Do you think there is a "Polish" problem in the Uk now that it's become the 2nd language in England?

(379 Posts)
NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 20:48:52

I've been to Poland and I like Poles a lot as a people. I think Warsaw is a great city and I have nothing against Polish people.

My mother complained back in 2007 about the number of Poles in Liverpool changing the 'culture'. What she meant was that she loves to banter with people in shops and restaurants and she used to get a lot of chat back (Liverpudlians are generally very funny - IMHO - and love a bit of verbal 'how's your father'). She complained that this had changed and that she was increasingly met with blank stares. This is high insult to my mother!

I didn't think much of it. But I am now finding the same - I approached a new restaurant outlet at my local services today and joked about them selling hot dogs and milkshakes and what a welcome addition to the usual (was hungry and about to make an irresponsible food choice!). I got the same blank stare. Didn't understand a word I said.

I finally understood what my mother has been saying. AIBU?

lljkk Thu 31-Jan-13 20:50:38

yabu.

blindinglight Thu 31-Jan-13 20:53:39

I don't think one incident with a random stranger is enough to declare a 'Polish problem'

littlewhitebag Thu 31-Jan-13 20:54:33

How do you know the people you spoke to didn't understand what you said or that they were Polish? They could have been quiet, reticent Liverpudlians. I don't know about unreasonable but your attitude seems odd.

TondelayoSchwarzkopf Thu 31-Jan-13 20:55:10

You do know that many Polish people settled here after world war two? And somehow the English language and culture survived...

Oreocrumbs Thu 31-Jan-13 20:55:20

I think YABU. There are a lot of Poles working in my local area too and their service is excellent.

My DD started nursery a couple of weeks ago and today for the first time another mother started a conversation with me, she was Polish. None of the other mothers have yet (including myself actually).

From what I have seen they have an excellent work ethic and are very friendly and pleasant.

iloveeverton Thu 31-Jan-13 20:56:01

YABU- I live in Liverpool and one of my closet friends is Polish- they are a great family and run a very successful business. Their children are polite.

I just think your joke wasn't funny.

sooperdooper Thu 31-Jan-13 20:56:19

What in gods name does an attempted conversation about junk food in a services have to do with a 'Polish problem'

You sound a bit mental tbh

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 20:56:59

This is going to go badly. Find your hard hat OP.

As it goes,I've met many polish people who don't have a great grasp of the English language,have yet to meet any who aren't willing to engage and be friendly (in a shop situation) as best they can though. Much like most of us Brists abroad no?

YABU

I thought 'how's your father' meant sex confused

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 20:57:32

Oh...YABU btw

VivaLeBeaver Thu 31-Jan-13 20:58:11

We didn't think that during WWII when the polish airforce came over here and flew for the RAF and helped to win the war.

sooperdooper Thu 31-Jan-13 20:58:38

Also, I hate the assumed, 'oh isn't everyone from Liverpool a joker' thing too, stereotyped and boring

LittleChimneyDroppings Thu 31-Jan-13 20:59:05

I'd have probably given you a blank stare too, your joke was not very funny. Sorry!

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 20:59:30

My mother complained back in 2007 about the number of Poles in Liverpool changing the 'culture'.

Whatever that 'culture' was that your mother was talking about no longer exists. We are so multicultural now in the UK we don't have a culture as such.

I do think however that one of the biggest issues we are going to face is the ghettos that are going to be created because we are not integrating as we should be.

CardiffUniversityNetballTeam Thu 31-Jan-13 20:59:32

YABU

How do you propose to combat this perceived problem? Send them all back to Poland? And then what about the Slovaks, Hungarians, Czechs, Bosnians and Kosovans? Can they stay?

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 20:59:35

Oh - definitely wonderful work ethic. I agree with that. What I'm talking about is a change in culture.

I don't see the issue. Something has to be the second language of England. I would expect most Welsh-speakers are in Wales. Is it surprising it's Polish?

What language would you prefer?

My favourite tea house is owned and run by polish people, they are lovely, polite and their English is excellent and they always remember us even if we haven't been for a while, and they introduced me to Bigos.
YABU

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 21:02:33

YABU.

There are lots of Polish people where I live, and many of them work in local shops and restaurants. I know that they are Polish because they are very friendly and chatty. They also give great customer service, which is more than I can say for some of their British counterparts.

I'm sure that there are some sullen, unfriendly Poles who don't speak English well, but I find it difficult to distinguish them from the sullen, unfriendly Brits who can't be arsed to talk to me.

isthisacrazyidea Thu 31-Jan-13 21:03:16

YABU. There is a huge Polish population in my local area, and all those who I come into contact with (in the service industry and at baby groups and in every day life) can all speak English perfectly well.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 21:04:10

I think stereotypes exist for a reason. I live in the South but when I visit my parents in Liverpool, I find the sense of humour is much more lively and witty.

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 21:04:13

Cultures do change anyway, OP. What's the problem?

MammaTJ Thu 31-Jan-13 21:05:11

I live in Rural Somerset, about as far away as you would expect from this but, I go down our main street and do not hear one person speaking English!

I am not sure it is a bad thing though, as they all CAN speak English and to a very high standard. Maybe they could teach us a thing or two.

I am at college with a Polish chap and he can pull apart Jeremy Kyles best but he can also make me aware of my failings.

HeadFairy Thu 31-Jan-13 21:05:19

who says cultures should be set in stone? Cultures are by their very nature evolving things, added to by subsequent generations. No doubt there were lots of tuts about the influx of Italians to Britain during the war (when my dad came here with his parents) but don't we all love spag bol and lasagne? Each influx of people to this country bring their own contribution, add it to the existing culture and change it - usually for the better in my opinion.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 21:05:30

I've been to Liverpool, do they speak English there?

Because most of the Polish people I've ever met speak more comprehensible English than most Liverpudlians I've met [arf]

<stirs>

YABU.
I cannot be bothered to elaborate frankly.
Populations have always moved and changed.
<shrug>

YABU. Why is it a 'problem'? I've yet to met a Polish person that is anything other than friendly and hardworking.

There are many people of various ethnicities in England and without them all, our culture wouldn't even be the one your DM is so nostalgic for.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 21:07:02

May I remind you all that I said that I like Poles and I think they are very hard working.

What I am saying is that the preponderance of one group of people is changing the culture more than I thought it would.

There is no need to be PC about this fact.

MammaTJ Thu 31-Jan-13 21:07:09

Our whole British culture is, in fact, a mix of other cultures!!

CashmereHoodlum Thu 31-Jan-13 21:07:19

I welcome a change of culture. The Polish people I have met have been far more cultured than the typical Brit where I live. As a rule they speak more than one foreign language, are more highly educated, and have more knowledge of (what I call) culture, as opposed to many of the locally born and bred people who often have an extensive knowledge of popular culture and little else.

chickensarmpit Thu 31-Jan-13 21:07:32

Would you be saying this if they were Muslim or Chinese? Or is it just acceptable to say this shit about white, europeans.

Zara1984 Thu 31-Jan-13 21:07:42

YABU

They're friendly, hardworking, pay their taxes, here legally and just trying to get on with life. What's the problem?

I bet people said the same thing as you and your mother when Irish started moving in large numbers to the UK. Or people CEO the Carribean. Or India/Pakistan/Sri Lanka.

winnybella Thu 31-Jan-13 21:09:03

YY, Viva. Battle of Britain, anyone? Squadron 303?

As far as I can tell (as a Polish person with English DP, not living in the UK, but have visited lots of times) Polish and English have lots in common and I really can't see how some Poles settling down in the UK will dramatically change the British cultural landscape.

DP is ranting now about 'fucking xenophobic idiots' grin

MammaTJ Thu 31-Jan-13 21:09:08

MaryZ, you're not wrong but the Liverpool accent is very sexy!

Zara1984 Thu 31-Jan-13 21:09:12

Oh - and maybe the reason you got a blank stare was because your joke wasn't funny.

allnewtaketwo Thu 31-Jan-13 21:09:17

Tbh I frequently get blank stares when I try to talk to "English" people. Nothing to do with language, some people just don't want to engage

CowboyPie Thu 31-Jan-13 21:09:19

I live in Liverpool. I've NEVER noticed a 'difference' when I get served in shops. YABU.

SomeKindOfDeliciousBiscuit Thu 31-Jan-13 21:09:31

YABU. I think you've met some unfriendly people, or people with limited language skills, that's all.

I was going to make some kind of cheap crack about my Polish mil not visiting until next weekend, but the poor woman's ill and very nice so it seemed a bit shit of me. So imagine some far less offensive joke which has a general feeling of integration and much friendliness.

Just wanted to add, YANBU to suggest there may be a problem with immigration as I think there probably is, but I think the Poles are more like the British (in terms of culture and expectations) than the majority who come and are less likely to integrate.

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 21:10:09

Do you know what preponderance means OP? hmm

winnybella Thu 31-Jan-13 21:10:14

OTOH I can easily see how Brits have changed the cultural landscape of southern Spain, for example.

