to want to take my dc for a week holiday during school time ?

(46 Posts)
mrsfuzzy Thu 05-Sep-13 12:13:51

i have a big family and can only take them to the seaside near us for a week each year, they are teens in school and college but it is something we all look forward to as a family as we are very close, even the 20yr ol tags along with his girlfriend! under the new rules, [i think this correct schools won't be allowed to authorise holidays during term time, fair enough] i can understand the not missing exams bit, but as dh and i can only work part time it is difficult to finance other arrangements. how do other parents manage ?

ButteryJam Thu 05-Sep-13 12:15:01

How old are your DC?

mrsfuzzy Thu 05-Sep-13 12:22:10

11, 13, 15,17, 18 and 20 three live in digs for college so we can't meet up as much as we like because they aren't local, this a family thing we have always done together, boy/girl friends join us too, it's great fun, we're a bit like the 'waltons' when we're all together!

AndThatsWhatIThinkOfYou Thu 05-Sep-13 12:23:36

a week is hardly going to be detrimental in their lifetime. I would.

Bowlersarm Thu 05-Sep-13 12:26:54

I don't take mine out of school but....

Are you 15 and 17 year olds taking exams next summer, and if they are do they get any time off immediately after those? Then you only need to worry about the 11 and 13 year olds.

5madthings Thu 05-Sep-13 12:28:07

We are going away on the 14th sept for a week shock

Mine are 14, 11, 8, 5 and little one is 2.

We have a letter from dps employer as he couldn't get any leave during school holidays so that was 'exceptional circumstances'.

Our primary school has always been OK at authorizing time off, high schools not so much!

This will turn into a big row BTW, it's a subject some feel strongly about!

mrsfuzzy Thu 05-Sep-13 12:38:44

bowler, exams are always taken into consideration so we avoid those times, will other parents take their dc out of school regardless of the new rules?

Rufus43 Thu 05-Sep-13 12:56:36

Not something I would usually do with a child in senior school (or around sats)

However

I took ds out of school last nov for 3 days when he was in year 9. And I will be taking my (what will be year 7 and year 8 ) children out in Oct 2014 for a week

Bowlersarm Thu 05-Sep-13 13:02:18

OP, I don't think you understood what I was trying to say!

mrsfuzzy Thu 05-Sep-13 13:16:37

bowler can you help me understand please i'd like to hear your view.

HeySoulSister Thu 05-Sep-13 13:20:05

But I also have a big family.... But I wouldn't do this. A 'big family' is NO excuse. We all have to live by the new ruling

nurseneedshelp Thu 05-Sep-13 13:26:25

I've been issued with a £60 fine per child for taking mine out for t home e week in June, doubles if not paid within 28 days!

I'm appealing and my employer has written a letter explaining that annual leave is difficult to take durin the holidays but we'll see! Don hold out mych hop.

My biggest gripe is the fact tha the traveller children go off for weweeks at a time and don't get fine?

I understand the cultural thing but it cant be separate rules!

nurseneedshelp Thu 05-Sep-13 13:27:00

Blimey sorry for the typos!

mummymeister Thu 05-Sep-13 13:28:06

just been onto the short haul holidays threads. the unexpected (being kind to the govt about this) consequence is this. because kids are no longer being taken out of school and have to go in school hols this will massively increase the number of people looking to go away during school hols. therefore holiday companies are going to increase their prices both because they can and because they need to cover any shortfall due to less people going away with families in say June. I wonder how places like centreparcs are going to deal with this? will be watching with interest.

ilovesooty Thu 05-Sep-13 13:30:29

I don't think this represents reasonable grounds for term time holiday either.

Anyone would think from some of the posts on various threads that headteachers are enjoying wielding some kind of power. This is all about government expectations, targets and Ofsted. Heads know that attendance is one of many factors influencing Ofsted grading and that they at any time are one poor Ofsted away from career over.

You can hardly expect them to be keen to make exceptions.

Bowlersarm Thu 05-Sep-13 13:30:59

I'll have a go....! Immediately after GCSE and A levels there is a short period of time that pupils have off. (My DS did after GCSE at his school so i assume that applies to all schools?) before the end of the summer term.

I was just thinking that if that applies to two of your children, given that they are 15 and 17, that's two you don't need permission for, just the 11 and 13 year olds.

Therefore there may be a window for you to go away in June, with the minimum of disruption. (You would still have to negotiate getting the 11 and 13 years a week off school in my plan, though)

Is that clearer, or have I just made it sound more muddled?!!

It may not be possible anyway as the exam timetables might clash for some of your children so they won't all be exam free at the same time, but might be worth exploring.

