To think leaving a dog on its own for 9 hours a day plus is mean?(71 Posts)
Please settle this argument. Dp and I have been together 2 years and when we met I already had my dog, who is 9 now. I got him when I was pg with dd1 and since then have pretty much always worked from home, so my dog has rarely been left on his own for any more than a few hours. I recently started college 2 days a week and I get up half an hour earlier so that I can drive the dog over to my mum's house, otherwise he would be shut in for 8 hours.
Dp won't stop going on about getting another dog. He used to breed pedigree dogs and really misses having his own dog, which is fair enough. But the problem, as far as I see it, is that I will be going to uni next year so will not be around so much, then after uni I will be working ft, if all goes to plan. So we will both be working ft and I think it's not right to get a dog knowing that for its whole life it's going to be left at home on its own for at least 9 hours a day. My dog will be 13 by then so will be cracking on. My mum doesn't mind having him but she would point blank refuse to look after another dog, especially as she has two of her own.
Dp's view is that there is nothing wrong with leaving a dog that long for 5 days a week, as lots of people do it. I know that's true but it just doesn't sit comfortably with me. I know I would be the one tearing myself up feeling guilty about the dog being on its own. Opinions?
Do you really need to ask?
Ffs. I'm annoyed I bloody credited this with a reply
It doesn't sit right with me either OP. We have had to do this with our dog very, very occasionally but the rest of the time one of us is working from home or doing a short day. I really wouldn't have a dog in the first place if we had to leave her/him for the entire day, every day. We are fortunate that on the one day neither of us are at home we have some amazing dogwalkers that have her all day and take her out with all of their other dogs, she has an amazing time!
What is the point of having a dog then? Yes he might like to have a dog but your current circumstances not its a no go. It's not fair.
Has he watched the programme that was on recently about dogs getting stressed bing left alone?
9 hours a day is a long time.. You could argue what is the point of having a dog when you will not be there to get enjoyment out of it? Alternatively look at dog day care or at least someone to come in and walk it half way through day?
YANBU. Would he like to be shut in for 9 hours with no use of a toilet, no company or entertainment?
He used to breed pedigree dogs, but he'd be happy to leave a dog alone for 9 hours a day on a regular basis?
Yes, it's not right OP. My next door neighbours leave their dogs all day. They are very territorial German Shepherds so they leave the back door open knowing the house is safe, but the dogs whine and howl a lot.
I would like a dog but I'm looking for work and have no idea what my hours will end up being when I do find something, so I couldn't make that kind of commitment.
Remember the dog will be a companion to the one you already have, so not only would you be leaving him all day, his companion will disappear all day too. That would be very stressful.
do lots of people leave their dogs home alone for 9+ hrs a day and think its ok? NO its not ok , dont back down on this, and you said the guy used to be a breeder ???
Would he agree to get a dog walker round 1-2 times a day if he really wanted another dog so badly?
I agree with you. It is mean and I am glad to hear that your dog has human and canine company during the day. Dp really needs to rethink this idea.
It's a long time. It would need someone popping in at some point and walking/taking to toilet
They do doggy daycare near me!
No, it's not OK - you don't need to ask do you?
The only way this could possibly work is if the dog was going to doggy daycare each day. But quite honestly, if you are working FT with all that demands, how on earth is he going to provide the time, training, input etc. that a dog (pedigree or not ) needs?
Sometimes being a responsible dog owner is about NOT owning a dog until the circumstances are right.
I can totally understand him missing being around dogs - but there are masses of ways of getting a regular doggy fix. He could start by volunteering for the Cinnamon Trust and walking a dog regularly for someone housebound or elderly - he would be bringing a huge amount of joy to both dog and owner. Most rescue kennels are always desperate for dog walkers and volunteer helpers.
Any reputable breeder would understand the importance of socialisation, training and welfare, and would not be happy to do this.
it's more than mean it's darn right cruel.If the RSPCA knew about this they would be having words and possibly more for being cruel to an animal.They reccomend you should not leave a dog longer than 4.5 hours.Dob em in or have a word with em
I used to live next door to people who left their dog all day, every day. It barked literally all day. It was a rescue dog. Some rescue.
I think it's one thing if you already have a dog and your circumstances change. And an older dog may not need as much walking. When i got divorced and had to go back to work FT my then 12 yo dog was fine as long as he got a good walk morning and evening. He slept a lot anyway.