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 21:11:05

I think nostalgia is a good word to use for the OP's mum. She wants to chat to people who share the same lifestyle etc which she won't get from newcomers who probably aren't great fans of Corrie or Eastenders! She probably feels she has nothing in common with them.

TondelayoSchwarzkopf Thu 31-Jan-13 21:12:10

Seriously are you actually from Liverpool? You know that world famous PORT, home of one of the worlds oldest Chinatowns, the huge population of second and third generation Irish immigrants, the multicultural, multiracial, LIVERPOOL that I used to know and love.

Theicingontop Thu 31-Jan-13 21:12:25

hmm

nickelbabe Thu 31-Jan-13 21:12:37

I think the only Polish problem is that the language isn't taught in schools.
it's increasingly becoming a mainstream language and woyld be great to have it available as a modern language option.

larks35 Thu 31-Jan-13 21:13:27

I wonder what the 2nd language in Poland is, or Spain, or Germany, or France (though they'd never admit it).

YABU I think. As for your mum saying that the influx of Polish is changing the local culture, my mum would agree but with a different perspective of enjoying the new culture - Polish shops with interesting and cheap new foods to try, a much larger congregation at their local church.

NcNcNcNc Thu 31-Jan-13 21:15:01

Isn't it stereotyping just as badly to keep saying 'oh wonderful work ethic' ? Really? All people from Poland have a wonderful work ethic???? Have you met them all then? hmm

Also sounds very patronising, like someone from the deep south saying about 'Mamee' that she had a 'wonderful work ethic' in Gone With the Wind.

mummybare Thu 31-Jan-13 21:15:43

<stares blankly>

I don't understand your joke either, OP.

YABU.

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 21:15:59

For quite a few years Liverpudlian culture was strongly influenced by Irish Catholics.

It isn't such a leap to Polish (Catholics).

Things change, cultures evolve, crap jokes are crap jokes wherever they originate.

nickel - Polish GCSE courses exist (I just looked it up), so maybe it is increasingly being taught? I agree, it'd be a good language option.

HollyBerryBush Thu 31-Jan-13 21:16:48

After WWII, 200,000 Polish settled in the UK - why are they now a problem????

herethereandeverywhere Thu 31-Jan-13 21:16:48

YABU!

I live in London, beside a Polish retirement home, round the corner from a Polish social club and church and the usual Polish delis etc. London is a melting pot of different cultures, if I walk 5 minutes in the other direction I'm absorbed in all things Indian/Pakistani/Bagladeshi. I LIKE this. I also like every Pole I've ever had the pleasure of knowing. All honest and hardworking to a fault.

Also OP - I'm slightly confused about the point your mother made about Liverpool (my parents are from there, I'm from the Wirral). Liverpool, as a port and former gateway to the rest of the world, has always had large communities of "other cultures and races" settling there. It has the second oldest Chinese community in the world and a large black Afro-Caribbean community and its famous Irish community. It's ALWAYS welcomed new settlers and that's part of the charm of the city.

I must also share this anecdote: I was buying lunch in a branch of EAT in London when the server clocked my accent and asked where I was from (near Liverpool). He asked where exactly, I explained and also stated where my parents grew up. He gave us our drinks on the house because he loved Liverpool so much and regularly visits his brother who lives there. He was Polish!

givemeaclue Thu 31-Jan-13 21:18:24

Someone didn't laugh at your joke. On this basis the culture of England is changing? Really?

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 21:19:58

Lets just say it as it is. First the Afro carribean came and changed our culture, then the Asians came and 'took over' our shops. Now it's those Polish and soon it'll be those Romanians/Bulgarians and the Daily Mail will be full of how the gypsys are taking over confused

gazzalw Thu 31-Jan-13 21:20:30

We have quite a sizeable Polish population around where we live and have worked out that DD's school possibly about 10% of the children have Polish parents although I think most of the DCs were born over here.

We find the Polish parents very friendly, even if their English isn't that good initially, and they tend to pick up English very quickly. Many of them intend to stay in the UK now although some are more transient.

I don't find it an issue at all, although we do find walking home sometimes that for all the English we don't hear being spoken with could very well be living in Poland. TK Maxx at the weekend is like Warsaw Central.

They are a breath of fresh air TBQH and I'd rather live surrounded by Polish people than a lot of our compatriots who live in the neighbourhood!

givemeaclue Thu 31-Jan-13 21:20:51

Someone didn't laugh at your joke. On this basis the culture of England is changing? Really?

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 21:20:55

Oh, I forgot to add the Chinese taking over the take aways wink

And the Viking stealing our women. angry

And the grey squirrels. Don't forget them.

feministefatale Thu 31-Jan-13 21:22:10

there will always be a "second language" in any country surely? confused get annoyed when it becomes the first language,

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 21:23:44

The Brits have changed southern Spain because they have moved there en masse but refuse to integrate whatsoever - so they eat English food, bought in English shops, send their children to English schools and talk English all the time.

When there are entire areas of Liverpool with Polish people who only speak Polish, who have set up their own exclusive schools for their children to be taught through Polish, and who refuse absolutely to learn a single word of English, then maybe, just maybe, there will be a problem.

I don't think that's likely, btw. Any Polish people I meet are fantastic at English.

There is a Polish option at Leaving Cert in Ireland now.

TarkaTheOtter Thu 31-Jan-13 21:25:35

No one understands my jokes where I live, but given the white, British monoculture that pervades round here I can't blame the "polish problem". I'm considered forrin as I hold an American as well as a British passport.

Your chat sounds a bit tedious tbh, I'd probably just smile and nod if I encountered you in a work situation. Maybe there is a American/British problem? <brushes up on citizenship test just in case>

Yabu. The Polish parents at my daughter's school are, surprise surprise, just like everyone else. Most lovely, a few shy.

Maybe it's you...

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 21:30:22

Learning Polish at school? Good grief! What a mad idea!

I can't believe I even read that. Pls tell me why that's a good idea?

And would all the people silently agreeing with me kindly jump in?

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 21:30:47

My grandfather was a proud Liverpuddlian. He was also the son of Irish immigrants. I dare say that there was some "cultural change" that came along with the massive influxes of Irish immigrants all those years ago. Immigration is nothing new. It's only a problem if you choose to make it one.

And my daughter enjoys learning some Polish words from her friends. Win win as far as I can see.

sue52 Thu 31-Jan-13 21:31:10

When I was a schoolgirl in west London in the fifties about 50% of my fellow pupils came from Polish families. I didn't see it as a problem then and certainly it isn't one now. All the Poles I have known have a great work ethic and their presence can only be to the advantage of the UK.

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 21:32:54

Polish is a very difficult language to learn, it's rather like Latin. As an intellectual exercise, it is very worthwhile.

Are you perhaps just a bit of a bigot OP?

nomads - why isn't it a good idea? Usually, people learn languages so they can speak them and communicate with people.

French used to be the standard second language in UK schools, but it's increasingly common to do languages like Chinese or Spanish, which are more widely spoken. What's the issue?

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 21:34:06

Learning Polish at school? Good grief! What a mad idea!

You are joking aren't you. Am I not getting the joke here?

Why not Polish? We learn French, German and Spanish.

ThinkAboutItOnBoxingDay Thu 31-Jan-13 21:35:35

Yabvu. In my experience, sample of one though it is, the influx of Eastern europeans has massively improved my shopping and eating out experience. Now shop assistants and wait staff are polite, friendly and helpful, glad of a job and committed to doing it well.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 21:35:47

Well <explains in very, very, simple words> if you are from a Polish background and sitting your A-levels, it is nice to be able to sit a Polish A-level, studying Polish literature, just like your English school-mates can study English at GCSE and A-level, and Welsh can study Welsh, and Irish can study Irish, and French can study French and ........

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 21:36:33

Er OP the only reason the standard languages taught at schools are standard is because they were considered to be the most widely spoken/influential/political. Why would you think that wouldn't change?

What a strange outlook on learning languages you have.

ReallyTired Thu 31-Jan-13 21:37:16

I have to admit I thought the second language of England would would be urdu as there are million muslims in the UK.

duende Thu 31-Jan-13 21:37:35

I saw there were quite a few posts on this thread and I was a bit hesitant to open it. I'm so relieved! Most of the posters on this thread are lovely, it's people like you who make this country so welcoming.

I'm polish by the way, I speak very good English (and spanish) understand local sense of humour, integrate with my local community, watch british tv and ead british press, pay a lot in income taxes and have never claimed any benefits. Still, a bit sad that I feel the need to say it, no?

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 21:38:09

Maryz Welsh pupils don't study Welsh literature,they study English literature etc in Welsh. If they have the option.

That is not the same.

thezebrawearspurple Thu 31-Jan-13 21:39:22

There are a lot of Poles where I live (not UK) and they're great neighbours. Hard working, respectable, they place a huge importance on education for their children, are good parents and they keep fit and healthy. They improve the area. Nothing wrong with that.

