People taking ridiculous risks with their dc in supermarket trolleys

(166 Posts)
wherewasi Sun 21-Apr-13 16:30:20

Just done the supermarket run, as always I find I have to avert my eyes and bite my tongue at the sight of so many tiny children standing up in the trolley while it's being pushed round the shop or hanging off the side.

I have seen so many accidents where the trolley gets shunted and the child falls over/off and hurts themselves - bangs their head, bites their tongue, scrapes themselves on the metal. Why do parents do this? Presumably they take the normal precautions in other areas - car seats, road safety awareness, advising dc to take care in the playground or running round the house?

Even saw a really tiny one today slumped in one of the shallow trolleys with his head lolling over the edge, just at the right level to bang it on a shelf.

AIBU or OTT to cringe about this?

prophylaxis Sun 21-Apr-13 16:36:54

I have seen so many accidents where the trolley gets shunted and the child falls over/off and hurts themselves

Is that because they are caused by you? wink I don't get why people always moan about this, I hardly ever see it and have never seen an accident because of it. Is it specific to certain areas where people do this?

Theironfistofarkus Sun 21-Apr-13 16:41:00

I let mine stand in the trolley. No accident yet but i do watch them carefully. Who is doing the trolley shunting? Is trolley pushing a bit like dodgems down your way? smile

When I was younger (3 or less) I was stood on the side of a trolley and it tipped and fell over blush

I was at the checkout once. Toddler stood up in a shallow trolley. Mum ignoring her whilst paying. She toppled over and I caught her. shock The Mum didn't see, and I didn't say anything. Child sat down and off they went......

mybelovedmonster Sun 21-Apr-13 16:43:51

DS always stands in the trolley when we go to Ikea - he's never hurt himself!

CocacolaMum Sun 21-Apr-13 16:44:03

ive never seen an accident caused by a child trolleysurfing.. it looks like fun and if I thought I could get away with it I would do it!!

elfycat Sun 21-Apr-13 16:45:21

My 2 seem to be able to do all of those injuries sitting in a child-friendly room, so meh? And?

And before we get the 'oh it's unhygenic, they might have trodden on dog poo and that's where I'll put my food' I'll remind people of the rats and pigeon poo from the warehouse where the food is stored.

And I don't let my DDs do this I much prefer them free-range to harrass the other shoppers

Your supermarket sounds like a bloodbath.

I'd rather they were in the trolley than running about the place, I've nearly knocked a few kids over when they have bolted in front of me.

I'm also starting to think I don't pay enough attention in supermarkets, there are so many threads about what other customers buy/say/do in them, I really never notice anything unless it directly involves me. I need to get down to Tesco with my judgy pants ready to be hoiked asap.

SkinnybitchWannabe Sun 21-Apr-13 16:46:24

I work on a checkout and Ive lost count of the amount of people who put their babies and toddlers on the end of my belt and down at the packing area. I always ask parents to move them because its dangerous.
YANBU

livinginwonderland Sun 21-Apr-13 16:47:05

eh, i used to stand in the trolley all the time, or ride on the end of it. it was great fun and stopped me kicking up a fuss about being dragged around a supermarket!

SilveryMoon Sun 21-Apr-13 16:47:16

Mine stand in the trolley. I only let them in the big ones though, not the shallow ones.
Ds1 likes to stand on the side, but I don't really like that, so it doesn't happen often.
I think comparing standing in a trolley in a supermarket to using a car seat a bit OTT, but if that's how you feel, that's ok.

Yonihadtoask Sun 21-Apr-13 16:59:40

I used to work in a supermarket and have seen trolleys tipped over by children standing on the runners on the sides.

Hate to see children standing inside the trolleys. It always looks unhygienic (I know, I know - trolleys are left outside, pigeon poop etc.)

So, when the little darlings fall out of the trolley or pull it over on to themselves- the parents will be bound to blame the supermarket ??

sweetkitty Sun 21-Apr-13 17:01:06

YANBU last week someone was on FB saying her DS fell out a trolley and she had spent the day in A&E having him stitched back up. hmm

There are lots of things we cannot prevent our DCs doing that can potentially hurt them but I think it's about minimising the risk, none of move have ever stood up in a trolley, they would much rather be running around creating havoc.

fluffiphlox Sun 21-Apr-13 17:05:16

Didn't a child die in a trolley in a DIY place once? May have been about 15 years ago?

FrameyMcFrame Sun 21-Apr-13 17:06:28

I'd hardly call it a ridiculous risk. Do you wrap your children in cotton wool all the time?

If I hadn't caught the toddler she would have hit the floor head first. sad

wherewasi Sun 21-Apr-13 17:10:20

I never thought about the hygiene aspect, but it doesnt really bother me as I usually use the flatter bed type and today was the first time i've seen a child in one of those.

I really don't understand why parents do it - why not just put them in the trolley seats as designed? Obviously it's not a 'bloodbath' but I have lost count of the number of minor bangs and scrapes i've seen with resulting bawling frightened child and sheepish parent. I don't believe my area is unusual in that.

I certainly didn't wrap my dc in cotton wool when they were little - in fact I encouraged them to explore and be physical but this is a 'ridiculous' risk because it's completely uneccessary and of no benefit to the child.

Thank god you were there sparklingbrook - could have had a lifetime of repercussions and for what?

MyHusbandRoy Sun 21-Apr-13 17:13:38

I don't know about the DIY shop fluff but when I was a teen I used to watch Airport (or a similar programme).

I can always remember one of the staff members saying that a child had died from falling off a luggage trolley because they fell flat on their back and hit the back of their head sad

slatternlymother Sun 21-Apr-13 17:18:30

What I can't bear is people ignoring their children in supermarkets. I walked past a mum the other day, and she had her 2 little girls with her; about 18 months and 5.

Mum was chatting to a friend she had bumped into, and the 5 year old had stolen her little sister's dolly and was dancing up and down the aisle with it. The could see what was going on; but she just chose to ignore it. Her younger DD was getting really upset and crying 'mummy, please dolly back!' And was really, really distressed.

The mother was just talking over her sobbing little DD to her friend, who looked quite shocked herself.

