to thinj working 3 days a week doesn,t mean you work part time x

(115 Posts)
maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 19:14:07

Would you class working mon to Wednesday so 3 days but 13 hr shifts is working pt or ft ? X

The govt says anything over 30 hrs is full time.

dementedma Sun 22-Sep-13 19:15:27

Part time

HotCrossPun Sun 22-Sep-13 19:15:43

That's full-time.

BOF Sun 22-Sep-13 19:16:20

Full time, I'd say.

HoneyDragon Sun 22-Sep-13 19:16:21

That's full time employment.

39hrs a week = FT.

I work Mon-Fri, but only half days. So despite the fact that I go to work every day I only work PT.

YANBU.

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 19:16:36

How come dement x

Euphemia Sun 22-Sep-13 19:16:38

Full-time.

how is it part time? 3x13=39, so fulltime

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 19:16:56

Part time. I do mon-fri 7-7, so double the hours.

Finola1step Sun 22-Sep-13 19:17:56

I would call it full time hours, compressed into 3 long days. Lots of full timers work a compressed week.

MrsAMerrick Sun 22-Sep-13 19:18:23

full time. You are working 39 hours per week, even if it's "only" over 3 days.

SilverApples Sun 22-Sep-13 19:18:54

I'd say pt, if I was discussing my work with friends.
Average working hours seem to be 40-45+ a week, but it depends who is asking. smile

HamwidgeAlive Sun 22-Sep-13 19:19:10

Of course 39 hours isn't part time.

Agree with Finola, it's a compressed week.

lljkk Sun 22-Sep-13 19:19:20

FT & compressed hours, for sure.

5x12 hour days isn't FT. "Super-sized" time maybe.

SanityClause Sun 22-Sep-13 19:19:36

Many 9-5 jobs are only 35 hours. If the shifts are 13 hours, with no breaks, that's 39 hours. Even with an hour of breaks within the 13 hour shifts, that's 36 hours.

Definitely full time.

SilverApples Sun 22-Sep-13 19:20:36

That's a new phrase for me, 'compressed week'
It sounds useful. Thank you.

Artandco Mon-Fri 7-7 is 60 hrs, not 78. So although I don' dispute that you work a lot of hours, you don't work double the hours that the OP does.

*don't

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 19:21:05

Thank you, I have always classed it as full time lol ... should add its night shifts so I do 3 days on etc xx

HandragsAndGladbags Sun 22-Sep-13 19:21:09

I work 3 standard days so am part time. I would say 3 days of 12 hours or more is a compressed week and full time.

redexpat Sun 22-Sep-13 19:21:39

Full time.

SlobAtHome Sun 22-Sep-13 19:22:46

Full time, compressed.

Artandco so because you do more everyone else is doing PT? Er... how about no...

pianodoodle Sun 22-Sep-13 19:22:51

Yes 39 hrs I'd definitely say full time.

lifesgreatquestions Sun 22-Sep-13 19:23:09

That's part time according to the NHS - nations biggest employer.

OryxCrake Sun 22-Sep-13 19:23:46

39 hours a week is full-time, regardless of how you group those hours.

Agree. Full time, compressed week.

FirstStopCafe Sun 22-Sep-13 19:24:32

Full time - it was full time when I worked those hours on nights for the nhs

Snazzyenjoyingsummer Sun 22-Sep-13 19:25:11

For that many hours, full time. But if someone told me they worked three days a week I would assume part time.

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 19:25:24

Art and co, what would you class people working 18 hours lol

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 19:25:38

Jemima- ok it's not 78 out of home, it's 60. But just because I 'work' 7-7 doesn't mean il finish then as sometimes work later, in Eves when home or weekends ( ie I have been on my laptop all day today working) so could easily be 70/80 hrs some weeks.
I just have personally never worked less than 50 hr weeks and hardly know anyone who does ( London based if any diff), so anything under 50 seems part time to me.

Trills Sun 22-Sep-13 19:26:22

I agree with Snazzy.

You work full-time hours, but if you said you worked 3 days a week without any other explanation I'd assume that you worked 7-8 hours on each of those days and so were part-time.