The same census that came up with 'Polish in 2nd language in England and Wales' also states: "The least common main language in England and Wales was listed as Manx-Gaelic with 33 speakers, followed by 58 Gaelic Scottish speakers."
Really??
Only 58 Gaelic Scottish speakers? I find that hard to believe tbh. In which case I find myself doubting the accuracy of the whole exercise tbh.

Also, Poland happens to be a country in which the entire population speaks ONE language, hence its frequency. I wonder what the statistics would be like if all people from the Indian Subcontinent spoke the same language?

Damn, I got sucked into this thread afterall.

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 21:40:18

Welcome duende. Perhaps you can give us all our first Polish lesson and teach us some useful phrases grin

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 21:44:13

That's a bit mad, Alis, why do they do that? If they study Irish they study Irish literature, don't they?

pacific - would they not be first-language speakers of Scots Gaelic? I think that must be much more unusual than people who're bilingual.

StickEmUp Thu 31-Jan-13 21:45:26

Do people from the UK never up sticks and live anywhere outside the UK then? confused

Yes, it is sad that you need to say those things, duende. Welcome!

I am not Polish, but also not British. Been here 20 years, pay taxes, no benefit, yadda yadda. And I don't think I have changed the local culture too much. Wish I could... yes, I am looking at everybody who does NOT pick up their dog's crap <<bitter>>

I meet many Polish people through work and guess what, most are nice, some are so-so (or have an off day when I see them) and v few are a twats. Just like the Chinese/Indian/Pakistani/African people I come across from time to time.

LRD, yes, you must be right. And also tbh I had not quite taken in to account that this referred to England and Wales only, doh!

BumBiscuits Thu 31-Jan-13 21:50:53

One of my pet peeves is people slagging off the Polish and other Eastern Europeans. It is bigotry, however you dress it up.

NumericalMum Thu 31-Jan-13 21:51:53

YABU.
And just for the record OP saying "All Polish people are hard working" is racist.
I am sure you not be impressed if someone said all the British people are boring...

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 21:51:55

But reallytired, not all Muslims speak Urdu. There will be a lot of Bengali speakers in that number, as well as speakers of Arabic and many other languages.

duende, no, you really shouldn't have to say it. sad

MrsSchadenfreude Thu 31-Jan-13 21:53:57

I love it. I speak Polish - not fluent, but can hold a conversation. When I lived in UK I could get all of my favourite foods without schlepping them back from Warsaw, from the fabulously named Polisz Szop grin. I interpreted for a woman in a charity shop in Northampton (to her amazement and gratitude), helped people with catching buses etc. They all found it most bizarre that an English person had learned their language, and even more bizarre when I explained that I had learned Polish when I lived in Warsaw in the 1980s for three years.

I think no one should ever move from where they were born. Shit, I just realised I'm typing from where I live in Canada, CANADA and I'm a mixture of Polish and Scottish. Argh. Where shall I send the two halves of myself?

BTW I'm both lazy and funny. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 21:59:17

Well, I can see that those who posted don't agree with me.

Thanks for all your comments which I have appreciated.

SamSmalaidh Thu 31-Jan-13 22:00:27

The only problem with Polish is it's a fucking difficult language! I live in a very Polish area and have no problem with having Polish neighbours, shops, children in schools etc. They seem to be very keen to integrate with British society and contribute, most speak good English or are learning - what's not to like?

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 22:02:15

MrsTP, do you mind, posting from a forrin country just might change the culture of this thread grin

VivaLeBeaver Thu 31-Jan-13 22:02:15

Dd can choose polish as a mfl at her school from year 9. There is also a polish language club at lunchtime for all years.

I've tried learning polish but it is difficult. Never got much further than tak.

ReallyTired Thu 31-Jan-13 22:03:09

The Quran is written in arabic and I was under the impression that Urdu and arabic are very closely related. Many muslims learn Arabic/Urdu even if its not their first language.

matadornetwork.com/abroad/why-hindi-urdu-is-one-language-and-arabic-is-several/

Hindi is very closely related to Urdu. I am not sure at what point different dialects become seperate languages.

Perhaps going back to the orginal topic. The fact that turkish is strongly related to arabic and arabic strong related to urdu/hindi shows that people travel all round the world. Migration of people is not a new thing.

I am sceptical that English is an endangered lanuage. The chances of Polish being wiped out is greater than English being wiped out as a language.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:04:38

Learning Polish at school? Good grief! What a mad idea!
I can't believe I even read that. Pls tell me why that's a good idea?

OP are you joking? You're not are you? shock sad

Why is it such a mad idea that Polish be taught in school? Do you feel the same way about French/German/Spanish on the curriculum?

And with reference to your thread title, I don't really understand what you mean by ''Polish problem''. What problem exactly? That they don't get your jokes? (like most people on this thread it would seem).

You come across as very bigoted.

Witam duende - by the way you definitely do not need to say it.

Viva grin

Joiningthegang Thu 31-Jan-13 22:06:12

I have a polish problem - i can't be bothered to do it.

Oh - we aren't talking about polish - just a blatantly xenophobic op

Yabu

As you were

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:08:39

Mrs Terry - you are on unfamiliar ground for most Brits.

EVERYONE in Canada comes from somewhere else. Well, apart from the First Nations people. Let's no go there.

Canada is a new country born of new people and has adapted that way. Perhaps the reverse is happening to Britain, former colonialists.

thegreylady Thu 31-Jan-13 22:09:19

Polish is the only language other than English offered by the touch screen at my GP surgery. I think it is great that the communities are amalgamating. Our PCSO is Polish and I always sayGood Morning to her in Polish when I see her. She helped dh and I with some simple phrases before we went to Krakow last year.
The service done to this country by Polish airmen in the last war deserves our undying gratitude, the way they were treated afterwards was disgraceful. As far as I am concerned they are more than welcome.

WhichIsBest Thu 31-Jan-13 22:09:32

I have just clicked that Karol Wozniak, from my primary school, must have had Polish parents.

thegreylady Thu 31-Jan-13 22:11:33

Isn't 'tak' Norwegian ? Polish is very difficult I think.

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:12:09

Urdu (and Hindi) certainly have lots of imported Arabic words, but they are very different languages. I can understand Hindi (and therefore most Urdu) but I wouldn't have a clue what people were talking about if they were speaking any one of the versions of Arabic.

I think lots of Muslims do learn Arabic but I don't know if they actually learn to speak it as such, or if they tend to concentrate on being able to read the Quran.

But you're right, the similarities between languages are clear evidence that people have been migrating and mixing for centuries. After all, Urdu, Arabic, Polish and Enhlish all share the same Indo-European roots!

'Tak''thanks''Danke' are all versions of each other; I think 'tak' is used in a number of Northern European/Skandinavian countries. Except Finland/Hungary grin

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:15:02

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:15:05

OP, most people in Britain could trace their roots back to somewhere else if they went back far enough. The movement of peoples really isn't new. Do you know anything about British history?

CheCazzo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:15:36

OP you sound like precisely the sort of Little Englander that makes me want to take a cricket bat in my hand and............
When the first wave of Polish people started coming over I was employed in the leisure industry and in a position of having to staff my department sufficiently to give good customer service etc etc. Until then we'd really only been able to draw on the local population although there was a good smattering of Spanish, Italian people with a good enough command of the language to do the job. Then came the Polish and overnight we saw just how bad the British workforce had been for so long. How entitled, unwilling to work, couldn't care less about attendance, sick leave, reliability and honesty (no, obviously not ALL of them, but many!). It was a real pleasure to suddenly find people who wanted to do the job, do it well, be polite and give a shit about performance.
Their English was great and their work ethic was a revelation. They fit in instantly and there was never any disharmony.
So never let me hear anyone being disrespectful to Polish people and expect me to agree - I bloody love them and long may they remain here!

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:16:13

Jinsel - pls explain given that Britain has the richest history of imperialism?

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:16:58

I guess it's better than Arabic being the second language.

Why, is there a hierarchy?

Portofino Thu 31-Jan-13 22:17:22

I live in Brussels. 25% of the population are not Belgian born. I don't notice any cultural issues. It is a multicultural city in a world of multicultural cities. Imho it is very small minded to have an attitude about these things.

Flisspaps Thu 31-Jan-13 22:19:20

Why is Polish preferable to Arabic as the second language?

Why is any language preferable to any other as the second language?

As an aside, DH is Liverpudlian. I find him and his family no funnier than any other people I've ever met. Most Liverpudlians that I've met think they're funnier than everyone else though!

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:19:27

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Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:19:56

Yes, we have a history of imperialism. Not sure I would describe that aspect of our heritage as "rich". hmm Though I suppose it made us rich.

Explain what exactly? That we have a long history of people coming to the British Isles from other parts of the world, and that many British people are therefore descended from immigrants? Which part of that are you struggling to understand?

"I guess it's better than Arabic being the second language."

Better? How??
I guess Arabic would be even harder to learn, what with different letters an'all.

Gawd, that makes you sound even more xenophobic and small-minded.

Nagoo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:21:27

My neighbour is a bin thieving bastard.

I don't think that's a Polish problem though.

