To be wary of this guys behaviour and what do I do / say?!

(165 Posts)
GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 14:00:15

Not a regular poster but I've recently had one date and could do with some input!! Am I unreasonable to be wary of this guy?! and what would you say to him?

Been single and plodding along for a while and got back in touch with an old childhood friend after bumping into him on a train (I'm starting to think you should never get back in touch ever haha). After about 3 weeks of chatting online, exchanging numbers, I thought he was all very much like me with same interests, humour etc so I okayed a date when he spontaneously asked if I wanted to meet him "tomorrow" after work for dinner; Now comes the downfall!

I organised myself to be free and met him on way home from work thinking as we're up the city we'd get a drink / food. Easy right? He suggests dinner at mine confused Flustered I say I haven't got much in need to do a shop and lets just get something to eat out. End up having rather awkward conversation - half flows well but other half of him going on a tangent about whatever he's talking about. Thought maybe it was just nerves as he's quite an intelligent man.

Automatically I pull out my purse as the bill arrives because It's just natural to me look up and he's very slowly looking like he's considering pulling out his wallet, so I just hand over my card and pay for it and have done with it. Then he starts exclaiming how no woman has ever paid for his meal and is all beaming at me.

Rather awkwardly he ends up coming back to mine for a drink... how I allowed this I don't know. I certainly didn't utter the words come back to mine! Over a cup of tea, we have yet more awkward conversation and luckily the tele is on to diffuse it a bit. I seemed to learn all about his ex partners and at quarter to 12 I'm wondering when he's going to piss off so I say "Don't you have work tomorrow" and he says "Yeah, I'll be fine" with no intent on going... So for the next couple of hours I'm saying "Tomorrows going to be hard to concentrate I'm knackered" he's still not taking the hint shock he leans in to kiss me and I laugh and back away, he tries several times whilst trying to get my bra off! I stand up and say right well I need some kip if I'm ever getting up tomorrow and his reply "I suppose I can get the nightbus". In a bid to just get rid of him I say "I'll drive you" so at 4am I drive him home eyes hanging out of my head.

Oddest "Date" I've ever had and so taken a back by the events unfolding i really don't think I was my usual assertive and upfront self. I thought my body language etc was quite obviously a "No, thanks". Clearly he didn't read any of these signs and has been texting non stop. I've limited replies to the odd polite one, but still he advances with all sorts of crap. In fact at 5:30am this morning he sent 8 consecutive messages! Even pictures of himself after the gym, the sky... To his sky I replied " nice view, mine is my pillows because It's 5 fucking thirty am and I'm sleeping!" he replied "trying to tempt me in to bed you little temptress?" shock

What on earth would you say to a bloke like this? I'm dumbfounded. My replies this week (if I've actually replied) have been sledgehammer blunt. He may be academically intelligent but he's a social retard... what the hell do I say?!

Dahlen Wed 24-Apr-13 14:03:40

You don't say anything. Just ignore. Eventually he'll get the hint.

monsterchild Wed 24-Apr-13 14:04:16

Good lord, I don't know what to say, but I'd keep hammering away with "I'm not interested in seeing you again" a few more times, then stop responding.

If he won't stop let him know it's harrassment.

I'm sure more posters who are more blunt than I am will be along, but whatever you do, don't meet again!

MrsClown1 Wed 24-Apr-13 14:04:45

Nothing - dont reply to his texts. He sounds incredibly creepy to me. If you engage with him you will give him hope so just ignore him.

HeathRobinson Wed 24-Apr-13 14:05:44

Block his number?

CocacolaMum Wed 24-Apr-13 14:06:00

what Dahlen said.

:D

ImTooHecsyForYourParty Wed 24-Apr-13 14:08:22

I don't want to see you again.

You don't actually have to say anything else! You don't need to justify yourself in any way.

I would say just ignore him, but he now knows where you live, so he may show up at your house if you just don't reply to him. So you are probably going to have to be very clear indeed.

Callisto Wed 24-Apr-13 14:09:00

Why on earth were you replying to all his texts though? Especially the 5.30am ones?

Personally, I think a 'fuck off' would probably suffice. And be more assertive next time. He really took the piss, don't get sucked in like that again.

Booboobedoo Wed 24-Apr-13 14:10:28

Turn your phone off at night.

Block his number (as suggested above).

Good luck: he sounds dreadful.

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 14:11:52

Even after ignoring him for 3 days he continued to send me messages all day long.

He even sent one saying he was at a pub and his friends wanted to know where I am and asked after me (people I do not know and have never met). I'm getting the feeling he thinks we are in a relationship.

Coca - I phoned E and they say they do not block numbers apparently.

Callisto - I thought replying was rather making it obvious. I'll be honest, I am worried about saying "Fuck off" because he does know where I live and I have received a few drunken "Your place is closer than mine wink" texts.

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 14:12:17

God he sounds like Percy from Blackadder.

Move house!

flippinada Wed 24-Apr-13 14:13:08

I don't think he's socially awkward at all, he's deliberately ignoring your very clear signals that you aren't interested and is pushing to see what he can get away with, which is actually pretty creepy. He's counting on you bring too nice to say fuck off.

Rather than ignore, I would suggest sending a final message saying something along the lines of "I'm not interested, please don't contact me again". If he persists, then repeat and threaten him with the police (if you do this you must be prepared to follow through) - this will be enough to deter the basically well meaning but socially inept types.

Tee2072 Wed 24-Apr-13 14:13:57

Tell him to fuck off to fuck off and then ignore everything he sends you from now on.

And next time, when it's time for someone to leave your house, stand up and say "Well, it's been nice, time for you to go." and open the door.

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 14:14:44

actually I think if you know anyone who knows him, get them to have a word.

If not, then you are going to have to be really blunt in a polite, but firm way - leave out the swearing as it clearly doesn't work! Just say, look, Quentin (or whatever he's called)

I'm sorry but after the night we spent together you're really not my type - and I've met someone who is, and I'm pursuing a relationship with them, so please could we call it a day.

Or something. Invent a boyfriend or a 6ft 10 brother.

somewhereaclockisticking Wed 24-Apr-13 14:15:47

You have to be very direct. Next message say I'm sorry but this isn't going to work out. It was lovely to see you after so long but I would rather we didn't see each other again. If he texts again block his number although of course (not wanting to worry you) but he knows where you live so if this guy has a bit of stakler attitude as it sounds like he does.... you may have to threaten to report him to the police. Some guys get the hint but just don't care that you're not interested and they just think if they keep at you, you'll give in for some peace. To have that attitude then it must have worked for them at some point in the past. You have to be blunt because they will use any sound of hesitation as a weakness - let's face it - he's obviously very attracted to you, you paid for his meal and then he thought he could get a bed for the night probably with a few extras thrown in. His thinking is he's onto a good thing here and won't take no for an answer unless it's rammed down his throat so to speak!

Send him this text. 'I do not want to see or hear from you again. Do not make any further attempts to contact me. If you do not leave me alone I will report you to the police for harassment.'
And when you have sent it, ring your local police on the non-emergency number, tell them that a man you have had one date with is pestering you and you are concerned that he might turn up on your doorstep and cause trouble.
He may fuck off, of course, but if he doesn't then the police will take a complaint seriously. They will have a word with him and if he continues to bother you, they will arrest him. It's OK to do this, if it becomes necessary. You don't owe this many anything.

fluffyraggies Wed 24-Apr-13 14:16:47

My replies this week (if I've actually replied) have been sledgehammer blunt.

What have you said to him to get rid OP?

If you've seriously told him bluntly not to contact you again i would be mentioning the police to him. Have you still got the texts you've sent him telling him to leave you alone?

