To think DH is starting to take the piss now?

(165 Posts)
BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 12:46:31

DH is now in 2 bands. This means he's off at band prac 2-4 times a week. One of the bands he comes home from work, wolfs down dinner, then goes straight back out. He eventually gets home about midnight.

The other band he goes to practice straight from work, and usually gets home about 9:30pm.

Last night he was at practice with band 2 - he went straight from work, told me he'd be back about 9:30pm. Well, at 10pm he still wasn't back. I call his mobile, no answer. At 10:30pm I tried again, but no answer. Sent him text, no reply. Was starting to get worried as was expecting him home an hour previously, & his journey home involves dark, twisty lanes.

I finally got through to him at 11:30pm - 2 hours after I was expecting him home; 2.5 hours after he should have finished practice. He said "yeah, sorry, we decided to do some recording while we were here, we're just packing up now."

Well why the hell didn't he just ring me to tell me that, or even just drop me a quick text?! We had a bit of an argument & apparently it was just one of those things that I know can happen, & I need to chill out & be more supportive. I said that I thought i was being supportive, but he takes the piss! I did back-track & ended up saying" fine, ok, just let me know in future." I hate confrontation & DH sulks for days.

I think I am bloody supportive though! He works full-time in a demanding job, I get that one of the things that keeps him sane is playing with the band. We have 2 DCs, 3yo DS & 10mo DD. Both are a nightmare at bed-time, when I'm by myself with them I'm lucky if they're both asleep by 9pm. DS has some medical issues too (although is ok most of the time). Despite this, I am happy for him to go play with his bands as I know it makes him happy.

My psychiatrist has even spoken to him before, saying that having both kids by myself for so long is something I really struggle with - sometimes the evenings are that awful me & the kids end up all sat on the sofa, all crying. At that time he was only in one band, & cut back to just 1 practice a week. That lasted for 3 weeks, then he joined another bloody band as well as increasing practices. (I have been struggling badly with post-natal depression - I was admitted into the mother & baby unit for 6 weeks when DD was a few months old, & I'm still struggling now. In fact, I'm really, really struggling. Having confusing thoughts.)

So AIBU to think he should have just bloody told me he'd be back late last night?

I know it's a tiny thing, but it's annoyed me lots. I don't know if I overreacted a bit to just a little thing?

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 12:47:24

Oh Lordy, that was a bit longer than I'd intended blush

StUmbrageinSkelt Thu 28-Nov-13 12:50:50

I'd be incandescent with rage. Communication is a perfectly reasonable thing to expect especially when they are taking the piss like this at the expense of the family.

Your dh is a man child. Lots of people have demanding jobs and don't shake off their family because they don't fit with their idea of down-time.

No idea how you might turn this around, no doubt someone else will, but YANBU.

whatsthatcomingoverthehill Thu 28-Nov-13 12:52:38

YANBU. You say he works full time in a demanding job. Well so do you (I'm assuming you're a SAHM). Except he gets to go off and have a break from it. What about you - do you get a break? Does he let you lie in at the weekends as compensation? What would he think if you went out 3 times a week for a hobby leaving him to do the kids alone?

HandragsNGladbags Thu 28-Nov-13 12:53:16

DH is in a band, doing a masters and has a very full on job.

We have 3 DC.

Band practice was the first thing to go. And I have kids who go down easily.

Do they actually gig and therefore is he bringing money in? Or are they arsing around in a studio?

He's a shit. Is this how you want to live?

So sorry op. Hugs. I know how being at home with kids feels and bedtimes. Sympathy and hugs x

JeanSeberg Thu 28-Nov-13 12:53:25

This means he's off at band prac 2-4 times a week

Make sure you get the equivalent child-free time in the evenings/weekends.

Does this happen?

frustratedashell Thu 28-Nov-13 12:53:51

His place is at home. End of

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 12:57:37

Thanks for your replies - I think I'm struggling to look at this situation objectively.

I'm still on maternity leave at the moment, I'll be going back to work 3 days a week from mid-January.

I sometimes get a lie-in on a Saturday if we're not doing much, I need it because I'm usually up at least once in the night for at least one of the kids! Doesn't end up being much of a lie-in though because by the time I've managed to get him up I'm normally fairly awake anyway.

JinglingRexManningDay Thu 28-Nov-13 12:58:14

Do you get free time too OP? He gets two evening consuming hobbies and what do you get? He's being selfish and self centered.

Please talk to your gp too.

Dillydollydaydream Thu 28-Nov-13 12:58:55

2-4 nights a week every week is excessive. He's definitely out of order not letting you know he was going to be so late too. Your dh is lucky he's married to you!

AngelaDaviesHair Thu 28-Nov-13 12:59:11

He's in the wrong. DH and I had this issue about letting one another know what was happening. We rowed, but we've sorted it. You just have to let your partner know what is going on and where you are, just as I imagine your DH would let his bandmates know if he were running 2 hours late to meet them. It is basic. Just because you're spouses doesn't mean that courtesy becomes optional.

But the real issue is that he is out of the house too much, especially give you are struggling. OK, it 'keeps him sane'. What keeps you sane? Did he consult you before he joined the 2nd band? Big concern if not.

Do you think this is really about avoiding the hard things, like bedtime, bath time and those frankly often rather boring evenings at home when you have small children?

If anything you may be underreacting. In your shoes I would be having a very serious discussion about how your family life is structured at the moment and what needs to change.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:02:24

I'm lucky in that DS goes to nursery 2 days a week, & DD has just started going 1 day a week. My in-laws often take them both one day a week too. It gives me time to sort housework out & plough on with DIY stuff. God only knows what I'm going to do when I go back to work though.

I don't really get evenings. If DH is here then he'll put DD to bed & I'll put DS to bed. If DS goes to bed ok, then I'm usually back downstairs at about 8:15/8:30pm. Then I may cook dinner (depending on day, some days we eat all together), then do dishes, laundry, cleaning & tidying...Then I pretty much go to bed.

DoJo Thu 28-Nov-13 13:02:49

What are the bands actually practising for? Because my husband is a full time bill-paying musician and he doesn't practise that much with his band unless they are rehearsing up songs for recording. And even then he wouldn't do it at the expense of our family life. This sounds like there is a group of them just jamming together in the evenings, which is neither necessary nor particularly productive if he has other responsibilities which he is failing to meet.

hermioneweasley Thu 28-Nov-13 13:03:11

You should both get equal leisure time.

BTW, work full time in a demanding job and spending time with my family and supporting my wife is a joy to me because I love them.

Whoknowswhocares Thu 28-Nov-13 13:04:10

What do you mean 'starting' to take the piss?
He's been taking it for ages. Free time should be equally distributed between the two of you.
I'd be willing to bet that his behaviour, selfishness and lack of support are a VERY big part of your PND.
He is an arse. A selfish, pathetic, man-child of an arse!

kitsmummy Thu 28-Nov-13 13:04:21

Your DH is a selfish cunt. He doesn't do this to "keep him sane", he does this because he wants to, and knowing that it is to the detriment of your sanity.

YouTheCat Thu 28-Nov-13 13:05:08

He needs to drop one of the bands at the very least and give you some bloody support.

His selfishness is undoubtedly adding to your distress.

I would agree that you need to have a serious discussion about everything going on. He sounds very selfish to me.

He thinks you should be more supportive? When *you are the one in need of support that you simply don't appear to be getting.

He should not be swanning off out when you and your DCs are ending up spending time on the sofa crying. He needs to grow up. A lot.

JeanSeberg Thu 28-Nov-13 13:05:58

Then I may cook dinner (depending on day, some days we eat all together), then do dishes, laundry, cleaning & tidying

What does he do to contribute to the running of the house?

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:08:25

He is selfish. I accidentally said that to him once & he stormed off and didn't speak to me for 2 days.

DD still doesn't have a bedroom because he's still not finished the building work. We're creating a spare bedroom too, which he is calling his man-cave, it will apparently have all his music stuff & games in it. hmm

I was studying a degree with the OU. Started my next module this Feb, but had to defer it for a year due to the PND. Not helped by the fact I never had time to do it.

AmberLeaf Thu 28-Nov-13 13:11:45

He is being incredibly selfish.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:12:21

He does nothing to do with running the house. We've argued about that before, I'm fed up of never getting 10 mins just to sit in the evening. He said he'd help, so he started doing some bits (dishes, laundry etc) while I was getting DS to bed. Great, it meant I actually got to just sit & relax for a bit. But that gradually stopped. If I ask him to help then sometimes he does, sometimes he says yeah, he'll do it in a bit, stop nagging, & sometimes he will just flat-out say "No."