It's a bloody bin-thievery problem though.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:22:46

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VivaLeBeaver Thu 31-Jan-13 22:23:03

I thought tak meant yes. Not thanks. God, I'm not suprised all polish people look at me a bit oddly!

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 22:23:06

Well, actually almost everyone in Britain comes (at least partially) from somewhere else as well.

Many are Celts, or Normans, or Vikings, not to mention all the more recent immigrants.

I wonder if you walked down any "white middle class" road in England how many pure-bred English you would meet - most will originally have come from somewhere else if you go back far enough. And of course, any multicultural area will have a huge number of "brits" who originate somewhere else but are just as much British as anyone else.

Okaaay....

<<backs away slowly>>

VivaLeBeaver Thu 31-Jan-13 22:24:12

I'd like welsh as a 2nd language.

Just so I could heat up dinner in a pingity ping.

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 22:26:51

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mrsbunnylove Thu 31-Jan-13 22:27:15

Do you think there is a "Polish" problem in the Uk now that it's become the 2nd language in England?

no. i have some pupils who are very naughty polish boys but i suspect if we had one or two polish-speaking teachers or assistants that would soon stop.

when i was a small child, my grandparents spoke admiringly of polish people who had come to the uk around ww2 - goodlooking, smartly dressed, hardworking, their only fault (from my proddy olds point of view) was that they were roman catholic! but they were very well-respected.

my gran thought my dad might be polish when my mum brought him home, as he was so handsome! as a teenager in school a good friend had polish parents from that same influx - i learned from them that 'proper parenting' means being at the bus stop to meet your teenage daughter so she doesn't walk alone in the twilight, and i tried to apply that level of care when i had a teenage daughter of my own.

then daughter grew up and found a wonderful boy to marry. and his mum is...polish. smile so my little grandaughter is a little bit polish too. not a problem, not a bit of it. just a joy.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 22:30:13

Oh, ffs, x-posted.

op, you have just crossed the line from "casual bigotry" to "open racism".

You will put up with the Poles because they are better than the Muslims hmm

I have reported this thread.

winnybella Thu 31-Jan-13 22:30:23

Viva- 'Tak" means 'yes'
"dziekuje' is thank you.

Cornycabernet Thu 31-Jan-13 22:31:09

'polish' problem?
very offensive

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:32:22

Viva tak does mean yes in Polish. I think microwave is popty ping in Welsh though - but I think I prefer pingity ping actually grin grin

Isildur has hit the nail right on the head

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:33:24

I reported too Maryz. Sometimes it just isn't worth engaging.

VivaLeBeaver Thu 31-Jan-13 22:33:46

I'm sure they'd understand pingity ping. Especially if shouted loudly enough. [gin]

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:34:22

Maryz, I did not say that. You are twisting my words and that is unfair and untrue.

For a start, Poles are a nationality. Muslims belong to a religion.

bluegnuboo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:35:08

Haven't the posters who agree with you turned up yet op?shock

How odd, any minute now I'm sure.

ComposHat Thu 31-Jan-13 22:35:30

the number of Poles in Liverpool changing the 'culture'

Yes Poles have a reputation for being hardworking, Liverpool must be a terrible culture shock.

You see it isn't nice when people make crass generalisations about a group of people.

If you know anything about the history of Liverpool, claiming about 'migrants changing the culture' is the most absurd and blinkered statement you can imagine, considering half of Liverpool is made up from the descendents of Irish, Chinese and African-Caribbean immigrants.

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:36:10

popty ping is lovely. smile

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:36:12

Well, it's no wonder England has gone to pot.

Cornycabernet Thu 31-Jan-13 22:36:35

<calm down> nomads

cerealqueen Thu 31-Jan-13 22:36:55

Yeah, like the 'blacks' and the 'Irish' and the 'asians' were all 'problems'. YABvU.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 22:38:02

Yes you did Nomads.

You know, your deleted post about Poles being Catholics which you suppose is better than being Muslim as at least they won't make you change your clothes?

That really nasty post. Have you forgotten it already?

EllenParsons Thu 31-Jan-13 22:38:40

I'm not sure if you are serious confused very unpleasant op either way and yabu!

StuffezLaBouche Thu 31-Jan-13 22:39:43

OP, you're either thick, bigoted or have an appallingly crap understanding of cultural evolution.
These ponderings of yours seem to have come about after a Polish woman on a till didn't banter back at your joke?!
Or are you just shit stirring?

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:39:46

I didn't delete it. MNHQ did because some crawly little twit reported it.

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 22:40:10

I live in a multi ethnic city. And I am very pleased to do so. Immigration is a good thing.

I think if I went far enough back I would find out I am from somewhere else. Most of us are.

OP you sound positively ghastly.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:40:28

Nomads why do you think England has gone to pot?

BTW don't you mean the UK? Or is it only England that's gone to pot?

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 22:40:56

I hope the whole thread gets deleted as it is pointless goady crap.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 22:41:11

Of course you didn't delete it.

It wasn't deleted because it was reported, you know. It was deleted because it was racist.

StuffezLaBouche Thu 31-Jan-13 22:41:37

Oh. So that's what your deleted post said. You're a waste of oxygen.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 22:41:48

Ok, here we go again

<sings>

"I'm a goady fuck and I'm ok
I troll all night and I goad all day"

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:41:59

I am actually quite a reasonable person. I'm not UKIP. I'm just normal.

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 22:42:32

Maryz no idea! I'm Welsh and never studied Welsh literature. People who go to Welsh speaking schools invariably study total immersion as opposed to their own culture. Is an odd one. It's not even as though historically speaking Wales had a dirth of bards etc!

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 22:42:54

You forgot the ab.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:43:04

Nomads are you Nick Griffin? You are aren't you. Admit it.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 22:44:46

It does seem odd Alis - all our kids (Ireland) have to study Irish up to Leaving Cert and study a lot of native gaelic poetry, prose etc. Boring as fuck most of it, but at least it's Irish.

I can't imagine studying Harry Potter in Irish and answering questions on it in an exam, it just wouldn't happen.

Having said that, I suspect this more interesting discussion will disappear soon, along with the op grin.

out2lunch Thu 31-Jan-13 22:45:06

What a load of rubbish op

I read the whole thread and was going to comment about my polish family but am glad this is going to be deleted

Cornycabernet Thu 31-Jan-13 22:45:18

Nomads - the fact that you don't care that your views have offended people speaks volumes

ThingummyBob Thu 31-Jan-13 22:45:37

Viva its **popty-ping (scuse sp.) I believe but its my favourite word of all time EVER!

<<takes Viva inside for a modernised modern languages lesson>> grin

OP. you are aware that you sound like a horribly racist and xenophobic twat bigot about now aren't you?

I mean this has to be a fucking nasty wind up, right?

ReallyTired Thu 31-Jan-13 22:46:54

"I guess Arabic would be even harder to learn, what with different letters an'all."

My son went to an Urdu class for a term at the age of six. He told me that learning greets like alsalam aakeum (no idea how you spell it) was quite easy. Orginally the club was for children with no knowledge of Urdu, but then the Indian/ pakistani parents complained and wanted their children to join. Teacher then went up about 100 notches in difficulties. My six year old son was taught the Urdu alphabet and Urdu phonics. Sadly its was over ds' head.

Poor ds got very confused because English phonics blends from left to right and Urdu reads in the opposite direction. Urdu has about 50 characters. He had barely learnt to read in English and declared with great frustration that "Urdu was a backwards language". (Luckily the pakistani parents found it funny and realised he wasn't meaning to be racist.)

The experience of struggling to learn a different language gave him insight and empathy into how the EAL children felt. Prehaps some posters on this thread could do with a similar experience.

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 22:47:52

Nomads...I'm sure you have a point that you're simply not bright enough to articulate in way that doesn't read as offensive,I just simply cannot see what it is.

And please OP stop saying "all Polish people are xyz" as if they are all the same with no variation. Saying "all" any nation is a ridiculou sweeping statement. Polish people are just people like any other. I must admit,I've yet to meet a Polish person I have found unpleasant but that's neither here nor there.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:48:20

Before this thread goes up in smoke...

Spierdalaj NickGriffin Nomads <waves>

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:49:20

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lisianthus Thu 31-Jan-13 22:49:41

"Tak" or "tidak" means "no" in Malay.

I would have thought that Polish people would fit right in if a place was full of witty, talkative people as all the Polish people I know are like that.

And WTAF about the "at least it's not Arabic"?! Yes, a language with an amazing oral tradition and a rich tradition of poetry, history, literature and science isn't something we'd want in the UK, oh dear me no. hmm

Flisspaps Thu 31-Jan-13 22:50:08

My favourite is pysgod wibblywobbly which (I think) is a jellyfish grin

Cornycabernet Thu 31-Jan-13 22:50:31

thread snitch?
I'm sure MNHQ have been following this from the start

fridgepants Thu 31-Jan-13 22:50:56

My landlord is someone who communicates entirely through sarcastic jokes. It is irritating to say the least.

