AIBU to not allow my child to go to a football parade on a week night during SATs week?(475 Posts)
I'm being called all the names under the sun by my ex, and DS1 is sulking and barely speaking to me.
I just found out tonight that Ex DP is planning to take DS1 to watch the Man United parade on Monday night. It is 6-7.30pm, and is 25 miles from home.
Any other school night I'd be fine with this. But not during SATs week, which it is next week.
I've said he can't go. He's worked hard for these exams, his sets for high school depend on the outcome of them. I just want to do what is best for DS.
I've rang my mum, his headteacher, to ask her opinion in case I am being unreasonable. She is furious that ex thinks this is even a good idea.
This is his dads reply by text 'you too are pathetic when he rebels against you youve only yourself to blame'. And 'Like I said pathetic'. Followed by 'just wait promise you he will rebel he already can't wait to get out of mums school I will laugh my ass off'. Those are his exact words by the way, not my typos.
I want my son to do well. I hope I am not being unreasonable.
It's not like utd don't have a fucking parade every season is it??
I would let them go, I suspect I am not the norm on here though .
My dd has Sats next week - realistically he could be in bed by 9 - surely you won't be getting him cramming in the evenings?
Just re-read and it is Monday - if it was Wednesday I would say ok then go, as it is Monday I think I would refuse too
Can you not have the compromise of be there for 6, see the start, and come home again?
Stats are meaningless for secondary school as they will do their own assessments and a lot of children will start in one set in september and move to another at christmas.
I would let him go
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
If your mum is is his headteacher then i think she may be a bit biased (sorry) What time will he actually be home? I think as long as he is in bed by 9 30 - 10 then he would get his eight hours +sleep surely?
I'd probably let him go as it's an historic one with Fergie going.
Mind you, my DS was at Scouts until 10.30pm the night before his 11+, so you might not want my opinion!
Having been to Manchester from where we live, busy nights like that will be, he will be lucky to be home for 9 even leaving early. His bedtime is 8.30 on a normal school night. His dad gets him up at 6.15 and he's in school for 7.30 in breakfast club.
If he's already worked hard I don't think a few hours is going to affect his results? Possibly could affect them more with him being so upset he can't go and watch the parade?
I'm a teacher and I'd say definitely go.
He will just resent you. Let him go. I thought you were going to say it finished at 9 or 10pm. If you would let him go on a normal school night there is no reason to not let him go just because there happen to be SATS this week
He does need 10 hours sleep minimum.
He's also not that interested in football. His dad is. Ds1 just wants to show off in school. If he was football mad is understand but he isn't.
yabu but I can sort of see why, personally I would let him go and think all the fuss over sats is ridiculous
Dneice has SATS next week too. She will spend 4 nights til 9pm some nights swimming training.
Let him go. These are the things of which memories are made. SATS are not.
I'd let him go too. SATs are more important for the school. Primary SATS won't mean anything to any of you in a few years. Make sure he has early nights in the run up to it and he'll be fine with one late night.
Doesn't matter if he is footie mad or not we want to go and his dad wants to take him. It is a one off event and one slightly later night even in stats week isn't going to blight his education in the long term.
He is borderline 4/5 and obviously I want him to get those 5's if he can. I'd be upset for him if he didn't get the results he has worked for.
Let him go, he sounds like he needs a break from the pressure.
But the results are meaningless and i cant even remember my sons stat results
Why on earth would you be upset. It means nothing. Why has he been forced to work towards a series of meaningless tests rather than enjoy actual learning?
YABU, but so is your ex by the way he speaks to you. Sats test the standard of teaching not the child. Secondary schools generally do their own assessments when the child starts and won't base sets purely on Sats esp as in recent years quite a lot of schools have boycotted Sats. Also secondary don't always put children in sets for every subject from the word go, generally just maths or perhaps English ime
he sounds like he could do with the break, as others have said sats mean nothing in terms of set movement as the high schools will carry out their own.
SATS are for the benefit of the school, not the child or his future school and if you've been led to believe otherwise the advisor is being disingenuous. Your son will be independently tested when he reaches secondary school.
This is a once in a lifetime for your child - trust me, with other managers taking their new appointments for other clubs in the Prem next season Man Utd will never be doing a victory parade again.
OK, maybe not, but still you're being unreasonable. It's a really, really big thing for a fan to be part of and to be able to get there but not to be allowed will result in resentment from all but the calmest, most forgiving of kids (or adults!).
You mention him having to be in for 7.30 for breakfast club - can you or your ex take an hour or two off work as a one off and allow him a lie in and then get/take him to school for the start of the day?
Go on, let him go!
I would want my child's SATS to be a reliable picture of how they are day to day. My dd sits hers next week and has done no extra work.
I am a teacher who does the Year 7 setting as well.
Putting pressure on children aged 10 to perform in exams is wrong anyway, but to stop them doing things they want to simply because of the SATS is unfair IMO.
I'd let him go. He won't be in bed that late and it's a one off, special event.
Will Fergie be there? It's a piece of history.
SATs only exist as a stick with which to beat schools.
To add some balance we use SATs and primary teacher information to set the children, so they are not totally irrelevant . However we reset again about six weeks later using our own initial assessments . We can move a child up ,but to do so we need to move another down .
They matter to the school- it doesn't matter to him whether he gets a 4or a 5. They will use them for setting, but with advice from the school, and move him pretty quickly if it is wrong. Schools get in a tizz about it because of the league tables.
exactly Aris, it should be a picture of a typical performance for that child not something that they have worked for. It seems that lots of parents and children have this message from somewhere that Sats are important and will effect their future and its so untrue and so unfair to put unnecessary pressure on people.
Tuesday is new Grammar test. I would def let him go because this new test does not matter one jot.
This year's cohort are the guinea pigs. They sit this new test and all you are going to get as a parent is the actual score that he gets. No level, no indication of how well he has done in comparison to his peers - just the raw score. It will then be used by the powers that be at Whitehall to set the expectations and levels for next years test.
It will have absolutely no bearing on his Secondary school. Let him go but make sure he knows that it's a massive treat for working so hard.
. its daft what if he were to get toothache that night and end up awake late in pain or any other possibility.one day is not a picture of a childs ability just like pp said and he won't have his high school future pegged out from one late night/lower score. your ex sounds like he speaks to you like crap though so yanbu to be pissed off about that
I would let him go too.
SATs don't make as much difference to the individual child as they do to the school. If he has a good grounding in the subjects, it won't significantly affect his outcome to be in bed an hour late on one night.
If he would be 3 or 4 hours late to bed that would be different but this is something he really wants to do.
I doubt very much that the very small difference being in bed an hour late would make to his performance in his SATs would have any effect whatsoever on his sets at high school. If he were placed in the wrong set he'd soon be moved anyway.
You need to work out how much of this is about your feelings about your ex and his lack of respect for you and how much is really about your DS's performance in school. It would be quite understandable if you were taking advantage of a ready made excuse to stop your ex having an enjoyable evening with your DS if that's how he usually speaks to you.
Are you definitely taking the moral high ground here?
I am genuinely surprised that everyone is agreeing with me. I must be transforming myself into an average mumsnetter . I must get an alternative hobby
aris . I thought I'd be going against the grain too apparently not
We go to them (when City actually do win anything) and I wouldn't think about not going. It's something that they will remember for ever. They'd have forgotten about whatever SATS paper it is by the weekend.
Unfortunately your Ex sounds like a bit of a tosser, but I don't think that's a reason not to go.
Let him decide how much the SATs mean to him.
In reality, he will be assessed when he gets to High School, a late night probably won't affect his performance, and SATs are for the school's benefit.
So, he'd go to bed 30mins late?
Let him go.
Yes, I would let him go too. Your ex's response was childish, but I think you're wrong to stop your DS from going.
... of course the Head is furious, unfortunately her job may depend on it and at this moment she will be feeling a lot of pressure. No reason to transfer that pressure to your child.
Your Ex sounds like an arse
Sorry, I meant her job may depend on SATs results, not your son's performance
It's great that you have this decision to make! Imagine supporting Stockport...
Some of our local secondary schools use the test results, along with Teacher Assessment levels, to set in Year 7.
Happy and relaxed or grumpy and disappointed could make a difference to how a 10 or 11 year old does in a test. . .
See where you're coming from though- not isn't timing!
Some of our local secondary schools use the test results, along with Teacher Assessment levels, to set in Year 7.
Happy and relaxed or grumpy and disappointed could make a difference to how a 10 or 11 year old does in a test. . .
See where you're coming from though- not great timing!
The head teacher is your mum though, right OP? Of course she's going to back you up.
I'm concerned that he has 'worked hard' for his SATs, apart from a few practice papers to familiarise children with the format they shouldn't be working hard for them. Unfortunately some schools do pressurise their pupils to perform so that the school looks good, perhaps you could have a word with the head
I agree with others if he can be in bed by 9 he will be fine, if it was midnight then probably not.
Oh I missed that - the fact that the Head is his grandmother
That does suggest levels of complication
Let him go, I can't believe the fuss surrounding sats; they are not qualifications.
His HT is also his GM? I missed that bit. Presumably that is why you are more concerned than the average parent that he performs!
I wish my yr6 needed 10 hours sleep/night (wistful).
I don't think SATs should be made more important than a fun & relatively early night out. Sorry but yabu.
I wouldn't let him go.
He won't remember the Man Utd football parade, the final one with Fergie in charge for long.
But the Sats results he'll remember for the rest of his life.
I would let him go but then I am about SATS.
My dc will do their best as always but life outside of school and the ridiculous SATS malarky will continue as usual.
I'm a primary head.
If he was my child, I'd let him go.
If he was one of my pupils, I'd advise him to go.
'But the Sats results he'll remember for the rest of his life'
I had 2 footsie mad lads and wouldn't have dreamed if acting like this.
Of course you should let him go. Sats are for the school not pupil.
Your mom should act like a concerned grand mother who thinks this will be a wonderful father son bonding memory.
If you keep up this pressure over sats what will you be like over GCSEs and A levels.
Sats have absolutely no hearing on high school settings either.
Chewing - I suspect there was a hint of sarcasm in that.
Message withdrawn at poster's request.
I'd let him go. It's a fantastic memory.
In fact, my DB took the whole day off school when we won the rugby world cup to go & watch the parade with our Dad. He had the permission of both his tutor & the head, who wished they could go too.
I would let him go.
It's not as if he's going to be that late to bed anyway.
Gah course, oops sorry
Lol at dads tongue in cheek comments.
I'm joining the rest - compromise of him going for the start and coming home early.
At the risk of being mean, your mum thinks the SATs matter because she's a head of a primary school, and for the school it'self, the SATs really, really matter. For the individual child, not so much. The secondary school will put him in sets based on his SATs results to start with, but at most you've got to worry about him being in the wrong set until Christmas.
Arisbottle Sat 11-May-13 19:45:16
"I would want my child's SATS to be a reliable picture of how they are day to day. My dd sits hers next week and has done no extra work."
This. The SATS results are there to provide a reliable picture of the day to day teaching of the school. If parents force their children to cram and even engage tutors, as some do, all that happens is that nobody gets a reliable picture of whether the school is doing its job or not. So the whole exercise will have been wasted.
Dd's HT was like this. Told the children in assembly that these exam results would determine their future. Problem was, I had already explained the SATS procedure and the setting policies of the local secondaries at home, so dd knew he was lying. Not a good thing to learn about your HT.
Otoh dd's friend became hysterical when she fell ill during SATS week as she genuinely believed her future would be ruined if she didn't sit them.
I would let him go.
DD has sats, monday she will be home at half 8 as she has netball, Tuesday it will be 10pm as she has scouts.
Let him go. SATS are about the school, not the child. High school will do their own assessment. And it will probably be more detrimental for him to be so upset he didn't go tbh.
"Told the children in assembly that these exam results would determine their future. "
This makes me angry.
I have asked all the secondaries and they all access once the kids get there.
How dare they put so much pressure on kids that these results determine their future, no they bloody do not they just tell people how the school is doing.
He'll be in bed by 8.30
Pigs started doing loops over our house if my two went to bed by 9pm ever at that age. 9. 9.30 before DD2 was asleep and don't even go there with DD1.
YABU. Sats measure schools, not pupils.
I have three adult sons who have all been to good universities. They all got fantastic A level results.
I have no idea what their SATs results were. They have no idea either. They were forgotten immediately. They are an irrelevance to the child taking them.
What they do all remember is the football parade when their team won the FA cup.
I wouldn't hesitate to let him go.
Well, given that it isn't his team, he isn't that in to football, and only wants to go because his dad does - and to show off to his classmates. No. I won't let him go.
If he really wanted to go because of all the other reasons given, I'd consider it, but for the reasons he wants to go, it's a bad idea.
It's just a game of football. And a manager who is retiring. DS1 doesn't even know who he is!
