New to the horrors of separation

(59 Posts)
Choclover27 Sat 26-Oct-13 19:12:33

After 20 years of marriage I have finally separated from my husband. I asked him to leave as yet again I found evidence of his secret drinking ( and driving ) . He has been doing this on and off for 17 years since the birth of our first child when I found a dustbin full of empty cans and gin bottles.
Two more children later, daily drinking from 4 pm and picking a fight plus binges and secrecy, finally enough is enough. And he's gone. But keeps coming in and out the house at his leisure. Internet dating before leaving the home ( he told me that with delight) plus now he has a new relationship which he thinks may be his future. Although he only met her three weeks ago, the night of leaving the house , he would like to tell the children to demonstrate his honesty.
I have started mediation process, he says its biased cis its a woman. Seeing a solicitor on tues as I want to divorce. He says he also wants a divorce ( that's good ) but wants the family home on the market immediately and wants 50% of the equity (£500 000)
Feeling sick about it all.

quoteunquote Sat 26-Oct-13 19:18:23

Good luck, sounds very draining, I hope you get a good solicitor.

mytimewillcome Sat 26-Oct-13 19:31:30

If your children are school age and I'm assuming will want to stay with you (the more responsible parent) can you stay in the family home and leave selling it until they leave? That would give you time to plan your next move. I don't know the legal chances of this.

Choclover27 Sat 26-Oct-13 19:34:05

Thankyou. Drained is exactly how I feel. Today I saw emails on the computer saying he has been paid £8000 this month but he has only given me £500 to help with looking after three children. When I brought this up he denied being paid it ( its in black and white) , then said he was not giving me another penny. But its not for e its for the chidren and te bills. I have always paid the mtg and the bills from my salary. Finally gave me £650. But he's furious. From now on you will get no more than £500 PCM he said.

Choclover27 Sat 26-Oct-13 19:37:36

Three children 17. 14, 10.
10 year old has epilepsy. I slept with him for 6 months last year till it was sorted. Husband slept with him 4 times only cos he was kept awake by his jerks.
Kids will stay with me cos I can't trust husband but this is going to be a battle cos he denies his drinking. And the kids love their dad. I don't want to stop them seeing him. I just need to keep them safe

mytimewillcome Sat 26-Oct-13 19:50:21

If I were you OP I would start collecting evidence such as how much money he earned this month. Is there any way you could prove his drinking?

So did he pay you per month and then it all came out of your account? You must be able to use that to your advantage somehow.

He sounds awful. You are doing the right thing.

mummytime Sat 26-Oct-13 19:59:47

Collect all the evidence you can, if possible at least all his account numbers etc.

You need a rottwiller of a Solicitor who will fight for you.

You can use the CSA's Maintenance Calculator to get a rough idea of how much he should be paying you. Also do not forget about his pension/pensions.

Twiggy71 Sat 26-Oct-13 20:12:23

I also separated soon to be divorced from a man who is a functioning alcoholic they never admit they have a problem with alcohol. And I was with him for 19 years and five years on he is still in denial even his dc realise now he has an alcohol problem.

Get evidence of all finances and get to a solicitor I was able to stay in my home legally until my youngest dc is 18. Although I did take on a mortgage on my own eventually so have no worries about this now.

You really do need a solicitor as knowledge is power and you feel so much better when you know your rights. Be prepared for your h to act dirty and put yourself and your dc first, good luck ..

Choclover27 Sat 26-Oct-13 21:35:47

Thanks everyone. Am seeing solicitor on tues and feel like throwing myself at her feet and screaming help!!
One if the worst things is that husband looks me in the face and calls me a liar. Says I have no proof about his drinking and that it is a fabrication of my manipulative mind. And then laughs and sneers at me. I am a strong woman but it makes me doubt myself. Is he right. Does he drink cos if me, am I the bad mother he says I am, have I really only ever cooked two meals for my children, am I lazy etc etc

mummytime Sat 26-Oct-13 22:58:06

Remember the Alanon slogan "You didn't cause this, You can't control it, You can't sure it".
In fact Alanon might be another good source of support, especially if he is going to continue being involved in your DCs lives.