Tavv Sun 22-Sep-13 19:27:55

Full time

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 19:28:19

Artàndco I also have to do extra work out of hours , I think your hours are a lot but it wouldn't make me think others were part timers.

FrussoHathor Sun 22-Sep-13 19:30:31

36hours so full time. I work 3 days, total 19hours I class myself as part-time because I dropped 2 days

DiaryOfAWimpyMum Sun 22-Sep-13 19:30:42

I worked 8 x 3 and considered it part time but 13 x 3 I would think of as full time, unless there are more hours of the week to be worked in the job I guess

ILetHimKeep20Quid Sun 22-Sep-13 19:31:33

Of course it's full time.

Anyone needing to do much more than 45 hours a week needs to manage their time better

I'd say that's ft pt in your job would be only 1-2 shifts.

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 19:34:18

Lol I lethimkeep I don't know how I would fit in 45 hrs

SlobAtHome Sun 22-Sep-13 19:34:54

lifesgreatquestions - er no, NHS advertise 37.5 hours as full time. Why do you think they would consider 39 hours part time?

BOF Sun 22-Sep-13 19:47:33

I wonder how many meals you can get out of a chicken, Art? grin

Tavv Sun 22-Sep-13 19:49:40

> Anyone needing to do much more than 45 hours a week needs to manage their time better

Bit of a generalisation there...

noisytoys Sun 22-Sep-13 19:54:06

It's full time. We don't need to be competitive about who works more hours, the question was is it part time or full time, the answer full time.

PiratePanda Sun 22-Sep-13 19:54:13

Artandco unless you have physically and in person signed the Work Time Directive optout, your hours are illegal under UK law.

Anything over 30 is classed as FT; anything over 48 (without signing the optout) is illegal.

hmm at Art
Of course 39 hours is full time. Why the fuck should people be expected to work 50-70 hours a week to be considered full time? Mugs.

Full time without a doubt.

bludgerwitch Sun 22-Sep-13 20:00:09

Definitely full time.

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 20:01:25

Bof - erm I get one meal out a chicken

Pirate - I work for a private foreign company . There is no legalisation on hours

Ehric - I love my job, I'm hardly a mug. If I earnt half the amount We couldn't afford to live in central London. As I said its completely normal here and I honestly don't know
Anyone who works less than 50hr.

I'm only answering the question in the op, not sure why its seen as an outrage as I don't agree with others. Work 1 hour a week if you like

TweenageAngst Sun 22-Sep-13 20:01:48

It depends what your break allowances are. Are you paid for 13 hours or technically 11.5 hours. If your have unpaid meal breaks and therefore work less than 37.5 hrs per week paid you are not full time.

BrianTheMole Sun 22-Sep-13 20:02:53

Its 39 hours. So its full time compressed hours.

FreeWee Sun 22-Sep-13 20:04:54

What Pirate says. Everything in that post is true.

Featherbag Sun 22-Sep-13 20:10:48

Of course it's full time, and the NHS most definitely sees it as as such too! I work the same, counts as 12.5 hour shifts when the half hour unpaid break that often doesn't happen is deducted.

fuckwittery Sun 22-Sep-13 20:10:51

Its full time, but I used to work a lot more hours when I was only meant to do 8 hours a week every day, this turned into 12 hours plus 2.5 hrs of commute 5 x a week. Working compressed hours I do think frees up a lot more time in the rest of the week, you only have to get ready and commute 3 x a week etc.

MrsOakenshield Sun 22-Sep-13 20:11:10

Art - I live in London, always have done, and have worked here for 20 years. Never, contractually, have I done more than a 40-hour week, and that was my first job, so for the last 15 years it's been a 35 hour week, with odd bits of overtime as and when needed (unpaid, mainly). And that's the norm for my industry. Please don't think you speak for everyone who works and lives in London!

VinegarDrinker Sun 22-Sep-13 20:11:17

I do 36 hours per week but class myself as PT because FT in my job is 48 hours.

