To think ' bin dipping' is a fkin disgrace.

(101 Posts)
chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 21:17:06

A personal vent /rant whatever. I am so embarrassed to even mention this to anyone in RL . My brother has long term drug issues and until recently we were not speaking after he stole and pawned my jewellery, for my parents sake we are, albeit it strained. I saw him earlier with a bag over hos shoulder and wearing gloves so pulled over toask what he qas up to.
He was being shifty so I asked him if he had stolen goods. He then admitted he had a bag of stuff from waitrose bins. He aopened his bag and he had shepherd s pies, cold meats and youghurt s. I made it clear I was disgusted and he said it was desperation that drove him, and he reckons another dozen to ' bin dip ' he said greggs is a other good spot. I said normal people would spend their money on food not drugs. He tried to justify hi.self. He also raid ashtray s for baccy and finds himself dimps. I have spoke to my parents and they have their head firmly in the sand, they know what he is but theres nothing they can do. NothingI can do either he Iis 35, single and has not worked for over 3 yrs. Its frustrating, disappointing and disgusting all at the same time.
We live in an affluent tourist town and it seems my brother is part of an underclass who think bin dipping and dimp hunting are normal. His ex gf used to get all her clothes from bags left outside charity shops. Ffs It was so much easier havi g zero contact.

MrsRajeshKoothrappali Wed 24-Apr-13 21:19:24

Don't see the problem.

He needs to eat and the food came from a bin, he wasn't shoplifting.

I'd let him get on with it.

I don't think bin dipping is all that bad really. It's a shame so much decent food gets chucked out and if someone can salvage it then good luck to them.

If you don't like your brother then go back to not speaking to him.

HollyBerryBush Wed 24-Apr-13 21:20:09

It's called 'freeganism' - a lot of people live like that, although I'm surprised they don't lock their bins.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeganism

It was called skipping when I did it. If I could have afforded to buy food I would have smile

CaffeDoppio Wed 24-Apr-13 21:22:35

What's a 'dimp'? A fag end?

HotCrossPun Wed 24-Apr-13 21:23:00

The amount of perfectly good food that is thrown away at supermarkets is ridiculous.

YABU. What does it matter if he eats it? It's getting chucked away anyway - he's not stealing.

Atavistic Wed 24-Apr-13 21:23:46

I'm surprised by your horror. Yes, he's fucking up by being a junkie, if that's what you mean by long term drug issues. But the food is being thrown away, and I presume , still in it's packaging.
He could be doing a lot worse, and who exactly is suffering because of his choices? You?? Because you're embarrassed? Please!

Fakebook Wed 24-Apr-13 21:23:50

We live in an affluent tourist town and it seems my brother is part of an underclass who think bin dipping and dimp hunting are normal.

Something about that sentence doesn't sit right with me. You seem really up yourself tbh. Just cut contact. Your obviously embarrassed of your own flesh and blood.

Fakebook Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:10

You're*

PilchardsonToast Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:23

This is understandably a much more complex and emotive issue for you than simply - eating food from bins which really when you think about it is not that bad. It's just food that isn't being used and will be wasted if he/ someone doesn't eat it

gordyslovesheep Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:24

YABU it's only going to landfill - at least it's being used

Schlock Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:26

Throwing out perfectly good food when people are starving is a fkin disgrace.

Raspberrysorbet Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:30

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HollyBerryBush Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:32

When eBay was at it's height, I knew people who would hang round Woolworth back doors when the stock lines changed - Woolies used to clear the shelves and dump most of their products (probably why they went bankrupt), mind you they made a nice living from it.

WTFisABooyhooISBooyhoo Wed 24-Apr-13 21:24:34

you clearly dont understand addiction if you think it's just as simple as him choosing to spend money on food instead of drugs.

and no. it's not disgusting. lots of perfectly good, sealed food is thrown out everyday in shops, why should it go to waste if people are willing to go fetch it out?