(BTW the way he makes you doubt yourself is called Gaslighting, like the film.)

Choclover27 Sat 26-Oct-13 23:37:07

Hi mummytime. I've just googled gaslighting and omg. That's him and me. He says so many insults then denies them the next day if ask him why he said something to hurt me. He says its in my mind. Says I'm mad and all my friends think so, then 5 mins later says I have no friends. He told me that he was in a relationship now but I wasn't to have a relationship till our youngest child leaves home in 8 years. But four days later said that he wants to tell the children about his relationship. So when I said but you don't want me to have one so isn't this hypocritical and reminded him of the 8 year thing he said, he denied saying it at all. It's mind games. Soul destroying.

mummytime Sun 27-Oct-13 00:23:22

Try to stop engaging with him. He has no right to tell you what to do with your life.
Women's Aid may be able to help you. You may also want to look into the Freedom Programme.

Do stop talking to him. Ideally communicate about the children in writing (email or text) so you have a record. If not record him.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 09:25:46

I think you're right. It has to go in writing. This morning he came back and told me about his new partner and gave me dates he's now not going to be around. Again reiterating how happy he is with her and how lucky he is to have met her. He wants to tell the children soon as she is telling her boys this week. He has been seeing her for THREE weeks. I want him to have someone who makes him happy cos I never did, but to tell the kids so soon??? And he still wants 50% of the money And he still doesn't have a drink problem.

Pigsmummy Sun 27-Oct-13 09:58:06

I am not sticking up for him but when he is denying saying things could it because he was drunk saying it? Either way you don't really have a lot to gain by trying to sense out of him if he is so often drunk. Take evidence of earnings, CSA should get you 700/800 per child for youngest two and maybe something for running home? Good luck

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 10:03:41

As I understand it, he cannot make you sell the house until your youngest child is 18.

Get money via CSA.

Finola1step Sun 27-Oct-13 10:04:51

Right Choclover. I'm no expert on these things and there are plenty of other mnetters who can give excellent advice. But I will say, from your posts, your STBXH is taking the right effing piss out of you. It is time to toughen up my dear.

You've kicked him out. Fantastic. You now need to go into evidence collecting overdrive, esp on the financial front. You cannot stop him from introducing your dc to his new partner. You can support them through it.

Stop engaging with him unless its to do with the children. Email contact only. Get advice from solicitor about how to stop him entering the house at will. It may not be possible to change the locks but there is nothing to sto

Finola1step Sun 27-Oct-13 10:08:23

Oops posted too soon.

Nothing to stop you locking the doors from inside so that he actually has to knock.

I will reiterate that he is taking the right royal piss out of you and enjoying every minute. By engaging with him, you are opening yourself up to his mind games. You have to switch off to preserve your own emotional well being.

Get some fight and start planning your next steps.

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 10:10:43

There is also nothing to stop you adding bolts to the inside of doors. wink

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 10:58:51

Going to ask all these questions to the solicitor on tues. thankyou. Not sure how I stand on the door locking situation cos he says its still his house. Also boys would be upset if that was done
My daughter just thinks he's an idiot and is better gone.
Anyone know what the situation is re him being entitled to 50% of the money? Could he fight me for joint custody? He says its my word against his and he doesn't have a drink problem.

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 11:01:38

The 14 and 17 year olds will have a say. I don't think he can even make them visit if they choose not to and I doubt a court would seek to break up the kids unless there was a very good reason for it.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 11:02:06

And yes. He probably is drunk when he says a lot of things. Maybe not major drunk but just had a few. Suddenly clicked that I should only talk to him in the mornings.
Did I mention he's a golfer. Major love of his life
Always enough money for golf membership, bar bills, health club membership bla bla bla
I am a complete mug

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 11:04:05

You aren't a mug. And good luck with the solicitor.