MrsKoala Sun 22-Sep-13 20:13:33

I work in HR and this is considered FT condensed hours. But it doesn't stop people making snipey comments about colleagues who do it. But then again people make snipey comments about 'jammy' part timers. I often point out they are also on part time wages. It appears some people think unless you do 9-5 mon -fri you don't really have a proper job.

mamapants Sun 22-Sep-13 20:13:47

My full time job is 37 hrs.
When do people who work 50hrs do other stuff? Like eat, see friends, exercise, spend time with family, read ie have a life

Portofino Sun 22-Sep-13 20:15:05

My official hours are 39. I work full time.

Wibblypiglikesbananas Sun 22-Sep-13 20:16:51

Full time - and hopefully there's a full time salary to go with it. If you can condense hours like this, I think it's great and allows much more time to spend with children/do what you like.

MrsDeVere Sun 22-Sep-13 20:17:14

Roaring @' anything under 50 hours is part time'.

Do you wear red braces and eschew lunch art

grin

TooExtraImmatureCheddar Sun 22-Sep-13 20:18:20

I work 36 hours over 4 days. In local govt, a 36 hour week is full-time.

MrsDeVere Sun 22-Sep-13 20:18:44

Are you a nurse OP?

That is a standard full time shift pattern isn't it?

I might be out of date but it was when DD was ill.

AaDB Sun 22-Sep-13 20:20:43

Full time condensed hours.

motherinferior Sun 22-Sep-13 20:21:02

I live in London, know plenty of people in interesting fairly high powered and well paid jobs and most of them don't work 50 hours per week. I worked like that 20 years ago...

miffybun73 Sun 22-Sep-13 20:22:03

Definitely full time as 39 hours.

80sMum Sun 22-Sep-13 20:31:45

When do people who work 50hrs do other stuff? Like eat, see friends, exercise, spend time with family, read ie have a life?

I can answer that one. We don't! Well, I don't anyway. I guess I can't speak for anyone else. Actually that's notqui true, I do manage to find time to eat but that's about it.

What are your contacted hours OP?

MrsKoala Sun 22-Sep-13 20:35:17

Perhaps if you work in London in the city longer hours are expected and in certain professions. Also my DH worked for a US company and they thought he worked 24/7 (Calling him and giving him work on xmas & boxing day and expecting him to work on our holiday - which is why he left). But everyone else i know who works in London at an office based job does 9-5 hours.

When DH went to work in the office the the US (about 1 week a month) they were shock when he stood up at 5pm to leave. He said loudly to his team, 'in the UK it's considered very unprofessional to work longer hours than you have to, it shows you can't manage your time or do your work in the hours expected'. Which of course is bollocks as we have a culture of presenteeism just as much as anywhere else he's worked. But the next week while he was there all his staff left at 5pm, and still got just as much work done smile . Sadly wen he left they reverted as were overseen by a US manager sad

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 20:38:57

No I'm not a nurse

''When do people who work 50hrs do other stuff? Like eat, see friends, exercise, spend time with family, read ie have a life? ''

If I'm home at 7.30pm, I would go for a 30 min run, shower and have some down time before eating around 9pm. Friends might join for meal sometime as also on same work times, same as dh. After I would have a few hours free to catch up with dh/ emails/ bake/ watch something before bed. Some Eve's I would go out. At the weekends i am either free all day to do the above or il add a few hours of work in if needed.

expatinscotland Sun 22-Sep-13 20:40:23

Katie Hopkins, is that you?

catgirl1976 Sun 22-Sep-13 20:41:18

39 hours = ft to me

MrsOakenshield Sun 22-Sep-13 20:41:27

MrsKoala - that's very interesting. On Woman's Hour a few weeks ago there was an MD who said that she like having working mothers working for her as she felt they were far more efficient with their time as there was no way, in many cases, they were able to stay late to get things finished - the work had to be done in the time.

I have also read that companies that almost depend on unpaid overtime are in effect treating their employees like a charity - i.e. the employees are donating their (unpaid) salary to the company, which I believe has all kinds of tax implications.

