To not get people putting messages on FB to relatives that have been dead for years?

(236 Posts)
Wampingwillow Wed 30-Jan-13 13:12:25

I just don't get why anyone would want to wish their mother/ father/brother etc a happy birthday on Facebook when they've been dead for 10 years! Obviously they are dead and I would expect that the family and close friends would know that it would have been their birthday so why the need to let everyone else know? Is it just so they can get loads of 'sending you hugz Hun' messages and while we are at it why to people like the status? Do they really like the fact that your relative is dead?

photographerlady Wed 30-Jan-13 13:13:24

People enjoy getting attention from RIPing on the internet.

CunfuddledAlways Wed 30-Jan-13 13:16:01

maybe they feel they need to show they are still thinking about whoever but don't know where else to express it? maybe they like the thought of people thinking of them as people tend to greive (sp?) for loved ones for years especially on soecail occasions/birthdays etc

Maybe it gives them a way to remind people and find a bit of support and comfort? Does it really matter how people choose to grieve, ignore it and move on.

Surely anything that makes the grieving feel a tiny bit better is completely understandable and NotToBeJudged?

Let them be, please.

Why do you care? I will post something along the lines of thinking of mum in october when it would of been her birthday. As will i in november on the first anniversary of her death. Not for everyone to fuss over me but as a way to acknowledge that im thinking of her and miss her. Id also delete any idiot who asked me why i was doing it or if it was to get attention. People grieve very differently live and let live.

RingoBaa Wed 30-Jan-13 13:19:58

A guy I used to work with died but his family never had his Facebook page deleted so on his birthday loads of people wrote things like 'Happy Birthday mate, hope you are having a great time in heaven xx'.

But I think people are just sharing how they feel. People might feel a bit down on the birthday of someone they loved who died so why not get some 'hugz' from their friends?

chaos spot on

thegreylady Wed 30-Jan-13 13:24:10

Some acquaintances of mine have kept their family member's fb page open though she died 3 years ago. It was the family member who was my friend and I find it quite distressing to get status updates from my dead [much missed] friend.

Sunnywithshowers Wed 30-Jan-13 13:24:10

YABU

Again, why do you care? A friend committed suicide, he lived (and died) in the US. I like to look at his page and remember his life, and acknowledge his birthday. His family are happy that people remember him.

Because, OP, despite your disapproval, people tend to cling on to any link with a loved one who has passed, including their facebook page.
I know a lady who left her DP's FB open, and she tags him to pics of their two small children still. It is her link to him and I'd never begrudge her that, the pain she's feeling must be immense.

How nasty!!

My mum has passed away and come October I will make a reference to her on her birthday....I will make reference to her on mothers day - it gives my dad and my siblings comfort to know she is being thought of.

If it gives someone a shred of comfort then what does it matter??

FeltOverlooked Wed 30-Jan-13 13:29:50

Surely it is no different to the In Memoriam type messages in the newspapers?

Poledra Wed 30-Jan-13 13:30:52

People have done this for years, but it used to be in the 'In Memoriam' section of the local newspapers. It's not something I'd do, but if it gives them comfort... <shrug>

I think it is actually very difficult to shut someone elses' FB down.

My son died in July and we and his friends post on his FB loads, we posted on his birthday, christmas, new year etc. My younger son just posts random stuff exactly as he did when James was alive. All James' friends do the same.

YABU
it has nothong whatsoever to do with you, if you don't like it, don't look at it.

DontSweatTheSmallStuff Wed 30-Jan-13 13:33:11

YABU

It's not just about sending a message to the dead person though, or getting attention. It's a way of keeping in contact with other people who knew them/knowing that others are still thinking about them and having a bit of support.

I have no contact with my brothers friends but it's nice to know they are still thinking about him.

mumblechum1 Wed 30-Jan-13 13:33:43

sad I am so sorry Mumof2teenboys.

LetsKateWin Wed 30-Jan-13 13:34:10

I've got friends who do this. I really feel for them. How heartless of you to question their motives. I can't imagine the pain they have to live through on significant dates.

Are you a troll?

Threads like this make me wonder if im being judged when i post about my mum as i have done every few days since her death. It beggars belief really that someone would begrudge me that 5 minutes of expressing how i feel since i lost her. I honestly couldnt give a flying if people dont like it then theres a delete button for a reason. When they have watched their parent die horribly so young then they can judge what i do.

GilmoursPillow Wed 30-Jan-13 13:38:09

My beloved grandmother died 18 months ago. Despite being in her late 80's she was still a Facebook user. I write on her wall on the anniversary of her death and on her birthday. It brings a little comfort to me and it's a collective for my Mum 7 hours flight west, and my cousin 14 hours flight east to share memories on important dates. I don't actually give a fuck whether anyone else likes it or not (although I don't wish her a happy birthday on my own wall, just hers.)

SaskiaRembrandtVampireHunter Wed 30-Jan-13 13:38:49

mumof2 I'm so sorry about your son.

OP - what everyone else has said. People grieve in their own way and at their own pace, it's really not up to anyone else to decide what is and isn't appropriate.

