Not wanting to be invited to a lunch if there is someone I don't talk to?

(340 Posts)
Neverland2013 Fri 08-Feb-13 22:46:22

I will try to keep it short. I had a big fall out with one of the mums from our 'mumsgroup' over a year ago. In the past, during a B'day party, I managed to be civil to this person but I am rather annoyed that one of my friends invited me as well as the other person to a Saturday lunch although she knows how I feel.

HollyBerryBush Fri 08-Feb-13 22:48:56

Well dont go.

Fuck sakes what is it with the world at the moment?

If you werent invited you'd be threading you were excluded because she was there.

Don't pull the invitee into your teenage games, I would assume you are an adult if you have a child?

KobayashiMaru Fri 08-Feb-13 22:50:07

get over yourself. It's not up to others to remember and police the vagaries of your teenage style relationships.

Sirzy Fri 08-Feb-13 22:51:27

Don't go then.

It's rather childish to expect friends not to talk to others/invite others because of your argument. Why should try have to take sides?

AgentZigzag Fri 08-Feb-13 22:51:30

Could the other mum want to try to forget what happened?

It depends on why you fell out.

Anything serious?

SkinnybitchWannabe Fri 08-Feb-13 22:54:00

Yabu. Why shouldn't your friend invite the other mum to lunch? She can invite who she wants.
Maybe it's time to forget the past and move on.

PatriciaHolm Fri 08-Feb-13 22:54:19

Well, the world doesn't revolve around you. Assuming what you fell out about doesn't involve murder/ fraud/adultery, maybe she's hoping you can both get over yourselves and deal with it for an hour or so?

Whoknowswhocares Fri 08-Feb-13 22:54:27

Seriously, you are still bothered after a year???? Unless she caused physical or mental harm to your family (although the term 'fall out' indicates a trivial issue) then for goodness sake let it go!Try to remember you are an adult, and act accordingly
What sort of example are you giving your children if you indulge in long term petty squabbles?

BackforGood Fri 08-Feb-13 22:57:52

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

AgentZigzag Fri 08-Feb-13 22:58:45

You can't say the OP's immature/childish/teenagerish unless you know why they 'fell out'.

I agree it's got nothing to do with the friend doing the inviting, but if she knows how the OP feels about the woman you'd have to ask yourself why she'd invite two people she knows not to be talking.

To just ignore it would create a bit of an atmosphere, not something you want when you've got people round, if only for the feelings of the other people there as much as the two friends who've fallen out.

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:00:21

you mean you feel that she shouldn't have invited the other person, don't you?

Just decline the invitation, if you have a problem being in the company of this other woman.

Or go and just be civil. you are both adults, you can be civil to one another.

But you can't expect people to choose one of you over the other.

larks35 Fri 08-Feb-13 23:00:24

YABU I agree with others that on the info given it all sounds a bit childish. If you had asked "AIBU not to go to a lunch as I don't talk to one of the other guests" then we would probably all say YANBU, but you seem to have taken offence at being invited!

SirBoobAlot Fri 08-Feb-13 23:01:13

Depends why you fell out and how many other people will be there.

But realistically, if you're both part of the same friendship group, you will see her around.

MerylStrop Fri 08-Feb-13 23:03:50

Is she trying to engineer a reconciliation?

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Fri 08-Feb-13 23:04:04

I think it's unfair to label the OP childish and to forget the past. We don't know what this woman has done to the OP. Perhaps this woman has caused the OP a lot of trouble but the woman hosting the lunch has said she's 'not getting involved' and this hurts the OP as the other woman has behaved badly?

OP, I would just make polite excuses and not go.

almostanotherday Fri 08-Feb-13 23:05:28

Would she be trying to get you two to patch things up?

AgentZigzag Fri 08-Feb-13 23:06:45

Do you mean the friend inviting, or the friend she's not talking to Meryl?

Because I wondered whether the friend she's fallen out with could be trying to bring it to an end.

But if it was the one inviting, if it's got nothing to do with her, she'd be wrong to try and stir things up again.

ihearsounds Fri 08-Feb-13 23:07:00

Omg, really. A person has more than one friend? shock

timidviper Fri 08-Feb-13 23:07:03

Having had a similar situation myself I can understand how you feel.

I just told all my friends that I felt very uncomfortable in the presence of this woman following her appalling rudeness so please don't invite me to anything where they knew she would be there. I told them I obviously didn't mind if they wanted to see her and would not be offended if I wasn't asked to something as a result.

Might be an idea to do the same. At least it's all out in the open then.

Your friend did the right thing imo. She is obviously friends with both of you, she can't invite one and not the other without one of you taking offence so she is leaving it up to you two to make the choice. Would you rather have not been invited?

Neverland2013 Fri 08-Feb-13 23:11:20

I wouldn't call this a teenage game and I am truly sorry that we are where we are. I don't expect everyone to remember but I would expect a 'close' friend to do so. The person I don't talk to knowingly gazumped us.

mynewpassion Fri 08-Feb-13 23:11:40

You know there is such words as "no I can't attend but thank you" when you receive an invitation. Simple.

HollyBerryBush Fri 08-Feb-13 23:14:50

She paid more for a house you wnated?

Thems the breaks I'm afraid.

In seriousness Op - what would you like to happen?

(a) you dont get invited but the other lady is invited
(b) the other lady not invited but you are
(c) the invitee/organiser doesnt play games and invites everyone and assumes everyoine can indeed decide for themselves whether to go or not
(d) no one ever has lunch ever again

Whoknowswhocares Fri 08-Feb-13 23:15:48

Gazumping is horrible. It doubtless cost you money as well as the house you wanted.
It does not mean you can act childishly and not be civil, or to expect others to take sides. You don't have to like her. You don't have to go if you don't want to.
But it's unfair to expect your friends to put up with an unending feud or pander to EITHER of you. Yabu

Sorry but that has nothing at all to do with your mutual friend. You are going to end up falling out with the whole group if you try and make them choose sides.

mynewpassion Fri 08-Feb-13 23:18:48

Guess your friend is not holding a grudge.

Yfronts Fri 08-Feb-13 23:20:09

you are both grown ups, I'm sure you can be civil

echt Fri 08-Feb-13 23:21:58

You've managed to be civil once, so I'm sure you can do it again.

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Fri 08-Feb-13 23:22:58

mynewpassion why would the ex friend hold a grudge against the OP? The OP hasn't done anything wrong

Yfronts Fri 08-Feb-13 23:24:20

move forward? get over it. agree gazumping is an dirty thing but it's just part of house buying and I'm sure it was nothing personal. of course the vendor would sell to who ever was prepared to pay more. you could have offered more also possibly?

SirBoobAlot Fri 08-Feb-13 23:27:34

So she paid more for a house you wanted?

And you expect other people to isolate her because of this?

hmm

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:28:11

you can't expect your friend to choose between you.

If you play with her i won't be your friend any more...

you have to get over it.

Yes, it was a shitty thing to do. But it's been a year. you are going to have to find a way to be civil. People aren't going to choose sides. If you can't find a way to be civil, then you risk losing friends.

Neverland2013 Fri 08-Feb-13 23:28:27

Yes, it was horrible at the time. Perhaps more as it was done by someone I knew well and our children spent so much time together. Although I don't expect my friend to choose I would prefer not to be invited to same playdates or lunches (although I can understand if it is a special day eg. B'day etc).

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Fri 08-Feb-13 23:29:04

I'm really surprised that some of you think that the OP's ex friend didn't act badly? I think, if she knew the OP had gone for the house that she acted sneakily and unfairly. I would never do that to a friend, not if I wanted them to talk to me again! People do get emotional and upset about house buying, it's very stressful. I think her friend acted badly.

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:29:59

But it was just an invitation. Which you are free to decline. I don't understand why you're cross that she invited you.

Just say no.

Unless what you actually want is her to not invite the other woman, so that you can go?

I mean, you can go, obviously, but you don't want to if she's there.

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Fri 08-Feb-13 23:30:33

I don't see too how the OP will lose friends by refusing to have anything to do with this woman. As adults we are free to choose who we socialise with and associate with. I would expect my friends to be supportive of any decisions I make not to speak to someone. Not to take sides, but to respect the fact that that was my decision.

ouryve Fri 08-Feb-13 23:30:57

How many of you are going?

If 3 of you, you can't make it.

If 12 of you, then sit at the other end of the table and get over it. Or say no, anyway.

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:31:28

I agree. She did.

But who's going to lose out now? The OP. By declining invitations etc, she runs the risk of not being as close to her friends. You can be civil to someone in a group, for the benefit to you of being part of that group and being with the other people.

Whoknowswhocares Fri 08-Feb-13 23:31:37

Well that's your call. But it will be you and your children who will miss out confused Cutting off nose to spite face will not turn back time and she will have got the house AND your friends
Which will make it 2-0

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Fri 08-Feb-13 23:32:52

Well that's very true Hecate, and I think if I was in OP's position I would do as you suggest. However I would expect friends not to fall out with me just because I'd decided for my own reasons to cut someone out of my life.

CaseyShraeger Fri 08-Feb-13 23:33:25

You're the one with the grudge; you should be the one to make the effort to check up on whether your ex-friend is going to be at events before you accept (or decline) the invitations. It's unfair to expect all your mutual friends to keep a mental spreadsheet of who isn't speaking to whom and validate all their invitation lists against it.

HollyBerryBush Fri 08-Feb-13 23:33:47

I doubt the seller was upset. Its an estate agents remit to get best price. Duty of care to the seller.

SirBoobAlot Fri 08-Feb-13 23:33:50

If you'd rather not be including in social gatherings, then you will loose friends. Plain and simple. Firstly as people will stop inviting you, and secondly because they will think you are being very childish.

No one is asking you to be the best of friends with her, for goodness sakes, but surely its worth a few civil words for the sake of the rest of your social group?

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:34:07

If she distances herself from the group, won't attend all the get togethers, basically makes it be known that it's either her or the other woman - do you not think that has the potential to make things harder for the group, or to create more distance?

It would for me.

Like I say, I think this other woman behaved badly. I wouldn't do that to a friend. A house is not worth more than a friend. But it's done and the best thing for the OP to do is to be the bigger person about it.

Neverland2013 Fri 08-Feb-13 23:35:57

I received the invite earlier today via FB and already accepted without noticing that the other person was invited as well. The group will be rather small - 4 families max. I feel like coming up with an excuse but then again I don't understand why am I being invited when I made my feelings very clear.