Ex wants to go, and because it is his night with DS, he is dragging him along.
Also, I want the school to have good results - it's good for the teaching staff and my mum who have all put hard work in with these children for many years. Why would I want the school to suffer? Even if my mum wasn't the head or a teacher there, I have no reason to want to sabotage his chance of doing well in the tests.
DS1 has a bad attitude towards school and working as it is. I'm trying to drill it out of him. Letting him go will not help those efforts.
SATS matter to schools, not pupils, so of course the head is going to say "no, he shouldn't go".
Let him go, they won't matter in six months time, let alone in a year.
I feel sorry for him to be honest, regardless of if its his team or not it would be something he would remember for ever and he doesnt get to go because of SATS and the wanting to create a good work ethic. i think this sounds more like you dont want him to have a fun night with your ex.
Well thats that the .
I wonder if it's important to his father to have him there?
Maybe he wants to share the experience with him.
At his age he should be learning because it is fun, not because he cares about exams or feels the need to bolster his teachers' careers. And he should definitely feel that school is not the only place where learning happens. You seem to have a rather narrow view of what constitutes education.
I would let your ds go and watch the parade, hes worked all year in school for his sats. Probably not the best person to ask though, weve done the promotion party at home, away and the open top bus this season.
yes, because the godlike adoration of people who kick balls around is nuts. Where else are managers revered like this? Why stand around for hours to watch a bus go by?
let us hope he learns better English than his father.
I am having a hard time telling my dd she can have a completely normal week next week - the school are fine and downplaying it but other parents seem to think their children should be shut in all evening and completely forgo their normal routine. No playing allowed, her friends not being allowed to go to athletics after school etc.
Am so fed up about it, it's this which is stressing her out
I would definitely let him go btw, it sounds like a memorable experience.
It's the atmosphere, the celebration, the sense of being part of something. I'm new to the phenomenon that is being a footy fan but I kind of get it having been to a few matches and parades.
I have also seen the bond it has created between DS and his dad, the good times had and sharing disappointment (City fans )
Just because you dont get it, or because your ex is a twat, I don't think you should be denying your DS a share in his Dad's celebration. But I am wondering if it's more to do with you than him, especially as you've taken the trouble to get others on your side.
It does seem that this is you having a go at your ex Op.
Why ask if you're being unreasonable? You seem pretty certain you're not.
I don't 'get' football either but there's another aspect to this which ohforfoxsake mentions regarding sharing stuff with his dad. I think that's v important.
Sounds like you'd already made your mind up OP, don't know why you were asking.
Sorry but if it is his night with his dad why on earth do you get to dictate what they do together?
I actually hope he does take him anyway as it is what your son wants to do and your reasons to stop him aren't good enough to say no IMO
Why ask? Why not? It doesn't change my opinion, but I just wanted to see what others think.
Lady his dad is a twat in general, this makes no difference to him. If you want another example, he let him watch Paranormal Activity when DS was 9. That kind of stuff. He's more in to lazy parenting, or Disney Dad as it seems to be known on MN. I don't need to have a go at him - never have done. I find ignoring him is better.
YABU, you've been told that by most people but obviously your decision. Don't know why you bothered asking really.
Anyway I think you should let him go, you're obviously biased because your mums the head teacher, but I agree with your ex.
He doesn't have a set night, he just asks can he have him on days that suit him. He must have taken Monday off this week to watch the parade, and as it is his only day off, he knew he wouldn't be able to see DS any other night. So he decided to take him along too.
I guess if it was local it wouldn't be an issue. But it isn't local.
Seeing as its your ds s night with ex then I can't see how you can actually stop him going.
I think he should go. If it were my DCs I'd be cheering them on. It's a shame your ex is being a twat in the general scheme of things, and yes he may be using this to wind you up, but that's no reason to keep your DS from something amazing. SATs are completely unimportant, when DD1 came home with a pile of revision papers over Easter last year, I recycled the lot. And she hasn't had any sort of dip in Yr 7, has just kept right on progressing.
So it's the only night they can spend together?
I guess it's a matter of priorities. My child's relationship with their parents - either of us - and nurturing that is more important to me than statistics and league tables.
I can just say DS isn't going that night. He doesn't have a set night, if I say he can't go, he doesn't go. I've only said no twice before, and that is because he often only gives me a couple of hours notice. And obviously sometimes I've planned stuff.
'He wants to go because his father does and to look cool at school'
And that's a problem??
Op if you put your mothers wishes as a head teacher and stupid meaningless sats tests before the above statement then I feel really really sorry for your lad to be honest.
Your ds will definatly know Alex Ferguson I suspect this is much more to do with pissing off your ex and sucking up to your mother than it is about a supposedly late night.
You are being very unreasonable and the vast majority of posters on here agree.
echoing what everyone else has said it was never about the SATs really, which are a load of bull anyway, that is proved by your constant sniping about your ex and his parenting. Hope you see sense and let your boy go and enjoy a one time occasion with his dad. regardless of whether you think hes a twat or not.
I'm putting DS's education above football, yes. Regardless of whether the general consensus is that SAT's aren't important. It's more about attitude towards education than anything else.
But you've already said its his only night off so the only night he an see his dad.
Obviously you know best won't waste anymore time.
An attitude that life is for living is also good. No 10 year old should be missing out on things because of an 'exam'. No 10 year old should feel pressure to do well in an exam.
I think its quite sad you value a meaningless exam more than you do his relationship with his father and his chance to have a fantastic evening out with him and still be home at a reasonable time.
Well you asked if you were being unreasonable, you have been told by an overwhelming majority that yes, you were. It's fine that you won't accept this, but I do wonder why people even want to garner opinions if they aren't willing to be open minded.
I will say that I think you have made a very poor decision.
I feel sorry for your DS.
Can't stay up 30 mins late, having fun, just because of stupid bloody SATS!
I wouldn't say constant sniping. I've given one other example of his style of parenting.
Not the exam, but his education in general.
DS has the attitude of 'it'll do' and 'can't be arsed'.
He's in for a shock in high school!
Listen to the poster way upthread that said it is only the grammar test the next day. It's not being levelled in that this year. Your son is being used to set next year's levels. He has no chance at a 4 or 5.
I agree that it isn't special because it's football. It is a night out doing something different and exciting though.
I don't think OP's are obliged to change their mind just because posters decide they are being unreasonable are they? I would ask to find out what others thought out of interest and perhaps to take into account next time. It's not always a good idea to give a child what they want when they are sulking to get it.
I don't think you'd be sabotaging anything by allowing him to be in bed 30mins to an hour late on one night but I can see that you could feel you weren't being seen to be supporting your DM by allowing him to go.
You're clearly very flexible about contact and your ex sounds like he's an immature, unsupportive twunt. You just need to be very sure that you're making decisions for the right reasons because it would be very tempting to stoop to his level at times like this.
SATs aren't about your DS's education though. They are about getting the school through OFSTED. He won't actually learn anything from doing these tests. So your decision doesn't have any bearing on his education.
He will have an enriching and memorable experience if he goes to the parade though, which is much more important.
Still, you'd obviously made your mind up already before you even started this thread.
And you think making him miss out on things is going to change his attitude?
He is a 10 year old boy, that attitude is perfectly normal!
I would definitely let him go, wouldn't bother me at all. Let him go, he can still work hard the rest of the week.
But it will all be counter productive and he wont learn for the love of it and will just resent it even more if he already has the wrong attitude towards school.
You are hardly fostering an environment that teaches that education and learning is fun if all he seeing is you putting it above things he also wants to do.
He will be 25 miles away from home and relying on trains and buses to get home. I can just see it ending in disaster quite frankly. They will have to leave straight from school, so it will be a long day for DS, and they don't know what time they will get home for sure.
If he gets tired he can sleep on the bus and train.
It seems like you are just looking for reasons not to let him go.
He's already got over it now anyway, so I think he can't have been so bothered. He was fine about 15 minutes after I posted it.
He's sat here now laughing away and being his usual self.
'Ex wants to go, and because it is his night with DS, he is dragging him along. '
If it is his night though surely that is his choice? My DTs have SATS also and I won't be doing anything that differently..I wouldn't stop them going out, that isn't really a late time anyhow.
Of course I would look for reasons he can't go. Otherwise I'd say he could go? That doesn't even make sense.
You're not putting his education first you're putting the school's performance first, which is something completely different. In terms of attitude to education, its quite possible to value education and still enjoy other things in life. When I was doing my A Levels and and University exams I always made sure that I DIDN'T revise the night before and that I tried to have as much normality as I could around the exams whilst also being able to revise. Its tricky but cramming doesn't work and an important part of education and growing up is about learning to have balance in life. I have a 2:1 degree and I have no idea what I got in my SATs, I can barely remember my GCSEs to be honest
You will regret not letting him go.
But none of your reasons have any logic to them. You seem to be looking for problems that don't exisit and certainly don't seem to be thinking about your son.
Like I said before I hope his dad ignores you and takes him anyway. You still haven't answered why you feel you can dictate what he does when looking after his son.
"Twenty five miles" sounds pretty local to me, that's less than I drive to work everyday.
Let him go. If you don't you are being a total spoilsport for no good reason.
He isn't revising at home - he won't be doing any over the week, and is attending his usual activities. But I don't think going to something which happens every year
several times 25 miles away, on public transport in the evening during SATs week is the best idea in the world.
Our town have just won the FA cup, if he wants to go to a good parade, our home town one will be just as good. As I say, he hasn't got a 'team'.
I can dictate what he does by not letting him go. I never have, but I can do. He has no access arrangements. Everything is done ad hoc to suit him.
So we are taking Wigan to Manchester then. Thats a nothing trip!
You still haven't answered why you feel you can dictate what he does when looking after his son.
I guess that's because the OP usually lets the ex choose which night he has their DS. She probably doesn't have to do that.
25 miles isn't local at all! Local is in the same town or next town.
You still haven't really explained what the problem is. What is it thats so bad that you think will happen if he goes?
This is all going to kick you in the arse when he hits his teenage years Op.
That he will be tired, it is a long day for him, it will be on public transport, and that isn't reliable at the best of times. I have done it by bus and train recently, in the day time. It took ages.
I have done Wigan to Manchester on the train many a time and NEVER had any sort of delay and trains are pretty regular too.
But even if he is tired when he does his SATS its not the end of the world
I would let him go. One evening wont ruin the knowledge he surely should possess by now! I should think that especially during SATS week it is important to rest your mind a little.
My son is also sitting the SATS next week, and I have no had him do any revision, they have prepared enough in school.
I would have let him go. SATs are for the school, not for the DC. He should not be feeling pressured about exams at 10, there will be enough of that in years to come. My DS1 is 18, he is in his A2 year, he and I worked out the other day that he has spent 4 Spring/Summers revising and under pressure of doing exams. Your lad should be having fun and making memories.
Tomorrow our day is being completely rearranged so my 2 can watch the ManU match, see the trophy be lifted and listen to Sir Alex's speech. If I lived near Manchester I would allow them to go to the parade on Monday, and DS2 had 2 GCSEs onTuesday.
He might be laughing now and not bothered, but when the time comes he could be very upset.
I'd let him go. SATs are a load of bollocks really and while they determine which set they go into when they start secondary school...by the end of the first half term they'll be moved around again if the set they're in doesn't suit their ability.
So he might get to bed a bit late?
Mountain - meet molehill.
"Well, given that it isn't his team, he isn't that in to football, and only wants to go because his dad does - and to show off to his classmates. No. I won't let him go... Ex wants to go, and because it is his night with DS, he is dragging him along."
That's really horrible. You're doing this to spite/out of dislike for your ex. Would you rather the ex cancels that contact night and goes to watch the parade? Because I would if it were my team and you were my ex.
You know, I hate my ex with a passion. I mean really really hate him. But not as much as you appear to hate yours.
I hope you take him to the Wigan parade.
But why would it be a problem that he was tired?
If you want to help out your mum by pushing him to do really well, then maybe this makes sense. Or if you are trying to stop your exH from doing the whole 'creating memories' thing (because this is the sort of thing a boy that age will remember as a big 'father son' event), but that's rather petty.
Honestly, I can see you've made your mind up, but really, it does make you look petty.
NB, I meant to highlight and only wants to go because his dad does in my last post.
I'm not bothered if he cancels the night, it makes no difference to me. I'm quite happy having DS home with me.
Yes, I've told him I'll take him to the Wigan parade with his brother. He is happy about that.
If he has worked so hard where is his reward?
It does seem more stick than carrot.
Yes education is important and you are aiming high for your child but are you aiming a little too high?
Before you even typed in the OP it was a fine deal really, it may be tough and it may go against the initial support you got but in the light of some if the comments here would it be possible to reconsider perhaps ?
It just seems like a nice treat.
It's not always about the battles, usually it's better to win the war.
He's got a whole load of massive treats over the summer planned - and he knows this! He's being pulled out of school for several things before the end of the year.
