Aibu to expect abled people to move? (Pushchair related)

(230 Posts)
Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:07:34

If I see a pushchair, wheel chair, person with 101 bags and so on, walking towards me, I would, without hesitation, move out of their way.

Why does it seem that whenever I am out and about with my pushchair, 9/10 times someone will continue to walk towards me with no intention of moving out the way, therefore I end up swerving at the last to move out of their pathway!

I'm particularly cross about this today, as I was walking towards a woman (and I don't mean intentionally to knock her down,) she continued to walk directly towards my pushchair, glaring at me as if to say 'are you going to move?'. For the first time, I didn't and we both came to a standstill. Sounds ridiculous I know, but I was finally fed up with the amount of rude people I encounter and wanted to be sure I wasn't completely over reacting! This lady called me all sorts, and walked past me in a huff!

Other mothers I have spoken to in the past say they encounter this a lot. But they just swerve out of the way to avoid confrontation.

I'm not normally one for causing a scene. But I am amazed that an abled person wouldn't consciously move out of the way of somebody that has a pushchair or struggling with shopping /children etc.

So, aibu?

Rainbowinthesky Mon 01-Apr-13 19:10:08

Yanbu. I always move for pushchairs. Assumed everyone does as its far easier for an able bodied person to step to the side then pushchair.

KayHunt Mon 01-Apr-13 19:10:35

I have this problem. I am invisible being nigh on 6' tall with a very bright coloured pram.

I just move out the way, smile courteously and swear liberally in my head

It's the amount of people who seem to go out of their way to whack DS1 with their bags that gets me. I do see the rage then!

Bluelightsandsirens Mon 01-Apr-13 19:11:05

I'm a mover with or without a buggy if that helps smile

Nancy66 Mon 01-Apr-13 19:11:23

As someone who has just spent the day in central London and had god knows how many buggies pushed into the back of my legs I'd say - yes - you are a bit....

is moving a foot to your right or left that much of an inconvenience?

Are you serious?

Purplecatti Mon 01-Apr-13 19:14:36

Yanbu. I have a huge solid ancient pram. People STILL don't get out the way but at least they come off worse. My baby laughs when she gets bumped.

kinkyfuckery Mon 01-Apr-13 19:14:49

Why should someone move out of your way, just because you are pushing a PFB pram? How do you know said person is 'able bodied'?

chandellina Mon 01-Apr-13 19:15:35

Who cares, pick a fight or get out of the way. Tbh, I've never had this happen or seen it in real life.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:15:44

I'm glad it's not just me! (That sounds awful doesn't it!)

I'm just reeling from the verbal abuse I got from this lady today!!

VinegarDrinker Mon 01-Apr-13 19:16:46

Never thought anyone should move out of my way just because I have a buggy tbh. It's hardly an impediment.

INeedThatForkOff Mon 01-Apr-13 19:16:56

Why should people move for a puschair any more than for someone on their feet? I agree that it's annoying always to be the one who gives way, but life has its polite and rude people, and a passive aggressive sing-song 'Noooo problem,' delivered with a beaming smile, usually makes the point.

The pushchair is a red herring.

blueraincoat Mon 01-Apr-13 19:17:33

YABU. A pushchair is not at all like a wheelchair, a wheelchair takes a lot more manoeuvring for a start. Pushchair does not entitle you to a right of way!

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:19:06

Nancy- I'm not talking about ramming a pushchair into the back of someone's legs!! That's plain rude! I'm talking about a person without a pushchair walking towards a person with a pushchair. Surely the person without the pushchair would think to move??

FarBetterNow Mon 01-Apr-13 19:19:10

YANBU.
Well done for not moving course.

The ones who expect you to move out of their way, will be the same ones who expect me to drive my car up the bank / grass verge in a narrow lane, whilst they drive up the middle of the lane.

It is because they are more important than you and me. (wink)

TondelayoSchwarzkopf Mon 01-Apr-13 19:19:23

YABabitU I think - does your buggy not steer confused

Someone who has a pushchair is not always the same as someone struggling with shopping and / or children and is definitely not the same as a wheelchair user. Most buggies these days are very steerable especially if they only contain one small baby. I guess it's common courtesy to move out of the way for anyway who is approaching regardless of whether they have a pushchair but sometimes you get people who are in their own world or a bit rude. I think you were as bad as the other lady.

A pushchair is not the same as a wheelchair.

FarBetterNow Mon 01-Apr-13 19:20:20

Oh, the wink thing didn't work!!

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:22:20

Kinky- put it this way, no one 'should' move, but someone has to, right. So why (in most of my encounters) 'should' I all the time? Would you seriously walk towards a person pushing a buggy and alway expect that they move?

For the record, third child not pfb

I would move aside for someone who I felt couldn't move aside as easily as me - someone in a wheelchair, or with a buggy for example. That is just being considerate, I think.

Bridgetbidet Mon 01-Apr-13 19:23:20

YABU. I move out of the way whether I have a pram or not. It's not THAT hard. To be honest I've been far more irritated by people with prams who think they can use them as mobile battering rams than people not getting out of my way when I had a pushchair.

YABU its just as easy for someone with a buggy to move as it is for someone walking to step aside.

Pushing a buggy is in no way comparable to being in a wheelchair either hmm

ShellyBoobs Mon 01-Apr-13 19:23:53

Is this a late Aprile Fools' thread?

Why on earth does anyone need to move out of your way when you're walking towards them with a pushchair?

Can you not steer the fucking thing?

confused

BrianButterfield Mon 01-Apr-13 19:24:27

I hate it when you are up against the shop window/wall/etc on a crowded street and people still expect you to move. MOVE WHERE? I can't shrink my pushchair for your convenience! Then they huff about having to walk round you when you couldn't actually move anywhere in the first place, apart from maybe walking backwards down the street.

difficultpickle Mon 01-Apr-13 19:25:01

I look able-bodied but I've currently got a serious knee injury. If someone forces me to swerve out the way I end up in such pain that I struggle to walk. If someone is coming towards me and it is too quick to get out of their way I just stop and wait for them to go round me. The worst for doing that are late teens early 20s men and women with pushchairs.

HeySoulSister Mon 01-Apr-13 19:25:45

What's in that pushchair? Is it the second coming of Christ? Does it not steer?

Salmotrutta Mon 01-Apr-13 19:26:33

I'm not sure i understand confused

Do pushchairs have right of way?

Well I never.

ShellyBoobs Mon 01-Apr-13 19:26:33

FFS. I've just the noticed the pushchair/wheelchair bit too.

angry

MiaowTheCat Mon 01-Apr-13 19:27:02

I lost count of the number of women who drove their pushchairs directly AT me while I was on crutches, obviously heavily pregnant and struggling to walk.

Molehillmountain Mon 01-Apr-13 19:28:07

See, I feel the opposite op. I sort of feel my pushchair does inconvenience people and I usually wait. More often then not, I get waved through or the dance of politeness ensues where each of us is tryi g to get the other to go first. I don't see why a pushchair should always go first.

Has anyone said 'entitled' yet grin

BackforGood Mon 01-Apr-13 19:28:52

YABU .
've never come across this as an issue. It's like driving - you don't get up to an obstacle, then think 'how am I going to deal with this?', you look ahead of you as you are moving, and anticipate things, then a very slight angle moves you around each other. Usually done with the slightest change of direction. I really think you are making an issue where there needn't be one.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:28:55

Can I just clarify, until today I ALWAYS have been the person that moves out the way, because I am polite! But I am human and am quite frankly pissed off with the amount of rude people I encounter that EXPECT me to move.

I guess because I am considerate in general, I'm fed up that when I have my pushchair (sometimes a double as I work with you g children), more times than not people will walk straight towards me with that expected look on their face!!!

Salmotrutta Mon 01-Apr-13 19:28:57

I'm trying very hard not to use the "E" word.

<sits on hands>

SneezingwakestheJesus Mon 01-Apr-13 19:29:20

YABU when its one person walking towards you. YANBU when its two or three blocking the whole pavement and none of them move at all.

Here's my technique if there's a group like that walking towards me with the pram: just stop while they are still a few metres away. They always move then. I've noticed if you keep walking they seem to see it as a challenge not to move but it you stop, you become an obstacle to walk around.

If it was one person walking towards me, I'd just move if they weren't. Pushing a pram doesn't give us any more rights of way.

Salmotrutta Mon 01-Apr-13 19:29:49

Hahaha!

X-post with MissyMoo.

HeySoulSister Mon 01-Apr-13 19:30:15

EXPECT?? So you feel they should move and not you? You sound, yes I will say it, entitled!!

McNewPants2013 Mon 01-Apr-13 19:31:31

How do you know the person who has not moved has a hidden disability.

Great minds think alike Salmo

And hurrah for HeySoul for being the first to use it grin

Salmotrutta Mon 01-Apr-13 19:32:29

Ooh that's torn it.

<hides>

Salmotrutta Mon 01-Apr-13 19:33:50

I predict interestingness on this thread.

I always used to move and still do for some people.

