effort to eat a number of vegan meals. Can't imagine eating meat every day.

I am, incidentally, an excellent cook.

We like the high book and cook from it every week (tomorrow night having goats cheese and veg frittata from it as well!). I think you either love or hate it - I got it out the library before buying it.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 17:58:20

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 17:58:30

I eat meat or chicken every day and I will continue to do so. There is no point in people bleating about eating corpses in an attempt to shock me or make me think twice about my animal consumption because I am well aware that I am eating animal flesh.

gamerchick Thu 01-May-14 17:59:08

ah man I want a steak now. angry

the meat replacement thing always makes me chuckle.. don't eat meat.. heres a fungus instead hmm no.thankyou.

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:01:49

That study a Gina posted is bollocks because although many people are intolerant to dairy produce lots of people are also allergic / intolerant to nuts, citrus fruits, wheat, shellfish. If we said humans were not designed to consume something because some people have allergies / intolerances we would never eat anything.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 18:02:36

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:05:07

That would be a good thing - more meat in the butchers for me.

motherinferior Thu 01-May-14 18:05:45

I'm not 'bleating'. And don't eat quorn.

I am rather shocked at the blatant disregard for all the stuff that's been recommended in terms of personal health and world resources. Mind you I'm also slightly shocked at people who don't buy cookbooks. A good cookbook is a lovely thing.

purplemurple1 Thu 01-May-14 18:08:07

Yanbu - I eat 'animal corpse' at most meals - so 3 times a day.
Most are hunted or reared free range by family and neighbours so fairly ethical as the hunted animals would be killed wether we eat them or not.

I was vegetarian/ vegan for 12 yrs so feel I've done my bit on the veggie meals!

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 18:08:19

'bleating' is rude, Impatient. If you don't want to hear other people's views, maybe don't frequent talk forums hmm

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:11:45

I do have cookbooks and I do listen to the health advice, but seeing as my granny and grandad are almost 90 and in reasonable health and have eaten meat every day of their lives (except when small babies) I think I can make my own judgement. If we listened to all the health studies and followed their advice we would exist in a little bubble never having any enjoyment or pleasures.
I will continue to eat meat, drink wine and eat chocolate, sit on my leather sofa, wear my suede jacket and enjoy my life.

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 18:12:36

sarinka It's a good thing for everyone to mind their own damned business. Which people should be rebuking me about my omnivorous preference? My work colleagues? Someone in the supermarket queue who sees me buying fish? Some random passer-by outside the butcher's shop?

There is a self-righteous streak about many - not all - vegetarians which does their cause no good and pisses other folk off.

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:13:10

Attempting to use shock tactics isn't polite either.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 18:15:40

On minding your own business:
1) there's a very strong argument that high meat consumption affects us all, through the environmental impact of livestock farming
2) for those who feel strongly about animal rights and welfare (I am not one, I am a meat eater at least), theirs is a moral preference and I think they should be entitled to air it on those grounds

Impatient I wonder if your granny and granddad ate as much meat as you do - have you checked?

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 18:17:13

ok Impatient well then why not just call them shock tactics initially? That way you're actually saying what you mean rather than being insulting!

(I appreciate that I am being annoying and self righteous)

gamerchick Thu 01-May-14 18:17:45

I don't mind the shock tactics.. over the years, the more slaughter videos and whatnot my militant facebook friends post in an attempt to make people give up meat makes me more 'meh' about it.

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 18:18:14

"some poor dumb creature has died for their gastronomic pleasure."

So? That is rather usual in the animal kingdom.

"Someone reading tonight might even stop eating meat, out of compassion."

Really now grin

"How would that be a bad thing, exactly?"

It's not a bad thing for meat eaters, but might be a bad thing for the others, depending on how you define 'a bad thing'. It is certainly a Darwinian thing. Not eating any meat means your muscles will not develop in quite the way that a meat eater's will. Not eating fish will have an effect on your brain and of course you will lack essential oils.

All that looks like intentional malnutrition to me, but hey, to each their own.

expatinscotland Thu 01-May-14 18:20:22

Eat right, exercise, die anyway.

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 18:21:38

rootypig Who should they be entitled to air it to? I ask again: work colleagues, people in the shop, people in the street?

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 18:21:51

"there's a very strong argument that high meat consumption affects us all, through the environmental impact of livestock farming"

Many things affect us all. Do you drive, travel by plane, eat imported foods, buy goods from any of a zillion industries that use too much energy and pollute the earth?

