To be a Non-Driver that doesn't expect lifts.(101 Posts)
Or am I a rarity?it would seem so reading all the moaning about giving people lifts threads on MN ATM.
YANBU. I bought a car in October and cycled everywhere / got the train / walked before that.
I loathe being driven by other people.
YABU. Just because you don't expect lifts it doesn't mean that some non drivers do and can be quite self entitled about it. People have every right to come on a moaning forum and moan about it.
YANBU. I'm a driver, but was a non-driver for longer than most and never expected a lift. It was nice to get them occassionally though.
I always pick up my work buddy if I see her at the bus stop. She doesn't expect me to stop.
In fact, I don't think I've ever been asked for a lift by a non-driver... that might be a bit telling on my driving skills though, who knows!
I rarely get lifts, and would never expect anyone to go out of their way for me. However, I am fortunate that I live within 5 minutes walk of 3 useful bus routes (and 2 useless ones), and can therefore easily get to the train for longer distances. All the supermarkets deliver to where I live, so I don't need to carry heavy shopping.
Basically, I live in London and have never had to drive.
I'm a non-driver, I don't expect lifts. I certainly never ask for them. If they are offered, half the time I turn them down because I enjoy walking or there is an easy train journey I can make instead, and if I do accept them I offer petrol money or make sure I buy the driver tea/ cake etc. Neither DP or I drive and we don't have any problems at all. If there's somewhere we want to go that's hard to get to, we get a taxi - it still saves us thousands a year, considering we live somewhere easy to get around and we both commute by train to work.
So YANBU. But I agree that we seem to be in a minority. And according to a lot of posters, we only haven't learnt to drive or bought a car purely to be massive, entitled PITA's to everyone we know!
I'm a non driver and I know bus routes like the back of my hand!
All that seething by the lift givers, who knew?
i'm a non-driver and i ask DH to take me places, i never expect him to
but he'd find himself with no dinner if her refused
i walk or get the bus/taxi if he's busy
im a non driver. Rarely ask for lifts except occasionally off my mum or partner, but not usually.
I have been trying to learn to drive for the last 2 or 3 years but i have no spatial awareness and shit concentration span and have failed my test 7 times and just cannot afford to keep on with it
I'm a non-driver and have never asked for or expected a lift from anyone.
All that seething by the lift givers, who knew?
I know, it makes me a bit nervous to accept lifts now!
I don't drive and me and DS are well used to getting the bus or train or just walking. I got chatting to another mum at football on Sat morning as we stood in the snow watching the kids get covered in mud and mentioned that we were getting the bus home and she offered us a lift. I did say that we were fine on the bus but she insisted. I was very grateful and thanked her properly (I hope!) but now I'm worried that she's seething inside.
I was a non-driver for years and lived in London so very easy to get around. Geography does play a part. When I drive I offer lifts all the time and don't seethe if they are accepted.
The rules would be; thank people; don't expect; refuse a little to see if they really want to; offer petrol if it is regular or a long way; if petrol is refused maybe a little coffee or something as a thank you.
Im a driver, and i have no issue with giving people lifts, its when people just automatically assume they are gonna get one, even though its quite obvious you havent got the time.
The only lift I have ever accepted was with a woman who lives down the street from my mum, and who works up the street from my house. She offered me a lift, and I gladly accepted - but I walk up to her workplace, and only go in the car if it suits her plans. I don't expect her to change any plans/
Very very rarely in cars anyway, other than taxis. I much prefer the bus as I can kick back, and listen to music for an hour. Costs £12 for a return journey to my mum's though - it would cost me less to travel 150 miles to Glasgow!!
I don't expect lifts as a non driver but live in London so is actually easier to get about by public transport. If someone offers I won't say no though
Of the many many people I know that don't drive or have cars, I don't know any that 'expect' lifts from those that do.
So YABU to make an enormous extrapolation from the couple of threads about it.
I don't say no if they offer though
I'm never going to accept a lift again, just in case I do it wrong
YABU, don't you realise that all drivers should be offering to drive us everywhere. In fact I demand the drivers of MN start a rota to ferry us non drivers around. It is my human right.
And i won't offer petrol money or thanks either. Because I am special
A couple of threads?
There's one a week on here at least.