My buggy is fecking massive this one I don't move anymore though and just stop and wait for them to move around.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:36:46

Haha! Typical, a lot of you have miss interpreted my thread. Clearly, the majority walk straight towards a person that is pushing a pushchair, after all. It can steer can't it!!!!

As someone who doesn't always go out and about with a pushchair, I would without hesitation move out the way if someone way heading in my direction with a pushchair. Not because I think they have right of way! But because it is ever so slightly easier. For me to walk around them!

And those who haven't encountered this problem are bloody lucky. I live in London. You don't go a day without seeing a herd of pushchairs!

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:38:21

Mcnewpants - likewise for the person pushing a pushchair!

TheCraicDealer Mon 01-Apr-13 19:39:40

Having a child in a pushchair does not give you priority. There have been a number of occasions in shopping centres or on the high street when I have had to dodge prams being pushed at speed with a single-mindedness that would put Jenson Button to shame. If you're not nippy enough with the damn thing to treat other people courteously when you're out and about, get a sling.

And those people who hang shopping off the side and then squeeze past you and whack your legs- do you have no spatial awareness?

VinegarDrinker Mon 01-Apr-13 19:39:40

I live in London, too, and have never had this problem confused

FakeHotCrossLobsters Mon 01-Apr-13 19:39:52

I've noticed a lot of people who seem to have a fixed course and don't want to move even an inch off it, regardless of who has buggies, bags, wheel-chairs or anything else.

I'm sure in the past most people used to move a little bit out of each others way, more if the other person wasn't as obviously able to move. You know, both take a half step to the right as you approached each other and it meant you both passed by without bumping.

But now it seems like if I don't move entirely out of everybody's way, they bump me. I do my half step but they don't do theirs. And they usually follow up with a mouth full of abuse.

milkwagon Mon 01-Apr-13 19:40:57

OP - get a grip. You're the one with the obstacle trundling up the pavement, not the other way round.

I always move out of the way whoever is walking towards me, I am fit and able and I know nothing of the other person so its just basic manners for me to do it IMO. Its really no big deal at all.

ChippyMinton Mon 01-Apr-13 19:42:46

YABU and entitled. As it's your buggy that is taking up space on the pavement of course you should move out of the way.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:46:49

I don't believe I should have priority. It just makes sense for the hands free person to move?! But then I have always been the considerate one and moved anyway. More fool me!

For the record (with the exception of today) I never charge towards someone with my pushchair expecting them to move, it's just general navigating your way around a busy London pavement. But hey that must just make me sound entitled confused

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:48:35

Chippy-you're being ridiculous now!

piprabbit Mon 01-Apr-13 19:49:18

People never step out of my way, or do anything which might make life one teeny bit easier. For example, a couple of weeks ago I was walking on a footpath beside a busy road. A pair of women were walking towards me chatting. They could have walked single file for a couple of steps while we passed, but they chose not to. I had the choice to either step into the road or into the hedge. I stepped into the hedge and waited for them to pass. Instead of saying thanks, smiling or giving me a small nod of recognition, they gave me nasty looks and made some nasty comments.
Cows.

ihearsounds Mon 01-Apr-13 19:50:03

I am pissed off with the amount of people pushing buggies that expect me to move. Damn right rude. Why should I have to move out of your way? I do not appreciate being glared at either. Modern buggies are usually light weight and easy to manoeuvre.

And what really, really, really fucks me off is the entitled knobbers with their buggies that glare at me, swear at me, and try and ram us when I am pushing a wheelchair. You know because I should move easily the wheelchair out of their way..And the ones out in a group are the worse type. When we go out, I know make sure I am wearing hard boots, because those cows will steer into ankles as the walk past, when I have to stop in the middle of the pavement to let them past.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:50:06

Milk wagon- So you don't move for pushchairs? So that makes you entitled??

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 19:51:54

Ihearsounds- if you are pushing a wheelchair, I understand. But that's a whole different argument

maddening Mon 01-Apr-13 19:53:24

I just stop dead and let them walk around me.

marjproops Mon 01-Apr-13 19:55:32

one of my fave videos ever is the Verve-bittersweet symphony, where hes walking up a street and no one gets out of the way and he barges through them!

tried it myself one day with DC in her buggy....nope, we're invisible arent we?

ChippyMinton Mon 01-Apr-13 19:56:01

Am I?
FWIW, I had 3 DC under 2.5yrs. in a double buggy with a buggy board, and I did not expect people to get out of my way, as I have good manners. Something which seems to be increasingly lacking these days [grumpy old woman]

maddening Mon 01-Apr-13 19:56:07

and I make eye contact and smile nicely - no need for a stand off and generally people smile back and say hello as they pass or I make a comment such as "they never think of pushchairs when they build pavements do they" and everything remains pleasant :-)

derpityderp Mon 01-Apr-13 19:57:20

Walk fast and look arsey and/or pretend you're not paying attention.
Probably BU but I get what you mean. Sometimes it's easier for people to move especially when they're one of those path hogs who waddles in the very middle. They could just move to one side a bit and give equal amount of path so you can pass each other but nooo.
I always get it in waves when everyone fucking does it and I'm the one going left, right, left, right. Gets right on my tits.

FierceBadIggi Mon 01-Apr-13 19:58:03

Missymoo has it - it's all about manners really.
Just me and pram = I move out of the way of person with pram and pre-schooler. Me, pram and dc1 = we move out of the way of elderly person with a stick.
When someone stands back to let me past, I show my appreciation.
Prams/buggies are not going to be easier to move out of the way than it is for a pramless person without mobility issues to move course slightly.
There aren't enough well-mannered people around these days wanders off the read DM

mumofweeboys Mon 01-Apr-13 19:58:50

If its just a buggy then 50/50, sometimes I moved, sometimes people get out of my way.

However if Im pushing my phil and ted with my 18 month old and 4 year old in it and myself being hugely 36 weeks pregnant, Im not moving for anyone. As the p&t doesnt swerve with that much weight in it. I walk very slowly -not much choice at the mo so loads time for people to move but still end up with the odd mexican stand off lll

ihearsounds Mon 01-Apr-13 19:59:22

I don't always push a wheelchair. Even when I am not pushing one, why should I move out of your way? When I am pushing a wheelchair, I try and steer round people, depending on who I am pushing.. I actually find the worse offenders, buggies pushers.. Able bodied people will walk around us.

Tbh I think people are getting fed up with the attitude from some buggy pushers. Ramming people is not an uncommon event. barging past people in and out of shops is becoming the norm. Arguments on buses about wheelchair spaces is the norm with the buggy brigade. Aggression from buggy pushers is becoming the norm. The 'entitled' believe is taking over. The parking spaces. The children running around restaurants.. I could go on. It's all, well I pushed a kid out of my chuff and I expect all this special treatment.

imaginethat Mon 01-Apr-13 20:02:58

I think you are right OP. I happily step aside for prams, stray children etc and I can't think why anyone would seek out a collision course. I was the same when I had children in prams, I'd veer to one side or wait if it was a bit of a squeeze so I didn't bump them I didn't actually have very many bad experiences but my friends in posh areas complained often of aggression from those walking towards them. It seems to me a lot of people are angry and looking for a fight.

mumofweeboys Mon 01-Apr-13 20:05:37

Now parking spaces for parent and child are a blessing for those of us lugging young children about. Nothing irritates me more than seeing someone with their 9/10 year old parking in these spaces as Im trying to manhandle my under 5s with my gigantic preggers belly out of the car in normal space.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 20:07:29

Chipy- as my op states, I am very well mannered and always move. Doesn't mean I don't get mighty pissed off that 9/10 people 'expect' that I move, as if to say my pushchair has inconvenienced them. You are clearly a better person than I am, if you genuinely don't get a little miffed that it is always you that 'has' to move.

Today I finally snapped. And it proved my point all along.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 20:09:06

Mumofweeboys- I too am a phil and ted owner! They an be a nightmare at times but would be lost without it:-)

hazeyjane Mon 01-Apr-13 20:09:57

ihearsounds, I really hate phrases like he 'buggy brigade', it implies that everyone who pushes buggies are entitled idiots, who believe that they should take priority over everyone else, and I just really don't think this is the case.

Also (and I know I might be in the minority of buggy users here), there are children in buggies who are disabled, I hate to think we are being lumped in with this entitled, selfish, 'buggy brigade' you talk of.

FWIW, I always move, but it does hack me off when this means moving out into the road, or having to tip the buggy into a hedge when walking down a narrow path, meaning the whole buggy nearly tips over!

Round these parts people kind of vear slightly to one side as somones approaching and other person see this and vears slightly to the opposite side, so neither are expecting to walk straight or move too much. Kind of a human version of plane crash avoidance.

We have very narrow and cobbled paths and people then to both stop, spend the next minute waving for the other one to go and then saying "after you" until busier out of the two finally gives up and goes. Only to be met 5 steps down the path with another routine of stop, wave, "after you", oh fuck this, I'm going.

In stand off situations I would go with the, you move, you have the obstacle. But then I would move regardless of pushchair or not. <Helpful>

ChippyMinton Mon 01-Apr-13 20:10:37

I suspect a lot of buggy pushers have the same mindset as urban 4x4 drivers...