StuntGirl Wed 30-Jan-13 13:40:05

It's pretty easy to close a deceased person's facebook page down actually. Many people choose not to because like others have said, its a link to that person even if they're not here anymore.

It doesn't affect you so why do you care?

YABU. A young girl from my town died 2 years ago today and my Facebook is full of messages about her. People are still grieving and want to show they are thinking of her today.

Wampingwillow Wed 30-Jan-13 13:44:00

Obviously I've unintentionally upset a few of you and for that I'm sorry. I said I didn't get why people posted birthday messages and I still don't, I've lost people close to me but to me grief is a private matter and I don't and never will see the need to share my feelings with the FB throng.

CheeseStrawWars Wed 30-Jan-13 13:44:58

It's to show their relative is "gone but not forgotten". Hth.

Waiting - I used to worry too much I don't care anymore - if people don't like it they can hide me.

My mum died in 2010 so not as raw for me and I don't mention her on there as much but in the early days it was a good release for me.

Who was it who said people enjoy getting attention and rip messages?? WTF??? I would actually enjoy having my mum here even more.

I wrote a beautiful poem when my mum died.......helped keep the insomnia at bay.

Well I guess you would be upset if people chose to belittle the way you grieve too. You should have maybe added this thread to the 'things you never see the need to share'.

goldenlula Wed 30-Jan-13 13:50:56

But that is the point, WampingWillow, grief is a very personal thing and everyone deals with it in their own way. I post such messages, I couldn't careless whether anyone comments on it, as it is me expressing how I feel at that time. My nephew was murdered a year a go, his FB page is still active, friends and family post on it. I do not feel ready or able to do this but I did a rip message to him on my status on the year 'anniversary'.

everlong Wed 30-Jan-13 13:51:12

' people enjoy getting attention from RIPing on the internet '

Oh really. Or maybe they find it helps them a teeny bit.

I don't refer to my dead son on Facebook very often. That is my choice. But I certainly don't begrudge anybody else that acknowledges their lost loved ones. We all deal with grief differently.

PoppadomPreach Wed 30-Jan-13 13:52:56

wamping - different people grieve in different ways. Just because you don't understand, does not make it invalid or wrong. It just means you don't understand, therefore you should just leave it.

theykillhorses Wed 30-Jan-13 13:54:24

I go to my grandfather's grave and talk to him. It's not logical. It's not going to change anything. But it makes me feel connected to him because I miss him. I imagine the facebook thing is the same.

I try not to worry betty anyone who watched what me and my family did over that period of time being powerless to help but not daring to not be there deserves to say whatever the jeff they like wherever as far as im concerned.

IrnBruChew Wed 30-Jan-13 13:55:34

As you can see OP people grieve in different ways. Just because you don't feel the need it's quite disrespectful to question "why"?

nethunsreject Wed 30-Jan-13 13:55:37

YABU. And insensitive.

People deal with things in different ways. You don't have to 'get' it.

What most people said. Birthdays etc are hard times and just having a bit of sympathy can help just that little bit. It also gives other people who loved the person too a bit of a chance to have a chat about them for support.

Plus - sticking stuff on FB is how most people feel they're "telling the world" something. If they think there is another place when you go, then perhaps they feel the lost loved one might just get the message, given it's addressed to "everyone". Obviously that's entirely down to the individual's beliefs but I'm quite sure many people do see it that way.

AbigailAdams Wed 30-Jan-13 13:57:19

Nice sensitive post there OP. Well done.

Exactly waiting - my poor mum really suffered towards the end and 2.5 years later I still have bad nightmares about it all.........

JustAHolyFool Wed 30-Jan-13 14:08:30

What's the difference between that and going to put flowers on a grave?

In my mind there is no difference, really.

LittleChimneyDroppings Wed 30-Jan-13 14:12:28

One of my friends died a few years ago and his fb is still open. I like it, its a place where his friends and family from all over the world can gather, to say a few words when they feel like it, and to acknowledge birthdays, christmas and the day he died. Just because he's gone doesn't mean we want to forget him. His grave is too far away to visit. I love the collection of photos and words dedicated to his life, and I can look at them whenever I want. Its not causing harm to anyone else.

OwlLady Wed 30-Jan-13 14:13:32

surely it's just the same as putting a poem in the newspaper. I know my Mum does this for my late sister. I think it's because she doesn't want my sister forgotten. It's very difficult when someone you love so much dies, everybody else might get over it but you never do. It lives with you forever

BellaVita Wed 30-Jan-13 14:14:05

Yabvu.

badguider Wed 30-Jan-13 14:14:23

A friend and colleague of mine died in a tragic accident but until she died she brought joy and inspiration to everybody she met and knew.

People still post on her fb page or post statuses with her tagged to mention things that made them think of her or moments when they particularly missed her.. it makes me smile everytime i see it because yes, it hurts that she's gone and I miss her but it's important to me that we all celebrate her life (and she was very much that kind of person who we know would feel that way too).

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

HugeLaurie Wed 30-Jan-13 14:17:07

My brother died very suddenly last April. His FB page is still open and people keep adding photos of him and little comments now and then. What was nice about it was they were photos I had never seen or stories that I didn't know. It made me feel like I knew more about him and it also showed how popular he was in life.