Must admit I never did offer petrol money as it was a journey this person would be making daily anyway, she wasn't incurring extra expense due to me .. Maybe I should have offered!! Buy her a bottle of and that every Christmas though.
I suppose if you are a non-driver you never get asked for lifts so it is something you have no experience of. I don't mind giving people lifts but sometimes I do feel like I am expected to give someone a lift when I would rather not. Most people I know who don't drive manage perfectly well using taxis or public transport but there are some who do expect a lift.
Ah, but usual, this is a skewed sample.
No-one is going to show up here and say "my neighbour is a bitch because she won't give me a lift every day and she passes my door".
But, thinking about it, there is a "lift in the rain" thread that has been running for a few days ...
Can be next to impossible not to ask for a lift at times to be honest. At my mum's they have a branch surgery and the main appointments are done 2 miles away in another village; either you can walk 2 miles to the village along the country roads
take me home... or you can take the bus to town (30 minutes) and then the bus to the next village (35 mins), or you can plead for a lift!! Understandably most people choose the second option but it does mean that there's a need for willing drivers to ferry you over. My gran wasn't too chuffed when I had surgery and needed to go to the main surgery daily for a week...
I don't drive because i have epilepsy which isn't well controlled.
The only people i ever request lifts from are my 2 best friends who i've known for 20 years so they're like sisters really.
& then only if they are driving my way anyway, plus i offer money & / or drinks.
Sometimes they expect me to get to places that no bus goes to (they both live in country towns) & i feel that they have no idea what it's like not to drive.
But i try to make an effort where possible.
I would love to be able to drive but it's just not likely that i will be able to.
I think it's akin to collecting children from school - you are collecting anyway, you are walking by their house, of course you don't mind getting your neighbours children.
BUT when it becomes a daily expectation, and one day you want to visit Granny, go the other way, let your child go to a club or to a friend's, or simply are in a bad mood and don't want extra children, and your neighbour is miffed that you won't get them because you always do and so she expects you to and has no other way of getting them.
That's when it's a problem.
People who are arsy about giving lifts are really, really horrible, and I hope Karma gets them one day!
People who are arsey about giving lifts are ridiculous, and I hope Karma gets them one day!
I feel so strongly about this I posted twice!
I think drivers are getting an unfair press on here. No one is complaining about giving lifts or 'quietly seething' everytime they offer to drop someone home after pilates or whatever. The complaints are about the type of non driver who just assumes and expects that everyone will drive them around, takes it for granted that people are always prepared to go out of their way for them or seem completely oblivious to the fact when they are adding miles and maybe half an hour onto someone's journey. Obviously not all, or even most, non drivers are like this but enough of them are for it to be something drivers sometimes like to have a moan about.
I just wanted to re-dress the balance a bit.
Us non-drivers get a hard time on MN.
I wouldn't want a lift from anyone now.
I'd be too scared they would start a thread on mumsnet about how entitled I am to expect a lift if I accepted.
I'm a driver, and I don't seethe about giving people lifts, but only if I've offered.
I wouldn't like it to be a daily expectation. I've known colleagues to offer someone a lift home once and then find that person waiting beside their car for them every afternoon saying 'well, you go past my house anyway'. Which wouldn't be so bad if they offered to contribute towards the cost or something, but to expect free transport day in and day out...
But, as I say, I know most non drivers don't do this. Its just that, like anything in life, the ones who do behave like this are the ones that people tend to remember.
If someone has offered then there is no need to feel bad. Accept if you want to or don't if you'd rather not.
confusteling - it's not hard in that situation though, that's what taxis are for! I save loads of money not running a car, so can afford to take a taxi to places not covered by public transport.
Me too Tantrums, it's a minefield.
Do they really want to give me a lift? or are they just saying it, and then they will moan about me afterwards.
Shall I accept? <wrings hands>
If I offer to give someone a lift then I won't seethe.
If it's not convenient then I don't offer
Sometimes karma works in your favour. I used to work in a homeless shelter and gave all the shift staff lifts home after (very dangerous time/area to be walking). I never expected money or presents. There was a very heavy snow and instead of crying and getting a cab I had three willing snow clearers and pushers out. Yay.