BasilBabyEater Wed 24-Apr-13 21:25:21

I don't think your DB's freeganism is the problem is it, it's the drugs and the seeming inability to function normally in the society in which he finds himself.

I think you're focusing on something that's a detail, rather than the larger issue which is what really bugs you about him.

The bin-dipping really is the least of his troubles.

maddening Wed 24-Apr-13 21:25:31

nothing wrong imo - I think it's disgusting that some places purposefully spoil their thrown out food by way of pouring a chemical over it that makes it inedible.

the food should be offered to those that want it - the waste is terrible.

it's not just humans that could take the left over food - zoos etc could use it too.

HumphreyCobbler Wed 24-Apr-13 21:25:32

tbh I would be depressed if my brother made his living by getting food out of bins due to a drug habit. After pawning the stuff he stole from me.

I think it's far more disgraceful that so much food is thrown away when people are starving the world over. And that people in this country throw out a quarter of all their food.

I'm sorry about your jewellery though, it's incredibly hard having an addict in the family.

Oh stop being so pious and prissy.

I get that its horrible for you watching your brother struggle with addiction, and that he has behaved really badly towards you and broken your trust.

But FGS would you rather he stole to feed himself? Its surely better that he eats at all (lots of addicts don't and suffer malnutrition as a result) and at least he makes use of what others waste instead of stealing...

TBH the real disgrace is that anyone is in a position of having to eat from bins in a society so affluent that edible food is thrown away.

BasilBabyEater Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:01

And yes it's fucking disgraceful that the food is being thrown away. By Waitrose of all people.

Why aren't they donating it to their local food bank?

HollyBerryBush Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:09

The trouble is though, "dates" even if it were given away, the supermarkets could be sued if anyone became ill.

Raspberrysorbet Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:17

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

livinginwonderland Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:43

it's a "fkin disgrace" that shops and supermarkets throw away perfectly good food when there are people starving. i feel sorry for your brother. an addiction is not as simple as saying "i'll stop buying drugs and buy food now".

HumphreyCobbler Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:48

the bin dipping thing is a bit of a red herring OP, isn't it? Isn't the issue that you are deeply fed up with the mess your brother is in and that he drags you into?

I am sorry for the stress you are under.

usualsuspect Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:57

The sheer amount of wasted food in this country is as fucking disgrace.

Raspberrysorbet Wed 24-Apr-13 21:27:58

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TobyLerone Wed 24-Apr-13 21:28:11

I'd rather see people using 'waste' food.

YABU.

diddl Wed 24-Apr-13 21:29:17

I think that it's more of a "fkin" disgrace that he stole & pawned your jewellery tbh.

Serenitysutton Wed 24-Apr-13 21:30:08

I understand why you're so upset, it must be get hard to see your brother like that. But he's addicted to drugs and you can't apply you standards to him. His life is shit enough tbh, I doubt raiding a bin even registers. I hope one day he will get the help he needs.

AndBingoWasHisNameOh Wed 24-Apr-13 21:32:39

I can get why you're horrified. However compared to his drug use and stealing, taking food that has been thrown away out of a bin is the least of his issues.

chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 21:33:54

Yes I see what you mean in terms of waste and need and freeganism. However this is someone who chooses to spend his cash on drugs, he injects amphetamine and has a weekend off his head, comes down and is skint. Picking other people's fag ends up to re use is disgusting.
I prefer having nothing to do with him, out of sight out of mind etc but my parents have been v distressed, I took him to court last year when he stole of me. But yes at least he is stealing....yet. To be honest when his payments go monthly I will be surprised if he lives much longer! A months pay on drugs up his arm would finish him for good. Maybe that is what the government are hoping for.

GreenEggsAndNichts Wed 24-Apr-13 21:33:57

What's dimp hunting?

I think getting good food out of bins isn't nearly the disgrace that the fact that the food is there in the first place is. (holy hell that's a bad sentence, sorry)

The problem is ofc that he's using drugs and can't afford to feed himself.