TBH I have no problem with FB pages staying open so people can remember. What really upset me was finding out he was dead on FB. That was horrendous.

KellyElly Wed 30-Jan-13 14:18:34

I've lost people close to me but to me grief is a private matter and I don't and never will see the need to share my feelings with the FB throng. Yes and that's YOU. Do you often express the rest of mankind to express their grief and emotions exactly the same as you do hmm

KellyElly Wed 30-Jan-13 14:18:49

*expect

KellyElly Wed 30-Jan-13 14:19:53

People enjoy getting attention from RIPing on the internet. What a wankerish post. How lovely and empathetic you sound.

same betty what i post on fb is usually quite tame compared to how i actually feel.

JustAHolyFool Wed 30-Jan-13 14:21:13

HugeLaurie shocked that you found out about your brother on FB. That must have been horrendous.

HugeLaurie Wed 30-Jan-13 14:24:36

JustAHoly - It wasn't great. He was found dead in his flat in the morning. Some neighbours saw police breaking in and obviously found out he was dead. They (the neighbours) then posted it on FB before the family were told. I logged on to FB during my lunch break at work and saw it. Nothing you can do about it though, people just do stuff without thinking sometimes.

wigglesrock Wed 30-Jan-13 14:25:05

I've done it, my Godmother would have been 60 last year - her daughter was a teenager when she died, she put a post up on Facebook and we all replied. Her other brothers and sisters are in different countries - they all can't go to the grave, go to Mass together so its connects them. I don't get what the big deal is - it's how people remember their loved ones.

badguider Wed 30-Jan-13 14:31:25

btw. If I was to post about my friend who died "missing x today on her birthday" nobody would say "aww hugs hun" and neither would i want them to... what they would say was 'x made the world a better place' or 'x was a special person we were lucky to know' - something nice and affirming.

JustAHolyFool Wed 30-Jan-13 14:31:44

Wow HugeLaurie how unthinking of them. Sorry that happened.

MolehillAlchemy Wed 30-Jan-13 16:09:40

It's just a way of speaking to the universe isn't it? It's pretty common in all cultures to leave messages for the dead. Whether it's an annual parade, a rock on a hillside or now, a note on Facebook.

And even if people do it just for people to say, "Aw hugz babe, thinking of u" well so what!

Dear Universe. I am grieving. Please acknowledge my grief. I don't see anything wrong with that.

Pandemoniaa Wed 30-Jan-13 16:15:50

One of my dearest friends died suddenly two years ago. It really was a totally shocking, completely out of the blue, tragedy made all the worse by her age and the fact that she left young adult dcs behind who were, in every way, unprepared to lose their mother.

Her Facebook page is still active. Her dcs have got enormous comfort from it. It is not a vicarious desire to share their feelings with what you insultingly describe as the FB throng because the page is limited to family and close friends. But call it ridiculous if you like but I feel just that bit closer to my lovely friend when I leave her messages on significant days. I know she is dead. But she'll never be forgotten.

It's hugely insensitive to dictate how other people find ways through the grieving process.

StuntGirl Wed 30-Jan-13 16:24:57

You sound very insensitive OP. Do you often dictate to others how they should feel? Surely by going through the grieving process yourself you have discovered not everyone grieves the same?

I know someone who deals with a death by talking about it all the ruddy time. Every time I see her she talks about it, and the person, and personally I find that quite suffocating and unnatural. If she (the deceased) were still here she wouldn't be the focus of every conversation, and I struggle to have it 'in my face' every time I see my friend. However, it is clearly her way of dealing with it so I let her get on with it.

BabyRoger Wed 30-Jan-13 16:26:14

OP - do you mind people saying happy birthday on FB to their alive relatives and friends?

My mum died and I say happy birthday, happy mothers day etc. I think you are really insensitive. Why shouldn't I?

I most certainly do not do it because I "like RIPing on the internet" or I am looking for comments about it. Really, do people think that if someone is posting about a close relative like a parent or child who has died is only doing it for a bit of attention?

I am just putting it out there - I want to say happy birthday to her in person but I can't, it's just a channel to say it.

YABVU.

elliejjtiny Wed 30-Jan-13 16:33:29

YABU
My cousin died 4 years ago. His facebook page is still open and my auntie always posts on it on significant dates. I always like the post or comment because that's what I'd like people to do if it was one of my children.

LadyWidmerpool Wed 30-Jan-13 16:35:58

I wish my stupid bereaved friends would STFU about their grief. Attention seekers.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Wed 30-Jan-13 16:37:10

Anything that anybody does in public is judged. Should anybody care about that? No. Does it affect the way they behave? No. People do what they want to do.

I agree with the OP; I don't post anything on Facebook. This isn't facebook, it's AIBU and there are always questions asked that will offend somebody. The thread title is clear, why read it if it will upset you?

Do what you want to do but accept that not everybody will feel the same way as you do about it anymore than you feel the same way as them.