AnneNonimous Wed 24-Apr-13 14:17:06

I'm a bit confused how you manage to carry the date on for so long when you felt it was awkward from the beginning? Maybe the fact that you had him over til 4am on your first date made him feel you were interested?!

He does still sound like a pain. Just tell him you are not interested. That's all he needs to know. Then ignore him.

Callisto Wed 24-Apr-13 14:18:22

Sorry, I didn't mean to come across as flippant with my 'fuck off'. If he really creeps you out and you have a bad feeling about him I would keep a copy of the texts that he is sending just in case you need to go to the police at some future point (really don't want to scare you here either, and it probably will just fizzle out). Blocking his number is fine, but sometimes it is better to know what a nutter like this is thinking.

I think the best advice is 'ignore, ignore, ignore' and hopefully you will never see him again.

lollilou Wed 24-Apr-13 14:19:39

And next time, NEVER let a man come back to yours on a first date.

ShortTermName Wed 24-Apr-13 14:20:40

Yes he sounds like a wierdo but it also sounds like you were unassertive and very unclear. As others have asked, have you actually said/texted the words "I don't want to see you again" or not? I get why you don't want to be rude but it sounds like you are being too polite and he is too fucked up to get the message. Plain speaking is called for.

Also, I hope you have learned some new ideas as to how to get rid of someone - having them stay till 4am is madness.

flippinada Wed 24-Apr-13 14:21:07

Please could we steer clear of implying OP is at fault for "allowing" this in any way? It's not her job to manage this mans behaviour.

Fillyjonk75 Wed 24-Apr-13 14:25:33

I would do as AnneNonimous says. And then report him to the police if he harasses you further.

AmberLeaf Wed 24-Apr-13 14:26:36

What Solidgoldbrass and flippinada said.

He knew you probably felt uncomfortable, but he relied on you being too polite to say 'go home'

Some men, unfortunately think that a date = sex.

You don't have to do anything you don't want to do, saying no isn't rude, it is exerting your free choice.

Fillyjonk75 Wed 24-Apr-13 14:26:41

Please could we steer clear of implying OP is at fault for "allowing" this in any way? It's not her job to manage this mans behaviour

Exactly. I hope to god some contributors here never appear on a jury at a rape trial.

Tailtwister Wed 24-Apr-13 14:26:53

Wow! Well, I guess it's not going to go any further from your side, so I would just bite the bullet and be blunt. Tell him straight that you don't want to see him again and hopefully that will be that. He seems to be the type who can't (or won't!) read any signals and he'll keep on and on if you don't make your position abundantly clear.

Good luck!

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:31:29

'I'm not interested in seeing you again. Don't contact me anymore. Bye.'

Block, block, block. He comes round, do not let him in. 'You don't understand or respect my personal boundaries so I'm not interested in seeing you anymore. Bye.'

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 14:32:37

Fluffy -

He has mentioned meeting up for dinner a few times etc I have said no in several ways. First polite, no thanks. Realising he doesn't get that I'm not interested I've said "Sorry, you're not really what I am looking for" in a hope to point out he's not date material. With more pestering I've said " I dont want to meet you for dinner... I dont want a date..." etc. I haven't been as abrasive as "fuck off" but I have begun to be abrasive with telling him he is annoying me and I dont appreciate his messages.

If this had been a random guy I'd never known before in my life it would have been thanks for dinner and depart. This seemed rather awkward because it was much like catching up with an old school friend and reminiscing, no spark but he made romantic advances. I really didn't know how to behave with him because I've never had a man behave in such a manner before. There were definitely no advances or come ons, on my part and I was definitely too polite in allowing him to outstay his welcome

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:32:42

X-post with SGB, who is too right.

lollilou Wed 24-Apr-13 14:33:04

Sorry but I do think for your own personal safety that allowing a stranger to come to your home late at night is not wise.

DreamingOfTheMaldives Wed 24-Apr-13 14:34:05

Definitely just keep being blunt with him. 'I don't want to see you again' and 'Stop texting me please' etc. Keep the text messages and if he persists after you have been blunt and it is blatantly obvious that you want to be left alone, perhaps ask a mutual friend to speak to him and then go to the police if he persists.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:35:08

'actually I think if you know anyone who knows him, get them to have a word.

If not, then you are going to have to be really blunt in a polite, but firm way - leave out the swearing as it clearly doesn't work! Just say, look, Quentin (or whatever he's called)

I'm sorry but after the night we spent together you're really not my type - and I've met someone who is, and I'm pursuing a relationship with them, so please could we call it a day.

Or something. Invent a boyfriend or a 6ft 10 brother.

Why? She's a grown woman who doesn't need to involve other people except the police. OP, you have nothing to apologise for. NO 'sorry' needed. Or lies, either.

And you don't need to be polite, either.

'Do not contact me anymore.'

estya Wed 24-Apr-13 14:36:14

8 texts at 5:30am are a worrying sign. Its kinda controlling because he must have been aware they would wake you up/keep you from going back to sleep.

DreamingOfTheMaldives Wed 24-Apr-13 14:36:29

Sorry, GlassofRose, X-post.

You have already been blunt with him. I would ask a mutual friend to have a word with him and then I would speak to the police.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:37:53

Asking a mutual friend to get involved only inflames the situation with people like these. I wouldn't want to get involved, either. WTF, the OP is an adult, not a damsel in distress.

This guy's a stalker.

What SGB says entirely.

WTFisABooyhooISBooyhoo Wed 24-Apr-13 14:38:29

honestly i would jsut be totally straight with him. he doesn't take hints.

text him saying " i dont want to see you again. i'm not interested. dont contact me again" and dont get into justifications when he starts with "why, we were getting on so well, give me another chance".

he isn't taking hints so tell him straight and dont worry about his feelings. he'll get over it.

flippinada Wed 24-Apr-13 14:41:10

That's how people like this work Glass - they push boundaries and use your niceness/good manners against you.

It's really ok to be rude to people like this.

GreenEggsAndNichts Wed 24-Apr-13 14:45:21

From the OP, he wasn't a complete stranger, he was a childhood friend she's reconnected with.

If you must send another response, make it along the lines of "I'm sorry, I'm not interested in going out with you again. See you around Facebook." (or whatever, assuming FB is where he crawled out from under) Don't mince words, just say it. And then never respond to another text. Any further responses to texts, even if it's one every few days, gives him hope of getting his foot in the door again, literally.

I realise my next comments are going to make some believe I'm blaming the victim, but I'm going to say it anyway: you're dating again. Please be aware and firm with men who presume to be invited back to your house. You say you aren't sure how it happened; he sounds like the sort who is well-schooled in talking his way in the door. If it's a first date, take cabs, meet there, whatever, but have a firm end to the evening on neutral territory. This will also help avoid the 'he knows where I live' thing.

(I also feel like I should repeat for some, if she had been raped or something I certainly would NOT be blaming her for allowing him in the house. hmm This is standard advice I'd give to any friend meeting someone on a first date. Thankfully, the main reason for this advice is not to avoid sexual assault, but just to avoid having to deal with an irritating date longer than you have to.)

GreenEggsAndNichts Wed 24-Apr-13 14:46:30

Sorry, just saw SGB's text. Looks good to me.

Be firm, do not respond to follow-up texts.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:46:44

He doesn't take hints because he thinks he is right and you are here to do what he wants.

It's not on.

'I do not want you to contact me anymore.'

Shinigami Wed 24-Apr-13 14:48:00

Exactly Flippinada. Rudeness is the only thing they understand.

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 14:48:01

This guy is someone I was childhood friends with from 4 - 10. My family moved and never stayed in contact. It was by chance I bumped into him on the tube. He became facebook friends with me (I'm starting believe the evils of that thing) and thats how we got chatting. We don't really have mutual friends because I can't really say that I have friends in my circle that I made as a small child in primary school so getting someone else to chat to him isn't even an option.