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:36:12

I am not saying they will actively fall out with her.

It is more - and this is just speculation on my part - that a distance could be created. and who wants to organise alternate get togethers and remember to not invite X if you invite Y. In the end, one of them will get sidelined. Not in a grand falling out way, but in a this is just too much hassle way

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Fri 08-Feb-13 23:37:05

I find it interesting to see some of you on here refer to the OP as bearing a 'grudge'. I don't see why wanting to cut someone out of her life is holding a grudge. If someone treats me badly then I cut them out of my life. I try not to dwell on it and would never act spitefully to someone in retaliation for them treating me badly, but I would cut someone off. I don't see this as being a bad thing in all honesty.

SirBoobAlot Fri 08-Feb-13 23:37:09

Maybe because they value you as a friend and expect you to act like you're not 13?

HecateWhoopass Fri 08-Feb-13 23:37:11

Does it matter? If you don't want to go - don't go. They only invited you. you're free to decline.

CaseyShraeger Fri 08-Feb-13 23:37:56

I don't see too how the OP will lose friends by refusing to have anything to do with this woman

Because the wider group of friends is going to have a series of lunches and birthday parties and get-togethers, and the OP isn't going to be going to them -- indeed, doesn't want to even be invited to them -- in case she encounters X. It seems obvious that that's going to distance her from the group, if she sees them far less often than she used to.

Maryz Fri 08-Feb-13 23:41:19

The thing about houses is that it isn't up to friends to decide who is more deserving of buying a house. They may well feel that she offered a higher price, so fair enough, she obviously wanted the house more.

But whatever she has done, or however you feel about it, if you make a whole group of friends choose "you or her", you have to be prepared for the fact that they might choose her.

So make sure you are prepared.

LittleChimneyDroppings Fri 08-Feb-13 23:43:13

Hell, I'd be pissed off too if a friend guzumped me. It will have cost you money and its a shite thing to do to a friend. I would just tell the person who invited you that you're sorry, you cant make it this time, but hopefully next time. Either that or tell her the truth.

Whoknowswhocares Fri 08-Feb-13 23:44:59

Plus if you are the one perceived as being difficult, they are most likely to choose her
It will happen gradually. They will invite her as she says yes to invites.they know you are likely to decline and they cant have you both.As time goes by, you are no longer part of the main group. She is and asking you too is hassle they can do without. At this pint you can consider yourself dropped

LittleChimneyDroppings Fri 08-Feb-13 23:45:13

Although, if the other person has been invited but not said yes, do you think they would still go knowing you are going to be there?

Whoknowswhocares Fri 08-Feb-13 23:47:49

Well if you are thick skinned enough to gazzump a friend, I doubt a double lunch date holds too many fears!

AgentZigzag Fri 08-Feb-13 23:48:59

'I would never do that to a friend, not if I wanted them to talk to me again!'

And that's it, of course the ex friend is totally within her rights to do what she did, but she (or anyone on the thread) couldn't expect the OP not to remember what kind of a person she is and not want anything to do with her.

Cutting her out of her life would be good advice if the OP posted about what she did at the time, nothing immature about it.

But I read the OP as saying she was mostly surprised the friend doing the inviting, invited them both, knowing what she knows.

And that's not an unreasonable thing to wonder about.

The OP could come down with a case of (what I saw nicely described on a thread here as) Diplomatic Norovirus, and not go, but just thinking about being in the same room as the ex friend must have brought up all the shit she had at the time.

If that's the case it's not surprising she's a bit hmm at it.

Neverland2013 Fri 08-Feb-13 23:58:06

Perhaps I see it too black and white but I do wonder whether it is time for me re-evaluate who my friends are. At the time, the three of them knew what was happening but did not tell me as they didn't want to get involved. Now I am being invited to same events and to be honest I feel like cutting my losses. In some ways, although I try really hard, it is always at the back of my mind...........

anonymosity Sat 09-Feb-13 00:09:02

Its funny. The first responder to this OP was dismissive and saying roughly "don't act teenage" then almost EVERY post thereafter jumps on the bandwagon.
I wouldn't have been so harsh. Maybe just don't go but don't make a fuss either?

I do wonder sometimes if Mumsnet is stuffed to the gills with sheep....

CuriousMama Sat 09-Feb-13 00:14:53

Neverland if they knew what she was doing they're not nice either imo. Cut the dead wood and start anew I'd say. They could've told you anonymously tbh. Fuckers.

Viviennemary Sat 09-Feb-13 00:16:43

There is not very much you can do about this. Either go and avoid her or don't go. I don't think you can blame the other person for the fact that both of you are invited to the lunch. As you've both got the choice of whether to go or not. You've got an issue with this person because of what happened. But you can't expect everyone else to avoid her too as it's not really anything to do with them. But I do have sympathy for your difficult situation.

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Sat 09-Feb-13 00:18:28

So they didn't want to get involved yet they did get involved by listening to her telling them she was gazumping you! They don't sound like friends, I would cut ties with the lot of them, they've made it clear where their loyalties lie

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 00:19:57

Spot on there AgentZigZag. Good post.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 00:20:06

CuriousMama - that is how I will proceed because I can't be ask to put up with this anymore.

Thanks to all for your responses.

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Sat 09-Feb-13 00:20:26

Meant to add why is it in these situations it is always, always the person who does wrong who ends up smelling of roses and keeping all their friends, whilst the person who has done nothing wrong often ends up sidelined and left out with everyone telling them they're 'not getting involved'? Maybe it's just me but I tend to always side with/defend the person who has been treated badly in these kinds of situations.

CuriousMama Sat 09-Feb-13 00:22:06

Good for you. Friends are loyal and to be trusted. This lot deserve each other by the sounds of it.

timidviper Sat 09-Feb-13 00:25:10

Neverland You sound exactly as I felt over the fallout I had (mentioned upthread). Some of my close friends also felt this woman had behaved badly, understood how I felt and stopped inviting her to things but others still see her and me, just seperately.

I do feel a bit let down by their lack of loyalty though, they take the attitude that they agree she behaved badly but didn't do it to them so they have no issue with her whereas I hope that, if anybody did that to one of my friends, I wouldn't stand by and ignore it but we are all entitled to our own opinions and ways of doing things.

It sounds like a re-evaluation may be overdue if the others knew the gazumping was coming and didn't tell you. They don't sound like good friends to me.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 00:25:18

Just because they said they're not getting involved, doesn't mean they aren't.

Someone I know, who's professed for years they never get involved in one side or another (of something specific), has just outed themselves as being anything but impartial.

Some people like others to think they're above it all, when in reality they're the biggest stirrers out!

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Sat 09-Feb-13 00:27:16

Zigzag, that is so true about those that make out they are above it all being the biggest stirrers! It also tends to happen that people will only say 'I'm not getting involved' to the person that they are not siding with

Zondra Sat 09-Feb-13 00:32:17

Ouryve- has covered what should happen.

If it's a small group, decline.

Big group- go! Don't let this crappy situation deny you friendship.
Be courteous, polite, cold even. Gloss over it.

I do think it's rubbish, though. However, through experience of my own I a similar situation, the best thing is to rise above & forget. You don't need to forgive, but I assure you that you'll gain more in the long run.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 00:32:19

And the accusations of the OP being childish aren't taking into account how complex relationships between people can be, and how emotional they are, regardless of how insignificant they might seem from the outside.

If successful interactions with other people can make or break a person, it's not immature to try and work out how you want to feel about someone you thought a lot of but who betrayed you.

If the ex friend fucked the OP off big time, the OP's been left wondering whether she's able to read things properly. Why she didn't see what the person was like before she dumped on her.

It can make you wonder whether you can trust your judgement, and if you can't in that situation, what about other ones.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 00:37:55

' It also tends to happen that people will only say 'I'm not getting involved' to the person that they are not siding with'

That's true in my situation too.

The person doing it has very strong views on how things are, and this makes them like to be seen by other people as totally objective/consistent. But because they've got such strong views, they can't help themselves and are compelled to call a spade a spade, regardless of how much what they say hurts the other person.

They just can't see it in themselves though and I'm not talking to them so I can't call a spade a spade myself grin.

Zondra Sat 09-Feb-13 00:40:12

Agent- that's a very insightful post. Thinking about it all, you make a lot of sense.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 00:43:34

I agree. I understand that they didn't want to get involved and it is a very difficult situation but as timidviper states I do feel let down by their lack of loyalty and now even sensitivity. I would like to think that if I was in their shoes I would acted differently. I do find it odd that now I am being told that I should be glad that we didn't buy the house as it needs so much work etc. Should that make me feel better? I just wish one of them had the guts to tell me at the time what was going on so we could have done something about it. Instead, I found out on completion!

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 00:44:30

That's very kind of you to say zondra, thank you.

I'm always surprised by how similar the people I have a problem with in RL are to the people posters describe on here.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 00:47:12

They should have told you op. I can imagine the the thoughts whizzing round your head when you found out. Absolutely rubbish behaviour.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 00:49:17

And yes, Agent, your posts have been particularly insightful tonight. Very well thought out.

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Sat 09-Feb-13 00:50:32

I think they've behaved appallingly OP. Ditch them.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 00:51:03

It is possible that they genuinely didn't know what to do for the best though Neverland.

Nobody wants to go down in local friend history as the one who blabbed and risk the possibility of everyone else turning on them and gossiping endlessly.

But this wasn't about a he said/she said thing, this was buying a house you wanted to be your home, and that's as personal as it gets IMO.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 00:53:55

blush thank you as well LittleC.

It's from experience unfortunately.

But on the bright side, I'd rather be me and be able to get away from them, than them and have to live with it forever grin

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 01:01:18

The thoughts? I could actually feel my heart physically move! grin) I laugh now but at the time my little bubble burst and it wasn't nice.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 01:41:44

It's surprising the other people you know didn't back away from the gazumper, if she's capable of that, what else would she see as OK to do to a so called friend?

Have you ever heard on the grapevine from other stirrers the reason why she thought it was alright to do that to you Never?

MrsMangelfanciedPaulRobinson Sat 09-Feb-13 01:55:16

AgentZigZag, that kind of illustrates what we were saying earlier about those that do the dirty on others coming up smelling of roses whilst the innocent person is pushed out. I've seen it happen loads of times. The gazumper is probably a self-important, entitled, spoilt brat, who no one dares get on the wrong side of huge assumption but I'm still bitter from recent experiences

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 02:14:23

I've been on, and started, threads about why people flock round these people MrsM (which I thought I'd mistakenly read as Mrs Mangel, until I read the rest of your name grin is that sacrilege proposing such an abomination? I mean, Paul Robinson?? He was terrible grin) everyone else is just too scared by the threatened tantruming/sulking they know would be inevitable if they dared say anything.