I get everyone has bad days, but come on; the older DD only got a quick 'oh give X her dolly back', in a sigh-ey voice before turning back to her friend! Older DD just carried on! sad

slatternlymother Sun 21-Apr-13 17:19:50

And I agree WRT standing up in trolleys; it looks unruly. Most children of that age are capable of walking by the trolley, and perhaps helping to put things in. If you don't want to take them round the shops; Internet shop.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 17:22:24

I always let my dc stand up in the trolley.

specialsubject Sun 21-Apr-13 17:23:14

the supermarkets tell you not let kids stand in trolleys. Presumably there is a reasonable risk.

no qualifications required for parenting.

Delayingtactic Sun 21-Apr-13 17:24:20

My DS stands in the trolley. It's hardly a ridiculous risk and a bit much to compare it to using a car seat. Children can get injured doing all manner of innocuous things. I probably pay more attention to my DS safety when he's in the trolley than when he's out. Plus those trolley seats are very easy to climb out.

ShadowStorm Sun 21-Apr-13 17:25:08

YANBU to think it's a silly and unnecessary risk to take. There was recently an incident near us where a child (about 5 or 6 yrs IIRC) fell head first out of a supermarket trolley and ended up in hospital with a fractured skull.

But I think it's a bit OTT to compare it to not using a car seat or not teaching kids about road safety.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 17:25:18

Well mine have never had an accident. Its not as if I'm not right there watching them is it. hmm

When DS1 was a toddler he was sat in the trolley seat properly but sneezed and hit his mouth on the bar you push. Teeth through his lip, blood everywhere. sad trollies are dangerous.

Asda were fab though. Straight up to the staff room, first aider, and chocolate bars afterwards.

KnockMeDown Sun 21-Apr-13 17:34:04

I hate seeing kids in trolleys, and have always been adamant that mine would never do this. DS, now 14, would always sit very nicely in the toddler seat, and I would look and tut very smuggly.
Now, I have DD, almost 3. She is not as compliant as DS grin . Have you ever tried to get a reluctant, kicking toddler into one of those seats? So guess what, she rides in the trolley, either sitting or standing. She will sometimes walk, but when its very busy, I would say she is safer in the trolley than out of it! Also, shock, horror, shock , when doing the self-scan along the way in Tesco, I give her a pack of chocolate buttons to keep her occupied!

OrlaKiely Sun 21-Apr-13 17:35:05

I think there's a bit of dissonance - people feel like it's not their responsibility because it's in a shop. Also the trolleys are crap.

I've had so much trouble trying to go shopping with a baby - finding a baby-sized seat is hard work, when you find one it's filthy, if you use your own car seat you can't even see where you're going as they are so high - supermarkets need proper parent centred trolleys.

If I was a designer I'd design one right now. Proper, comfy low down seats for the children, with stuff to do like a steering wheel etc so they wanted to go in them - and proper baby seats you could collect on your way in, attach, give back at the end. Ones that got cleaned once in a while, yunno.

Startail Sun 21-Apr-13 17:36:49

DD1 had to be strapped in a trolley with her walking reins.

She could get out the waist belts. People used to tut, They seemed to think it was cruel.

Having had her climb out onto the conveyor, I was taking no chances. It's a long way down out of a trolley seat.

Tee2072 Sun 21-Apr-13 17:37:33

I have never seen a child fall out of a trolley.

I never fell out of a trolley when I was a child.

Therefore, children never fall out of trollies...

ddubsgirl Sun 21-Apr-13 17:37:56

i hate seeing it at work sad kids hanging on sides and it tips,kids inside ewwww people have had raw chickens etc sat inside them,and sat outside in all weathers and not just that but the kid may have crap on his/her shoes and then others have to use it to put shopping in!

Meh. What delaying said. I very rarely take my DC to the supermarket but if I do then them sitting in the trolley makes it more pleasant for everyone.

No injuries yet, though DS is currently sporting a big scab on his face which he sustained while already lying on the floor. Kids get bumps.

It's completely absurd to compare it with car seats unless trolleys are crashing at 70 mph round your way.

neunundneunzigluftballons Sun 21-Apr-13 17:41:03

YABU I think you are a little bit too risk averse there OP. Children cycle bikes, walk on footpaths, jump on trampolines, climb monkey bars all of which carry risk too but they survive to tell the tale in the main.

ChippingInLovesSpring Sun 21-Apr-13 17:42:41

minor bangs and scrapes

Kids get minor bangs and scrapes all the time, it's really nothing to lose sleep over.

In all my years, many of them spent in a country far more 'lax' than the UK, I have never seen a single 'trolley accident'.

... and small children are far safer in the trolley than walking about - they are at far more risk of getting hurt if they walk around the supermarket.

I agree with the OP. I think letting your child ride in any part of the trolley is reckless and lazy. I have three dcs. Two of whom are very stubborn and all of whom are active and inquisitive. They have never sat anywhere other than a trolley seat. Nobody needs to do this and you are running risk of serious injury to your child. Really, really crap parenting.

MajaBiene Sun 21-Apr-13 17:47:44

I don't see the problem, and don't think it's a big risk. Children hurt themselves climbing trees, riding bikes, running into lamposts regularly - I don't think it is necessary or desirable to eliminate all risks.

I have also never seen a child hurt themselves falling from a trolley. I don't doubt it happens, but it doesn't seem very common. The chance of DS hurting himself in a trolley I am pushing seems very small.

imour Sun 21-Apr-13 17:49:47

why let your kids stand in trolleys ? they have seats , what if they got dog shit on their shoes then its all over my shopping then in my cupboard ,its a food carrier not a ride !

DolomitesDonkey Sun 21-Apr-13 17:50:49

When I was a child we'd steal trollies and take turns to push each other down the hill. grin

wherewasi Sun 21-Apr-13 17:55:20

they are at far more risk of getting hurt if they walk around the supermarket. What a ludicrous comment.

Of course kids get bangs and scrapes and of course mine did - the worst injury was incurred in a playground. The point is there is a massive benefit to children playing so it would be crazy to try to limit that because there is a risk of injury.

Letting your child stand in or hang off a trolley is different because there is no good reason or benefit to the child of doing it.