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:13:47

One band is gigging just a couple of times a month, the other they're still writing material for at the moment. Both are purely hobbies.

JeanSeberg Thu 28-Nov-13 13:14:51

I think you might find the depression would mysteriously lift if you got rid of this useless waste of space.

Whoknowswhocares Thu 28-Nov-13 13:14:59

He is selfish. I accidentally said that to him once & he stormed off and didn't speak to me for 2 days.

So if you challenge him, he bullies you into submission with passive aggressive shit then. He sounds like a bloody charmer OP.
To me, it would be ultimatum time. No way could I live with someone who put his fun and hobbies above my mental health sad

PuppyMonkey Thu 28-Nov-13 13:15:14

Well unless these bands he's playing in are One direction and Coldplay I'd say they're way down his list of priorities at the moment.

Actually, strike that, even if these bands are... Etc etc.

Big kid.

Hope you feel better soon op.

Dh plays in a church band and practices a couple of times a week. He can be an arse at times, but generally speaking, is very good with putting the kids to bed, for example. I would NOT put up with a hobby taking over to the point of stupidity as sounds the case with you Dh. Manchild is right. Fella needs a bit of a wake up call.

ElizabethBathory Thu 28-Nov-13 13:20:01

I'm sorry, but from everything you've said it sounds like you're married to a selfish, lazy waste of space who is not contributing family life, or even acting as if he has a family at all.

The not bothering to even text that he's going to be late would make me incredibly angry and upset in itself.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:21:20

Sorry, forgot to mention, I have physical issues too - I have kyphosis, scoliosis & degenerative disc disease. Last MRI showed 3 herniated discs too. I'm just about managing with medicines & injections, although when I get a flare-up I'm pretty much stuck to just sitting in a chair - can't turn a door-handle, never mind pick up DD!

He pissed me off with that last week. I fell down the stairs and wrenched my back. My in-laws took the kids the next day. DH had a meeting in another city, I knew what train back he was booked on, he should've been back by 6pm. In-laws brought kids back at 6:15pm, DH wasn't home yet but I thought he'd be home any minute, so told in-laws thank you very much & they might as well go home as DH would be home any minute now.

DH didn't turn up until 8:30pm. Apparently he decided he may as well go for a beer with a friend who lives in that city.

That evening was hell. Trying to get both kids to bed when I can't lift them & could barely move without pain was just a nightmare tbh.

YouTheCat Thu 28-Nov-13 13:21:25

He's an abusive arsehole.

So what does he do to support you when he can be arsed to actually be there?
You have 3 kids here.
You don't have a responsibility to one of them at all so get rid.
He sounds awful. Seriously. Why are you putting up with this treatment?
And when you go back to work you will cope with everything because he will help you.
Do a rota now and go through it with him so he is well prepared come January, to do his fair share.
And do NOT describe it to him as 'helping' you out!
He has to do his fair share. It's what a relationship is. Sharing!
He seems to just take, take, take!
Seriously think about where you want to be in 2 or 5 or 10 years time?
Still putting up with this shit!?? I think not!

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 13:22:16

Hang on... you're getting 3 days a week child free time.

This is plenty of time to get tidied up and then have a good chunk of time to yourself.

I do think your dh needs to be home earlier to help you with bedtime, but I think begrudging him free time of his own is quite unfair.

When you return to work then you will both have to reevaluate. Dh & I have a deal that when on maternity leave I am responsible for household and all children duties during the week. At the weekend he is equal to me, however I am no longer on maternity leave.

Most people don't even get a weekend off let alone 3 full days!

LittleBairn Thu 28-Nov-13 13:22:29

YANBU I tell him its time to grow the fuck up he isn't a rock star.

Fuck the measured response then, what a dick. You deserve better than this.

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 13:24:05

I didn't read your post about your illnesses before I made my post above.

He definitely needs to be home to help you. I don't think he is abusive just selfish

I used to be in bands... I even kept one up in the first year of DDs life, but I think I attended a rehearsal fortnightly. Then I just couldn't keep it up anymore.

This week I could have gone out in the evening (not a rehearsal, but a hobby) but I decided not to because I could see how tired my DH was and I didn't want to give him the added pressure of putting both kids to bed on his own.

Usually the boot is on the other foot in this household - usually I go out more than DH. So occasionally I transgress in the "back later than expected and didn't warn you" department. The difference is, that when this happens I realise that I am in the wrong, and try to amend my behaviour in the future. The absolute opposite to your DH's reaction.

Infact the script would be the other way round: My DH (at home) - would tell me I need to be more supportive; would sulk. I can't imagine me (out and taking piss) telling DH he needed to be more supportive, or sulking.

Perhaps this is a fundamental difference in the way men and women communicate and feel they can ask for.

So yes: with young kids, and you struggling, he cannot be in two bands with this intensity of rehearsal schedule. And even one, he needs to realise, is a big impact on family life. He needs to hear you and take action. This is the bit its really hard to advise you on - because my character is such that I would hear my DH and take action.

All time of both spouses becomes very interlinked when you have children. I can't give my time to a voluntary activity without it impacting on DH - so he has to be fully signed up to me (us) doing that. We can't even both work without it being a partnership - an ongoing juggle of who picks up kids, looks after kids, and when we are available for work trips.

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 13:24:31

I didn't read your post about your illnesses before I made my post above.

He definitely needs to be home to help you. I don't think he is abusive just selfishb

AngelaDaviesHair Thu 28-Nov-13 13:24:42

OK, after those updates I'd say he is intent on avoiding family life, certainly all chores and parenting. That's deeply unfair at the best of times, but especially with the medical issues you have.

If he is not going to address these issues, you've got a real problem on your hands. Not sure what to advise really, but I do feel for you.

Preciousbane Thu 28-Nov-13 13:25:41

He is selfish and the fact that you were poorly enough to be an in patient shows just how monumentally selfish he is.

He just wants the single life still but have you do all the drudge of running a home.

He will be contributing directly to the state of your MH and the fact he is not taking on board what your consultant said makes me think that you would actually be better off without him.

ElizabethBathory Thu 28-Nov-13 13:29:04

Lily Perhaps this is a fundamental difference in the way men and women communicate and feel they can ask for. I see what you're saying but I think you should replace 'men and women' with 'selfish, thoughtless people and unselfish, thoughtful people'.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:30:09

Sorry, I'm a bit slow today!

I don't really have 3 child-free days though. DS is at nursery 2 days a week, DD has just started 1 day a week (literally, today is her first day!). My in-laws have them for a day about every other week, although they've only recently started having DD as well as DS.

ElizabethBathory Thu 28-Nov-13 13:31:19

That's not meant to sound sarky at all by the way - I just mean, there are plenty of men out there who are capable of thinking about their partners and how their behaviour will affect them. The OP's H does not sound like one of these men.

GobbySadcase Thu 28-Nov-13 13:31:41

Ditch the dead weight.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:40:44

I just don't know how to make this better. I've given up trying to ask him for help as I just haven't got the energy for the confrontation.

Every now & then my CPN will call him & tell him I'm struggling. Then he gets angry that she's had to call him i.e. that I didn't tell him myself. Then he wants to know what I want him to do. Depending on how I'm feeling I either say help with housework (in which case he either says ok, he'll help - but then his help tails off after a week or so. Or he'll say he hasn't really got time, or once he said that since I'm home all day with the kids while he's at work I should really be doing it then. Not easy with these kids!) or I'll just say that I don't know what he can do to help. Then he goes off in a sulk again. But I honestly just don't know what he can do to help.

You are at home on maternity leave yet you 'cook dinner, do dishes, laundry, cleaning and tidying' after DS has gone to bed at 8:15?
Sorry but I think you need to be a lot kinder to yourself. Simple dinners that you all eat earlier, laundry and cleaning done during the day etc. 8:15 is sitting on sofa with a cup of tea time.

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 13:43:51

This probably won't sound the way I would like it to.

Living with someone with severe pnd is no easy task, my dh was driven to breaking point by my crippling depression which also saw me in a unit (without my dd though)

Who looked after your ds whilst you were in hospital? How supportive was your dh when you were poorly?

Illnesses do not just effect the person who is ill, they have a huge impact on everyone in the household. I am not excusing your husbands behaviour however he may of gotten lost in his own emotions and being away fromhome means that he is away from the problems which arise from his families illnesses and stress.