In some ways he seemed a stranger, but he's also that boy I was friends with in primary school. Any other Tom, Dick or Harry wouldn't have made it through my front door. He seemed "safe" if that makes sense because there was some familiarity. He's no idiot, he's actually a lawyer which is why at first he was doing nervous gibbering rather than being an actual nut job. Now I have the feeling I need to be very careful.

I think I'm going to think about what to write and send him a text. The calling the police is something I think I need to do. Hopefully they wont think I'm wasting their time.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:48:05

No sorry and please delete him from FB if you have it!

You have told him no dates and now he is stalking.

I'd ring non-emergency and make the police aware.

Keep all these texts, too.

AmberLeaf Wed 24-Apr-13 14:49:41

The police won't think you are wasting their time, Im sure they will have dealt with his type many times.

DreamingOfTheMaldives Wed 24-Apr-13 14:50:07

Expat - I'm fully aware that the OP is an adult and not a damsel in distress; I wasn't suggesting that she ask a male friend to come running to her aid and go and have a strong word with him!! I just thought that perhaps a mutual friend (of either sex) would make this thick skinned idiot realise that he has gone too far, his advances are not welcome, and that it isn't just the OP being over sensitive (I'm certainly not suggesting she is) and that he needs to leave her alone.

Some people don't want to involve the police and getting someone else to have a word with him to let him know his behaviour is far from acceptable is another option at this stage.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 14:51:20

'The calling the police is something I think I need to do. Hopefully they wont think I'm wasting their time.'

They won't, especially once they see this log of texts he's been sending and his refusal to take no for an answer.

GreenEggsAndNichts Wed 24-Apr-13 14:52:32

Don't worry Glass, they won't think you're wasting their time. Show them the texts, get it all noted.

You're right expat, now that I've read everything more carefully, it's best to be as blunt as possible with him. I'm usually in the 'no apologies' camp, too; I think I allowed this one because she knew him in a previous liftetime.

I think it's time to send one very blunt text, not a joke and not an insinuation, and do not follow it up with any further explanations.

AmberLeaf Wed 24-Apr-13 14:52:56

They won't think you are making a fuss over nothing either, just in case you are worried about that aspect. He has crossed over into stalker territory and needs dealing with accordingly.

DreamingOfTheMaldives Wed 24-Apr-13 14:56:33

Doh, X-post again GlassofRose!

You are understandably feeling very uncomfortable and concerned about this man. You can speak to the police about his behaviour and he will be given a harassment warning notice about it; it formally lets him know that his attention is unwelcome and is causing you distress. That way, if he persists, the police can then take action against him as he cannot claim not to know it was bothering you/unwelcome.

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 15:01:36

"he's actually a lawyer which is why at first he was doing nervous gibbering rather than being an actual nut job."

Was meant to read:

That is why at first I just thought his random behaviour/talking was nerves rather than him being a nut job.

Sorry for crappy quick posts.

Thank you for the support smile

I didn't know that police would hand out harassment warnings, thank you dreaming.

Trying to construct the message now. I did start thinking "It was nice to see and old school friend but..." however I really think you're all right, no niceties should be included

CautionaryWhale Wed 24-Apr-13 15:04:24

Do not bother with social niceties - he hasn't.

Block on facebook - this must send some message.
Log all / any further contacts - time date etc if able to, set up email to store his twattery in a folder but bounces a reply that not received? (is this doable)
Say quite clearly Do not ever contact me again if he calls or sends a leery text - then if he continues to text keep them/log them for police
Pop into local police and explain what you are doing and why - you can do this now or wait until you have evidence that he is continuing to harass but stay safe in the meantime (door lock chain fitted or spyhole/phone pn ansamachine to rtecord the twat/vet calls/take care in carparks etc the usual)

GOOD LUCK X

GoSuckEggs Wed 24-Apr-13 15:04:34

He sounds nuts! do inform police.

MansView Wed 24-Apr-13 15:20:42

yeah, you need to tell him that you're not interested...he seems very creepy... sad

Crinkle77 Wed 24-Apr-13 15:24:15

The only thing you can do is be blunt and say you are not interested then if he still persists get his number blocked. What a horrible experience for you.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 15:30:08

'I am not interested in you. Do not contact me any further.'

Then block. Don't wait and see if he pings back. Just get rid. Block any other contact details. If he knows where you work, make sure they know, too, so he doesn't try to contact you there somehow.

Ring police on non-emergency number.

He is intelligent enough to understand boundaries, he just doesn't think yours count for shit. That's what stalking is.

fluffyraggies Wed 24-Apr-13 15:35:53

Bit late now as you've probably written it already but good luck, and yes, be blunt. A bloke you knew from 4 - 10 is a stranger.

I hope it wont come to it, but have it in your mind that this is the text that you can show the police as an unarguable ''i don't want to see you again - leave me alone'' text.

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 16:26:41

Expat, I was offering her an alternative to the blunt approach in case she is worried he might get aggressive in response.

when you have got someone of this calibre on your case you do whatever they will understand, whatever will make them leave you alone and that includes lying if necessary.

Now I have seen her further posts I think it's probably gone too far for anything but the police...I wonder if he has MH issues/ some kind of disorder. This behaviour is NOT normal.

LarvalFormOfOddSock Wed 24-Apr-13 16:48:30

OP, some sensible advice on here but I'd also add that I think it would be a good idea to save the texts and keep a record of every kind of contact he tries to make.
I really hope that you never need to use it but should things escalate, you will get better support and more prompt action from police if you have the evidence all there to hand.
I hope it stops soon. Of course YANBU to be wary.

LarvalFormOfOddSock Wed 24-Apr-13 16:50:14

Oh, sorry, I just realised CautionaryWhale already said that. Anyway, she's right!

Isabeller Wed 24-Apr-13 16:59:18

It sounds like you have already said all you need to say.

I have changed phone number to make cutting contact possible. It was difficult and rather inconvenient but made it impossible for the person to contact me so I was free of the interference and didn't get triggered to worry about it every time there was a message.

It wasn't fair having to but was fairer on my nerves in the end.

Good luck.

ladythatlunches Wed 24-Apr-13 17:27:50

Could you maybe say
' it was a nice catch up and seeing a old friend. Just hope you didn't think it would be anymore. Ive started seeing someone so thank you for offer of going out etc but things are going really well. Nice seeing you take care.

Nice polite to point?

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 17:43:36

'Could you maybe say
' it was a nice catch up and seeing a old friend. Just hope you didn't think it would be anymore. Ive started seeing someone so thank you for offer of going out etc but things are going really well. Nice seeing you take care.

Nice polite to point?'

Read the entire thread, the time for nicey nice is long gone. In fact, the time for nicey nice was gone with the first date when he tried to press to go to her house.

And WTF? All this nice seeing you, nice catch up, take care and lies about seeing someone else? Bullshit. She did not enjoy the date, there was nothing nice about it. And nothing nice about his behaviour at all.

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 18:05:35

That's not the point though, with respect Expat. She doesn't owe him honesty either.

These are all suggestions, she can choose which she thinks will be the most effective at getting rid of the twat. No one is saying she has to lie - just that it is an option if she thinks it will work better for her.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 18:09:31

'That's not the point though, with respect Expat. She doesn't owe him honesty either.'

She doesn't owe him FA. But since he is stalking her, and she feels it's time to notify the police, the time for nicey nice, oh, thank you is over.

If she doesn't care to tell him to go away, then it's best to answer with nothing besides a note from the police.

FAR, far too many women become victims of individuals who don't respect their boundaries because they are conditioned to be 'nice' and 'polite', don't make a fuss, etc and even come in for blame when they encounter a stalker or an abuser, as well evinced on this thread.