Gentleness Sun 21-Apr-13 17:55:32

Well if cheap people didn't use the no-token-required twin trolleys when they don't have ANY kids, I'd never have my 22mo-old standing in the trolley. As it is, the choice is between having him run amok or get lost if I concentrate on the shelf contents for more than 10 seconds or standing him (we do try sitting!) in the trolley. Not all the time, but you can tell when the mood is on him. And sometimes he starts off walking but can't last the course. Seems to me that a lot of parenting is about choosing the least-bad option!

I did once go to customer services when I had all 3 kids (all under 3.5) with me and ask what had happened to all the twin trolleys. They were the ones who said they had loads but cheapskates used them instead of finding a £1. I've also asked someone if I can swap their child-free twin trolley for my single child one with one in the seat, one in the trolley and one alongside. They'd have got a £1 out of it and I'd have got a more peaceful shop but they refused!

racmun Sun 21-Apr-13 18:00:41

My son rides in the trolley, only a big one though and I don't let him hang out the side.....

He just climbs out of the seats and that is really dangerous.

If he's not in the trolley then he is generally being 'helpful' knocking things of shelves etc.

I do wonder sometimes why people are so judgemental about other people's patenting choices. Having your child the trolley at all is in theory dangerous regardless of whether they are strapped in the seat if it is going to get rammed in a moment of trolley rage. There are loads of 'dangerous' activities that parents let children do
why does it bother people so much what other people's children may or may not be allowed to do when it has no impact on your life whatsoever.

MajaBiene Sun 21-Apr-13 18:03:09

They reason/benefit is just that the child likes it - fun.

Yup concussion is such a giggle isn't it. A child who falls out of a trolley will be falling 2-3 feet on to a very hard surface. For no reason other than their dim parents couldn't be arsed to manage their behaviour or indeed plan their need for shopping differently. Nobody needs to do this and it's really stupid.

Levantine Sun 21-Apr-13 18:11:19

Those seats aren't fit for purpose with a toddler. Mine climbs out of his when I turn my back. I think standing up in the trolley is safer, though I don't thing its ideal

DigestivesWithCheese Sun 21-Apr-13 18:12:17

OP - you will horrified if you see me in the supermarket. I have twins in the two baby seats at the front of a trolley and two year old DD standing upright in the front section. She is often snacking on something I have opened for her and likes to shout "Hold on tight!" or just "Whee!" as we are walking around.

I am puzzled by the hygiene comments - the food in the trolley is always wrapped in some way, isn't it? Also flummoxed by the children "falling out"... It's a deep trolley & she is quite small. I think my DD is in more danger when she is hanging on the back of a pushchair and standing on a buggy board.

MajaBiene Sun 21-Apr-13 18:16:32

DS is much more likely to fall out from standing on the seat than standing in the trolley.

He could also get a concussion falling off his bike, out of a tree or from a wall.

'I think standing up in the trolley is safer' - no it isn't. What would be safer is you doing your shopping in a different way.

neunundneunzigluftballons Sun 21-Apr-13 18:21:20

Trolley surfing - is it a means of getting kids and food from A to B or is it an extreme sport for kids and a vehicle for really crap parents to express themselves? find out more on mumsnet.

Really, really crap parenting.

<rolls eyes>

I think that is ever more ott than ridiculous risks.

neunundneunzigluftballons Sun 21-Apr-13 18:21:51

ever = even

MajaBiene Sun 21-Apr-13 18:22:43

This is such a non-issue. I find it bizarre what some people get worked up about grin

Levantine Sun 21-Apr-13 18:24:40

It is safer, because he can't stand up and fall out. What would be better would be to do all my shopping online or without him. But those seats are crap and dangerous IMO.

In France they have toddler friendly trolleys with sterling wheels which are really good

He can fall out actually. As you'll probably discover.

hate seeing children in trolleys! angry

used to work in a supermarket... it was always the supermarkets fault when things went wrong... never the parents! hmm

i think shops should try and put a stop to it

Levantine Sun 21-Apr-13 18:27:45

How? he is shorter than the edge of the trolley? do you mean if he stands on something?

helopoly Sun 21-Apr-13 18:30:27

The trolley is not stable enough to support a child if it leans too much on the side. I know of a child that had a really bad broken arm after falling out of the main part of the trolley. Why risk it?

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 18:33:16

The trolley is deep. No chance of dc falling out unless they suddenly sprout up another couple of feet taller whilst on the supermarket circuit. Very little chance of that happening. Dc are perfectly capable of holding on. I'm not walking round with my eyes closed so I can see exactly whats going on. Safer because theres less chance of dc getting barged by other peoples trolleys, less chance of getting lost, less chance of them snatching things off the shelves. I can give you plenty of examples of crap parenting, but that aint one of them. The level of preciousness on here is a little OTT.

They should not be stood in the shallow trollies though.

PurpleThing Sun 21-Apr-13 18:35:19

"Dim" is a bit much. I can't believe people are so irate about this. Yes they could hurt themselves if you are not paying attention but so could they if they slipped on a dropped grape!?

There is no internet shopping here. I get one chance once a week/fortnight to do my shopping so I have to do a big shop, so some of the time I have him standing in the trolley, putting things in the front section for me. He climbs out of the seat or spreads his legs in rage so I can't get him in it in the first place. If he is freerange he takes things off the shelf and runs off. If I put reins on him he lies on the floor. I used to sling him on my back but the sling is now too knackered to use.

MN is such an education about what other people are judging you for!

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 18:36:02

They should not be stood in the shallow trollies though.

obviously not. They'd fall out.

Unless Aunty Sparkling is there to catch them TheChao. sad

People seem obsessed with this being 'low risk' so lets look at that and assess the risk:

Firstly - how often does this happen? Well the people who do this do it all the time.

Secondly - what is the liklihhod of a child falling? Given that they are riding in something not designed for them, subject to shifts in weight, on a smooth floor, being used by people with a less than adult appreciation of danger and accompanied by parents who are looking in other directions and moving away from the trolley I would say the chances are high of a fall

Thirdly - what are the consequences? Broken bones or head injuries are possible. Even fatalities.