How about you write him a letter? Tell him how much you love him and how you just want you all to be a family and explain how him leaving you so regular is causing your depression to worsen and your physical illnesses to cause you pain. Spell out to him exactly what you want him do for you.

Be reasonable though, he needs time off aswell.

He can presumably help by not putting himself and his hobbies before you and your family needs.

lottiegarbanzo Thu 28-Nov-13 13:45:42

He sounds like a teenager who thinks he's living with his Mum (and frankly taking the piss through lack of contribution to the running of the household even at that age).

In what way is he supportive of you? Why does he think it was ok to have kids then leave them to you to look after? Did he explain beforehand that he didn't really want to be a parent? Why doesn't he care about your health?

It reads as if any support he does offer (money, anything else? It's not obvious) could be provided remotely and, if he didn't live with you, you'd probably have less work to do overall, wouldn't you?

Could you pay a builder to finish the work on the house? Do you feel beholden to your H to get this and other practical jobs done?

Sorry but if the only benefits he offers to the family are practical, he's not really part of the family is he? Practicalities can be addressed in other ways.

Fluffycloudland77 Thu 28-Nov-13 13:47:57

He's a millstone around you're neck op.

Send him back to mummy.

YouTheCat Thu 28-Nov-13 13:48:40

OP shouldn't have to spell out what help she needs when she has so much going on with her health.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:51:33

Thinking objectively - yes, he provides money.

I'm on mat leave so not earning. My child benefit stopped earlier this year, so not getting that. His salary goes into his bank account, he then transfers a huge chunk to the joint account to pay mortgage, bills etc & for me to do shopping, my diesel, stuff for the kids etc.

lottiegarbanzo Thu 28-Nov-13 13:52:41

What he can do to help is come home from work most days and put at least one of the kids to bed, sometimes both (you do both, he can too). Maybe cover some of their getting up time in the morning. Give you a lie in every weekend. Take turns cooking dinner and doing the washing up and tidying so you get some time off in the evening. Take them out or to see his parents now and then at the weekend.

I can't understand how your arrangement is going to work when you go back to work. Your life will be work outside the home, work in the home and sleep - and not enough of that because you're doing all the nights with the dcs. While his is work outside the home plus vast amounts of leisure time and the occasional interaction with his dcs.

The return to work is a good reason to sit down and talk through how things need to be for the household to function, with you both getting osme time off and enough sleep.

Fluffycloudland77 Thu 28-Nov-13 13:53:38

Could you stretch to a cleaner? Or an ironing service? Or both with your back problems.

mummymeister Thu 28-Nov-13 13:54:26

OP - re read your posts. not once have you said that you love him. or even like him. this might be the pnd but more likely the fact that he still wants to live like a single 20 something and you have to be the grown up. its decision time. either you can get him to give you the help and support you need or you cant. if you cant then why stay with someone who creates more anxiety and work. he is a drain on you if he wont grow up. be really clear on this. he isn't going to change. why should he. write it down. tell him how you feel. suggest some solutions. there is no need for anyone how ever stressful their job or life to be out 4 nights a week. this is about blokes messing around rather than facing up to it all. don't put up with it.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 13:56:33

Re: DIY. He just has to finish the sodding plastering then I can do woodwork & decorating. When we were doing our room a couple of years ago, he was taking forever so I got my mum round & me & her fitted the new door. He came back home, I thought he'd be pleased cos we'd saved him from doing it, but he wasn't. He got in a proper strop that we'd done it (to this day I still don't understand why), he stormed out of the house, eventually came back after a few hours but again didn't say a single word to me for a couple of days.

When I was in hospital my in-laws & my parents took turns in looking after DS.

Really disturbed that he keeps 'not saying a word' to you for a couple of days when he's challenged on his laziness. This is really childish behaviour.

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 13:59:53

Could you suggest as a compromise that he helps you get the children in bed and then goes to band practice?

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 14:05:13

Going to practice after bedtime doesn't really work. He gets home from work about 6pm, we eat at about 6:15pm, then DS has to wait 30 mins before he takes his meds, then 15 mins after that until he has a drink...DS won't go to sleep by himself either, I have to wait up there with him. I've been trying really hard to address that & I'm at the point now where he'll let me wait outside in the hallway rather than in his room, so getting there! Nightmare getting him into bed in the first place now though.

And DD just will not go to sleep easily. She gets properly mad & hysterical. So if he waited til kids were in bed he'd not be leaving the house til 8pm ish, which is too late really.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 14:07:35

When I say he won't say a word for a couple of days I really do mean just that. He'll completely ignore me, & won't speak. Even if I ask him something inane, like does he want a coffee, he'll ignore me. Tbh I find it very difficult & stressful when he's like that.

enriquetheringbearinglizard Thu 28-Nov-13 14:08:19

It sounds to me like he's almost totally avoiding home life. He's not being a decent husband and he's not being a decent father either.
I totally understand that he might be under a fair bit of pressure from full time work, a second child and a poorly wife, but he should man up and see what practical help will make life easier and better for you all, not rush off to play and drink with the boys.

These trying times with little ones are so difficult in terms of chores and sleep loss, you think you won't ever get through, but you will. You just need to plan and pull together. You and your DH should be tackling all this as a team, not opposing sides with him running out and sulking when you ask him to pull his finger out.
I feel angry on your behalf.

YouTheCat Thu 28-Nov-13 14:10:40

That sulking behaviour is him punishing you for whatever thing he has deemed an offence.

It is one of the behaviours listed by women's aid as being a form of emotional abuse.

OHforDUCKScake Thu 28-Nov-13 14:12:14

Do you know what OP, you would have more time off, more of a break if you were a single mother. He would have his set days with the kids, you would have set days/nights off.

Im not saying LTB, Im putting things into perspective. Perhaps you should relay that to him.

TheBitchesOfWeestick Thu 28-Nov-13 14:12:19

He sounds utterly revolting.

Are there any women in either of these bands, by any chance?

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 14:19:19

No women in the bands as far as I know.

Tbh I don't trust him to look after the kids by himself. It was my mum's birthday a few weeks ago, we agreed I would go & take my parents out for dinner then stay over at theirs for night - first time I've been away for the night since DD was born. DS was going to in-laws so DH just had DD. I got home the following afternoon to find that all he'd given DD was loads of bottles of milk. She'd had diarrhoea & he didn't know what to feed her anyway, so he thought it better if he just stuck with bottles.

If I trusted him to look after them I would've gone away a long time ago.

Inertia Thu 28-Nov-13 14:20:07

He's worse than useless. Not only does he refuse to do any parenting or make a practical contribution to the household, he's an abusive arse to you when you sort it out yourself. And this would be the case even if you didn't have medical issues to contend with - the fact that you do makes his behaviour even nastier.

It's not a tiny thing. It's a big big thing.

I think in your shoes I would ask your inlaws to help as much as you can, as long as they are supportive. They might shame him into taking responsibility.

lottiegarbanzo Thu 28-Nov-13 14:21:41

He was cross about the door because you showed him up. He was making a thing of it being too big and tricky a task to get done and you showed it wasn't. Also, it was about control. He was in control of whether or not the job got done. You took that away from him. The sulking is all about control too and punishment. He gets to decide whether you have a nice, comfortable life or not and if you annoy him, or fail to pander to him adequately, you're punished by him witholding co-operation.

tinkertaylor1 Thu 28-Nov-13 14:24:06

He sounds likes real prick!

Why women put up with this I will never know.

Op send him back to his fucking mothers. That fact that your psychologist had had to speak to him about you needing support and he still can't step up and be a man is awful.

You are the only one that can change this situation. People only treat us however we allow them. If you want to be a door mat carry on!

He clearly has no respect for you what so ever. If you have any for your self you will fuck him off.

You will be far better off on your own.

toffeesponge Thu 28-Nov-13 14:24:58

You are living with a bully.

You need to decide if this is what you want until your children leave home. If not, tell him things have to change or he will find himself divorced.

captainmummy Thu 28-Nov-13 14:26:02

He has you well trained, OP. If you dare to raise a question/do something he doesnt like/challenge his (lack of) help, he flies into a rage and/or sulks for days. Neither of these addresses the problem, and it has the effect that you don;t raise a question/do anything/challenge him. RESULT!
He gets to do what he likes, while you get on with the drudgery, and never ever challenge him.

lottiegarbanzo Thu 28-Nov-13 14:26:19

You must realise though that everyone else can see that your health is more important than his hobby. Do you realise how obvious that is and what a big thing his choice to prioritise his leisure time obviously is, to anyone else?