Main issue with freeganism is that people don't always leave the bins in decent order when they're done, so shops start locking them up or doing other things to discourage people.

diddl Wed 24-Apr-13 21:38:16

Even if has been thrown away-is it theft?

My bin is on my property & in theory at any point before it is emptied I could decide that I want something back out of it!

Maryz Wed 24-Apr-13 21:40:23

Your brother is an addict.

Either accept that, do what you can for him practically (giving him food if appropriate) and support your parents who will be finding it very difficult to cope with.

Or don't see him.

You sound as though you are more embarrassed by his bin-dipping than upset by the fact that he is throwing his life away, which strikes me as very odd.

chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 21:40:48

No I am not prissy or pius or up myself. But I do belive that addiction is the problem yes. His addiction has torn are family apart and I see no happy ending. It is hard to love and support and addict you know, by their ature they are self pitying and manipulate or worse incoherent mumbling messes.

Raspberrysorbet Wed 24-Apr-13 21:43:32

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 21:44:00

No I have spent years upset and yes I still am. However it is embarrassing to see your brother like that, people comment about himto me. He looks weird, big hollow eyes and a slack jaw, when people talk about him I am beyond sad but Iits still embarrassing too.

chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 21:45:52

Btw ....dimp hunting is usually done in the dark, fag ends on floors ashtray s outside pubs and houses etc

Maryz Wed 24-Apr-13 21:48:35

Oh, and don't ring your parents to tell them all about it. Of course they have their heads in the sand - they are very sensibly deciding that they can't change him until he wants to change himself.

It will be even harder for them than for you, so sympathy would be better than ringing them to rant about where he gets his food.

HumphreyCobbler Wed 24-Apr-13 21:49:39

Honestly OP, if I wanted to let of some steam I wouldn't post in AIBU.

I see that it is upsetting to see your brother rifling through bins for his meals, and that it represents a life thrown away and a family left in turmoil. What a terrible waste of a life. sad I am not surprised it sometimes makes you angry with him too. I just can't imagine really.

Maryz Wed 24-Apr-13 21:50:03

And I'm not unsympathetic by the way. I understand this is probably the last straw for you sad. But it isn't the worst thing he is doing, so don't let it upset you. Put it out of your mind and only help him practically when you can.

Don't emotionally exhaust yourself by worrying about it when there is nothing you can do.

LessMissAbs Wed 24-Apr-13 21:51:10

YANBU. I think anyone would be pretty devastated if their 35 year old's brother's life consisted of feeding himself from bin leftovers (as opposed to having a job and his own money).

Yes, isn't "bin-dipping" wonderful and great for the environment, but would you seriously be happy if this is what your close relative had to do to survive? Or would you like to live like this yourself, if you think its so wonderful?

imour Wed 24-Apr-13 21:55:17

rather he bin dipped than stole from some ones house if he was my brother , i would try and get help for my brother than just slate him on here ,you just seem bothered that you are related to him not that hes got problems or why , god help you if you ever get into any sort of trouble one day , what goes around and all that .

aldiwhore Wed 24-Apr-13 21:55:23

There's two (or more) issues here:

The bin dipping, not something I'd do unless desparate but I have a few eco friends who've done this at one time or other, mostly they were NOT addicts, but disgusted with the amount of waste generated by supermarkets... there's was a fair point, but I was never going to join them.

Addiction causes everyone pain and YANBU to feel angry at your brother. My own brother's behaviour used to make me rage, because I knew it was due to his various addictions and NOT HIM, and I found it hard to listen to his shit when he tried to explain why he did it, always skirting around the truth that actually, the way he behaved was because he'd never afford to actually live normally AND feed his addiction.

I raged.

It also broke my heart.

It's a horrible situation to be in and there is nothing you can do but wait on the side lines until your brothe is ready to help himself. Then, all of a sudden you must cast aside all that angst that's been building and be supportive and positive when all you really want to do is throttle the thoughtless bastard! And it is crucial that you cast your own feelings aside when the time comes.