Spice17 Wed 30-Jan-13 16:45:58

My cousins 13 year old daughter put the other day 'RIP Mum, can't believe it's been 2 years, love you' Is it that sot of comment you don't like OP? Because I think people should do whatever the fuck they want with their Facebook account and if it bothers you that much, just unfriend them.

nailak Wed 30-Jan-13 16:51:50

who decided "grief is a private matter" and made that the law? ffs

now there is a right and a wrong way to grieve?

I suppose you dont see the point of funerals or memorial services or gravestones for that matter as "grief is a private matter"

and yes this does seem part of a bigger issue that people just seem to hate whatever other people post on fb, pics of food hate it, politics hate it, memories, hate it,

if you are so intolerant it is your issue.

IcanandIwill Wed 30-Jan-13 16:54:51

Just because they've been dead 10 years does not mean you miss them any less. I've grieved the loss of someone very close, very publically on FB. It's therapeutic to get those feelings out there. Grief is very personal and each to their own I say.

expatinscotland Wed 30-Jan-13 16:59:24

Yes, let's just hide away grief over the natural life event that is death, that'll make it go away and stuff. hmm

Our attitude towards death and bereavement in this culture is ridiculous, as OPs like this demonstrate.

Why do they do it? Why do you care? Hide them and move on, or better yet, block people who do this before they find out they've got someone this insensitive as a 'friend'.

SonOfAradia Wed 30-Jan-13 16:59:35

People always want to remember their Beloved Dead. It's been going on since our species was very young.

Go to any country in Central or Eastern Europe and the cemetries at night are beautifully lit up because relatives have left long-burning candles in coloured glass jars. This happens to some extent every night of the year, but on Saint's days and festivals, the graveyards become a blaze of colour.

In Britain we don't really go in for that so much. I wasn't even allowed to put such a coloured light on the place in a church graveyard where my dad's ashes are scattered. In these modern times, the Facebook page of a deceased relative or friend provides an outlet for grief, a place where memories can be shared by those who loved them. It's really simple to understand.

threesocksmorgan Wed 30-Jan-13 17:00:27

terrible isn't it op.
how dare I mention my mum who died when I was 18 on fb.

SonOfAradia Wed 30-Jan-13 17:02:58

I meant to add also that in European cemetries, the gravestones often have a small picture of the person buried there, as a reminder. Not so different to a facebook profile photo in concept.

expatinscotland Wed 30-Jan-13 17:06:34

To think, we have entire days set aside to remember dead soldiers from decades ago, not to mention all those memorials in nearly every town with dead peoples' names on them. Even the Queen goes on telly and participates in remembering all these dead people in front of the entire nation! Gah, haven't we all just 'moved on'? Must be doing it for attention.

Who'd have thunk it?

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Wed 30-Jan-13 17:08:00

Yes YABU to not 'get' why people are different to you.

You are also BU to start a thread guaranteed to upset other people when you clearly have NO intention of even trying to understand that POV.

What on earth was your motivation to start this hurtful thread?

oldraver Wed 30-Jan-13 17:08:32

I really dont see it as any different to an In Memoriam in the local paper, that seems to be an acceptable way of remembering a deceased loved one and no-one questions it....FB is just the modern way of doing things

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Wed 30-Jan-13 17:09:38

Oh and for what it's worth... I don't 'do' facebook, so no personal axe to grind.

madlymoo Wed 30-Jan-13 17:15:07

My Dad's facebook page is still open, he passed away last September. My sister and I quite regularly put a little message on for him. Its not meant for other people to read really and if they do read it, who are they to judge? It helps us in the grieving process. So personally speaking, if it makes people feel a little better, why not. I wouldn't belittle anyone wishing to remember their passed on loved ones in a way which suits them.

Sleepthief Wed 30-Jan-13 17:17:25

YABU. On the first birthday after he'd died I sent my dad an email wishing him a happy birthday (his work hadn't deleted his account). Made me feel better. Also every year on his birthday and the anniversary of his death either I or one of my brothers and sisters post a FB status tagging each other showing that we're still thinking of him. We're spread around the world and don't get a chance to talk much. Loads of friends and relatives 'like' it to show they're thinking of us and remembering him. I guess either you have never lost anyone you love or that you find it difficult to empathise with others...

propertyNIGHTmareBEFOREXMAS Wed 30-Jan-13 17:23:34

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 17:26:14

It's a way of dealing with grief, If it helps someone a tiny bit how can that be a bad thing?

What a fucking horrible OP.

xxxxmrsxxxx Wed 30-Jan-13 17:26:33

My daughter isn't dead but she was seriously brain injured in a car accident 4 months ago. Her friends, her family and I all write on her Facebook even though she will probably never recover enough to read it. I often read her some of the things that people have written to her.

If you don't like it, unfriend the person. It's not your Facebook they are writing it on.

SonOfAradia Wed 30-Jan-13 17:29:29

One other thought struck me: cremation and the subsequent scattering of ashes is so popular these days that people often have no focal point for their grieving, eg a grave they can visit. I know when my dad died I was actually quite upset at that thought when my mum said it'd been his wish to be cremated. Perhaps Facebook can provide an alternative to the old ways.