It is the classic game theory problem, pitting tangible personal benefit against an insignificant (per person) incremental benefit to the collective.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 18:22:01

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fancyanotherfez Thu 01-May-14 18:25:04

Sneak some Quorn mince into Spag Bol or chilli instead of minced beef. My DH is a bit of a meat eater and didn't notice when i did it, even after I told him, he said it doesnt really taste much different with al the sauce and flavourings. Also, cut down the meat and bulk out with veg. This is easy to do in casseroles and stews. I tried to do 2 meat free days a week, but have lapsed a bit with all my home cooking lately

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:25:19

Impatient I wonder if your granny and granddad ate as much meat as you do - have you checked?

Yes they do and always have. They come from a different country where a meal (lunch and dinner) is not seen as a meal if it doesn't have either meat, chicken or fish. They even have certain types of breakfast dishes which include fish. They probably have eaten far more animal produce than I ever will despite me eating it daily.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 18:25:38

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

fancyanotherfez Thu 01-May-14 18:27:29

Oh sorry silly me, I answered the question before realising that this had become an argument about the meat industry grin

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:28:03

The OPs DH might not want to give up his meat. The OP has already said that he likes his meat so why should he give up something that he likes? Why does a wife have the right to dictate what her husband eats? If he is too lazy to cook for himself then fair enough he has to eat what he is given, but if he shares the cooking then have some respect for his wishes to eat meat.

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 18:29:47

Not new to this one sarinka

On line I don't mind, and if I did I would not be here. I asked about three groups of people in RL: my work colleagues, people in the supermarket, people on the street outside the butcher's shop. Do you think it's their duty to point out the errors of my ways to me when the see me buying or eating meat or fish?

Pandora452 Thu 01-May-14 18:32:02

Swopping out some of the meat in meals might work too? I'm thinking lentils in mince dishes, chick peas in a curry so the meat you buy goes twice as far (and over time I guess you could completely phase out meat in those dishes?)

I've had bean crock on holiday which is uses some of the less popular parts of pork - pork belly and a trotter if you can bear it - its basically pork and beans but you make it at least a day before you want to eat it in a slow cooker (if you use a trotter, you fish out the bones - I've had it with just belly pork too and that tastes very similar!) very filling and relatively little meat in there too smile

Grilled Portobello mushrooms with a bit of garlic, some halumi and some onions in a bun is a not-to-bad substitute for a burger too smile

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 18:32:16

Impatient Why does a wife have the right to dictate what her husband eats?

Not dictate, noone could read the OP and think she is dictating, more the opposite hmm But since you ask:
Maybe because she is cooking
Maybe because the shared aspects of a relationship involve compromise

Fair enough re your grandparents, I was genuinely curious. My Turkish relatives / acquaintance eat SO much meat!

Andrew yes yes, because I have said that people are entitled to air their moral views, I mean they are entitled to accost perfect strangers in the street. That is it exactly grin

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 18:35:27

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 18:35:50

Cote the classic game theory problem is the prisoner's dilemma, which is about imperfect information. This is classic market externalities / external preference. Self regarding v other regarding actions, as Mill had it. And yes all the things you list affect others too. They are all discussed and negotiated - formally and informally - too. So we have fuel tax and air passenger duty. For example.

Pandora452 Thu 01-May-14 18:37:22

Be careful putting in Quorn. Some people react badly to it

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:38:37

Yes, relationships do involve compromise, but would you expect a vegetarian to compromise and eat meat because the other half is doing the cooking?

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 18:45:10

Do people stop reading the original post after a few responses?

To clarify, not that I have to....

DH likes a 'proper' meal. So a baked potato and beans, or soup and bread, is not 'proper' in his mind. They are lunch. I would happily have them as dinner but he would probably waste away. And ask where the meat
is to go with the potato.

If i wereon my own I would rarely have meat.

To reiterate.....any suggestions for quick alternatives?

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 18:46:25

Well I don't think it's the same thing, Impatient, because a vegetarian eating meat is to give up vegetarianism ie not a compromise but abandonment of the principle. Whereas a meat eater can eat less meat and not be vegetarian.