His dad is pulling him out for them by the way. He has a residential trip planned, and a weekend in Alton Towers to look forward to.
He's got a summer full of lovely stuff planned to be honest!
So your saying he can't do something special with his dad then your going to take him to a similar event yourself. Can you not see how that will appear to your ex? And how unfair that is to stop your son having that special experience with his dad.
I'm not aiming high - just aiming for him to reach his full potential.
I'm definitely not a pushy parent!
It's ok to pull him out of school but not go to the parade?
He can go to Wigan with his Dad if he wants to - I really don't mind at all! It has nothing to do with it being 'something special with his dad', and all to do with the timing of it.
His dad is pulling him out of school.
As several people have said, sats are about the school not the child, so this is about your mum not your son.
"I'm definitely not a pushy parent!"
I think I'd feel less saddened by this if you were, OP.
OP I think you sound like a lovely parent who is trying to do the right thing by your son. Your ex is probably trying to do the right thing for his son in his style. (He is out of order being rude to you though). Regardless of WHAT the event is, sometimes you have to give a little to get the moral high ground. You could say something to your son and XP along the lines of - I've been having a think, and although education is hugely important, if DS has a quiet week and early nights the rest of the week, I could consider letting you have some Dad/son time at the parade if you GUARANTEE to be in by 10...
Might score you some points too!
I think you need to stop being so controlling. I know you don't see it that way, but that is exactly how it sounds.
Is there a power struggle going on with you and your ex generally? There just seems to be a lot of hostility.
No, no power struggle. He never normally tells me what he is doing with DS, and I don't ask. DS will tell me after and I silently feel annoyed that he has done something inappropriate. But it takes a lot to get me to say anything. The 18 DVD's was one. The leaving him alone with a dog that had bitten him once already was another one.
I know I am being controlling, I don't see that as an issue. I am controlling the fact that I don't want DS going somewhere I feel is inappropriate. Any parent with what they believe to be their childs best interest at heart would be controlling.
My dd is going and she has SAT's next week. She is also sitting the level 6 papers.
Its isn't clear though why you feel its inappropriate. Its like saying my child might be a bit tired if they have a late night before an Ofsted inspection so they can't go out.
OP, it feels as if you and your ex are both guilty of using your DS to beat each other up with. That's very .
Yabvu he is ten and this will be a fabulous event for him to go to with his dad.
SATs are totally irrelevant in the big scheme of things, ,my ds2 is taking them next week as well and I have told him as much. I have said he should try his best as he should do every day at school but I wouldn't make him miss out on a treat because its SATs week.
If your ex can't see your D's Amy other night this week'ot also seems mean to make him miss seeimg his dad for a week as well. So he isn't a great dad iyo but he still deserves to have a relationship with his dad.
It is an issue, OP.
It's so sad that you're not able to see the value in this for your DS, and you think the most pointless part of the pointless sats (which probably won't be affected anyway) is more important than your DS having the evening out with his dad.
I gather since you control which nights your ex has your DS, this is not actually an issue of your ex just wanting to go and dragging your DS with him because he was there. It sounds like something he really wants to share with his DS.
I suspect you thought everyone would come out with a rallying cry of yanbu, so I'm sorry if you've been disappointed.
I really hope you are able to reconsider this, but I think it's likely you won't.
You're being horrible to your son. His father, who sounds a dick, wants to do something he sees as special with him and you're putting so many obstacles in his way because you don't like him.
Your name change seems perfectly appropriate.
How so pointy?
His dad doesn't pay much interest in anything about DS other than actually seeing him. He doesn't do his homework with him, or take any interest in parents evenings, reports, extra activities DS does etc.
Everything is left to me.
I don't talk to his dad other than a text saying 'can I have DS on X day' and I reply yes.
I had to force him to come to parents evening this year as DS was making no effort and being cheeky in class. I wanted him on board. Ex thought it was funny.
DS doesn't have 2 parents working together unfortunately. I tried, but it is easier to make all the decisions myself, and ex is happy with it that way it seems.
When I say I don't talk to him - he doesn't talk to me, so I gave up trying. It's been 4.5 years.
Ex didn't want anything to do with making a decision over high schools. He literally pays no interest in actually bringing a child up.
But he is taking an interest.
He want's to take him to the parade.
It's you that's putting your foot down.
YANBU to be unhappy about it, and I can't believe how unpleasant some posters are being. I'd be a bit unhappy about this on any school night, but it's really not great in SATS week and your ex shouldn't be being so vile to you.
Whatever anyone feels about SATS, it is certainly true that many secondary schools will indeed base their setting on them, at least initially. I have thoughts about SATS in the wider picture, but I knew set 1 in year 7 needed a level 5 at SATS, and so I did certainly care about dd getting one if she could.
You're not being nasty and you're not being unreasonable: I don't necessarily know what the right thing for you to do here is going to be, but if you do change tack, remember that your motivation and reasons were perfectly fair.
He takes an interest in the fun stuff. Not the boring parenting stuff. You know, the important decisions, doing what is best for DS etc.
Interesting name change, op!
I wanted to change it months ago, for a joke
penis jokes. But it wouldn't change. MN have just fixed it for me, so I was checking it worked. It does .
Our school isn't doing the exams the day after because they are not stupid!
They don't have a choice, smudging - they have to do them on the day set, it's a statutory requirement.
My DS is in year 9.
When he was in year 6, his Primary school was one of many who boycotted the SATs in protest at the fact they're a waste of time and completely irrelevant.
He still ended up in exactly the right sets for his ability. Other kids who took the SATs at their Primary schools were moved about after the first half term, into sets that suited them.
This is normal. Schools don't need SATs results in order to know where the child should be.
A decent parent would have said to you 'look, I'm thinking about taking ds to this, but it's on a school night: what do you think? Are you ok with this?'. They would not go ahead and sort it and then make you feel shit for not wanting ds to do it.
It's all very well saying the tests are for the school not the child, but it's the child's sets next year, not the school's. A lot of arrogant complacency surrounds some people's notions about SATS, I think.
Secondary schools are also obliged to set GCSE targets from SAT results and are judged on whether students attain them. It's ridiculous to say they aren't about the child - you can't get much more about the child than that!
They are not going to leave him in the wrong set- it is only a rough guide anyway.
Btw, I'm a secondary teacher and I would let him go. Although the SATS set him up for secondary, he will thrive there regardless.
But this does seem to have much more to do with access arrangements and I can understand it must be tough.
I agree about SATs being a waste of time. A lot of exams are. But the point is, they are there, he has to do them
unless he is ill so why not do your best in them?
I just want him to have a good attitude towards education. He needs an education in order to succeed in life.
The SATS results won't effect his GCSE grades though!
But high schools rarely use Sats for sets.
Dd's school doesn't do data at all and several children go on to state secondaries each year.
Seriously - your stressing your child about SATS ?!
But they will affect which grade his teachers expect him to aim for.
No, they're probably not going to leave him in the wrong set: but why start out in it, if you needn't? And yes: GCSE predictions also use year 6 SATS, amongst other things.
That said, I would probably let him go - it's only the SPAG!
Let the poor boy go!
Dd's school doesn't do data at all
Unless it's an independent school, it won't have any choice.
No, I'm not stressing him, I'm just asking him to do his best?
He's not sat here working 24/7 on them. He's not chained to the chair revising.
I just want him to be well rested and prepared for next week. That's all. A cup and football team are not the priority to me!
These things are not set in stone- they can make new predictions about grades, and it is what he gets that counts- not what he is predicted.
Yes, but what you are predicted matters quite a lot in terms of what is expected of you, IME!
Not that I am saying, y'know, if you don't let him go the he will be put in set 3 and predicted a d and his life will be in tatters. That would be silly. But I do think that a) OP is trying to do the right and responsible thing and b) it is complacent and arrogant and wrong when people go on about SATS being irrelevant and only for the school.
If you do let him go, I mean! Sorry.
All I want to do is what is best for my DS.
Do they really use SATS to predict GCSE outcomes, even though theres a whole 5 year gap!?
OK - OP, I feel pretty ambivalent about football. BUT you want to keep DH in your son's life, and maybe the thing they bond over is football... Some parents aren't that interested in Parents' Eves etc etc but LET him parent in his way and you parent in yours...
HAve you read Fever Pitch by Nick Hornby?
A rough guide- of course they have to change their minds! DS1 came on in leaps and bounds in year 7- in maths he went from set 3to set 1 within 6 months- of course they had to change predictions.
SATs are used to set the official target grade on which the school will be judged at GCSE, yes. It is nonsense, especially when pupils are crammed for SATs and not showing their genuine level of achievement. However, the official target will not influence a DC's teachers' view of their potential. They will judge that for themselves what with being, you know, education professionals...
I am a secondary English teacher.
Teaching your son that in order to 'do education' he has to sacrifice things he wants to do is not going to produce the attitude to learning you want. It's the same as saying you can't have your pudding until you've eaten your main, you imply that the main is a bad thing. Saying he can't go because of the sats implies to him that a. You think they are very important and b. he must sacrifice fun to do well. Whether that is how you see it or not, as someone with a degree in ed psych, please let me tell you, this is absolutely not the way to produce a good attitude to learning!
If he has a 'cant be arsed' attitude already, the idea that he had to miss out for school is not going to improve that at all. You need to show him that learning is fun, not constantly hard work, and if you value your sons education then you should be doing everything you can to avoid him having a negative attitude towards school. I'm begging you please reconsider, you are doing the opposite of what you are intending through the implication that you cannot have fun whilst in education.
He won't remember his sats, but he may remember the time he missed the parade for his sats, and have a negative attitude towards exams as a result. Please reconsider.
Getting to bed a bit late after spending a great evening with his Dad isn't necessarily going to stop him from doing his best.
Anyway, how do you know that being forced to stay home while his Dad gets to enjoy the parade isn't going to piss him off so much it affects his ability to concentrate?
Being over strict about these things can backfire massively and put kids off school/trying their best. I hope this doesn't end up being the case.
Exactly getting a cup is not a priority for YOU ...
What really truly is in your sons best interests from a wellbeing point of view.
I would have thought that if he went he would be out to prove it made no difference to his results, but if he is resentful he is hardly likely to do his best.
DD1 has had her grade expectations in maths and English adjusted twice this year (upwards both times) so I'm thinking there is plenty of flexibility in setting targets after SATs.
And I do totally get you OP - yes, you are stuck with the hard work part of parenting whilst your exH gets to swan in and spoil your DS and not do any of the tough stuff. I totally get that. It's bloody unfair, so many of my divorced friends have to put up with being 'Mummy who always says no' whilst Dad gets to live the bachelor lifestyle and be 'Fun Dad' when it blinking well suits him.
But on this particular and pretty damn unique occasion I still think YABU. It's a special year. This one event is not going to set his attitude to education in stone, only you can do that. It's utterly shit that your exH is hindering that, but I really think you need to be more flexible here. As Feenie says, it's only the SPAG, for which your DS is being used as a guinea pig. And if he doesn't know his adverbs from his prepositions by now, one night out is not going to change that.
It is independent. But not all children go on to Indy secondaries.
Dd is in year 6 and will be spending all day tomorrow in show rehearsals.
Our school use the Fisher Family Trust to predict GCSE grades. However, the predictions do alter throughout years 10 and 11.
YABU to ask on a public forum if YABU, then ignore, or argue with everyone who says you are - that is the overwhelming majority of replies.
I would let him go. It's a bit of social / cultural history for Manchester, the NW, and football generally. I'm not a Man Utd fan but I'd go if it were that local to me. Also, even if he can take it or leave it, it's important to his Dad, and for that reason he should go.
I assumed you meant he would be back at midnight at first, but it sounds like he will be home about the same time as my dd (also doing SATs) will be on both Monday and Tuesday nights after her activities. Not sure what the problem is
I also wondered why you asked if YABU, because clearly you don't think you are Op.
TheDicktective Sat 11-May-13 22:38:24
"I agree about SATs being a waste of time. A lot of exams are. But the point is, they are there, he has to do them unless he is ill so why not do your best in them?
I just want him to have a good attitude towards education. He needs an education in order to succeed in life."
Yes, but he doesn't have to have that attitude fully developed and ready at the age of 10. I'd say that the one attitude re learning he needs to have now is that finding things out is exciting. The rest will come later.
And I'm a university lecturer: a good deal of my life revolves around exams. Even so I'd say that even at undergraduate level, the ones who do best in exams are not usually the ones who are wholly focused on the exam, but the ones who have a generally open and interested attitude towards life. The ones who get a shock are the ones who arrive at university thinking education is all about doing well in exams: they find themselves up against students who have a wide range of life experiences, who take part in things around them, who read for fun and not just for results- and they can't compete.
Good post Cory.