Just think what a lovely relaxed Christmas you could all have without him and his drinking. smile

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 11:22:26

That's true. Two Christmas 's ago he went out in the evening on xmas day to walk the dog and didn't come back for hours. I went searching for him. Turned out he had popped in at a mates to wish him a happy Christmas and had been drinking whiskey.
Have asked him what he wants to do this year. He said he hadn't decided. Aaaagggghhhh
Must stop engaging. Must stop engaging

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 11:23:54

Don't engage.

Ask the kids what they want to do. I don't think he should have the luxury of dictating to them or you.

Finola1step Sun 27-Oct-13 11:33:00

You are not a mug.

You are a woman who has been married for 20 years and naturally you are used to consulting him on big decisions, such as Christmas. It is a hard habit to break but has to be done.

Your children are old enough to express their own views esp the 14 a d 17 year olds. Take it step by step. Deal with the next few days first. Focus on your meeting with the solicitor on Tuesday. Write a list of what you want to ask / cover in the meeting.

As for Xmas. Talk to the children. Ask them what they want and make your plans from there. Golfer Prick does not get to decide your plans.

You are not a mug. But it sounds like that he thinks you are and is quite happy to take the piss as and when he can for his own little enjoyment. Tis the time to get angry.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 11:33:59

Yes. Going to do that. Let them decide what they would like.
Will not engage anymore.
That has been a fab piece of advice. Might have it tattooed on my body somewhere for easy reminder

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 11:36:13

I loved starting some new Christmas traditions when I started my new life. Now dd is 18 we have mulled wine and cheesy Christmas films on Christmas eve.

It is lovely and relaxed and no one is waiting to see what mood the drunk one will return in any more.

arethereanyleftatall Sun 27-Oct-13 11:43:04

He sounds horrid. Sending massive hugs your way. Well done you for kicking him out. Could you secretly record some of the horrid things he says?

arethereanyleftatall Sun 27-Oct-13 11:46:30

Also, if you have been paying all the bills (you will have evidence of this through statements) what on earth is he doing with 8000 pound a month? He must have stacks somewhere, of which you would presumably be entitled to half.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 12:07:54

There is always a reason why he has the money. Doesn't have the money etc. it will all come out in mediation I guess. He's here right now. Brought boys back in from football and proceeded to make himself lunch from the fridge. I WANT TO SCREAM. My heart is racing. My stomach churning. ( have developed IBS in the last year) I will not engage. I will not engage.
The boys are happy that he's here. What can I say. Bring on Tuesday. I hope the solicitor is good.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 12:10:50

And he picks his nose. Sat on the sofa eating and picking his nose. Yuck yuck yuck

PreciousPuddleduck Sun 27-Oct-13 13:56:11

Hugs, you are doing the right thing Xx

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 15:49:44

He has no right to wander into your home and eat your food.

Some serious guidelines need putting down, in writing.

Joy5 Sun 27-Oct-13 16:33:05

I'm in the middle of a messy divorce, in court in Jan to try and sort out the finances. Basically my ex refuses to pay spousal and child maintenance at a level that means we can manage. He carries on paying the mortgage though, only missed a few payments. Also bought a new car although he denies its his.

Starting point is fifty fifty equity for the house. The partner left with the children gets a higher share, to provide a house for them. Advice is right, take it step by step.

Also think the one who leaves and has the higher income, says an awful lot of things to the partner with the lowest income. I was told repeatedly by my ex he would be getting custody, even after our middle son was 18. Now he usually sees our sons for an afternoon a week. Thats at most. Half term this week, theres a chance he'll ring our sons late morning one day, and ask if they want to go out for the day. Only a chance though.

See your solicitor, ask all the questions you can think of. You'll be paying for the hour, so make the most of it. Afterwards, don't ring or email to ask single questions, wait till you have a few. You'll be charged the same amount!

You're not a mug at all, like most of us with husbands who walk out after a lengthy marriage, you're the one whose kept everything going, for years, your kids will know how much you do, your ex will never acknowledge that.

Know its hard, but have as little to do with your ex as you can, then he can't say things that upset you.

greenfolder Sun 27-Oct-13 16:39:17

a couple of things you need to hang on to

its him, not you

you have had the good bloody sense to keep a career going through it all, are not dependent and even in your worst case scenario will be able to cope financially.

good on you.