Knowing they're spinning a situation to other people (who you know) as though you're the one who's being awkward and tantruming by not pandering to their every whim/expressed opinion, does make you question yourself though. Am I being awkward? Am I just manipulating them into doing what I say?

And that's when MN can be handy, for hearing what other people would find acceptable.

I might be able to describe what I think might be going on, but I haven't got a clue how you're supposed to deal with it. Ignore them and you're complying, pick them up on it and you're being difficult, go along with them and you end up doing things you'd rather not do.

mynewpassion Sat 09-Feb-13 03:31:26

Here's my thinking why I think the op is being unreasonable. I am an adult. I get an invitation. If I don't like a person who is also going to be there, I will decide to go and be polite to her or not attend. I don't need others to police their invitations to my likes and dislikes of people. I am not five where I need a mommy to protect me from another bad girl. I am mature enough to make my own decisions.

Eastpoint Sat 09-Feb-13 06:59:08

YANBU

I can completely see why you feel hurt from your OP and then even more so after your updates.

I think it is hard to remember that just because you are invited to something it doesn't mean you have to go. Can you now just say you are sorry you made a mistake and you can't come and just leave it like that? I choose not to go to things with people I dislike as I get stressed out in that sort of situation and end up saying dreadful things. I think I get over adrenalised & am in flight or fight mode. Not saying you can't control yourself but lots of sympathy for you.

Being gazumped is bad enough, but by someone you know & like appalling behaviour. She & her dp,are in my eyes, horrible people. I would feel deeply hurt by your friends who did not let you know what was going on especially if they all knew.

Somethingtothinkabout Sat 09-Feb-13 10:21:53

That is bad OP, I can understand why you're upset, especially now you've been put in the position where it's YOU that has to get over yourself and go with the person who did it to you, or you lose out.

However, maybe the house does need a lot of work, and this woman and her H are getting their comeuppance. Karma's a bitch.

If I were you, I think I'd go and sit as far away from her as possible, just pretend she's not there.

Nanny0gg Sat 09-Feb-13 10:33:36

I wouldn't go, and I would re-evalute the 'friendship' of the others.

If you didn't find out until the very last minute about the gazumping, you'd certainly incurred considerable costs. And it's a hideous way to treat a 'friend'.

And again, all posters who think the OP is making a fuss about nothing, and acting like a teenager - you'd all be okay in this situation, would you?

I think not.

DSM Sat 09-Feb-13 11:09:05

For god sake OP, grow up.

I 'fell out' with a friend, a friend I had had for over 20 years. She did something horrific, something I can't forgive. Not buying a house i wanted.. hmm. Anyway, I have cut her out of my life, but we have lots of mutual friends, and are both adult enough to go to social events together.

One of lunches for no reason are irrelevant. Don't go. Weddings, hen weekends (a particular nightmare!) birthdays.. Those are unavoidable. If you can't be adult about it, then don't go. It's your issue.

Sugarice Sat 09-Feb-13 11:16:21

I'll stick my twp pennies worth in.

Don't go to the lunch and yes, I would be hurt that my feelings weren't worthy of more thought from the lunch host.

amicissimma Sat 09-Feb-13 11:29:38

Well, to me, buying a house is a business transaction. If you both wanted it, one of you was going to lose out. If you'd been the one with the highest offer, she would be in your position.

I can't imagine bearing a grudge a year later, neither can I imagine involving other people in my disappointment.

It's up to you but I think YABU to expect other people to consider who was involved in which disagreement.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 11:32:01

I can get that you're upset and because you are, you shouldn't go. Decline the invitation, but what you can't do is expect other people to remember who fell out with whom a year ago. Other people have lives and you and your house purchases aren't relevant to them. I doubt the invitation has been given maliciously.

SamanthaStormer Sat 09-Feb-13 11:59:02

Your friend did the right thing imo. She is obviously friends with both of you, she can't invite one and not the other without one of you taking offence so she is leaving it up to you two to make the choice. Would you rather have not been invited?

This. I've been in your friend's shoes, friends with two people who refuse to get on.
I'm friends with both of them. If I invite one and not the other one, then the other one takes the hump.
Invite both, they whine like you're doing and say how rude, how dare you invite her, blah blah.
Well, if I'm friends with BOTH of you. What am I supposed to do then?
I refuse to get involved. Either go, or don't go. Yours and the other person's argument, not mine.

ChaoticisasChaoticdoes Sat 09-Feb-13 12:06:57

It's the principle of the whole thing really though. Someone the OP considered a friend has lied to her and deceived her. I wouldn't want to be friends with someone I couldn't trust either.

OP don't go arrange another lunch date if you want to see the friend who has done the inviting.

MsHighwater Sat 09-Feb-13 12:22:15

Do you really mean that you don't want to be invited to the same events as she is or that you don't want her to be invited to the same events as you are?

Not getting involved, on your friends' part, could mean not choosing between the two of you - I.e. not inviting only one of you to something.

I could imagine not knowing what to do if I knew that one friend intended to gazump another friend. I do remember house hunting at the same time as another friend. We looked at a few houses in common. We both understood that there would be nothing personal in it if we both made an offer on the same house. That said, gazumping doesn't really happen here in the same way so that never arose.

Choose to go or not go. It's not up to your other friends to manage the situation.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 14:25:25

Well, it was my own stupidity or naivety at the time. In my excitement I disclosed the fact that by a chance we saw a house we liked. My 'friend' asked me which one and I told her. Little did I know that after our catch up she viewed the house a week later. When I found out that they bought the house and confronted her, she told me that she did not know that her h putt an offer on the house. She was depressed at the time and her h wanted to make her happy! I found it all really weird as I wouldn't go and see a house I know my friend is interested in. I agree, if I have known that they were looking it would have been different. However, I can't believe that my h will buy a house without me knowing. Neither would I go see a house I know my friends are interested in. I value my friend more than houses ( I wouldn't even do it to a colleague at work). I guess at the time I realised that we have different values and there was no point carrying on. I couldn't really imagine going to her place for a cup of coffee etc. What would be the point? I don't have an issue finding myself in the same place as this other women but I find it odd that my close friends expect for me to just get over it. Hence today I did say to them not to invite me along in the future if she is invited as it makes awkward for everyone involved. From my side, it will never be the same and I am not prepared to pretend otherwise.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 14:29:00

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mum11970 Sat 09-Feb-13 14:36:57

So she didn't gazump you, she just put a bid in and bought a house you liked.

KobayashiMaru Sat 09-Feb-13 14:43:04

you hadn't put an offer in? She didn't gazump you then.

Seriously, its not your friends reposibility to juggle their lives so you can avoid someone you decided to fall out with. You are going to find yourself not invited to anything if you carry on like this.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sat 09-Feb-13 14:44:04

Did she gazump you?

It doesn't sound like it.

However

I wouldn't do what she did. Sounds like she does have different values, and if you other friends don't see anything wrong with it (many people would't) then maybe you aren't really good friends. I have learned that some friends we meet as mums aren't necessarily friends-of-the heart. It's more pragmatism than shared values.

MsHighwater Sat 09-Feb-13 14:46:16

I certainly can't imagine my DH buying a house without telling me but I also appreciate that other people, live their lives differently for. How I live mine.

It would be ridiculously OTT to bar yourself from looking any house that a friend (or colleague, really?) was looking at. As I said our friends and we understood that it was not personal. Perhaps you should try to consider the same thing. After all, friends are more important than houses, aren't they?

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 14:56:48

I would consider viewing the sane house but I would tell them and not do it all behind their back. Is it too much to ask? I wouldn't use the information e.g. How much the other person offered to my advantage nore would I be quite about being interested in the same house knowing that the other person can offer more than I did. I may not use the correct term and should have used screwed instead gazumped as we did not pay a survey but we were in negotiations until a higher offer came along. There were only two parties interested us and them.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:02:19

They went to see it and put an offer in which was accepted. They didn't screw you.

They made a better offer.

Really you seem to have lost perspective on this issue a little.

Ok, I was totally with you until just now. You weren't gazumped, you were outbid. Is that right? You'd not paid out? It's still unfriendly, but if you live somewhere like me, where houses in the bracket we desire & can afford are very limited, it's likely that any two people house hunting at the same time will view/like the same house.

I have had minorish issues with women in my group of mum friends, they have been handled badly by them but I have always ended up taking the flack. I have slowly distanced myself but remained civil.

If you really don't feel that you can put it behind you, then you need to back away now. But think carefully, is it REALLY that big a deal, could you just forget it?

YAB a bit U

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:16:51

Ok, that isn't gazumping.

That's called "buying a house they like".

Anyone can do that - if you are househunting, you look at all houses, no matter who else is viewing, and if you want to buy you put in an offer.

For all she knew, you were looking at loads of houses and wouldn't have bought this one anyway confused

I now feel sorry for your friends, who really are caught in the middle. And if you continue to make them feel bad by pressurising them to choose between friends, you are going to lose touch with them all.

Which of course might be easier for you in the long run, but it isn't their fault.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:17:16

In my world, if I care about someone I wouldn't knowingly hurt them. Buying a house is a big decision. If someone come to me and discuss it I wouldn't go behind their back and using the information to take it away under their nose. Let's say I get over it, what would be next? I can't be open with this person any more. Yes, she asked me at the time to remain friends but I can't and don't want to try to trust her. Life moves on.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:20:37

They had every right to go and look at a house that was advertised on the open market without discussing it with you and stepping back because you might be interested.

They bought a house they liked. Why is it your business?

Really you need to let this go.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:20:52

You should re-read SamanthaStormer Sat 09-Feb-13 11:59:02

She is in the position of your friend, and it isn't a nice position to be in.

You should either get past it and carry on, being polite to this woman, or completely cut yourself off from the whole group. You can't carry on like this, it isn't fair on anyone.

BoneyBackJefferson Sat 09-Feb-13 15:21:31

I was sort of with you OP until your post of 14:25:25, then you followed up with saying how you told them how much you bid.

I think that you should be angry with yourself.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:23:12

She knew that we put an offer in, she knew which house it was, I did not know they were looking. She knew how much we offered and how much we could increase it to and that is why she didn't tell me that she was interested in the house as she was worried that we may increase our offer knowing too well that we could afford it.

