PFB or normal precaution for childcare?(120 Posts)
I got an email from a friend who is getting married soon, complaining about another friend and I can't decide who is right on this. Opinions please!
Friend A is getting married with a small-ish do (60 people). During the meal, she has arranged for a couple of the staff from her DDs nursery to come and look after/entertain the children in a separate room. The invitation is slightly vague in so far as it doesn't say the children must be left in the room, but doesn't say they are welcome to join the meal (relevant later!). This isn't intentional - she just assumed most people would rather eat in peace given the option and it didn't occur to her that people would think they couldn't have their children sat with them if they preferred.
We both have a friend B. I've never been hugely close to her, but we ended up living near each other so probably see more of each other than we would under any other circumstances.
Friend B has emailed Friend A to ask if the can share the names and qualifications of the nursery workers who will be looking after the children, and also the name of the nursery, because she'd like to phone them up to speak to them - I guess get a reference?
Friend A has got really cross about this, because she thinks it is questioning her ability to find good childcare for her children and also thinks this is Friend A passively aggressively asking for her child to stay with them during the meal, which would have been fine if she had just asked outright.
I can sort of see Friend B's point that she doesn't want any old person looking after her (PFB) DD, but is it totally OTT to ask for their references? They'll be looking after the children for a couple of hours, tops, and the idea is they'll be supervised with toys, books and DVDs. I don't know the age range of the children, but would guess at 2-6?
On top of this, Friend A has asked me to bring it up with Friend B. I think I'm going to stay out of it and let them sort it out directly, but I just wanted some other opinions before I wade in on one side or anotheirng
I agree, stay out of it! Tell friend A to speak to friend B directly.
I'd stay out of it.
To be fair I wouldn't want someone I didn't know looking after my dc and therefore I'd also ask for more info.
Back away slowly from the situation. .......then run like billy-o, this has disaster written all over it.
Friend is (IMO) being PFB....... Have been to weddings where a child's entertainer had been laid on in another room to keep kids occupied during meal/speeches - they were feed kid friendly food as well which was great - it was like a party for them
The bride seems to be trying to do the right thing by having children at wedding but allowing patents the choice of some kid free time to enjoy a meal and chat. They need to sort this out between them or you're going to be the bad guy in all of this.
I agree, stay out of it.
Not sure all children will be happy in another room with complete strangers though, kind of see friend B's point a little bit.
I would stay out of it to be honest and let them sort it out together.
However, I am sort of with friend A - I am sure she has got reputable childcare sorted out and am sure that friend B can pop into the room at any time to make sure the kids are ok.
Personally, I think it is great idea to have some childcare sorted out AS LONG AS they weren't forced to go and could stay with their parents if they wanted to.
Sounds a bit precious to me but then I suppose our kids are our most precious thing aren't they
stay out of it, but B is being ridiculously PFB..
I agree, stay out of it. She is being really PFB, though!
Definitely stay well out of it!!
Does Friend B know that the staff are from Friend A's dc's nursery? If so she is being ridiculously PFB!
Yes stay out of it, B is being stupid.
I think it's a lovely idea. As long as the bride accepts that, while most DCs would far rather mess about with their peers than sit in a formal meal, a few will cling to the bottom of mums dress.
DD1 would have joined in slightly shyly, DD2 always chooses her peers over adults. DD2's DF was still impossibly shy at 10.
Stay out of it, but for children under primary school age (ie under 5) I would also want to know what the ratios were roughly - would have thought one person could cope with up to 4 small kids? (ie would want to know that it wasn't one adult and 20 small kids etc). Wouldn't care about qualifications if I was in next room and would check every so often that all was ok.
Over 5 (ie able to sit and watch DVD) wouldn't care about ratios.
So person B being a bit unreasonable - I think correct response by A to B is:- "there will be X adults to X children, and they are suitably qualified BUT if you prefer to leave your children at home then that's fine as well. Also fine if you bring your own babysitter to look after your child in the child's room. But sorry no places laid out for children in the dinner"
But tell A you don't want to be involved!
Back away very slowly! If the children are going to be in the same building, just in another room I don't see the issue. Definitely being PFB.