My cousin's husband's company sent him over to the US for a bit, and they were thinking of making the move, but he thought the hours expected were so unconducive (sp?) to any kind of life that he bailed pretty quickly.

BOF Sun 22-Sep-13 20:42:31

And they wonder why the City has a massive coke habit?

MrsKoala Sun 22-Sep-13 20:42:58

So Art after eating at 9pm you have a few hours to do other stuff? Wow. That means you go to bed at about 1am? What time do you get up and have to leave your house to get to work at 7am? How much sleep do you get? Do you have dc? I'd die after about a week of that! grin

catgirl1976 Sun 22-Sep-13 20:43:53

I used to work 60 hours a week

Then I had DS and realised I was being a mug, making myself ill while making my bosses happy. So now I work 35 hours. Which is ft.

Anything over 30 is ft to me

Hulababy Sun 22-Sep-13 20:46:12

It's a tricky one I think.

If you say that you work 3 days a week - that automatically makes you think PT

If you say you work 39 hours a week - well that sounds like FT

I work 4.5 days a week - 32 hours (although I should technically take off about 3 hours of that as have unpaid breaks/lunch) and only work term time, not cuonting all the work I do in unpaid time). I say I work PT though it feels like far more than PT most weeks!

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 20:46:15

Bed around midnight, up at 6.30am. No small children yet, but dhs teen brother (15) lives with us.

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 20:50:21

Art do you have kids , I never saw you mention them x
I'm a nurse at gosh , my hours used to be different.however had to change them .
I have 2 kids , and a lone parent x

I was asking because if you read my other thread regarding step children , there mum had made a comment about me not working full time which I claiming to do x

BOF Sun 22-Sep-13 20:52:18

You really don't need to use kisses on most threads on Mumsnet, btw.

MrsKoala Sun 22-Sep-13 20:52:41

MrsO that's similar to us. DH was told we had to move to Washington DC as they were closing the UK office. We initially accepted but then slowly realised they would expect DH to be 'present' for much longer hours than at home. Even tho he still worked the same hours at home, they insist if you are in the country, you should be in the office. The pay was better than UK equivalent - but only by 10k or so, which at higher rate tax meant he was getting very little an hour more with the amount of extra time he was doing. Most of it was just pointless meetings to make them all feel important and busy. it drove us mad. He'd have skype meetings at 2-4am and still be expected to be in the office for 8am with no recognition for hours worked on xmas and boxing day etc (i don't mean pay - but cheers for doing that, take an avo off kind of thing). Anyway, we declined the offer to move to the US with no notice period or offer of any repatriation - it would have been very risky and all the power in their favour - DH would have had to take more and more work on and i would have been a lonely wreck. They wouldn't care tho, as once he was burnt out they'd move on to the next poor fucker and we'd have to foot the bill to get home within 21 days. Cunts!

ErmagherdPerngwens Sun 22-Sep-13 20:53:41

I used to have a shift rotation job where it was 4 x 10 hour days (with 45 mins deducted for lunch) so 37 hpw, it was definitely considered a FT job by everyone who did it.

In this country more than 36 hpw is FT, no matter how many days.

Maggietess Sun 22-Sep-13 20:54:20

When I when through looking at all the options with my company (private multinational), they would have classed that as compressed full time hours (which I had wanted but they didn't offer sad) .

If it's the same hours as the hours that a Ft employee in the same company works but over a shorter period then it's FT compressed hours. Every company's definition of what constitutes FT will vary a little but largely in the 35-42 hour region is the norm.

Interestingly (or not so much but I'm a need wink ) I once was getting insurance quote over the phone and explained I worked part time, 22.5 hours and they said that for insurance purposes anyone over 18 hours is considered FT. Seems odd to me but them was the rules apparently..

You are working for the NHS and contracted for 37.5 hours a week you are full time.
Anyone who says otherwise is thick doesn't understand.

MrsKoala Sun 22-Sep-13 20:54:44

Art - how are you up at 6.30 and in work at 7am? DO you live really close to work? That's another thing about central London jobs, most people i know travel at least an hour and a half to work.