BoundandRebound Mon 01-Apr-13 20:11:15

Yes you are completely unreasonable regarding pushchairs - you should move your pushchair out of people's way. It comes with wheels to enable you to do so

You are not disabled by your child. You a simply acting like an entitled brat.

It is common courtesy to ensure you don't impede other people which is why people step around each other politely in our society

SoWhatIfImWorkingClass Mon 01-Apr-13 20:11:36

I don't get why some have such a problem with people who are pushing pushchairs/ strollers/ prams/ pramettes/ travel systems the lot.

Get the fuck over it.

crashdoll Mon 01-Apr-13 20:13:24

I posted the other day that I have recently been at the mercy of entitled pushchair drivers who think people walking down a busy street should part like the red sea for their precious cargo to move through.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 20:13:53

Fierce- that's just it really. Manners. I am astounded by the lack of them when I'm out and about. Even with a pushchair, I move out the way for another person with a pushchair. But more often than not, that person looks like they were about to move also.

ihearsounds Do you not even consider that some of those "buggy brigade" might be disabled themselves and it could be painful to move out of the way for every single person that walks by?

Changebagsandgladrags Mon 01-Apr-13 20:15:50

I have a personal rule. If I am out with the pushchair I move for old people, or those who look like they would have difficulty moving out of the way. Also small children, I always go around them so that my pushchair is between them and the road.

Other people I normally don't try to go around because it would mean me being nearer the road. My own rule is an adult should be nearer the road. I also move out of the way for other pushchairs that look heavier/harder to steer/with younger children in. Babies should never have to pass on the roadside.

I get a bit narked off on one particular route. DS aged two likes to walk on a very low wall/kerb type thing by a grass verge. But I have to hold his hand. The amount of people who think it's not sensible to go round us. Grrrr. Also adults who want to walk on the wall and think I am going to move DS.

WestieMamma Mon 01-Apr-13 20:18:44

In my experience it wouldn't make any difference whether the OP was disabled or not. I am disabled and have to use a rollator when I'm out and I'm often rather slow too. I get so frustrated with people refusing to give way, like the OP describes, and/or getting angry/tutting/bitching about me getting in their way.

Strangely enough, the only place where I haven't encountered this is when I go to London. The first time I went I was dreading it as I thought it would be 100 x worse than normal. I found Londoners were exceptionally polite and accommodating, even on the tube at rush hour.

Redbindy Mon 01-Apr-13 20:19:07

OP, are you unable to steer the pushchair? Perhaps some L plates would come in handy.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 20:19:37

Boundandrebound- so I am entitled, and those Individuals that walk right towards my pushchair and expect I move out of their way....they're not acting entitled? Or bad mannered? Please clarify this for me....

badtime Mon 01-Apr-13 20:21:11

YABU
I think each person should move, that way nobody has to move as much.
And what the hell is 'abled'?

Itsaboatjack Mon 01-Apr-13 20:21:54

YANBU at all. I also live in London and am constantly amazed at the number of people with no basic manners or consideration for other people.

I've had people walk out of a shop or round a corner and walk into the side of the buggy and glare at me for being there. I've had people overtaking me, and as soon as they are passed me they start moving over infront of me as if the buggy no longer exists so they either walk into it or I have to slow or stop to give them space. If people drove like they walk down the street, with such little awareness of what's going on around them they wouldn't make it to the end of their roads.

My dd is now out of her buggy and walking, she is quite slow so we try and stay over to the side so out of the way as much as possible, people still try to push between her and the buildings. And don't get me started on women with their massive handbags that all seem to be at toddler head height, more than a few times I've had to pull her out of the way of being clouted with one, or if we are somewhere very busy I've even had to put my hand out to stop the bag hitting her and I get looked at like I'm trying to mug them.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 20:22:43

Redbindy-,I am as unable to steer a pushchair, as you are able to read my post properly.

crashdoll Mon 01-Apr-13 20:22:48

Btw I would move out of the way, especially if it was one of those big tank pram types. I just dislike the expectation that I should move.

SoWhatIfImWorkingClass Mon 01-Apr-13 20:22:50

Maryshoppins It seems your manners go right out of the window once you set foot on the pavement with a pushchair.

Pavement??? Get on road!

kungfupannda Mon 01-Apr-13 20:24:11

I find that there are a huge number of people out there who don't seem to be capable of making the most minor of adjustments to their course so that people can actually pass them without leaping into the road.

I also seem to encounter quite a few people who start off on one side of the pavement and then get drawn towards anyone going the opposite way on the other side of the pavement, as though they are magnetic. I spend a lot of time muttering "walk in a straight line!"

I've only occasionally used a buggy (I'm completely incompetent at driving one so I became a full-time sling user pretty early on) and I haven't found buggy-less people any more or less willing to move when I've had the buggy. However I do seem to spend a lot of time leaping out of the way of buggies, particularly those walking in pairs on narrow pavements who seem to be entirely incapable of breaking formation so that the woman, the baby and the small child don't have to hurl themselves into the road.

FierceBadIggi Mon 01-Apr-13 20:24:20

Ihearsounds - what a lovely, moderate post hmm You must live in a really awful place to have had all those experiences, but feel free to extrapolate that everyone who used a pushchair is the same as the thoughtless ones you have met!

One thing that certainly isn't as easy for a pram as for the average pedestrian is to sidestep briefly off the pavement. I love the post that suggested if you're not prepared to swerve your pram you should wear a sling - strange how we think of all sorts of physical reasons why a pedestrian might have difficulty moving/hidden disabilities, but the parent/carer must be at the peak of fitness, no bad back, SPD or post c-section wound holding them back from carrying their baby!
And then of course there's the problem when all the well-mannered people meet, and you each swerve in the same direction and do that odd dance thing..

ouryve Mon 01-Apr-13 20:27:58

So long as you're not the person who was walking behind me with a soaking wet buggy, the other week, ramming me in the back of the legs. It was busy, there was a guy in front of me plainly struggling with the crowds (trainspotter type, my aspie radar was bleeping wildly) and I was hardly going to barge past him to face the same oncoming crowd he was facing. And if I couldn't get through, the person with the buggy couldn't get through, either.

I did turn round and point out to her the folly of her ways.

So, as long as you're not that person, YANBU.

IvorHughJangova Mon 01-Apr-13 20:29:30

For fucks sake. If it's easier for one person to move than for another to move, then the person who has it easier should move. Simple. If I'm pushing a pram and someone's prancing along towards me not pushing one, they should move. If someone was pushing a pram and I was prancing along towards them not pushing one, I'd move. Anyone who expects others to accommodate them when they're obviously going to be the greater inconvenienced by doing so is being this fucking 'entitled' that the sheep on this forum so love to bleat about at the moment.

Why does everything have to turn into such a boring, repetitive, spiteful bloody argument?

ouryve Mon 01-Apr-13 20:34:28

Posted before finishing - YANBU, so long as you're sure that person is able bodied and hands free and it really is easier for them to move than for you.

Maryshoppins Mon 01-Apr-13 20:37:01

Ouryve- it wasn't me. Promise! :-)

Theicingontop Mon 01-Apr-13 20:39:28

I think its far worse when you're walking with a child, and people take no notice of the tiny person holding your hand, and barge right into them.

I'm an apologetic buggy driver. I move out of the way, and if I see a stream of people coming towards me I'll 'park up' out of the way and let them pass. I'm very aware that a buggy takes up a lot of room on a footpath.

Just polite really.

TheCraicDealer Mon 01-Apr-13 20:40:47

For fucks sake. If it's easier for one person to move than for another to move, then the person who has it easier should move.

Well who it's "easier" for is a matter for debate. If I'm at the edge of a pavement and a pram pusher refuses to accommodate me and I'm forced into the gutter, that's hardly easier for me than for them to correct their path slightly and allow both of us past.

And yeah, some people have mentioned getting slings, and there are plenty of times when this might not be an option for a parent. However, there are also plenty of occasions when it might be difficult for a seemingly "able bodied" person to dodge a travel system. Swings and roundabouts.

Aside from the rudeness factor, a pram has the potential to cause someone injury, not unlike a car (hear me out). So when "driving" said pram, the pusher should make allowances for other road users pedestrians and try not to hurt or inconvenience them more than necessary.

IncrediblePhatTheInnkeepersCat Mon 01-Apr-13 20:59:41

Ivor "For fucks sake. If it's easier for one person to move than for another to move, then the person who has it easier should move. Simple. If I'm pushing a pram and someone's prancing along towards me not pushing one, they should move. If someone was pushing a pram and I was prancing along towards them not pushing one, I'd move"

^^ yes, exactly!

I've always been a leap out of the way of anyone person, except when there is a huge group of people taking up the whole pavement, then I stop dead for them to navigate me.

Now when I'm out with the pushchair, I still move out of the way of people in wheelchairs, people with sticks/crutches/mobility scooters/young children/lots of shopping/elderly people/other pushchair users, people looking in windows or having a conversation, but equally I expect similar treatment in return from those for whom it is easier to take a split second to take a side-step.