Thanks everyone, I don't really have any inclination to get involved, other than perhaps to tell Friend B that A is going to speak to her regarding the childcare stuff. I don't know her well enough to tell her anything else...
DewDrOp, yes, she knows that.
I haven't got the invitation with me for the exact wording, but it says something like 'DD will be hosting her own do in the room next door, ably-assisted by a couple of ladies from [DD's] nursery. Games, toys and food will be laid on, so please let us know numbers'
So frend A's own child will be hosting her own little party?
Friend B is being an ill mannered idiot who would be better off leaving her precious angels at home. Providing she can find a CRB'd babysitter, of course.
Well her DD is not quite 2, so not sure how much 'hosting' she'll be doing, but yes, the idea is she is next door with all our children, while we eat and listen to speeches!
It seems to me that either friend A is correct and so you becoming involved will just lead to you being tangled in a mess. Or Child B has some additional needs that the mother has not made generally known but which she does want to discuss with staff beforehand (without troubling the bride beyond contact info), in which case it is private and raising it will again only lead to difficulty.
Scaevola, no, B's child doesn't have any special needs that any of us are aware of.
I wanted to make my initial post as neutral as possible to get impartial opinions, but I find her very PFB. I was going to list a few examples, but I think they'll all 'out' me..!
foreveronadiets response is a good one!
I think it's a lovely idea and a good solution all round and she really isn't accountable for answering friend B's questions!
Agree, let them sort it out between them.
But I do think Friend B is definitely being PFB. I have a PFB (DD) and would be thrilled if I thought that someone (who is clearly qualified if they work in a nursery) would be looking after DD while I could have a relaxing meal!
Alternatively, Friend B could go and eat with the children!
I think it sounds like a brilliant idea! If the carers are suitably appropriate types (and if I was close enough to someone to go to their wedding, then I'd be happy to take my friends word for it) then I'd be happily dropping DS before heading in to the
bar adults party. A lot more fun for the kids, and with the parents only next door, presumably they'll be able to come in and out if they really need anything or want to be part of a particular part of the reception such as dancing or cake cutting.
I wouldn't be handing out the names and details of the workers (other than to tell Friend B that they are fully qualified) because the nursery do not need B ringing up hassling them about their workers. There's also a good chance that this is a quiet cash in hand type deal for the workers, and it could be a risk to their employment if it gets back to the employers that it is going on.
Having said that, I went to a wedding last year where they laid on so called entertainment for the children in a separate room. Twas a boring disaster with rubbish food. I thought then that the wallies "entertaining" the children couldn't possibly be qualified. However, it never crossed my mind to ask
Definitely being PFB
I had wedding nannies at our wedding and nobody asked anything of the sort. They were only too glad to eat their meal in peace and have the kids entertained.
It was a proper wedding creche service though so appropriate ratios were stuck to.
How old is friend B's PFB? Does she use childcare? If she has a very young child who has never been left with anyone but family, I can see why she'd be nervous. I'd also be nervous if there were going to be two people looking after a group of say 20 2-6 year-olds. The normal thing to do would be to call friend a and discuss it all though.
I don't think it matters if it's PFB. A lot of people have anxieties around leaving their children and sometimes it's a bit of a wrench just leaving them with grandparents. In an unfamiliar location, with unfamiliar other dc (other parents popping in and out too, lots of toing and froing), then why shouldn't person B try and work out in her head how this might work. Perhaps it's even a kindness that she's not hassling the bride for all this information and is happy to go and do it herself. I have a friend who works in child protection and she would do this sort of thing. She very carefully vets every childcare arrangement and will refuse certain situations but she has seen some awful things which skews her perception somewhat. But it comes from an honest place and to call her PFB would be derogatory. Her anxiety is very real.
All that said, it's not your place to get involved. The bride either wants to give out the info or she doesn't. Friend B is PA or she isn't. None of this is your concern tbh.