"I think drivers are getting an unfair press on here. No one is complaining about giving lifts or 'quietly seething' everytime they offer to drop someone home after pilates or whatever. The complaints are about the type of non driver who just assumes and expects that everyone will drive them around, takes it for granted that people are always prepared to go out of their way for them or seem completely oblivious to the fact when they are adding miles and maybe half an hour onto someone's journey. Obviously not all, or even most, non drivers are like this but enough of them are for it to be something drivers sometimes like to have a moan about."
As far as I am aware, there hasn't been a single post about people expecting drivers to go miles out of their way. It's just horrible, petty mean spiritedness. "it's my car. I don't want you to get in it, you horrible, non driving person. Why, I might catch "poor" from you! Or even "environmental awareness" which would be even worse!"
I actually turned down 2 lifts today.
Do I win a prize?
Only the Self Righteous Cup.
Get in the car, woman, don't be such a twit!
Please accept lifts if I am offering - I have terrible environmental guilt about driving if I am on my own, I would much rather have at least one other person in the car with me sharing my carbon footprint!
Me neither, only one I expect to give me a lft is OH and as I see it thats one of his jobs . He can swop it if he wants.
I do work with 2 people who live in the same town as me, I hid rather than accepting a lift, they're both lovely people, but if I take the train/bus and time it right my journey takes 20-25 minutes. A lift at peak time, at least 30 minutes, normally nearer 45. I can be home and in my PJs by then , but neither of them will accept that the train can be quicker.
Oh I'm not bothered about catching poor or environmental awareness. I'm happy to offer lifts if it's convenient. However I decide what's convenient.
If that seems mean spirited then there's not much I can do about it
I accept them if repeatedly offered, I only ask very close friends for help every now and then and they dont mind.
I always offer petrol money even if its only a short distance and usually I preffer to get the bus.
So OP YANBU
Drivers should not offer lifts if they dont want to give it IMO
Do other non-driving females sometimes feel forced into accepting lifts even when refusing several times?
I grew up in London, I am used to walking reasonable distances, and I can take care of myself, even when walking after dark yet friends who are drivers really will not accept that I like to walk, even in the rain. Half the time I get lifts it's because I haven't the heart to keep refusing them.
Is it because I am a small woman, perhaps my friends think I'm vulnerable (I'm not).
I once had to pretend to go to the loo in a bar so I could sneak out of a pub to walk the half-mile home, instead of being forced by friends to get a cab home (I hate cabs, anyone could be driving, feel far safer walking).
"I always offer petrol money even if its only a short distance and usually I preffer to get the bus."
But why do you prefer to get the bus? WHY??????.
But sometimes non drivers do expect people to go out of their way. I used to have a friend who lived 30 miles away from me and thought nothing of asking me to give her a lift somewhere. And it wasn't just because we were close friends (which we were, at that time), she regularly asked people for lifts who didn't live anywhere near her, or who weren't going to where she was going. And then she would moan and bitch to me about how selfish they were to refuse to 'help her out'. When I refused to give her lifts it struck me that she was probably moaning to other people about me. Needless to say, we drifted apart.
"Oh I'm not bothered about catching poor or environmental awareness. I'm happy to offer lifts if it's convenient. However I decide what's convenient.
If that seems mean spirited then there's not much I can do about it"
But if you're going the same way, how can it possibly be remotely inconvenient?
I left part of my sentence out there, I mean she asked other people for lifts as well, colleagues and the like, not just close friends.
Seeker I use the walk to and from to school as my exercise and that's why I refused both offers from fellow parents today.
I like walking. And I like the bus. Don't have to make polite conversation with people on the bus.
Well, obviously, 30 miles out of your way is a bonkers thing to ask. But the threads on here are always about people going to the same party, or picking children up from the same place. it's insane to complain about that!
I hate getting the bus on sunny days because the type of epilepsy i have is 'photosensitive' - i get a taxi i can't afford rather than get the bus on sunny days, because at least the taxi can stop if i ask them to.
I think we feel guilty about our non-driving state.
We trudge in the rain while you are warm and snug in your cars.
But seriously, I do like walking and do refuse lifts if I feel like a walk.
Well seeker, it's not just about where I'm going to. It's about how full my car is, how clean my car is, who the person is, whether I'm in a rush, whether I need to stop for petrol, whether I'm not in a chatty mood etc.