That said I know many couples where one person is vegetarian and the other person has a largely vegetarian diet at home in the spirit of - well, love, I suppose. Others eat separate meals so that each can be to their own. But that's for each couple to decide. My DH has a preference for less meat than I do and I have cooked more vegetarian meals to accommodate this, I am happy to. Equally he doesn't criticise what I produce, meat heavy or not, out of respect and appreciation for the labour I've put into it. So I think it doesn't have to be so adversarial, not either / or.

expatinscotland Thu 01-May-14 18:47:33

Then he buys his own meat and cooks it. Why are you skivvyng for him? You are not running a restaurant.

sarinka Thu 01-May-14 18:53:09

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 18:54:49

Rootypig - it might not be the same for you, but for some people eating meat is a big deal in the same way that vegetarianism is a big deal for others. My DH and children are like the OPs DH and would question where the meat is if I served up a vegetarian main meal (which I wouldn't because I like meat as much as they do). Why is it unacceptable to expect vegetarians to not be forced to eat meat but acceptable to expect omnivores to not have meat?
If you think it's acceptable to ask an omnivore to reduce their meat intake the perhaps we should ask vegetarians to increase their meat intake. After all they can still have their veg, nobody is stopping them.
It's just patronising controlling bullshit. If somebody likes meat then their partner should not expect them to reduce their consumption of it just because they want to reduce their own intake.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:06:43

Why is it unacceptable to expect vegetarians to not be forced to eat meat but acceptable to expect omnivores to not have meat?

In my view, because of the environmental impact of meat and because meat is not necessary for human health. Others would say animal rights, or animal welfare (I would probably agree with the latter, in that high meat consumption probably implies intensive rearing). You would disagree with all of the above. As a social scientist, I would say that the public good (environmental protection) should prevail. That is my personal answer to your question.

Anyway I think you're shadow boxing here. The OP says "I would happily go without meat most days". So I saw this thread as a partner asking for advice on how both people in the relationship can be happy, if they are to share meals. And so I gave some advice about satisfying vegetarian meals, before the bun fight began. <shrugs>

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:08:47

I should have said, high levels of meat consumption are not necessary for human health, or daily meat consumption is not necessary for human health. As I said earlier, I am not prepared to give up meat entirely myself. But I have reduced my family's meat consumption drastically, to perhaps once a week. I barely notice any more, though I would miss meat if I cut it out entirely.

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 19:10:33

rooty - Prisoner's Dilemma is just one Game Theory problem. The most basic one taught on the 1st day of a GT course.

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 19:10:39

I'm not skivvying. I do the cooking because I like to. I like to cook for us both. Although thats really not what I was asking about.

Clearly some of you think IABU for forcing DH to eat less meat. As i said, he just wants a proper sized meal and I just want some practical suggestions.

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 19:11:33

I do agree that high levels of meat consummation are not essential, but i don't think that one human should force another human to reduce their meat intake if they don't wish to do so.

Mintyy Thu 01-May-14 19:11:53

Am amazed that there are people who eat meat every day!

Nottalotta Thu 01-May-14 19:12:58

Thank you again rootypig

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:16:41

Cote Sure - I mean, my economics is just undergraduate and a long time ago. I was being finickity about what you might consider the 'classic' game theory dilemma to be. Because it just didn't strike me as a classic game theory issue, because each person is making their choice based on personal preference alone and not necessarily in anticipation of another person's choice, iyswim. I'd be interested if you want to explain.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:18:38

No need to thank me OP - not sure what for! I am just on my soapbox like everyone else. Second H F-W's book as full of good quick recipes, though it is not meat substitute ideas really, have a flick before you buy it, it might be meals that are too light for DH's preference.

Andrewofgg Thu 01-May-14 19:18:58

For DW and me, and when still lived at home for DS too, the main meal is not just about refuelling; it is about being together, talking together, acting as a family. That's not going to work without some compromise, some give and take, about what goes on the table, and we all sometimes eating what the other particularly enjoys.

My niece is a vegetarian, and for some years until she moved out DSis and BIL managed to have two meals running, so it can be done, but only because DN never criticised them, cooked the meat when it was her turn (in a three way rota) and helped was up meaty dishes. DW and I would have done the same and under the same rules for my DS if he had turned vegetarian. But I would not have stood for any lectures from him about the evils of meat and if I were a vegetarian and he turned meat-eater (in his own home) I hope I would not have given him any.

dolphinsandwhales Thu 01-May-14 19:19:16

I think eating meat everyday is not great for the environment and your health may benefit from the variety of some veggie meals.

Try swapping meat mince for soya mince (or quorn mince, though I prefer soya) when making spaghetti bolognese or chilli. I did this and no one noticed grin you can buy veggie mince in the freezer in supermarkets.

How about veggie stir fry? Or veggie curry? (I love butternut squash curry). Or a roasted vegetable lasagne? Mmm I'm hungry now!