Hulababy Sun 22-Sep-13 21:04:46

Art - do you have children? That is where I would struggle - not seeing DD properly ever.

It is bad enough for DH as he gets home just before 7pm most evenings, and that is when DD is older. DH is a pretty efficient worker with his time and luckily he almost always has weekends free, rarely does much work at home once he is home and takes a decent amount of holiday. Anything more and he would struggle to see much of DD and hence their relationship would not be as great as it is imo.

Family and home time is very important to both me and DH so we chose to manage out work home life balance as best we can. So DH works FT, as the much higher earner, and I work nearly FT, but not quite and have school holidays free.We are fortunate enough to be in a position where I don't have to work FT and have chosen to take a lower scaled pay work than I used to have, but which I chose to do more hours in as I enjoy it.

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 21:34:32

Yes I live and work in zone 1. I walk to work. No children yet as mentioned above.

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 21:35:52

That makes sense then , I have a 1 yr old and 4 yr old , so 39 hours defo feels like full time lol

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 21:37:10

Oh btw where are you , I'm in chelsea and know no one who works 50 hrs lol

Artandco Sun 22-Sep-13 21:41:35

Not far from you

MrsKoala Sun 22-Sep-13 21:44:20

Art - Lack of commuting makes a massive difference. If you have 2 hours either side of 9-5 it amounts to the same 'work' day as you really. I used to work in an office where it was commented by my boss that tho i got in at 8am i left at 5pm on the dot (commuting train left at 5.15 and only one an hour), but my colleagues left at 6-6.30. I pointed out that most of them arrived at 10ish and took full, and often longer, lunch hours, so in fact i worked longer hours. But just because they all did those hours, it looked like i did less.

VinegarDrinker Sun 22-Sep-13 21:44:28

Most if not all your junior doctor colleagues will be on 48 hr contracts maddy - the 48 hrs is an average tho so includes weekends, and a mixture of 8-5, long days, nights etc. Some weeks will be less, some more.

fuckwittery Sun 22-Sep-13 21:48:57

Think long hours depends on your profession and professions of your friends rather than location. I know a lot of bankers, junior doctors and lawyers!

mamapants When do people who work 50hrs do other stuff? Like eat, see friends, exercise, spend time with family, read ie have a life
I did very little of this stuff when working 50-60 hours a week. I ate virtually all meals as take outs, breakfast on my way to office, lunch at my desk, a little trip out to pret for dinner at my desk around 6pm before starting the evening shift, or sometimes tried to fool myself that I'd be leaving soon, and then end up eating shit from the newsagent on my way home at 11pm.

My exercise was running for the train and speed walking to/from work to the station.

I hardly saw my kids or my husband. Did nothing else. Sometimes read a book on the train, mainly fell asleep though. I am now a SAHM and much poorer but much happier, as my job was not compatible with having a life! (lawyer). I am seriously shock at how my kids ever were clothed or fed or the house ever tidy (had a cleaner once a week, but it was probably only tidy on cleaning day before I got home)

maddymoo25 Sun 22-Sep-13 21:49:58

We were talking about people where we live vinegsr , not one person here that I know works 50 hours and more .

pooka Sun 22-Sep-13 21:57:47

Full time. I used to work 37.5 hours a week, Monday to Friday. That was definitely classed as full-time. Because I then worked post first dc for 20 hours - which was part-time.

Shallistopnow Sun 22-Sep-13 21:59:39

What is your job artandco? I'm intrigued!

Altinkum Sun 22-Sep-13 22:07:11

Depending on you're breaks your only working 36 hours or 35 hours (every 6+ hr shift = a 20 mins break, 30 mins = a 8 hr shift.

You need 11 hours between your finishing times and start times.

Either way, yanbu, it's irrelevant really, you work as you need to, or required too, part time/full time is a load of bollock when their is so few hours between each shift

ItsTheOnlyWayToLive Sun 22-Sep-13 22:37:38

I'm having the same issue with hours, op.