Most times it's convenient. Sometimes it's not
yes, I don't mind giving someone else's children a lift to dance class or whatever. If I'm going that way anyway, its not inconvenient.
I don't feel guilty at all about my non-driving state. Why would I?
It's not by choice, it's by lack of funds to pay for lessons/tests/license/car/insurance.
I got my first US license when I was 17 and my first car at the same time, funded by my mother who insisted I drive so I could run errands for her. I missed it for about 2 months when I first moved to Belfast, now it's just a fact of life.
But I actually enjoy walking. Even in the rain.
I should have said, we are made to feel guilty for accepting lifts.
Especially on MN.
Yanbu. We grew up without a car, only one person in my family had a car and he lived too far away to give any lifts to us. Ex didn't drive either and neither do I so I never expect a lift anywhere, if someone does offer me a lift I'm very grateful and I always offer petrol money.
don't feel guilty for accepting lifts.
If someone offers you a lift, you have to assume that they actually mean it.
If they offer you a lift, and secretly hope that you will say no because they don't want you to accept, then its their own bloody fault. I hate mindgames.
I don't think we are in the minority. I can drive but a couple of years ago due to pay cuts etc I made the decision to give up my car. I walk or get the bus pretty much everywhere. We do still have a car but my husband uses it for work so I don't often get to use it.
I am sometimes offered lifts, but unless that person has to actually pass by my house I decline. Or if they are passing I offer petrol money or if that's refused insist on paying for lunch/coffe or whatever. It doesn't take me long to walk to where I usually meet friends for lunch, or if it's pissing down I get the bus.
I think people that expect lifts are in the minority - it just annoys people so they are likely to come on here and moan.
As far as I am aware, there hasn't been a single post about people expecting drivers to go miles out of their way. It's just horrible, petty mean spiritedness. "it's my car. I don't want you to get in it, you horrible, non driving person. Why, I might catch "poor" from you! Or even "environmental awareness" which would be even worse!" QUote
usualsuspect - I was going to post this thread when I saw the first moaning about giving lifts thread today. I don't drive but don't ask for lifts either.
Related to atthewelles quote - I know someone who bought a Smart car so she wouldn't be able to give lifts to two friends together. That really is mean IMO.
I drive, and I only offer a lift if I actually want to give one. I can't stand all that 'fake offer/pretend refuse' stuff. If I don't want to offer, I don't. Forthright me.
That said, I rarely actually give lifts these days as I am a SAHM of children firmly still in car seats, and most of the places I go are with other mums and kids, so unless it has been planned in advance you can't give anyone a lift as they don't have the right seats, blah de blah de blah.
SamSmalaidh - tis £15 to get to next village and back, I'd far rather face the wrath of my Gran than fork out £15 for a two mile round trip!!
If that's the only reason to buy a smart car then what a strange person. Most people just buy a car that meets their needs surely.
I've only got 4 seats in my car so when we're all in it there's no lifts possible. That wasn't the reason for buying it though - small, economical cars aren't big enough for more than four seats
I think Mandy that qualifies as downright weird, rather than mean.
Amanda Good for you. I admit I sometimes offer a lift while inwardly thinking "Oh please say you're not going straight home/are being collected by DH. I'm soooo tired and just want to go straight home and if I drop you I'll have to come off the main road and get stuck in that one way system but if I don't offer a lift I'll look so mean because I know to you it seems like only a ten minute diversion......"
Sorry non-drivers who hate being offered lifts when the driver doesn't mean it, but drivers are only human too and try to do the right thing
even if we have a private moan about it afterwards.
I used to give a friend a lift a lot. I stopped one day after I overheard her complaining that I had refused to give her a lift home one day. Yes, I did refuse. Because I wasn't going home - I was going to visit my mother that day.
Apparently it was my fault that she didn't have a coat, because she expected me to be dropping her home, because I always did .
I don't believe you non-drivers have never met anyone like that. No more than I believe that there are no drivers who are precious about their cars and refuse to give anyone lifts anywhere.
There is wrong on both sides, you know <grumpy>
And I never take petrol money, btw. Especially not if I'm going anyway. It is nice if people offer to pay for the parking, or the tolls, or buy a coffee if it is a long journey.