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:19:32

Well Impatient I don't know where all the people forcing other people not to eat meat are tbh. Not me, not the OP, not you.....

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 19:21:36

Game Theory often looks at instances where an individual's interests clash with those of society at large, and that is what I meant by meat eating being a classic game theory problem - tangible personal benefit against an insignificant (per person) incremental benefit to the collective.

Eating meat & fish is definitely beneficial to me. Therefore, I intend to continue doing it. But it is not that great for the animals involved and possibly the environment, hence the society. Do I or don't I care so much about the near-zero effect that my going vegetarian would have on the planet that I stop eating meat, and thereby depriving myself of the tangible benefits of eating meat?

RiverTam Thu 01-May-14 19:23:31

if everyone cut down on their meat consumption, the amount of land that is currently used to produce feed for animals, that could be used to provide food for humans, would be massive. Cattle and sheep could be kept for land that is unsuitable for agriculture. If the market for meat was smaller (and if people were prepared to pay a proper price for meat, instead of tuppence ha'penny) then it could be produced less intensively, which would be better for the animals. I guess that the meat-every-day crowd really don't give a fuck about these issues, just their own 'right' to eat that amount of meat. Depressing that in 2014 in this country there are still people who think like that.

In answer to your question, there are loads of meat-free pasta, rice and noodles dishes you could try. Hugh Fearnley-Whitingstall's Veg is a good place to start, it's aimed not at vegetarians but those wanting to consume less meat and fish.

Otherwise, you could do what people used to and get a joint for Sunday but get about 3 meals from it (growing up we would have roast Sunday, cold meat with salad and jps Monday and some kind of stew on Tuesday, all from the same joint - that's a family of 4).

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:28:32

Game Theory often looks at instances where an individual's interests clash with those of society at large, and that is what I meant by meat eating being a classic game theory problem - tangible personal benefit against an insignificant (per person) incremental benefit to the collective.

But game theory is about strategic decision making? I understand externalities, which you describe, but I am still confused as to how game theory would be applied here. I can see that you could describe the loss of public good in game theoretic terms, but not how you would model the individual's choices, iyswim, because people don't make a choice to eat meat or not based on what everyone else does. So I can see how game theory works for say driving and travel, because the dominant strategy is to anticipate non cooperative behaviour from everyone else. The public good fails. But meat eating is not contingent in that way for most? AM I making sense? probably not!

grovel Thu 01-May-14 19:32:27

Loads of pasta dishes. It's only one extra pan to serve pesto and bolognaise.

Loads of serious salads (with potato/croutons, avocado, egg, anchovies, capers etc). Just add chicken, bacon, salami for the carnivores.

Fishcakes count as "meat" in my house for some reason best understood by the men.

CoteDAzur Thu 01-May-14 19:43:16

rooty - Vaccination is a similar example where individual benefit clashes with public good and has been analysed in GT terms, like here. HTH.

londonrach Thu 01-May-14 19:44:26

Hate pasta. Tofa is poison. Surprised it's sold as a food! Did occasionally have meat free day but that rare. Our teeth mean we meant to gave both meat and veg. Love Fish. Now I'd be happy with just fish and veg...but a good lamb roast with meat sauce..... Happy to leave beef.

Kissmequick123 Thu 01-May-14 19:48:28

Brown lentils are surprisingly meaty.

Chickpeas dishes are also good

grovel Thu 01-May-14 19:50:07

Not too hard to have vegetarian and meat curries in the freezer. Again, only one extra pan.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 19:52:04

Well it doesn't, Cote because vaccination outcomes are affected by another person's choice ie they are strategic. The possibility you choose not to vaccinate lessens the incentive for me to vaccinate, as the overall effectiveness of vaccines is reduced (approximately). I still don't see how the meat eating analogy holds. Yes, I see that it is a public good question and collective action is the ideal. But all reductions of meat eating in theory improve outcomes for all (and taking health into account, particularly the individual) - but also I think it is much more a case of personal preference than strategy. I am labouring the point - but I stand by what I first said.

Anyway, game theory arguments and pasta recipes, my favourite. I have definitely outed myself grin

GarlicMaybeNot Thu 01-May-14 19:55:18

Am I allowed a small chuckle at the less-meat example of a Sunday joint feeding a family of four for three days? That joint comprised, self-evidently, enough meat for 12 meals. The fact that it came from a single animal doesn't make it less meat grin

Impatientismymiddlename Thu 01-May-14 19:56:31

I can go with Grovels ideas because they take account of the fact that one person wants to reduce meat and one person doesn't.

rootypig Thu 01-May-14 20:01:21

Cote - sorry yes I am still here, little brain chugging away - I suddenly see that we possibly disagree not on what game theory is but whether people eat meat because they are free riding.