The other day I pulled over in a doorway to let an older lady pass as a lamppost stopped us both using the pavement at the same time, but she insisted I go first saying that "prams have right of way" with a twinkle. I seem to find myself in a politeness dance with lots of people who I'd move out of the way for, lots of smiling and thanks given.

GreenEggsAndNichts Mon 01-Apr-13 23:04:24

As someone upthread mentioned, if I found myself coming up on a situation where I couldn't easily swerve, I'd just stop. Early on, while they're still a few feet away, so I wasn't in their face or anything. I'd manage a feeble smile or whatever, they'd do the same, life went on.

Pushchairs are fairly nimble so I can't actually think of many times when I struggled. It was the early days when he was in a larger buggy that I'd have to do the stopping thing. He wasn't even in a particularly monstrous thing, but the wheels were large (it was secondhand so I can't quote a name brand, something by Mothercare iirc) and it just wasn't as easy to steer.

So glad we're past that stage, though we are considering having another. sigh.

AlbertoFrog Mon 01-Apr-13 23:22:28

OP YANBU.

I have always moved aside for everyone and anyone and still found myself doing so when I became a buggy pusher however, DS is getting somewhat heavier and (for example)on fruit and veggie buying days I find it a bit harder, and slower, to steer out the way of oncomers so now I just stop dead (though obviously not in front of wheelchairs or other visable impediments)

There seems to be as big a lack of manners in the High Street as there is on Mumsnet these days smile

Xmasbaby11 Mon 01-Apr-13 23:28:46

I have a slimline buggy and try to stay out of people's way as much as possible, but i find most people kind.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 00:04:23

It seems that there are very mixed views here. I suppose the title of my thread sounds very 'entitled, but the context of my op says otherwise.

I am genuinely shocked at the people who think that a pushchair is an obstruction and therefore, the user 'should' be the person to move!

In an ideal world, we would all be considerate, but I feel it is always me that is the considerate one, and that those individuals who walk straight towards me with no intention of budging over are damn right bloody rude!

Albertofrog - I completely agree with you. It's challenging enough shopping with a pushchair/children! and when you are literally railroaded into a different path you can end up causing more chaos!

Xmasbaby - I'm not so lucky!

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 00:35:05

Here's a thought, not sure if someone has already said it, but what if these "damn right bloody rude" people are people just like you who have moved out of the way every single other time and it just so happens that the day you walk towards them is the day they became sick of it and decided not to move no matter who walks towards them?

Or it could be that they've moved for a lot of people that day and their moving karma quota for the day is full so they decide to let the next person move and it just happens to be you.

Every person you walk towards isn't connected. Its not like they know you have moved for everybody all day so they aren't being any less considerate than you are being expecting them to move. How do you know they aren't in exactly the same frame of mind and feel like they are always the one to move? You don't and they don't.

YABU for thinking there's some vendetta against you and that you are always the considerate one.

toffeelolly Tue 02-Apr-13 00:48:58

Of course she should have moved out of your way. This person clearly does likely not have children , just no manner's . I alway's move out of way for pram's.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 00:59:57

Sneezingwakesthejesus - Oh come on! considering the years I have been pushing a pushchair and the amount of times I have encountered this problem, I'd say it's very unlikely. Obviously, yes sometimes that may be the case. But I'm talking about in general.

Also I wouldn't hesitate to move over if the oncoming person had lots of bags, pushchair, kids - whatever! because it's what considerate people do. S when it is always me moving, yes, I get pretty miffed about it! The woman in question today, was clearly challenging me as she walked towards me. Therefore I refused to budge!

toffeelolly Tue 02-Apr-13 01:03:32

You were just right.

ComposHat Tue 02-Apr-13 01:10:43

YABU

I have lost count of the number of times I have been thwacked in the shins and ankles by twats pushing those absurd three wheeled buggies the size of a sherman tank. I am silently thankful when I get off the bus unscathed by one of those monstrosities.

They might be fashionable, but in the busy centre of a medieval city they are utterly inapropriate as they take up almost all of the pavement to transport a tiny child. Sorry but I'm not going to step into on-coming traffic, just because the yummy mummies of Edinburgh have more money than sense. If you want more space, buy a smaller more manoeuvrable buggy.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 01:19:59

ComposHat - Sorry, but what has that got to do with my op? I am not advocating people whacking others in the shins? I have be whacked on many occasions by people with walking sticks, pushchairs, bags, feet...it's not nice!

With regards to the larger pushchairs - some people need larger pushchairs if they are transporting more than one child around!!

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 01:21:16

toffeelolly - it's nice to know others are considerate :-)

ComposHat Tue 02-Apr-13 01:26:15

Just to point out that pram users can be bloody inconsiderate and self centred and that it doesn't give them the same rights as emergency vehicles: respect is a mutual thing. If a pram user has whacked me in the ankles getting on and off the bus, don't expect me to fall over myself to ease the same person's passage along the pavement.

And why are kids kept in pushchair til close on to puberty these days? aside from children with disabilities, is there any reason other than parental laziness? (realises I've become my own mother)

DramaLlamaFarmer Tue 02-Apr-13 01:27:41

Why should someone move out of your way because you have attained the awesome status of breeding?? Just point your fucking awesome pram away from the person who doesn't give two flying figs that you have bred and get on your way.

I spent every second of Sunday going around a nature reserve with my H. He has slipped two discs in his back and is also suffering sciatic nerve pain. Walking is pure agony for him. As he tried to hobble, bent over his crutch, from the car to the coffee shop, he was walked at by constant waves of people with prams who were apparently incapable of pointing their pram wheels away from the man bent over a crutch in agony. Strange that.

DramaLlamaFarmer Tue 02-Apr-13 01:31:09

Oh and between us we have 6 children. I never assumed that the fact I had bred gave me right to walk at people and push them off a pavement.

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 01:36:06

Mary, in that case you are both as petty and childish as each other. You must find walking very stressful if you take every time you walk towards someone as a battle.

abbyfromoz Tue 02-Apr-13 01:41:06

Haven't read the whole thread just the OP... Just wanted to say i agree with you and YANBU. Same goes with able bodied people hijacking lifts when there are perfectly good escalators I (with a buggy) cannot use and therefore have to wait for at least 2 to go by before I am able to fit in due to lazy people who are often only going one floor! confused

I'm one of those people with a massive tank of a buggy, anything smaller and There isn't enough suspension and I can't bloody push it. I don't think it's possible to push a child and use a walking frame or sticks, is it? So I will stick with my monstrosity.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 01:44:40

Drama- wtf??? You have gone completely off the point? I am not and have never been a precious mother who thinks everyone thinks my children are gods gift and more! Either way, completely irrelevant. This is about basic consideration which in my experience, is rather one sided. Did you not bother to read my post with regards to always being the one to move??? Thought not!

Oh, and with regards to your husband, I would have moved for him. Again not my original point regarding able bodied people!

DramaLlamaFarmer Tue 02-Apr-13 01:46:30

No actually you are right. I had skimmed the OP and not fully read the point you were making so I apologise.

rentalproperly Tue 02-Apr-13 01:50:39

Once, after buying something on a market stall, I turned to leave and my shopping bag bopped a small child in a pushchair. The child was behind me, and like most pedestrians, I wasn't using a rear-view mirror. The mother went slightly bonkers, accusing me of hitting her child. I told her off for letting her child bruise the bananas I'd just bought.

Now, she was insane and entitled. The OP seems perfectly reasonable. YANBU.

abbyfromoz Tue 02-Apr-13 01:51:04

P.s for those asking 'why should we move out the way for a pushchair/buggy' because 1) there is often no where to go (have once been forced onto a busy road due to crowds pushing me thus)
2) they are harder to manoeuvre than if you were to simply take a step to one side
3) because it's considerate (see 1 & 2)
I too have been run down by buggies before and had them clip my heals, but if you refer to 2) (being that they are hard to manoeuvre) and if you receive an apology, i think it's a forgivable misdemeanour.
Also you will notice that if you do have a buggy how unbelievably unaware people are of their own surroundings...for example crossing the pedestrian and then stopping on the curb to stare at your feet when there is a woman with a buggy ON THE ROAD behind you is probably not the best idea.
Oh and no don't worry about blocking the exit i am just standing here for fun because i like standing in random places ridiculously invading your personal space... For no reason... But to stand next to you....when YOU ARE BLOCKING THE EXIT....
Rant over.

DramaLlamaFarmer Tue 02-Apr-13 01:52:55

Clearly your fault for not buying bananas that were slightly under ripe. The child taught you a valuable life lesson. grin

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 01:53:40

Drama- no worries! I can understand why you'd be fuming regarding your husband.

rentalproperly Tue 02-Apr-13 01:54:51

Drama - I will not be made to wait 3 days to eat my bananas. I will not.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 01:55:49

Abby- you hit the nail on the head :-)

DramaLlamaFarmer Tue 02-Apr-13 01:56:39

abby you must bear in mind that the majority of the people you just gave a life lesson to have already managed some considerable years of managing buggies prams toddlers newborns kids and all other connotations of the same and all without helpful advice on how to manage the same grin

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 01:56:42

Rental - that's hilarious :-)

Bananas are best when they're all bruised, is that under or over ripe?

abbyfromoz Tue 02-Apr-13 01:57:47

Hence why i said 'if you have used a buggy'...