In my world my children and family come first, if I was buying a house and the perfect one for us came up at a price we could afford then that would be the only thing I would take into consideration, if a friend was also looking at it then its just a case of whichever one of us could pay more gets it, but in all honesty I wouldn't feel bad for putting my family first and I don't think she should either.

You seem to think she did this to you, she didn't, she did it for her family.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:24:54

you should have kept your mouth shut. That's why I never discuss financial details with friends.

But if you don't let this go and get over it you will have no friends left.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:25:45

Yes, I am upset with myself for trusting people and expect them to treat me as I would treat them.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:27:19

You are putting unrealistic expectations on other people.

People do things for their own families first - are you seriously saying that your friend should not have bought a house because you said so?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:28:10

I recently bought a car. My friend had viewed the same car online. I gloated terribly when I found out. We laughed. And moved on.

You need to do the same.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:35:52

No, I am not saying that she shouldn't buy the house because I said so. What I am saying is that pretending to be my friend and finding out all the details and waiting until the house is in their name before telling me is completely wrong.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:37:27

How come, if you could have paid more, the estate agent didn't come back to you and say "we've received a higher offer"? Or were you hanging back (it sounds like it if you didn't even have the survey done) hoping you could pay less.

When selling a house, the vendor always wants as much as possible. If they thought you were serious about buying, surely they would have informed you about another offer. It all sounds very strange.

But regardless of the pros and cons. This has been going on over a year. You have to get over it and move on, either with or without this group of friends.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:37:58

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Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:38:27

And, from reading your posts, I'm not surprised she didn't talk to you about it. There would have been a massive row, and (especially if she was depressed) I suspect she put it off and hoped she would not have to face having the row.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:39:29

Did you read SamanthaStormer's post, by the way.

You should realise that this isn't your mutual friend's fault, any of it. You are being very unfair to her. And to your children, if all the children are friends.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:40:25

And even then it wasn't her who told me. I found out from someone else! However, she did ask me to collect her son from school. WTF!

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:40:52

If I follow your logic.

Friend and me were looking for the same type of car. I knew this. We had discussed the fact that we were both looking for the same type of car.

Car was advertised. We shared links and discussed that it looked a great deal. I went to look at it before they did because I live closer. I bought it.

But by your logic because I knew they were looking before me I shouldn't have bought the car.

Can't you see how weird that sounds?

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:41:34

I can't find Samantha's post.. . The link doesn't work.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:41:42

Of course she didn't tell you.

She knew you would over-react.

Have you bought another house, by the way?

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:42:55

I didn't know they were looking... Otherwise I wouldn't disclosed so many details.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 15:43:09

It isn't a link, just a cut and paste. Here:

"Your friend did the right thing imo. She is obviously friends with both of you, she can't invite one and not the other without one of you taking offence so she is leaving it up to you two to make the choice. Would you rather have not been invited?

This. I've been in your friend's shoes, friends with two people who refuse to get on. I'm friends with both of them. If I invite one and not the other one, then the other one takes the hump. Invite both, they whine like you're doing and say how rude, how dare you invite her, blah blah. Well, if I'm friends with BOTH of you. What am I supposed to do then? I refuse to get involved. Either go, or don't go. Yours and the other person's argument, not mine."

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:44:04

No, we did not and even if we did it wouldn't make it better.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:44:57

But neverland they have NO OBLIGATION to discuss their personal family decisions with you

Honestly you need to let this go. It's not for you to decide what other people can do in their lives. You can't control things like that.

mynewpassion Sat 09-Feb-13 15:51:53

So you want your friends to choose between the two of you. That is what boils down too. If they like you both, they don't have to choose. You, YOU, can choose to accept or decline invitations. They are leaving up to you and her to decide, as free thinking adults.

She has own kids. She doesn't need to be a mummy to two adult women and separate them.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 15:55:18

Understand but I don't have an obligation to carry on and pretend that it is o.k. I don't have to be friend with someone who I don't trust. I can be civil to them but I don't want to spend my spare time in a small group with them. I rather start again. If it means that I loose some other people along the way than be it. I would like to say that I don't meet people and drop them when they upset me but this went a bit too far.

Doha Sat 09-Feb-13 15:56:23

My parents and my friends both went after he same bungalow a few years back, my parents put in he highest bid and won. No hard feelings from my friends--they still talk.
What's for you won't go by you. It was obviously not meant to be

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 15:59:26

You are not reacting normally to this at all. If you took that argument then my friend would drop me for having dared to have bought the car they wanted. Instead of us having been texting all day as they are going to see another one today.

catnipkitty Sat 09-Feb-13 16:06:26

Blah blah...why should anyone else be bothered to worry about your 'fallings out'.... Just don't go <shrugs and wanders off to think about the people in the world with real problems>

Lueji Sat 09-Feb-13 16:11:11

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Lueji Sat 09-Feb-13 16:14:23

If it means that I loose some other people along the way than be it. I would like to say that I don't meet people and drop them when they upset me but this went a bit too far.

I think your friends will be lucky if you do drop them.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 16:15:58

:-) diva like? Oh, well....

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 16:26:43

YANBU to avoid the other mum if what happened is annoying you this much later.

YABVVU to expect everyone else to remember all the ins and outs of your fall out and not invite you. It's an invitation. Just say no.

I genuinely don't get the angst and the need for drama

Whoknowswhocares Sat 09-Feb-13 17:35:37

Ok we'll from a poor start, you sort of had us warming to you in that middle bit. I felt a bit sorry for you. But you were a damn sight less than truthful!
Turns out first impressions were right. She didn't gazump you........not even close. She bought a house you liked. She liked it too and offered on it, before you had even placed a bid if I read it right. So you didn't lose a penny. bad luck, but thats life.
You have decide to spend the following year behaving like a petulant brat and expect your friends to join in? I'd say they could do without a drama queen who thinks the world revolves around her

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 17:42:46

Actually, we put an offer on the house first and she knew it. Yes, you can say I was sightless as I did not expect it coming. I found the house, put an offer and then whilst chatting to her I told her about it. She asked me what house it was and I did tell her...

Whoknowswhocares Sat 09-Feb-13 17:45:38

Ok that changes it a little (sorry), but your offer had not been accepted had it? No surveys,legal expenses etc?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 17:46:27

Then it's your fault for having a mouth like the mersey tunnel. you should have kept your private personal business private. sorry but you need to get over it.

Mia4 Sat 09-Feb-13 18:26:08

YANBU to dislike someone and not want to be friends, however you can't expect other people to encourage you with that or make concessions by not inviting other out.

I sucks, I've been there except it was a once good friend of mine who'd slept with my (4x back) ex partner for months while we were together and was dating one of my DPs friends. I was civil to her but very cool, I made it clear I wanted nothing personally to do with her but we were still able to go out in large and small groups because I just avoiding interacting with her. She obviously knew and tried to draw me back in but i was civil, polite but disinterested in her. I didn't ask her about herself or how her day was, just hello and goodbye and then interacted with everyone else.

This happened until she slept with one of DPs other friends, breaking the heart of his close friend and pissing off everyone else (except the one she cheated with). Thankfully now i don't have to deal with her.

It's hard but it gets easier with time, you don't need to be friends just acknowledge and move on. I'm sure there's plenty of people you do want to interact with who will be there.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 18:36:02

Had your offer been accepted op? I think its weird of the friend not to mention it either way. That would be the normal thing to do, not sneaking around. I couldn't imagine doing that to a friend without talking to them about it first.

WhateverTrevor Sat 09-Feb-13 18:46:43

Why didn't you offer more?

QOD Sat 09-Feb-13 18:47:08

Ok, so how would you feel to see photos of them all, the one you fell out with and all the others, at a event, having fun, and you weren't invited and didn't know about it?

Feels like shit I can tell you.

Suck it up or you'll be the one.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 18:56:38

they are all cunts

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 18:59:09

I am completely on your side neverland

firesidechat Sat 09-Feb-13 19:03:00

Don't know what to say really except that you should possibly just let it go. I haven't "fallen out" with anyone since school, so can't help much.

HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 19:06:31

I think it was very sneaky of the ex-friend to pump you for info on what amount you would bid etc.Very sneaky indeed,and I wouldn't trust her again either.I completely understand how you felt used/stabbed in the back etc.

I think the friend who invited you to lunch did so as to avoid taking 'sides',or offending you if she didn't invite you and you found out about it later.

To be honest,rightly or wrongly,I think I'd just take a step back from that group too.See how you feel after not seeing them for a while,if you feel better then leave them in the past.If you genuinely miss them,then stay in touch with the ones you miss.

I really do think it was sly of the ex-friend to use the info you were giving her against you,actually can't believe that other posters don't see that.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:08:07

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JamieandtheMagicTorch Sat 09-Feb-13 19:10:50

I think people are being rude to the OP.

So she has different expectations of friendships? They aren't ridiculous, IMO.

On the subject of the OP, I'd say - just don't go. The inviter probably wants to smooth things over, doesn't get why you might still be upset, but you can't really bear her any ill will.

HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 19:16:14

Oh earlierintheweek,have you never discussed anything with a friend without expecting them to use it to your disadvantage?It's called chatting about what's happening in your life,it's what friends do.OP was being perfectly normal to chat to her friend about it,friend was being perfectly sneaky to keep her mouth shut about what her true intentions were.

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 19:16:50

They are cunts.

They know they are, because they had to make up this ridiculous surprise-surprise-darling-I've-bought-you-a-house story.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:18:59

No I wouldn't discuss how much I had offered on a house. I would say I was looking, I might say what house I'd seen, but I would never ever ever tell what actual money I had offered, no.

Because that's personal and private and no one's business but your own.

And I certainly wouldn't hold it against someone if they went to see a house and put an offer on it. If the op had really put a proper offer on, they'd have been told about the offer and had the opportunity to up their offer. They didn't. Tis just one of those things. And not worth being annoyed about a year later.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 19:20:23

nver ever did the OP say she was pumped for info. She said she told the ex-friend. She had a big mouth and it bit her on the bum.

Is it normal to not tell your friends about things you are excited about then? In case they do the dirty on you? People obviously have wildly different expectations about what friendship means, thats for sure. hmm

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 19:21:38

They know they are, because they had to make up this ridiculous surprise-surprise-darling-I've-bought-you-a-house story

I agree. What a load of bollocks.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:21:40

I would tell a friend I had looked at a house. But I wouldn't blab my offer that I'd put on. I must be weird.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 19:24:33

You obviously don't have much trust in your friends then earlier.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:25:40

No I just was brought up that it was vulgar to discuss financial dealings.