AnyFuckersBigHat Sun 27-Oct-13 16:47:43

Tell him the cheese / ham whatever had laxatives in for the neighbours cat.

Ask him if he'd like to fuck off home now before he shits through the eye of a needle, because if he doesn't go you will be recording it and posting it on YouTube. smile

HauntedFlyingNaanBread Sun 27-Oct-13 18:03:24

Ignore, ignore, ignore.

When he tries to talk to you and spout the bullshit about how wonderful his life is and how great his new GF is - ignore. Don't make eye contact and don't say anything - keep moving and keep busy. He's only saying this shit to you to try and get a reaction so don't give him one

Re: food can you buy what you need daily? A PITA in the short term but it will ensure that there is nothing to spare so nothing for his nibs to help himself to. Batch cook and freeze stuff if you can.

Make copies of everything you can lay your hands on but most specifically anything that relates to bank accounts, pensions, savings and his pay.

Finally - the next time he gets in the car pissed, call the police and tip them off. That's not revenge - that's civic duty, because one of these days alcohol will affect his reflexes, he'll judge the road wrongly and God help anyone else who is there at the time. If he injures - or heaven forbid kills - someone, you'll never forgive yourself.

myrubberduck Sun 27-Oct-13 19:25:34

If the issue of joint custody (or residence ) ever comes up (it may be used as a threat) tell him that the court has the power to order hair strand analysis if there is an allegation that an applicant parent is a heavy drinker. I gather that the testsare pretty accurate....

Finola1step Sun 27-Oct-13 19:32:54

The greedy fecker!

His behaviour is telling you something Choclover. It's telling you that he thinks he's in charge. Even though he's not living there, has met a new woman, is talking about divorce. As far as he is concerned.. he's the boss he can come and go as he pleases. He can help himself to food from the fridge whenever he likes. Because he's still fecking in charge.

Wow, you are so well rid of Golf Prick. You must discuss with your solicitor how to deny the entitled shit access to your home. I am livid on your behalf. I do hope that sandwich gave him wicked indegestion. I know what I would like to do with one of his flipping golf clubs. grin

Euphemia Sun 27-Oct-13 19:34:13

If you have access to bank statements, can you see where he's spending his money? Might prove he's buying shitloads of booze!

Get copies of internet history, get copies of financial records and if he's been drinking at home and hiding it can you photograph hiding places?

Can you write records as far back as you think about what he's said, when etc.

And if he's in and out, is there another door you can use and keep your key in the front door lock - if he tries to get in he has to ring the door bell then.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 20:27:39

Wow everybody. Big thanks
I have started to write things down. A history of his drinking
Bad things...... The time he was on a drink break but got hit by a bus in the midfle of the night. Ambulance man called said he would live but was drunk. I told them to keep him. However he discharged himself in the middle of the night spent £60 on a taxi and arrived home covered in blood concussed and drunk. Had to hide him in the spare room Next day was youngest sons birthday party. Had to do it by myself and pretend husband was ill.
I'm going to have to pull together my energy to keep from going under. Will be speaking from a legal standpoint after tues when I know my rights.
When I ask to talk to him, this morning about youngests school application, he refused to sit down (6 ft 3 tall ) or look at me. Said he is too disgusted by me to look at me. Then answered a call from the golf club mid conversation and walked off.
I will not engage. I will not engage. And oh yes, the new girlfriend is now continually being quoted as to how she thinks I should be behaving.

HauntedFlyingNaanBread Sun 27-Oct-13 20:34:15

So don't consult him about anything. If he expects you to carry on as a single parent - then act like one. Email him - keep the communications very factual and businesslike and say only what you need to in them. If he refuses to get involved or sends abuse back, then it's just another weapon in your armory if it ends up in court.

The priority is the DC and you can demonstrate that you are keeping them as a priority. Your STBEXH's behaviour doesn't come across as being that of someone who is determined to put his kids first.