All this adds up to a high risk rating which can be mitigated by only one thing - NOT DOING THE ACTIVITY. And the risk of not doing it - you have to otherwise occupy your child. Wow. Balancing the rleative risks here must really task some people hmm

ShowMeTheYoni Sun 21-Apr-13 18:42:07

Wow, glad you have never seen me in a supermarket. I let ds stand on one end whilst I get the trolley spinning round and jump on my own side blush. We only ever do it in empty isles! We laugh, hurt no-one and have never fallen off either of us I am clearly in the "lousy parent" camp. Ds is 6 by the way, but we have been doing the spinning trolley routine for years! <runs away>

AnyaKnowIt Sun 21-Apr-13 18:44:11

As an ex manager and first aider in a supermarket i've lost count of how many times I've had to treat children who had fallen out of trollies.

GreenEggsAndNichts Sun 21-Apr-13 18:45:27

Sorry but when I hear people say they allow their children to do xyz risky thing and say they haven't hurt themselves, I just think of how my mum says they never wore seat belts when they were children and they're all fine now. Well yes, they were never in a car accident, so they're fine. It is risky behaviour, whether or not you want to admit it. It just happens to be a risk you're willing to take.

cece Sun 21-Apr-13 18:45:48

This is exactly why I do online delivery. People even judge you about how you use your trolley. biscuit

DB still bears the scar from where DM let go of the trolley where he was safely strapped into the seat, and it tipped over, dumping him on his wee face sad

Thereafter she always put something heavy in the other end ASAP, and I remember to do so too.

My children ride in the seats or not at all. But we do indulge in trolley spinning.

Gentleness Sun 21-Apr-13 18:46:31

Goodness me - I'm talking in my own case of a small 22mo who is not capable of climbing out of the sort of trolley I use, or tipping it over. There is no risk of that at all. There might be for bigger child with more climbing skills, but you know what, I know my own child.

Seems to me that with some people talking about some trolleys and some about all and some about bigger children and some about any children and so on, there is so little point in having this discussion.

There is a HUGE difference between a boy on the 100th percentile for growth and one on the 1st. That's before you get into ages and characters and seriously don't tell me that with all the crass educational decisions the government are taking about one-size-fits-all schooling, we could have similar over-controlling regulation of trolley usage.

chickensaladagain Sun 21-Apr-13 18:46:41

I've seen a trolley tip over sideways due to a child surfing

I have never seen so much blood as his head split open on the concrete floor and the ambulance took him away on a spinal board

It wasn't pretty

MrsWolowitz Sun 21-Apr-13 18:48:53

Meh.

I have three DC under 4yo.

I get a double trolley and put the twins in the seats and DD1 stands in the trolley. I watch her and no accidents yet.

I wasn't even aware that this was an issue.

Who are all these trolley shunters? I've never seen a trolley-tastrophe. Hopefully they are pretty rare.

If they are too big to sit in the trolley seat they should be walking though.

Tommy Sun 21-Apr-13 18:50:00

I'm with you on this one OP!
If they are small enough to need to have a ride round the shop, they should go on the seat. If they are too big for the seat, they can walk.
smile

Gentleness Sun 21-Apr-13 18:50:34

Is trolley surfing the same as standing in the trolley?

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 18:50:57

Oh well, because I dont agree with you Northern, I'm going to carry on doing what I'm doing. You think there's huge risks so don't do it with your children, I don't think there's huge risks, so I will.

I think trolley surfing is standing on the back of the trolley isn't it?

'we could have similar over-controlling regulation of trolley usage.'

We aready do. Every supermarket has notices telling you to put children in the designated seats only.

Cece - I only judge stupid and reckless trolley use.

DigestivesWithCheese Sun 21-Apr-13 18:52:27

Fatalities?

Northern Lurker, I'm sure your post wasn't intended to be humorous but I have to admit it really tickled me, thank you flowers

ShadowStorm Sun 21-Apr-13 18:52:34

I think trolley surfing is when the child is hanging on the outside of the trolley.

BrittaPie Sun 21-Apr-13 18:53:23

My FIL does this and it does my head in, plus it means I have to deal with tantrums when I don't let the DC do it.

The signs saying don't let children stand in the trolley are surely there for a reason? confused

Quick question for those who put DC in the main part of the trolley: how the fuck do you fit the actual food in? And do they not stand on the fragile things?

ShadowStorm Sun 21-Apr-13 18:59:08

Yes, Digestives, fatalities are possible if a child were to fall head first out of a trolley onto a hard floor.

I posted upthread about an incident near us where a child got a fractured skull as a result of falling head first out of a trolley. AFAIK, the child recovered okay, but I'd bet it's possible for a fall serious enough to cause a fractured skull to also cause fatal brain damage.

I appreciate that such a serious trolley accident is rare, though.

Ancient American article but a study was done.

YY Horry grape treading. grin

DigestivesWithCheese Sun 21-Apr-13 18:59:25

Horry - in the trolley I use, there is a separate section in the front of the trolley. I've always thought it is meant for putting bottles in so that they don't fall over, I might be wrong about that though. I wouldn't put DD in the actual trolley because she would trample all over the place.

Gentleness Sun 21-Apr-13 18:59:41

Well trolley surfing clearly carries more risk of tipping (larger children) and falling off (no barriers). Not really to be compared with a small child in a large trolley.

Northernlurker - the supermarkets also try to provide a useful range of trolleys for people with children. Unfortunately, selfish fellow shoppers use those trolleys as they tend not to require a token. Leaving those of us with a baby and a young toddler with a dilemma. Abandon the shop? Go to customer services and wait till they find you a trolley while the kids get bored? Try to manage the shop with a young toddler walking/getting distracted/bolting (as some do, despite even the best parenting)? Or make the best of a bad situation and put the toddler in the trolley with the baby in the seat.

All I'm saying is that you can't make a one-size-fits-all rule without it being ridiculous in some situations. No children in any trolley ever is nonsense. So is any child in any trolley being fine.

Tailtwister Sun 21-Apr-13 18:59:53

I don't do it with my own DC as I think it's dangerous. Other people doing it doesn't bother me. They obviously think it's ok, they are doing it with their own DC, it's not any of my concern.