DramaLlamaFarmer Tue 02-Apr-13 01:57:58

Well clearly you buy your bananas at asda....<cough> chav <cough>

toffeelolly Tue 02-Apr-13 08:26:20

Is this thread about banana"s nowwink

PlumSykes Tue 02-Apr-13 08:31:26

I know what you mean. I am thankfully past the pushchair stage, but it always struck me as far easier for a single pedestrian to move aside than for a person pushing a vehicle. And it's not exactly a massive inconvenience, is it?

Bumply Tue 02-Apr-13 08:43:42

As someone who takes a blind lady out shopping I'm often astonished at the fact that she turns invisible as soon as I'm leading her. The number of people who bump into her in a wide shopping mall with plenty of space is amazing. She's in her 80s so attempting to side step her out of someone's path at the last minute isn't always possible.
There's a lot if inconsiderate unthinking people out there, pushchair or not.

weegiemum Tue 02-Apr-13 08:47:27

I can't always move aside easily. If I'm on a good day (no stick or wheelchair) then I don't look disabled but I have very poor balance and would fall if I had to swerve.

There are some rather entitled buggy-pushers out there. I've had rolled eyes and tutting when I wanted to use a lift in my chair or with my stick. And 3+ years ago when I was ok but my dd2 was in a major buggy with a serious hip problem, I got asked to move out of the wheelchair space on the bus by buggy pushers (the McLaren major is officially a wheelchair and my dd couldn't weight bear at all without being in agony).

Just because you have a baby with wheels you don't have right of way!

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 08:54:44

Why do you have such a sense of entitlement to the right of way just because you have a pushchair?

You are the one taking up more room?

I HATE women who think everyone should move out of their way just because they have a pushchair - YOU are the one with the bulky item, YOU move!

InSearchOfPerfection Tue 02-Apr-13 09:02:02

I would say YANBU and YABU

I think it's more a case of seeing the situation and for both persons to make an effort. Sometimes it will be easier for the walking person to move away, sometimes it will be easier for the pushchair to move away.

TBH, I have seen that happening too with two able bodied persons with one person refusing to move out of the way. Or playing the game of 'I am not going to move until the last minute' to see who would 'win'. Cue for brushing shoulders as people passed each other and usually one of the person quietly or not so quietly swearing at the other....
I've actually seeing one person becoming physically threatening during one of these encounters shock

A bit hmm about 'you are the one with the bulky item, you move' though. If you have a bulky item, where are you physically suppose to move?? I mean sometimes, there just isn't room at all unless the other person change his/her way slightly.

HarrySnotter Tue 02-Apr-13 09:07:51

Shouldn't it just be a case of both parties making an effort to make it easier for each other. If it's easier for the person without a pram to move they move, if easier for the person with the pram, they should move.

I cannot abide this notion that just because you have a pram the great masses should part like the red sea to let you through. I would always move out of the way for anyone with pram, bags etc but if it was more sensible for them to move for me, then they should.

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 09:09:43

"A bit about 'you are the one with the bulky item, you move' though. If you have a bulky item, where are you physically suppose to move?? I mean sometimes, there just isn't room at all unless the other person change his/her way slightly"

Oh so just because I haven't bred yet I am the one who must be shoved into the road/hedge/ etc etc?

If you have nowhere to go - stop.

My point is that you don't just automatically get the right of way JUST BECAUSE you have a pushchair.

FWIW, I am usually a give-wayer. But it is irritating that the push chair users I have come across just seem to EXPECT EVERYONE to move out of their way like Moses parting the Red Sea. It's very very very irritating and rude.

reneaa2 Tue 02-Apr-13 09:11:11

I always move to the side if I can and if someone is coming towards me.

Often if it is too crowded or if I can't move the side easily for whatever reason I just stop where I am, smile and say sorry.

I haven't met any rudness doing this, although I feel bad if I am holding up people behind me but often there is no alternative.

Ambridge Tue 02-Apr-13 09:11:46

I'd generally take the view that the more burdened person (in this case you, OP) would not feel obliged to move. Especially if the other person is not particularly laden down and it's just easier for them to swerve to one side.

But it's a matter of common sense and courtesy, both of which seem to be in short supply these days. Only yesterday I was in a crowded coffee-shop and had to get between two tables to reach the only free seat. A girl (well, in her 20's, so a girl to me grin) was sitting at the other table with a folder and book spread out so it was sticking out into the space between.

Did she move it back onto her table so I could get past? Of course she bloody didn't, I just got the flat stare of death as I tried to manoeuvre past. And then again when I had to go back to the counter to get something.

Sigh. It's that kind of pointless stubbornness that really gets me angry. Similar to people refusing to give way on pavements.

InSearchOfPerfection Tue 02-Apr-13 09:18:26

MrsSpagBol,
As I said in my post, I believe that both person need to make an effort.

However, the way your post was worded didn't make me think we were on the same lines but that you thought the one with the pushchair should move in any case.
You've clarify that.

SoWhatIfImWorkingClass Tue 02-Apr-13 09:19:16

And it's not exactly a massive inconvenience, is it?

No but to some people it's just the "moral" of it or something like that. Like, they know it's easier for the person without the pushchair to move but the person with the pushchair has to make the effort to move as well just because it's what people expect them to do.

Just for the record I always move. For one I don't have time to waste dodging people an for two with this compensation state we live in I can't be arsed with people looking for opportunities to swindle some money out of people.

"oh I'll just casually walk in to this mum with her pram so she hurts my foot and I can make a big song and dance about it in the street."

SoWhatIfImWorkingClass Tue 02-Apr-13 09:20:09

*waste time dodging people

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 09:34:51

InSearch

Yes I think my post was poorly worded but more out of a sense of a frustration rather than an extreme view that anyone carrying something heavy or pushing a pram should always move.

For clarity, I think if both people moved as much as they could, there would be very few stand offs. It just makes more sense.

There is something about the OP's tone that irritated me - I think the vague suggestion/ idea that pushing a pram is some great hardship and just because I am not pushing a pram I must automatically move out the way.

As I said, I am always a give wayer (to the point that it sometimes annoys people behind me) - it's just this thing the mums in my area have where they think they are entitled to the entire aisle/path/walkway/pavement for the sole reason that they have a pushchair.

And it just riles me - "your pushchair, your problem" is what I think in my head (while I give way!)

Mia4 Tue 02-Apr-13 09:52:03

YANBU but aggressive people seem to be everywhere! The amount of times I've been struggling with bags and have had doors slammed in my face, not held for a moment to help, or been barged into.

But people with buggys and the like can get very aggressive themselves, some -and i stress some because not all and i do try and maneuver out of their way anyway- parents are aggressive selfish shits when it comes to this.

I've had a dad run into the back of my ankles while 'playing' with their kid in the trolley, and not even giving a sorry just an 'opps you know how kids are', I do know how kids are mate but you were the one in control of the trolley-don't fucking 'play' races down Tesco aisle. They almost sent an old lady flying after that and did clip a five/four year old who burst into tears and wailed loud enough to bring half the store and security who evicted the dad.

Plus my poor partner had someone bash past him into his back and side with a buggy when he was waiting in a line at boots Pharmacy - I gave that woman a piece of my mind, she had the whole other side of the aisle but decided toe 'owned the middle' since she had a push chair expected him to move for her because she had a buggy. My poor partner was waiting for a prescription after having his appendix out, he wasn't exacty with it anyway and didn't see her coming, not to mention how much room she had to move around him!

I saw her again when getting into the car, she gave me a withing look and said 'oh it's you really loudly to catch our attention' to which i replied that i hoped she drove better on the road, or else she should hand in her licence for public protection. Even her husband laughed, she didn't seem too impressed like that but he was shrugging and nodding and agreeing so hopefully she took note that she was being a selfish shit.

SpecialAgentTattooedQueen Tue 02-Apr-13 09:59:43

I never care (as a twin buggy pusher occasionally) as long as there isn't shopping bags attached to the sides. That is rude and creating unnecessary issues.

So even though I find your tone entitled, YANBU.

You are, however, being beyond unreasonable comparing a wheelchair to a (non specialist)buggy.

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 10:06:34

"I've had a dad run into the back of my ankles while 'playing' with their kid in the trolley, and not even giving a sorry just an 'opps you know how kids are', I do know how kids are mate but you were the one in control of the trolley-don't fucking 'play' races down Tesco aisle."

jumps up and down

^ ^ ^ what she said!!!

HoHoHoNoYouDont Tue 02-Apr-13 10:10:08

I take great pleasure in watching people get rammed by pushchairs because they have their head down texting and aren't watching where they're going! Only last week I witnessed this on a busy shopping street. The mum could swerve as the street was packed so she just stopped hoping the guy coming towards her would move. He didn't, so his ankles got rammed! Luckily the toddler sat in the pram was unhurt.

HoHoHoNoYouDont Tue 02-Apr-13 10:10:58

* couldn't swerve I meant to say!