Remember - ignore, ignore, ignore. Strange how his GF thinks you should be behaving. Doesn't say much about the state of their relationship and how exciting it is, if all they do is spend their time talking about you! grin

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 20:41:14

Hey naanbread. That's funny. First time I've laughed all weekend! He spends two hours a night talking to her...... About me! How sad is that.
Interesting fact. Husband has three brothers and one sister.
Sister still married.
Two wives left two of the brothers
Third wife kicked out her husband cos he'd been having an affair, although they're now back together.

His mother left his father ( and left behind all the kids) as having an affair when my husband was 7. Father married the neighbour almost immediately.
Mother now aged 75 been having an affair for 5 years and keeps leaving her her husband and going back

They are all nuts

HauntedFlyingNaanBread Sun 27-Oct-13 20:42:52

They sound it - the good news for you is that you are leaving it all behind you, so don't have to engage with any of these incredibly odd people anymore!

YouTheCat Sun 27-Oct-13 20:45:29

Doesn't sound healthy.

If you'll excuse my language... his gf can go and fuck herself. She has no right to pass any comment on anything.

I agree with all communications via email. Also proviso that he now drops kids at the gate and doesn't enter the house.

Choclover27 Sun 27-Oct-13 20:53:50

Do you know...... I'm sat here right now with my two lovely boys cuddled next to me watching xfactor. Daughter staying in portsmouth with her Uni boyfriend and on tues we are joining her for a couple of days holiday. Right now, in this peaceful moment, I am the luckiest woman in the world

foreverondiet Sun 27-Oct-13 21:42:42

He won't get 50% of the equity unless he can demonstrate that with 50% of the equity you could move to a house suitable for you and 3 children.

If you need him to stop popping round you can take out an order against him but start with changing locks.

But you need a good lawyer...

tiredoutgran Mon 28-Oct-13 01:18:56

Ugh, you are well shot of him! You can just imagine the tales he is telling the new girlfriend (you will be the devil incarnate), all you have to remember is that you KNOW exactly what he is like and that she is very welcome to him, poor biatch, getting stuck with that!

I would change the locks, if he isn't living there then there is no reason for him to have keys, or have an extra lock fitted 'because you are nervous on your own with the children' and keep it locked. He is trying to hurt you by rubbing your nose in it and trying to make you feel as though you are not worthy of him, because he is angry that you took control. Ignore his insults and just imagine him sat on the sofa with her, picking his nose. I agree with the cat that he should pick up and drop the children at the gate, or if he can't unlock the door then you could block him when you answer it and say thank you for dropping them off before shutting it in his face. Explain to the children that as he is no longer living there it is not right for him to have free reign over the house. You don't have to slag him off to do this, if they hear his comments then they are old enough to understand anyway that he is cruel to you.

I believe the basic rate of child maintenance would apply which is around £330 per week, that was taking the 8k as gross pay, it would obviously be quite a lot more if that was net. You can call the CSA and they will set up and collect the payments for you and pay directly into your account.

AdoraBell Mon 28-Oct-13 02:06:27

Change the locks, because you lost your key and so of course you've chained the locks as matter of basic common sense.

If DCs ask why he doesn't let himself in anymore, or doesn't have a key just tell them "he doesn't live here" in a matter of fact tone. You are not preventing then access to their father etc, he just can't walk in and walk all over you.

As for the GF saying how you should behave, if she is, that could just be him gaslighting again, just smile and nod. She doesn't know you and clearly doesn't know him if she thinks he's worth spending her time with, so can't possibly form an opinion.

And make sure you get a shit hot solicitor.

Choclover27 Mon 28-Oct-13 09:19:24

Well the husband let himself in again this morning approx two hours before he was due to take the boys out for the day ! And I stood up to him and told him that from now on he is not to come and go as he pleases. I also said he is not to quote his girlfriends opinion of me. I told him he is bullying me and that I'm not going to stand for it. He has packed some more clothes. He was horrified
Also said how much sex he's getting and how wonderful it is, and he's enjoying watching how it gets to me !
I told him he is behaving like a teenager and I'm not interested.
Will get additional lock put on door as in fact it is insufficient as I'm now on my own.
Still feel like crying tho. Actually I am crying

It's okay to cry. I saw your advice on another thread Choc. How kind of you to empathise with another when you're going through this. Well done for standing up to him. Things will get better. There'll be loads more x-factor-type moments with your lovely dc x

YouTheCat Mon 28-Oct-13 09:46:04

(((Choc))) I know hugs aren't very MNetty but still.