B is being PFB (unless child has SN in which case I can see why she might want a quick chat with the staff beforehand, but on the other hand I just would have gone in the room with ds1 who has severe SN & stayed with him)
It's difficult to judge this. If dc is only just 2 that's v different to being 6. i.e. my dd (currently 21 months) when she just turns 2 will be still in nappies and will never have been in a professional childcare setting... only left with grandparents who she knows very well in a familiar environment. She is still at a stage where she can hurt herself badly by climbing, running, falling etc if not watched closely and needs cuddling if tired and close to naptime. I'm probably pfb but would be unsure about leaving her.
When she's 6 however she'll have been at school a couple of years.
In a wedding situation like this though I wouldn't be asking for credentials of nursery staff, I'd prob be arranging to go to wedding without dd as if I felt awkward leaving her I wouldn't but also wouldn't want to mess up or dictate someone else's wedding plans. Think I'd much rather go child free anyway.
So can sort of see both sides, depending on child's age.
It is a lovely idea, shame that friend B can't see that. If friend A asked you to get involved/have a word then I would. So what if you piss off friend B? You hardly know her. help your friend out.
As long as the chdren are not sitting in a cold cow shed (happened at a wedding I went to) I think they would probably have more fun in separate party. This is another example of a bride bending over backwards to accommodate everyone only to have a bitchy guest decide to kick up a fuss!
What Showy said.
It's the proper job of a parent to be happy with how they are caring for, or delegating the care for their child. All parents are different, all children are different, and while some children would be fine, others wouldn't. None of your business IMO - how people choose to parent is their business and no-one else's. If she is very attachment-y then perhaps her child hasn't been away from her? I think it's common to be a bit OCD about having perfect childcare, and tbh isn't it better than the alternative?
YY I agree with Showy too. No one should try and shame or sneer at a parent to try and make them agree to a childcare situation they're not happy with. How awful if you went against your better instincts and then regretted it afterwards.
I think PFB is a funny phrase to use when you're knowingly referring to yourself as being a bit cautious when you don't know what you're doing with your first born but it's not so nice when it's a label attached to somebody else who you don't know at all.
I'd be staying well out of it - in fact I'd be running very very far away cos it's going to implode if Friend B is ringing around trying to rally supporters to bug Friend A on her behalf (I suspect you're not the only friend she's contacted to bring it up).
Poor Friend A - going waaaay above and beyond trying to keep the parents on her wedding guest list happy and having to field it not only from Friend B but from all Friend B's mutual friends being asked to needle at Friend A as well. It's the sort of behaviour that makes people turn around and say "Fuck it, no kids at all then" or "Sod off and don't come" and then we have yet another childfree wedding invite thread.
I'm guessing her child has an issue she doesn't want to share with A, but WHAT a rude way to go about things! Poor A must have thought she'd come up with come up with a fabulous plan for all concerned.
A must suck it up I'm afraid as she is hosting, and try to make B happy with things, but poor poor bride. Guests can be very vexing.
PFB but I can understand.I went to a wedding (in spain) with a similar arrangement and I was quite anzious about it beforehand especially as the 'nannies' were Spanish.But on the day it was fine, better than fine there were about 15 children between 2 months and 12 years and the function room was just across the hallway and they all had a ball! especially the 8 week old baby who even at that age was fascinated and excited by all the older children!.
It says in the op that friend b directly emailed friend a, not that she's ringing round third parties. Op says it's friend a who has asked her to get involved, not friend b.
I agree it should be kept between the two friends, but from this op for various posters to label friend b's behaviour bitchy and that she's rallying round friends to get her point across just seems fantasy to me.
Friend B is being
Not really sure why I'm feeling the need to stick up for friend B but some comments seem a bit harsh on this person who I have never met and have no idea what they're really like.
I would stay out of it.
When my friend did this at her wedding, she gave us lots of background info on the agency she was using. We also had the choice about whether or not we wanted our children to be in the other room.
I trusted her to find someone who she trusted since her little girl was going to be there too. We're all different though and if friend B doesn't feel happy about it, it's not someone else's place to tell her that she should be.
I can understand friend A being annoyed though...
It's absurdly PFB.
What on earth is going to happen during an hour or so when the parents are in the room next door?