ElizabethBathory Thu 28-Nov-13 14:27:18

He's not even capable of caring for his own children. Wow hmm You are getting nothing but extra anxiety and stress out of your relationship with this man.

TooExtraImmatureCheddar Thu 28-Nov-13 14:28:05

That is ridiculous. How dare he treat you like that? Refusing to speak to you for a couple of days - that is absolutely not on.


He sulks for literally days
He goes out 2-4 nights a week
He does nothing around the house
He does very little with the kids
He didn't even look after his own son when you were in hospital (!!!!)
Your CPN contacting him has no effect

Tell me, if your DH transfers a huge chunk of money into the joint account for household expenses, what about your own leisure money? What does he have left after bills, and what do you have left? Is it equal?

captainmummy Thu 28-Nov-13 14:30:12

I have a friend whose DH will not let her do anything (that he considers HIS job) round the house - to the extent that he leaves piles of papers on the stairs that he 'will sort out', tiling to be done, greenhouse to be emptied of old growbags (for eg) ; except he never does. He doesn't do it, but won't let her do it either.

I tell her to just do it and front him out.

Look up 'stonewalling abuse' you'll find your 'D'H in there!
He sounds vile.
Kick him to the curb until he can rectify his behaviour.
You should not and certainly DO NOT need to put up with this kind of shit.

JinglingRexManningDay Thu 28-Nov-13 14:41:05

So he has completely opted out of being a parent then. Happy to piss about like a single man whilst you skivvy at home. He has no respect for you and doesn't care about you. I don't say that to be unkind or to be hurtful but that's the way of it. And he has you too beaten down to object to it.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 14:42:16

I just don't know. I'm stuck.

Just to offer a little correction - he couldn't have really looked after DS when I was in hospital, he doesn't get any paid leave from work.

I don't really have leisure money I guess. The most I do leisure-wise though is go to the park or visit friends, & my diesel money comes out of the joint account as I'm not earning at the moment. I'm not that bothered about spending money - I pretty much just spend on the household/food shop, diesel, the odd soft play/coffee & the odd item of clothing I just grab from the supermarket.

I'm not even 100% sure what DH earns, I know roughly though. I know what he transfers to the joint account, but I'm not sure how much he keeps back. Enough to buy guitars & amps, & pay for practice rooms, the odd night out etc.

Elizabeth you're right, its selfish vs thoughtful not men vs women.

BionicEmu I really feel for you, you're in a right tangle. You really need some extra help from somewhere. How awful that your DH can't even cope with feeding your DD for a day!

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 15:01:29

It truly pisses me off when people start throwing out abuser & useless blah blah blah.

It sounds to me like you just don't want him to go to band practice? If he went at 8 -12 thats 4 hours hardly not a great amount of time for him to do whatever.

From what you say there is alot of trauma that has happened in the household and would it be really difficult for people to cut the guy some slack?

I was a total utter cow to my husband when I had depression.

Oh and.. he could hardly look after their ds where would the money to pay bills come from?

Then it would be his fault they lost their house.

If you've got to the point that you cannot take any more then find a way out. You both sound utterly miserable to be honest

lottiegarbanzo Thu 28-Nov-13 15:05:39

What, tinyturtletim, if he put his son to bed at night or looked after him for a day at the weekend he'd lose his job and their home? Really? No one else has suggested him giving up his job.

Whoknowswhocares Thu 28-Nov-13 15:06:34

It truly pisses me off when people start throwing out abuser & useless blah blah blah.

It's an open forum. People are perfectly entitled to call it as they see it. Everything the OP has written screams useless, selfish twunt. Abuse? Maybe not intentional, but imo it's still an abusive way to treat the person you supposedly love.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 15:06:51

That's how I'm feeling - all tangled up.

I'm fairly sure I'm not particularly happy, but I don't know what would make me happy.

As cliched as it sounds, what I really want is for my kids to be happy. Right now they have a warm house, plenty of food & lots of toys. I'm grateful for that & so am struggling to work out what to do.

It's all very well saying leave him/kick him out, but on a practical level that just doesn't work.

I don't know, I'm having a hard time thinking straight at the moment, my head is too full.

lottiegarbanzo Thu 28-Nov-13 15:10:31

Well exactly, you need some major changes to happen before you'll be able to think clearly or consider your own needs properly. To an extent then, you need to act 'on faith', following others' advice (your doctor /nurse) believing that change will make a difference and allow you to consider things properly. What you can't do is trap yourself in limbo forever, as then you'll never be in a position to make decisions about anything.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 15:11:18

tinyturtletim if you read what I have written then I don't begrudge him going to band practice. I was upset that he didn't think to get in touch to tell me that instead of being home at 9:30pm, he was going to be home at about midnight.

FriendlyLadybird Thu 28-Nov-13 15:16:56

They're not practising: they're sitting around and noodling. My DH is a musician and, though he practises a lot at home, by himself, he rehearses very little with others. OK, so he's not actually in a band but one of the reasons he isn't is that he loathes wasting too much time. Your DH is massively taking the piss.

ElizabethBathory Thu 28-Nov-13 15:18:32

tinyturtletim, whether you call it 'abuse' or not, the OP's H is stonewalling her, failing to do what he says he'll do (come home on time, complete tasks round the house), fails to feed his own children properly when looking after them, and spends money and time on himself while his wife, it seems, gets no money or leisure time to herself. It's really not a question of just begrudging him his band practice.

JoinYourPlayfellows Thu 28-Nov-13 15:29:06

Your husband is a complete failure as an adult.

He is a totally fucking useless husband and father.

He treats you like shite, you know that, don't you?

Stonewalling you for days is abusive behaviour.

He gets angry to put you in your box if you ask for him to contribute at home.

And you are UNWELL.

Medical professionals are having to ring this useless fucker up and tell him to look after his own family and he STILL won't step up.

Seriously, you'll soon find out how much he earns if you divorce him.

You'll be far better off in all possible ways and so will your children.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 15:57:46

Thank you everyone for your replies.
Honestly, my head is just too full of thoughts of hurting myself to think straight. Every time I try & think about something else, the thoughts just keep coming back. I'm not going to, I just can't stop thinking about it.

I've been with DH for 10 years now, married for 8 years. We used to do all the house stuff together. I just don't know where it all went wrong.

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 16:01:16

lottie I was referring to when the op was in a mother and baby unit. Someone up above said he should of looked after his son at the time but presumably he needed to work.

bionic I feel sorry for you honestly I really do, and I totally get the situation that you're currently in. I am glad to hear you say its not as simple as leaving, if we all left when things got to the breaking point noone would be married to anyone anymore.

Consider writing him a letter. Noone is perfect sometimes we need to realise what we are about to lose before we get a grip and shape up.

whoknows did I say people are not entitled to say as they see things? Nope. I was doing the same.

Flicktheswitch Thu 28-Nov-13 16:07:12

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Nanny0gg Thu 28-Nov-13 17:13:45

BionicEmu Have you any family or RL life support (other than his parents)?

Your H (no 'D' about it) is truly taking the piss. He isn't being a husband or a father.
tinyturtletim I don't get why you want the OP to virtually appease this total waste-of-space. He is living the life he wants at the expense of his wife and children. If he sulks when she tries to talk to him he's really going to love a letter.

BionicEmu Would you be able to see a counsellor who may help you see straight? Give you the strength to decide what you want to do? Because I really fear for when you have to do all you do now plus return to work.

Whoknowswhocares Thu 28-Nov-13 17:32:03

Have you told your counsellor what you have written here? Do they know you are having these issues and the thoughts of self harm still?
I really think you need some help in clearing your mind, plus possibly some adjustments to your medication/treatment as you are clearly struggling.
Leave to one side any relationship issues for a short time. Obviously There will need to be big changes to make this a relationship worth saving. Big, long lasting decisions shouldn't be taken right now, as you need to be in a better state of mind to think clearly. That should be your number one priority.

toffeesponge Thu 28-Nov-13 17:49:23

It all went wrong when he decided he was Lord and Master and you were subservient to him.

If you want help to leave you will get it here.

If you want help to stay you will get support but with firm words.

He is not a good father when he treats their mother like crap.

My DH never really has a set time for when he will be home but he has just texted to say he is still at work. Just courtesy to let me know as I have the kids to sort out and dinner to do for DH and I.

enriquetheringbearinglizard Thu 28-Nov-13 17:57:07

Do you feel as though everything's got a bit out of control and beyond you?
Your OP was quite long and you've talked about more than one issue. It's not just your DH's behaviour and attitude really is it? it seems the children's sleeping habits, your own health and how you've been since DD was born are all snowballing.