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 18:12:11

true.

AmberLeaf Wed 24-Apr-13 18:28:18

Yes, there is no requirement to be nice!

Why would you be nice to someone who was being, quite frankly, monstrous to you?

It wasn't nice seeing him, he isn't an old friend, or any sort of friend, he is a pest.

Someone like this man would have a field day reading into the text you suggested ladythatlunches.

'Do not contact me again' is sufficient.

thistlelicker Wed 24-Apr-13 18:28:25

How
Have u got on op?

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 18:35:02

I think sometimes if you're not nice it can escalate and then they turn into proper bastards instead of hidden behind niceties style bastards.

I for one find it very hard to cope with aggression in the outright form

also some men WAIT for you to get angry because they enjoy it

and then they can blame it all on you

Nothing wrong with being assertive but it can be turned around - I prefer to act very calm and unfussed and polite, because then they don't get the gratification of an argument.

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 18:35:49

can you tell I have been there before. <sigh>

OrlaKiely Wed 24-Apr-13 18:36:56

I mean like this:

Man: pester pester pester flirt pester pester ignore wishes pester pester

Woman: PISS OFF

Man: Ah! I told you you were a bitch!

ReluctantlyBeingYoniMassaged Wed 24-Apr-13 18:41:32

Texts at 5.30am are the sign of an inconsiderate twat.

Smartieaddict Wed 24-Apr-13 18:50:47

I would send him one more message saying you don't want any more contact from him, and that if you hear from him again you will be contacting the police. Then if he doesn't give up, ring 101 and report it. As others have said keep all the texts. Hopefully the threat of the police will be enough for him, but if not they certainly won't think you are wasting their time.

AmberLeaf Wed 24-Apr-13 18:51:52

It doesn't matter if they call you/think of you as a bitch though!

I prefer to act very calm and unfussed and polite, because then they don't get the gratification of an argument

Maybe, if it is an argument they are looking for, but more likely it is that they are looking for a passive women too polite to assert herself when being bullied for fear of being thought a 'bitch' or thought 'not nice'.

I think sometimes if you're not nice it can escalate and then they turn into proper bastards instead of hidden behind niceties style bastards

They are bastards either way. A bastard is a bastard.

This thread shows that things can and often do escalate even when you are nice.

The problem is not how nice/not nice a woman is, the problem is men who are sex pests and stalkers.

It isn't about a womans behavior at all, it is about the man that does this sort of thing, the same as a woman isn't raped because she wore a short skirt or a nuns habit, she is raped, because she came into contact with a rapist.

In situations like this, nice is way over rated.

hollyisalovelyname Wed 24-Apr-13 19:00:18

Could he be on the autistic spectrum?

AmberLeaf Wed 24-Apr-13 19:11:02

Seriously? hmm

He sounds like the typical, boundary stepping, doesn't care about what the OP wants, sex pest stalker to me. those things don't = autistic.

He could be autistic, but it wouldn't matter either way, he is stalking the OP and he needs to stop.

Hi OP.

When you were a child did you ever explore rock pools at the seaside? If you did do you remember the limpets that cling to the rocks? If you treat a limpet gently, try to ease it off the rock a bit at a time, push it a bit and pull it a bit it clings so tightly that you have no chance at all of loosening it's grip. The only way to get a limpet off a rock is to give it a sharp, unexpected blow...no pussyfooting about, just one swift kick and off it comes.

The same applies to unwanted suitors.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 19:29:27

What Amberleaf said.

There is nothing impolite about, 'I am not interested in you. Do not contact me any further,' when a person refuses to take a hint and will not go away. 8 texts in a row at 5.30AM?! Constant texts otherwise?

This is not about her behaviour, it's about his, being a person who does not respect her boundaries and stalks her. And a lot of times, people like this do not realise what they are, the same way some rapists do not, because they are self-centred twats who think what they want supercedes everyone and everything else.

ImTooHecsyForYourParty Wed 24-Apr-13 19:58:20

My sons are on the autistic spectrum and they understand 'I don't want to see you again'.

There's nothing about having autism at a level that means you can talk, live independently and hold down a job as a lawyer that means you cannot understand that when someone tells you they don't want to see you again - that means they don't want to see you again

If you are so severely autistic that you don't understand language - you are likely to be living in supported accommodation, with a support worker.

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 20:23:56

Thank you for all of your responses!

To whoever it was that mentioned autism: He's not autistic; as children we were quite similar as we were quite grown up for our age and had different eclectic tastes compared to other children and it was indeed our mutual tastes that sparked this meet up. However, A couple of years back I actually worked with children under the autistic spectrum and I see why you've asked. In fact I did wonder at first if he had a problem with other peoples signals as he did seem a bit socially awkward. The continued ignorance and vanity of sending me pictures of his legs because he's off for a run, or himself in the bloody bath, or the fact he ignores quite obvious rejection says twat to me.

I haven't yet contacted the police, I'm not sure I need to!

Messaged him tonight, assertive and appeal to the fact he's a lawyer who probably doesn't need any hassle from police:

I didn't at all enjoy the date and your behaviour then and since has been unacceptable. I don't wish to date you, go out for meals, catch up, keep in touch or even so much as bump into you. Please do not contact me anymore. Just to clarify where I stand:I shall be notifying the police of your behaviour which constitutes as harassment.

No reply!!! fingers crossed

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 20:27:57

That is pretty clear, Glass! Good on you! Now I hope he backs the fuck off and leaves you alone.

Borntobeamum Wed 24-Apr-13 20:32:25

Can I urge you to tell a real life friend too.
It's unlikely he will make a pest of himself after that text, but please log it somewhere if you choose not to notify the police x

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 20:42:53

Thank you,

I have told a friend who knew about the date, hadn't told her how bad it was until now out of embarrassment. She did a bit of a WTF, but at him and not me thankfully.

LessMissAbs Wed 24-Apr-13 20:46:44

What an odd, odd man!

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 20:48:12

If she had done it at you, she wouldn't have been a true friend. smile Glad you have some support IRL, too.

ShipwreckedAndComatose Wed 24-Apr-13 20:49:42

Wow! He sounds like a total jerk!

I worked with someone like this. He had decided that unless a woman actually said 'no'! Then she obviously meant 'yes!'

So, he would back off if told but most women never said no outright as they thought it was too rude and unnecessarily blunt.

Sometimes, Blunt is the only way to be!

ShipwreckedAndComatose Wed 24-Apr-13 20:51:43

'Sex pest stalker' is dead right, btw, Amberleaf!

FanjoForTheMammaries Wed 24-Apr-13 20:55:03

He sounds like a creepy arse..not autistic

ImperialBlether Wed 24-Apr-13 21:09:35

I read all that with my mouth wide open. What kind of man asks you out for dinner then expects you to cook it and lets you pay for it? It was his idea!

I can see why you took him home (only way to get him out of the house) but fucking hell, again, what kind of a man would let someone take him home at 4 am and then send texts at 5.30, despite knowing she's desperate for sleep?

This man is a lunatic. Your final message to him was very brave and to the point. You must have been at your wits' end. I would log it with the police just in case he turns up at your house. If he does, it'll be proof he has real problems, so please don't answer the door.

walesdaff Wed 24-Apr-13 21:25:25

You should not have invited him back most men see this as a come on (annoying but true). Just ignore him.

GlassofRose Wed 24-Apr-13 21:36:55

Walesdaff - I didn't invite at all! He got on the tube with me and never got off at his stop... very very very very awkward weird. I had no idea what to say! I thought perhaps because I said I had nothing to eat at home so lets eat out made him think he was still welcome at my home?! I don't know.

Imperial - perhaps you're right, safer than sorry to just log it. I wouldn't answer the door, I wouldn't even like to imagine what could happen.