RiverTam Thu 01-May-14 20:36:05

the point I was making Garlic was that the joint could be your sole meat purchase for the week, and that you could, if you strip it properly, get at least 3 meals from it. That's less than eating meat everyday - isn't it? Sorry if I didn't make that clear.

RedSoloCup Thu 01-May-14 22:35:11

We don't eat much meat at all, I used to be veggie (just because I don't like a lot of meat) and now eat a small amount but not much.

Typical meals here include:
Breaded fish fillets, mash and beans
Veggie sausage casserole with mash / new pots / rice
Pasta (quorn bolog, quorn pieces and veg or just simply with a nice sauce, added veg and grated cheese on top)
Fish cake with salad and couscous
Prawn pasta pesto
quorn chilli and rice
veggie chilli / lasagne
homemade pizza - everyone choosed their own toppings

We do sometimes have chicken curry or a nice piece of fillet steak, I do steak burgers for the kids / dh and I have quorn ones, same with sausages sometimes....

GarlicMaybeNot Thu 01-May-14 23:19:50

I'm too old to faff about this, anyway. I visibly wilt if I don't have meat, and a bit of bacon stretched out with lentils doesn't fool my metabolism (I'm supposed to avoid pulses anyway, though I don't due to budgets.) When I were a lass we had meat at all three meals - often four, in fact, since we also had tea and that might include sausages or ham. Until the 70s, the only memories anybody had of meatless meals were from wartime. Then vegetarianism made its appearance, though a lot of 70s vegetarians ate fish grin

I just wanted to point out that a load of meaningless crap is spoken of how much less meat folks ate in ye oldene dayes. Outside of wars & famines, Brits have always eaten stacks of meat. A 'normal' amount of meat in modern life is way less than any but the destitute have eaten at all points in our history.

Oh, and vegetarian ape primates aren't vegetarian. They eat ants & beetles.

Nottalotta Fri 02-May-14 07:37:14

Garlic do you think the that the quantity of meat eaten in one meal is more now than in ye olden days?

When i was a child, if we had sausages, i had 1, brother and sister (older) had 1.5, mum had1 and dad had 3! (he did long hours at a very physical job)

Same with a roast. Oneice of meat. So although we had meat at almost every meal, the amount per meal was much less.

Rainbunny Fri 02-May-14 17:30:37

I could be you, I actually don't like eating much meat but my DH cannot imagine a dinner without it. I try to make dishes that I can add meat to: diced chicken, cooked & chopped bacon etc... Things like pasta sauces (primavera, tomato based sauces), chilli, curries, fajitas, lentil soup etc...

I sometimes use quorn instead of chicken in curries as well, I forgot to mention it to DH one time and he failed to notice that it wasn't real meat.

Nottalotta Fri 02-May-14 19:56:30

Thanks rainbunny I am going to give quorn a try. Isn't it cheaper and lower in fat?

'D'H is in a right old sulk tonight and doesn't want any dinner. Fine. I've had a carrot chopped into sticks with houmous, and two boiled eggs! grin

He certainly would not consider it a 'proper' meal!

gamerchick Fri 02-May-14 20:05:44

I do that when the husband isn't here.. just have little nibbles on a plate grin

I was chatting to the husband earlier about the quorn that we had once which gave us the squits.. He did a shudder as he remembers how rank it was. It does not fool you.

Nottalotta Fri 02-May-14 20:23:11

Its a concern gamer as I know some people have violent reactions to Quorn. A friend of mine included. But worth a try.

RiverTam Fri 02-May-14 20:38:38

we don't have Quorn - DH isn't keen (he doesn't really like any kind of meat substitute) it's too low in fat for DD, and as I'm not veggie I don't really want something that isn't meat tasting of meat!

We use canned puy lentils for making spag bol.

I defy your 'D'H not to like halloumi! Mmm, Halloumi burgers rock. Might have to get some for the weekend.

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 21:39:58

I don't know, Notta. I recall the rule of thumb for a joint was 1lb per person on the bone, and more if you wanted leftovers - which you did; we were hard up and did all the economy stuff. For two adults and two children, then, you'd buy 3kg to have enough left for sarnies & pies, etc. I don't think that quantity implies paper-thin slivers or anything!