I too am of the thought that 'education' is a lot wider than school tests. SATS are to assess where the child "is" in narrow curriculum areas, at the end of Yr6. They get to where they are by working in lesson time. Evenings, weekends and holidays are for broadening your horizons and having completely different experiences.
I'm a teacher, and I say let him go. You're not going to be doing anything to help his attitude to education by forcing him to miss things in life because of school. It's not a healthy attitude for anyone, child or adult. I often have to have the discussion with parents at school that they are pushing their children too hard. Usually when they come begging for more homework. No, send them out to play instead. Take them the beach/museum/footy/whatever. No one ever develops a healthy approach to education by being forced.
Instead, use the parade as a way of teaching your son how to negotiate his activities and priorities. Sit him down, and tell him that you understand that he wants to go to the parade, but that his exams are important, so how can you reach a compromise together. Perhaps he could offer to go to bed an hour earlier the night before, or to stay in on sunday afternoon and have some quiet time instead of running around with his mates. Let him make the decision about how he will fit all of his choices in and which ones are important. As adults we all have to do it. I stayed up late last night to get some marking done so I can go out to dinner tonight. Prioritising and compromising are very simply part of life. You've got a great opportunity here to teach your son valuable life lessons, but I fear your hatred of your ex is getting in the way.
Sensible post from MidniteScribbler- I agree with it as a teacher.
He's your Ex - you can't control him anymore. Let him parent the way he sees fit.
What he does with his dad in his time, has nothing to DJ with you, younsay your son doesn't want to do it as he doesn't like football etc.... But will do it because his dad does, that is more reason to allow him to attend, than him liking football.
There is actually truth in his texts.
YABU, & controlling,
I think you're scared of what your Mum will say if you let him go.
I think all your reasons for saying no are totally flimsy and meaningless and It's ALL about your Mum.
I think it's rubbish you are making your din miss out on this. You say oh he's not that bothered about football anyway. Maybe he's starting to be, maybe he sees his Dad getting excited about it and wants to share it with him? Like most sons.
Stop worrying about your Mum and let your son have this. It's obviously very important to him.
I'd let him go on the proviso that they go for the beginning and are at the start of the route then leave. He'll need some downtime after tests all day anyway.
The big mistake your XH and DS have made is in informing you of their intentions.
They will be secretive from now on and share nothing with you. Is that what you want?
We actually can't tell whether he is a dickhead or not without knowing, verbatim, what you have said to him.
The tests are, what, an hour each morning for levels 3-5?
Do you seriously think he will be unable to manage that after going to bed a bit late?
TBH the way you come over, it wouldn't surprise me if he's completely wound up about the SATS already and won't be able to sleep anyway.
Excellent post from Midnite.
I think all you are doing is reinforcing the idea that you are the 'boring' one and your ex will love that.
It sets a bad precedence for future exam preparation.
Yes I'm a big one for education being wider than school work but sorry a football parade the first night of an exam week wouldn't be high on my list of priorities.
Say they get caught in traffic.
Sometimes as a parent you have to take unpopular decisions for the good of your child,this is one of them.
Your ex is a complete arse btw.
So his head teacher is your mum? Ah.
Let him go. He can be home by 8.30, in bed by 9.
And what's wrong with wanting to show off at school?
But some schools do use SATs for setting. And being in the wrong sets for even 6 weeks can be a very bad thing indeed. And even if they don't us them, doing the very best you can in any test is a good idea.
So yes, it is very silly to say that SATs aren't important, and it makes me cross when people do. Particularly when they seem to use them as a way of getting back at teachers.
But I think that a not particularly late night isn't going to make any difference, frankly.
They do. It use the SATs in isolation for setting.
Sorry iPad - they do not use SATs in isolation for setting.
They do at ds's school, exotic- they are set from day 1. Then reset after a term.
Seeing as 1/3rd of school opt out of SATs, I don't see what the bloody fuss is.
The information gleaned might be useful on day one of secondary school but it becomes apparent very quickly that SATs are usually over inflated to boost the primary schools in their own league tables.
CATS (Or similar) are usually performed within the first week, and set tweaking occurs very rapidly
The only prob I see (and not read all the threads) is that the ex was fairly nasty and if ds goes he may use this in future to get his own way.
<holds hands up> just saying!!
I agree about sats not being important to kids (have a thread about it) but I've been flamed in the past for dd having to prioritise her dancing over school which doesn't surprise me given this country's obsession with football.
The key phrase there, seeker, is that they are re set later.
I do the science setting. We use teacher assessed levels in science and the ones in English and Maths as a guide. but am very aware that it is a really bad idea to keep these in stone because of the way pupils change as they mature.
I don't use the CATs because we don't get those until the start of term and I need to set in the summer term before the kids have even joined. Cats can be used to add to the whole picture we are getting of the child through the first term.
Seeing as 1/3rd of school opt out of SATs, I don't see what the bloody fuss is.
What on earth do you mean? State schools do not 'opt' out of SATS - they are statutory, schools have absolutely no choice.
There was a boycott on 2010, in which schools had legal backing to boycott from the NAHT among other unions, but that's a very different thing, and very much a one off.
What a strange thing for a teacher to say!
I don't think any states school can opt out of SATs?
KS2 SATs only matter for the individual child wrt to setting future targets, I think? And good practice is to allow for targets to be revised along with sets.
Cross-posts. No, they cannot, they are a legal requirement.
I don't think your ex should have spoken to you like he has.
Notwithstanding that, i do agree with him and OPs that there is a real risk here that your DS will simply just opt out of working
You cannot force someone to work hard or try their best. You need to engage with DS to make sure he understands the consequences and benefits of putting the hard work in.
But you and your mum also need to be honest with him so that he'll trust and listen to what you have to say. I know nothing about SATs. However, if it is the case that they are not as material as you seem to think, I agree with poster above who said you need to discuss and agree with him a workable way of letting him attend. The bargain is that he works hard and makes up the rest (and let's be honest, he's not a new born baby. He can manage a slightly later bedtime as a one off) if you let him go. Explain that you feel that if he puts the effort in, he'll do we'll in the exams and you are letting him go as a pre-reward for that. As he's growing up, you're trying to reach a middle ground with him. However, if he lets you down, you won't be able to do that in the future.
Separately, I don't really like how you seem to be rubbishing something that is important to his dad and to DS. My DS is only 5 months old and my DH is a huge sports fan. I don't think it would be very fair in the future for me to stop him taking DS to sporting events on the basis that DS isn't keen.....er, he won't be as he's never had the chance to go!
How keen in sport etc are you in your house? Has DS been genuinely exposed to it so you can say with surety what team he does or doesn't follow?
My DH was sports mad as a little boy but his parents weren't interested. It was only when he went to uni that he really go the chance to go to matches etc which I think is really sad. It really annoys me when MIL keeps saying now that it's so surprising that DH loves sport do much. that'll be because you never let him watch any when he was a little boy or took him to any games
you selfish fuckers
I think the greatest educational mistake you can make as a parent is to let your child get the impression that ending up in a certain set, or doing badly in one exam, defines you forever.
Sets are flexible by their very nature. But they are only flexible insofar as the child's own attitude is flexible- and that attitude will to a great extent be determined by their parent.
If you decide that you are defined forever by one set of exam results then even the most encouraging and flexible teacher in the world can't help you.
It's not that working hard isn't something that should be taught. Of course it should. But teaching a young child that "you have to work hard because if you miss this one chance that's it" can end up terribly counterproductive.
They do at ds's school, exotic- they are set from day 1. Then reset after a term.
They are still reset. A term seems a rather long time to leave them in the wrong set. DS's primary had very close liaison with the secondary and I'm sure that teacher assessment goes a long way. e.g. they are going to say 'this DC had a fluke result in the SATs and is working at a much higher level'. I don't have much experience of secondary level but I know that in key stage 2 they like to make their own assessments and not go by key stage 1 tests-even if accurate they may have gone backwards over the long summer holiday.
I don't get the prediction at all. They have several years before GCSEs-what the DC got at 10 yrs (or 11yrs) isn't really relevant.
Exams don't matter to the DC until the GCSE's -then it is scary waiting for the results!
I've just a seen your post where you say you don't think you're BU in any event so my earlier post was as waste of time in any event.
However, how do you think this approach is going to "drill out" your DS's attitude? Is this advice your mum's giving you? If so, it seems counterintuitive.
The GCSE's are necessary for the 6th form and also predictions and UCAS forms. The results of the A'levels are vitally important for what you do next, university places, future job applications etc.
The SATs results do not matter. They are vitally important to the school-they are judged by them-by OFSTED, future parents, LEA, the community-therefore it is no wonder they drill them, want them in school with a good night's sleep-some even serve breakfast!
I also feel uncomfortable with the OP's decision that something can't be important because it matters to her ex but not to her.
I grew up in a family with terribly well defined views on what mattered (languages, humanities and classical music= good and worth making sacrifices for; natural sciences, modern music, animals= a useless waste of time) and I do feel it has limited me in life. There was endless support for the things that my family felt mattered, they would travel to the other end of the country to supply violin lessons with a maestro and take out a new mortgage to send us abroad, but nobody would even follow me down the road in the early morning hours to go beaver watching.
The result was that I never really felt I could let on how much these things mattered to me, because it made me feel awkward and undiscerning. So my mother would probably have said like the OP "oh she doesn't really care about those things, she just wants to be like her friends". My enthusiasm for dead languages and ancient history otoh was palpable because showing (my quite genuine) enthusiasm for those things did not make me feel awkward or wrong.
If the OP is anything like my mother, it is unlikely that she will get a straightforward impression from her son about what he really would like to do.
I took my son to the Wembley stadium tour at Easter. I think football is a useless waste of time as far as I am concerned. But frankly, when it comes to ds's life, that isn't very far. I still remember that I lived nextdoor to a beaver dam for 6 years and never saw a beaver because my family decided that couldn't possibly be something I really wanted to do. And I was not in a position to disabuse them.
Cory, excellent points.
Op feel sorry for your ds. He seems to have 3 parents here. You, your ex and his headmistress/gran.
You want to piss off your ex and please your mum.
This really can't be about totally meaningless SATS tests because that just wouldn't make sense.
The worst that would happen would be the ds would miss a couple of hours sleep the night before one exam.
Poor ds, it's a one off evening with his Dad, with Op determined to put obstacles in the way.
No - I think he's actually got 2 parents here - The OP and her DM. The ex seems to be treated like some kind of older brother who doesn't get an equal say and it's within the OP's exclusive gift as to when and where her ex can see DS with granny getting the final say.
I do understand that ex might be a massive childish cuntychops and there will be a lot of water under the bridge here. However, I do think that being overly inflexible here will lead to (a) DS disengaging due to feeling hard done by. A feeling that will probably be fostered by the ex and (2) ex going to court to get a formal contact order
Looking at the later end of the educational spectrum, I have come to the conclusion that the thing that matters most in university students (apart from brains, which you can't do a lot about) is flexibility and resilience. I get students who collapse and never recover because of a bad mark in the first semester- even though they know that first year marks don't count for their final degree. And others who fail their finals due to ill health or family breakdown and then come back and get a First.
Have you thought about what would happen if, as your ex points out, your ds 'rebels' because of your strict attitude and starts refusing to work or go to school at all in the future?
We've all seen it happen, kids are stopped from doing things by overly strict parents so they eventually just do them anyway. Respect goes out of the window and relationships break down. Think about how your future relationship with your son may be affected by decisions like this op.
Let him go. He'll thank you for it. He'll probably work harder in return.
Yabu , can't see reason not to let him go. It's not going to damage his school career. Also think we would do well to ensure our children are resilient, flexible and not completely regimented..
I can't even remember what mine got- I know DS2 got his level 4 in English because it was a worry with his dyslexia- beyond that I have never needed to think about it.
You are being unreasonable and, perhaps more pertinently, unwise.
Just remembered how a few years ago my mother tried to persuade me to throw out my fishtanks (which I use to breed endangered species for conservation) to install a piano, because she wanted my life to be enriched and didn't think I could be happy without live music.
It took all my strength (as a 47yo!) to look my mother firmly in the eye and say: "No mother, this is what I want". No way I could have done it as a 10yo.
Her motives were the very best, bless her.
To answer about him rebelling when older, this is one time I've said no. It isn't like he gets told no all the time!
I'm not an over strict parent. I am just a normal parent trying to do the right thing for my children.
He has his own interests. He isn't one of those children who likes doing loads of activities. He does Scouts and he dances. Both of which are his choice. I've never pushed him in to anything.
My ex will never take me to court. He doesn't have that kind of interest sadly. When offered the choice who to live with DS just says his dad said he can't live with him or see him more often.
Yes my mum has helped me bring him up. She is an important part of his life and has been more actively involved than his dad has.
That isn't my choice. I work full time doing shifts. I asked my ex to have him 3 days a week. He wouldn't. My mum stepped in where he buffered off.