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 10:44:19

Mrsspagbol- like you, I am always the one to give way. Therefore I don't consider myself entitled at all. I get frustrated too, frustrated that I will always be the one to move aside (sometimes causing further obstruction with my "bulky item" when in a crowded place). While the hands free persons trolls on oblivious and in their own world at times - now that sounds rather entitled to me!!

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 10:52:37

Specialagent- my point about the wheelchair is not that I believe a pushchair ranks the same priority! I mean that pushchairs (like a wheelchair) can be a pain to manovere in crowded spaces, as quite often they will cause further obstruction changing path suddenly!

Nothing entitled about the context of my post (ok, maybe the title sounds entitled). I'm just fed up of those able bodied rude people!

crashdoll Tue 02-Apr-13 11:06:15

Firstly, a wheelchair is much harder to manouvere a wheelchair than a pushchair. Secondly, do not just assume someone is able bodied, many disabilities are invisible.

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 11:09:52

if there is room to move i try to. but the variation that pisses me off is when i am halfway thru a doorway with my buggy and someone 'quickly' tries to get thru before me. either coming towards me or overtaking. it is bizarre. or when someone lovely purposely opens the dor for us and others try to run thru first - what's that all about?

where i live there is a central shopping location and one of the doors is automatic (i cant pull them open and get far enough behind the buggy to push so need to use that door) but as i approach it loads of clearly able people run/cram in in front of me so i am often standing waiting while there are 7 other unused doors which just need pulling. Also i have seen people in wheelchairs get shocking abuse for using them confused

in a shop i was 3/4 of the way round a square display, just coming out towards the door, with people behind me and a woman walked 2 steps into the 'square' and stood there with an angry face on and said ' i'm not moving just because you have a buggy'. i replied but i would have to manoeuvre backwards round a square and you would only need to take one step to the left'. we both stood for a bit till she huffed and moved. but really. come on. nothing to do with a buggy but just sense. like people who wont reverse or pull in. like to do so would be to 'give in'. get over yourself!

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 11:23:29

Crashdoll- a woman pushing a pushchair may have a hidden disability, or recovering c section etc. in an ideal world we would all be mindfull. Nobody can ever truly know these things. But in all the years I've been pushing a pushchair, I have encountered so many ignorant people, that I find it hard to believe they could have all had hidden disabilities.

With regards to the wheelchair - yes, it can be harder for a wheelchair user to move than a pushchair - agreed. So, by that can you not see in most cases, it is harder for someone pushing a pushchair (especially a double) to move, than an able bodied individual? It's all about assessing the situation ahead.

crashdoll Tue 02-Apr-13 11:26:57

I never said the person pushing a pushchair was not disabled. I just dislike judging and assuming everyone is able bodied.

You do seem to feel very entitled in your expectation that people should have to move for you. Sometimes you move, sometimes they move. I have been forced into the side of the road by people who just refused to manouvere even a tiny bit. Pushchairs do not have right of way.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 11:42:32

But crashdoll had you bothered to read some of my posts properly, you would see that I am indeed not entitled and that I always move, regardless! I just fail to see why the same curtesy can't be shown in my favour sometimes. Most (not all) of the time it makes logistical sense for the hands free person to move. Especially in crowded places!

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 11:44:11

Im now picturing thousands of people everywhere walking towards each other and analysing who has more rights not to move. (Is she pushing a pram? Does she look disabled? Who is more disabled, me or her?). And then they just both stop because neither will move. And they wait. And wait. And wait.

BegoniaBampot Tue 02-Apr-13 12:02:10

I usually move for most folk especially buggies, children, old folk etc but you could argue that it's you are bringing a possibly dangerous buggy in to the mix ( mine was fuck off huge), then you have the onus on you to be more careful.

What I get a bit pissed of is when two or more folk expect you to move, often having to step on he road or such. There is a narrow path at our school,if someone comes towards me I always prepare to go single file wth my kids but many don't and still continue walking in a line of two or three - that really makes my blood boil.

ariane5 Tue 02-Apr-13 13:32:32

This happens all the time where i live, especially difficult if Im pushing the double buggy loaded with shopping and another person with a buggy is coming towards me and clearly does not want to move their (usually single)buggy over.

For some reason round here everybody wants to stay on the inside of the pavement AT ALL TIMES! people do not want to move and Ive had a few awkward stand offs! Its like buggy wars

Ghanagirl Tue 02-Apr-13 14:11:50

YANBU, when my twins were small I had a tandem pushchair (front and back) so it was relatively easy to get out of the way, (although looking back why don't people realise it's much easier for them to move). But when they were older had to change to a side by side which was nigh on impossible to move swiftly out the way, some people just really rude but other mums are as bad I stopped using bus and would walk miles because it was impossible to take two 8 month old babies out of a pushchair and fold, I did occasionally appeal to mums with one baby/toddler but the ruddiness I encountered made it less stressful to do the 2 hour round journey to shops on foot, on pos side I was down to size8 in no time!

ouryve Tue 02-Apr-13 14:15:54

Begonia - we have that problem with a particular group of mothers from school. I'm having to work hard with DS1, who has ASD, to get it into his head that randomly stepping into the road is not OK - he's had a few scarily close shaves, recently. They just keep coming though - I usually loudly counsel him "you don't need to step into the road/wade through the mud, DS2 - people will move out of the way to let you past." (And I can't hold onto him because I'm already holding onto his younger brother, who is more severely affected by his disabilities and can't go out without a safety harness)

Ghanagirl Tue 02-Apr-13 14:17:33

Mrsspagbol why are you on mumsnet if you haven't "bred" the clues in the title!

WestieMamma Tue 02-Apr-13 14:24:16

That's a bit rude Ghanagirl. The vast majority of mumsnet content has nothing to do with being a mum.

<Goes off to tell husband and daughter they must renounce their membership of this mums only club>

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 14:25:39

Ghanagirl - I am pregnant.

Is that ok with you?

Are you the Mumsnet licence giver? Why do I need to have birthed a child to be on here?

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 14:26:39

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Ghanagirl Tue 02-Apr-13 14:33:39

just wondered why people come on here to have a go at people who have "bred" as you'll find out being a mum can be really hard work and tiring and encountering someone who won't get out of the way just because they think the other person feels "entitled" in some way can be demoralising

Ghanagirl Tue 02-Apr-13 14:36:52

And I'm neither an idiot or presumptuous, just expressing my opinion

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 14:39:42

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Ghanagirl Tue 02-Apr-13 14:46:10

Bowing out MrsSpagBol very spiteful and hysterical post.

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 14:49:36

????

"Mrsspagbol why are you on mumsnet if you haven't "bred" the clues in the title! "

But this is polite to you?

You don't even know me!
AND you did not read my posts properly!
But you still decided to single me out on a thread and question my entitlement to be on the website?

But I am the one who is spiteful?!

A bit of common sense and manners is all that's needed, but I agree with the poster who is baffled by people's expectations that you can somehow shrink.

I have a twin side-by-side buggy, and am usually walking a very large dog. This makes me a massive obstruction and I often walk in the road to keep out of people's way, but I often can't get into the road, e.g if cars are parked close together. The number of people who see me up ahead taking up X amount of space on the pavement and somehow expect that by the time they have reached me I will somehow take up considerably LESS space is just bizarre!

IdaClair Tue 02-Apr-13 15:26:53

YANBU to think basic consideration and politeness are good things. It's generally nice when people go out of their way to make your day easier.

YABU to expect them to, and YABU to take up large amounts of space on a pedestrian only area and expect other pedestrians to move out of your way.

I'm bloody glad I've never used a pushchair though reading this and hope I never have to - it sounds like a nightmare of pushing and shoving. I gave up supermarket shopping for a similar reason. Too much trolley rage. I bet I'd get pushchair rage too.

wibblyjelly Tue 02-Apr-13 15:50:44

I will always move out the way, whether ds is with me in his pram, or if I'm out alone. It's the polite thing to do, and it literally takes a second out of my day to do so. What does annoy me is the amount of people who don't thank or even make eye contact with you, when they can see you have gotten out of the way.

CakeForBreakfast Tue 02-Apr-13 15:59:04

There is a hierarchy, it is a mark of civilisation to have an unspoken understanding of the order of these things

Disabled and very elderly trumps all else. They have Right of Way
School Parties - lines of little 'uns walking crocodile fashion to get to places,
ME - I got twins in a buggy and a 5 year old and 3 year old walking next to me
OTHER Prams with less kids than me!

On the occasions I walk without kids, I move out of everyone elses way.

I think that settles it.

MintyyAeroEgg Tue 02-Apr-13 16:00:41

Only read about 10 posts, but this is an April Fools thread isn't it?

crashdoll Tue 02-Apr-13 16:02:16

I disagree that there is a hierarchy. Sometimes it's easier for a pushchair owner to move and sometimes it isn't. Just because you have a buggy does mean you never have to move.

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 16:05:20

What crashdoll said.

Cakeforbreakfast - what if i don't have a buggy but I have a broken ankle and am on crutches with a support boot (like my husband) - then I must move for you - healthy with a buggy with wheels and able to move or stop and wait. Come on now! Get over yourself!! Just because you have a buggy doesn't put you above anyone else!