My brother is happy, clean, working and fishing these days. We have a good relationship. I have forgiven him, and myself. It's a crazy life.

YANBU to feel the way you do. I went through a period of time of HATING people who wore petuli oil!! All of them! I didn't require a reason, but it was because his girlfriend who was his dealer's ex (the ex paid child maintainence via drugs... you get the picture) soaked herself in it. A lot of the rage is irrational. But it's all understandable.

Therefore YANBU. I sincerely hope you one day get past the rage and can be happy, I clung on to my rage for a long long time because the alternative was gut wrenching heart break and sorrow. x

seriouscakeeater Wed 24-Apr-13 22:01:05

Op I can understand your frustration. I think its the bigger picture your upset with also and I think so other posters can see that too.

When people have an addiction it wraps its fingers round them until all dignity has gone out of the window and family's ultimately pay the price too.

You obviously still care about your brother that's why you still have these emotions.

Alas you cant do anything about it as he doesn't seem ready to want to get better.

seriouscakeeater Wed 24-Apr-13 22:03:03

aldiwhore good post

chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 22:04:50

Thankyou.
Some of you clearly have experience of this and aldiwhore thankyou for your story. You have hit the nail on the head. Imour belive me I have tried to help it has been over ten years on and off. He has had a couple of drugs councillors and went in the army for a bit. I think our relationship changed when he robbed my jewellery, wedding and engagement rings from exDH. He denied it, helped look for them and only admitted it when my dad got involved. THAT is probably the issue. I will try and bury it for my parents sake.

Footface Wed 24-Apr-13 22:07:28

Hi op, I often think that the addicts family are forgotten about, and are put in such difficult situations.

I do feel for you. I have a relative who is an addict. It's hard to watch them tear the family apart, and the anxiety and fear the rest of the family feel. Particularly when it's long term and different rehabs have been tried.

The ripple affect is massive. I think on situation like this you just have to detach from the person, but support your parents.

pointythings Wed 24-Apr-13 22:07:52

I agree with the poster who said that you need to separate the two things. YANBU to find your brother's addiction and the behaviour it causes distressing, and you have a right to feel angry at him, especially for not seeking help and for stealing from family.

I'd try to put the taking discarded food from supermarkets out of my mind though, it really doesn't harm anyone and like many on here I resent how much perfectly good food is tossed every single day.

imour Wed 24-Apr-13 22:09:34

i apologise chosenone , i didnt know you tried to help him in the past , just reading your posts seemed like you couldnt be arsed with him and were embarrassed ,hope he gets and wants some help and you sort things out as a family , good luck .

Footface Wed 24-Apr-13 22:09:52

Also agree about the monthly benefit. For addicts this is a complete disaster.

SignoraStronza Wed 24-Apr-13 22:11:52

Someone I know works at Waitrose. If the fridges/freezers break down for more than about 5 minutes they have to bin the whole lot (h&s). Is a disgrace. Can really see why someone would go bin dipping there - some really naice stuff gets chucked out.

chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 22:23:19

Thankyou. Remaining detached definitely helps.

andubelievedthat Wed 24-Apr-13 22:43:39

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chosenone Wed 24-Apr-13 22:57:10

Yes search my history. Many threads in relationships. I am the opposite of some snobby cow looking down on addicts.

OliviaMMumsnet (MNHQ) Wed 24-Apr-13 23:02:43
AmberSocks Wed 24-Apr-13 23:12:39

Its not disgusting,its not stealing,and its not called bin dipping.yabu.

my dh,whe he started his business,had NO money,and would not sign on,him and his 2 partners would pay ret from the business and after that they were on their own,they did this all the time,literally,they lived on it,for years.

YouDontWinFriendsWithSalad Wed 24-Apr-13 23:24:31

I used to do it when I was in my early 20s and skint. Something like 60% of food is wasted from farm to plate, it's absolutely shocking and I had no qualms about it.