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 19:26:07

earlier, do you differentiate between acquaintances, work colleagues, mates, school pals and genuine friends ?

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 19:26:33

I think that her decision to buy the house over your head like she did, has broken a strong moral code in your book...so I definitely sympathise with how bent out of shape about the whole thing you clearly feel. As far as you are concerned it's a big no no. You wouldn't do it, and are appalled that she did. I hear you.

However, the fact is, she wasn't thinking about you, she was thinking about what was best for her family, and I'm afraid that's the way it goes. I know you feel like you were stitched up, and to be fair, in a sense you were, as she did sneak behind your back...but hey...when it comes to stuff like buying houses, it's every man for himself, and that's all there is to it.

I can well imagine feeling the same in your shoes, but I know I'd get over it because that's the way it goes.

To be still holding a grudge about it a year later, to the point where you wont attend a lunch with her is taking it too far. Stop this now.

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 19:27:20

Oh ok ....you've just teleported here from the 19th century.grin

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:28:02

this is a mum from the mumsgroup, it isn't a best friend in the whole world.

And even my best friend in the whole world I wouldn't tell how much I'd put on a house. Not until the deal was done. I just wouldn't.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 19:28:45

Yes with strangers. Not with close friends. But we all have different beliefs and ideas of what is right and wrong.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:28:54

grin quite possibly. I just wouldn't discuss financial stuff. I just wouldn't. I can't explain it, I just wouldn't. As I said, I'm obviously weird grin

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 19:29:34

when it comes to stuff like buying houses, it's every man for himself

Well clearly not otherwise the OP would not be sharing the finance info.

With friends like that who needs enemies ?

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 19:30:54

Not weird......just different grin

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:31:54

The thing is, it's not UR for the OP to feel she doesn't want to go to lunch because the former friend is there for whatever reason she likes under the sun. That's up to her, that's her choice.

What is unreasonable is that she is putting it onto her friend and she wants her friend to collude in the whole thing and not invite one or other.

Which is ridiculous. Her friend won't remember or give a shit. It's an invite. You are allowed to say no.

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 19:32:59

Stop this now

And how long are you planning on holding that "grudge" pictish ?wink

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 19:35:22

eh?

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 19:36:05

What is unreasonable is that she is putting it onto her friend and she wants her friend to collude in the whole thing and not invite one or other.

I would see it that any genuine friend of mine would look at gazumper as though they just trod in something.

Unless they are hearing a completely different story I would not expect them to maintain friendship.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:37:02

But she wasn't gazumped.

ModernToss Sat 09-Feb-13 19:46:00

She behaved badly towards you, I agree, and I'd be very angry too.

I think you need to let it go now though, or let the friends go.

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 19:47:53

She wasn't gazumped...she was outbid.

However, there is something quite galling about the friend using the info the op innocently gave away, to ensure her success in getting the house. She knew how much the op could afford to stretch to.
That does stink.

But hey - if it were me, I'd not let it sour my social life to the point of refusing invites to social occasions.

digerd Sat 09-Feb-13 19:50:15

If a friend of mine gazumped another friend of mine I would stand by the victim as I would expect anyone with a sense of decency would do. Gazumping your friend is nasty, and nasty behaviour should not be tolerated. Friends that condone her gazumping you are no friends of yours, I,m afraid.

What Pictish said re thinking what was best for her family. Not a lovely thing to do, but I'd be inclined to make some early comments & put it behind me. If she'd actually gazumped you & you were say £6000 out of pocket that would b very different.

Rise above. Make it clear you'll never trust her, but suck it up if you want to keep socialising with the other poor women.

Sarky not early FFS

Snazzynewyear Sat 09-Feb-13 20:23:54

Agree with cumfy - the person knew they were doing something that was not right. They weren't a true friend. Your other so-called friends would rather you just 'got over it' as that's the easy option for them. I would feel like you OP. Tell your inviter that you don't feel like coming and playing nice and you aren't going to pretend.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 20:26:17

I am still trying to imagine the conversation with a mum from mums group, not a close friend.

"yes we went to see 13 river cottages it's lovely it's for sale at £100,000 so we put a bid on at £90,000 but we can only afford to go to £95,000 if someone bids against us"

Do people really have those sorts of conversations with casual acquaintances?

Pigsmummy Sat 09-Feb-13 20:29:08

It's your problem not theirs. Yabu

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 20:33:20

I am still trying to imagine the conversation with a mum from mums group, not a close friend.

how do you know she wasn't an (allegedly) close friend at the time? I dont think the op referred to her as a casual acquaintance at any point did she?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 20:36:26

The OP said "one of the mums from our 'mumsgroup'" although she did later say she considered this person a close friend. But how close is close? Maybe the friend didn't think they were that close? The OP seemed to imply it was the kids that were closer.

Or I could be reading it wrong.

But I can't imagine ever spilling that amount of private stuff to anyone tbh.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 20:38:10

I think if it was her best friend the OP would have said so. And as I said I'm just staggered that anyone would have this sort of conversation with anyone - I wouldn't even with my parents because how much money I can or cannot afford to bid on a house is not any of their business.

But it's been established, I'm weird grin

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 20:39:04

She wasn't gazumped [sigh]

If the friend was househunting, it is entirely possible she would have seen the house anyway. The story about the husband could be due to the fact that the friend said "you know that house we were going to offer on, we can't put in an offer because Neverland will throw a strop", resulting in the husband putting in an offer anyway.

We don't know. The friend who invited the op doesn't know.

I mean, if she hadn't even got to the stage of having a survey, was it even a serious offer?

And it's a year later ffs.

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 20:47:05

I wouldn't call her a casual acquaintance. Our children were born only three weeks apart. We would see each other daily and looked after each other kids. When she was going through difficult time, I was there for her. When the rest of the group wanted to exclude her due to depression I stood by her. She looked after my DD and vice versa. We talked about our dreams and aspirations. Obviously, I got it all wrong. Instead, I was made to look like a fool.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 20:48:18

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WhateverTrevor Sat 09-Feb-13 20:49:15

Why didn't you put a higher offer in?

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 20:53:11

How come you didn't proceed with the sale, just as a matter of interest?

It seems strange that she managed to see a house for the first time, get all the checks done, put in an offer, have it approved and complete the sale in such a short time. Didn't you make a higher offer, or try to move faster?

Neverland2013 Sat 09-Feb-13 20:55:27

??? for not wanting to play nice??? For being true to myself and stand by what I believe in even if there are implications??? I understand why she did it but I don't think anyone can expect that our group will ever be the same.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 20:57:34

You seriously are taking this far too much to heart.

She saw a house she liked. She bid on it. She got it.

If you had wanted it then you should have either kept your powder dry and your mouth shut so no one knew what you'd bid and what you could bid up to, or bid higher.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 20:59:21

Oh dear "our group will never be the same" - groups are never the same, you move on and up and away.

If this is still upsetting you this much a year later you are better off without any of them, and quite frankly they are better off without you.

Either forgive and forget (or at least be able to pretend to), or completely give up the friendships, because this is doing no-one any good.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:01:16

And surely if you're saying "group" then she's not really a best friend is she?

timidviper Sat 09-Feb-13 21:04:49

earlier OP might be depressed, I don't know, but I think her feelings are quite rational after being let down by people she should be able to trust. Maybe I'm old-fashioned but I think loyalty and consideration are nice qualities in a friend rather than odd but then maybe that explains why I was let down badly too if other people think that.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:08:25

But she wasn't let down. She wasn't gazumped even. A house was for sale Her family and another family viewed it. They put an offer in and bought it.

How is that letting someone down?

OP, did you have an offer in on the house?

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:17:17

it is beyond me how anyone can think that if you tell a friend I am going to offer x for y, that in any universe it is ok for said friend to offer x+2 without saying afford.

and to say every man ( sic) for themselves

I do not want to live in that world

maybe I'm old fashioned but when did love and loyalty go so far out of fashion?

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:18:00

afford = anything

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:18:40

Hully but why would you tell a friend you were going to offer x for y? Oversharing, much?

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:20:56

why on earth wouldn't you?

why would u be so closed off and paranoid that you wouldn't?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:22:16

Not closed off and paranoid, not at all, I just wouldn't discuss finances with anyone.

I was brought up that it was in bad taste and vulgar. And as this thread shows, a bloody sensible idea.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:23:13

and thats not the point, thats just your good old victim blaming. point is she trusted her friend, friend was a slimeball, but shes paying the price. same as ever, it's always the bullied that leaves the school

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:25:08

I am slightly involved in property, as are several of my friends and acquaintances, if someone announces an interest, none of us would dream of trying to nick it. it's bad form, bad manners, and shitty

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:26:23

Hully I swear I'm not victim blaming. I just would never discuss personal dealings with anyone who didn't need to know.

I'm not a bully and the implication in your post that I am is misplaced.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 21:27:11

But Hully, she hasn't answered whether the friend was househunting - she might have seen it independently anyway. And she hasn't said how serious she was about it, the friend might not have realised that she was serious about buying it. And anyway, the friend who is now having the lunch isn't the friend who bought the house.

It's mad to be so upset a year later, especially as we don't know exactly what the piggy-in-the-middle friend knows about the whole thing.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sat 09-Feb-13 21:27:28

Hully. I am with you. I regret on here that trusting other peoplemis een as hopelessly naive and old fashioned.minwouldn't do what the firend did, therefore i would feel hurt if it was done to me. Can't imagine any of my friends doing that to me.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 21:28:40

I would love her to tell us whether she had put in an offer at all. Or whether she knows for a fact that this person didn't know of the house's existence.

Because it could have been entirely coincidence. I met a friend at a house viewing once. In the end, neither of us bought it, but which of us should have stood back had we both wanted it?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sat 09-Feb-13 21:28:59

Blimey.

That was possibly the most incoherent post i have ever done. Bloody ipad sausage fingers..

The upshot was: do as you would be done by

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:29:55

I'm not calling you a bully earlier

I said that she spending up ostracized from her group despite doing nothing wrong, just as so often it is the bullied child that leaves the school

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:30:37

she is ending up

yy James, damn phpne

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 21:30:42

Yes...I suppose you are right Hully.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 21:31:17

Completely agree Hully. I find it sad that anyone thinks thats ok. Whatever happened to friendship and being honest with people.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:31:45

Mary, she told het friend, the friend bought the house

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:32:56

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HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 21:33:26

Earlierintheweek,you seem to think your way of non-disclosure of information like this in a chat with a friend is the norm,it actually isn't. I'd wager that most people would feel safe discussing such details with a friend,which the OP genuinely considered the other woman to be.