Other than that I can't think of a way, but hopefully someone else has more experience of doing this than me, and will help you with ideas.

ivykaty44 Thu 05-Sep-13 13:32:15

As far as I am aware your dc doesn't have to go to school as long as you provide home school.

Can you take the d out of school to home school and then you can go on holiday when you like.

You can apply to put your dc back into school if you wish - but you my not get a place at a school you like, it will be possibly more difficult depending on how many schools places their are etc.

Beastofburden Thu 05-Sep-13 13:32:34

I think Bowler means that your 15 and 17 year olds will be free anyway to go on holiday next summer, as they will have done their exams and be on post exam leave, so that wont be an issue. if thats true you only need to think - can we get the younger ones off school?

Taking the little ones out of school- well there are worse things you could do, but I'm not convinced you necessarily need to go there.

I am sure an annual reunion for the whole family is really important. As the older ones get more into their courses/ jobs you might find that term time becomes quite difficult for them as well. If you want to start a tradition that everyone can afford, it may not be likely that all your kids will take their kids out of school in term/ be able to get time off their jobs and courses in term as they get older.

I wonder if the format might need to change a bit as their lives get more complex too? I can understand the money side, and not just for you, as their big siblings are going to be broke as well as they are young, and also need to afford their own separate holiday I am guessing. You dont want the family holiday to be so expensive that the older ones have to prioritise other things and not come.

My friend with six kids and a huge extended family used to have a load of terrible manky caravans all parked up in a circle for their big family jamboree. Perhaps a bit of creative thinking might solve the immediate problem and give you a more sustainable solution for the next five years?

Beastofburden Thu 05-Sep-13 13:34:05

sorry bowler, xposted with you!

valiumredhead Thu 05-Sep-13 13:34:13

Just do it. It will probably go down as unauthorised but so what? Family holidays are importantsmile

mrsfuzzy Thu 05-Sep-13 13:35:00

one rule for one, nurse. heysoulsister, yes i understand the new ruling but the point is that as my husband and i can only work part time due to ill health over the last couple of years we are very restricted for holiday costs. i'm not looking for a fight but i'm merely asking other posters what they are likely to do under the new rules, it's good that you are able to deal with these matters, perhaps you are in a better financial situation than me, as i say no offence intended.

Morgause Thu 05-Sep-13 13:38:46

I wouldn't do it without permission unless you are sure you can afford the fine.

Bowlersarm Thu 05-Sep-13 13:39:29

beast you put it much more succinctly!

mrsfuzzy Thu 05-Sep-13 13:39:44

thanks for clarifying bowler, makes a lot of sense what you are saying, going to rethink the situation from different view points but will speak to school first about it regarding the younger two dc.

mummymeister Thu 05-Sep-13 13:53:17

agree that you have to speak to the schools. I can understand where you are coming from ilovesooty and would have felt better about the new ruling if there hadn't been exemptions. but when you start saying that there is an exemption on religious grounds it starts to put peoples backs up. could I change my religion to Jedi and say that I have to attend a festival in wherever every year? it also means that yet again those that can afford the fines will just pay up and go. those that don't give a monkeys about their childs school attendance will still just take them out anyway. yet again, those with least money and who try to do the right thing will be the losers. why cant commonsense break out? 95% attendance can still be achieved and holidays be taken.

AnyFucker Thu 05-Sep-13 17:54:33

would somebody mind clarifying what the fines are, and whether it is statutory for every school to enforce them

cheers

nurseneedshelp Thu 05-Sep-13 23:10:35

Taking my dc out in June was a last straw as my annual leave was so restricted over the hols. Its not something I do regular!

They've both got 100% attendance and no exams etc so I felt justified.

AF its the council thats issuing them although when I emailed them to object they said if the head authorises it, they will drop the fine?

Both parents have to pay, so it works out at £120 per week/child and it doubles if not paid within 28 days!

skyeskyeskye Thu 05-Sep-13 23:22:42

Our school is an academy and we haven't been advised if the fines officially but standard seems to be £60 per parent per child. As I'm on my own it would cost £60, so financially, it would be cheaper to go away in term time and pay the fine.

However, in your case, @ £120 per child, it could potentially cost you £480 to take them out for a week.

Some parents have said they will ring their kids in sick for a week but when they turn up with a suntan talking about their holiday, it could give the game away grin.

AnyFucker Thu 05-Sep-13 23:29:41

OK, So I would be risking a £120 fine.