Perhaps it would help just to try and think about one thing at a time.
Perhaps you could have a quiet chat with DH and ask him that if he changes his plans he'd just let you know so that you could crack on with what needs to be done? Hopefully he won't spit his dummy at that simple arrangement.
Just try tackling one thing at a time so that the overall situation isn't overwhelming you all the time.

I think you need some time to build your strength up and you will get there.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 18:13:44

You're right, there's just too much & I feel at breaking point.

I haven't seen my CPN for a month or so, she keeps rearranging. I need to get used to not having her though, as come January I'll not be having her or my psychiatrist any more.

My pain management consultant is supposed to be arranging some counselling for me with one of their counsellers because I've just been told due to what spinal issues I have there's little they can do. She said that & I couldn't stop crying, the thought of being like this forever is horrible.

I think work is just going to finish me off. I'm already arguing with them over leave & how I'm starting back, & I feel actually sick when I think about it. I think they're trying to push me out of a job really.

sittinginthesun Thu 28-Nov-13 18:17:47

Where it all went wrong was that you became parents, with all the responsibilities that that entails, and you have risen to this and he has not.

I love my husband to bits, but he took a long long time to adapt. If I'd posted on here, he would have been flamed and I would have been told to LTB immediately!

He was (and still is) rarely back by bedtime. He has a long commute, but most late evenings are because he has stopped for a beer. He did very little round the house midweek, and I simply couldn't leave the children with him for more than a few minutes. The first time I went out, he called me to say the baby wouldn't stop crying and I had to come home straight away.

I have to say, it has settled down, and all is well now. I am glad I stuck it out, although I would completely understand if you choose not to.

I think what I did was to back off, because I started to sound like an old nag. I told him he could have his evenings out, so long as he let me know before hand.

I then sorted out my own social life (I play a sport, am a school governor, have nights out etc) and just made it clear that I expect him to be in on those evenings - they're a bit older now and he doesn't have to change any nappies...

We share a diary and it's first come first serve on the dates.

Strangely, once I stopped "nagging" he started to take on a lot more.

Oh, and I would tell him that the idea of a "man cave" is just childish and pathetic. Sounds like he's about 12.

Sorry, that's a bit waffly, but thinking outloud.

Branleuse Thu 28-Nov-13 18:19:24

hes a musician. Nuff said.

He needs a reality check., You shouldnt be doing all this stuff. Hes being completely selfish and unsupportive

sittinginthesun Thu 28-Nov-13 18:22:06

Sorry, meant to add that my dh couldn't cope at all with any of my mental health or physical health issues. Basically, if I'm unwell he goes to bits and runs. (Had both after ds2 was born although thankfully sorted now).

Show him this thread maybe? Might show him how on your knees you are?

tinyturtletim Thu 28-Nov-13 18:24:14

Have you tried acupuncture or an osteopath op?

If medical routes are running out definitely think of other ways

Preciousbane Thu 28-Nov-13 18:29:33

I'm worried you don't know how much he earns, my ex was like this and kept conveniently forgetting how much when i asked and not one wage slip ever arrived home.

It turned out he had a whole lot of money stashed away and earned loads more than he let on and I mean thousands more. He used to sulk as well and the atmosphere turned me in to a nervous wreck, amongst other stuff.

OP I feel so bad for you.

What is it with musicians? My best friend's (ex)husband walked out on her and their 3 sons, one of whom has cystic fibrosis, when they were all under 6. He "didn't want to be a full time dad. He didn't have enough time to concentrate on his music" FFS. Now he cancels contact on them more often than not. The youngest barely knows his own father. My friend is happier than she has ever been.

Manchesterhistorygirl Thu 28-Nov-13 18:46:38

OP why doesn't he get paid leave? I he self employed?

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 19:13:48

He's a contractor. In his industry that means he earns about twice what a permanent member of staff would earn, but obviously no leave/sick pay/pension. He only started contracting a few years ago & we weren't sure how it'd go so he's technically an employee of an umbrella corporation. In hindsight we wish he'd gone down the limited company route as he'd save thousands a year in tax & NI, so when his current contract ends he's going to look at that. His current contract has been renewed every 3-6 months for almost 3 years now.

Oh, he is no musician. Well, he's good at what he does but music is very much a hobby (however much he wishes otherwise).

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 19:20:13

I've been trying hard not to nag him. Nagging just automatically means he will not do what I ask. The alternative is not to nag & figure he'll see what needs doing but that doesn't happen either.

I've had acupuncture in the past, & it did help my back spasms but did nothing for the grinding, relentless pain. I had it twice a week through my entire pregnancy though (thanks to my amazing pain management consultant for actually doing it herself as everyone else refused), & would've been stuffed without it.

BionicEmu Thu 28-Nov-13 19:21:47

Eek, & sorry for not name-checking everyone that I'm replying to, I keep forgetting names & then trawl back through but by the time I get back to the typing-box thingy I've forgotten the name again. (Am on my phone). Also trying to get children to bed!

Someone said start small, not all the issues at once...

I wonder whether you could suggest that you start to alternate responsibility for bedtimes. Its obviously a time-consuming routine getting them to bed. (It is in my household too). Also, obviously, lots and lots of evenings you are doing it all by yourself.

So 3 nights a week he has to put both kids to bed, while you do... anything you want/ lie down with a cup of tea/ even go out if you want to?

Just an idea. Might start to alert him to the ongoing responsibilities at home. On the other hand, you might prefer to concentrate on some other aspect of your load first!

pianodoodle Thu 28-Nov-13 21:01:06

I wouldn't worry about name-checking everyone it isn't expected smile

I can't really add much if anything to what's been said other than another YANBU.

I'm so sorry but no decent adult should be acting the way your husband is. Silent treatment is disgusting IMO.

You have a family together and should be a team who support each other. He's a very selfish man who may as well be an extra child.

I wonder if his parents secretly know this and that's why they help you so much! I'm glad they do or I hate to think where you'd be.

All this talk of needing so much time away etc... really, there are people out there who do a days work and are itching to get back to their family and spend time with them.

If your main concerns about losing him are purely practical it may be worth having a chat with someone about what the reality would be there as it may not be as bad or impractical as you imagine.

I'm not saying you should or will want to leave, but in your position I'd be looking into how it would work and maybe talking it over with a counsellor and/or someone who can advise on the practical aspects. It's worth knowing what your options are...

gimcrack Thu 28-Nov-13 22:20:04

OP, it sounds as though you have a lot to cope with at the moment, and you need help. Tomorrow morning book a same day appointment with your GP and talk about how you are feeling. Ring your in-laws and ask for help with the kids. Ring your counsellor.

You can change things, but you need to start the ball rolling.

BlackeyedSusan Thu 28-Nov-13 22:46:30

i am only half way or so down the thread

but honestly, it is eaasier being a single parent and doing it all for the children with out help that the so called help that needs you to direct it, and the extra washing and mess and cooking and shopping ceated by another adult, and more imporrtantly the extra worry of whether they will kick off and strop.

you will get you child benefit back, possibly other benefits and if he cooperates maintenance.

YouTheCat Thu 28-Nov-13 23:16:54

If it's not too personal, have you lost your CB because of his earnings?

NumanoidNancy Fri 29-Nov-13 00:30:32

BionicEmu I am a musician. I play in two bands, one that gigs between two and six times a month and pays well. We rehearse that one maybe 3 times a year for a whole day. Thats it. The other one is also paid work but still getting off the ground so needs a bit more rehearsal - currently one evening practice a week but I am a single mum, the rehearsals only happen after 8 pm when my child is asleep. Your dh needs to take a long hard look at his priorities IMO.

nopanicandverylittleanxiety Fri 29-Nov-13 01:01:02


he is selfish

Grennie Fri 29-Nov-13 01:14:20

You say that both your psychiatrist and your CPN have spoken to him saying you need more support. Unlike us, they have met both of you and will be in a good position to judge what is happening. And they can both obviously see that he is not supporting you as he should. And yet, it makes no real difference to his behaviour.

Depression can often be turned in anger. women often if they are very angry, but afraid to express it, turn it inwards into depression. It may be, that what you are really feeling is massive anger towards a partner who treats you terribly.

Life can be better than this. I think you know that deep down. And many women say it is much easier being a single parent, than living with a useless partner.