It's all changed. As others have said, the meat itself seems to be more watery unless you get lucky. Also, 'cheap cuts', don't make me larf! A few weeks ago I got the urge to do some traditional English peasant cookery, and went to the butcher for scrag end of lamb - supermarkets don't sell that kind of thing, at least not here. I asked him for his smallest useable piece: can't remember what it weighed, but it was pretty small and cost £6.50!!!! The fucker shrank by a good 50% in the slow cooker, and didn't even yield decent jelly from the bones. It made ONE meal. I live in England's best livestock farming area confused

Could have had two supermarket steaks for that, and used fewer ingredients!

With some regret, I'm grateful for cheapo chickens. I genuinely do get 4 or more solid meals from one of those, for £3. Sorry, hens.

Nottalotta Fri 02-May-14 21:43:56

How garlic?? Seriously, its the stuff of MN folklore these everlasting chickens. I buy a free range from Aldo. Its quite big. It does do 5 meals but i mean 5 single meals. I assume you mean 4 meals for more than one person?!

Admittedly i could boil the carcass etc but i don't.

gamerchick Fri 02-May-14 21:45:22

It's worth a try definitely.. I did, I wanted to bulk out the meat with something else but that isn't the answer for us grin Maybe just use half and half to see what happens first perhaps?

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 21:46:21

No, just me - and the cat gets lucky grin I generally do make stock from the carcass, but have eased up on that as my freezer was filling up with beige stew wink

gamerchick Fri 02-May-14 21:49:03

I get the big aldi chickens (although they don't behave like free range IMO.. the legs come off too easy after cooking).. I get usually a roast dinner for 4, a chicken curry for me and the husband, a sweet and sour chicken for the boys or mild curry and the stock for whatever. You can get a lot of chicken off one of those things and it goes far.

itsbetterthanabox Fri 02-May-14 21:53:39

Switch to meat replacements like quorn.

Nottalotta Fri 02-May-14 21:53:52

Well that makes me feel better garlic

So gamer you get 8 servings plus stock? Assuming there are two boys. I need to stop giving DH so much chicken....

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 21:56:24

Actually I should budget for the big chickens instead. They give more meat, proportionally, so maybe a couple of non-beige meals for the freezer smile Thanks, thread!

itsbetterthanabox Fri 02-May-14 21:56:32

There's a big problem with eating meat everyday. It's a huge contributing factor to hunger in the third world that the west eats so much meat. In turn it is terrible for the environment. It is also not needed for your body and it is cruel and unnecessary killing.

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 21:57:35

(Although chicken is beige anyway, dammit)

gamerchick Fri 02-May-14 21:58:00

I suppose.. but remember a portion of meat is something like the palm of the hand.. there doesn't need to be loads of meat per serving but tbh the meals I make seem to be more meat than anything else but if you strip the chicken properly there's a big pile of it.

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 22:00:08

Yes, box, but unfortunately 'Western' people eating anything exacerbates food poverty in the supplier countries. Have you looked into the effects your legumes, beans, wheat, rice, corn & quinoa are having on the farmer communities?

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 22:01:18

Dunno what size portions you think I'm eating, Gamer! I'm very inactive, I don't overeat.

gamerchick Fri 02-May-14 22:04:32

I've no idea garlic I don't know you.. I do know that people are surprised at what a proper portion size is usually. What size are your portions?

itsbetterthanabox Fri 02-May-14 22:45:15

Garlic meat farming takes up so much land and energy. Much, much more than any vegetable, grain, fruit or pulse. It needs space to graze/live, huge amount of water and somewhere to put all the faeces.
Plant food has to be eaten to live but eating animals is not necessary and cause far, far more damage.

GarlicMaybeNot Fri 02-May-14 23:54:27

I know it does. Fortunately I live in Europe, which is still fertile and liberally supplied with large tracts of well-watered, well-drained, uninhabited space. If I were an African subsistence farmer I'm sure I'd be eating a lot less meat. Have you looked into the effects your legumes, beans, wheat, rice, corn & quinoa are having on the farmer communities?

Rainbunny Sat 03-May-14 21:07:28

About Quorn - I've never had any digestive issues from eating it (first time to hear that actually). As a meat substitute it's probably cheaper than meat but I think it's really expensive for a meat substitute (compared to soy based products, which aren''t as good for you).

I admit it doesn't fool me but it comes pretty close to a chicken-like taste. I only use it in strong flavoured dishes like curries & Thai dishes anyway.

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