JudgeJodie Wed 24-Apr-13 22:01:45

Well that text can't be misunderstood! Well done OP.
not sure if anyone has mentioned, but I am sure that lawyers etc have a professional standard to maintain even away from work. He would probably get more grief from whatever professional body he is a member of than the police, who tbf, may have a word with him but would be limited in what they could actually do at this stage.
Worth bearing in mind, but hopefully this will be a story to look back, laugh at and learn from!

DoctorAnge Wed 24-Apr-13 22:47:46

Good for you OP. I hope you never see this little twerp again.
Expat your posts have been spot on here. Lots of good advice.

expatinscotland Wed 24-Apr-13 23:54:40

It does not matter what you did, Glass. No means no. I have taught both my daughter and son this and put it into practice, when it comes to their bodies and personal space, and those of others, no means no and no other answer is acceptable and the wrong is always on the part of the one who does not respect that and my son, age 4, likely autistic as well. He fully understands.

Do you have children? I have a daughter left to me. Only one, her sister is dead. I teach both her and my son that their person is their own, and they are entitled to do what they will with it so long as they harm no other. And to countenance only similar behaviour. One who does not respect who they are and their person deserves nothing but to get gone.

You are some mother's daughter. You are special to her, vital to her.

There are 7bn people in this world. Life is too short to waste time of fuckwits who do not care enough about you to respect your boundaries of space and comfort.

AnAirOfHope Thu 25-Apr-13 00:32:11

I think you need to let the police know and log it anyway but hoping the txt works.

Could you get a personal alarm off the police just in case and make sure you can see who is at your door or get a lock? Also keep your phone by you at all times for a few weeks. Take care of your self and good luck. He sounds like a nut job.

OrlaKiely Thu 25-Apr-13 07:14:55

Just want to clarify that I'm in NO way trying to make it about her behaviour...I don't believe that and I wasn't trying to say that.

I was thinking of it from the OP's point of view, in terms of what she was most comfortable with and what she thought would get her the results she wants without some kind of backlash.

Which wouldn't be her fault if it happened.

I hope this makes sense. I would HATE to be thought to be blaming her in any way for anything he might do.

OrlaKiely Thu 25-Apr-13 07:17:38

and in fact the OP WAS polite. She kept her cool while stating the facts and informing him of her position.

I don't see the problem with that.

Lazyjaney Thu 25-Apr-13 07:43:12

Sounds like he either cant read signals well or deliberately pushes boundaries, hard to tell - but not paying at least half is a definite alarm bell anyway.

LottieJenkins Thu 25-Apr-13 08:07:35

Another vote here for contacting the police..............I had a similar experience a few years ago. A guy took me out twice and then decided to tell me he had a gf so i told him to get on his bike. forward a few weeks and I was very ill on the sofa with a lung infection. He decided to ring me at 4pm when he had spent all lunchtime in the pub. I told him to get lost and slammed the phone down. Two hours later he started texting me with "i love you" "i miss you" "i want you back" I told him to leave me alone and he carried on and totally freaked me out. I rang the police for advice and they said they could issue a harrasment warning order as he had continued after i had asked him to stop.....I decided to see what happened that night and i never heard from him again thankfully!

PurplePidjin Thu 25-Apr-13 08:28:11

To all the posters asking if this man has some kind of social communication or autistic spectrum disorder...

No, this man is merely a monumental twat. The markers for Autism do not mean a person acts like a sex pest and potential rapist, nor does it make a person act selfish, entitled or narcissistic. Please don't muddle the two.

OP, good luck. You've been advised by better people than me and i hope he buggers off pronto!

seeker Thu 25-Apr-13 08:42:40

You have told the police, haven't you, OP?

ladythatlunches Thu 25-Apr-13 09:18:58

My message was a idea.

Men like this cab be very nasty. Without the pokice involved abd considering he knows where she lives I thought her saying she was with someone else would make him back off!!!

Like I said a idea. Op obviously doesn't need to take my advice. I have never been in this situation and would find it very frightening hence the nice approach in hoping not to piss him off before police were involved.

ladythatlunches Thu 25-Apr-13 09:19:28

Nasty and police* bladdy iphone

TheBigJessie Thu 25-Apr-13 09:21:31

That's not autism. No way. For godlets' sake.

A man who was incapable of understanding fairly simple social signals like this: "Don't you have work tomorrow" and he says "Yeah, I'll be fine" with no intent on going... would be having difficulties functioning as a lawyer.

If he'd become a lawyer despite that, he would most likely have been diagnosed by now as an adult. An Aspie intelligent enough to be a lawyer is one who would then ask the OP if she meant, "I'm really tired" in a polite way.

As it happened, the OP, actually then did express herself literally, and he still ignored it. So for the next couple of hours I'm saying "Tomorrows going to be hard to concentrate I'm knackered" he's still not taking the hint

He's a selfish git. It is possible he has ASD as well, because many people do, but the fundamental issue is that he's a nasty git.

wellthatsdoneit Thu 25-Apr-13 09:23:02

I thought that was a really well worded email OP. Hope that's the last you hear from this arsehole.

Bluebell99 Thu 25-Apr-13 09:41:10

I'm struggling to think how you would recognise someone on a tube that you hadn't seen since you were ten! I don't think I would recognise adults that I had last known as a child, how did that initial meeting go? Also how do you know he really is a lawyer?

2rebecca Thu 25-Apr-13 09:55:17

Hopefully he'll clear off now. He sounds very bad at interpreting social signs but if I had a bloke in my house I wanted rid of I wouldn't go on about how tired I was but would say "I have work tomorrow and am tired so it's time for you to go goodbye". Also you don't have to invite a man into your house just because he has followed you home.
If he continues to harrass you after the clear email then phone the police but if you were responding to his texts in the middle of the night he maybe thought you were interested. Next time turn your mobile off when you go to bed and don't reply immediately to texts from men you aren't interested in.

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 09:58:06

Bluebell -

He looks like the adult version of his child self. I however think I look nothing like my ten year old self but he insists I do. On the tube I spotted him asleep on a chair and I laughed thinking that looks exactly like what's his name. See same guy on the train a few few times but thought nothing of it until I got a message from him on Facebook saying "is it you I've been seeing on the tube?!" I accepted his friend request and we got chatting.

The reason I'm sure that his lawyer status isn't fake is the lovely social work network LinkedIn... Which reminds me to go delete him off there. Hopefully I shouldn't bump into him too often because I work freelance.

Not reported to police yet, still humming and ahhing because I've had no contact since I sent the message thankfully

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 10:19:24

As a grown woman I'm well aware I don't have to let anybody I don't want in my home.

I never recall saying I responded immediately to his texts, what I do believe I said was that if I did respond to his texts at all then it wasn't in a positive inviting manner.

He outstayed his welcome, at the time I was rather taken aback and dumbfounded by his behaviour throughout the night which is why I wasn't as blatant and rude as suggested. Usually I'm an assertive, take no shit kind of woman. So it's very easy to say what you would do until you're actually confronted with a situation that quite frankly leaves you a little speechless and unnerved.

At the time and yesterday I was wondering whether he was just a bit of a socially awkward person, so I posted on here to get opinion from people who have no bias. Thinking about it, if I had said the "it's time for you to go" I'm not sure it would have gone any differently than it actually did because I'm inclined to believe he is a pig

Alwayscheerful Thu 25-Apr-13 10:36:52

Bluebell - good question how does OP know he is a lawyer?
So far as recognising him goes, I agree that is quite possible. I can recognise adults. Went to infant school with and I can also recognise toddlers I looked after in a Playgroup/nursery when they we're 2/3 and they are adults now.

ladythatlunches Thu 25-Apr-13 11:41:30

I agree with you glassofrose. Very hard to say what you would do until you are in that situation.