I've been to weddings where this has been organised well and I think it's a lovely gesture if parents want to take them up on the offer. Friend B is BU because:
- she should appreciate the gesture even if she wants her DD to stay with her. "Thanks Friend A, I'd feel more comfortable DD sitting with me but that's for the offer" would have been enough
- if she is potentially happy to let DD in the room what exactly is phoning the nursery going to achieve? "So you're CRB checked and have experience with children? Errr yes, you're aware you phoned a nursery?"
Friend B has handled this quite ungraciously IMO.
Total PFB behaviour! You should absolutely keep out of it though OP!
Oh leave poor friend b alone I say! It's a scary world we live in and a little checking up will do no harm.... Silly to cordon off kiddos IMHO. Dd may be au fait with the nursery staff, but other kids won't. Bride is being outrageously bridzilla. So what if friend be is being pfb. She's entitled to!
Some friends of ours did something similar for their wedding and it worked really well. The really young ones (3 and under I think) had their own childminder as they would be going off to sleep in the early evening. The ones who were staying in the room provided had a 3:1 ratio.
We were given a name of someone at the hotel to contact and they gave us the details of various childminders they regularly used so we sort of arranged it ourselves iyswim. I can see why friend A was annoyed though. Friend B's reaction suggested she doesn't trust friend A and thinks her judgement of good childcare providers is any good.
We did something similar at our wedding, much the best option for the DCs. However don't get involved- stay well out of it.
bordellosboheme, I don't think she is being bridezilla!
She isn't saying it is a childless wedding, or that children have to be kept away.
Her main point to me is that by saying B wants to check up on the childcare, she is basically saying 'I don't trust you to have found decent people to look after your own DD for 3 days a week'.
B's DD is also at nursery, and it is one which B perceives to be miles better than all the others in our area (IMO, it isn't) to the extent that she drives 20 mins in the opposite direction of her work to get there and drop DD off before she goes to work.
A and B live miles away from each other, so it isn't like she knows about A's nursery and doesn't like it.
And to the OPs that think I'm unduly muscling in, A emailed me to tell me about B's email, and finished off by saying 'seriously, can you have a word with her about this when you next see her, because I actually don't know what to say'.
I think I'm going to reply that it will be best coming from A, but that I will let B know that A is planning to speak to her
Back away...I feel sorry for the friend who's wedding it is, the pfb mum should just keep the child with her or hire her own sitter for the dc at home, putting extra stress/demands on the bride isn't fair (and my wedding was years ago). It's really odd that she thinks she has the right for more info, it was never going to go over well.
Why doesn't b have the right for more info ffs?
God I feel really sorry for friend b. if I was her I wouldn't be going to the damned wedding now. She's only trying to safeguard her child. Not a crime.
Will B also be checking up on the caterers, making sure she is happy with the registrar / vicar? Will she require references from the chef?
Run like the wind. A is being a total cow.
Sorry, meant B. Trying to multi task.
A is being very good in trying to make her wedding suitable for children.
B is the cow.
Wow some harsh views here....
It's not about the not leaving your child with a stranger, that's fine of course, my dd wouldn't go for a minute in this situation. But I'd never ask to see references, it's about how it comes across and the not being considerate of the efforts the other friend's gone to for friends with children. Weddings, you just accept or you don't go.
If I were you I'd stay well out of it.
If I were the bride I'd announce a change of plan and say that no children other than my own were welcome at my wedding.
If I were B I'd be getting myself a life and reading up on how nursery staff need to be CRB checked, interviewed and appointed on merit and experience regardless of which nursery they work for.
Gosh I have always thought I was not at all pfb about my dts, after reading this I have realized that I probably am.
I would want to know more about the arrangement tbh, but I would have asked the bride though rather than the nursery.
I think it all depends on the age of the children, and how confident they are in unfamiliar surroundings with unfamiliar people, sorry if I missed the bit where you said how friend B dc is.
I don't see why A doesn't just give out the info tbh.
Jeez-B just perhaps wants to satisfy herself that she has "done something" towards the care of her child iyswim.
How many here have let others choose the childcare that they use??