But do deliberately get a new dog - especially a puppy - when you know it would be alone all day, isn't fair. Unless you can afford a dog walker to come in and look after him during the day, or a doggie creche (such things do exist), then it's got to be a no.
widow u missed your chane there to have the dog rescued by the rscpca ,next time dob em in .cruel bstrds
Good, I am right! No he wouldn't get doggy day care or pay for a walker as as far as he's concerned there is no problem with leaving the dog on its own. And I don't see why I should have to fork out for it, seeing as I am v opposed to him getting the dog in the first place. Yes he used to breed mastiffs, and therefore he thinks he is the authority on all things dog related, and when I try to argue I get a patronising "I think I know what I'm on about, darling, I did used to breed dogs. He would get up at the crack of dawn and take them for a good walk in the morning, then walk them again in the evening, apparently.
I totally agree with you. Which is why we don't have a dog.
We used to have a dog, my housemate would be home with him til late morning or lunchtime , then I'd get home early evening. It's not ideal but it's what he was used to and he coped. I did feel extremely bad when housemate was on holiday and he was left for 8 hours or more while I was at work but my mum used to visit him in the daytime if she could. He coped. It's not what I would recommend though. He was a small dog who had always been left for several hours a day . A bigger dog who wasn't used to being left would be worse.
Most people I know leave their dogs when they go to work. We're gone 8+ hours, dog is outside in the garden chasing birds all day. We give him lots of attention when we get home. On days when we're home most of the day, he wants to be outside quite often anyway.
If he has to be in a very small space I'd agree but if you have a room for him to play I see no problem.
See if you can get "secret lives of dogs" on demand/catchup and show him. If I recall correctly, in their experiment, 85% of the dogs showed separation anxiety at being left alone.
No it's not fair, and yes I agree very close to being cruel to the dog. They are social, pack animals who need, not just want, but need leadership, company and stimulation. We only took on our rescue dog because I work part time from home so am with the dog nearly all the time.
Please stand your ground on this. I hate to think of a dog being left alone for this long. Poor things must be desperate to wee if nothing else!!
I am not really a dog lover but that channel 4 programme was interesting as well as heartbreaking.
It was estimated that 7 million dogs could be suffering from anxiety/separation problems without the owners even knowing.
I recommend anyone with a dog or who wants a dog to watch that programme.
9 hours is far too long to leave a dog on its own. If I thought it was ok I would go out and get a dog right now. I love them and really miss having one but it just isn't right if you both work all day.
I was going to say get him to see the life of dogs as others have suggested I was nearly in tears.
My dog goes over to my mums when I go to work as I wouldn't leave him for that long. 6 hours is the most he has ever been left alone for and thats been very very rarely.
Very cruel to leave a dog that long and I doubt your furniture would last long!
I didn't get a dog till I retired as it IS cruel to leave dog alone for hours, day after day.
When I sit out in my garden I can hear a dog fairly close by whining all day 8 - 6pm. Very distressing to hear and if I had the faintest idea which house it belonged to I would call the RSPCA.
If you work full time and want a pet, get a cat. They are far more independant and are happy to be left by humans.
It is cruel to the dog and some dogs bark almost all the time when alone, my dsis neighbours dogs do this and it drives her up the wall.
Does anybody know the laws re baking dogs as we suffer from this due to neighbours dog being left?
As one bit my son the barking and scratching at the door terrifies him.
Interesting you say that, BMW6. I had to rehome my cats as I couldn't take them with me when I moved, but I am just about to move somewhere where I would be able to get a cat. Me and the dc really want to get a cat, I've pretty much always had a cat about the place and I miss having one.
BUT dp is saying no. Just on principal because I have said no to him getting a dog. He says it's him or a cat. I hope he finds somewhere nice to live!
ShowmeyourTARDIS that's what our neighbours said when we told them it was unreasonable for us to expect to listen to that all day (it wasn't so bad for us before we had DCs as we were out all day too, but when I got home from hospital after DC1 and had to listen to that all day, that was pretty difficult to accept. They said 'he is happy running around in the garden all day.' I watched him. He didn't run around all day, he stood barking at the back door virtually all day.
Retropear You can complain to the council re noise pollution. In the first instance they will send a letter to the residents about their dog, which they claim helps. Up to this point, if you want to move house and not declare that you have complained about that, I believe you don't have to declare you did that. After that, if it doesn't stop, you have to fill in timekeeping sheets about when it barks, for how long, etc. Then the council will install monitoring equipment to measure how often and how loud. Then they will take action. But if you want to put the house on the market at any point within 3 years of that all happening you have to declare it to the buyer.
Your husband is being a cock. 9 hours is FAR too long to be leaving a dog on its own, they are domesticated animals that crave human company and are bloody miserable without it.