TheDoctrineOfWho Fri 29-Nov-13 01:16:13

Why does he think he is more important than you?

lessonsintightropes Fri 29-Nov-13 01:29:30

Oh dear OP. Your situation is a lot more complex than mine but DH is also a musician in addition to his day job. Our situation came to a head when he was doing 3 bands weeks before our wedding in addition to a travel away job. We don't have DCs. My snapping point was him either travelling for work or having band commitments every night for ten days in the fortnight before we got married. I had a massive strop put my foot down and said I wouldn't go through with the wedding unless he radically altered his priorities. He's a good man but struggles to say no to friends and I sometimes need to be very firm/clear about my needs. Sounds like you are doing everything you can to be clear about the impact of his behaviour. I love my husband but totally meant my ultimatum. He understood - and changed. He does slip sometimes but is always open to discussion - I think if yours isn't then thinking about your own mental health and his role as the father of your children needs to be brought sharply into focus, and you need to be prepared to follow through...

zebrafinch Fri 29-Nov-13 04:58:08

YANBU He is definitely taking the piss.
My ex did this , maybe not so much practice but definitely put the band above his family, went on gigs at weekends after rehearsing in the week, leaving me alone to cope with a Brain damaged baby and toddler.

We divorced. 15 years on he is still playing to audiences of twenty in crappy venues.

BionicEmu Fri 29-Nov-13 08:10:56

YouTheCat yes, I lost child benefit due to his earnings. It was a lot of money to lose!

I think I don't confront him about anything because I haven't the energy to deal with the fall-out i.e. the way he'll react and the sulking for days on end.

Deep down I think I'm scared that he'll leave us.

lottiegarbanzo Fri 29-Nov-13 10:38:32

Well, at least you are married. Financially, that makes a massive difference if you did divorce.

JoinYourPlayfellows Fri 29-Nov-13 10:40:35

"Deep down I think I'm scared that he'll leave us."

Maybe you should start wishing for that. You'd be better off in all ways.

expatinscotland Fri 29-Nov-13 10:43:41

Let's hope he does. This guy's a twat, you know.

Roussette Fri 29-Nov-13 10:57:27

I wouldn't put up with an OH ignoring me for half an hour, let alone days. It is a horrible childish thing to do. Everyone needs space at times, course they do.. but to actually ignore you when you ask him if he want's a cuppa is beyond the pale.

Wibblypiglikesbananas Fri 29-Nov-13 13:40:09

Just a thought, if you don't know what he earns, how did you lose the child benefit? How do you know he's over the threshold?

toffeesponge Fri 29-Nov-13 14:31:42

You didn't have to lose your CB. He could have still had you receive it and he take the hit himself.

My DH has done that. Partly so I still get the money into my account and partly to do with NI I think.

Why are you scared he will leave you? He brings nothing to your life and certainly nothing to your children's lives and well being.

waterrat Fri 29-Nov-13 15:02:49

You need some counselling to talk through why you are scared of losing someone who does not make you feel loved or valued

He sulks and lives the life he wants while you do the childcare and have no freedom - you need to get your confidence up so you can imagine life without him

LineRunner Fri 29-Nov-13 15:04:42

God I thought you were my ExH's new wife for a minute!

He is 'in a band'. They are shit.

They also spend shed-loads of money on this bizarre vanity project buying instruments and equipment, studio hire, recording 'tracks' that everybody hates but feels forced to listen to and watch on their sad little You Tube links, and generally being a bit early-middle-aged embarrassing. They also all think they are god's gift to women.

Meanwhile their kids (and partners) go without (time and money).

If my ExH's new wife is reading this, the medal's in the post, love. grin

justtoomessy Fri 29-Nov-13 15:48:38

I think you would be better off single than this piss taking idiot! Blimey he is very, very selfish.

No wonder you have suffered from PND you are bringing your kids up on your own but having to deal with a grown up child as well. Not sure why you are bothered about losing him as he doesn't seem worth it in the first place. At least if he left you would get a break form the kids when he had them.

PND is hard to deal with a you need some support. Give him an ultimatum that he has to stop some of the band practice and sod his happiness and he isn't giving a shit about yours.

Darkesteyes Fri 29-Nov-13 17:38:13

tinyturtle i know you posted before you saw the posts about the OPs illness but i disagree. Whether she is ill or not why should he get to check in and out of family life like a b and b guest just because he has a penis.
And OP as well as being emotionally abusive with the sulking passive aggresive shite, the fact that he says he will "help out" says that he sees the house and kids as YOUR job and womens work and that all that is beneath him.

YouTheCat Fri 29-Nov-13 17:42:25

If he wants to behave like a single person, make it so.

Upthejunction1 Fri 29-Nov-13 17:52:32

AFFAIR....Smacks of it, yeah he may be in a band or two...but dear oh dear...he wants the single life, you n the kids are secondary. I bet you he is seeing some young thing....let's say a GROUPIE...Wake up girl smell the coffee...or his clothes more to the point.

Loopytiles Fri 29-Nov-13 18:01:13


Onsera3 Sat 30-Nov-13 07:03:47

Wow he is behaving so selfishly. So he's out leaving you to struggle by yourself when you need the help which is unkind to you. And maybe this could be because he found your depression difficult to deal with and he's avoiding you. Would he go to counselling with you?

But what about the children?! He's missing out on so much time with them due to this self indulgent hobby.

Either he is a good guy who is hiding from some issues of his own through this hobby or he is a selfish bastard. Maybe even a narcissist, though that might be taking it too far when I haven't heard enough about other aspects of his behaviour. But the stonewalling rings alarm bells of someone having a real personality problem.

Was he any better before you had the children or the PND? Did you have an enjoyable relationship?

CMK86 Sat 30-Nov-13 14:55:53

It sounds to me like he is not taking any responsibility whatsoever - for his behaviour or his family. You need to have a serious talk with him about this. What is he bringing to the relationship? What does he do for his family?

You need to make it very clear that this cannot go on. If he sulks, throws a strop, don't back down - he is using childish tactics to get his own way. It also shows how little he considers your feelings.

Don't be afraid to throw him out the house for a few days if you can't get through to him. Or even better, go away for a day or two by yourself, to get some breathing space. Hopefully that should recharge your batteries and help him realise just how much you do for him and the children.

Essentially though, yo are carrying the entire burden/responsibility of having a family, and that is not fair on you. Don't back down on this. You need to get this sorted for the sake of yourself and your children.

BionicEmu Sun 01-Dec-13 08:52:00

Sorry I haven't been back here sooner, DS has got a chest infection & so is vomiting a ridiculous amount.

One thing that's confusing me is how strongly some people are saying that DH's behaviour is unreasonable. Is it really that bad? I don't really know how other people behave I guess - I have no basis for comparison.

I've been with DH since I was 17 & he was 24, I moved in with him shortly after I met him.

He's never really been that supportive of my back problems. Sometimes he'll ask what's wrong if I'm struggling a bit, I'll say that my back has flared up & he'll just go on about how I'm always whinging about my back. I think he maybe refuses to acknowledge how bad it gets cos he knows then he'll have to actually help.

I gave up asking for help when my back's bad long ago. When I was pregnant I was really struggling - had to use crutches & ended up being induced at 37 weeks due to the pain. He still wouldn't clean the cat's litter tray & clean up the dog mess from the garden. Every time I asked him to he'd say he'll do it later, but then he didn't. So then I'd ask him again, then he'd just say I was nagging him, always on his case...if I didn't do it he'd just leave it & it wouldn't get done.

I don't know what to say to him. I'm struggling doing everything for the children & the house. I feel sick when I think about going back to work. But then I feel sick when I think about talking to him about him helping. I feel like I'm almost at breaking point, & the fall-out from confronting him will just tip me over the edge.

TheBitchesOfWeestick Sun 01-Dec-13 08:59:22

Yes, it is really that bad. Going by what you've written here, he does not like, respect or care for you at all.

gimcrack Sun 01-Dec-13 09:07:03

OP, here's an example for you to consider. When my first kid was nearly two I was very ill for a week. My husband did all the cooking and cleaning. He would bring my son into our bedroom so I could see him, then whisk him away when he tried to bounce on me.

I did nothing other than focus on getting better.

Partners support each other, particularly when you need it most. Ok, everyone has occasions when their other half seems to be getting a better deal in terms of free time, but if you have a word then it gets better. That's a healthy relationship.

AnUnearthlyChild Sun 01-Dec-13 09:19:11


It is that bad.