I would probably done the same im not very confrontational and never would of saod can you go now. I would of gone for the subtle hints. Dont beat your self up over it op.

He may of backed off now. Hopefully that will be the end. But if he really doesn't get it after you emailing him I think going down the police route is the only option.

redwellybluewelly Thu 25-Apr-13 11:43:47

Please don't use the word retard - in any context

It brings you down to his level.

LessMissAbs Thu 25-Apr-13 11:49:17

Well the Law Society should have a list online of solicitors with current practising certificates (I take it he is not a barrister), so it should be a simple matter of checking online to see if he is telling the truth about that if not. Might be a good idea from a personal security point of view to see whether he is a bit of a fantasist or not although I do know plenty of male arses of lawyers who have little in the way of social skills whom I could imagine behaving just like that

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 12:01:32

FFS.

I find myself getting very annoyed with posters now. Why are you questioning this woman? Do you not think that men can act like wankers?

All this cross-questioning and amateur sleuthdom gets on my fecking tits.

And I also have a HUGE problem with the way terms such as "retard", "autism" and "ASD" are being bandied about on this thread. Next thing you know someone will accuse him or the OP of suffering from a mental health issue.

Sometimes it's not so much what the OP posts but the responses to it that makes me fucking despair of the ignorance of humanity.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 25-Apr-13 12:17:51

Wow I missed the glaring "social retard" phrase in the OP.

Not a great phrase.

The man just sounds pushy and creepy and worth giving a wide berth

firesidechat Thu 25-Apr-13 12:19:56

Bluebell, so pleased that you asked that. Not because I didn't believe the OP, I do, but because I wouldn't recognise a single school friend and certainly not one that was 10 when I last saw them. It made me feel a bit inadequate and antisocial.

In my defence we did move around alot and it was a very long time ago for me.

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 12:30:58

Shit.

GlassofRose the word 'retard' is highly offensive and is prolifically used as an insult against people who have learning difficulties. Please do not use it again. Ignorance is no excuse to resort to such offensive terms.

To educate: Neither ASD nor Autism automatically turns people into stalkers. Having little social awareness is one thing, being a dick is quite another. It is wholly unacceptable to ignorantly suggest that such a dick might have either of these conditions. I suggest you educate yourselves more thoroughly so you don't have to resort to making such ill-informed comments again.

Victim blaming - It doesn't matter how polite her texts are, how she was dressed, whether she invited him back to hers or not, she is not responsible for the way he behaves. If someone burgles your home are you to blame for not surrounding with a steel fence and barbed wire? She knew the man from her childhood, she was put in an awkward situation and largely acted out of politeness. He took full advantage of that. Therefore he is the dick.

If you don't believe the OP then kindly report the thread rather than cast aspersions on it.

seeker Thu 25-Apr-13 12:36:17

But even though the OP did use the retard, she is still not responsible for the actions of this man.

Either believe or report. Stop the bloody speculation. It's just horrible. Alll this over-the-garden-fence curtain twitching stuff.

FanjoForTheMammaries Thu 25-Apr-13 12:42:49

I believe her. .have met a few men like this

firesidechat Thu 25-Apr-13 12:48:23

I didn't read anyone as saying that they don't believe the OP. It all rings horribly true to me.

However I was genuinely curious about how she recognised him because I'm completely rubbish at recalling my childhood friends and constantly embarrassed that I don't recognise old faces.

Hope that's the last you hear from him.

flippinada Thu 25-Apr-13 12:51:28

What Rhubarb (and others) have said.

He's behaved like a horrible creepy sex pest, he's entirely in the wrong.

That's it.

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 12:52:26

seeker - was that addressed to me? I presume not as a large part of my post goes on about how she is not responsible for the choices he makes.

I think her current course of action is the best one for her. She has sent him a very blunt message indicating that her next course of action would be the police. She has told a friend and fully intends to inform the police should he respond to that message. So far he hasn't.

If she wanted to choose a course of action which is best for womankind, it would be to report it because if he behaves this way with you then chances are that he is a dick to all women he dates. Your report might stop him in his tracks or at least, if he does harrass another woman your report will help provide additional evidence against him.

I always fear that men who push their luck this way will end up taking full advantage of a woman one day. If these so-called 'minor' incidents were reported then it does make the job of prosecution so much easier.

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 13:00:59

Oh my...

Yes, I did call him a social retard. Did I mean to cause offence to anyone on this board? No. Did I mean to insult anyone with special needs/ learning difficulties? No.

I'm not "Ignorant". I spent 4 years of my life working with children who had a range of named disorders/needs that deemed them as having special education needs. The children I supported in education were ranging from deaf to having global delay and Autistic spectrum disorders. I wouldn't use the R word to describe any of those children neither would I compare them to the excuse for a man I had one awful date with.

On second thoughts I perhaps should have worded my post different but It was a quickly wrote spill of the guts and I quite frankly I didn't sit and think whether I'd be insulting others or even think people would think I was comparing the fucking whack job to anyone with genuine special needs or disordered behaviour.

So if I did insult anyone, I'm sorry. I didn't intend to and there was no venom in my post or mocking of special needs etc.

As for recognising him or recognising old faces - perhaps I'm not as old as some of you? (Obviously once again no offence meant). Perhaps I have a better memory?

As for checking whether he is a genuine lawyer? For what purpose. I've seen his graduation photos, bumped into him on his way home from the city and seen where he works as we were connected on LinkedIn.

Now if you don't believe me, that's fine. I came here for some genuine opinion because I had twat who wouldn't leave me alone. Thank you to those of you with genuine advice and concern.

seeker Thu 25-Apr-13 13:01:32

No, it was directed at the mumsnet sleuths and the victim blamers. I was worried that the tide was starting to turn, so I wanted to add my tuppenceworth. Some people only need to find a chink and they are in there like cut price Poirots.

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 13:05:15

I always fear that men who push their luck this way will end up taking full advantage of a woman one day. If these so-called 'minor' incidents
were reported then it does make the job of prosecution so much easier

Thank you for that rhubarb, I never thought of it in that way. I shall actually pop into the local station and do this and just show them my phone.

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 13:08:05

OP I realise you didn't post the word 'retard' to cause offence but I'm surprised you still thought to use it given your revealed background. I too have worked with children who have had various forms of learning and physical difficulties and I have a brother who also has severe learning difficulties. I am fully aware of the offensive nature of that word. I'm just surprised that you are not. But I do accept that you did not mean offence. Sometimes out of haste we fail to engage our brains.

As for the rest of your post. Well said and fair enough. You should not have to face cross-questioning on a post clearly asking for advice. Some people have far too much time on their hands.

If anyone wants to see the damage that internet amateur sleuthing can do just go and see the Reddit images pored over by such detectives in the aftermath of the Boston bombing where Asian looking men have been circled and indicated as suspects because they were a) alone and b) "brown".

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 13:10:28

GlassofRose well done, you might just save another woman from being harrassed in this way or help to nail him if he does push the boundaries even further.

EldritchCleavage Thu 25-Apr-13 13:12:58

All this cross-questioning and amateur sleuthdom gets on my fecking tits
cut-price Poirots

Oh blimey yes.

MikeOxard Thu 25-Apr-13 13:16:15

great message OP, subtle messages were not working, hopefully this has done the trick. well done. smile

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 13:19:16

rhubarb - Completely understand. I do see why it would cause offence and why you wouldn't use it. Like you I have relatives with learning difficulties, some in assisted care homes - wouldn't dream of using the word to describe anyone with any needs/difficulties or even compare this idiot to them. What an insult to them that will be. I suppose I amounted the word retard to idiot rather than special needs but I'll say no more on it; No offence was intended to anyone.