We would find boxes of jars of perfectly good food - if one broke in the box they would throw the whole lot away. Never touched meat but got loads of bread and produce, and planted a herb and flower garden from all the slightly withered seedlings that got chucked.

It's a 'fucking disgrace' that our society is so fussy about food and what it looks like that perfectly edible food gets thrown away while many starve, even in 'rich' countries like the UK

YouDontWinFriendsWithSalad Wed 24-Apr-13 23:27:45

Very interesting TED talk here on the food waste scandal if anyone's interested. It's really sobering.

HerrenaHarridan Wed 24-Apr-13 23:46:10

Op I'm sorry that your having to watch your brother suffer with addiction, it's brutal.

However you do sound like a proper snob! Underclass? Seriously?

Fwiw, skipping put an end to 8 years of vegetarianism for me.

There has been a lot of improvement in how much food is wasted but it is horrifying to see bin bag after bin bag of perfectly good food. Especially as m and s get their staff to rip open all the packets the pour in food dye!

I once found live seafood in the bin! How the fuck it was supposed to be out of date when it wasn't even dead I don't know but it haunts me to think that people went out to where these poor creatures were living, scooped them out of their universe only for then to sit and die in a bin bag angry

If you don't want to associate with your brother then don't, you won't be doing him any favours by sneering down at him from your overclass

ThatVikRinA22 Thu 25-Apr-13 00:01:05

you know what op

im a respectable working mum, career, nice house, 2.4 and all the rest.
my brother, was a heroin addict for 10 yrs. homeless for 3.
now, we got in touch a few years ago after a long period of estrangement - he is much younger than me and the fact that he is a homeless addict might give you a clue as to how good our parenting was.

nothing he did embarrassed me. nothing. the fact he was an addict? no.
the fact he had diseases? no. the fact he had no job? no.
i took him in once, he was 18. on heroin. he had lice. i judged him on his own parenting (which was unsuprisingly shite)

the reason that we dont have contact now, is that he and i just do not see eye to eye. simple.
nothing to do with his "issues"
i have my own "issues".

. i was willing to have contact with my bro - but he pushed and pushed and pushed for me to have contact with other family that were damaging to me and that i wanted nothing to do with. and so ended our contact.

people get addicted for all sorts of reasons - but there is always a back story.
i never judge anyone in that position.

olgaga Thu 25-Apr-13 00:08:39

Terrible story, but he's 35, after all, and has completely messed up his life (and no doubt the rest of the family) but if all you're going to do is have a go at him you're not helping him.

You're not helping your parents either, having a go at them.

What on earth do you expect them to do?

I don't see the problem with your brother finding freely available food. It might as well be eaten as end up in landfill. It's better than stealing from you or anyone else - isn't it?

LeoandBoosmum Thu 25-Apr-13 00:18:25

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LeoandBoosmum Thu 25-Apr-13 00:24:21

Sorry...I take that back. Calling you a bitch was a bit harsh there... Really though...your brother has to eat and is it not better that he does this than steal? It does sound like you are being pretty judgmental. I know it must be difficult to see your brother in this situation, not to mention frustrating, but it can't be easy for him either. Okay, he chose his path but once you're hooked on drugs it's so hard... :/ Sorry I was a bit harsh, it's just that you were coming across as holier than thou...

yaimee Thu 25-Apr-13 00:25:58

I've done it, no drugs problem here!
the wholesalers near my old work was a goldmine. Used to see other people there too.
Waste not want not.

Kungfutea Thu 25-Apr-13 01:33:43

I think it's so hypocritical that posters have both chided you for being judgmental and then judged you.

The more perceptive posters saw that the main issue is your distress at your brother's addiction.

I think aibu is the wrong place to post. You need support, not bitchy posts about whether you're a snob or not.