Your ex-friend is a sly arse,OP.You're better off being away from her,how could you possibly ever feel free to discuss anything without being aware she is listening and possibly figuring out how she can use that info to her own advantage.?

You don't need a doctor,you need some new friends.

(*earlierintheweek,some of your posts towards the op could also be considered rude and vulgar,perhaps you should read all that 'manners' manual???)

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:35:29

earlier, you are entitled to your world view, bit it is a mighty depressing one

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 21:35:45

I think my pov is not focusing on the friendship as much as the house itself. Having house hunted myself, I have never allowed myself to get too emotionally involved in a property until completion. I see it as pretty cut throat tbh.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:36:12

Well if it had been me instead of the OP I wouldn't have spilled my guts.

But the other family might have bought the house anyway.

WhateverTrevor Sat 09-Feb-13 21:36:36

I think the fact Neverland has avoided answering all the questions is that she wasn't gazumped at all.
Neverland did you put an offer in? Did you then go higher? There seems to be a lot your not telling us.
Maybe your friends think you're being petty and don't want to get involved.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:36:45

shes not being a drama queen

she is hurt by the first friend

and then lack of consideration from the second

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 21:37:13

But she's being a drama queen over very little.

but its not little to the op. It wouldn't be to me either. Very harsh to disregard her feelings in such a flippant manner. Treat others as you want to be treated yourself.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:38:07

Pictish - that's how I feel. Until the deeds are done, as it were, it's not a done deal. I wouldn't lose sleep. And haven't when buying houses in the past. Been outbid and done outbidding, once even by and with a man who played football with my then husband. We lost. So did they. A cash buyer trumped us both.

Maryz Sat 09-Feb-13 21:38:30

Yes, but if the friend was househunting, she might have already seen it, don't you think.

I saw every house within a ten mile radius when I was househunting.

It's kind of annoying me that she hasn't told us exactly why she didn't put an offer in earlier, and she hasn't answered lots of questions which leaves me thinking that maybe what the "friend" did might not have been so bad.

And also leaves me thinking the friend who is having the lunch is really stuck in the middle.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:38:45

it is irrelevant whether she had offered or not

she had told het friend of her interest and intention and was entitled to expect her to respect that

in a decent world

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:40:00

if it was all so fine and great, why didn't the friend tell her she was going to whack a higher offer on?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:40:53

I think the OP is dwelling on this far too much a year later by demanding that her friends choose. The danger is they won't choose her. But I honestly wouldn't have lost a minute of sleep over it - it happens when you're buying a house.

And yes my attitude to discussing money and personal things may be old fashioned. I don't particularly care about that - it's my attitude, it's what I'm comfortable with and in this sort of situation it would have served me well.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:41:13

the fact she said nothing, despite meverland telling her of her interest, says it all, sneaky slyboots

your friend treated you very badly and you were right to end the friendship.

my god, where are people's ethics???

it does seem like the others just want a quiet life. i've seen this so many times: group of friends, one treats someone like shit, the other friends shrug their shoulders, 'not our business blah blah', shat on friend gets sidelined. shit friend continues to be included in group of spineless shitty friends.

move on op. i like the sound of you. want to meet for coffee?

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:42:25

she isn't demanding

I think you are trying to pit her on the wrong to justify your own dog eat dog outllok

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:43:16

But she is making her friends choose by saying she won't go where the other person is.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:43:21

yy Claude

is happening to me right now sad

this friend pumped her for info on house, offer price, how high they could go and forgot to mention that she was even looking for a house. then gazumped her at last minute and didn't tell her. but 'oh, could you pick up my kid from school?'

do people really think this is acceptable behaviour?

it's DISGUSTING.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:44:33

life is full of choices earlier

oh hully i'm so so sorry. it's gut wrenching it really is.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:45:55

The friend didn't pump her. She spilled the info in her excitement.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:46:34

I'm supposed to be out right now and am at home for similar reasons. it really sucks ( cries a bit)

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:47:47

she shouldnt have needed to worry aboit it with a friend, earlier

the word friend is the clue

mynewpassion Sat 09-Feb-13 21:48:31

I am sorry but buying a house isn't like asking your friend if you could date an ex. No one owns a house that is for sale. It's open season.

While I understand the op is hurt by the whole thing, it doesn't negate that the inviter does not need to police two adult women. They have choices. The op has a choice to go to the lunch or not. The op can choose to not socialize with this friend or the woman who "stole" her house. She can't control other people's actions, only hers.

well, it's not something i would do.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 21:50:10

I'm supposed to be out right now and am at home for similar reasons. it really sucks ( cries a bit)

I'm sorry Hully. Its shite when that happens.

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 21:51:02

it does seem like the others just want a quiet life. i've seen this so many times: group of friends, one treats someone like shit, the other friends shrug their shoulders, 'not our business blah blah', shat on friend gets sidelined. shit friend continues to be included in group of spineless shitty friends.

This I agree with. That IS what bloody happens.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:51:13

It's a house for sale. Wouldn't it be advertised?

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 21:54:01

earlier you're determined to make it ok for people to treat each other like that

there's no point in arguing further with you

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 21:54:20

It's only every man for themselves with property if we've gone back to the bad old days of thatchers Britain.

It's not just about something the OP was thinking about buying, it was a place she could imagine would be her home, if I was being dramatic I'd say before her friend cruelly snatched her dreams out from under her grin

You said 'the friend might not have realised that she was serious about buying it' early Maryz, but that's the point the OP's trying to make, that if she didn't know how she (the OP) felt about the house then she should have asked.

Why didn't she ask?

Either she didn't give a monkeys whether it meant anything to the OP, or she deliberately didn't because she wanted the sale whatever it meant.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 21:57:43

Hully I'm really not, honestly, but I just don't understand being so emotionally invested in that situation. I personally wouldn't discuss information like the OP did, I wouldn't be in that mindset and I don't understand it.

Which isn't the same as saying it's ok to treat people like shit. Because I don't think the friend did. Unless you believe that the OP had first dibs on every house that came up for sale in the area?

And I do think expecting friends to pick and exclude ... it's likely it might backfire.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 21:58:25

It's a house for sale. Wouldn't it be advertised?

you seem to be deliberately missing the point. Do you really not get it? Not even a tiny bit?

HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 22:00:36

earlier,the friend then said 'oh dh put an offer on,without me even knowing!!'

Bullshit of the highest order,friend knew it was underhand,plain and simple,and still did it.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:00:51

No I really don't get it. And I'm not deliberately missing the point in some sort of passive aggressive way. I really genuinely don't get what the friend was supposed to do.

House for sale Advertised. Mrs x at toddler group mentions it. Mrs Y says nothing because she has already booked to see it. Mrs Y then buys house.

End of. No drama. And to expect another friend a year later to remember and not invite someone because of it is rather odd imho.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:01:59

Or friend thought "Ops going to kick off about this I'll fib to avoid a scene"

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:02:51

mrs y saying nothing is wrong

friends in the true sense and point of the word, dont do that

HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 22:02:53

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Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:03:59

otherwise they aren't friends, they are competitors

friends= trust

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:04:30

It all depends how close a friend the friend is then doesn't it really?

And as I have said earlier in the thread, the Op is quite right not to go if she feels upset or doesn't want to for whatever reason she likes, but to expect someone else to remember the whys and wherefors of a falling out that she had with someone and invite/not invite based on that is being unreasonable.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 22:04:32

But Mrs Y isnt just a person at toddler group. She was supposed to be a good friend. It isn't that simplistic.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 22:05:18

You're looking at it as a financial transaction between strangers, Earlier, but what happened was more than that.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:06:12

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earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:07:38

Then it all comes down to a subjective how good friends are you. And there's two sides to that story - the OP and the friend. The friend may not think they're such good friends as the OP does.

In which case she may feel, legitimately, that she's done nothing wrong.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:08:05

Hully you are absolutely wrong on that and that comment is insulting.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:13:00

why is it insulting? its only how I see it, you dont have to agree

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:15:48

You said I have low requirements of friendship which would make my life emptier.

How is that not insulting?

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:17:06

that is the conclusion I draw from your posts

its only insulting if you choose it to be

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:18:33

you misunderstood my bully remark earlier, I think we may speak different languages

pictish Sat 09-Feb-13 22:18:51

I think it's insulting too.

You guys don't agree on this, but that was a bit low. Eeek!

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:19:02

Whatever Hully.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 22:21:46

What it comes down to, Earlier, is that the OP's taken the decision not to have any contact with this person because she felt what she did meant so much to her that she didn't want to be around someone so casual about what happened.

Whether she was/is right to be pissed off at the woman for so long doesn't matter, the fact is, she feels like that.

From what she's written, it doesn't sound to me like she's putting it on to be a drama queen and have people flocking round her asking if she's alright, she was genuinely hurt by the woman.

And that's why it's not possible to say she's just being childish or shouldn't get upset about what happened, because she is.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:22:52

ok I'm off, but it's not meant to be insulting, just that if you think it's ok for acfriemd to behave like that, them you dont expect much from them, which makes life e adder, nitmeans a lack of the depth that trust and honesty can bring

seems logical toe <shrug>

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:23:17

Absolutely Agent. I said that. What is unreasonable is to expect other people to remember and not invite her.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 22:23:35

It was a bit like saying 'no wonder nobody wants to be friends with you', Hully.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:25:06

really? not logical?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:25:36

Hully you've done it again.

I have friends in real life. I trust them. I expect support and friendship from them.

But honest to god I would not act the way the OP has over someone who is a mum friend from a mum group over a house she didn't even get gazumped on. And I wouldn't have spilled my guts the way she did. I just wouldn't.

And to say I have no friends and am basically a horrible person because I see it differently to you is just unfair.

AgentZigzag Sat 09-Feb-13 22:26:24

Sorry Earlier, I only skim read most of the posts must have missed that bit.

I agree it could have nothing to do with the wider group, but, and this can be an awful bit, just by knowing what was going on, they were involved.

Like knowing someones cheating on someone else, it's not a situation of your making, but you have to make a choice, and not saying something is making a choice.