Perhaps it was the fourth time they'd heard a joke about hot dogs that day and it was difficult to smile politely. Service staff aren't there to be an audience, you know?

mrsjay Thu 31-Jan-13 22:51:01

yes yabu and a little scared of polish people taking over YOUR COUNTRY ,

ReallyTired, my remark re Arabic was ment to be a bit sarky, sorry if that did not come across.
FWIW, English is not my first language are my kids are (kind of) bilingual although DS1 states he knows 4 languages which include half dozen words in French and counting to 10 in Korean grin.

OP, maybe UKIP would be glad to have you hmm

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:52:01

So Alis...you accuse me of streetypes and then you do the same yourself.....

ThingummyBob Thu 31-Jan-13 22:52:03

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TheSmallClanger Thu 31-Jan-13 22:52:21

I sometimes buy Polish choc bars from our local Polski Sklep. One of the shop assistants is lovely and chatty - we had a nice discussion of vodka one day. The other is a rude old bag who barely acknowledges your presence, let alone stares at you blankly. Both are Polish.

I do recommend Polish chocolate. I also like the bread that this shop sells, and the esoteric range of crisps. Food is one of the benefits of multiculturalism.

LineRunner Thu 31-Jan-13 22:52:47

If you get banned, OP, you'll have to disappear.

Only unfortunates keep namechanging and coming back.

mrsjay Thu 31-Jan-13 22:55:08

Just so I could heat up dinner in a pingity ping.

no way is that welsh for microwave FABULOUS I am scottish but i would speak welsh if i could pingty ping my dinner grin.

CheCazzo Thu 31-Jan-13 22:57:23

I do hope the OP isn't getting too too overwrought!

mrsjay Thu 31-Jan-13 22:58:28

I do hope the OP isn't getting too too overwrought!

maybe getting an attck of the vapours grin

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 22:58:34

Thingummy - how dare you tell me to fuck off.

It's my opinion.

Are you saying that anyone who disagrees with you should fuck off?

And LineRunner - why should I be banned?

This is outrageous!

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 22:59:23

The outrage!

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 22:59:58

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WorraLiberty Thu 31-Jan-13 23:00:14

Dear lord what a strange thread

And what a precious mother you have OP

'Highly insulted' because she gets blank stares from people who don't understand her language? confused

CheCazzo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:00:27

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NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:00:56

The OP is not overwrought. What on earth gave you that idea?

fridgepants Thu 31-Jan-13 23:01:51

My mum's from Liverpool and she gets that reaction in her home town, tbf.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:01:56

I'm confrontational shock

Really?

I am so terribly sorry, what with you being so reasonable and all.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:03:09

Yes, Jinsei,you called it. I don't really get snitches. Sigh. Piteous, really.

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 23:05:18

Nomads

Erm...no?

I said I've not yet met an unpleasant Polish person. It's neither here nor there because I've only met about 10!

Don't be so dim.

LineRunner Thu 31-Jan-13 23:05:54

Calm down dear, it's only a Trollmercial.

Alisvolatpropiis Thu 31-Jan-13 23:05:55

You're not Nick Griffin...are you his wife or his daughter?

tilder Thu 31-Jan-13 23:06:13

I'm not racist but....

Cornycabernet Thu 31-Jan-13 23:09:08

I don't really get racists.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:10:04

Jinsei

Ya big old tell tale tit. Not fair. i'm taking away my ball.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:10:10

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E320 Thu 31-Jan-13 23:10:31

Quite frankly, I would rather hear a foreign language than poor English.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:12:07

God, am so annoyed with you all. It's not racist to acknowledge that a big influx of one nationality changes the nature of the local community.

If you can't see that, then we live in a different Britain. You'll probably all disagree that Nottingham has gone to pot since the cotton trade died there.

I give up. You would probably all welcome Sharia law because it's about welcoming 'diversity'.

ComposHat Thu 31-Jan-13 23:12:21

I'm not a racist as I have no black friends.

As racists always start conversation 'I've got black friends but ..something outrageously racist'

I did buy a Trojan records reggae compilation today so maybe I am a bit racist.

Canada is a new country born of new people and has adapted that way. Do you think all the red-heads and blonds are Picts? Britain is also a country of immigrants and emigrants. In my family (quite a boring one) I have Polish, English, Scottish, Irish, Pakistani, Jamaican, 'Cape Coloured' (as she was when she came from SA), Russian, Canadian, South African and that's just the ones I can think of. When I add my friends I might as well be hosting the UN. Next decade it will be another country and another culture. I love it.

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 23:13:02

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Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:13:16

The polish jaffa cakes are the fucking BOMB. Get some from your local Polski Sklep. Also the ham (and it is PROPER naice) is about a quarter of the price anywhere else.

Katz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:13:21

Alis - I'm surprised about you not learning about welsh lit or poetry we did at my school, guess it may be a curriculum thing or teacher specific mine was gun ho about learning welsh from welsh writers!

OP - you are so wrong, multiculturalism is what makes Britisn great

Not to mention the fact that Canada isn't 'new' and I imagine First Nations people don't think of it that way!

Cornycabernet Thu 31-Jan-13 23:13:43

OP-if you were genuine you would have apologised for offending people
if you were trying to appear genuine you would have done the same
<amateur>

mrsjay Thu 31-Jan-13 23:14:15

all welcome Sharia law because it's about welcoming 'diversity'.

and there we have it mumsnetters shock well im not shocked tbh

EduCated Thu 31-Jan-13 23:14:25

The last Polish person I met was an absolute cuntweasel angry

Made me realise you get cuntweasels the world over.

OP, there are opinions people disagree with. Then there's out and out racism, which people will call it for what it is. You do understand that MN pretty much have to act on racist posts or face getting into a potentially tricky legal situation?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:15:32

Val

Thankyou for the tip. DH is on an economy drive at the moment, whci resulted in bullet peas from Iceland.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:15:34

Valpolicella yy the strawberry jaffa cakes YUM

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:16:38

LRD - First Nation people are very different to 'new Canada'. It's obvious.

Frist person to quote the Polish for 'cuntwesel' gets a prize.

EduCated Thu 31-Jan-13 23:17:10

How is it 'obvious'?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:17:59

NOW! Can anyonentell me where i can buy lemon wafer biscuits, lemon, not vanilla, not hazlenut, not chocolate. Lemon?

Tia

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:18:45

Jamie, the cheese is also much much cheaper. My lovely Polish neighbour introduced me to it and I swear I will never buy ham or cheese from the supermarkets again!

Mildreds - YES! Aren't they just

ComposHat Thu 31-Jan-13 23:19:39

The Polish Vodka with bison grass in it. Kept in the freezer then drunk with cloudy apple juice.....that is the tits!

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:19:54

Educated - really?

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 23:20:18

Jamie, Aldi is your friend.

Lemon wafer biscuits exist there. But they are not very nice. sad

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:20:23

voila! Jamie

Ooooh they're Italian. Hope the OP is ok with that....

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:21:14

Actually scrap that...they are $32 shock

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:21:36

Really - I must have a look for those jaffa cakes.

I always go in the asian grocers (cheap, really fresh veg and really good lamb and chicken amongst wondrous aisles of turkish delight and ghee sweets etc) but have never tried polski sklep.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:21:59

Jamie I think I last saw them in Tesco Ostrowiec Swietokrzyskie...sorry probably not much use to you grin

EduCated Thu 31-Jan-13 23:22:05

Yes, seriously. It may be obvious for you, but I for one am struggling to see the complete distinction. I'd hazard a guess I'm not the only one.

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:22:24

that's a better price Jamie And a nice 'english' sounding company too <arf>

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:22:26

Salivating right now. Lemon wafers! Vodka! Bison grass! (whateverthefuckthatis)

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:23:25

Do Getorf. If you can't find any I will send you some. The cherry ones...<droools>

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 23:23:56

On the other hand, hunter stew.

I had it in a restaurant once and it was amazing, but am not brave enough to make it myself. I don't suppose it exists in a supermarket form?

It was amazing, but my neck of the woods is somewhat lacking in Polish restaurants.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:25:43

I'm Irish, I couldn't bring myself to buy ghee sweets. The rest sounds good though, GetOrf

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:26:45

Cherry ones!

< faints>

cory Thu 31-Jan-13 23:27:40

Logic decrees that some language or other has to be the second language in the UK. Do you have a specific problem with it being Polish?

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:28:28

I wonder how PC you will be prepared to step when it comes to other cultures coming into our culture.

Will you also accept a big Muslim population telling you cover your hair? Is that going to be ok because they have great shops and a great work ethic?

This is a serious question and I'd really appreciate a reply.

This is not a racist question - it's genuine. Would you put up with being told to cover your hair?

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:29:47

Hahaha at ghee.

You should try them. Really. 80% butter, 20% sugar. Whole box hoovered up by me. Wonderful.

GOD val cherry jaffa cakes? What other flavours do they make?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:30:31

No i would not. My hair is literally and metaphorically my crowning glory. Without it i am simply middle aged. With it i am middle aged with nice hair. Everyone deserves to get the benefit of it.