I'm sorry you and your family are going through this.

rainbowslollipops Thu 25-Apr-13 06:23:05

I can see why you're embarrassed cause I bet before all this at some point he had it all going for him. It's hard to help an addict because you can't understand him and he can't understand you. You just wanna scream get off the drugs to him and he wants to give you reasons why he can't but yet you'd still struggle to understand. It's shameful because he can make something of himself, he doesn't need to be this person. I don't think your parents help by burying their heads in the sand. Address the issue and sit down with him as a family and talk about it. Listen to eachother, discuss getting help. It wont go away on its own.

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 06:39:22

Yanbu. There is nothing wrong with bin dipping. But you are angry at seeing your brother piss his life up the wall and that you don't have a good relationship with him. I have a brother who is just the same. His drug and alcohol issues have gone on for years. But you can't really help him unless he wants to help himself.

Ledkr Thu 25-Apr-13 06:53:42

How lovely for him to have such a kind sister.
Would you rather he shoplifted to eat?
And yes most people spend their money on food rather than drugs because MOST PEOPLE ARE NOT DRUG ADDICTED.
You do realise that giving up drugs is not eat don't you?
If be happy he was managing to still eat tbh.
Poor bloke.

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 06:55:33

Just read your last few posts. My brother is still not well. The last time I went to see him, he was homeless and sofa surfing. He lives in an area close to where he had rehab and was replacing heroin with alcohol as his addiction. His homelessness was partly not his fault but I was still angry. I felt disgusted with him. Yes, unreasonable I know. It is his birthday today. He is 44. He has only recently got back in contact after a year of not knowing how to get hold of him. I wish I could offer you a happy ending. I hope your brother gets well.

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 06:58:20

And for all the posters who are berating the OP. TRY DEALING WITH HAVING AN ADDICT IN YOUR FAMILY angry

chosenone Thu 25-Apr-13 07:02:07

Again thank you to the posters who have an understanding of living with someone with addictions. That is the issue probably not the bin dipping, and yes they DO call it that.I am not going to argue my case about why I am not a snob tbh. Underclass is a strong term, however, many have used it when describing my brother. Where he lives many addicts live in bedsits and flats nearby, rubbish everywhere, needles on thefloor, anti social behaviour at all hours. Some of these people do go on the rob im shops and breaking into houses. Bin dipping, washing line shopping etc is a way of life. His ex gf had 2 children taken off her because of this way of life. She would use any old rags for her period to save her money for drugs. If these people are not the an underclass what are they?
Damaged people, people self medicating, people trapped in a cycle..... yes probably. It is sad and when you' re related to one and this stuff is on your doorstep, it hurts.

chosenone Thu 25-Apr-13 07:08:24

Sorry for you brother lovelygoldboots. It must've been hard to see him like that. I think finding a way out must be difficult. His drugs councillors helped him identify triggers and that was about it. Losing his job, car, previous home etc did nothing to change him. He is meant to be applying for ten jobs a month so his benefits don't stop but to lool at his face he is unemployable. I don't know what the answer is.

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 07:17:49

I made a resolution this year chooseone to detach emotionally. I have made myself ill worrying about him in the past. He has always been involved with drugs but his problems really started when my youngest brother died thirteen years ago. I can understand his pain, but I have worried about losing him too. I have another brother who helped him a lot. He went and got heroin for him while he was waiting to go on a methadone. Which doesn't work. The trouble is there are no answers. Which doesn't help you or him. All you can do is be there for your parents.

chosenone Thu 25-Apr-13 07:25:42

Yes I can see what you're saying. Thankyou. My parents have aged considerably and it is hard to watch.

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 07:31:57

There may be other organizations that can help. I have never accessed them. But maybe someone could link for you. Good luck OP, feel free to PM if it all gets too much smile

missalien Thu 25-Apr-13 07:32:29

If they are not underclass what are they ?

They are people .

The addictions have taken over , I see it as a bit of a parellell universe they live on. I'm sure there are many other things they do you would be horrified at but that is just what you have seen.

It's hard , but it is what it is. Truth be told , there is nothing you can foot help except support your parents .