SonOfAradia Wed 30-Jan-13 17:30:20

Sorry to read about your daughter, xxxxmrsxxxx

Heavywheezing Wed 30-Jan-13 17:36:01

I'm off to France next week.

My great grandfather died in the First World War. I only found this out in November. The first thing I'm going to do is say sorry.
Sorry I haven't visited earlier and sorry I didn't know about him.

I loved his son, my grandfather very much.

I don't know what else to do. I speak to my Grampy regularly. Not on Facebook, that's not my thing but I don't mind reading messages about people who have died.i'd be touched that somebody still loved me enough to think about me.

Who else or where else do they go?

Have compassion.

greencolorpack Wed 30-Jan-13 17:38:06

I agree sonofAradia.

I never thought much about cremation vs burial but lately I decided to seek out my grandparents grave. I found it through research and half remembered memories of a cemetery on a hilltop somewhere remote. I now live about half an hours drive away. I wandered round the graveyard and prayed to my Nana to find her and a second later I found her grave, it was just lovely. I was not sad, just so chuffed to have found them and I would like to go and leave flowers next time now I know. So now I can see the point of burial. It's good to have somewhere to go.

yousankmybattleship Wed 30-Jan-13 17:43:59

What a nasty post. I lost someone very very close a year ago. He was 40 years old. I posted a message on his birthday. I don't know why, but it helped a bit. On a day when everything was whirling round in my mind it helped to do something concrete I suppose. How could that possbily bother you OP? I shall hide this thread now as it has really upset me.

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 17:48:04

Yes, this thread has kind of upset me too.

expatinscotland Wed 30-Jan-13 17:52:27

My daughter is buried. She was only 9 when she died. I find her burial place very peaceful. It is a large cemetary with plenty of space left so it's an active, lively place and sadly, there are many children and young people around her sad. You always see balloons in the shape of a number at some spots on birthdays. 18, 21. Even if they've been dead for 5, 10 years.

thegreylady Wed 30-Jan-13 17:57:22

I should have said that although I feel a frisson of sadness when I see the updates I agree that no one should judge how others grieve.On my mum/grandparents grave the headstone says:
"Love's Last Gift-Remembrance" and that is so true.
Sorry if I added to anyone's unhappiness-fb can be such a blunt instrument sometimes.

OwlLady Wed 30-Jan-13 17:58:10

Please don't let the OP upset you, she is an ignoramus

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 18:00:38

It's not my thing either

I don't really understand why it's done on the dead person's wall rather than by private message?? can anyone who does it explain that to me (or do you do both??)

but I don't really mind it though so long as I'm not asked to partake in any way (i.e. tagged)

expatinscotland Wed 30-Jan-13 18:04:41

When you PM a dead person they can't retrieve the message.

Annunziata Wed 30-Jan-13 18:06:51

My dad has been dead for 22 years this year. I always take him a birthday and Christmas card and maybe if I used facebook I'd do that too.

YABU.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 18:08:11

they cant read their FB wall either!

I'm guessing its like writing the person a letter? I get that that helps some people, but just thought that a pm would be more of an equivalent IYKWIM?

PoppadomPreach Wed 30-Jan-13 18:11:54

OldeBagLady

I don't like celery. It's not my thing. Tastes horrible as far as I'm concerned.

But I do understand that some people like it. I don't think it's unreasonable that they like it. They do, I don't. It really is terribly simple.

If you're not bright enough to understand that public posts regarding bereavement on FB might be therapeutic to some, perhaps it's best to keep those feelings private?

FFS, can people not simply let people grieve how they want, and not have to "understand" it??

Sleepthief Wed 30-Jan-13 18:14:49

Maybe they want other people to remember the deceased person too? One of the hardest things for me was everyone else going back to normal after his funeral, where there was and always will be a huge dad-shaped hole in my life. He didn't want to die and he would want to be remembered. However, I don't really give a shit who likes what I post or otherwise. They can always ignore or defriend me.

GrowSomeCress Wed 30-Jan-13 18:15:15

I suppose you just have to accept the different ways people show grief.

But I really don't want people to be doing that when I die. I find the thought of people posting on my wall/posting on a RIP group after I've died very uncomfortable.

Criticising how people choose to grieve is crass and vile. I have contempt for you OP. If you had decent feeling you would ask mumsnet to take down this hurtful thread. How dare you respond like this. 'Grief is a private matter'. No it isn't. Grief shapes our lives, like love does and saying it must be hidden away is unspeakably cruel.
I have two friends who lost babies and both post about them on facebook on their birthdays. I am honoured to read those updates.

The dead can't read facebook but the living can. The living read mumsnet too and I know exactly what I think of you OP and some of the other stupid, hurtful posters on this thread. You're sharing webspace with bereaved people. Did you miss that? Or are you all just permanently lacking in sensitivity?

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 18:28:41

Poppadom, you missunderstand, if people who like celery KEPT putting it in your sarnies, would it bother you then?