Hands off my hair!

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:30:37

Ahahahahahahahahahahaha

Nomads....have a laugh.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:31:33

I may have laid it on a bit thick about the hair.

Cherry jaffa cakes. That is genius

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:31:46

look at fucking this lot!

Raspberry jaffa cakes
Chocolate covered plum gingerbread
Apricot filled breakfast rolls
Summat called KNOPPERS

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 23:32:20

Anyone shopping in our local Tesco would conclude that Polish people exist on pork and sweets.

That works for me; sausages, saurkraut, duplings. Nougat/marshmallow coated in chocolate. Wafer biscuits.

No problem at all.

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:32:22

Have you been asked to cover your hair Nomads?

LineRunner Thu 31-Jan-13 23:32:30

Oh dear. Do you seriously imagine that the majority of MPs in Parliament and the majority of the Lords would ever legislate for all women having to cover their hair?

Are you mad?

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:32:33

Well Getorf, I've only had the strawberry, cherry and orange ones. And they all totally piss all over British Jaffa cakes.

I shall consult LPN tomorrow in case she can ship over any others, while we share our Friday night wine grin

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:32:51

We-ellll <ponders>

Sometimes I think it would be useful for school pick-up. You know, on those days when you look like you've been dragged through a hedge backwards?

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:32:56

I wouldn't mind covering my hair. My hair is crap, it may as well be feathers for all the good it does.

And to answer you seriously - nobody is worrying about that, because it will not happen you twat

winnybella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:33:24

YY, Polish jaffa cakes are v.good.

Zobrowka- bison grass vodka, to be drank alone or with apple juice.

Kabanos/kielbasa mysliwska/poledwica sopocka- smoked sausages/pork filet-very good also.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:33:56

Knoppers. That made me snort.

I love ALdi and Lidl. Crisps with names like BUmfest. it's like that first Calais school trip all over again.

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:08

I found Rollmopski in the fridge the other day.

And cute little yoghurts. I am well fed, and happy.

EduCated Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:20

No I wouldn't. But I don't really see what that has to do with anything. British culture is, and always has been, a melting pot of different bits of many cultures. There is no single interpretation of British culture. Some bits of other cultures are adopted into 'ours' because people like it or its beneficial. I'm struggling to think of any 'bad' part of another culture which has become mainstream in the UK.

I also hate the idea that this is heading towards some kind of fight where we lose out culture. It's not, it's one big squiggly wiggly culturally wulturalliness.

cory Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:26

So how did we get from Polish being the second language to sharia law? Do they have that in Poland? confused

LineRunner Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:34

I'm wanting a bit of Dr Gerard's wafers.

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:36

Yes, I have. Many times. Not in England though. Yet.

FabulousFreaks Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:45

I think the op's premise is flawed and worrying, especially when I see the words "I think stereotypes exist for a reason." Negative stereotypes are often the result of istoric propoganda, myth and fear. To believe all stereotypes arise from a truth is scary and a win for the proponents of hate.

Through the last century alone the UK has worried about afro carribean communities taking over in the 50's then the Pakistani community taking over in the seventies and many other examples.

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:34:52

I urge you all to have the gingerbread. That's another fricking amaaaazing import.

I love my neighbour. She feeds me all these wonderful things to the point where I have to nearly roll myself down the stairs and not just because of the amount of wine we get through

winnybella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:35:06

Ooooh, and Sliwka Naleczowska- candied plum in chocolate-amazing

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:35:22

For Nomads I keep reading Gonads. No idea why.

EduCated Thu 31-Jan-13 23:35:30

<must disengage>

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:37:03

The last time I was asked to cover my hair was going into a Catholic church in Italy.

I wonder do Polish Catholics cover their hair for Mass?

And does that make them more or less of a threat to British Uncovered Hairyness?

>muses<

flow4 Thu 31-Jan-13 23:37:14

"I wonder how PC you will be prepared to step when it comes to other cultures coming into our culture. Will you also accept a big Muslim population telling you cover your hair? Is that going to be ok because they have great shops and a great work ethic?"

Nomads, FGS, no-one is going to ask you to cover your hair. Certain Muslim women choose to do it themselves; others are pressured to do it by their families... But no-one, ever, anywhere in the UK has seriously suggested you should do it too.

BTW cherry Jaffa cakes are not genius - they are just plain wrong! grin

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:37:18

I can't cope with more discoveries.

I ate a whole Lidl stollen in about 3 days at Christmas. It probably weighed more than the turkey.

QueenofPlaids Thu 31-Jan-13 23:37:23

This OP and some of the follow ups are awful. I agree with the posters who are saying YABU.

I live in a city with a huge numb of Polish immigrants and yes that means Polish shops and foods in the supermarket. I've often thought it was a right imposition walking past the Polish section in Tesco when I'm looking for my Oyster sauce or fucking pesto... hmm

We have a large number of Poles at work. Most speak good English and work hard. Some are lazy / rude / dossers. We have many British people at work. Most speak good English and work hard. Some are lazy / rude / dossers... shock

LineRunner Thu 31-Jan-13 23:37:30

OP, I'll see your Sharia Law and raise you Stole All Our Jobs.

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:37:50

lol at bumfest crisps. grin

NomadsLand Thu 31-Jan-13 23:38:28

I leave you to your biscuits and crisps. No wonder.

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:38:34

And They Cancelled The Word Christmas In Birmingham.

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:39:38

Do you think we have driven him off to shave his knuckles ?

[hopeful]

flow4 Thu 31-Jan-13 23:40:20

They'll be ordering the slaughter of our first-born next.

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:40:40

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Isildur Thu 31-Jan-13 23:40:52

I'm inappropriately hungry now.

Tomorrow I'm going out for wafer biscuits, german sausage, Taytos, and Club soda.

And so say all of us!

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:41:19

All this talkmof snacks. We are literally sleepwalking into an apocolypse

flow4 Thu 31-Jan-13 23:41:22

(That would save us both a job, eh Maryz?! wink )

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:42:04

Bugger. Apocalypse.

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:42:19

Really lol at 'and so say all of us' grin

JoanByers Thu 31-Jan-13 23:43:16

Didn't Hitler have a Polish problem?

Rather unfortunate choice of language.

And I say that being firmly opposed to open immigration from Poland/Romania etc.

Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 23:43:59

Bye OP. Make sure you cover your head on the way out. wink

HoHoHoNoYouDont Thu 31-Jan-13 23:44:28

grin at Linerunner

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:45:01

I keep reading Polish as polish. And that leads to guilt over my terrible housekeeping.

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:47:22

BAD Getorf. In Your Bed....you got deleted!

<MNHQ watching>

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:47:51

Jinsei I think the OP's head is firmly covered - by a white pointy hood

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:48:50

lolol I only said "shit for brains"

And I put a smiley face and EVERYTHING. grin

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:49:01

Hmm,

I wonder.

What would one have to say to get deleted?

OP. you are a cad

< waits>

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:49:09

Honestly, all the op's posts and you delete GetOrf for saying what we were all thinking shock

<tuts>

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:50:24

I wonder if a theoretical musing that the OP may be behaving slightly like a motherfucking tosspot would be deleted.

<ponders>

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:50:26

No?

OP, you are a dullard

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:50:27

my GF song is still there

nyer

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:50:47

The OP is DISINGENUOUS

<red rag>

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:51:06

The op's posts on this thread make him sound like a racist twat?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:51:22

GetOrf

That was rather upping the ante.

I was going to raise it to git next

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:51:35

Oh, sorry, he isn't racist.

The op's posts on this thread make him sound like a bigoted twat?

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:51:56

Sound LIKE. But we are not CALLING HIM a racist twat. Oh no. That would be rude and naughty.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:52:16

Maryz

cOntrol yourself! We need to move stealthily

OP is an ignoramus

LineRunner Thu 31-Jan-13 23:52:38

Someone on this thread is a fucking racist cunt and it's not me?

BackforGood Thu 31-Jan-13 23:52:53

Sorry to be serious for a moment... but where can I find which are the most commonly spoken languages in the UK ? I'm surprised to hear that it's Polish - I guess we probably base our perceptions on what we hear where we live. smile

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:53:15

I think now we have signed the execution papers for this thread.

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:53:32

No. justine said you have to say ' your posts make you sound like a shit head'

Apparently thats ok grin

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:53:55

Linerunner

Yes! Someone is a tosspot and it's not me

I bet hully has some humdinger medieval insults

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:54:17

Oh, no it's ok Jamie. Justine said I could do it like this. As long as I don't say the op is a bigoted twat, even if he is, which of course I would never say because if I did it would be a personal attack so I didn't say it.

confused

<hopes Helen is also confused>

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:55:04

Here you go back www.guardian.co.uk/uk/datablog/2013/jan/31/census-2011-language-map?INTCMP=SRCH

It is a Guardian link because I am a liberal pinko. Much to the OP;s disgust.

ZillionChocolate Thu 31-Jan-13 23:55:37

Surely this is a joke even less funny than the hotdogs one?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:55:44

Or,

An objective observer might conclude you are a turd?