I also had parents who didn't say no a lot and didn't push me into doing things. But who had such very strong views on what was worth doing that I felt wrong about liking things they didn't. Even more so my brother who was into sports and pop music. It wasn't brilliant tbh: he grew up feeling there was something wrong with him and I grew up feeling I'd be fine as long as I only admitted to liking the things that got you bonus points.
I think the issue maybe that he can't or won't look after DS for 3 days a week as he sees that as time mandated by you on your terms (rightly or wrongly). However, what could very well get him high tailing it to a solicitor is the fact that he seems to have no agreed time that he can see DS and you have a total right of veto in terms of what they do together - including withholding access if you don't agree
He could very well ask the court to fix one day a week for him to see DS and to be allowed to carry out whatever activity he sees fit to do as long as it is reasonable. As you can see from most of the posts, most people do think what he is proposing is reasonable.
I think you need to pick your battles here carefully. I can completely understand why this is irritating given his previous behaviour. However, it must be best for DS to have a relationship with his father and I think that has to be the overarching principle in terms of contact, however personally irritating that is.
He dictates the day based on his shifts. Hence why he will never agree to a set day. It suits him this way. I've asked for a set day. I've asked for more notice of the day. I've asked that he pays maintenance on a set date via bank. I've asked him if he wants him in holidays/christmas/birthday. He won't do any of the above.
It's always his way.
But if he wants it that way he has to accept that sometimes I will say no to his demands.
He will never go to court no matter what. I know this about him.
He walked away after 8 years with nothing but his clothes and playstation. I have the house, car, and everything else.
He's a strange character.
He is 11 or rising 11.A 7.30 finish + 25 minute drive home is hardly late is it?I suspect your DS is being used as a pawn in the great 'pissing off your ex' stakes!
why is everyone on Mn so UPTIGHT about SATS - why do they acutally count?
I am not at all interested in my son's, i have no idea what day they on and wont be beating the door down for the result.
I presume they are next week
It's not a 25 minute drive. I've said that several times.
It's a 1hr train plus 25 min bus ride plus walking and wait times.
Then time to get him ready for bed and to sleep. It takes him forever just doing that.
I'm sorry - I don't want to sound like I'm cross examining you but, in your last post, your saying your ex doesn't see your DS for holidays. However, earlier in the thread you say that he's pulling him out of school to go places.
I think what I'm trying to get at here is that perhaps - without meaning to - you sound very intransigent.
He's pulling him out for his day that he picks. He isn't taking him away. Or having him for half of school holidays etc. He's doing a day trip.
So if it finishes at 7.30 even it it takes 2 hours to get home he is back for 9.30 no reason for him to be in bed any later than 10 at the very latest. As a one off thats hardly a reason to say no!
As a one off, no it isn't reason to say no.
I've said that already.
But it's the timing. Like I say.
I'm just replying to people.
It doesn't affect you - I don't think it's me needing to chill! I am pretty damn chilled already, thanks for the concern!
What is it with all the SATs hysteria?
Stop making such a big deal out of it.
Let him go.
OP - AiBU?
US - YES
OP - NO I AM NOT
I haven't said I'm not. I've just said he isn't going and any points people have made I have read - but have failed to sufficiently change my opinion.
What's wrong with that?
I wanted opinions. I've got them. They haven't changed how I fundamentally feel.
I am not about to do something just because a bunch of people on the Internet say so.
I just wanted to know if it was unreasonable. That's all.
Hope that's okay with some pe
I wanted opinions. I've got them. They haven't changed how I fundamentally feel.
I am not about to do something just because a bunch of people on the Internet say so.
I just wanted to know if it was unreasonable. That's all.
Hope that's okay with some people.
But why ask for opinions if you are obviously so sure of your decision? Surely asking for opinions on something is for when you aren't quite sure and need help to decide?
Surely asking for opinions on something is for when you aren't quite sure and need help to decide?
Why can't it be for when you've made a decision and want other people's views on the decision you have made?
Ok fair enough, but have the opinions of others changed your own view of the situation at all?
why would you want other peoples opinions on something if you were happy with your decision though? Surely you wouldn't care what others thought and therefore wouldn't need to ask a group of strangers for advice!
Just because I figured someone might have a really good reason and change my mind.
I didn't know it wouldn't til I posted.
Do you change your mind often, OP?
I mean that question quite genuinely
Well as everyone has given a whole host of reasons its pretty obvious that you weren't going to change your views. You are still putting your aims to annoy your ex above your sons relationship with him
I actually think this is something your ds will always look back on with resentment. I understand that this is an element in all parent/child relationships but over something so pointless. I actually think you are risking damaging your relationship with him, or the early days of it at least.
Oh wow this is still going on?!
Pele have given plenty of very good reasons for you to change your mind OP, but you're clearly hell bent on getting your own way and that's that. You have made a poor decision, but if you haven't changed your perspective yet, you're clearly not going to.
It really is not your place to control your DS to the point where it is detrimental to a relationship with his father that you yourself admit is not as good as it could be. If you were doing the right thing, you would encourage it. You don't have good reasons not to this time, which basically equals this being a power struggle.
It is sad for your DS that you can't get past the silliness.
Pele would probably think YABU as well.
Good luck with the teen years op.
what a battle of wills that will be
And yes OP I have teenagers.
The reasons that have been advanced so far are:
it would benefit the relationship between the ds and his father if he is not stopped from sharing something that his father finds important
there is no knowing how much the ds cares or not: since his mother has very inflexible views on the subject, he may well not want to let on that he does care
his father as a parent should have the same freedom to decide over what ds does during their time together as the OP does when she has the ds- unless the father's decisions are genuinely dangerous which is not the case here
it would be detrimental to the relationship between the mother and the ds if the ds gets the impression she is trying to stop him from doing things simply because of her (understandable) resentment against his father or inability to share his interests
there is no reason to believe that being slightly late for bed one night will influence the SATS results at all
if the SATS results were to be affected (which few of us believe) any mismatch in setting will soon be remedied as his secondary revises the sets
it is educationally important to take a wide interest in what goes on in the community
it is poor exam technique to let everything focus on the exams, particularly on the night before an exam
It would be interesting to see what the OP did consider a valid reason if none of these are.
Sorry yabu. Let him go.
I don't think she's made a poor decision I thinks she's made the right one,op he'll thank you in years to come well done for sticking to your guns.
Excellent summary, cory
Blueskies, do you seriously think in 10 years time the OPs ds will be telling his mum: "Thank you so much for not letting me go to the football parade because it would have changed the whole course of my life and I could never have got back on track again."?
Personally, I don't think it will matter an awful lot whether the boy goes to the parade or not. But what will matter is if his mum sticks to her uptight attitude that everything has to be just so or the whole edifice will come crumbling down.
If I was your son I'd be v tempted to deliberately fail the sats to annoy you and your mother. Stupid ? Yes. Understandable?yes, esp if he realises he's only having to do them to keep. Headteacher happy and his score will make no difference to him.
Op,I think you sound very much focussed on your and your mother's needs and not so much on your sons.
Re school I stick to my guns every time,they only get one chance.
It's a football parade folks not an African safari,there will be any more(hopefully not in an exam week).
I'm sure his teacher will appreciate the op taking his education seriously.
This is very weird OP.
Everyone but everyone has said you are unreasonable.
You said you came on here to see if you are being unreasonable but wouldn't change your mind.
Why have you asked the question on here? Just to wind everyone up?
And quite frankly I hope your DS does hold it against you, because you are being blinkered and so unfair to him.
Op talk to him,explain that being a mum is hard sometimes and you have to do what you think is best for their own good.Suggest that you and his dad come up with an alternative treat not on a school night.
Blueskiesandbuttercups Sun 12-May-13 16:16:42
"Re school I stick to my guns every time,they only get one chance."
No, they don't. He gets a new chance in Yr 7 when they revisit the sets. And plenty of further chances in Yrs 8, 9, 10 etc.
But if he believes that this is his only chance, then it becomes true. That's got nothing to do with the number of chances on offer.
Blue skies, have you read the whole thread?
Why is the OP's opinion more important than her ex's?
This decision is not for the DS's own good, it is because the OP is being silly. If it was being made for the DS's own good, it would be to let him go. I would suggest reading cory's post above for a nice succinct understanding,
Sorry once you're stuck in a lower group you have to work doubly hard to get out of it for what- a football parade!
Op I think your ex has put you in a crap position tbf,there is no way my dp would suggest a jolly the night before exam week.He'd want our dc to achieve their absolute best too.
Sats are for the school NOT the child and high schools do their own exams to set children anyway. You should let him go.
Excellent posts cory.
So blue skies, just you and the op. think that a 12 year olds sats results will define his educational and life chances for ever?
Ha ha ha ha ha.
We went in holiday during one of my lads sats weeks as it was the only time my dh could get off.
He is a graduate so kinda think it didn't really affect his education.
There was absolutely nothing in Cory's post that would make me let any of my 3 go.
But for an African safari you would allow it Blueskies that is your particular price?
Tell me OP. Would you be able to show this thread to your DS.
And then still justify your decision to him?
I don't very often say this on MN, because its generally a matter of opinions that differ wildly, but the OP is just plain wrong, as is blueskies.
It's such a shame when people can't see past their own selfishness to do the best thing for their DCs.
Blueskiesandbuttercups Sun 12-May-13 16:28:17
"Sorry once you're stuck in a lower group you have to work doubly hard to get out of it"
Which would be a far more valuable life experience than closing your whole life down for the exam.
But this will only be the case if you are in the lower set because of lower natural aptitude. A child who knows his stuff but has accidentally ended up in a the wrong set because of a blip on the day should have no difficulty in demonstrating his real ability. It happened to dd who was ill during SATS week; she was moved up at the first opportunity. SATS aren't about what you can cram the night before the exam: they are about longtime learning.
Right am off on an African safari,,
Hopefully dds won't be too late to bed.
Who decides that an African safari is more important than a chapter of a city's social history? However uninterested I am in football I think it would be difficult to deny that this is what the current Man United event is.
Sounds exactly like my mum deciding that playing the piano has more real value than breeding endangered species.
Who wants to take some kind of bet on whether or not this thread will end before the OPs DS finishes his gcses?
Selfish,no selfish would be taking the easy route.
There is no way on earth I would want to give my kids to get the idea that exams don't matter and basically they come second to having a good time.One day they'll have to manage their own prep when a drink down the uni bar would be much more preferable to sitting studying or getting a good nights sleep.
Basically saying we don't give a shit re school exams because we don't value them is a dreadful precedent and something I would never start.
Rightly or wrongly the Sats have to be done and it's one week out of an entire school history,hardly a hardship.
Basically saying we don't give a shit re school exams because we don't value them is a dreadful precedent and something I would never start.
What poster said that? Not even the teachers who have posted in this thread have come anywhere close to saying that attending the parade would be equivalent to this. Instead, they've all said to a one to go.
Is prep what us poor people who like footi call homework?
Not getting a good nights sleep,letting the child have a late and tiring night at the start of an important week and going against the school's wishes is not giving a shit imvho.
No the body it's what us poor people who don't think football is the be all and end all of life call preparation for an exam.
Actually, selfish in this case is the OP prioritising herself and her feelings over those of her son.
She is wrong, plain and simple, and has made a bad decision. I would hope that even if she feels unable to admit she is wrong that when she has been told by so many people, that she will do the right thing privately and allow her DS to go out with his dad.
But it's not a late night and on what basis would the Op's DS not be able to get to sleep thereafter?
He's more likely not to be able to sleep after he's been hyped up to 90 about the alleged importance of these exams
for granny's career
Sorry, but if they're old enough to go to the uni bar, I hardly think they will be referring to it as prep, Blueskies.
I am a teacher and I have three children, the eldest is in year 6. He is taking part in a local amdram production of Oliver and will be up until after 10 every night sats week including tonight. He has got far more out of the Oliver rehearsals and show than his sats which are only important for the school. For what it is worth the school know he is doing it and haven't said a word.
Parenting is all about prioritising our feelings of what is best over the wants of our children,I do it daily.<shrugs>
A parade will be knackering and if they get stuck in traffic which is highly likely the cause of a very late night on a school night.
ann - we need an [appalled face] icon for your blatant none shit giving behaviour
as defined by blueskies.
I haven't read the whole 13 pages but FWIW I'd let him go!
My DD has her SATS next week and also swims in a competitive regional squad. The only training sessions she will miss will be the morning ones before school and will train as normal on an evening.
Don't put him under too much undue pressure.
"Is prep what us poor people who like footi call homework?"
African safari = glorified zoo. ;)
Blueskiesandbuttercups Sun 12-May-13 17:58:48
"Parenting is all about prioritising our feelings of what is best over the wants of our children,I do it daily.<shrugs>"
But it is not a given that all parents's feeling would lead them to prioritise the SATS. A fair few of those of us who have older children or experience of secondary school/HE would not see the SATS as overwhelmingly important compared to other learning activities.