You are well within your rights to add bolts to your doors - though I'd not change the locks until you have advice from a solicitor.

You are doing brilliantly to stand up to him. Hope that rattles his cage.

And for future reference, although I know this will be the last thing on your mind at the moment, since I left my ex I have a met a wonderful man who is 10 years my junior and makes the ex look like a wizened old drunk (which he is).

Mazza66 Mon 28-Oct-13 11:18:53

I think you are very brave Choclover27. I have a friend who has married a known drinker, and had a second baby by him, and he doesn't admit to it, nor go to meetings - he is totally in denial. This year he has disappeared three times, once for 6 days "because he needs to drink"!! He was found and brought back by the police. He stank. How she keeps, and will keep this hidden from her four year old, I don't know. Last time I was at their house, tidying up the mess, he started shouting at me that my son had created the mess in their house!!

You need to do this now for your children, to show them that you are strong. My own marriage broke down last year because of redundancy and mental breakdown that ensued. Marriage guidance counselling was rubbish. But mediation, even though I hated going was good, because you must talk to this person about the kids now and in the future, so it gets you started on that path. Texting is good, if you can't bring yourself to speak to him.

Don't worry about money, perhaps you can go back to work? The rest of your life starts right now! Look forward! Think of the freedom that you will have from this millstone that you have carried around for the last twenty years!

I am a total lurker on mumsnet, still waiting to one day become a mum blush but I couldn't read this and run, so I just had to say how wonderful you sound and how utterly rubbish your stbxh sounds. Stay strong and get through this, your future without this arse will be so much brighter. I feel so sad for you that he is being so awful, but the pain will be worth it in the end smile

Preciousbane Mon 28-Oct-13 11:33:05

My stepfather was an alcoholic that drank himself to death at 49. It's easy for me to say don't let him get to you as I'm not having to put up with him but I have seen this hideous manipulative behaviour as a child.

Your doing the right thing, just to reinforce your choices. He does sound like a pathetic teen with his comments about getting sex.

I agree get evidence and a couple of posts back you made a joke about getting a tattoo, a personal mantra for yourself. I thought when I read that this is one strong woman. You will get there, come here often for support and try and speak to someone you trust in RL as well.

Choclover27 Mon 28-Oct-13 12:47:49

I do have a job. I run a gardening business which is successful with 10 staff. But for the last two weeks i can hardly do the work, let alone manage the staff and the customers. Im falling behind.
I keep saying to myself. No one has died and no one has gone to prison. So although this is bad, it could be worse. But I feel hollow and empty. And scared for my future. I can and will be strong for my children, I am a lioness. But when I'm alone , like right now, I long for someone to hold me and love me.

HauntedFlyingNaanBread Mon 28-Oct-13 17:39:49

So you've had it from the horse's mouth - he's admitted he is only telling you this crap to get to you. Don't respond, don't engage and don't give him the reaction that he wants. Imagine you are dealing with a naughty toddler - this is classic attention seeking behaviour.

Yes to the additional lock - he doesn't live there anymore! Or if you don't want the aggro then just fit a chain to each of the doors - then keep them on whenever you are in the house.

Choclover27 Mon 28-Oct-13 17:40:26

Husband brought boys home from an exciting day out. I asked him to remember the good times that we had in the early days so that we could use those memories to be more amicable. I also said that he must no longer use new gf's opinion as it is unnecessary and hurtful.
He replied that he has been speaking about he like this to hurt me to which I replied that it has hurt me. Not because I'm jealous he has someone else( good luck to her) but that he has so little respect for me. He admitted to 'putting me through it over the years' Slight understatement.
But it means things are calmer, tonight I'm not crying and tomorrow is a new day.

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