BackforGOod

Wiki is your friend. Please don't distract from the serious business of this insult arms race

MildredIsMyAlterEgo Thu 31-Jan-13 23:56:11

I told the OP to fuck off in Polish up there^^ ages ago and it's still there

<preens>

flow4 Thu 31-Jan-13 23:56:31
Jinsei Thu 31-Jan-13 23:56:58

I got deleted TWICE earlier on this thread! shock And I wasn't half as rude to the OP as I could have been.

<stamps foot>

Valpollicella Thu 31-Jan-13 23:57:47

X posted with Maryz <highfives>

Your posts Maryz make you sound like you aren't making a personal attack <sagenod>

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:58:02

Who knows insults in pig latin? ( bloody Romans, coming over here and building our roads etc etc)

GetOrf Thu 31-Jan-13 23:58:08

Well done mildred.

The OP is a schwanzlutscher (it's not polish but the only foreign insult I can spell)

Maryz Thu 31-Jan-13 23:59:17

Oh well done Mildred [approving]. I thought you were saying hello in a friendly manner grin

JamieandtheMagicTorch Thu 31-Jan-13 23:59:37

Ze OP parles merde?

Valpollicella Fri 01-Feb-13 00:00:27

Vaffanculo OP

<hides behind Mildreds>

I am off to bed now. I can't wait to see the reason for this thread having vanished by the time I get up.

Goodnight y'all. And remember, if you don't have Polish shops near you I am more than prepared to share the Polish Jaffa Cake joy and send them onto you grin

Maryz Fri 01-Feb-13 00:01:07

<highfives Val>

Val's posts on this thread make her sound like an educated sensible person smile

Uckfay offay, perhaps Jamie?

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 00:01:16

I am thrilled by the jaffa cake knowledge.

I am going to buy some tomorror and report back.

Night all.

EduCated Fri 01-Feb-13 00:02:18

Der OP ist ein Schwein mit ein Scheizenkopf?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Fri 01-Feb-13 00:02:54

Me too. Lots of Polish shops near here. Now i have excellent reason to send DH on a mission.

AU Revoir

WorraLiberty Fri 01-Feb-13 00:03:16

All this talk of Polish stuff

Anyone else repeatedly singing "Mr Sheen shines umpteen things clean" in their heads?

No?

Just me then.... blush

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 00:03:24

in de nahe von der kühlschrank

(the only other german I know other than brot mit kase and zwei bier bitte)

JamieandtheMagicTorch Fri 01-Feb-13 00:03:29

Thankyou Maryz

JamieandtheMagicTorch Fri 01-Feb-13 00:04:49

Worra

No, me too. As i saidupthreadifyoubotheredtoread grin

BackforGood Fri 01-Feb-13 00:14:26

Thanks GetOrf, Jamie, Flow4 - I'm amazed....but you learn something everyday on Mn don't you? grin

flow4 Fri 01-Feb-13 00:15:26

And me. I came here to advise you never get a polish problem if you simply learn to love dust...

<Mutters> I still want to know the Polish for cuntweasel.

Also, people do know that you don't have to cover your head in a lot of Muslim countries, right? I mean, I went to Morocco and Zanzibar and didn't have to. I don't know why anyone Muslim would want me to here.

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:28:04

Yes, you're completely and utterly U OP. You lot here in England wouldn't be here in your present form had it not been for the Polish contribution during the Battle of Britain in 1940. And what a bloody bad show during the Warsaw Rising of 1944. You should be ashamed. Really very, very seriously ashamed. So don't start all the stuff about foreigners now please. You deserve to have lost your Britishness decades and decades ago.

I can tell you in Russian it's pizda-hariok, mrstp. Important to know, eh?

(They are vaguely similar languages. Possibly not with idiosyncratic MN obscenities, who knows?)

WorraLiberty Fri 01-Feb-13 00:32:59

JamieandtheMagicTorch Oh blush

Yellowtip that post was nearly as bad as some of the ones the OP has made.

'Us lot' deserved to have lost our Britishness decades and decades ago?

Well sorry but I wasn't alive then so there's not much I could have done about it hmm

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:33:31

MrsTerry the done thing for Brits is surely just to shout 'cuntweasel' out in a very loud voice, whenever in Kracow or Warsaw (or Lwow, or wherever). That will get the desired response.

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:37:33

Tbh don't really care Worra. I can do it, as half Brit, half Pole with almost every Polish family member playing a significant part in the Home Army and being let down at every turn.

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:40:11

And I wasn't alive then either Worra and made no contribution but honestly some of these xenophobes do need to get a grip of their history.

<Waves at Yellowtip> A person with a rellie in Polish Bomber here. Lost my Grandfather over Germany. I would have put it a teeny bit differently, though smile

That would be Polish Bomber Command...

WorraLiberty Fri 01-Feb-13 00:42:30

You can do what? confused

Did you play a significant part yourself or like me, did you get to play no part?

If it's the latter then I'm not sure why you feel the need to put British people down, any more than the OP feels the needs to put Polish people down.

We can't go back and change history...we played no part in it.

Therefore stooping to the level of the OP is pretty foolish imo.

WorraLiberty Fri 01-Feb-13 00:43:40

X posts!

But still, let's not stoop to the OP's level particularly as our generation played no part in it.

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:46:06

Well you're probably more temperate MrsTerry. I'm afraid the thankless lot annoy me even though I can't claim any effort either. Was your dad a Pole or was it your mum? Sorry about your Grandpa.

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:48:37

Lots of cross posts! Agree heartfeltedly about not taking glory but even so, this coming over and taking our jobs stuff just really gets my goat (yes goat, I very deliberately used the term goat).

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 00:52:27

Sorry *Worra/ Mrs T - mixed you up.

My Mum is half Polish. It was all very tragic. He came over, fell in love with my Granny and they conceived my Mum. My Grandmother talked about being in the WAAF and counting the planes in and back. Normally a smaller number coming back. I never knew if she was there the day my Grandfather didn't come back.

It does affect me because people talk about the Polish and make Daily Mail type comments and my DM adn I hear them. They don't know they are talking about us and our family.

WorraLiberty Fri 01-Feb-13 00:56:12

Lol at goat! grin

It is ridiculous and nearly always said by very ignorant people.

I'm the daughter of Southern Irish parents who came here to England nearly 60yrs ago...and despite the Government begging them to come and take up manual labour after the war, they still got flack about 'taking our jobs and houses' etc.

My Dad really did see the B&B signs in the windows that said, "No dogs - No Irish".

But as he'll tell you himself, there are ignorant and bitter people to be found everywhere in the world and you just have to look to the majority of decent people to realise the others are (thankfully) in a minority...even though at times it won't seem like it.

Do you think the op actually accepted their arse back or do you think it is lurking in the corner on a plate still?

Only reason i can see for this thread still being in existence is the fact that it shows quite clearly that mnetters won't accept views that come across as racist.

HoHoHoNoYouDont Fri 01-Feb-13 01:06:17

Back to the Polski Sklep forrin grub for a min. I'm a bit precious about food ingredients and wondered if all food imported has to have clear labelling on it (fat,salt etc) or is that just a uk thing?

Yellowtip Fri 01-Feb-13 01:07:12

Worra I meant I could be fairly rude about racist British attitudes to Poles because I have a foot in both camps.

My dad would have said exactly the same about the majority being decent. Still, the minority can do with being pulled up from time to time in case daily reading of the Daily Mail gives them ideas above their station.

mrsjay Fri 01-Feb-13 08:45:24

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Hulls Fri 01-Feb-13 10:53:34

Hully was mysteriously obliterated last night (awaiting reasons from mnhq)

but did see odd thread of naming. Just wanted to say thanks for those wot defended and may sanity one day prevail...fat chance.

LineRunner Fri 01-Feb-13 17:37:34

Yellowtip, no-one here (well, no-one that isn't the OP) would disagree with you that DM-type hypocrisy is ignorant and sickening. It's just that when you said 'you lot' is could have been read as 'you lot on this thread.'

This was unfortunate as people on this thread are definitely not in the business of tolerating the very ignorance that gets all our goats.

Dear, dear goats.

Hully, Lots of posts have been deleted, I see, including loads of the OP's. Is it worth MNHQ keeping the thread, really? It started off mad and went downhill.

Mia4 Fri 01-Feb-13 18:05:37

Was that the DM article? It was all very sensational and scare mongering...until you get to the point when 92% speak English, mother tongue or not? And only 1% speak Polish. So basically only 8% of people in this country don't speak English: a proportion of those will be Welsh, a proportion will include those who haven't learnt yet and those who will and a proportion will be those who can't be arsed.

But sadly, not being arsed to learn the language or the country you are going into, is very universal for all walks of people. I know a fair few ex-pats in France, Germany and Spain and while they are learning the language they know many other English and Americans who can't be arsed to and expect others to speak theirs. Whilst English is very widely spoken, a lot of the time it's the same attitude existing that stops people bothering to learn.

marjproops Fri 01-Feb-13 18:23:17

At least any Poles Ive ever met/seen actually work in this country, I was a bit shocked when the news said Polish is now the second language here, was expecting another one to be (wont say at the risk of sounding you-know-what).