I've never seen any trolly accidents btw. DS1 (4 at the time) did get whacked on the head by someone's basket once. He was holding my hand and the guy just came barrelling round the corner, didn't see either of us and DS was just at the right height to get cracked on the head. He was lucky not to end up with a nasty cut. Accidents happen even when you're being careful. I prefer not to raise the odds though.

I am glad DSs are older now, I can send them into the supermarket and they can push the trolley.

Ah the front section makes sense. But that's the place to put heavy things to counterbalance the seated toddler. ::clutches pearls::

Mine would grape-stomp on purpose. hmm

'All I'm saying is that you can't make a one-size-fits-all rule without it being ridiculous in some situations. No children in any trolley ever is nonsense.'

I've made a rule. My oldest child is 15. In 15 years of parenting I've survived without doing this reckless and dangerous thing.

And I'm glad you find the potential for life altering head injuries so funny Digestives. That'll give you quite a giggle when you're waiting for a CT scan with your child in A&E.

YouTheCat Sun 21-Apr-13 19:08:46

I don't care if other people want to take the risk, though why people can't use the seats for their kids I don't know.

What I do object to is having to put my food where other people's dirty shoes have been.

fortyplus Sun 21-Apr-13 19:09:28

I used to nag my mother about allowing my son to stand in trolleys... until the day that he fell out and landed on his head. Fortunately he didn't suffer life changing injuries.

YoniRanger Sun 21-Apr-13 19:10:55

I know of two babies that suffered serious head injuries due to trolly falls. It's a stupid risk to take hmm

FuckThisShit Sun 21-Apr-13 19:14:28

Meh.

MarvellousYou Sun 21-Apr-13 19:15:21

I must go to a special supermarket because for my DS to fall out the trolley, I'd have to run and stop doing about 30mph. YANBU but I also think most parents know when something is a bit risky and are very careful.

FWIW we only put our 2 year old in the main bit if he sits down and normally we're going in for milk and strawberries and then leaving.

'I also think most parents know when something is a bit risky and are very careful'

This thread suggests otherwise.

mamij Sun 21-Apr-13 19:21:36

DD1 always stands/sits in the trolley, as DD2 sits in the "proper" seat. If the trolley had two seats, there wouldn't be a problem!

Are the 'trolley standing is ok' people the same ones that take their buggies on escalators?

wherewasi Sun 21-Apr-13 19:25:46

It's not just a question of falling out of the trolley, though of course that would be far the most dangerous thing. Kids can do themselves plenty of nastiness by falling around inside the trolley.

I don't understand why this is seen as 'judgy' either - it's just common sense. I couldn't care less if you give your dc choc buttons to eat round the shop but I really don't want to see yet another poor little kid screaming and bleeding from the mouth while the guilty parent tells them it's their own fault for not sitting down.

YouDontWinFriendsWithSalad Sun 21-Apr-13 19:31:28

What's wrong with taking a buggy on the escalator??

You aren't supposed to YouDont there's a sign saying not to. Tis dangerous.

neunundneunzigluftballons Sun 21-Apr-13 19:44:28

This www.thudguard.com/product-info is designed for toddlers who are learning to walk and it just shows the lunacy of taking risk assessment to the extreme. Read all the awful things that could happen to your toddler without it. Northern this wesite should hire you as their risk assessor you did a far better job here.

ShadowStorm Sun 21-Apr-13 19:51:02

YouDont - risks of taking a buggy on an escalator would include:

- You tripping on the escalator;
- You losing your balance because you're holding onto the buggy instead of the escalator rails;
- You losing your grip on the buggy handle;
- A bit of the buggy gets stuck in the escalator mechanism (harder to keep a buggy away from the sides than it is to keep yourself away from the sides), and if this happens, the escalator will be trying to drag the buggy down into the escalator mechanism;
- You get a bit stuck getting off at the top / bottom, and anyone behind you on the escalator will pile into you;

Any of the above could result in serious injury.

MarvellousYou Sun 21-Apr-13 19:57:34

I guess it's lazy parenting, when you know your kids should sit in the proper seat but scream when you try. Letting them walk round ends in a tantrum because they can't go down the toy aisle and all you went in for is a refund for some pants and some frigging milk!

Some people will say you're judging but I think you're just saying what parents already know

The thudguard boasts of 'by protecting our precious loved ones little brains from everyday thuds and bumps' - which is of course a ridiculous over-reaction imo. Sitting in trollies isn't an every day requirement. Nobody needs to do it so there's no point running any risk whatsover with it.

ChippingInLovesSpring Sun 21-Apr-13 20:06:57

sparklingbrook - I can't answer for everyone of course, but yes, if there's not a lift I'll take a buggy on an escalator...

wherewasi - (I said) 'they are at far more risk of getting hurt if they walk around the supermarket] Your reply of 'What a ludicrous comment' is ludicrous... Of course a toddler walking around a supermarket is more at risk than one in a trolley - it should go without saying.

Well if there's no lift Chipping there isn't much option. sad

'Of course a toddler walking around a supermarket is more at risk than one in a trolley '

How? Yes if totally free range and liable to be flattened by a stock trolley or to pull down baked beans on their head. Not if somebody is holding their hand.

Btw if there's no lift in a shop only an escalator then you need to visit that shop when you don't have the pram with you. Going upstairs in a shop isn't worth the risk of serious injury to you or your child. What do you think is up there? Solid gold buttons on sale?

ShadowStorm Sun 21-Apr-13 20:18:21

I'm also not understanding how a toddler walking around a supermarket is more at risk than one standing in the trolley unless toddler is totally free range.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 20:23:06

My sil took ds to the supermarket a few months ago, she was holding his hand, and he still got bashed in the head by someones shopping basket. He arrived home with a bloody great gash on the side of his head. He would have been far safer in the trolley.

jamdonut Sun 21-Apr-13 20:23:52

I've only read the beginning of the thread, but I have a Husband who works for Tesco, he says they are told to challenge the parents of children standing in trolleys ,because it is dangerous.There are also notices on the handles of trolleys in most stores telling you not to allow your children to do it. I guess if you've got the sort of children who will sit still, then the chances of an accident happening are slim, but so many you see are jumping up and down or climbing in and out. If a trolley tips and hurts your child, would you then blame the store,or make a claim against them?