I work for the nhs too, and reduced my hours from 37.5 hrs a week to 30. I have read that 30 hours upwards is full time, yet a poster on the employment thread says I work part time. You could try on that thread for answers if you are still confused.

I know I am hmm

Samnella Sun 22-Sep-13 22:43:40

Ft

Turniptwirl Sun 22-Sep-13 23:28:00

Full time, compressed week, very common in my office.

I'm full time and work 35 hours.

You may well be classed as part time in some ways for administrative purposes. Like in my office if you don't do 7 hours per day 5 days a week you have holidays calculated in hours (same entitlement as 9-5ers ), whether you do 3 hours a day 5 days a week or 12 hours three days a week

ceeveebee Sun 22-Sep-13 23:43:48

I live in London, in finance, and know many people that work 50-60 hours a week, including my DH. I used to before I had kids too, now I work 3 x 11 hour days plus expected to be available 24/7 on mobile/email

But 39 hours is FT by any definition

utreas Mon 23-Sep-13 00:15:26

Part time IMO

BOF Mon 23-Sep-13 00:17:00

It isn't a matter of opinion though, is it? It's a simple fact that it is full time.

BackforGood Mon 23-Sep-13 00:45:21

It depends on your job though.
When I was FT, I worked around 60 hrs a week,(as did/do most of my colleagues) so when I went to 0.6 of a week, I was working around 36 hrs a week, but only being paid 0.6 of a FT salary.

It did confuse people when I had to fill in documents and they asked if you worked FT or PT, then asked your hours though grin

As others have said though - if YOu only leave for work 3 days a week, then people generally 'perceive' that as being Part Time - you would have to specifically explain that you have compressed hours or that you do 3 x 12 hr shifts or whatever, for them to understand that you are actually working as many (if not more) hours as them. You can't expect everybody to automatically know that.

Does it matter what her perception is anyway? You know what you do.

VestaCurry Mon 23-Sep-13 01:20:55

I know a lot of people who do compressed FT hours, either into 3 or 4 days.

Morloth Mon 23-Sep-13 04:42:53

DH and I both do 12 hour days. I do 3 (so 36) and he does 5 (so 60).

It is all good, we reap the benefits in pay, DH is a workaholic who is going to work like that in any case so he might as well get paid for it.

We tag team the kids a lot and are fiercely protective of our weekends being for our family.

Pobblewhohasnotoes Mon 23-Sep-13 04:53:37

How can it be pt?

In the NHS 37.5 hours is full time. Just because we work 12 hour shifts doesn't mean we're part time. Not everyone has a 9-5 job.

NameChangedForAChange Mon 23-Sep-13 05:53:02

As many people have said, if you say you work three days then that is perceived to be part time. If you say 39 hours then it will usually be perceived to be full time. It's up to you how you describe it.

LovesBeingOnHoliday Mon 23-Sep-13 06:17:27

Ft compressed hours

Firsttimemummy33 Mon 23-Sep-13 07:52:44

Nhs full time hours are. 37.5.

BoozyBear Mon 23-Sep-13 07:58:22

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

sarahtigh Mon 23-Sep-13 09:54:48

NHS FT is 37.5 hours

someone working 7-7 will get breaks so it is not 12 hours as no breaks is also illegal

however any job over 30 hours per week is generally considered FT as someone else said more than 48 hours is illegal, I do not think opt outs are that common though I think like for farm workers at harvest is can be 48 hours average over a period

PT for a working credit claim is over 16 hours and under 30
on JSA looking for FT job means upto 40 hours contracted the rest is overtime upto 8 hours can be compulsory

mycatlikestwiglets Mon 23-Sep-13 10:08:27

Opt outs from the WTD are fairly standard in the City - they form part of the employment contract (particularly for lawyers/finance workers). Sadly working 3 days per week would be considered part time in many professional firms (including mine), regardless how many hours you work per day - it's expected that you'll work significantly more than the standard 9-5. Doesn't make it right though!

Somerset8 Mon 23-Sep-13 10:32:24

Full time.

JedwardScissorhands Mon 23-Sep-13 10:38:41

I work 30 hours and think that is part time.

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