My mum is a heroin crack addict was was my younger sister who recently died . Just love your own life the best you can . I always say if you wouldn't walk I'm their shoes, don't judge. And be thankful there are not children involved .

But for the grace of god, there go I .

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 07:40:12

A parallel universe is a good analogy. You know they are there but you just cant reach them.

Footface Thu 25-Apr-13 07:54:24

It's very frustrating to watch the people around you becoming ill and old because they are supporting an addicted family member.

In my case I have completely list respect for tge person involved. He has lost everything. He's been an addict for 20 years. He has 2 children that he jumps in and out of their lives depending on how he feels. He will cut contact when he wants to. Leaving you wondering if he's dead or alive.
He begs, borrows and steals.

With long term addiction it becomes hard to remember the person they were before the addiction. Often leaving you feeling that they are just a selfish, self centred arse. But deep down that person must surely still be there.

olgaga Thu 25-Apr-13 08:27:03

The real tragedy here is the complete lack of treatment and support for addicts, and their families who suffer the brunt of it.

No methadone doesn't work - it's just maintenance.

Sadly no government will ever decriminalise drug use and addiction in order to tackle the problem of addiction properly for fear of being seen as "soft on drugs".

Approaches which explicitly reject an evidence-based public health approach, but instead focus on incarceration and criminalisation of addicts, continue to utterly fail, at enormous financial and human cost.

chosenone Thu 25-Apr-13 09:14:10

Thank you lovelygoldboots. Missalien and footface sorry to hear of the addicts in your family. You are so right about detachment and focusing on my own life. I had done that after the court case and recent contact has bought it all back to reality really. Seeing him showing me the spoils of his visit to waitrose was so depressing and upsetting, hence this post! I honestly don't know where a govt would begin with addicts. We have tried many avenues over the years only when he committed/was caught committing a crime did he get more support. His ex GF was a product of the care system and had not been schooled since 8 years old, abused in care, domestic abuse within relationships, prostituted herself for drugs. I felt sorry for her but she could not function in society. She is banned from all local shops, has no idea how to look after herself. It's sad but when she stole all my dads anti depressant medication and was part of the theft from me my sympathy ran dry. The answer? Unfortunately I have no idea sad Thank you

Thumbtack Thu 25-Apr-13 09:30:54

Agree that addiction is horrible - it effects every thought a person has.

missalien Thu 25-Apr-13 09:53:05

His life has nothing to do with you and does not reflect on you. If you get a chance , as I did with my sister before she died , I said ; I'm sorry your life is like this , it's a frightening way to live , I love you as my sister and I wish things were different for you , but I can't help you, and I'm sorry about that. Addicts chew up every person in their path and then move ok to the next and have no consideration for the destruction they cause, they are just trying to survive and the code of conduct does not register on a Normal persons moral compass.

For my mum, the best thing I can do for her is to turn out normal the. She can feel proud not guilty and she does enough already .

Ther lives must be awful to lead . I for one feel lucky I didn't turn out that way . And I support sterilisation for addicts .

You just have to be you , you can't do anything else . I hope you come to terms with it and can walk away realising you can't help and there is no cure.

EldritchCleavage Thu 25-Apr-13 11:06:24

Actually, don't try and bury it for your parents' sake. It's doing you no good at all. I would cut him off, not out of anger necessarily, but just to preserve your sanity. Given how he is and what he did to you, I don't think it is fair of your parents to expect you to have a relationship with him for their sakes. Understandable, but not fair.

LouiseSmith Thu 25-Apr-13 11:17:26

I think maybe he needs your support instead of your judgement.

If you were so worried you call always cook him a dinner.

Unfortunately chosenone there really isn't much you can do. he needs to be ready, and at the same time have access to suitable re-hab, which in this country is practically impossible without a 2 year wait.
Unless someone could afford for him to do it privately when he's ready

If you can't bear to see him, don't, if people try to talk to you about him, say you don't want to hear it. You cannot help.

same goes for your poor parents, but he's their boy, and it's not as easy for them.

good luck, it's hard I know.