Pimpf Sun 01-Dec-13 09:21:44

Yes, it really is that bad. He's a selfish, irresponsible, thoughtless, childish twat.

If I were you I would want to know exactly how much he earns and what spare money is spent on his hobbies. I would also be saving a chunk of money each month for when I decided to kick him out so at least there was a slush fund. I would tell him to man up and stop being such a child himself. He is your husband, not one of the children. He is supposed to support you, not leave the mundane crap for you to do.

Apart from money, what does he actually bring to the relationship?

Sorry yes it sounds bad

Do you have no friends or family who are in good relationships (for comparison)?

AnUnearthlyChild Sun 01-Dec-13 09:28:29

Look at it this way

If you lived in a flat share with your bff how much would you expect your flat mate to pitch in and do shared chores like washing and cleaning?

That should be your benchmark. He is massively taking the piss.

FutTheShuckUp Sun 01-Dec-13 09:30:28

In what ways does this man child show you he loves you? Because most of the basic ways someone could show love and compassion for their partner for instance not wanting them to struggle when unwell he certainly doesn't

lottiegarbanzo Sun 01-Dec-13 09:34:10

Yes, it is that bad, it is very, very bad.

He doesn't care about you and treats you like a servant.

People in normal relationships care about the other person and try to make them happy. They can be selfish too but usually only within limited boundaries and they'll recognise when they've gone too far.

Partners can adopt rigid roles, often quite traditionally 'gendered' ones, which may be where some of your confusion comes from. You see other wives doing a lot of home stuff and husbands who have more defined hobbies. That's usually happened as a process of negotiation over the years though 'I prefer doing this, could you do that? I'll cook if you wash up, I'll make dinner while you put the kids to bed, I'll do the night shift if you get up with them in the morning, I'll do laundry, you deal with the dishwasher, I'll plant flowers, you mow the lawn' etc.

Men often do have more defined hobbies 'band, football, cricket' whereas women have social lives, consisting of lots of different activities. Most of us are able to pursue these activities for a similar amount of time each week.

BionicEmu Sun 01-Dec-13 09:47:12

I don't have any savings at all. The way we're set up at the moment is that DH gets paid into his bank account, then transfers a big chunk into the joint account. The mortgage & all bills go out of the joint account.

At the moment, as I'm on mat leave, I am bringing in no money at all, so all food shopping, my diesel etc is coming out of the joint account. I'm trying to spend as little as possible.

When I'm at work, I buy all the food/household shopping & my diesel etc. If I've spent all my money before the end of the month (usually due to an occasional expense like buying kids clothes) then I dip into the joint account.

Thinking about it very hard, I think maybe some of these problems started when DH started earning a lot more. He used to earn about £32k as a permanent employee. Then he was forced out of his job (local office closed so ended up being based at different office 100 miles away.) . We decided he would give contracting a go. So overnight he went from earning £32k to £60-80k. (As I said, I'm not sure exactly but am 99% sure it's in that bracket). Although of course he gets no annual leave, sick pay or pension.

This all happened when DC1 was a couple of months old. So I wasn't earning much & was at home all the time anyway.

I think sometimes he maybe has the attitude of "I bring in all this money so that's my job done." When I've spoken to him before about buying expensive music stuff he's had the attitude that he brings in all this money so he should be able to spend some of it on himself. I guess because I'm on a low wage (I work 3 days a week & my gross salary is about £10.5k - full time I would be on a salary of £18k.) I have to make up the difference by doing all the housework. I've not really thought about it before.

BionicEmu Sun 01-Dec-13 09:51:20

Oh, & I don't think he's having an affair.

In some ways I kind of wish he was. Then he might stop badgering me for sex! Plus then when I found out I would just leave him/kick him out.

Itstartshere Sun 01-Dec-13 09:59:22

This is a really sad thread. You deserve so much more. His behaviour is appalling - very, very selfish.

Pain is awful, it wears you down to a nub. He should be cherishing you and helping out where he can. He's doing the complete opposite.

How can 2 people be in a relationship where 1 of them is quite hard up, and the other is rich and spends happily on himself.


Mia4 Sun 01-Dec-13 10:24:45

OP he is being VVU. Suggest you reread your posts, imaging that it's one of your DC telling you their partner is like that. Do you still think it's acceptable and not that unreasonable?

Sounds to me like he's eroded you over time and continues to tread you down to keep you there. Have you looked into counselling?

BionicEmu Sun 01-Dec-13 10:29:43

Oddly enough, I've spoken to his parents about him quite a bit. They're really lovely & pissed off at him too. MIL keeps saying that I can't go on like this, but I said to her what else can I do? They've called him selfish too.

Example: DH rarely sees his parents. They live a 20min drive away & have DS on a Fri and sometimes DD as well. In-laws keep saying to get DH to pick the kids up from him, but he never does. If I ask him to then he's always got something that needs doing so he can't. Or sometimes he'll just say a flat "No."

MIL has been in hospital a few times now. When she's there DH will visit her every single day. Yet when she comes out he'll go months without seeing or even talking to her.

When we were trying to do the DIY stuff to make DS a bedroom DH took that long doing it (an entire year) that his dad came round and finished it off.

I'm just confused. And I don't know what to do. I'm struggling very much right now, I don't think I'm doing very well mental-health wise. That's why I'm stuck I guess. I feel at breaking point, but I know that I can't really ask DH to help more. Whatever I say I'm sure he won't like & will think I'm criticising him, so then he'll get all defensive & be in a right mood for days. And that will just tip me over the edge.

BionicEmu Sun 01-Dec-13 10:33:44

The thought of him leaving me terrifies me too though. At the moment my children have a nice, warm house, food to eat & lots of toys, craft stuff etc to play with.

It just seems a bit selfish to risk all of that.

Those are valid feelings.

Can you maybe start making small changes?

You need a. "Running away fund" ( some money of your own he can't touch) even if you never use it, so you don't feel trapped, ever, and just stay for financial reasons.

You cannot stay this helpless.

Get your financial independence sorted!

TheBitchesOfWeestick Sun 01-Dec-13 10:44:21

All of that means nothing without happiness and loving respect, Bionic. Nothing at all. Your children are seeing one parent abuse and disrespect the other on a daily basis. Your health is at risk. You sound like someone who is being rubbed out, and that is so sad. This is not a partnership in any sense.

You deserve care and joy and kindness.

5amisnotmorning Sun 01-Dec-13 11:19:34

My heart is just so sad for you.

What a partner should do is listen, support and work things out together.

I have ante natal depression at the moment and whilst I have been coping, was starting to get a bit down again. DH has taken a week off work to just do fun things together and help with DD which has made all the difference.

It doesn't matter if you are being unreasonable or not (and most definitely you are not) but the fact is that you feel that you need help and you can't turn to the person who is supposed to care the most about you.

I don't know what to advise you to do but on a practical level, what I would do is start allocating free time and free money between you. Ie. any money left after bills gets transferred to a joint savings account or gets a spending amount agreed. This could include getting a cleaner to help you out.

I would also say that you get as much of the washing etc done during the day both DC are in nursery (I had a high needs baby so know how difficult other times can be). Then evenings get divided between you both 2 nights off each and 1 to share. You can do whatever you want on your nights but I would suggest getting out of the house and letting him cope. Let him know what time you will be back and switch off your phone.

Same on the weekends - he needs to spend either Saturday or Sunday morning looking after both kids while you do something for yourself. Again, I would suggest getting out of the house, going sitting in a coffee shop, shopping etc. just leave him to it - the DC won't starve in that time.

I think the key here may be NOT to tell him what to do, just tell him what you are GOING to do for the sake of your health. Ie. understand the money situation to know if there is any money for a cleaner, get a hobby to give yourself an identity outside of being a mummy.

He will then need to sort out his band practice around those requirements. It may be possible for you to be able to do the housework on the day that both DC are in nursery then he can see that there is no 'free time' in the week and any other time needs to be shared between you.

5amisnotmorning Sun 01-Dec-13 11:22:17

And by the way, you are happy for him to go to his bands as it makes him happy..that's great - that's what people who care about each other want for their partner. So you need to ask yourself what is he prepared to do to help make you happy?

TheDoctrineOfWho Sun 01-Dec-13 11:24:49

Yes, it is that bad.

If you saw someone at the park on crutches struggling to pick up dog poo, you'd probably help them. Your husband gives you less consideration than you give a stranger.

By the way, it is really tax inefficient for your husband to draw over the higher rate tax and and over the child benefit cut off out of his business when you are not earning (assuming he is set up as a company rather than a sole trader). If he is a company and you were both shareholders, you could utilise both your tax bands and keep your income such that you still got child benefit which then increases the household income.