For those of you questioning his lawyer credentials: I've just been on to LinkedIn to delete our connection and he's listed as being a paralegal so he has indeed been hamming it up.

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 13:23:38

Paralegal? He offers services to the supernatural?

EldritchCleavage Thu 25-Apr-13 13:27:06

Well, he is almost certainly fully legally qualified. There's a lot of competition even to be a City paralegal nowadays.

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 13:28:16

Not quite the big I am he made out though.

LessMissAbs Thu 25-Apr-13 13:47:08

As for checking whether he is a genuine lawyer? For what purpose. I've seen his graduation photos, bumped into him on his way home from the city and seen where he works as we were connected on LinkedIn

Because you're already on the internet and it takes about two minutes on the Law Society's site (set up for that very purpose) to check.

Because men who behave in such an odd manner tend also to be liars and fantasists and since you have already expressed concern over the fact that he knows where you live, personally I'd want to arm myself with as much information as possible.

Sorry I suggested it though.

Pigsmummy Thu 25-Apr-13 13:47:37

I am confused as to why people are questioning if he is a lawyer? What does it matter? He behaved like an eejit and became a pest, I think that the message to him about contacting the police should do the trick, also blocking him on FB and linkedin.

I was in a similar position, also in London and a threat of the police did the job, when the guy started calling my work (annoying colleagues as I wasn't office based) I knew that I had to act. The police said that they could contact him just to say that they had received a call from me about his behaviour but it didn't come to that, (they can make that call to his mobile) just the threat worked.

Incidentally I would also recognise someone from primary school now, would strike up conversion and would probably feel safer with them than a random date, so don't beat yourself up about that.

LessMissAbs Thu 25-Apr-13 13:51:06

Oh right. Posted before I saw the update about him being a paralegal. He might have a law degree (of some kind) but unless he is a practising solicitor, it would be a bit unusual to describe himself as a lawyer, which is generally taken to mean solicitors, barristers, academic lawyers and prosecutors. Not paralegals.

A paralegal does not require the LLB degree, as all the above (mostly) do. I'm not even sure that all paralegals require degrees. There are some solicitors who work as paralegals after being struck off.

GreenEggsAndNichts Thu 25-Apr-13 14:07:21

Of course there are men out there who act like this. I'm shocked that people are questioning this. Hell, I've known more than a couple, myself, and I didn't even date much before meeting DH.

I'm glad you sent the text, and hopefully that's the end of it. smile

THERhubarb Thu 25-Apr-13 14:19:54

I once had a date with a bloke I knew who was a friend of my friends. This bloke was a copper and seemed charming enough, everyone in my circle of friends knew him so when he asked me on a date I agreed.

We spent the entire evening watching all bloody 3 Star Wars movies - no kisses, no cuddles, no drinks just him telling me nerdy snippets about each movie.

Another bloke was at Uni and I used to meet him in his room where we'd sit side by side listening to his U2 album. I fell for his Irish accent but my goodness the bloke was a complete bore. After 2 weeks we hadn't got further than holding hands and he never wanted to go out anywhere. Just sitting in his room listening to his music was excitement enough for him I think.

Then there was the bloke whose chat up line was "I've been watching you for some time now...."

Oh and an old friend of dh's, on meeting me for the first time actually shook dh's hand and said in front of me "she's a nice catch, where'd you get her from?"

lollilou Thu 25-Apr-13 14:27:35

Please don't think I was victim blaming in my posts. It's just I have done this (let a man come back to my house) it wasn't good but could've been a whole lot worse.

GlassofRose Thu 25-Apr-13 17:25:47

rhubarb - you half quoted my night there... He sat there lip synching the big bang theory prior to trying to get intimate with me on the sofa.

Well I still haven't heard from him which is a relief!

Well done OP, excellent message and it will hopefully keep him away.
I can see why you were less quick to go 'fuck off nutter' than you might have been in that someone you have fond childhood memories of is difficult to be rude to. But selfish men and rapists (which this man probably is; just one that hasn't been prosecuted yet) rely on the fact that women are socialized very firmly to be nice to men, not to anger them, and to be flattered and grateful for their attention.

THERhubarb Fri 26-Apr-13 09:58:40

Not sure SGB, I think we all socialised to be grateful for any kind of attention and our culture is notoriously too polite. Look at how many women are taken advantage of by other women to be unpaid babysitters, to pay for lunches, to give them lifts, etc. Mumsnet is full of threads from under-confident women asking how to deal with so-called friends who take advantage.

Perhaps is it a particularly British thing too. Giving out compliments doesn't come naturally to most and what do we do when we are given a compliment? We deny it straight away. I've found that this doesn't happen across the pond where they are more likely to give and take compliments.

I don't think you can label him as a probable rapist either. Yes he's a dick but would he go so far as to take sexual advantage? We don't know. Maybe and maybe not. But if GlassofRose does report the texts to the police then should he ever push his luck and prove himself to be a rapist, there is evidence there that will help in his prosecution.

You'd hope that it will never come to that but there are both men and women out there who are all too willing to prey upon polite and under confident victims. I'm glad that the OP ditched the polite approach for a more forceful one.

Pity they don't do confidence lessons at school along with lessons on respect.

GlassofRose Sat 27-Apr-13 15:42:53

I'm not sure I can assume he's probably a rapist... but then again thinking about it we're all kind of programmed to imagine rapists as some bloke in a hoodie down a dark alleyway.

His behaviour advances on the date weren't overly forceful. He tried to kiss me and I laughed which was a mixture of nerves and shock as I clearly wasn't sending out signals. He kept pressing to kiss me and he had his arm behind me trying to unclasp my bra rather quick. I got up for a drink and sat on back down on the opposite sofa. The lack of "Fuck off" was out of sheer shock really.

QueenStromba Sat 27-Apr-13 19:08:44

The rapists in dark alleyways are definitely in the minority and most rapists don't even realise they are rapists, in fact most rape victims don't see themselves as such.

GlassOfRose: he was behaving like a rapist, though. He kept ignoring your hints and signals that you were not interested and overriding your objections, he kept mauling your body and kissing you despite your obvious lack of enthusiasm. He insisted on coming into your house when you didn't want him there, and if you hadn't been firm enough about driving him home, he would have been trying to stick his dick in you all night.
This isn't a man who is socially inept or who struggles to pick up social cues, this is a man who thinks that he is entitled to have sex on women, and he's going to keep on pushing until it gets to the point where he has to either cross the line and acknowledge (to himself) that if he contineus then he's raping the woman ie she's told him to leave the house or slapped him or something, or decide to back off for the moment but to behave as though the woman is the one in the wrong for not accepting his right to stick his dick in her.

MusicalEndorphins Mon 29-Apr-13 04:55:44

Date -Rape almost. Hope he got the message finally.

AllOverIt Mon 29-Apr-13 05:09:37

Have you contacted the police OP?

MummaBubba123 Mon 29-Apr-13 05:44:44

Nutter
Stay well away!!!

GlassofRose Mon 29-Apr-13 13:44:18

Allover - Yes, I have.

After a few quiet days I got several short messages from him:
"What?"
"I don't follow?"
"I really like you, thought you liked me back?"
"I want us to have a chance"

It was either a ploy to plead innocence or he really doesn't understand how inappropriate his behaviour is!

So I didn't reply to any and followed through with popping into the police. I relayed everything and showed them all of the messages on my phone. Really glad I posted on here because I was really doubting myself to begin with.

THERhubarb Mon 29-Apr-13 14:02:47

Gosh he really does take the biscuit doesn't he? Are the police going to do anything? You did well not to answer, I hope they contact him and make him realise how inappropriate he is being. He is certainly not innocent, you don't work in law without realising when you yourself are breaking the law. Perhaps he thinks he is above it all and because of his status, he'll never get into trouble? He certainly sounds disillusioned enough to believe that.