FJL203 I don't think the bride wants it to be a child free wedding.
The majority of friends and family have got children, and lots of aspects of the day have been planned around making it work for their own DD.
I think OP nailed it by saying she has just had her otherwise lovely gesture thrown back at her where as B should probably be saying how lovely it is that she is being accommodating.
Diddl, I sort of see your point, but I know that it wouldn't occur to me to check out the qualifications of the entertainment at a birthday party
diddl - I wouldn't send my very young DC to a childminder because I wasn't willing to leave them with someone who was unsupervised by no-one and who I didn't know.
I was however willing to leave them with a babysitter who was also a qualified P/T nursery nurse and P/T nanny to my friend's daughter because I trusted my friend's recommendation of a nanny she herself used.
I bet most people are also happy to let the school choose the teachers - and therefore carer - for their pre-prep/reception age child too, or do most want to see the credentials and have the details of the class teacher, peripatetic music teacher or additional staff and class helpers who take the child on a day out?
* who was supervised by no-one, not un supervised by no-one. Whoops!
I can see friend B's point of view. My dd is 3 and would NOT be happy being left in the care of strangers, no matter who they are. I'm not being pfb as she's my second and she's left with our cm every day, but she's an incredibly shy little girl and would always want to know the people she's being left with.
I wouldn't have asked for qualifications, etc though, I would have just asked if dd could stay with me if she needed to as she's not very socially confident in new situations.
I'd stay out of it if I was you. Get them to talk to each other, not text, and see if they can sort out the problems. It's probably a communication problem rather than a question of unreasonableness.
I think A is being silly to involve OP, just give B the info and forget about it. A shouldn't be trying to 2nd guess B's motives.
Although you guys know B best, and if she's such a pest the staff will refuse to come after all, maybe... but then why has Bride invited B at all, etc.
I agree with diddl. If I was the bride I would not care at all about any checking up. What's there to hide, after all?
I think it's fine to supply the PITA with the name of the nursery. As for individual qualifications, she can take them up directly.
I should imagine that A has other/better things to think about.
PFB in the extreme. I would stay well out of it.
bordello, do you think it might annoy the nursery/key workers?
I can see them being a bit narked at having their ability questioned by a random mother, plus there is also the issue of them doing a bit of work on the side...
Although I think the issue is still whether this questioning means B thinks A doesn't have capable people to look after her child
All nursery workers do bits on the side, that's normal.
I am beginning to realise what a headache this is for A. Ideally she should ask the workers if they mind their details being passed on, then pass them on, but A has enough on her plate without this silliness, because B can just interview them on the night, no need for advance arrangements (assuming no undisclosed SN, etc.)
The best the B could reasonably hope for is a cold, "You know which nursery these 2 people will be coming from, it's the one I use for DD. Give them a call and ask them, if you're interested."
Though personally I'd add, "But if there's a problem with the childcare on offer at <through gritted teeth> MY wedding I won't be at all offended if you leave littleB at home with her dad or if you decide not to come".
Spare change if the nursery workers a so high and mighty about a genuine reassuring checkup then there's something wrong with them / something to hide. Are they actually allowed to do work on the side.... ? Is that the real issue here?
Stay out of it..
I think it's a great idea - DP's work's parties do the same thing, I actually feel more sorry for the entertainer than worried for the kids because once DS realised that the man was there to provide toys/balloons/magic tricks he wouldn't leave him alone (especially embarrassing during the whole secret pocket in a velvet bag which makes things disappear/produce silk hankies - loud voice, and little poking fingers 'it's HERE')
of course they are allowed to do work on the side, most nursery workers earn very little that they rely on babysitting to pay the bils
I doubt very much if the nursery would tell friend b anything about their staff even if she did ring and ask
bordello, really? They are trying to hide something? That seems awfully paranoid
There was a thread a few months ago where a teacher said the PTA had asked all the teachers to provide details on where they got their degree and the grade they got. There was widespread outrage that parents should ask for, let alone be given this level of detail!