I don't think it's always the expectation of a lift that annoys drivers. In my case I really wouldn't mind giving a lift if I was going in the same direction anyway.
What does annoy me is when people expect me to drive rather than both/ all of us use public transport.
I've had more than one friend suggest a day out to another town or city for shopping, when I've responded "Oh yes that's a good idea, I'll find out the train times" all of a sudden they go off the idea.
One friend liked going to out-of-town restaurants but only if I was the designated driver, she wouldn't go if it meant getting a taxi.
I had to organise a Christmas 'do' in December, when choosing a restaurant I made sure it was on a main bus route. One woman said she wouldn't be coming because it was too much hassle to catch a bus, I said "Oh dear, that's a shame". For me to collect her and take her home would have been a sixteen mile trip. I listened while she told every other member of the group that she wouldn't be coming and eventually someone did offer her a lift...
It's not the lifts - it's the thought that I can just hop in a car that drives itself, knows where to go, doesn't mind getting stuck in traffic, and pays for itself.
I hardly ever get offered lifts (maybe i look dodgy!). I have no problem with it I normally get taxis since the buses never seem to go where I want. The only thing I take issue with is when family members organize parties/meals out which are miles and miles away from my house and then get really arsey with me when I say I cant come. I mean what exactly am I supposed to do fly? spend hours and hours on about 4 different buses? not eat for the rest of the week to pay for a taxi? what?
I have no problem not going tbh with some of them I am quite glad but I have actually stop speaking to me because I have refused invitations to trips out!
Also people who say why dont you just learn to drive and buy a car...well yeah I never thought of that they dont get that we dont have the money for lessons or a car so its a car ....or a house.
I want to know when driving became the default position.
I'm sure once upon a time legs and buses were more used.
I've only just learnt, well driving for 1.5 years including lesson time, I'm nearly 30, so thus far more of my life has been spent without a car.
StickEmUp - we used the car a lot when I was little and never went on buses so for my parents driving was the default position 40 years ago.
I hate driving and feel it's very important for the DCs to walk/develop road sense/know how to use public transport etc so never accept lifts. We do live in an area well served by public transport and I have the car for emergencies but most drivers cannot seem to understand that we actually prefer walking.
Even in shitty weather (kids have all weather kit), The younger ones love splashing in puddles and the older like the chance to chat to me when they have my full attention.
If you don't/don't want to drive, don't go to places you can't get back from sensibly and have cab fare and numbers on you in case of an emergency.
If you drive and don't want to give a lift for what ever reason please don't offer. It is really not your job to ferry others around. Most non drivers are not expecting it. Those that are, are the entitled nightmares being ranted about.
So, those of you who think drivers are mean because they don't always offer lifts:
Don't you ever leave something and look forward to the peaceful walk alone with your thoughts, or enjoy listening to your mp3 or reading, or just staring out of the window of a bus or a train.
Sometimes car drivers just want to get in, shut the door and have a little time alone before they get to the next thing. It's hard to sit in a confined space in silence with someone, specially if you don't know them well. Sometimes anyone, driver or not, feels like company, sometimes not. It's sad to think drivers are being judged for sometimes wanting to do a journey alone. AFAIK, most drivers offer lifts sometimes, but sometimes don't.
I don't think any of the non drivers have said that they think drivers are mean for not offering lifts. It's paranoid drivers who think that in the very act of not having a car means someone is demanding a lift 30 miles out of the drivers way!
The drivers aren't always paranoid though, seeker.
I bet every driver has at least one or to stories of people who have been downright nasty to them about getting/not getting lifts. I can't believe you haven't once, ever, felt someone was using you for your car.
My fil was a classic example of someone who never drove, but also never, ever got a taxi or bus. He thought nothing of getting anyone to drive him 30 miiles out of their way.
I don't think anyone on this thread has said that drivers are mean for not offering lifts?
I agree with stickemup - driving is seen as the default position nowadays, which is why non-drivers are sometimes seen as a bit odd. Even the 'I live in London' explanation is seen as a cliche, even though it's more hassle than it's worth to have a car in most of London, and I barely knew anyone who did own one the whole time we lived there (especially the places where 20-somethings tend to live in London: Islington, Balham, those sorts of places).