No one on here has said that they would never move for someone who obviously needs them to (bigger/twin buggy, wheelchair, major buggy, walking sticks, older person etc).

We're all quite happy to move when needed, just not for every single bloody person.

MintyyAeroEgg Tue 02-Apr-13 16:13:25

If there is the remotest chance this is a serious thread, I will tell you something in all sincerity:

I would never move out of the way for a pushchair user. I would expect the pushchair user to move out of the way for me, if possible.

To be perfectly honest I thought this was the way of the world!

shushpenfold Tue 02-Apr-13 16:17:40

YAB ridiculous and entirely unreasonable....steer dear, steer! A wheelchair is not in the same league as a pram, even a double one....trust me, I've pushed every blinkin sort of them.

sue52 Tue 02-Apr-13 16:19:33

I always moved out of the way when I was at the pushchair using stage of my life, shopping or no shopping. I think most of my friends did likewise where possible.

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 16:25:32

i find that odd mintyy. why? are they not citizens too? with as much right to the pavement. and if someone is on 2 easily manoeuvrable feet why would someone pushing something heavy move for them? confused

MintyyAeroEgg Tue 02-Apr-13 16:30:13

If you are using something which is obstructing the pavement to the extent that two people cannot pass each other side by the side, then the person causing the obstruction lets the other person pass first, surely?

Viviennemary Tue 02-Apr-13 16:34:29

I would move out of the way for pushchairs. But I object to people using them as bulldozers.

^"I would never move out of the way for a pushchair user. I would expect the pushchair user to move out of the way for me, if possible.
"^

Well, if you passed me you would be waiting an awfully long time because I wouldn't be moving.

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 16:35:36

so when on a pavement with parked cars, one person alone could step to one side very quickly, or someone with a buggy can't fit between the cars or would have to stop and put the cumbersome buggy down the kerb. the person walking alone should blunder along? i find that very odd. it's quite black and white to say the person causing the obstruction, but that could apply to an elderly person with a shopping trolley thing etc. is everyone to move for you?

MintyyAeroEgg Tue 02-Apr-13 16:46:38

Of course I would move out of the way for an elderly person or person in a wheelchair. Of course!

FierceBadIggi Tue 02-Apr-13 16:49:09

It's often not that two people can't pass side by side though is it, it's that one person is walking down the middle and meets another person and doesn't want/choose/notice to give way.
School run pavements are a nightmare. Prior to having kids I would have got very annoyed at this - post kids I realise there is no option, it's just rush hour the same as on the roads! (And better pushing the buggy than driving surely)

FierceBadIggi Tue 02-Apr-13 16:52:26

Mintyy I hope you don't meet any out-for-the-first-time, possibly depressed new mum getting top grips with life pushing a pram and never again sleeping. Someone displaying a lack of even common courtesy will really make her day.
I've been generally heart-warmed at how nice people are to someone out with a baby, the little smiles that can make it seem easier somehow.

Fierce It is amazing how something as small as a smile can change your day when you're a new Mum/not coping with lack of sleep etc.

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 17:20:38

right mintyy, so it isn't about the person 'obstructing' as you said, it's about the type of person obstructing?

MintyyAeroEgg Tue 02-Apr-13 17:25:39

smile No, it is about a person obstructing. Otherwise we wouldn't be talking about someone having to move out of the way, would we?

I didn't expect to have to include disclaimer about the non able-bodied as I would have hoped that that would be a given. But NO!! as ever, on Mumsnet, I should have remembered to state the bleeding obvious.

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 17:33:58

sorry, i am now confused are you saying you are non able bodied? surely this discussion is about the able bodied not moving? i think it is entirely because it IS a given that it would not occur to me that a non able bodied person would be included in the expectation to move. This is turning into a people's front of judea argument ('any man...' 'or woman' etc i don't think people expect to keep saying 'or disabled' in discussions as it is an unspoken accepted.)

MintyyAeroEgg Tue 02-Apr-13 17:41:44

No! but I give up and am off to cook the dc dinner. I thought my couple of posts were clear but it seems not and its not important enough to me to try again!

sue52 Tue 02-Apr-13 17:45:26

When someone's obstructing my way (including buggy pushing parents), I use the time honoured method of smiling and saying "excuse me please". It has never yet failed in all the years I have employed it.

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 17:52:30

Sorry if i'm not getting your point mintyy. smile i'm a bit sleep deprived.

BegoniaBampot Tue 02-Apr-13 18:05:21

Minty - if you were on a narrowish path and came face to face with a mum, buggy and a toddler - would you really expect them all to step on to the road to let you pass?

Dinkysmummy Tue 02-Apr-13 18:16:44

No yanbu...
I hate people who dont move out of the way for buggys/wheelchairs/people with small children ect.
It's the same on the bus. I hate those who don't move to let the buggy go in the wheelchair space! angry

Defo NBU!

This thread tickles me.

Oh how the times change.

I remember a similar one a few years back where everyone was firmly on the side of the OP in this one.

Walkers should move, it is eminently easier and quicker as a pedestrian to step out of the way of a pushchair than it is for a parent to manouvere the pushchair sideways...

Buggys only have swivel wheels at the front, which means they can only go diagonally... and moving over means potentially either ending up in the road and either tipping sideways off the curb and/or blocking traffic and endangering both mother and child, or hampering the path of numerous other people you just moved into the path of.

For a pedestrian to sidestep out of the way and then back again is much quicker and safer!

And seriously, if the choice was to step briefly into the road to let a pushchair pass, would you honestly force a mother and pushchair off the curb instead of you?

Ghanagirl Tue 02-Apr-13 18:47:17

Very depressing that some people would rather make a point than make some poor woman with toddler and baby's life a little easier��

BoundandRebound Tue 02-Apr-13 18:56:02

Poor woman?

Oh gosh my heart bleeds

We all, well most, have children. We all know exactly what it's like to have a baby, and a toddler as well.

Some new parents have an entitled air about them. Some experienced parents have the same air too.

Basic manners count and I am pretty sure we mainly all show these manners whilst out and about. I have never consciously not moved out of someone's way but a parent bearing down on me with any form of entitlement that they should have right of way for they have a buggy is absolutely laughable. If they smiled and said excuse me or I'm sorry then fine

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 18:56:27

Shushpenfold- so do you walk towards pram pushers and expect them to move? Must make you entitled eh!

hazeyjane Tue 02-Apr-13 18:57:38

I tell you what really annoys me - when I bump ds's buggy up the steps into school, nearly everybody pushes past, I have to wait for ages for someone to let us go through, even if we are half balanced on the steps I don't mind the kids doing it, but I kind of think the parent's should know better! I have had a few tuts though, so I guess they think I am the pain in the arse!

MrsKoala Tue 02-Apr-13 19:00:19

i think anyone who is less able to move out the way (for whatever reason) is more 'entitled' to the right of way. how bitter some people seem about some things is bizarre.

FeijoaVodkaAndCheezels Tue 02-Apr-13 19:06:09

At 8 months pregnant and suffering bad SPD I was busy struggling to push a half full shopping trolley around the supermarket when a stupid cow with a mostly empty basket made me swerve around her. I nearly cried from the pain and swore at her in my head a lot.

Some people are just dicks.

MooMooSkit Tue 02-Apr-13 19:06:16

Uhm it really depends. If it's a wide enough path that both can easily fit then YABU as it's quite easy to move.

The only time it ever pisses me off is I live near a quirky old fishing village and it's really old fashioned and the pavements are SOOO narrow so you can only literally fit one person walking on it or if someone wants to get by or is coming the over way you have to go in the road which is a nightmare in the summer as its a harbour and seaside town so gets VERY busy! I've actually had two occasions in the summer where people have refused to move and I had to put the buggy on one side so half of it was off the pavement :S I'm not a confrontational person though so don't say anything but that's the only time it bugs me. Now my lo is older and doesn't use a pram I always make sure it's us that step out for the pram to stay on the pavement where it's safer and easier to steer as the roads are cobbled and awful to push prams on!

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 19:11:08

Boundandrebound- ANYONE who acts entitled would piss me off! But I have always been the person to swerve because most of the time unfortunately, the hands free pedestrian acts entitled but not moving for me. Nothing entitled of precious about my op.

Why on earth should a person with a pushchair apologise than oncoming person, one who is able bodied to move over? It should be a mutual acknowledgement but usually, it makes sense for the person without a pushchair to step to one side? On the very rare occasion that has happened, I've been grateful and thanked the person. It's got nothing to do with entitlement! It makes logistical sense especially in a crowded street.

lljkk Tue 02-Apr-13 19:17:28

12 years of pushchair use & I never once noticed that people especially expected me to swerve. confused

Not that I mind, anyway. Am I supposed to? Why? confused

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 19:25:59

lljkk- well consider yourself very lucky! 11 years of pushing a pushchair (in a busy town) and unfortunately most pedestrians seem to expect I move all the time as I am clearly an inconvenience. Seeing as I always do, yes it does nark me ever so slightly. For someone like you who clearly encounters courteous people, it would be quite hard to understand why I'm frustrated with my predicament.

lljkk Tue 02-Apr-13 19:34:02

Snarf at East Midlanders being called courteous.
Or maybe some of us don't make mountains out of molehills.

crashdoll Tue 02-Apr-13 19:43:54

Very depressing that some people would rather make a point than make some poor woman with toddler and baby's life a little easier

How patronising. Do men not push buggies? And why is parenting such a hardship? As I said, I would move but I dislike the expectation that I should move. I would never purposely make someone else's life more tricky but I am not indebted to anyone simply because they have a child.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 19:55:12

It's tedious that I'm being labeled on here as entitled or as someone making a mountain out of a molehill. This is a discussion forum. This issue is a tiny fraction of my life. I don't loose sleep over it and I don't let it spoil my day. However, I am within my rights to discuss my issue on here. The fact is, I am always the considerate one that privately fumes at other people's rudeness.