A customer let her DD sit on top of what was about £100 worth of food shopping and she did a wee on it, it soaked through
All of it and left a big puddle on the floor!

'He would have been far safer in the trolley.' - in the seat part of the trolley. NOT the basket part.

Hopefully the sign saying don't do it will prevent any claims direct stylee stuff jamdonut.

Katla Sun 21-Apr-13 20:27:16

When I was a student about ten years ago I worked in a shop and I witnessed a small boy, I think he would have been about 3 or 4, fall out the front of a trolley. His father was pushing it and he stopped rather suddenly, whilst looking the other way. The little boy just went head over heels right out over the front. He landed on his head and I heard his head hit the solid concrete floor from where I was standing about twenty feet away. It was one of the most horrific things I've ever seen and I remember that sickening sound. His head swelled up with an enormous orange-sized bump on it where he hit the ground and he screamed so loud. His parents went absolutely spare with panic and worry. Then first aiders were called and the child got a cold pack on the lump and the parents were going to the hospital with him.

It happened so quickly that they couldn't have caught him and the trolley wasn't even going that fast. I recall it vividly even to this day.

So I too want to tell people with their kids standing in the trolley to just don't do it. Yes, I've seen many many kids riding around in trolleys without mishap and just that one child fall out. But there is no way I'm going to risk hearing my own child's head hit solid concrete like I did that day.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 20:33:08

'He would have been far safer in the trolley.' - in the seat part of the trolley. NOT the basket part.

Nope. Because he's too big for the seat and above the weight limit.

Khaleese Sun 21-Apr-13 20:34:11

We don't allow ours to stand in a trolley, far too dangerous.

Did watch the youngest run away in the trolley as i deal with dc1. It was a heart stopping moment, hurtling towards parked traffic!!

Level the freaking car park!!!

It happens to us all.

Trolleys should have brakes.

Khaleese Sun 21-Apr-13 20:37:06

I know, it didn't. I was horribly sleep deprived though, so that didn't help....accident happen when you just don't see a danager!

curmit Sun 21-Apr-13 20:39:01

totally in agreement with this. Saw a child (way too old to be sitting in a trolley) sitting in a shallow trolley, she leaned over and tipped the trolley over and she banged her head. The crash was horrible. Mother continued with her shop and child cried the entire time, later I saw that the girl was BACK inside the bloody trolley.

girliefriend Sun 21-Apr-13 20:43:41

My dd, once she was too big to sit in the front bit, always sat in the bottom of the trolley, I wouldn't let her stand up but sat down she is contained and less likely to run off. She still sometimes does this and she is 7yo blush

ChippingInLovesSpring Sun 21-Apr-13 21:02:06

Northern there's absolutely no need to be rude to me, none at all. We have a difference of opinion over this - that's all. And, not that I should need to justify myself to you, but I was actually thinking of escalators in tube stations etc not shops.

Curmit & others... those of us who don't think letting kids sit or stand in the trolley is putting us straight onto the path of hell wouldn't necessarily be the same people who would allow a child to sit or stand in a shallow trolley - I for one, would not.

Children regularly get hurt in supermarkets when they are walking about because they are small, they can't be easily seen by other shoppers and they get knocked by baskets and trolley and that is why they are safer in the trolley, whether that be in the seats in the front or sitting in the (deep) trolley.

Anyone who thinks a kids shoes are the dirtiest/unhealthiest thing that ever gets put in a trolley need to have a wee look at where they are stored... and that's without going into the contamination of packaging of food along the way, meat juices and christ knows what else.

chickenfactory Sun 21-Apr-13 21:11:15

My DH sprained his ankle falling out of a trolley as it tipped over. He was about 25 though so really should have known better. wink

pamelat Sun 21-Apr-13 21:14:12

Before I had my DS, I would have taken a similar, quite self righteous really, view.

DS (2) is uncontrollable in a super market, he would run off or at the very least hurt himself or someone else scooting under legs etc

I have a dd (5) and she didn't do this! It's a personality thing.

It is safer for me to let him stand (not at bread/end bit) in the main trolley with me watching him than to have him "loose"

I think it's a bit trampy somehow (?!) but needs must

The context of the thread is about shopping not public transport Chipping. It never occurred to me that you would mean tube escalators because if there's no lift in the tube then you either ask the station staff to help you with a folded buggy or you plan your journey to avoid those stations or travel with a sling or back pack. Nobody HAS to take a buggy up an escalator just as nobody HAS to put their child in the basket part of a trolley.
Whilst we're throwing around personal experience as evidence I'll say again, 3 kids, oldest now 15. In all that time none of them have sat in the basket part and none of them have emerged from a supermarket with as much as a graze. The stubborn insistence on this thread that it's your right as parents to pointlessly endanger your children simply beggars belief.

Tanith Sun 21-Apr-13 21:19:10

YANBU
I know a child who smashed his front teeth tumbling out of a trolley. His mum was so upset - it looked awful until his second teeth came in.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 21:20:24

Well good for you that none of your children have emerged with a single graze. My ds has, and I will therefore continue to keep dc in the trolley to keep them safe.

ChippingInLovesSpring Sun 21-Apr-13 21:23:06

Northern - my comment was directed to sparkling in answer to her question, so no I didn't feel I needed to make it clear to anyone else what I was talking about.

It has nothing to do with 'my right to pointlessly endanger my children' what a ridiculous comment. It is simply that I don't think it is a risk when I do it and I know what I and the children are able to do - you make your decisions, I make mine - no need for the nasty comments.

YouTheCat Sun 21-Apr-13 21:30:53

Special needs aside, how come so many children too big for the trolley seats are not able to walk next to parents safely?

Is this a new thing? I know it was impossible to take my ds around a supermarket once he was too big for the seat as he is autistic and supermarkets send him into total meltdown because of the noise and lighting. His twin sister was able to walk sensibly next to me though from about age 3.

YouTheCat - DS2 is only just two and only just under the weight limit for trolley seats (50th centile). I think it's a pretty big ask for a slightly fatter child of the same age to walk nicely round the whole shop.