And for the people who do leave their dogs 8 hrs+ per day, even with access to outside...I take it you've not heard that there are gangs of thugs going around stealing dogs from back gardens and using them as bait animals?? And no, that's not urban legend. It's a known problem and on the increase.
For the record I have 3 dogs, and our whole lives are planned around not leaving the dogs for more than say, 4 hours at any one time. And even that not regularly, as I work from home.
Stick to your guns, you KNOW that you're right on this one.
It certainly doesn't sit well with me to leave a dog that long every day... although I have to say in Australia it is very common to do this, and the concepts of dog walker/dog sitter is quite new to me. But in Oz, dogs are usually outside, left with balls, toys and garden to play in (and good weather most of the year!)... but many do get lonely even with an outside environment to be in. Many people have 2 dogs as well.
But to consider the other side of the arguement -
- would your dog be there too, so there is 2 of them together?
- would the dog be just in a house, or would it have access to the garden?
- will your children be home from school earlier to play/entertain dog before your work finish time? Would they be in the foreseeable future (ie. secondary type age).
- on weekends, do you usually do things that the dog can come to or be with you?
I wouldn't agree to get a dog knowing it would be locked inside all day, every weekday, but if it had a friend, access to outside and the weekends were very inclusive of the dog(s) as a general rule, then perhaps I could consider it. Having a dog walker come seems a good compromise - you're not saying no dog, just this is needed to make it work for us at this time.
The RSPCA won't rehome to anybody whose household members are out of the house all day long , for good reason!
Yes lots of people do it. Does that make it okay?
We leave the dog for long periods VERY occasionally. I work from home apart from weekend nights, and OH is home on those nights.
You can't have a cat that you are willing to look after because he can't have a dog that he's not?
He sounds an absolute arrogant arsehole tbh.
Hope at least he was a decent breeder who had homes for the puppies before they were bred.
As far as I am concerned dog breeders are as irresponsible as owners who leave their dogs all day or never walk them properly. No place for them these days. Breeding dogs is irresponsible.
YANBU. He is being selfish and entitled.
Oh, and if you're set on getting a cat again, get one from a shelter.
9 hours is a really long time to leave a dog. IMO it is very cruel.
Also, sorry but I don't think someone who bred dogs is an expert. For all we know he was an irresponsible BYB and that doesn't make him the authority on dogs in the slightest.
Astonished that someone who bred dogs would consider it OK to leave one indoors for 9 hours a day.
I think we push it with a dog at home for nearly 8 hours a day. He has a front, side and back garden to run around, has two off-leash runs every day without fail, 2/3 beach and sea runs every week, and I'm there on the school holidays. Even then, I know he's always happiest when we're around.
Sorry, your DP is also being a knob for comparing your wish for a cat as being the same as commitment to a dog.
Having said that, our new cat is amazingly person dependent, and when any one person is in the house, they are shadowed by both dog and cat.
Each can only "let go" if the pack is at home.
The beasties need us (people in general, that is). You are right to look to the future of a dog's life, OP. Stay firm.
CackleCackle said what I was too wimpy to say. So many thousands and thousands of dogs in rescues and people are still breeding. Makes me .
Jenny - in answer to your questions:
No I wouldn't start leaving my dog at home all day just because there was another dog there, and even if I did, my dog isn't going to live forever so at some point the new dog would be on its own.
I wouldn't be able to leave the back door open so it would have to be in or out. Not so bad in the warmer months but I can't imagine it's going to want to be outside all day long when it's pissing down with rain/snowing. There is also the risk that it would get stolen, especially as he is talking about getting a pedigree dog that will cost 1k+ to buy.
My eldest will be at secondary in a couple of years but we will still be talking about 8.5 hours being left alone, allowing her time to get home.
Yes we often do dog friendly stuff at the weekends but sometimes not...again my mum is good at having my dog if we are going away for the weekend but if dp got a dog I have no idea what we would do with it if we wanted to go away.
Cacklecackle, yes I will definitely get one from a shelter.
I can see why you call your dog "your dog", OP, but if you and your DP are calling his putative pooch "his" then you have problem.
The dog should be "ours".
YANBU, of course.
>He says it's him or a cat. I hope he finds somewhere nice to live!
Hopefully in rented accommodation which doesn't allow dogs so he's not tempted to be so irresponsible.
I wouldn't leave a dog on its own all day. It is horrible cruel. I would love a dog but because we work FT it's simply not possible.
Could you quote what the RSPCA and dog rescue centres say - in that they will not rehoming a dog to people who are out all day? Mind you he sound a bit of a know it all so that possibly won't make a difference anyway.