I wonder how he'd react to that suggestion.

Nanny0gg Sun 01-Dec-13 11:25:34

Is it really that bad? I don't really know how other people behave I guess - I have no basis for comparison.

That bad? Oh, it's much worse than 'bad'. I'm so sorry. He is treating you appallingly. He has no care, kindness or thought for you. Let alone love.

Please seek legal advice and start making plans to improve your life - no-one should live with someone who treats them this way.

Would his parents support you as they seem to clearly see what he's like?

Mia4 Sun 01-Dec-13 11:34:34

Please dont stay for the sake of your kids having that OP, I wish my parents had divorced early on rather then watch emotional abuse throughout my life. The guilt as an adult thinking mum felt she had no choice but to stay for us is horrible. I feel it's my fault (ours with sibs) that she was trapped, although tbh I'm getting over those issues now that we're all adults ourselves (some with kids) and she's still not leaving him.

BionicEmu Sun 01-Dec-13 11:57:17

Firstly I just want to say thank you to everyone who's replied. I really appreciate it, I don't really want to bother anyone I know in RL, so it's good (& a bit odd!) to see what other people think. And at least with it being here I'm not bothering anybody - if you don't want to read & respond then you don't have to!

When I'm back at work I'll try & save some money up. I'm not going to be able to save that much every month though.

I think I need to talk to DH. I have no idea how to or what to say though. I don't even know what I need to get across to him, never mind what the best way to say it is. I guess really, I'm scared to. Scared of what he'll say & scared of the repercussions. Oh god, I'm so pathetic.

I don't really have any hobbies. I can't really think of anything I can do.

Re: money etc. DH is technically an employee as he's under an umbrella corporation. So he just gets a salary & pays ridiculous amounts of tax & NI on it.

lottiegarbanzo Sun 01-Dec-13 12:27:22

Well, you can get tangled up in details of exactly who does what housework and when, which will probably take you round in circles, or you can:

Tell him you will be taking time off, go out and do it, as suggested above.

Ask him whether he loves you. Just hit him with that and let him answer freely. That's not a question anyone who does love someone can get defensive or unhappy about answering.

(I bet you get some sort of defensive, accusatory riposte, 'of course, why would you even ask? What do you want? Oh, am I not lovey dovey enough for you, did I forget the flowers? You're not a bubbling bundle of romance yourself, are you?')

NoobytheWaspSlayer Sun 01-Dec-13 12:34:23

Fucking hell.. I've read some eye-openingly awful things on mumsnet, but really really this is terrible!

Yes, yes it is that bad. And then some.

Ask yourself this - if you split up, how different would your workload and life be? It sounds like you do all the kids/house/life stuff anyway, and all he does is add to the burden. Does he bring anything other than money to your relationship? Because if that is all he brings then he would still have to pay maintenance.

Do you love him? What do you love? Do you think he loves you? How does he show it? Because it doesn't sound like he cares very much about anyone other than himself.

He lets you be in PAIN, both physically and mentally because he rather go and play music with his mates.

What. a. cunt.

lottiegarbanzo Sun 01-Dec-13 12:41:18

You could also tell him what is going to happen to support you through your back pain and depression. Don't ask, tell.

'As you know I'm really struggling with serious back pain and depression at the moment. Both are getting worse and there's a real danger I soon won't be able to look after the DCs at all. So, to avoid that happening and allow us to function as a family, here's what's going to happen:

We're going to get a cleaner for a few hours a week.

You are going to do these pick ups, bed times and take charge of this regular weekend time with the DC.

I am going to see my nurse / doctor / physio, go swimming once a week and have some time off at the weekend. That may I might start to get better, at least I should be able to prevent myself getting worse.

I've contacted the cleaning agency and everything's ready to go. You'll still be able to get to one band practice, it's up to you to organise the other one around being a dad.'

You could talk to his parents first, involve them in your plan and get their support. E.g. He could see them with the DCs at the weekend. There's a risk he'll feel ganged up on if you present it as joint plan but it also shows how desperate you are and how much everyone else agrees that things need to change. You can present it as your plan first, let him respond, then say you've checked that they are willing to play a part to make it easier all round, he just needs to play his part.

On th previous 'straight questions' theme, I'd ask if he really wanted DCs? It's not apparent from his behaviour.

RandomMess Sun 01-Dec-13 12:43:44

He is being very unreasonable I'm afraid.

I would TELL him "I am not coping with looking after the dc from 7am until 10pm by myself 4 days per week, it is making me ill. What are WE going to do about it?"

He could pay for help to come in and give you the practical support when he is out rehearsing or he could stop rehearsing and help himself. It is not forever - the dc will grow up and it will get easier.

I would try this approach for now and talk a long hard look at what you want in the future when you are feeling better.

Where are your parents/family? Could you go and stay with them for a while?

MrsAmaretto Sun 01-Dec-13 13:31:06

Start off by getting child benefit again, he can just do a tax return.

When you go back to work don't stop paying for food etc from the joint account. Save your wages. If he questions, suggest he's right, it's time to sit down & look at household earnings & outgoings.

But really your life & marriage suck, I hope things improve x

SomewhereBeyondTheSea Sun 01-Dec-13 13:51:27

It really really is bad OP. I am so sorry.

Get a cleaner (he can pay extra money into the joint account to cover it).
See a solicitor (drop the kids at his parents; don't let him know you are seeking legal advice though).
Tell him he is doing half the bedtimes each week, he can pick which evenings, and you will be leaving the house for the duration of those evenings, with your mobile off (even if you just go sit in the car somewhere! He HAS to start learning to do this stuff).

Oh and have a look at a benefits calculator and the Child Support Agency to work out what you'd be entitled to if you were single. You may find it's not too bad.

That's just for starters.

lottiegarbanzo Sun 01-Dec-13 14:35:26

Yes, definitely reinstate the chld benefit, it covers your state pension contributions, you're not getting them otherwise. You gain that and lose nothing by claiming and repaying.

Yes, keep your money for yourself. Or pay into the joint account what you think is an equal proportion to him - so if you think he's paying in a quarter of his salary, do the same. Carry on using the joint account for groceries and diesel and say 'well, my job just pays pocket money really and where else am I going to get money for clothes, haircuts, swimming and other basics?

From what you've said you are skimping on grocery shopping while on mat leave, rather than ask him to pay in more to cover esssential household expenses because you're scared he'll react angrily. That's crazy.

It would seem fair for you to do a bit more cleaning than him, according to what you can fit in on your two days not at work, depending on what it's possible to do around the dcs. That's all, that's your work time. Everything that happens in the evening and at weekends is joint leaisure / domestic tasks / enjoying and taking responsibility for the dcs time and needs to be negotiated accordingly.

I think you should suggest he accompanies you to an appointment with whoever you see for your back and one with your mental health people. He needs to hear from them how serious the problems are and what treatment is needed.

You could also suggest he sees a councellor by himself, to get to grips with his feelings about your depression and other illness. He may be having real difficulty with this and is trying to pretend it all away by sticking his head in the sand and running away. You can certainly tell him that is how it appears.

Would it help if his parents sat him down for a chat and said 'look, we can see that your marriage is in real trouble. We're scared you're going to lose your family and, in the meantime, we can't bear to see your wife suffering and your dcs being brought up without a father in their lives.'?

I've responded to posts before where there are clear imbalances in relationships and have suggested considering a hierarchy of needs e.g. everyone's health and having enough money to eat and put a roof over your heads is of topmost importance. Having friends and family close by or other support might be next. Having more interesting jobs and a higher standard of living might follow, and so on. Expensive hobbies are a very long way down that hierarchy. I'm not sure I've ever seen a thread where the imbalance is so extreme - between your 'health and basic ability to function' and his 'vast amount of time devoted to expensive hobby'.

lottiegarbanzo Sun 01-Dec-13 14:49:51

Trying to understand how a previously decent person could possibly behave the way he is, it could be that he feels very helpless in the face of your illnesses and feels that there's nothing he can do that really makes any difference, everything is always grim, difficult and awful at home whatever, so his only option is to disengage and find normaility and happiness elsewhere.

So, what he needs to know is that there are things he can do and you can do, if he supports you, that will make a real difference. Not immediately but over time. You can't make promises or feel pressured but if he understood your illnesses better and what exacerbates them and what relieves them and aids recovery, he can help create a positive environment and gain a happier family life.

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