Im not opposed to ANYONE coming to live in this country if they are genuinly looking for work, (and theres a lot of workshy layabout nationals here as it is who moan ''all the bloody foreigners getting all our jobs''-yet theyre not prepared to work) just the ones that come here and immediately get the posh houses and benefits without doing a scrap of work. beacause they can.

prepares to put hard hat on.....

and Id say the same about any country.

I LOVE the Australian PM, theres a speech she made that said it all, about anyone choosing to live in Australia.

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:27:40

Hulls my love - they are letting you back soon , surely ?

mrsjay Fri 01-Feb-13 18:28:37

oo I was deleted I can't remember what I said confused oh well

mrsjay Fri 01-Feb-13 18:29:44

OH i remember what I said was nothing THAT bad ho hum

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:29:45

I heard about the 'name names' shite this morning. you weren't bothered were you. That has been on the cards for while - like a big boil.

It has been a bizarre day or so.

LineRunner Fri 01-Feb-13 18:33:30

the ones that come here and immediately get the posh houses and benefits without doing a scrap of work. beacause they can.

I see your Posh Houses For Free and raise you Clandestine Immigrant Devil Worship.

BIWI Fri 01-Feb-13 18:35:02

Pag - have had a message from Hulls saying she has been banned sad

manicbmc Fri 01-Feb-13 18:37:13

Is the devil an immigrant? Oh ffs. grin

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:37:43

Oh fucking wankery.
She said she couldn't post but I assumed that it would be brief while they sorted that thread out - which is after all a big pile of steaming toss -pottery

Gah.
Sometimes the arses on here....

manicbmc Fri 01-Feb-13 18:40:35

What the hell has Hully been banned for?

Should we have a 'Free the Mn One' thread?

marjproops Fri 01-Feb-13 18:41:02

Immigrant devil worship??????? explain????

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 18:41:07

Bloody hell! She hasn't been banned. SURELY not.

What the bloody hell has happened?

BIWI Fri 01-Feb-13 18:42:16

Not sure - I wasn't on the thread. The one in FWR with pan.

catgirl1976 Fri 01-Feb-13 18:42:34

YABU

Something's got to be the second language

What would you prefer?

Also, the Polish guy who works in the shop near me is vair good looking.

catgirl1976 Fri 01-Feb-13 18:43:33

Hully has been banned? shock

But...but..why?

That's like banning strawberries from Wimbledon. Only wronger.

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:44:36

T'was one of the wankers on the FWR thread.
They've been all smug and gloaty about it 'well if you can't refrain from personal attacks' while they derail, and goad and misquote her after the fact.

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 18:44:58

I was on that thread fgs. She didn't do anything other than call Pan a coward. And quote an insult back at him which he used in the first place. And she was het up but NO more than any of us have been on threads at times.

Fucking norah. angry

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 18:45:51

Oh I am so fucking FURIOUS they sit there insulting but staying within the guidelines, and then when someone loses their temper THEY are the ones banned.

Those bastard fucker arseholes.

aquashiv Fri 01-Feb-13 18:47:00

Surely any culture will change over time. Nothing is set in stone that is the beauty of it being able to evolve change and grow?

I think you need to come up with some better one liners than that no wonder you got blank stare.

BIWI Fri 01-Feb-13 18:47:23

Ah. So more derailers, then?

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:47:37

Yep. Absoloutely right Getorf.

They must be ever so precious that being called a coward is too much in the midst of a very robust debate

Oh, I missed lots of bad German swearing! I could've contributed <disappointed>

I am surprised this fred is still standing. In a fashion...

But more improtantly: hully has been banned?? WHAT?? Whatever for??

So you like Poles when you are in Poland on holiday, but rather they did not come here and change Liverpoodlian culture to the worse with their blank stares at your bad jokes?

Yabu.

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 18:49:59

The motherfuckers.

They are still at it on that thread.

Useless inadequate pieces of piss.

Oh dear.

That will learn me not reading to the end of the thread.

Surely they should have banned Worra, and not Hully?

<runs and hides>

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 18:51:55

Apols for the language.

I haven't even had a drink yet to excuse myself.

GetOrf Fri 01-Feb-13 18:52:18

lol at Quint, bloody hell grin

manicbmc Fri 01-Feb-13 18:52:54

Which thread?

They cant have banned Hully.

She was snogging Justine two years ago at the Christmas meet. And danced with Helen.

We need to get her back.

We should all flounce until Hully is back.

FairyJen Fri 01-Feb-13 18:53:36

What Fred getorf. What the actual fuck has happend?? They can't ban hully it's not allowed

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:54:39

[sigh] me too.

It's just immensely frustrating.

The absoloutely wastes of space are still here, trying to wind mners up. Hully gets banned.

I just ignore them. They are nothing. But they upset people on issues deeply felt.
It's very annoying.

Kveta Fri 01-Feb-13 18:54:45

I came here to defend eastern Europeans as I am currently bfing my half Czech DD to sleep, but hully banned?! Wtf?!

TuftyFinch Fri 01-Feb-13 18:55:04

What's going on? I've been not here.

I have no idea whats gone down here.

But before I unleash the Wreath of Worra, I should say I was joking.

FairyJen Fri 01-Feb-13 18:57:02

I've obviously missed something epic here. This is the end of mumsnet a we know it

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

We are talking Hullygully? The hully who has a dog named after her?
WTF??????????? shock

Hully banned rally?

Uppatreecuppatea Fri 01-Feb-13 19:01:26

I think large groups of migrants change the nature of the country in which they live by the very force of their presence. This is a natural consequence of mass migration. The fact is, large cities in the UK now experience 'ghettoisation" where migrant nationalities tend to group together for the sake of familiarity of language and culture: from this, specialist shops and services spring up (mosques, halal butchers, afro-caribbean hairdressers, Polish specialist foods etc). It's natural.

Many people have brought up the example of Spain or France. Both good examples but the basic culture is very similar in terms of belief systems. Language is obviously an issue and I think it's up to the migrant to try and assimilate by learning some of the language.

I have visited Dubai a few times and that is one place where I can clearly see that the mass influx of Brits (amongst others) HAS changed the culture. The shopping malls now post signs asking people to dress modestly. I see Brits walking around the malls in mini-skirts and boob tubes juxtaposed against the Emirati women wearing abayas and veils and I wonder what on earth they must think has happened to their country. Emiratis account for only 17% of the population of the UAE (Dubai, Abu Dhabi etc) and that must be pretty scary for them.

I think it's blinkered to think that the influx of groups of migrants doesn't change the local culture. It simply does. Whether it's a good or a bad thing is just a matter of opinion.

Pagwatch Fri 01-Feb-13 19:01:38
GothAnneGeddes Fri 01-Feb-13 19:10:49

O.P is proving why as one of "those Muslims", I was so happy to leave Liverpool and move to Birmingham.

Liverpool likes to think it's multicultural, but it's still very segregated and there is a lot of racism there.

WorraLiberty Fri 01-Feb-13 19:17:59

But before I unleash the Wreath of Worra, I should say I was joking.

I haven't got a wreath yet honest shock

Other than that, I have no idea what you're talking about.

Men in sauna here. That is how Finish Culture is our downfall

blush Wrath

Uppatreecuppatea Fri 01-Feb-13 19:26:52

GothAnneGeddes - I suppose that proves the point about Ghetto-isation and people moving to where they feel most 'at home'.

I know that Brits who move to Spain or France, for example, prefer to live in areas with lots of expats. It's normal.

I hope you'll be happy in Birmingham - it's a great city with so many fab restaurants. I love Brindley Place!

feministefatale Fri 01-Feb-13 19:29:16

Oh god, sweaty men drinking hot beer. What is the world coming to?

feministefatale Fri 01-Feb-13 19:30:05

I could just about accept it, if they were drinking proper beer grin

I thought Pan was a Good Guy... sad

Oh sorry, just ignore me, I ment to post that about 2 hours ago blush.

... And on a different thread? Yes, me too. Tbh im finding mn strange at the moment with plenty of previously 'normal' posters going odd. But I'm clinging to mn as in general I love it here and I fear change

Nope, right thread, but a bit out of context now.
I just hate goading. Naught wrong with a bit of exaggeration for dramatic effect to make a point, but to keep needling people when they are already het up... urgh. Hate it when the darling offspring do it, and hate it on here. Still luff MN bigtime otherwise though grin.

GothAnneGeddes Sat 02-Feb-13 00:23:05

Uppa - I wouldn't say I've segregated myself.

The area I live in is very, very mixed, Liverpool is considerably less so. L8 still has by far the highest number of ethnic minority communities.

LineRunner Sat 02-Feb-13 00:34:45

Pan reported Hully on a thread and unfortunately he made his reporting public.

The thread was in FWR and already infested with MRA trolls. They then probably just jumped on the reporting bandwagon and the rest, as they say, is hysteria.

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