Hullygully Sat 09-Feb-13 22:27:39

I'll go then

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:28:09

My very first post on the thread

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 11:32:01
I can get that you're upset and because you are, you shouldn't go. Decline the invitation, but what you can't do is expect other people to remember who fell out with whom a year ago. Other people have lives and you and your house purchases aren't relevant to them. I doubt the invitation has been given maliciously.

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 22:45:49

Some people do prefer being stabbed in the back to being stabbed in the front don't they.grin

earlier do you recognise the logical contradiction in your position ?

It's OK for a "genuine" friend to side with someone who went behind your back in a property deal.
But heaven forfend any random poster on MN who makes an honest and logical comment about another post.

I think it's all to do with values.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:49:28

I don't see any contradiction. I don't. The "friend" may just see the OP as a mumgroup friend.

It's a house the OP went to look at. Nothing more. She didn't get it. I personally would have shrugged my shoulders and not taken it personally. I just wouldn't.

And I find being told that because I feel like that I have very low requirements of friendship which makes my life empty utterly uncalled for and insulting.

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 22:53:25

Not just shrugging then earlier ?

Fine.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:54:36

Look. I disagree with you. I just do. Why are you needling me and trying to make me feel bad about myself?

cumfy Sat 09-Feb-13 22:57:11

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HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 22:59:33

Your description of your experience of friendships actually said more about you than you probably realise earlier.You described yourself as 'weird' because you could not understand how friends would actually discuss buying houses amongst each other....even though most of us would find that the most natural thing in the world to do.

I'm guessing that if you find that too invasive (or whatever) then it actually would make one wonder how close your own friendships are.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 22:59:58

Look. I would not have got upset in the situation that the OP describes. I just wouldn't. It wouldn't have bothered me personally. And I don't and wouldn't have discussed finances, which I have accepted makes me weird, but I just wouldn't have told anyone what I could have offered on a house.

I have had and continue to have bigger shit going on in my life that is much more worthy of being worried about that something like that.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 23:01:02

No Hilda, sorry, maybe I wasn't clear. I would have discussed that i was moving, discussed a house I looked at, but I never ever ever in million years would have discussed the offer I put on or how much I could afford to pay, which the OP says she did. I just wouldn't have.

LittleChimneyDroppings Sat 09-Feb-13 23:01:09

Look. I disagree with you. I just do. Why are you needling me and trying to make me feel bad about myself?

dont you think by dismissing the ops feelings and calling her a drama queen, is trying to make the op feel bad about herself and how she feels?

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 23:02:38

This is what I actually said Hilda
earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 19:18:59
No I wouldn't discuss how much I had offered on a house. I would say I was looking, I might say what house I'd seen, but I would never ever ever tell what actual money I had offered, no.

Because that's personal and private and no one's business but your own.

And I certainly wouldn't hold it against someone if they went to see a house and put an offer on it. If the op had really put a proper offer on, they'd have been told about the offer and had the opportunity to up their offer. They didn't. Tis just one of those things. And not worth being annoyed about a year later.

I think that was pretty clear

HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 23:12:14

In your book,*earlier*,it's not worth getting bothered about.In the Op's,it is.And calling her a drama queen and telling her to see a doctor about it??.A fairly insulting character appraisal there,I think.

How ironic that you then got upset about a stranger passing an observational comment about you.

earlierintheweek Sat 09-Feb-13 23:14:10

Look, whatever, we disagree. I wouldn't have got bothered about it because to me it's a small thing. What do you want me to say? Do I have to tell you all the other stuff in my life so you can judge whether something like this would be small to you if you were me?

HildaOgden Sat 09-Feb-13 23:14:25

I'm out of this thread now,because quite frankly it's becoming too sidetracked.

Best of luck OP,my guess is that you may have outgrown that group of friends x

Helltotheno Sat 09-Feb-13 23:21:49

I sympathise OP. You confided in someone you thought was a mate and she fucked you over, let's not beat around the bush. In a general sense, she's not in your corner and you absolutely don't have to socialise with her. Why should you be the one to behave as though nothing's happened? Sod that!

Don't go, and distance yourself, that's my advice...

Hissy Sun 10-Feb-13 08:57:17

I'd live in a world filled with Neverlands, Hullys, Claudes any day of the week!

Never, you have such a high moral and ethical code, it may be that in legalese, and black and white that it wasn't such a massive thing as gazumping, BUT it wasn't right, proper or nice to do, and you have every right to feel miffed about the 'friend' AND the lack of support.

You clearly have higher standards in how you treat friends than the bunch of people you socialise with. The people you know are actually not good enough, you do deserve better. I'd love a friend like you, you sound so loyal, trustworthy and generous with your time and care.

If I were you, I'd go friend-hunting instead of househunting.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 09:45:39

As i said earlier, i have found that some friends I have made as a mother are not really friends of the heart. There's a pragmatism about them - being in the right place at the right time, Iyswim. There's sometimes a false sense of intimacy because we talk to each other a lot about emotional stuff to do with our children. But push comes to shove, some don't hold the same views/ values/ ethics.

I can see * earlier's* pov, in a way. But i really suspect that if you were in the same position as the OPs friend, whether you would have been more upfront about your intention to buy a house she was interested in. From the way you have spoken on herre, i suspect that you would have been honest and upfront.

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 09:48:52

Jamie - is that last paragraph to to me?

Hissy Sun 10-Feb-13 09:57:28

Sounds like it earlier and it sounds like a compliment. grin

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 09:58:51

Yes

It was a question really. Would you tell a friend you were looking at a house they were interested in, and were putting in an offer?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 10:01:31

The reason i ask, is because, although i would probably step away from a house a friend was interested in, the second best response would be to talk to my friend about it. Not be underhand and make up a silly lie, which would underline the fact i knew i was doing something a bit grubby

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 10:04:01

grin the thing is, and I'm going to say this and hope it doesn't bite ME on the bum, I would have said I was looking at the house, I would have discussed what a lovely kitchen, the bathroom needed done up, but I just wouldn't have told my financial gazintaes to anyone except my partner (if I had one to be buying a house with). Obviously I am weird, and I accept that and I am out of kilter with the MN attitude, but that doesn't make me malicious. Or friendless. And I wouldn't take what the other mum did personally.

And I genuinely can't get my head around (and this isn't a dig or meant snippy it's a genuinely can't) that you would discuss how much money you had or didn't have to buy a house with a mumgroup. And I certainly wouldn't ban myself from looking at a house my work colleague might like. I work in an organisation with thousands of employees there wouldn't be a house in the country I could view!

I am old. My children are older now but I have been through the mumgroup stage. And as a friend of mine (yes I do have them) says "friends come into your life for a reason, a season or the rest of your days" the tricky thing is knowing which sort of friend they are. This isn't a rest of your days friend.

MusicalEndorphins Sun 10-Feb-13 10:05:41

OP, I think your ex friend did a sneaky thing, and it would annoy me. I wouldn't do that to a friend either.
I don't think you should go to the party if you do not want to. If it were a family members special occasion or something, I would go and just not bother with her while there, but with only four couples, for a non important gathering, why bother? I would just change it to not attending, if I didn't want to attend something. You are a free agent, and not obligated to go.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 10:06:30

There is no "MN view"

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 10:08:31

x-posts

Jamie - if I assume it was a really close friend and not a mumgroup friend, yes I would tell them I was interested and tell them I was putting an offer in. Which would mean there would be none of this he said she said they went behind my back stuff which I have every sympathy for the OP on because it's not nice. But me and my friends have that sort of relationship where we are honest and open and up front.

But I don't think it's in any way at all grubby for the "friend" to put an offer in on a house. Everyone puts their own family first. Everyone. We don't even know if the OP had an offer on the house.

<deep breath and waits to be deleted but I don't mean this nasty> I have been depressed. I have been very depressed. And when I was very depressed things which normally wouldn't upset me really really upset me and my reactions were disproportionate and out of kilter with the seriousness of the actual event. I can see echoes of this in the OP's posts and reactions and I have every empathy with that.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 10:14:03

It is as I thoughtt. This is a matter of perception. The OP perceives this person as a close friend. You think she might have been mistaken to think so. But you can only say that after the event. The friends actions proved she wasn't a close friend. You can see how the OP is disappointed?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 10:14:38

Earlier

I have aslo suffered with depression

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 10:19:58

I have to admit, i find friendship groups problematic. I an an extraverted introvert. I find myself avoiding groups because people tend to be unkind in them.

< blatant hijack)

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 10:20:04

Absolutely Jamie I can see how the OP is disappointed. But you know in more than 20 years of being a mum I can count the number of true friends I have made from a mumgroup who lasted and who I am still friends with now on less than the fingers of one hand.

Having kids the same age doesn't mean you're going to be great friends. Maybe that's the voice of bitter experience, I don't know.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 10-Feb-13 10:21:56

Well then maybe this is the first time the OP has realised that, and will protect herrself more next time.

Sorry to be talking about not to you you OP!!

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 10:22:28

I'd still like to know whether the op knows for sure that the friend didn't know about the house anyway.

And also how far along the buying process she had got.

Because imo the answers to those questions make a huge difference.

[stubborn]

I still reserve a lot of my sympathy for the friend who is having the lunch and who can't do right for doing wrong!

JenaiMorris Sun 10-Feb-13 10:29:04

This might restore some people's faith in human nature; someone outbid us on our house but the vendors still let us have it because the other buyers were BTL developers and they preferred that the home they'd raised their children in go to a family.

The BTL buyers would have let it as an HMO.

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 10:31:05

And what Maryz said.

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 10:33:28

Jenai, my parents did that. They were selling our family home, and they sold it (for less money) to a family rather than to the developer who had been trying to buy it for years.

The fuckers sold it two months later to two different developers (the garden to one, the house to another) and almost doubled the price.

My dad is still very angry about it. Not the money, but the lies. They brought their children to see the house, they played in our tree house etc. They never had any intention of living there.

JenaiMorris Sun 10-Feb-13 10:39:14

Oh sad

We're still in ours!

Hullygully Sun 10-Feb-13 11:08:20

Mary, the l.p. considered the other woman a proper friend. she told her of her intentions,

how, in any circs can the friend be excused?

she didn't say, oh I've seen that house, she didn't say anything, she sneaked off and used the info shed been trusted with re price to nick it.

as sneaky as your parents buyers, in fact worse, she was supposed to be a friend and have a bit of honour

stradbally Sun 10-Feb-13 11:34:20

OP, seriously, YABtotallyU, have you heard yourself?? Life is just too short, if this is how you deal with something so petty I really hope you never have any real problems to cope with.