Personally I get a little frustrated sometimes that the default is to do something that costs so much money to learn to do, and to continue doing, when there are perfectly other reasonable ways of getting around.
I've found often that it's the long-term drivers who haven't had to use public transport or walk a fair distance for a while that think you must want a lift because they couldn't imagine walking 30 minutes to meet someone for coffee. I'm not implying they're lazy or anything, just that as they haven't had to do it, they see it as something less pleasurable or more onerous than it is to someone who is used to it.
Nope. Never. I have been driving for 30 years. I have never felt anyone was "using me for my car"
You are lucky with your relatives so .
dexter well i Am sure back then finances came into it.
If you had a television in the 50s you may have percieved that as the default. It wasnt.
maebe made the point perfectly.
I lost a friend like this i started driving and she suddley expected me to help do her weekly shop told my anutie i got up myself since i started driving
She baiscally stopped coming to my home once i started driving expecting me to always pick her up and drop her home
When do you think it became the default then? I was only saying that 40 years ago it was the norm to have a car where I lived.
Bleeding hell i was only asking. I made a good point though?
Celebrities. Designer clothes the norm?
Not for us though.
I meant that kind of thing.
Ah ... Where you LIVED. The norm there.
Thats what i meant.
I have no idea what you are on about now, so no you didn't make a good point!
You said it was the norm 40 years ago.
I questioned you and you came back with a chippy reply.
In your reply, you Said it was the norm where you lived, this is an important addition, is it not?
Whe you lived ... Now was that an affluent area where everyone had a roller, or a council estate where everyone got the bus.
That admission you made about the norm as to where you lived adds an amazing amount of weight to your point.
You also said to me again a. It chippily, when did i think it became default.
My post was asking the question, so i don't know.
But i do believe what people have, and when, can be down to money.
If you don't understand that, i don't know how to explain
I just hope you aren't being obtuse on purpose.
Hardly anyone had a car where I grew up.It certainly wasn't the norm.I am quite old though.
Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.
I, as a non-driver, am sick to the back teeth of constantly being pestered by various people about when I'm going to learn to drive, why I'm not, how I cope, etc, as if it's some sort of deficiency
Also, I had a car for over 20 years. I don't have any stories of non drivers expecting me to ferry them around.
hide your keys, people, looks like Olivia wants a lift
InMySpareTime, I have experienced that. I find it a bit embarrassing to be offered lifts - it is usually well-meant, but I'm a grown up who doesn't need help to get around. But drivers can be like Mrs bloody Doyle in their persistence. I like walking, darn it!
I should have kept a tighter reign on my thread.
Sorry Olivia, I got distracted by Emmerdale.
My DDs both drive but we live 5mins from the tube and so when going out for the evening they tend to use public transport.
Except their friends and their friends' parents insist on driving them home. It drives them bananas and it annoys me too, particularly when they were younger (16, 17 say). We live on a well lit, busy route from the tube station. There was absolutely no point in their dad or me hanging around to pick them up when it was quicker and easier for them to come home by tube.
But those parents judged us big time and that irked me.
What do you think you are doing, allowing people to fight on your thread?
I am sometimes amused when people get chips on their shoulders about not offering me a lift, when I didn't expect one, want one and wouldn't have accepted one anyway! I take ds on the train with me in the morning and walk a mile to drop him off at nursery opposite work. I like walking and the time with him so except in extreme weather I don't mind, and even then I get togged up and just grit my teeth and get through it. I might complain about being cold or snowed on but only to the same extent that drivers complain about road conditions. We just share the annoyances of our journeys, basically.
Anyway, once I got to nursery and was a bit damp. The nursery worker at the door commented on how it mustn't have been a nice walk, and I just said, as I tend to, that it was OK really, I don't have far to go now, I'm used to it etc. Just matter-of-fact, not martyrish. Another mum was there doing drop off too and she started going on about how she saw me every day, and she felt so sorry for me, and she would stop, really she would, but then there were pushchairs and car seats and it was too difficult.... all this to the nursery worker, not to me. Basically she felt guilty about it, and just had to make sure I knew that. I never even noticed her driving past me until that day!
I'll give anyone a lift,i even pick up hitch hikers when i do long journeys.
I especially give lifts to mates from the pub when i haven'nt been drinking.
And no,i don't ask for petrol money.
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