Gosh, you seem a bit blinded by authority spare change. I don't blame PTA actually ( and I'm married to a teacher)
That's strange. The degrees, grades and where they were from of our teachers were published in each annual prospectus. Those of my DC's schools are published on the school websites.
I can't quite believe there are some people out there who'd be calling someone who's laying on quite a lot of provision to stop kids getting bored at a wedding (and there are parts of weddings that are boring as shit to adults even) a fucking bridezilla!
She'd be called a bridezilla if she said no kids, she's being called one for laying stuff on to cater for them in order that they can come... what the fuck do people want? The ceremony to take place in a ballpool conducted by a clown and a balloon modelling wedding ring?
I'd be bloody eloping if I had some of the posters on here for friends who seem to think an entire wedding should totally revolve around their child.
FJL I can only assume your children are at private school. that's not been my experience in state schools
I can't understand why someone would have a friend who you don't trust to organise nursery staff.
bordello given they are nursery nurses from the brides DD nursery, surely they are already experienced with children and are CRB checked - what questions are there to ask? Fair enough ratios/how many other children but that could have been asked nicely to the bride. Sun not the wind and all that when someone is trying to do you a favour.
If for any reason she preferred her DD to stay with her (shy, SN, PFB, whatever) then fine but she doesn't need to come across so rude.
Of course nursery workers do work on the side, but the nursery management usually takes great care to let parents know this is a private arrangement and has nothing to do with the nursery. So if friend B phones up to check their crb status I imagine she will get short shrift from the mgmt.
I don't think that someone who is being as thoughtful as this would be in the slightest bit phased by a child not settling with the childcare and coming back into the main room. She just sounds like she wants everyone to have a good time, including DCs.
Anyway. A is being thoughtful, B is being PFB and C (that's you OP) should be getting her trainers on and running far, far away....
Difficult one. I would want to speak to the childcarers because my DS has allergies, an epi pen and social problems.
I would leave him
quite happily but only if I knew he would be looked after and kept safe.
Personally I think if someone wants to check on provision for their child then thats their business - what harm does it do for friend A to provide it. If friend B does become all PFB and OTT its not friend A it will reflect on iyswim?
Oh, btw - I wouldn't give a toss about the qualifications and bits of paper - just that they could deal with DS needs if they arose.
I think friend b is well within her rights to politely ask for contact details (so as not to bother the bride). I don't let my mates choose my childcare. The school does employ teachers etc on our behalf but that is in an official/qualified capacity and I don't think that's comparable FJL203.
You haven't said how old friend b's children are but I'm guessing they're at the lower end of the age range and that's why she's more concerned.
Its easy when you've got older primary children to forget what its like to have really little ones.
I think this has been blow out of proportion I bet she just wants to ring and ask the nursery nurses a quick question like "dd is 2 will you be able to cope with her with all those 8 year olds?... ...you will that's great see you there"
Agree with everything ShowOfHands said
I think I'm in the minority as I would also want more information. As a parent it is my responsibility to ensure my child is safe and cared for appropriately. I would have no problem in principle about the arrangement but I would want to know about ratios and qualifications.
in my profession I have visited many nurseries and the quality of staffing varies greatly as does the level of experience. even if the nursery is great, there is a hierarchy there with staff who have different levels of responsibility and experience. I would be wanting to ensure that there was at least one supervisor or senior/ very experienced member of staff rather than a bunch of the less experienced or still training staff.
if that makes me pfb then so be it
B is being ridiculous.
She can choose whether she wants her child entertained by qualified, checked childcare professionals in the same building she is or not. I wouldn't be pandering to her by letting her hassle the nursery.
It's not like Friend B is being asked to leave her child in a different building. The child will be there, in the next room, with qualified staff and Friend B can pop in and out as much as she likes. She can even change her mind and bring her child in to the main room if she really isn't happy about the standard of care.
I think Friend B is making a huge mountain out of a molehill and and Friend A is adding to it by trying to involve the OP.
Coffee, I do understand wht you're saying, but ultimately the parents of all these children will be in the same building. They aren't being handed over to strangers, they're being entertained next door.
I think A's dd is around 2, btw.