Hullygully Sun 10-Feb-13 11:48:28

how is a betrayal of trust and good faith "petty?" confused

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 11:48:45

I dunno, Hully.

I could be wrong, but I suspect there is a lot more to the whole thing. She can of course come back and tell me, but if both of them were househunting, there is no proof that she even saw the house first. It is possible that the other woman had already seen it.

I agree with you that if this was the first she had heard of it, and she deliberately went to look, and deliberately put in a quick offer of more than the op had said she could afford, and done it all behind her back and made sure she didn't find out so she couldn't put a higher offer in, then yes it's a horrible thing to do.

But the slight drip-feeding and the refusal to answer any questions is making my fishy-radar zing a bit.

I'm also not good at carrying grudges. I feel sorry for the friend in the middle who is having to deal with the fall out over a year later

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 11:49:24

That was an interesting middle paragraph, grammatically hmm

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 11:54:39

Maryz I agree. Also, surely the estate agent has a professional duty to get the best possible price for the house? And surely the first offer is always the least you think you can get away with? So it sounds to me like the "friend" was in a stronger position or able to complete quicker or there was more than one bidder (ie not just the OP and her friend)?

Hullygully Sun 10-Feb-13 11:56:05

I don't understand the determination to put the op in the wrong.

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 11:58:35

Hully - I'm not trying to put the op in the wrong. Or the friend in the right. I think (genuinely not having a go) that this is one of those situations where it's all about perception and context. And it's one of those ones where there's three sides to the story - his, hers, and the truth.

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 11:59:53

It's because she was drip-feeding a tad and I got cross. And then she wouldn't answer the questions about whether or not the story (from the other person's point of view might be different).

So I got stroppy.

I'm waiting for her to come back and assure me that the friend wasn't house-hunting, that the house hadn't been advertised so the only way the friend knew it was for sale was through her, and that she (the op) was just on the point of completion (not had seen it once, along with lots of other houses, and was just thinking about it).

But she won't tell me [grumpy]

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 12:01:33

And, you see, the op wasn't about "was my friend mean?" - she probably was.

The question was "aibu to be cross that I've been invited to lunch?" and she patently is being unreasonable about that, as a year later the mutual friend is still stuck in the middle.

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 12:04:32

I agree Maryz.

gotthemoononastick Sun 10-Feb-13 12:13:46

Of course Hully is correct.The word 'friend is so overused'.You are very lucky to be able to count your friends on one hand.These would always think like the Op and Hullygully.

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 12:14:44

Pardon got?

stradbally Sun 10-Feb-13 12:25:32

I just think the OP should get over it, life is messy. IMHO she should be glad she has friends who invite her to lunch, glad she has a house, even if it's not THE house, and glad that she belongs to the mumsgroup because she has children, which so many people are desperate to have and can't. I'm sorry if that all sounds a bit Pollyanna, and I'm not saying she hasn't been let down, but she should learn to not sweat the small stuff. Just go to the lunch and enjoy yourself. Having cancer has taught me this, and I really wish more people would learn it without having to go through cancer. I don't mean that to sound melodramatic, or make it be about me, but it's just true smile

Hullygully Sun 10-Feb-13 12:27:44

it depends, I went through a "you are going to die" experience and it made me less tolerant of shitty behavior, not more

Lambzig Sun 10-Feb-13 12:33:10

OP I think your ex-friend has behaved badly. I think she should have been open about going after the same house and not made up some obvious lie about her husband doing it behind her back. Therefore, if you dont want to see her dont.

However, I expect that your mutual friends just hear "she made a higher offer than me" and dont know the ins and outs (its also not clear as presumably you knew your offer had been turned down before completion?). As you can see from this thread, some people wouldn't think it was a big deal, particularly as ex-friend has apologised. Obviously you feel it is, but your friends might not and they want to include you in their social life. As a friend, I would probably have just kept out of it. I dont think you can expect the mutual friend to exclude her.

Also earlier I agree with you about not discussing money. My two closest friends have recently bought houses. I have discussed their moves endlessly, talked about feelings on moving, looked at photo's, been shopping with them for new stuff for their houses (as well as sharing lots and lots of non-housing related experiences with them), but I dont have a clue how much they paid for their new homes. I have a vague idea of one because I know the area, but it could be £100k out. Why on earth would they mention that? Doesn't make it the OP's fault, but I wouldn't discuss money either.

Hullygully Sun 10-Feb-13 13:01:53

the discussing money thing is irrelevant these days, all paid prices can be found online btw

earlierintheweek Sun 10-Feb-13 13:04:10

Yes Hully - but the OP told what she was able to afford to bid up to. Which is a slightly different thing?

digerd Sun 10-Feb-13 13:07:54

Because OP has already said in former posts that she had put an offer in. 'friend' had not told her that she was house hunting. OP told her excitedly how she had found a house she liked and told her what offer she had put in and how high she go to. Friend still said nothing.
The other friends knew that "friend" had put in a higher offer, but didn't tell OP. One of the other friends told OP after completion. Agree with HULLY

amillionyears Sun 10-Feb-13 13:38:54

I feel sorry for the op.

ino, there are at least 3 sorts of "friends"
A. Friends that you tell almost anything to and think you can trust. Would immediately ring up in an emergency and expect and hope they would help you out. May only have 2 or 3 of these in your life, and are very important.
B. Friends who you hope you can trust. More of these.
C. Looser friends, acquaintances, work colleagues etc.

As far as I can see, the op thought her "friend" was definitely the A variety.
But , when the friendship was put to the test, she turned out to be the C variety at best. I would be gutted too.

Viviennemary Sun 10-Feb-13 13:39:37

I've not read all of this thread. To me gazumped means somebody puts in an offer, and it is accepted. Then somebody else comes along and puts in a higher bid which is then accepted and the first buyers told to get lost. Now if this is what happened in this case then the OP should find new friends. And if not then she should think again.

amillionyears Sun 10-Feb-13 13:39:49

Oh, should say, agree with Hully!

Trills Sun 10-Feb-13 13:56:46

YABU to not want to be invited. That's ridiculous.

Especially because I imagine that what you want is for the other person not to be invited.

You don't want them to be invited and you not invited, so YAB especially U because the thing you say you want is not what you actually want.

The friend doing the inviting clearly either doesn't know precisely what went on, or does but doesn't think it is so bad. Either way, they have decided that they still want to be friends with both of you.

I think the invite-er is being perfectly reasonable to invite both of you, let you both know that the other is invited, and let you sort out your spat between yourselves.

Trills Sun 10-Feb-13 14:17:58

I agree with Maryz that the question is not about "was the friend who bought the house in the wrong?"

The thread is about whether the friend who is stuck in the middle is wrong to invite both of them.

And the answer to that is "not necessarily".

Hullygully Sun 10-Feb-13 14:20:04

the other question is much more interesting tho you raving pedant

Maryz Sun 10-Feb-13 14:27:47

Ah, but you are going off topic Hully shock.

Don't all aibu's have to say on topic?

Shouldn't it be:

OP: AIBU
Poster1: Of course you are reasonable hun, you are lufferly
Everyone else: You are a raving loon.
Random posters: BUNFIGHT.

[arf]

I think she's hidden the thread and I will never know the answer sad.

stradbally Sun 10-Feb-13 14:28:15

Lol!

flowery Sun 10-Feb-13 14:44:54

You weren't gazumped but I agree your ex friend didn't behave well.

However I find it weird to be cross with your other friend for inviting you to something confused. Inviting someone is a nice thing to do, leaving someone out is not. Seems like your friend couldn't win. If she had left you out no doubt you would be fed up about her taking sides with the ex friend.

If what you mean is you wanted your friend to exclude the ex friend, YABU for not saying that in your OP.

ivykaty44 Sun 10-Feb-13 14:55:32

so did you put an offer in for the house? I am guessing you didn't as she viewed the house a week later and if you had put an offer in and had it accepted then the house would have been sold and she would not have been able to view it.

Do you think that maybe they waited a few days to see if you offered on it and then when to view it and the agent would have said whether there was any other serious interest in the house (namely you) if you had put in an offer then.

ivykaty44 Sun 10-Feb-13 14:57:44

the freind that is somehow stuck in the middle - well possibly they didn't realise how you still feel about this woman buying a house you liked.

Is she wrong to invite guests to her house - no she is not.

Do though explain to her why you don't want to go and I am sure they will drop you from social occasions

digerd Sun 10-Feb-13 17:25:08

IVY
OP already explained that she HAD put an offer in and told her 'friend' how much and how high she could go. 'Friend ' then went behind her back and put in a higher offer, having not mentioned she was interested in finding a new house. The other 'friends' knew this but didn't tell OP until after completion.

digerd Sun 10-Feb-13 17:33:19

And my Estate Agent lied to me when he told me there were 5 others waiting to pay the full asking price for that bungalow. The truth was there had been 5 other viewers but all were not interested as far too much work needed doing on it. I pulled out and they reduced it by £10,000 .

Hissy Tue 12-Feb-13 00:10:16

if you had put an offer in and had it accepted then the house would have been sold and she would not have been able to view it."

Oh if only that kind of integrity actually existed in house selling...

ivykaty44 Tue 12-Feb-13 16:19:08

hissy i twice tried to view a couple of houses that had been offered on that morning so they refused - even thought we were in a great possition to buy - i guess it depends who you deal with they must all vary

CinnabarRed Tue 12-Feb-13 17:15:38

My XH once bought a flat for us to live in that I hadn't seen. He thought it was perfect for us (it was), I was feeling very fragile because we'd lost a lovely property (failed its survey), and he wanted to move quickly to put an offer in. He called me, told me he loved the flat, suggested putting an offer in there and then, and I agreed.

So, it's possible that the ex-friend really hadn't seen the property before her DH put their offer in, particularly if she herself was depressed (to the point of losing friendships from what the OP has said) and felt too fragile to get involved in the househunting process.

Cherriesarelovely Tue 12-Feb-13 17:48:32

Yanbu exactly, especially if the person hosting the event was a very close friend of yours and not of the woman you have fallen out with. On the other hand if she was as friendly with both of you then it was fair enough she asked you both. I'm sure you would prefer that than not being asked.

I know how you feel though, we had a terrible falling out with old friends last year (over our children). Tried and tried to approach them to resolve it and was blanked every time. We gave up after a year and, like you, could not be in the same room as them now. I think it is much worse when friends take sides though.

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