Crinkle77 Thu 25-Apr-13 11:38:59

A lot of people do bin dipping. It is actually disgraceful that these companies are throwing away perfectly good food but as it has gone past its best before date it gets thrown. But the ashtray dipping is foul. But drug addiction is complicated and if it was that easy to give up then he would not be doing all this dipping. People will only give up when they are ready and no amount of coercion from family will persuade him

EldritchCleavage Thu 25-Apr-13 11:47:40

*I think maybe he needs your support instead of your judgement.
If you were so worried you call always cook him a dinner*

How unkind. And naive.

Saski Thu 25-Apr-13 20:32:33

I feel for you OP, and wish you all the best.

Anyone would be sad to see a family member eating out of trash cans. If they're doing it because they're a freegan, great, but freegans have a choice.

crashdoll Thu 25-Apr-13 20:43:27

And for all the posters who are berating the OP. TRY DEALING WITH HAVING AN ADDICT IN YOUR FAMILY

Been there, it is very painful. Please don't assume you know better than everyone else. Addiction can tear families apart and while I cannot and will never condone his behaviour, I still love my family member and I wouldn't want him to be without food.

Lovelygoldboots Thu 25-Apr-13 20:58:38

I have never once said I know better than anyone else! This is painful. For me and others. It does not take a lot to scratch the surface and try and help.

overprotection Thu 25-Apr-13 21:06:41

The horror of being from a well to-do family from an 'affluent' town and having a brother who takes needlessly wasted food from bins for free to save money.

I'm quite glad me and my partner come from scruffy backgrounds, it means now that we earn decent money we can still buy cheap stuff and save the extra without spending the whole time worrying about appearing suitably affluent to the locals.

reelingintheyears Thu 25-Apr-13 21:27:43

Nothing wrong with bin dipping,i have a friend who does it quite often,no drug issues.

We have had bags of perfectly good potatoes,veg and other stuff from his trips out.

All still well within date and good quality.

It is scandalous what supermarkets throw away.

Oh,and he often gets lovely wrapped bunches of flowers for his wife.

ThatVikRinA22 Thu 25-Apr-13 21:28:03

i dont think the issue is bin dipping really is it.....

im in police - addicts are hard work but hats off to your bro for not resorting to theft....unless he has. not many addicts havent tbh.

my own brother included.
i had more of an issue with his stupidity than his addiction.

reelingintheyears Thu 25-Apr-13 21:29:46

They often bin stuff within date to clear the shelves before bank hols and Easter/christmas so they can stock up with seasonal shite.

LynetteScavo Thu 25-Apr-13 21:33:08

He's an addict. He's desperate. "Normal" people spend their money on food not drugs, because they are not addicts.

I would hate to see my brother doing this. I can see why you are frustrated, disappointed and disgusted.

But I don't think bin dipping is the crime of the century . Wasting food while there are people hungry, for what ever reason is a bigger "crime".

I used to do this.

I wasn't a junkie. I was a very hungry teenager though. Behind bakeries is all ways good. If you've gotta eat, you've gotta eat!

LynetteScavo Thu 25-Apr-13 21:47:01

A very hungry teenager in a normal growing teenager kind of way, or one who wan't fed enough at home kind of way?

I know my DN and her friends did this at uni... in a hippy recycling, why not kind of way, rather than impoverished can't afford to eat kind of way. I wasn't disgusted when I found out....although it's not something I would readily do.

Wasn't living at home by that point, I/we were hungry and skint.

I don't understand what is so disgusting about it? Is it because the things have come out of a bin? We were always quite careful to only take things that were still wrapped up - and we were also pretty sure that some of the shops left the 'best' things on the top so you never had to dig too hard.

I think it's far more disgusting that all that food can be thrown away when there are thousands of children living in poverty in this country.

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