Do tell me that the police will contact him?

Thank God you went and it's all on record. Makes me wonder if he is already known? If not I fear he soon will be.

LessMissAbs Mon 29-Apr-13 14:07:00

Perhaps he thinks he is above it all and because of his status, he'll never get into trouble?

He's a paralegal. Believe me, if people in his firm knew he was going about telling people he was a lawyer when he was a paralegal, he would laughed out of town. Depending on the firm, it might also be a disciplinary matter.

THERhubarb Mon 29-Apr-13 14:19:32

He would only be disciplined if he filled in forms as a lawyer though, exaggerating his status to a potential date is not quite the same. It's a pretty pathetic lie anyway when he has a LinkedIn profile and the OP on his friends list.

Makes you wonder why tell her the lawyer fib when she can clearly see from his profile that he's not?

What would be a disciplinary matter is if they find out he's been reported to the police. I'll bet he'll want that hushed up pretty sharpish.

GlassofRose Mon 29-Apr-13 14:26:27

Rhubarb,
Yes, he doesn't take the biscuit he nicks the whole cookie jar!

I think the things you were saying about it being programmed in us to be nice etc are bang on. My initial reaction to everything has been has been benefit of the doubt really. Thinking, Have I led him on? Is he one of those odd bod types who don't have much experience and have really crap social awareness like you see on The Big Bang?

It's only when sense kicks in I remember he's not stupid or some sort of hermit and he's got a job that would make him aware of this stuff at least.

The police guy I saw said it's actually pretty common for women who report this stuff to be self doubting. I don't have his home address but I did get his work one off of linkedin and they were going to contact him with a harassment warning letter. Feeling slightly mean that it'll go through his work confused

LessMissAbs Mon 29-Apr-13 14:26:37

No, his employers might consider it a disciplinary offence if he was lieing to people about being a lawyer, particularly if he was telling them he worked at X Firm. I found the bit where he said he was a lawyer or not and the LinkedIn part a bit unclear.

GlassofRose Mon 29-Apr-13 14:30:06

lessmissabs

He was on my linkedin friends list. I have to be honest I don't use it much as I'm currently juggling being a university student with freelancing and the odd bit of tutoring. Didn't cross my mind to check his actual job title until another poster mentioned it.

Smartieaddict Mon 29-Apr-13 14:32:15

He must have the hide of a rhino. You could not have made it any clearer that you did not want any more contact. Glad to hear he will be getting a warning letter. Fingers crossed he will finally get the message!

Jux Mon 29-Apr-13 15:15:42

Just in case someone may not be taking this sort of scenario seriously, I thought I'd tell you that I had a similar experience. In fact several, way back in the early 80s.

The time an apparently friendly bloke I'd just had a meal with just kind of followed me home and inveigled his way in, he raped me. Yes, I'd told him to go, yes I'd made it clear I wasn't interested. He got in on the pretext of needing a wee. He had followed me home apparently to ensure I was safe.

So, lurkers, report these guys before it happens.

Xenia Mon 29-Apr-13 15:24:18

It's done now and I expect he'll keep away.
Lawyer is not a restricted term. Solicitor or barrister or nurse or doctor are. So I can call myself a therapist or life coach even if I have no qualifications but I must not call myself a doctor in public if I am not. So if his linked in profile said he was a lawyer and he worked at a law firm I don't think he's broken that particular law whereas if he says he is a solicitor or barrister he will have done.

I think the lesson is don't invite men back on the first date. Don't allow them to walk you home. If you do want him to come in say yes come in for 5 mins and then make sure they leave after 5 minutes. It seems a very very strange lack of ability to assert. I think a lot of women need assertiveness training and I hope they bring up their daughters to be assertive.

The fact she paid doesn't matter. I pay sometimes. Why should men pay all the time although you might have expected him to offer to pay at least half.

He sounds like one to avoid in future.

THERhubarb Mon 29-Apr-13 16:11:21

I would hope Xenia that whilst women are bringing up daughters to be assertive and distrustful of men, that they are also bringing up their sons to be respectful, to never take advantage, to realise that no means no and to have a clear idea of what rape is.

It should not be down to the women to prevent themselves from being raped. It's down to the men to CHOOSE not to be rapists.

LessMissAbs Mon 29-Apr-13 17:06:16

So if his linked in profile said he was a lawyer and he worked at a law firm I don't think he's broken that particular law whereas if he says he is a solicitor or barrister he will have done

What particular law are you referring to? The guys a paralegal. By no stretch of the widest imagination is he a lawyer. Lawyer is a generic term that refers to solicitors, barristers, academic lawyers and prosecutors. Not paralegals. Lawyers will have the LLB degree or have done professional Law Society exams specifically with a purpose to becoming a solicitor or barrister. Paralegals are not required to have any qualifications at all (not even Standard Grades) though of course they may have.

There is a criminal offence but only if someone who doesn't hold a practising certificate carries out legal work and charges for it.

THERhubarb Mon 29-Apr-13 17:16:40

"A Paralegal is a person qualified through education and training to perform substantive legal work that requires knowledge of the law and procedures and who is not a qualified solicitor or barrister. Paralegals may work for, or be retained by solicitors within the legal profession or they may work within a legal environment within commerce, industry or the public sector." - National Association of Licensed Paralegals

THERhubarb Mon 29-Apr-13 17:24:26

The definition of a lawyer by the LSA is only a guide. Unless you are using the term in a professional manner i.e. charging for your services as a lawyer then I doubt anyone would bat an eyelid.

Some lawyers also practice as paralegals. They are not unqualified and require training. Not quite a lawyer then but he will know the law and he will have had training and qualifications to get that position.

You do get intelligent weirdos too.

QueenStromba Mon 29-Apr-13 17:25:57

I'm sorry that happened to you Jux. I bet the guy doesn't even think he's a rapist.

Xenia Mon 29-Apr-13 17:28:29

It's interesting isn't it?
I am not sure that you break any law if you call a legal secretary say with 10 years experience of doing quite a bit of legal work a paralegal.
The act which says you cannot call yourself a solicitor unless are you are one is one of the Solicitors Acts. There is a similar act for the words barrister, nurse, doctor. They are statutory prescribed words. There is no such legislation protecting against use of the word para legal or lawyer or attorney, contracts manager, purchasing manager, legal adviser.

So you are much less at risk if you use those terms as they have no statutory definition. Although general law against miselading selling such as the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading regulations might apply just as if I said a plastic jumper were made of silk when it wasn't. Then you would have to get out your dictionary and decide what the term means. The fact an association has decided to produce a definition which many may not agree with I suspect does not add to the debate.

I could set up the association of life coaches tomorrow and produce my own definition and say I'm a life coach.

THERhubarb Mon 29-Apr-13 17:36:55

I think we get it that this bloke didn't break any rules by merely telling her he was a lawyer, it only illustrated his arrogance.

Sorry to go on about it LessMiss but I wanted to make the point that he is an educated man who is well versed in the law because it's important that women realise that even respectable, educated men can be creeps and they shouldn't allow any man to use their so-called 'power' to take advantage. Often the more educated the man, the more intimidating he can be.

GlassofRose Mon 29-Apr-13 22:39:45

Xenia...I think the lesson is don't invite men back on the first date.
Don't allow them to walk you home. If you do want him to come in say yes come in for 5 mins and then make sure they leave after 5 minutes.

Well aren't you a delightful flower hmm

It seems a very very strange lack of ability to assert.

I could think of some very assertive responses for that

I think a lot of women need assertiveness training and I hope they bring up their daughters to be assertive.

Clearly you never read all of my posts... if you had perhaps your head wouldn't be shoved as far up your own arse.

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