Which is why I'm planning to go when he is at playschool once he is too big for the trolley. But not everyone has that luxury.

And online shopping is shit.

Meglet Sun 21-Apr-13 21:37:02

DS is 6 and sometimes hangs off the edge of the trolley. It's safer than having him wandering off or bumping into people. He has been known to 'help' and push the trolley but I get ratty and he ends up bumping into things / people.

DD is 4 and still sits in the trolley seat if I do a big shop. I dread the day she doesn't fit it. My nerves will be shredded when she is free to roam the supermarket.

Not thinking something is a risk is not the same as it being risk free or even low risk. Nobody thinks their child will choose the moment to lean out a bit too far whilst you're deciding between types of pasta but the risk IS there. The supermarkets know it's there - which is why you'll be told not to do this in person and by signage and labelling.

YouTheCat Sun 21-Apr-13 21:38:34

There was no online shopping when mine were small. But, having said that, I think the trolley seats were more generous back then.

Maybe supermarkets should make the seats bigger?

Schooldidi Sun 21-Apr-13 21:40:23

I let dd2 stand in the trolley most weeks. It's never really occured to me that people might judge me on it. She's 3, she fits in the normal trolley seat, she sometimes sits in the seat, sometimes she prefers to stand in the big section, sometimes she walks with me. She is aware that she needs to hold on tight and make sure her fingers are out of the way of other trolleys.

I would rate the risk of letting her stand in the trolley as less than letting her ride her bike, which seems acceptable yet has accounted for a number of grazed knees. She has had far more problems walking beside me because people don't always notice her, or she stops unpredictably (as 3 year olds do sometimes) and ends up being bashed by a trolley.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 21:42:31

Well I've never been told by staff to take dc out of the trolley. In fact one staff member kindly held the trolley still so I could put dc in recently. No signs up either.

It would be useful if the seats were bigger YouTheCat.

When DS1 was little (he's 13) there were trolleys at Tesco with a Little Tikes car attached to the front. They were great.

TheChaoGoesMu Sun 21-Apr-13 21:48:51

Our tescos had one of those but its vanished. That would be amazing.

GirlOutNumbered Sun 21-Apr-13 21:51:13

I had DS2 in the front of the trolley and must have pushed off a bit hard. He smacked his head in the metal bar bit and I felt like a cunt.
Won't do it again!

DontSHOUTTTTTT Sun 21-Apr-13 21:53:48

I don't like kids being in the trolley. I think it can be dangerous and I really dislike it from a hygiene point of view. I never let my kids do it.

TooExtraImmatureCheddar Sun 21-Apr-13 22:04:37

Gosh. I let DD (13 months) stand in the end of the trolley all the time. Big trolley, in the little bottle compartment. She's not tall enough to come even remotely close to falling out, she likes looking around, and people coo at how cute she looks. I gave up putting her in the seat when she cried, arched her back, thrashed a bit and damn nearly fell out.

Maybe the people looking at her and smiling are secretly judging.

lozster Sun 21-Apr-13 22:12:07

Any risk assessment considers the likelihood that an event will occur and the impact of the event if it does occur. Child falling from a trolley may well be unlikely however it is likely to have a severe outcome if it does. I actually don't think it is that unlikely either - kids climb and pull themselves (hence surely cot sides adjusting/removing a side when the child is big enough to pull themselves). In short, a trolley simply isn't designed to be used in this way and the instructions tell you this. Some parents always think they know better and it's not a great lesson for the child. An equivalent is when Ive seen parents putting their kids in jacuzzis for example at health clubs then arguing with the staff when the no children rule is pointed out to them.

'people coo at how cute she looks. I gave up putting her in the seat when she cried, arched her back, thrashed a bit and damn nearly fell out'

So that's your answer to a unhappy baby, as a presumably responsible parent? Put her somewhere not designed for her, beyond your arms reach? hmm Look, just think about that because she is going to grow and get stronger and even more able to lever herself out.

Theironfistofarkus Sun 21-Apr-13 22:15:23

If you have more than 2 small Dc then it is much easier to shop if they are all contained. Sometimes they all run around in different directions and they can be slippery little eels. Standing in trolley probably not ideal but better than losing one. And trolley surfing is fun!

Of course it has a benefit, it's good for their balance skills wink

<polishes Really really crap parent badge> grin

wonkylegs Sun 21-Apr-13 22:18:06

My sister fell out of a trolley when she was about 3.5 and ended up in hospital with lots of stitches & concussion. It was serious and with it in mind I've never let DS stand up in the trolley.
I remember it well because I was gutted that my brother (because he was making a huge fuss) & my sister (because she was waiting for an ambulance) got toys from the ASDA manager and I got nothing because I was being quiet & good & looking after my baby brother angry I'm not in any way still bitter about thatwink

olivertheoctopus Sun 21-Apr-13 22:26:06

I have never seen a kid get hurt due to standing in a trolley. Perhaps OP is a tad risk adverse. I can hear the helicopter blades whirring...

wherewasi Sun 21-Apr-13 22:26:36

I let DD (13 months) stand in the end of the trolley all the time...she likes looking around, and people coo at how cute she looks.

God that's sad. A tiny child relies on its parent to care for them and protect them but this parent decides it's ok to take unacceptable risks because people think it looks 'cute'.

lozster Sun 21-Apr-13 22:34:23

I'm bemused at why people think that never having seen an accident occur means that something is low risk. As a kid in the 70s I never saw a child go through a windscreen of a car either but I'm still buying a car seat for my baby to be. Several people on here have mentioned their own or other people's accidents that have occurred - do they not count? A child died riding a trolley in B&Q as mentioned up thread.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Sun 21-Apr-13 22:36:40

It is risky.

But the alternative if you have a "runner" is not risk free and probably more likely if less severe (eg chasing the runner down the aisle, maybe having to leave behind a younger sibling in the seat every single shop vs a low likelihood of an injury as a "one off")

I squeeze DS2 (the runner) into the seat or get him to help push (and try not to crash into other shoppers) but I can understand why people balance the risks differently. I can't hold his hand and push the trolley one handed.

On the whole, I shop online.