I am not bothered by people doing it by themselves!, I AM bothered by being tagged, and doing it on walls or by posting photos of the dead person on their wall and tagging everyone who knew them, allows people to enforce THEIR way of grieving on everyone else. In a pm it'd just be them getting on with it IYKWIM

everlong Wed 30-Jan-13 18:31:13

I like your post northern sums it up really.

StuntGirl Wed 30-Jan-13 18:37:47

^"The dead can't read facebook but the living can.">

This. Just the physical act of putting it 'out there' helps those writing, and may help those reading.

When my friends post about their dead family members/friends I know they are hurting right now and I do what I can to help. Sometimes that's a nice message to them, sometimes it's just being aware of and accommodating their feelings, sometimes it's leaving them the hell alone. I'd do whatever I can do to help them when they're hurting. Because they're my friends and I love them.

DioneTheDiabolist Wed 30-Jan-13 18:43:36

Oldebaglady, I get it. You don't want to be a part of this. Therefore, you need to let people know how you feel and ask them not to tag you in.

Why do people do it?
1)To share the good times and their grief with others doing the same. This is widely recognized as being helpful to the bereaved.
2) To communicate their feelings to the deceased as well as others.
3) Because it's their wall and they can do as they wish.
4) For all the other good reasons put forward by posters on this thread.

You do not wish to share and that is your prerogative.
Others do. That is their's.

rubberducky24 Wed 30-Jan-13 18:46:08

so sorry to read some of the stories on this thread, has really made me cry. Whatever helps people deal with their grief is fine by me so OP YABU

Greensleeves Wed 30-Jan-13 18:47:08

I feel pissed off for all the posters who have lost loved ones - especially those who have lost their own children - who have had to read this bullshit angry

OP have you ANY IDEA how it feels to lose one of your kids? No? Neither have I. So how about shutting the hell up about things you know nothing about, and respecting others' right to express grief in any way that helps them. That way you might one day become a decent human being, rather than the haunted beef you currently are.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Wed 30-Jan-13 18:49:57

There are plenty of threads that upset me on MN that I wish the OP wouldn't have posted but they do - and other people post to the thread also. It seems that people pick and choose what offends them, which is fair enough.

I can understand why this thread is upsetting some posters but it's not really about dictating what a person can or can't do, or telling them how they must grieve, is it? I see this all the time, somebody posts an opinion which is unpopular and they're immediately slapped down but then the post is taken out of context and actually, that's unfair and not very honest. I don't see that OP is being disrespectful in giving his/her view on something that other people are also doing.

The facebook 'like' thing is odd. For a myriad of things, ie. "Johnny fell and broke his leg today"... and there are half a dozen 'likes'. To me that's odd. I don't care whether YOU think it's odd or not, I do - think what you like.

Don't call people names just because they have different views to you; nobody's telling you how to think or what to think. OP doesn't understand why people do this on Facebook. Frankly, I don't either but it doesn't bother me because I don't look. Have me as a friend in RL and you won't find anybody who will care about you more or support you more. The 'stopping judging' works on every level...

forgetmenots Wed 30-Jan-13 18:49:58

Nicely summed up northern.

Oldebaglady, to continue the metaphor, stop eating those sandwiches or letting those celery lovers make them! Unfriend or hide people whose updates you don't like.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 18:50:56

"Oldebaglady, I get it. You don't want to be a part of this. Therefore, you need to let people know how you feel and ask them not to tag you in."

I have repeatedly! particularly when it comes to anniversaries of the actual death - I may remember someone on their birthday or christmas in my own way, but I deliberately choose to forget the exact date of their death! I don't want to remember/mark that! However some people who do get annoyed by this as they want their remembering it to be a group activity, and I am repeatedly reminded every year of certain people's death anniversary even though I have asked not to be!

If people leave me out of it, their posts on deceased people's walls don't show up in my news feed because of my settings! but they don't leave me out of it! THEY want it to be a group thing!

to me it's like if I lived with someone who died and none of their mail was cancelled! every time something was delivered it'd be a reminder that they'd never open it! I feel the same about FB stuff they'll never see IYKWIM

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Wed 30-Jan-13 18:53:01

Greensleaves... how about you not telling others to shut up? You have no idea of anybody's background here unless you know them. Why are you posting on a thread that upsets you so much to read? You have a choice.

EIizaDay Wed 30-Jan-13 18:55:47

I think what the OP means, but hasn't said clearly, is the "Happy Birthday" bit. Am I correct OP?

I think the "remembering you" or "thinking of you" etc is different but I actually agree that saying "happy birthday" is a bit strange. Of course they, sadly, cannot have a happy birthday.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 18:56:07

Greensleeves, by definition, anyone being tagged/invited to FB RIP groups/posts/statuses has lost someone?? If they hadn't they wouldn't have seen them/been included in them in order to have an opinion on them right?

Greensleeves Wed 30-Jan-13 18:58:10

I was replying to OP and the second post - both of which were insensitive and nasty.