Blueskies - that is not what the OP is doing though! She is prioritising her own selfish feelings under the guise of it being for the good of her DS when it isn't. The best thing for her DS would be allowed to go out with his dad. The OP needs to stop kidding herself that a) the sats will be affected and b) she is acting in her DS's best interests.
It's like talking to a brick wall around here sometimes though, so I doubt the OP will accept this.
Parenting is all about taking sensible decisions and having a balanced approach.
Parenting is about building loving relationships with your children, loving them and supporting them in THEIR interests, hobbies, social and school life.
It's about having a laugh with them.
It's not bullying or controlling to the point of unkindness and its definatly not all about bloody sats.
Oof what a miserable cah. Life is for living and creating memories. Let him go. If he has been working and prepping as much as you say, he'll still do well in that one test.
If it were his GCSEs then maybe...
But come on he's a child. They need some excitement and fun and he will be a small part of history (ok, i know its football history, but still...)
I hope you let him go OP, I really do. Because some of your comments sound as though you just won't allow it to get your ex's back up.
Go. I sent dd to her swimming club as per usual in SATS week which she gets back from at 9. It didn't affect her scores at all but do what you think best if he really needs his sleep.
Tidy you think it isn't the best thing for her child,she still does,it's her child.
Tidy and the whole of Mumsnet think it's the best thing for the child. OP and you blue are only ones who don't. Lets hope her child's dad can do something about it.
Blueskies - the OP isn't thinking in those terms, it's obvious. If she was trying to act in her DS's best interests and getting it wrong, that would be one thing. But she's not even doing that. She's being selfish and controlling and pushing her own views on her DS and her ex under the guise of it being for the best. And she's taking the view of her mother who has a mistaken professional bias as backup. She is wrong. At best that makes her misguided, at worst manipulative and horridl
The issue is not only that he will get home late and be tired the next day, surely his excitement and lack of concentration both on Monday and the following day will be the cause of him not being able to do as well as expected. We had an event last week with our Y6 children which was a huge competition and the whole day of the event they were high as a kite. They couldn't concentrate on any lessons and were unable to settle to any work set that day as a result of emotions. The following day, as they won, again they were unable to settle and were busy rattling off tales of what had happened and how they were able to win the competition. Has it been this week no doubt it would've distracted them from their tests and they would not achieve what they have worked so hard to do so all year.
Erm a thread on MN does not make it the right decision or speak for everybody. I know an awful lot of people who would agree with her ie that schlepping off to a football parade culminating in a late night on the first night of an exam week is best avoided.
And wanting your child to do his best is not selfish.
Blueskies there is a HUGE like I can't emphasise how MASSIVE difference between SATs and Uni exams. SATs test the school and all they need the child to provide is a picture of their abilities on an average day. Uni exams effect future jobs or qualifications. Its as simple as that.
I have allowed my DS2 to do no revision whatsoever this afternoon so he can watch the ManU game on the TV. He has his GCSE's starting tomorrow. What he doesn't know now he will never know IMO.
My DSes have had tears in their eyes, lumps in throats and totally welled up watching Sir Alex's departure. If your Ex is a ManU fan, regardless of wether DS is or not, he will have been the same. He will be going to the parade because it is an historic event, and one where he can say to his son, because he isn't just yours he is his too, do you remember that night ip we saw that parade? It is an experience you are robbing them of for your own selfish reasons.
The DC aren't supposed to know they are doing SATs. Your mother only wants him to have an early night and stay at home is to keep her OFSTED report up, or get it up whatever the case maybe. You are both being selfish. Your son is a child, not a pawn to be used in pathetic games!
They're not even exams, they're tests. Sorry to get all pedantic but they really are something completely different.
"Has it been this week no doubt it would've distracted them from their tests and they would not achieve what they have worked so hard to do so all year."
Am I the only one to find it really depressing if dangly's school children have really been working all year for their SATS? When I was 10, I was still learning because it was fun and exciting.
As for the idea that there is something wrong about an event that leaves 10-year-olds so excited that they are finding it difficult to stop thinking about it...
Ladies save your breath ( fingers) the op is far too interested in pissing off her ex and sucking up to her mum.
This has nothing whatsoever to do with these meaningless tests.
I still laughing over the picture of blues son telling the whole uni bar he has prep to do! Jolly good.
cory...they have not been working to the tests all year. What I meant is that they have worked all year to progress from where they were...and they all have.
I just find a lot of people in this day and age make too many excuses about 'living life' and 'once in a lifetime' opportunities which in other words is any excuse to do something they want. Lets face it - a Man U parade is not a once in a lifetime thing now is it? They kind of become devalued if it happens most years like it does!
Cory I think our parents have a lot in common.
As a parent now I think of some of the decisions they made with regards to priorities and my hobbies and I would never, ever do that for my DS. I remember I wanted to join the debating club - great opportunity to develop speaking skills as I was quite shy, also a good way to meet boys as went to single sex school. But I wasn't allowed to go because it clashed with my clarinet lesson, that I hated anyway. But to them music was sacred.
OP I don't get football, don't get any of the hoo haa associated with it. If it was my child I wouldn't be too keen for him to be out late on a week with tests, but sometimes unfortunately for us children have two parents and what doesn't seem right to us might not be the worst thing in the world for the child. Oh and wanting to go so he can boast about it at school - it's not a dreadful reason, most decisions in life are motivated by self interest.
In theory it doesn't sound like a hugely late night. I'd let him go. But on the other hand I'd be kicking up merry hell about your XP pulling him out of school - it would have to be something very special before I'd agree to that.
ok, dangly, I see: it was just the way it was phrased that made it sound as if you really had had them working towards this exam all year
brought back some of my worst memories of dd's HT telling absolute porkies about the importance of SATS in assembly at the start of the year and some of the children (not dd) getting very worked up
but your later post makes it clearer
still, of they have worked for progress all year, they will still have that progress, won't they? it won't be taken away from them if they are on slightly less than top form during one SATS day?
as for the importance of the parade, I think it is different this year because of Ferguson leaving; that's not going to be repeated every year
I think I found the oddest thing that OP rang her Mum about it!
If that happens a lot, I'm not surprised the ex gets pissed off!
So does the boy really want to go?
It would be the late night that would bother me-plus is it really "history in the making"-that a football manager has resigned??
And grown men have had tears in their eyes about it?
Why's is it funny that grown men have had tears in their eyes about the greatest football manager this country has ever seen retiring? (That's not me saying that, that's statistics and the media etc). If you are a true fan of ManU, and have been for years, then no matter what sex or age you are, today will have been emotional!
agree diddl, I also wondered if this was an established pattern. Seems like a certain conflict of interest to be head to your gs but probably not unique. Maybe her pride in gs' performance is at stake too.
Yeah their grades won't get taken away but they still have the opportunity to make progress on our own assessments. There are many who aspire to achieve more than they have already and I would love to see them all reach their personal targets. We have 5/6 children who are within 1 or 2 marks of reaching a level 6. Watching them achieve that will be a very proud moment both for the parents and the staff. I know a few children who are very keen to reach a level 4 and with a good nights rest and a calm morning, they can achieve it but being borderline, having a disrupted night or being unsettled at school will make all the difference. Right now our assessments have them at a high 3 and they can achieve a 4 if they are in the right frame. I want them to be proud of what they have achieved and don't want any disappointed faces when it comes to results time...
As for Ferguson, he has been at the past however many...so it isn't any different because he has attended them all, be just be the same as every other parade for the past however many years! I do see the point tho that he won't be in the next one but I reckon he will pop up with them still here and there!
I think it is clear that this does actually mean a lot to a lot of people, so in that sense it is history- how else do we define history?
I felt quite emotional when I managed to secure tickets to hear Victoria de los Angeles sing at a charity concert, despite the fact that her voice was definitely past it: it just seemed such a special thing to have heard her. I'd call that a historic moment, must have been one of her very last concerts. So why should someone who feels about football as I did about opera not feel the same about a manager who has meant a lot to football? Neither of them have waged war or conquered nations, but they both meant a lot to their particular area.
As ds told me when we went on the Wembley football stadium tour: "This means the same to me as seeing those old inscriptions in the Tower of London means to you." Point taken.
I told him that I knew that and that was why I'd wanted to go with him. And was very proud of my 12yo who could verbalise something that I hadn't been able to put into words until I was well into my 40s.
dangly131 Sun 12-May-13 19:29:43
"Yeah their grades won't get taken away but they still have the opportunity to make progress on our own assessments. "
I think we have rather different views of education. My point was that the progress they have made, the learning they have done, will not be taken from them, no matter what happens to their grades. I find it very sad if the only benefit of Yr 6 is supposed to be the actual grade you achieve. (tbh I find that attitude sad in my undergraduates too- and I can't help noticing that the ones that do best even in terms of grades are usually the ones who understand that learning is about more than grades)
You asked if their progress would get taken from them not their learning.
It really isn't about my ex. I don't care what he does or doesn't do. My sole concern is DS. Any amateur psychologists can make what they like. I know how our 'relationships' work. I have to be the parent, while he calls himself DS's mate. He just won't be involved in any discipline, any issues, or in DS's education.
Believe me. I've tried to involve him. He laughs in my face when I tell him DS has done something and I'd appreciate him backing me up with whatever.
As much as it frustrates me at the time, I'd never let DS suffer for that.
The situation, as it is, is that I don't think it appropriate to go to this given the distance from home. I regularly go to Manchester, and I know, hand on heart we are always later home than whatever estimated time we think it will be. We always get caught up somehow.
If it was local, there wouldn't be an issue. But it isn't.
You obviously think you know better than anyone else. So there is little point in asking opinions. So 14 pages later you are no further forward. Just go along in your headstrong foolish way. As you have no intention of budging an inch. Pathetic!!
It's 25 miles, not the fecking moon!
I actually don't think it is about your ex OP. He sounds infuriating and irresponsible and its likely that when your DS is older he will see for himself which parent invested more in him. I also disagree with your ex and other posters who say that your DS will rebel against you. IME the teenage years are a bit unpredictable, and I think we definitely can't predict what your relationship will be like based purely on this tiny snapshot of your lives.
Its just still really unclear what it is all about because the SATs really don't matter.
OP, I'm a Liverpool fan & I think your DS should be allowed to go to watch this.
SATs are a pointless waste of time imo & I'm speaking as a parent with two DC in grammar school who I have high expectations for, so don't think I'm
disparaging about education generally.
This is a parade he'll always remember.
DS hasn't mentioned it since it was brought up. If he really wanted to go, there would be no let up on the pester front.
I think it is a non issue now as far as DS is concerned. I've no idea from his fathers point of view, as apart from a few texts in a row calling me various names, I've not heard since.
I think it's very dangerous to push children to get those extra 1-2 marks in SATs which will push them over a grade boundary - because they won't really be that level at all, they will just have been drilled and drilled and drilled to do well in the test. When they hit Yr7, the school will realise what level they really are, and they may well be disappointed to be told they have 'gone backwards' when all that's happened is that they are working at their real level. It's called the Yr7 dip, and I'm pretty sure it's linked to excess coaching for SATs results.
Ah well, you're right and we're all wrong.
Next time you have a dilemma don't bother coming on AIBU, just speak to your mother.
Hope your ds does well in his sats op. Maybe you and your ex need to work out a better way to talk to one another about your son, you will be having these conversations for awhile.
So your DS isn't bothered about going, and your ex isn't too bothered about him going either?
Well that was a lot of fuss about nothing then OP, getting us all riled like that
I think he should go OP, he might not seem bothered now but he would probably enjoy it a lot. Education is not just about school, what United have achieved with Ferguson is a massive part of social and sporting history. Given that he's retiring it makes the parade more important thing year.
FWIW I remember going to the pub with my Dad to watch England play France in Euro 2004 the night before my GCSE English Lit exam. I probably had a couple of drinks, probably didn't get in til gone 11. I still got an A*.
YABU, but why ask on AIBU if you do not want opinions (especially when the majority say YABU). Your son is 10/11 he will obviously remember his year 6 sats for the rest of his life.
The chance to bond with his father is just bullshit obviously and maybe they
you would be happier if they were revising.
Your mother and her opinion obviously comes first.
I remember when Ryan Giggs (I do not care for football) came to my local supermarket (during sats time) do you know what I remember? My exams (just kidding) it was standing in a queue with the camaraderie that went with it.
To be honest I feel sorry for your son, he is missing out on some bonding time with his dad.
You come across as very controlling
I think it's very dangerous to push children to get those extra 1-2 marks in SATs which will push them over a grade boundary - because they won't really be that level at all, they will just have been drilled and drilled and drilled to do well in the test. When they hit Yr7, the school will realise what level they really are, and they may well be disappointed to be told they have 'gone backwards' when all that's happened is that they are working at their real level. It's called the Yr7 dip, and I'm pretty sure it's linked to excess coaching for SATs results
But of course when it happens the primary schools, teachers and HTs achieve their targets. Thank goodness not all schools are so unscrupulous. You have to feel sorry not only for the pupils but for the high school teachers picking up this headache in terms of their own performance management.