I'm aware the parents are next door but If they aren't there to supervise it doesn't really matter how far away you are. you are still leaving your child in someone else's care and relying on their judgement
I'm also aware that the child is 2. So is mine but I still would want to know more
I'm with friend B, and I think friend A is being over sensitive and making it all about herself.
Why does she think that friend B is making a judgement on her choice of childcare? That's a completely illogical conclusion to come to. Friend B probably couldn't give a toss about who is looking after little A at nursery, as long as they're not harming her. All she cares about is who will be looking after her child, which is what any good parent of a two year old would care about.
I'm shocked that people think it's PFB to want to at least talk on the phone to someone who is going to be looking after your toddler. It's a basic part of parenting to ensure your child is only looked after by people you trust, not PFB at all!
Friend A made the mistake by being vague in her invitation. She should have made it clear that she was providing a facility that parents were welcome to use if they choose to. She should not have risked coming across as if she was telling people what they would be doing with their own children.
You are next door coffee. Your children are in the room for at most 2 hours, probably nearly 1.5.
What is your concern? Seriously, I'd really like to try and understand because I just don't get it. There are qualified professionals from the b&g's DD's nursery who will be doing the childcare.
Do some of you seriously ask to see the quals of every single person who ever cares for your children? Ask for refs? Even if it's for an hour?
I just wonder how you're going to cope when your kids start school. And I feel very sorry for the schools
I'd meet the babysitters/entertainers on the day, I'd see what the room and set-up was like, I'd leave my 2 year old there if he was happy.
No way would I expect to call their employers to get references.
Well exactly Cloverer. That's the normal way of dealing with this sort of issue. What B is proposing is extremely rude.
kiriwawa- I didn't say I would ask for references. I would want to know about staff ratios, qualifications and experience.
In answer to your question, yes I do make sure I know and trust the people who care for my child. When he starts school, I will see the school, speak to the teachers and see the facilities like most parents do. I will make my choices based on that.
I would also like to think that my ds would be at a coherent developmental stage in 3 years! ie his communication skills would be more advanced, his understanding increased so it could be explained to him about the arrangements.
The nursery workers are not taking these children on a potholing trip. They are looking after them briefly in the next sodding room.
Exactly Heebiejeebie! If your DC isn't happy you can always go in with them anyway.
I'm surprised you need to know about ratios, qualifications and experience in advance for someone to watch your toddler in another room in the same building.
Especially as you can go along there on the day and stay with them if not happy. But I am surprised that you think that a friend is incompetent to make a simple arrangement.
I think everyone parents differently based on their own experiences and comfort zones. Any friends I have wouldn't have an issue with me doing what I needed to feel comfortable leaving my child with someone I did not know myself and vice versa. they certainly wouldn't take it personally!
If I was the bride I would say for goodness sake, just keep your child with you then!
I wouldn't think my friend is incompetent, I see it as my responsibility to ensure my ds is happy and safe, not my friends.
I don't expect everyone to agree but I would expect a friend to respect my parenting choices, particularly if it's just a case of getting additional information
Just go and sit in with the entertainer-simple.
I would respect your parenting choices if I were the b&g if you didn't make it my problem. which means you make a decision on the day and I never need to get involved. Its the fact that B has made this the bride's issue that makes it so incredibly rude
The more I think about this the more I don't see a problem tbh. Friend a has provided a service at her wedding, friend b asked directly for a little bit more information about it. The nursery service is a nice thing to do; friend b can now satisfy herself that it is ok for her dcs.
Surely now the info has been given that's the end of it and everyone can be happy? Not sure why A needs to be cross or defensive or why B should be cross or picky.
The only thing that could make it difficult is others getting involved or friend a or b making more of it than they need to.
I think B has far too much time on her hands. Surely you suss it out on the day and leave little B if everyone is happy if not you don't simples.
I'd be annoyed too if I was friend A, especially if I felt that friend B was infact being passive aggressive about wanting her child to sit in on the meal. Does friend B have form for being passive aggressive? One of my friend's is very passive aggressive and it winds me up no end!