But if jumping down my throat serves a purpose for you, knock yourselves out - I am NOT one of the people who is being hurt by this ridiculous and offensive nonsense hmm

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Wed 30-Jan-13 19:00:40

Your post was pretty nasty, Greensleaves. <shrugs>

logitech56 Wed 30-Jan-13 19:04:32

thank you op for reminding me i hadnt told my father about my exam results yet, despite them having been out for 9 hours already.
FB is the only memoriam I have of him that means anything to me. It celebrates his life in a way that his gravestone never can. flowers cant, and none of the traditional ways of doing things can. If you dont like it, then ignore, just like we have to ignore ninety percent of the crap on the internet

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 19:04:41

Mum so very sorry about your son.. Please accept hugs however hollow from a stranger..

My dd is coming up to an anniversary of a fatal crash in which she and lots of her friends were badly injured. Her teacher died.

We will be marking the memory if him on Facebook, with flowered in RL and in fund raising. It helps her.

Nasty nasty post.

Saying Happy Birthday isn't strange.

I believe my son and daughter are in heaven, I believe they are together and I believe that they celebrate their birthdays together, although I don't have FB I do wish them 'Happy Birthday' every year and have 'gardens' for them on a memorial website. So yes, they can, imo, have a happy birthday. If I didn't believe that then I don't think I could have carried on.

I have known people to grieve in all different ways, I have known them celebrate their loved ones birthdays, to ignore them, to go out and get steaming drunk, to go on holiday, to sit at their graveside all day, to sit and write on FB, to laugh all day, to cry all day.... who the hell is anyone else to comment, pass judgement, or slag off the way people choose to get one second of feeling slightly less crappy at such a heartbreaking time.

NippyDrips Wed 30-Jan-13 19:07:37

In your defense op, I lost my mum 16 years ago, I was a child and my mum never had Facebook. My siblings all do the happy birthday nun status and I have never understood it. She doesn't have Facebook was my thoughts.

Having read this thread my eyes have been truly opened and I understand better now but your question is one that i have often asked myself.

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 19:08:00

I had a birthday party for my DD 10 days ago.
Her 21st. We had cakes and balloons and everything.
She died 7 years ago.

I wish her happy birthday, say goodnight to her and post her songs on FB.

Attention seeking RIPing?

Fuck off.

Just.fuck.off.

I have many bereaved friends. We all try our best to mark each other's children's birthdays.

I spell their names out LIKE THIS. Out loud.
Because we don't get to see our children's names written down or hear them because people want us to be quite and not bother them with our tiresome grief.

You know what?
Fuck that.

GoSuckEggs Wed 30-Jan-13 19:11:55

How about shut the fuck up and delete them from your FB if you are going to be such a twat about it.

It is nothing to do with you. Greif is not suppose to be anything, greif is excatly how you feel it. NO ONE CAN GREIVE WRONGLY. despite what idiots like you think.

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 19:12:48

MreDeVere,, anyone with any sense totally understands why you do this and of course anyone with any modicum of humanity and understanding totally supports you.

Love and hugs to you and all the bereaved parents on here.

You may not know us but lots of us are thinking of you. Xxx

Eliza - both my friends who lost babies never got a chance to see them open their eyes. They never heard them make a sound. All they have are graves, one has photos and the knowledge they carried them. If they want to wish them a happy birthday - or anything else - it's fine with me. It's ALL they can do. Those of us who have our children in our arms have no place, no place at all, to tell them what they should or should not do.

Lyingwitch - I don't buy the argument that we should just ignore the things that upset us. Why? I believe the OP is wrong. Very wrong. I think that the people who agree with her, who wish to push death and the grief of others away from them are wrong too. If I had ignored this thread then I have in some way let it stand, when I think it's wrong. Sod that for a game of soldiers.

i have posted 'Happy Birthday' type messages to my Dad on FB, he died when I was 18, over 20 years ago now. I have a large family, 5 siblings and various nephews and neices on fb and good friends who knew me (and him), we have shared memories and acknowleged Dad's bday and the anniversary of his death over the last few years. If the few, more recent acquaintances I have friended on fb find this weird they are welcome to hide my updates.

Grief is private, I have sobbed alone in my kitchen plenty, but sharing memories of a person you loved with friends and family who also knew and loved them is a great comfort. Death is not a dirty secret it is part of life, fb is a way of sharing your life so omitting grief because some people find it distasteful? hmm to that

VelvetSpoon Wed 30-Jan-13 19:15:47

judging the way people grieve is pretty fucking unpleasant tbh.

My parents died a long time ago, 19 and 15 years respectively, when I was in my early 20s. I was an only child. They were my only family (no grandparents). I think of them and miss them every day. I cannot imagine there ever being a time when I won't miss them. I don't talk about them much, it is so long ago only a couple of my current friends even knew them.

I update my status on FB at least once a day on average, with any manner of mundane shit. As such I don't think that twice a year (on their birthdays and the days they died) it's too unreasonable of me to post a status saying I am thinking of them, and that I miss and love them.

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 19:16:08

Northern, absolutely spot on.

EIizaDay Wed 30-Jan-13 19:16:23

What I find distasteful about this thread most of all is that someone has expressed a view which not everyone agrees with.

The posters on here being downright rude and aggressive to the OP would be the first ones to shout "bully" if they were being spoken to in the manner they have used to attack the OP.