And if the OP and Blueskies seriously think that the SATs are so important it's proabably useless trying to reason with them.
I think this parade is historic - and I'm a City fan.
And yes: I agree with those who think the OP sounds controlling.
I think that you should let him go. It's a day he'll never forget even if he isn't that much of a football fan.
We had our local teams parade last Sunday (championship winners) and took both DS6 and DD4. It was an extremely long day with events starting at 3 and not finishing until 9.30pm, but it was the most amazing experience and an absolute joy to witness something so special. DS and DD have not stopped harping on about it since!
I understand where you are coming from and support your decision. My girl is a member of a local drama group and she will not be there this week because I want her to be in bed early. Do not feel pressurised by your ex, you have made a decision and do not need approval from onyone.
SATS are pointless micky mouse tests. ...I wouldn't worry a second ovwe them. YABU
DS hasn't mentioned it since it was brought up. If he really wanted to go, there would be no let up on the pester front.
Perhaps he's learned there's really no point?
As I asked before, do you often change your mind/listen to other's opinions?
Most children go backwards after a long summer break. In every year group in primary you get children coming up as being X level and more often than not you look at your first piece of work with them and you kind of rubbish all the previous levels! Every teacher will notice discrepancies between where a child has been working and the dip that occurs when children do nothing for nearly 2 months.
My girl is a member of a local drama group and she will not be there this week because I want her to be in bed early
I don't often have to change my mind on things - because I don't have many decisions to make that directly affect someone else.
Yes, I do listen to others opinions. But it does take a good argument to change my mind.
Why do parents think SATS are important?
I get that they're important to schools, but not to the individuals.
Goodness knows why there are any parents left who believe SATs are in any way important to pupils.
I don't often have to change my mind on things - because I don't have many decisions to make that directly affect someone else.
Do you live alone? Do you have a job?
I'm genuinely puzzled by this. I make loads of decisions everyday that directly affect DS and DH. The vast majority are relatively minor (what to have for tea etc/what to watch on tv) but I'm always happy to listen to DH's opinion. DS can't speak but I take him in to consideration too.
DD1 didn't get to sit level 6 SATS. I'm not sure if they didn't do that then, or if her school just didn't do them. By the time DD2 got to year 6, they had stopped doing SATS altogether (independent school).
Neither of them have an overriding belief that they have missed out on something wonderful. I promise you.
illovesooty I can only speak for my children, but their place in top set maths was determined by SATS scores, and their maths set was also their MFL set. Yes, you can be moved, but why take the chance, and why not try to do the best you can in any test given to you?
When people look back on childhood, its the way they're made to feel and the experiences that they had that come to mind first. I used to go climbing, fish for tadpoles, blackberry picking, had picnics and failed each time to play cricket on cobblestones. My big regret of last year was being unable to take LO's to London to experience the Olympics, money etc being factors.
I think that OP is in a difficult situation as her mother is the HT so really she and her son would be unconsciously be used as benchmarks for comparisons with other children/parents. And that's harsh for them.
But here's the main question - has you son studied hard and worked towards his exams? If the answer is yes, then let him have the night off. It's a memory - it may not be his team and it might be a late night as a one off, but its a one in a lifetime thing that he can look back and remember. Think of it as a reward for all his slogging.
Gosh my day and life are bloody chock full of decisions.
Anyway op you asked the question aibu and I think only two posters agreed with you where the rest of us think you are wrong.
Of course it's up to you but just out of curiosity do you ever think you are wrong?
To the poster whose dd will miss her drama group next week for sats what a sad situation.
Sats are tests to see how schools are doing. Not children.
"How sad"- it's one friggin night- seriously!
Your DC will not be in the wrong set due to SATs results! The new school is intelligent enough not to rely solely on them. If they are going to a school that put them in sets purely due to tests taken a third of a year beforehand I would suggest you haven't got a very good school!
I also think it highly unlikely that a resentful child is going to try their best!
I'm a teacher, I'd let him go, don't wish to be horrid but that level 5 is more important to your mum than it is to him. Secondary schools view teacher assessment as more important to setting, and will re set v quickly if they think it's wrong. Whereas year 6 results and value added are V important for league tables and ofsted ratings, and headteachers performance related pay. Any head teacher has a very vested interest in this.
If he doesn't know it now one late night (and not even that late) will make no difference at all.
Schools talk to each other! They are not going to let a DC who is one of their best mathematicians go into a lower maths group because of a poor test result. You would think that DCs go to secondary schools with nothing except one test result.
Their Maths set was also their Modern Foreign Language set? How does that make sense?
I dunno, I didnt make the decision! I suppose timetabling and so on means one set is often another, and starting a new language is a challenge so perhaps best done in ability groups?
I guess that probably a pretty unusual situation though and probably not a n argument for the importance of SATs. Surely most schools re-set at gsce level too.
I have no idea. It's not a very unusual school, though! My thoughts are that if you are given a test, it is good to try your best at it, whatever.
Try your best yes but not arrange your life around it
No employer/college or anyone else for that matter is ever going to ask your ds how he did in his SATS, I bet you wont even remember in a yr or two.
Secondary school always adjust sets after the first term anyway, being slightly later really wont make the slightest difference.
Let him have some fun, time spent having fun with his Dad is worth more than any test!
I would let him go if it was just about the exams. His dad's attitude would have me bristling and thinking twice though...
Hmmm... but really it is his dad who is being unreasonable, not your son- if he wants to go, I'd let him. If it finishes at 7.30, surely it won't be THAT late a bedtime for his age?
I understand why you asked your mum, because you knew she'd help justify your not letting him go, for whatever your reasons are.
I have spent several years 'boosting' for SATs. The year 6 teachers are under terrific pressure from the Head to get good results. The Head is not concerned with their individual score or setting for secondary schools - they know it doesn't matter- they are concerned about the reputation of their school. Teacher assessment is of far more importance to the child, and that is not based on one test.
How many 10 yr old boys are there in Wigan with separated/divorced parents, and whose grandmother is their HT?
With that in mind you might want a better name change OP. Quite a lot of identifiable info going on.
I think YABU too, but I am probably wasting my time.
I have nothing to wide Marthas so I'm not worried. Thanks for thinking of me though!
I'm not the type of person to type one thing on screen and say another in real life. Or say something that I wouldn't say to someones face.
Hide even .
Would like to blame ipad. But no, just fat fingers!
Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.
There's a lot of evidence that pushing children to achieve high grades in standardised testing is actually detrimental to them when moving in to higher grades.
I was like that. Managed to just scrape enough to get in to the advanced stream of maths in first year of high school, and then my parents spent a fortune in tutoring (which I detested every minute of) to get me to scrape enough of a grade to get in to the advanced stream for the next two years. Those two years were a nightmare. I would cry myself to sleep over it, would throw up before exams. I ended those two years just getting through with the lowest score possible to get me in to the advanced stream (what we used to call Maths 1 here) for the following two years. I practically had a breakdown over the thought of another two years of it. My mother, finally, saw the light, went to the school and put her foot down and said no more, she's doing what we called Maths in Society back then (which was a more practical maths based course and included economics and social maths more than advanced algebra, trig, etc). The school argued and said I would be limiting myself to not do the advanced maths. But my mother fortunately stood by me, and insisted and said that I was already taking five advanced humanities, so hardly slacking off. I ended up graduating at the top of the class in that course. It made sense to me. I went on to university and a Masters course, and twenty years later, not taking advanced maths has not limited me in anyway. If I'd been placed with the stream based on my appropriate level of skill in the first place, those few years of stress could have been avoided, and it wouldn't have affected my life in any way by taking the lower level course.
Pushing children in standardised testing to "fluke" a top result can actually end up harming more than it does helping them. Not everyone can be top of the class, and education is about encouraging the love of lifelong learning, not about turning children away from developing their own drive to achieve.
How has your opinion of me got anything to do with my ex? I left him. Asked him to leave. He left with his clothes and playstation. He wasn't interested in anything else. There is a reason that is far too personal to disclose on a public forum why. But it isn't anything to do with me, but completely him and his actions.
That was a disgusting and uncalled for personal remark, composhat, and I have reported your post.
What Feenie said,that is an utterly ridiculous and nasty thing to say.
Op I can't believe the vitriol you're getting for trying to do the right thing by your son,1 night out of his life.
I feel for teachers too.They've got Gove and Ofsted breathing down their necks,work their butts off to get the grades to please both and then have attitudes like this.
You can't win,glad I left some years ago.
dangly131 Sun 12-May-13 19:40:49
"You asked if their progress would get taken from them not their learning."
Progress to me means progressing (=moving forward) in your learning, not the measuring system that is used to measure it. Ime you can make real progress in a subject without it showing immediately in your marks (though it will eventually).
Agree that personal speculations about the OP are totally inappropriate and in very poor taste.
I think tthe fact that Op seems to regard her son's wishes and interests so dismissively is more likEly to cause him difficulties than a late night in sats wk.
"Every teacher will notice discrepancies between where a child has been working and the dip that occurs when children do nothing for nearly 2 months."
This seems a very miserable attitude towards learning: the assumption that doing something different out of school amounts to doing nothing.
A fair few of these children will have been playing in the park, building dens, practising their problem solving skills, helping their parents around the house or with DIY, speaking to relatives and friends of varying ages, getting involved in community events, visiting places of interest. All these things develop the mind and therefore, in the long run, support learning.
My children's CM used to comment how greatly their generall langauge skills improved over the holidays. I pointed out that as we stayed abroad they hadn't been practising any English at all. But their minds had been expanded and in the long run this clearly fed into all the languages they spoke.
If children forget some of the immediate facts and techniques practised in that particular school year, this does not mean they have not been learning valuable skills which will eventually feed into all the learning they do.
Education is a longterm project. The above is the short sighted view.
Cory you're being ridiculous.
My kids have the broadest life possible out of school.They've ticked off every thing on the NT list to do before you're 11- wild camping,crabbing,fire making,museums,galleries etc,etc
However the night before exam week they'll be tucked up in bed early and kept on a low key after a restful weekend alongside whatever else school recommends in order to be at their best.Treats and trips will be arranged for after.
That does not mean they lead a narrow life,it's once out of their entire primary education and not a hardship.
My last few posts were not in response to yours, Blueskies. I have never said there is anything wrong with the way you parent the children.
As should be seen from my quoting, it was in direct response to the wording of dangly's posts, which suggest that "progress" should be understood as another word for "test scores" and that no valuable learning takes place in the holdidays.
It was not about the more general question about exam week; it was about a teacher (as I understand dangly to be) propagating a narrow and unhelpful view of education through the way in which she words her posts. Hence my use of quotations to indicate precisely which parts I had a problem with.
OP, I would not like SATS stop my ds doing anything. SATS are not for the benefit of the child and are a load of nonsense!
I know I am being controlling, I don't see that as an issue. I am controlling the fact that I don't want DS going somewhere I feel is inappropriate
The reasons you are giving are nonsensical and your poor son sounds like he is being used as a pawn in a battle between you and your ex and you are saying no 'because you can' and it is a good way of spiting your ex.
Progress within schools is measurable with levels and sub levels. You asked me about progress so I told you! Children who do no academic work for 2 months are bound to slip and most children spend the summer having fun and not doing any academic work. Try as you might to pull my comments apart that I think no valuable learning takes place during the summer but you know clearly you are out for an argument and being pedantic because you feel you want to be! Learning happens outside of the classroom but how many children do you know work on subordinate clauses during the summer break for example? You and I know full well that is what was meant. Clearly I am narrow-minded as a teacher who knows and appreciates that children need to be children and have a summer of 'other learning' but if you assume that I mean all children should be nailing their use of colons and hyphens during the summer months then you have shown to me you clearly have a bee in your bonnet with everything a teacher says. You have reflected your opinions greater than I have.
but they don't slip and then not regain their momentum, do they?
The extra time they have had to relax, read, talk and gain self-esteem from the experiences they have (hopefully) had away from the pressure of school and the social set-up of school, not to mention the physical and emotional development, all add up to improvements later down the line.
I think we are all basically agreeing, but sadly the "immediately measurable" seems to have taken precedence over the long-term and less-measurable in teacher's lives
Through no fault of their own
They do regain it again but it does take time after returning to school. I was commenting in response to someone who said that there is a slip noticed in yr7 but my comment was to share that is happens in all years not just yr 7 and it being due to children having a summer having fun. I won't say doing nothing (as in academic work) incase thing gets taken out of context again!
Please tell after all these posts.
I hope that he got to go!
I'm not sure why you asked- were we just supposed to agree with you?