JenaiMorris Sun 21-Apr-13 22:41:04

Ds tipped a full trolley over once, hanging off the side - shopping everywhere, him underneath.

Thankfully all that happened was that he was very shocked and I got to say 'I told you so'.

Basically, children shouldn't be riding in or on anything other than the seats.

When I was about 3 I fell of the side of a trolley in Kwik Save, I still remember it even though I didn't seriously injure myself.

My ex though, he also fell out of one when he was small but he actually fractured his skull. sad He's suffered terribly with migranes his entire life and thinks that is the cause.

I don't think it is worth the risk.

Theironfistofarkus Sun 21-Apr-13 22:49:01

Ps I have a confession to make. I still trolley surf myself (not with DC standing in trolley or indeed anywhere in the vicinity).

Mehrida Sun 21-Apr-13 22:50:36

This is all just reminding me how much I always wanted to go trolley surfing yesterday when I was wee and DH my mum wouldn't let me.

Thanks for that.

Schooldidi Sun 21-Apr-13 22:54:12

I was injured once in a trolley. I was strapped into the proper seat and when the trolley fell over (because it was missing a wheel shock) my arm was trapped underneath and I broke my wrist.

That hasn't stopped me letting dd2 ride standing up in the main part of the trolley, or hang onto the end. I make the decisions about what I consider to be safe for my child because I know my child and the way she is likely to behave. There are things other parents let their children do that i consider to be unsafe for mine, but that's their decision.

TheMNeffect Sun 21-Apr-13 22:58:05

Youngest DD has fallen out if a trolley when she was 18 months old. She was sat in the seat bit, but there were no straps on this particular shop's trolleys. I was bent down looking at something on the lowest shelves and she landed next to me. Luckily she didn't hurt herself.

She is 2 now and can take the straps off and stand herself up on the seats. She is also the most horrendous bolter. Given even the slightest chance, she would run away and end up in the car park.

So I weigh up the situation and I let her sit in the basket part of the deep trolley as I feel it is the safest of all the options available to me.

I actually do my shopping online so I will only do this when we are nipping in for a few supplies and won't be there long.

I had no idea I was failing her so badly as a parent hmm.

neunundneunzigluftballons Sun 21-Apr-13 23:03:32

If this thread was about stairs, trees, walls whatever we could have a litany of trips, falls and all sorts of hazards. At the end of the day parents need to supervise their kids and even doing that with the best will in the world there will be accidents.

BurnThisDiscoDown Sun 21-Apr-13 23:09:38

I've done this with DS (20 months) once - as soon as I put him in the seat he screamed and started to climb out, and I can't hold his hand and push a trolley at the same time, so I put him in the basket section. I couldn't see an alternative at the time, he only stayed there until I got to the baby aisle and bribed him into the seat with Organix biscuits. blush I've never done it before, but he would have fallen trying to climb out of the seat.

YouDontWinFriendsWithSalad Mon 22-Apr-13 02:35:36

God I must be a terrible mother - I let my kid stand in the trolley AND I take the buggy down the escalator to get to the tube.

reluctantmover Mon 22-Apr-13 08:38:47

Of course it's a risk to put a child into a shopping trolley designed not for toddlers but for putting your purchases in. It's also a risk putting them in the seat, but at least it is designed for that purpose and the likelihood of an accident from the seat it much lower, so long as you keep an eye on your child. You really can't argue that there is no risk in letting them stand or sit inside the main part of the trolley, or hold on to the outside of the trolley. I've seen the odd child fall out. You'll indeed find details of deaths of children who've fallen from these trolleys, yes they are rare but it happens, they are all accidents which would have been avoided if parents had just not put them there. You'll also find details that shopping trolley accidents do make up a small percentage of A+E admissions for children, but you'll find far higher percentages of admissions are due to causes which could have been avoided, such as leaving a baby on a bed, a sofa, a changing table, open stairs, even dropped from arms. Why do parents take these risks? I really don't know.

ilovexmastime Mon 22-Apr-13 08:55:42

I used to let mine sit in the trolley, never stand. I honestly can't see a problem withit.

fortyplus Mon 22-Apr-13 09:02:10

YouDontWinFriendsWithSalad - you'll stop doing it the day your child reaches for something and falls out and lands on his head on a hard floor like mine did when he was 2

reluctantmover Mon 22-Apr-13 09:14:03

Life is full of risks, you just can't avoid them.

I didn't like the idea of taking a child down an escalator in a buggy when they were small. If I was in a shopping centre with the option of lift or escalator, even if the lift was further, I'd take it. If I was taking the tube and the option was stairs and escalator, I'd take the escalator and hold on for dear life! But if I were in a supermarket and had the choice of seat where I could strap a child or where I could let them stand up, the choice was easy to make which was less risky.

I cannot fathom why anyone can't see why there is a problem with a child sitting or standing inside a shopping trolley, when there is a safer option.

Crunchymunchyhoneycakes Mon 22-Apr-13 09:18:06

I saw someone with a baby of about a year old sat precariously on the tiny baby basket seat on the top of a trolley - not even strapped in! So about 5 feet off the ground on a slidy too small seat above a hard floor. I couldn't even look it made me properly shudder. Why would anyone do that? It was so obviously really dangerous. I have a really strong anxiety response to stuff like that though, I can't watch children hanging over balconies and things either it totally freaks me out, I actually have to run away to somewhere I can't see them anymore.

Crunchymunchyhoneycakes Mon 22-Apr-13 09:20:28

Oh and I don't let my son ride in the main bit of the trolley - the older one is 5 and he walks round with us or if we go to one supermarket near us - gets a half hour in the soft play within the shop - there's a good idea! The wee one stays in his sling at the moment but may go in the trolley seat in future.

Crunchymunchyhoneycakes Mon 22-Apr-13 09:20:49

It's like a softplay/crèche thing.

Fakebook Mon 22-Apr-13 09:29:55

Life is one big risk. Stop being a party pooper.

UnChartered Mon 22-Apr-13 09:34:15

i always thought trolley surfing was where you held it by the handle, ran as fast as your could then balanced on the handle to see how far it could run without you knocking loads of jars over touching the floor again

every day a school day wink

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