Parenting isn't a hardship. I've been doing it for years and I have never been precious or expected royal treatment for 'breeding' as one poster charmingly put it. But I find some people would prefer to railroad a person with a pushchair, out of principle because they are disgusted at the size of their pram, or because think the pushchair has inconvenienced them in some way. Rudeness!!

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 19:59:10

Crashdoll- if for example, I was walking towards you with that expectant face with no smile or acknowledgement, I'd expect you to be angry and not want to move. My issue is that I am ALWAYS polite, smile and STILL most people will not even acknowledge me, they just wait for me to move. Would you in my case,wait for me to move with my double pushchair in a crowded street???

IdaClair Tue 02-Apr-13 20:27:54

Every day on the school run I walk along a narrow path, there are equal amounts of people coming by each way. It is wide enough for a person and a small pushchair to pass by - but only just. Either side of the path, at this time of year, is the most disgusting ankle depth sinking mud. I already wear wellies to do the run but the DC has to wear school shoes.

Many days we encounter a giant pram on the path coming towards us. No way round it.

Who should yield - ie who should go on the mud? Pram wheels, or me and my DC? By the way, I also take a baby on the school run, if that tips the scales of MN fairness.

FakeHotCrossLobsters Tue 02-Apr-13 20:35:09

This thread (and the people who inspired it) reminds me of this old joke.

Believe it or not...this is the transcript of an actual radio conversation between a US naval ship and Canadian authorities off the coast of Newfoundland in October 1995. The Radio conversation was released by the Chief of Naval Operations on Oct. 10, 1995.

US Ship: Please divert your course 0.5 degrees to the south to avoid a collision.

CND reply: Recommend you divert your course 15 degrees to the South to avoid a collision.

US Ship: This is the Captain of a US Navy Ship. I say again, divert your course.

CND reply: No. I say again, you divert YOUR course!

US Ship: THIS IS THE AIRCRAFT CARRIER USS CORAL SEA*, WE ARE A LARGE WARSHIP OF THE US NAVY. DIVERT YOUR COURSE NOW!!

CND reply: This is a lighthouse. Your call.

Everyone seems to want to be the lighthouse now.

I've found the same thing OP, some people will not move even an inch regardless of their circumstances or yours, but they are always surprised/angry if nobody moves for them.

I was heavily pregnant and knocked to the floor by one man. I was standing still looking at a display in a shop and he walked towards me on my right hand side and just knocked me over, then shouted at me for being in his way and walked off. I hurt my arm and was very worried about my baby (third pregnancy after two late losses) and just sat on the floor and cried from the shock.

I tend to move for most people as well. I know my situation, I don't know theirs, but as I said earlier in the thread, I'm sure both people used to move slightly to avoid each other in the past and now that doesn't seem to be the case, you are either the lighthouse or the ship and most people now want to be the lighthouse.

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 20:36:56

Maryshoppins - can I ask, what IS your issue with my posts??!! I really don't understand it.

I have just looked up the definition of breeding - and it is defined as follows:

"Breeding is the reproduction, that is, producing of offspring"

Can I ask what about that makes me so abhorrent?! Enough so that you feel the need to say "....for 'breeding' as one poster charmingly put it."

???

stephrick Tue 02-Apr-13 21:13:37

I allways move for pushchairs, sometimes off the pavement, but that being said why do some people allow their children to walk on the traffic side of the pavement and not on the inside. This is a bug for me.

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 21:28:30

Mrsspagbol- to be fair I was talking about a poster way up thread. I generally find that when a person uses that term (all be it the correct term) it often comes across offensive and dismissive, like us mothers expect a gold star for having children! Maybe that's just me who feels that way?

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 21:33:03

Idaclaire- in that situation, the pushchair should move! I wouldn't expect right of way all the time. It completely depends on the situation ahead. I move for a parent and child/ren without a second thought! It never occurs to me to wait for them to move.

This is all getting rather out of context as fakehotcrossedlobsters mentioned. People sometimes will not budge an inch, but are angry or surprised when you don't.

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 21:36:57

I think breeding/bred does come across offensive sometimes because it sounds so similar as to when people want to insult parents so call them "breeders".

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 21:41:13

Mary and Sneezing

you are entitled to take offense at whatever you words you wish to, but I am entitled to use whatever vocabulary I want to - especially if I am not using the word incorrectly (ie misusing it in terms of meaning).

Secondly, I never referred to anyone on this thread - Mary or others - I used the word in relation to myself!

Please read my posts properly. I feel I have been saying this all day! It's so frustrating when you hone in on one word by one poster and choose to take offense - when none was actually intended.

"I think breeding/bred does come across offensive sometimes because it sounds so similar as to when people want to insult parents so call them "breeders". "

When did I insult ANY parent on this thread?! I am pregnant - I am going to BE a parent (all things going well). FGS!

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 21:58:00

Erm, did I say what you said offended me? I was

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 21:58:31

Erm, did I say what you said offended me? I was pointing out why it comes across offensive to some. You sound very angry.

MrsSpagBol Tue 02-Apr-13 22:01:02

I am not angry at all. But feel free to assume what you will. As I said, you can attribute offence (inferred or actual) to whatever you like.

SneezingwakestheJesus Tue 02-Apr-13 22:10:06

I will. Thanks for the permission smile

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 22:12:49

Mrsspagbol - I did say someone else up thread. I don't particularly want to single that person out and say who, but it is in one of the 9 pages! No, I don't like the term, but yes, you are correct and you are well within your rights to use it!!

AlbertoFrog Tue 02-Apr-13 22:14:31

Yes yes yes FakeHotCrossLobsters that sums it up perfectly.

Although I only become the lighthouse once in a blue moon. I much prefer sailing on calm seas.

Goodness there are some very intolerant people on here lately.

And I'm so bored of the "entitled" word being bandied about just because someone doesn't want to be pushed around all the time.

The OP moves for others. I move for others. Just sometimes we get fed up having to move for every goddamn pedestrian in the street. I swear some days it takes me 3 miles to walk 1 (disclaimer - that was mildly exaggerated)

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 22:21:28

Alberto- I couldn't agree more! I suppose I asked for it posting on Aibu. But it has got blown out of proportion. As I've said, it's a small fraction of my life, but 9 pages on, I'm still justifying myself!

FierceBadIggi Tue 02-Apr-13 22:32:09

Must remember to pick up a "Congratulations for breeding!" card at the shops tomorrow for my expectant friend. Since it's such an acceptable term for people who have had babies.

AlbertoFrog Tue 02-Apr-13 22:32:43

I once started a post in AIBU about lift etiquette. I thank God it was then and not now. I reckon I'd be flamed big time.

I do wonder sometimes if some posters just want an argument.

ie "I change my knickers every day AIBU?"

reply "YABU I change mine twice a day you minger!"

or "Think of what you're doing to the ozone layer with all those wash cycles - panties can be turned inside out and used again."

Good luck on your next outing Maryshoppins (may I recommend hiring an American Football costume? grin)

Maryshoppins Tue 02-Apr-13 23:00:53

the last two post have tickled me :-) grin

and so very right! !

crashdoll Wed 03-Apr-13 09:12:27

Mary In the same way you said you this was a tiny fraction of your life, it's probably most of ours too. It doesn't mean we don't enjoy wasting spending time debating over the small things in life. grin Hey, where have the Easter smileys gone??!!

OhLori Wed 03-Apr-13 09:33:15

I've noticed recently that pushchairs are being used rather aggressively, like tanks, as a way of getting people to move out of the way. The parents go at breakneck speed along the pavement pushing this huge vehicle, not looking where they are going, and expecting everyone to move out of the way. Ignorant.

Maryshoppins Wed 03-Apr-13 17:58:34

Crashdoll - couldn't agree more! It's good to have a moan debate at times grin

Ohlordi-I hate those type of people too

crashdoll Wed 03-Apr-13 18:48:55

Just wanted to add, that I think calling parents "breeders" is rude. If it wasn't, we might refer to our parents in everyday conversation as that. "Oh yes, the lady who bred me invited me over for dinner but I can't go because the man who bred me has a terrible cold and I don't want to catch it".

thornrose Wed 03-Apr-13 19:01:56

I noticed my mum always stepped to the roadside of the pavement when a buggy was approaching so the buggy could pass on the inside. Same for people with small children.
I instinctively do it and I always remind dd to do it now she's older. It's no big deal and its a "nice" thing to do.

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