I can't believe you let your petty sniping at your ex take priority over a meaningful event between your son and his father.
It's not as if it would have made any difference to his
stupid pointless SATs anyway - the parade wasn't during the exam.
<grateful that DS, Y6, is not doing any fucking SATs>
Let us know how many Level 5s he gets.
As it is, he is at his dads, and his dad accepted that it wasn't a good idea for DS. So in fact, I didn't have to do or say anything else.
I've already stated why I asked exotic if you read what I have written
It is ok to ask for advice and then stay with your original first thought after others views.
Level six in simmering resentment I would imagine
I think I know my child well enough to know this isn't going to bother him for the rest of his years.
Not terribly conducive to trying your best- far more likely to not really care- depending on personality.
Passive aggressive comments aren't big or clever.
So it all worked out exactly as you wanted. How lovely
I don't think there's anything in the talk guidelines about OPs being required to comply with the majority opinion
The OP has stated all along that she wasn't going to change her mind. She is still allowed to ask for opinions isn't she?
I know my son very well, hes a good hardworking young man. He wasnt allowed to go to a cricket match when he was young, school night wouldnt have been home till gone 11. Imagine my suprise op, when going to check he was fast asleep, he was sat in a little tent made of blankets, watching the cricket on tv.
What I can't believe is that I have - indirectly- supported someone's right to go to a football parade, when I fecking hate football. With a passion.
I must be very very principled. Or something.
Well why do poster go to the bother of posing a question or dilemma if they have no intention of considering a point of view other than their own.
I suspect the op came here expecting everyone to vindicate the strong stance she was taking in response to her feckless ex and her son's education. However as it became clear to a lot of posters that she was playing power games and her son was the pawn.
It is all to common:
Op - AIBU?
MN - Yes!
Op - hissy fit.
You see when divorced men bleat on about mother's using the kids as a weapon, it is normally bullshit excuse for being a crap father, but I really think that in your case that is what you are doing.
Maybe she did consider it...just because she didn't change her mind doesn't mean to say she did not listen to what was being said and make an informed decision. We don't know the thought processes she had in making her decision. Just because she has a differing opinion does not make it ok to be abusive and label her a crap mother for missing one football parade which will happen again next year or the year after because that is how Man U roll! Granted by then said child will possibly support another team!
Well said Dangly
I often put a dilemma out there to get it off my chest and work through. It isn't a given I'll go with advice given. Sometimes you just want to be aware of alternative points of views to understand them more.
I think it's pretty weak to go against something you think is right just because MN told you to.
We don't know said child,said dad or said school.Op may well have spoken to hoards of friends who do and who agreed with her.
I think some posters get a little carried away with the role of MN and put far to much stock by it.<whispers> It isn't RL.
Op glad it all got sorted.
Your ex said nasty things (good to know it's water off a ducks back btw)
BUT I have to reluctantly agree there's a grain of truth there. You admit you're controlling. Is your stranglehold going to get tighter in Secondary? Because the problem is the only way he'll do well in school is if he gets have a 'regular' life.
Oh and trust me... No matter how much of a high achiever he is, and even if his dream is to be a doctor/scientist/lawyer... When he's fifteen and their is a girl involved with interrupting his studies, you have no chance of winning.
Fond memories of my cousin's teen defiance
What a shame, obviously I agree with the majority here that you should have let him go, that this is more about you dictating to your ex and being controlling.
Puzzled at why you don't seem to think your ex working shifts meaning he cant agree a set day for contact is reasonable? if he has to work shifts what do you expect?
Finally... SATs are not exams the amount of people I have seen write stupid facebook statuses this week saying 'good luck xxxx in your exams this week' yes, they are talking about bloody SATs!
My 16 yr old has his first exam this week...a real exam that has real importance for his future, not something that measures what his school is doing.
Good for you, OP.
SATs aside-a football parade on a school night-not important enough imo.
it wasn't a football parade, it was the parade to mark the retirement of the most successful manager in history after his 13th title, more than any other manager in any country in the world, ever.
It was a one off! Even I know that!
My dc missed the Olympics in it's entirety,even the cycling as it went past their gps town- they survived.
Good lord people, united are always having bloody parades. If this boy were really bothered, he'd have been to plenty by now. And not in SATs week.
Such a shame! Especially when someone pointed out that the exam today is the new grammar exam so only being used to set standards for next year so no impact on the school and OP won't even find out what her son's score was. OP's mother will have known this too. Completely pointless!
OP, if you don't relax a little it will only get harder as your DS gets older. I had cousins who werent allowed to do anything at all for weeks before any exams. They got exactly the same grades as my sister and I did but we were trusted to make our own decisions about when and how much we revised. DS1 has his History A level today. I have had no input into his revision and placed no restrictions on him and I'm a teacher. He did five hours yesterday and spent most of the weekend revising, missing out on a party through his own choice. If you don't give them a bit of freedom they will soon come to resent school. They will have enough pressure later on so why put it on him now when it really truly doesn't matter?
Ds was told his SATS scores last year, have things changed this year then?
You get the SATs score for the other tests just not the new grammar teat being sat today because it's a trial. It also won't be used to look at the school's standards because obviously it hasn't been sat before.
Ooh, sorry, a one off football parade.
Sometimes kids/adults miss
history in the making stuff due to school/work/can't get there/inconvenient time...
I'm sure Op is sitting now quietly smug in the knowledge that she got one over on her ex.
The parade made headlines in the news yesterday, the atmosphere looked wonderful.
And I say that as someone that hates football with a passion.
And sometimes kids/adults miss something because of petty point-scoring by adults behaving like children.
But he was at his Dad's-so what was to stop the Dad taking him if they both really wanted to go?
passive-aggressive threats from the OP most likely. Otherwise why wouldn't have just gone?
Maybe dad after thinking about it agreed with the op.My dp wouldn't have dreamt of taking any of mine out the night before exam/ test week.
Also many may say Sats aren't important however one never knows exactly how assessments are used.I for one want my dc to do their absolute best in any test they sit incase it comes back to bite them on the bum at a later date.
It is good practise to get into at the very least.
"passive-aggressive threats from the OP most likely."
" Otherwise why wouldn't have just gone?"-because he wasn't really bothered, not bothered enough when it meant taking his son as well?
Maybe he just suggested it as a wind up because he knew the OP would say no.
I walked to the tram from work through Manchester during the build up of all the celebrations and parade last night. All i could think of was OP's poor son missing out on it all
OK you stuck to your guns and didnt back down, fair enough, there is a lot to be said for that. But i do think that PatPig's comment was spot on:
''And sometimes kids/adults miss something because of petty point-scoring by adults behaving like children.''
But in this case-who's the point scorer-the adult who didn't want the child to go, or the one who could have taken him & didn't & will blame it on the other??
Father picked something he knew mother would disagree too and would get son on side. Mum said no, and used 'but I have to do what's best for you' on him.
Basically, this poor kid is a pawn to hurt/piss each other off.
Yeah you have a point diddl, but we don't know whether the OP threatens to withhold access or whatever. It's clear that she has a stock of 'poor parenting decisions from months ago' that she likes to use against her ex.
It's possible the ex did this to score points against the OP, and vice versa, or both at the same time even.
I think you're surmising an awful lot out of somebody you don't know simply wanting their son in bed at a good time pre test week.
Seen it happen an awful lot, and I just don't have faith in bitter break ups that involve children any more, especially with opposite personality types.
Hopefully you're right though, and OP is just a little tightly wound/overly strict etc.
Oh and unrelated but I hope the father gets his act together. I hate it when split up parents disrespect each other. No one deserves that kind of nastiness.
I'll agree with you that it's a shitty situation by the sounds of it.
I wonder though, all those saying "let him go"-what would happen if the other parent was saying no-who would "prevail"?
Not that I particularly care, but since aspersions are being cast over my character. This man has a caution for domestic violence. Against me. He would have had a conviction if I had reported the further incidents.
There is no point scoring as far as I am concerned. Merely protecting my child as far as possible.
It might make you think though, when someone posts something, they usually have far more to the story than meets the eye. And one should not feel they have to disclose such information.
I wasn't going to, but you know what, I've done nothing wrong. I'm not ashamed. He is. And that is why he walked away with nothing, and why he isn't as involved as he should have been.
I don't trust his judgement - no. Would you?
Gosh - that's unfortunate he just got a caution. Usually the CPS take the view that cautions are not an appropriate way of dealing with DV situations (even one incident), so that's not sent out a very good message.
Unfortunately posters can only go on the information provided so can necessarily assume cautions
or convictions for DV when responding when theirs absolutely no info that could even lead to
No, but it would do well for some people to stop and consider that there is often far more than can be posted about, when they start chucking comments about and casting character assertions.
Particularly those who think they make good amateur psychologists.
I posted for opinions on the scenario. Not opinions on me. That is just rude. And given that most people if asked this scenario in real life, would not say half the things that have been posted on here - I ask, why is it okay to type something you would not say?
It was 4.5 years ago, he admitted what he had done, was taken away and cautioned.
I don't really like thinking about it, or talking about it. I feel sorry for him, that he would have behaved in this way.
I am very sorry you had such a horrible time.
But you did post about football parades and SATs- not about your ex partner's violent tendencies......
Exactly, I posted about one thing. The parade.
So why did several posters decide to character assassinate me? I fail to see how that is acceptable?
I totally agree detective,how you get from parade to all the accusations on this thread I don't know.
Yes or no. Simple question.
Everyone got cross with you OP because we only had what you had said to go on, and when everyone advised you to do one thing you were digging your heels in-very infuriating. Everyone was feeling sorry for yourDS, having an absolutely immovable mother, no matter the advice given on here.
I don't know how you get from parades and SATs to domestic violence cautions, to be honest.
However, for the avoidance of doubt, YABU.
Nearly everyone said yes.
You were keen to keep saying no.
That is very frustrating, so people were compelled to argue with you.
Sorry Op, but that is drip feeding.
I've looked at other threads of yours and though he seems a twat, I didn't see anything about dv, but he wrecked your home and subsequently left.
You've also said he loves his son.
I think it's a bit unfair bringing this up now.
I'm still of the opinion that he should have been allowed to go to the parade.
But it's done and I'll back out now.
Bloody hell, it's just the internet! I think some people need to put it down and walk away if they get that frustrated at someone not doing as you say!
Why did you bother asking the question at all?
Your mind was made up from the outset.
I think some people need to put it down and walk away if they get that frustrated at someone not doing as you say!
I think some people need to put it down and walk away if they get that frustrated at someone not doing as you say!
Pot, Kettle, Black.
I think the issue is that you started with the character assassination saying that your ex let your son watch an inappropriate movie a year or so ago.
He is your son's father, he might not be the best father in the world, but scoring points is not going to help. Unless there are real solid things beyond 'he wants to go out on a school night, once in a blue moon', or 'he watched an unsuitable movie a year ago', it's best just to try and support your son's relationship with his father and accept that you may have different parenting styles.
drip .... drip.... drip...
oh and op you have chosen to return over and over again so pot kettle black.
Strange how this latest titbit is only posted when virtually everyone disagrees with you.
Hmmm, well, it is my thread, so I would return. Yes.
Also, you don't generally start a thread by telling your whole life history. I included what was relevant at that point.
It had no relevance until people started trying to attack my reasons for not wanting DS to go to this.
Now it does have relevance - as it explains the relationship more.
Uhm well surely if he's such a twat it's not a hard leap to assume you might be tightly wound and him provocative towards you?
I don't view that as armchair psych, just common sense.
But you're right, this is about the parade. No idea why you dredged up the DV (very sorry) Your character wasn't 'assassinated,' no one said you're a shit mum/shit at your job/called you names. Merely disagreed with how you handled this situation.
But as a few posters have noted, we can only go on what you posted here, and the general consensus was you were being controlling and point scoring. Puts on amateur psychologist hat When almost 400 posters think the same thing, maybe you should consider they aren't entirely wrong?
Leaving this thread now. Throwing your toys out of the pram by using such an emotive topic to guilt and silence those who
disagreed 'assassinated' your character isn't particularly classy.
I am sincerely sorry you were attacked, especially by someone who was supposed to love you the most. No one deserves violence.
Did your Son go the the parade?
I don't trust his judgement - no. Would you?
My opinion about this particular issue would not be any different if you had disclosed the information. Since you allow your ex access, and allow him to take your DS on holidays, then there does not appear to be any apparent concern as to his welfare when in the care of his father. You did say in your original post that you would have no problem with him going on any other week. I answered the question you asked. Yes I think YABU. And my opinion has not wavered on that point, regardless of your further postings on the issue.
You're sorry she as attacked but thinks this is about point scoring.
I think anybody who facilitates their son to have contact with somebody who attacked them is hardly going to have point scoring as a goal when making decisions.
The fact she is putting her own feelings aside in order to facilitate a father/ son relationship kind of pours water on that little theory.
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