Fair enough. It would cost me a fuckload more than that to take holiday purely outside of term time (we usually pinch a few days before end of term)

Littleroobe Thu 05-Sep-13 23:38:02

Apparently the government worded it wrong on the official documents and actually wanted to charge £60 per parent per child per day! Also there is talk NRP will be charged too so even if child only sees NRP once a month or something if RP takes them out of school both parents will be fined!
Schools have no say in these fines (unless academies where I believe they can set their own fines) they are from the government and schools won't see the money directly.
Surely this is only going to encourage deceitful behaviour by parents (not that I blame them) by just ringing up and saying their child is sick.

skyeskyeskye Fri 06-Sep-13 00:17:27

I don't see how they can charge NRP though as the decision is nothing to do with them? That would be very unfair and my XH would go mad! he won't have her at all in the holidays and is unlikely to take her away any other time either

ravenAK Fri 06-Sep-13 00:28:27

This is the problem.

Some parents will decide to restrict their holidays to outside of term time, but there are two tried & tested alternatives.

Solvent parents - OK, we'll just pay the fine & openly set it against the saving we make by going away in term time.

Skint parents - OK, we'll pretend we all had flu, & one of the side effects looked quite a bit like a suntan.

Neither of these is exactly conducive to an honest, respectful relationship between home & school. One lot are being told that rules are something you throw money at; the other are being told that it's best if you just lie.

Morgause Fri 06-Sep-13 07:41:28

My friend has had a letter from the school her son attends saying that sickness absence of more than one day has to be backed up by a doctor's note from now on. This following parents claiming sickness to take children on holiday last term.

The GPs are going to love the ruling morgause!!

ivykaty44 Fri 06-Sep-13 08:04:41

gp's don't need to give the fit notes, they don't need to do what the school says and parents would need to pay for a letter stating the child is ill - doctors will do this to stop children being brought to the surgery for minor illness tht will be ok in a couple or three days which could mean that parents will send very sick children into school each day if they haven't got £30 to spend on getting a note form the doctor to say the child is ill. Then the school can deal with it

That will then spread the illness if it is contagious and more sick child bring down the sickness rates - which in turn is what they don't want.

Floggingmolly Fri 06-Sep-13 08:15:01

I don't understand your logic either, Bowler confused. Instead of looking for a "window" in June, why not do what most of the rest of us do and go in the summer holidays??

bruffin Fri 06-Sep-13 08:29:43

Mine are 15 and 17 and have never taken them out of school for a holiday. We tend to go the last week of august to dutch centerparcs. The dutch have gone back to school there so it is cheaper.
Next year my dcs will have sat their exams so will be free in July so we will take our holiday then.

Sparklysilversequins Fri 06-Sep-13 14:27:52

Unauthorised or not I will still take dd out of school for a fortnight a year. However she's still at primary. I will rethink when she's older.

HappyMummyOfOne Fri 06-Sep-13 16:48:34

Holidays are a luxury and children have 13 weeks of holidays to go in rather than miss education. Its not the shools fault you fancy a holiday but cant go outside term as you choose to have numerous children on a part time salary. A head cant accept cost as an exceptional reason for time off.

Bowlersarm Fri 06-Sep-13 17:04:38

Because, floggingmolly, I was answering the op and trying to give her options on her quandary confused

Rufus43 Fri 06-Sep-13 18:13:56

Made sense to me bowlersarm

Bowlersarm Fri 06-Sep-13 18:24:34

Thank you for that Rufus43-I've been scratching my head thinking I had misunderstood something, somewhere. Peculiar that Floggingmolly only picked up on my post to comment on. I feel singled out! But hey ho.

Spikeytree Fri 06-Sep-13 18:56:20

Our attendance target is 96 % this year. We crept up to 94.9 % last year and got a bollocking because it wasn't exactly 95 %. Scary stuff because if we are below again Mr Gove will have an excuse to turn us into an academy. You wouldn't get an authorised holiday here.

Bowlersarm Fri 06-Sep-13 19:20:23

Spikey personally I think that is the trouble with taking holiday in term time. Supposing your child has a particularly tricky year with illnesses? With term time holidays, you are on a negative before anything else comes up which is more essential, quite honestly.

Spikeytree Fri 06-Sep-13 19:24:12

That's it really, Bowlersarm. Schools aren't being awkward about holidays for the sake of it. Those of us working in them are pretty terrified about any chink appearing because it doesn't take much to be deemed as 'requires improvement' these days.

josephinebruce Fri 06-Sep-13 19:33:16

Went away for the summer (for work!) and came back to the same old argument as when I left!

Schools will fine. It is unauthorised. It is taking the piss. Get over it.

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