People who leave their dogs and say they are happy to be left have no idea what their dogs are up to all day. They could be barking endlessly, or simply whining with unhappiness (which is what my MIL's neighbours dog did all day, whined and whimpered).
Echt - no no, he is very clear that it would be HIS dog.
See, I don't get that it's ok to go out for the day and leave your dog "access to the garden". I subscribe to a rescue service and the amount of folks that lose their dogs from their back gardens is ridiculous. Not just thieves you have to worry about, but someone opening the gate either deliberately or by accident, the dog coming across a wee hole in the fence and going off for a jolly across a busy road, or digging under the fence, or jumping a 6-foot wall (which we were horrified to discover our lab could easily do, after we'd had her almost 3 years)...the possibilities are endless. Not to mention the dog being outside all day and howling its head off and pissing off the neighbours because what he/she wants is HUMAN COMPANY, not to be left alone for hours and hours on end without knowing when the human is coming back
Our dogs have access to a third of an acre walled garden which has been gone over inch by inch for possible breaches, because we've had some of the above happen but luckily when we were at home, because I would never leave my dogs outside even if I'm only popping to the shops. They're only ever left outside to play when someone is at home.
I feel guilty leaving ours for 6 hours when I work on a Tuesday.... and hubby goes home at lunch mid way through to let him out to pee..
Dog has such big eyes and wants to sit on my lap when I get home...
Second what ginger said about walls and digging. We patrol our fences regularly for signs of digging.
Our pooch is pitifully respectful of fences of the leaping variety, shying away from even foot-high wire flowerbed edges, but they can always surprise you.
OP, so your DP would do all the walks, feeding, etc.? I'm taking for granted this would be twice-daily.
>no no, he is very clear that it would be HIS dog.
So...he's viewing it as his possession, not as in any way a member of your family?
If he's not convinced by the almost unanimous agreement with you on this thread, how about he posts his own in Doghouse?
I guess so echt! But he's not getting a dog, so it's irrelevant
So with your DH I may have steam coming out of my ears!
You know what, if mine insisted on doing something so fuckwitted, despite every word of advice from me and from every expert out there, I really would LTB!
I haven't told him about this thread yet. I wanted to muster a few more replies first, but I will show it to him later right after I have frog marched him to the doctor about his incessant bloody snoring.
Yes he said it's not fair that he doesn't have anything of his own, so he very much sees it as being his dog.
No YANBU, in fact knowing that it's mean is the one thing that is stopping me from getting a dog and every time I get the puppy pangs I have to remind myself of this very forcefully!
^ If the RSPCA knew about this they would be having words and possibly more for being cruel to an animal.They reccomend you should not leave a dog longer than 4.5 hours^
They really wouldn't. Warm, well fed animal in a home environment. Not ideal I agree but the RSPCA wouldn't be 'having words' at all, they wouldn't be interested and thankfully so. They have bigger things on their plate than a dog left all day whilst its owners work and tbh I despair of people who waste their valuable time on such trivialities.
They key word is ^ recommend^ . Leaving a dog for 9 hours isn't brilliant, I wouldn't do it myself but plenty of people do and their dogs are perfectly fine.
What would you suggest shake? That the dog who's left for 9 hours but loved, fed, watered and walked when it's owner comes home be taken from that home and thrown into a shelter where it will stay for god knows how long until someone comes along who doesn't have to leave it for longer than 4.5 hours?
I still have guilt from having to do this with an old gh boy I had. My work changed from where I could have him with me all day to being office based. He got a good run in the morning and in the evening, and I used to go home for him at lunch times, but it was so lonely for him. He's been gone over ten years and I still feel terrible about it. My rather extreme solution to the problem in the end was to have a nervous breakdown so I couldn't work any more! One of the only good things to come out of that was I got to be at home with my boy in his last years.
These days the hounds are never left for more than a couple of hours. If we need to be away longer they go to my friend. This is with greyhounds and lurchers who are the laziest dogs in the world - you have to peel them off the sofa, but they still need company and some mental stimulation. I hope your dp realises what a selfish arse he's being - maybe he should just get a tamagotchi.
It's true that the RSPCA wouldn't actually do anything. I used to live next door to a woman with mental health problems, who played Bonnie Tyler's total eclipse of the heart every morning really loading from 5am onwards. But I digress, that wasn't the problem. She had a collie dog who lived in her tiny garden, which was just a strip of mud. She never ever took it for a walk, I lived there for 9 months and I saw her waddling down the road with him once, and that was on Christmas Day. The rest of the time he was shut outside, day and night, and used to howl and whine a lot. I called the RSPCA and they came over and said whilst it wasn't ideal there was nothing they could do because the dog had shelter (a wooden box with a manky blanket in it), and water, so his basic needs were met. I then spent the next x number of months getting abuse over the garden fence for calling the RSPCA on her.