I can't believe how many people on here are saying that they would also want to check up on the nursery staff. Really? I hhonestly don't get it. They are CRB checked and work in a nursery, how much more do you need to know? It's only a couple of hours and you'll be right next door! If you aren't happy with the set up on arrival then either don't leave your child in there, or go in there with him/her. Talk about making life complicated.
if it were me i would want my kids to sit and eat with me,they dont need entertainers or kiddie food.but i would be more direct and just ask,if she said no would consider not going,it doesnt sound like a very child friendly wedding.
Sorry, I think this is very PFB. Qualifications, ffs. She's going to be in the next room! Anxiety and some degree of questioning and vetting I can understand but asking for a cv is OTT.
I am still bottling my reply to A, although I'm much more sympathetic to her annoyance having read some of the replies.
Amber, I have to ask what you think could make a wedding any more child friendly than an open invitation to all parents to bring their children, with a dedicated room for them to play games in during the boring bits of the day and room at their parents table for when they want to be with mum and dad
Your friend wants to check out who will be looking after her child ?
I'm not sure why anyone would worry about that, quite a simple thing to do really, it seems a bit of a fuss not to just let her reassure herself that people who will be looking after her child are safe.
Maybe she herself was abused as a child, it does tend to give you a heightened sense of awareness about who comes into contact with your children,
She not rejecting the concept of her child being looked after in another room, she just wants to reassure herself, that the people who will be looking after the child are safe.
Someone's fears might seem unreasonable to others who do not have the same experiences, it's a bit churlish, not to allow her to do a simple reassurance check.
What ever the reason for her anxiousness, the easiest solution would be to let her check.
Most people who look after other people's children must be use to the parents being inquiring about their suitability.
Child friendly to me is the kids being part of everything that going on,not being shoved off in some room.
I wasnt sure from your post if the kids are allowed at the table,i thought all kids had to go in that room?if so then to me thats not child friendly,i like inclusive stuff,not this is for grown ups that is for kids.
ffs she's hardly asked for a CV.
She just wants a quick chat with the staff. She's not bothered the bride (or God knows she'd be being criticised for that) What's the big deal?
The bride is totally oversensitive. So, she's laid on a crèche... Good idea. Doesn't mean no one is allowed to ask for any details about it
and should be vilified for doing so
And why the constant reference to the fact that its only 'in the next room'? Does proximity make the staff qualified/experienced, the children safe, the ratios suitable, the age range appropriate? No its irrelevant.
A should let B have the details, then forget about it.
Maybe B is being PFB. Maybe she has very good reasons to want to talk to the staff in advance. If she was employing the nursery staff as babysitters for just her child, on A's recommendation, it wouldn't seem an odd request. Having more children there gives more reason to check - ratios, supervision, activities appropriate for different ages, toileting arrangements.
The nursery staff know A, and A's DD. They don't know B or B's child. Looking after children of different ages in a room at a wedding reception is different to looking after them in a structured nursery setting.
Eglantine I just think its overkill, seeing a sheet of qualifications doesnt guarantee the competence of the childminder and its guaranteed to add stress for the bride. The relevance of it being in the next room is obvious: she can wander through as often as she likes and check on her PFB. It's not as if they are in lock-down.
Also if the child is seriously unhappy there is nothing to stop the mum from going to collect the child.
I think a sheet of qualifications would be overkill too...
Clarifying a quick question such as.
"My child is 2 the others are 8 will you be able to cope with this range I realise that's not what you're used to?"
"My child is in nappies still is that ok. Will there be enough of you to manage?"
"What will you do if s/hes upset?"
Eglantine I agree, what you have just described would be totally reasonable (I would do that myself), but the OP said friend B is asking friend A for references. Which I do think is overkill.
Stay out of it.
Personally I don't think friends B us being unreasonable and I'm surprised friend A didn't include of the email 'X & X are from DD's nursery [nameofnursery] whom we have been using for a number of years and are very happy with. If you have any questions please let me know'
If friend A doesn't want to give out any information then I would wonder why, because that's a bit weird.
Well said parachutes are fab
The OP has no idea what friend B wants to speak to the nursery staff about. She just guessed at references.
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