Juice it's not trivial to the dog though is it? Or maybe the neighbours who have to put up with the howling and barking?? And how can you possibly say a dog in that situation is fine? You don't know that do you?
And I don't anyone is recommending that any dog in that unfortunate situation be hauled out and thrown into a shelter. But the OP is asking if it's ok for a future dog to be treated like this and clearly it's not.
I'm also at the husband wanting "something of his own". FFS a dog is not a toy. Get
the whining brat him a bloody iPad or a tamagochi.
not good - but you can always hre a dog walker, sorted
No, the point is that while the RSPCA couldn't intervene, its totally irresponsible not to heed their advice in the first place and deliberately choose to leave a dog alone for this long. The Dogs' Trust recommends leaving for no more than 4 hours.
Can't remember whether you said whether he was contemplating getting an adult dog or a pup... if the former, a reputable rescue would be unlikely to rehome to someone out this long, and the latter is obviously an even more ridiculous idea (how did he manage when he was breeding dogs? )
Lol at tamagotchi mostlylovinglurchers! Maybe something for him for Christmas.
I agree about lurchers, I used to have one (daftest thing you ever met), and if I ever had to leave him, he would be beside himself when excitement. Absolute rapture, spinning around in circles etc. he definitely missed me!
ginger I'm one of those neighbours who puts up with howling and barking actually because the owner works 2 - 10pm but I digress.
I didn't say it was trivial for the animal, I said it was trivial for the RSPCA. They have a lot better things to do than chase round after dogs left for longer than their 4.5 hour guideline.
My comment was aimed at shakerattlenroll who seemed to think that leaving a dog longer than the prescribed 4.5 hour guideline warranted having words and more That more would indicate the removal of the dog and/or prosecution of the owners.
don't complain if you do this and get either the RSPCA around or find the dog dead from a poisoned steak through the letterbox because someone nearby couldn't stand the endless barking.
the destruction of the house is your problem.
in short - no.
When I got home, forgot to add to the last post. Shouldn't try to post and talk on the phone at the same time.
Ask him if he is able to keep his legs crossed for 9 hours each day
Its cruel to expect them not to need to wee (or poo) or stimulation.
Boredom and separation anxiety will also mean there won't be much of a house left.
Juice you've just contradicted yourself. Saying initially that "plenty of people do and their dogs are fine" and then in the next breath that you have to put up with a dog howling and barking because it's left for 8 hours a day. So clearly, it's not fine at all.
And I think you're putting words into Shakes mouth there. It IS cruel to leave a dog for that length of time on its own, they are social animals who need human company, because we've made them like that.
Let me clarify here that I don't agree with leaving a dog for that length of time.
What I don't agree with though is calling out the RSPCA to an otherwise well looked after and healthy animal just because it has been left alone. The time taken by those officers to go out and investigate would be better served dealing with those who use dogs for fighting, those who chain up dogs in yards with no food, water or shelter, those who leave their animals suffering because they can't be bothered to take them to a vet. Those are the cases I want the RSPCA to focus on.
My neighbour took on a Jack Russell 3 years ago, a rescue of types as his old owners couldn't keep him and from all accounts treated him poorly. My neighbour is 60, lives alone and works various shifts, fortunately the latest being 10pm. From the minute the dog came into her home he barked as soon as she left him. Constantly. For 3 years she has been trying to find a solution to this but his anxiety is such that the moment she walks out of the door he barks constantly until she gets home.
Yes, its unfair on the dog. I can apportion a lot of his stress to his mistreatment with his old owners, he needs company and reassurance that she can't give him. The situation is the same whether she leaves him for half an hour or for her 2 - 10 shift.
I wouldn't dream of reporting her to the RSPCA because despite this he's a well fed, walked and spoiled little dog whom she dotes on. She's hoping to retire next year in which case the situation will resolve itself. She shouldn't have taken him on, but under the circumstances I don't blame her for doing so.
ginger no, I haven't contradicted myself at all. I have to put up with howling and barking. Me. That doesn't apply to everyone now does it? My Mum's neighbour has 2 Westies, they leave at 6am and return at just gone 4pm. Not a peep is heard from either animal all day. Their dogs are fine.
My neighbours dog isn't fine. My neighbours dog isn't all dogs though is it and to suggest otherwise is putting words into my mouth.
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