Why don't you try calmly and gracefully to change someone's point of view instead of acting like fishwives and telling people to "f off"

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 19:18:15

"I think that the people who agree with her, who wish to push death and the grief of others away from them are wrong too."

why? why do I have to embrase someone else's way? why can't I be excluded from group FB grief if that's not my way? and yes I have hidden etc, but why should I delete people I am otherwise close to? surely they should respect that their way is not my way and please leave me out! but no! everyone has to "remember" at the same time in the same way!

Lots of posts saying "no wrong way to grieve"... then saying "you're wrong to not enjoy other people's way" - that is a contradiction!

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 19:20:03

because essentially all of you who think IABU are saying that my way of grieving is wrong!

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Wed 30-Jan-13 19:21:22

That's fair enough, NorthernLurker but the OP isn't actually dictating how anybody does anything or saying how they must grieve. She's saying, unless I've misunderstood, that she doesn't 'get' the 'happy birthday' on facebook and explained why. I read it - thought, well, I don't 'get' it either... but that's not saying that it's 'wrong' to post 'happy birthday' or anything else that they want to post.

For some people though, they have their own griefs over lost loved ones and to see people posting status updates is upsetting. Horses for courses.

Nobody is telling others they must not grieve or how they should be doing it. Where is this being picked up from? I certainly don't feel that I would have a right (or even a wish) to do that so if they're coming from my posts then I've written them very badly.

everlong Wed 30-Jan-13 19:24:07

God almighty. Eliza Have you any clue what it's like to lose a child?

Have you? I'd be very surprised if you have.

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 19:24:07

Oh please. The op was sneery and unpleasant.
She wasn't asking for views, she was being horrible about a sensitive subject.

Save your distaste for a person who mocks those who grieve in a way she find vulgar. Not only does she mock them, she accuses them of only doing it for the hugz and hunz.

She didn't ask why people might do it, she thinks she already knows.

I hope she never finds out how wrong she is.

Viviennemary Wed 30-Jan-13 19:25:23

People used to put birthday memories in local papers for loved ones. I didn't see the point of that I must say. But folk do like to remember the birthdays of loved ones. I always do but only privately. So facebook is just used for that and if it gives them comfort then fair enough.

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 19:25:23

Eliza I expect 'calm' and 'grace' arnt emotions generally associated with people when you loose a child. Do you?

Are you really calling a grieving mother a 'fishwife'. Shame on you.

I hope you never feel the utter terror of being told by police, like we were, that our dd was critically ill in a foreign country.

If you have no experience of either this or the death if a beloved child then please just shut the fuck up.

No-one has said that your way of grieving is wrong at all olde

There are many things you can do, you can change your settings so you can't get requests or tags or defriend the people who are upsetting you, or you can have a serious word and say that it upsets you.

Viviennemary Wed 30-Jan-13 19:27:13

I didn't read the whole thread so apologise if my post was insensitive.

SaggyOldPregnantCatpuss Wed 30-Jan-13 19:28:01

ChaosTrulyReignsWed 30-Jan-13 13:19:45

Surely anything that makes the grieving feel a tiny bit better is completely understandable and NotToBeJudged?

Let them be, please.
^^That. Everyone is different. If you dont like it, then dont look.

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 19:28:17

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Wed 30-Jan-13 19:30:12

usualsuspect... there are lots of sneery and nasty posts all over MN. You don't have the right to tell people to 'fuck off'. You have no idea of anybody elses circumstances or what they've gone through so best not to make assumptions, eh?

expatinscotland Wed 30-Jan-13 19:32:35

'I had a birthday party for my DD 10 days ago.
Her 21st. We had cakes and balloons and everything.
She died 7 years ago.'

And I baked a cake with my two kids, ages 4 and 7, for her and we all sang Happy Birthday because we couldn't make it to her party or we'd have been there! smile And put it on FB grin. We will do the same for their sister, who is also dead. Every single year.

A friend is having a party and raising money in our daughter's name. We shared it all on FB and the target's been exceeded grin. Yay! Money for a great charity.

Because they are loved people and people who are just as much worth of expression of that love as anyone else.

DioneTheDiabolist Wed 30-Jan-13 19:33:57

Oldebaglady, you've got it. People do this because they do want it to be a group thing. There is nothing wrong with this. I am sorry that your friend's do not respect your wishes. I would urge you to speak to them again and explain how strongly you feel about this.

Eliza, I think what upset people on this thread was not the fact that the OP doesn't understand such posts or even actively dislikes them, I think it was her assertion that they do so in order to to get sending you hugz Hun type messages.

Alisvolatpropiis Wed 30-Jan-13 19:35:02

It isn't something I do Op, I'm quite reserved (except on here essentially anonymously),but people on my Facebook do,it doesn't bother me. As somebody else said it's essentially a more modern form of the In Memoriam sections of newspapers,which still exist.

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 19:35:12

And the OP has no right to make assumptions about other people's grief.

vivizone Wed 30-Jan-13 19:39:27

op won't return. lol

vivizone Wed 30-Jan-13 19:40:08

I smell a name change coming on

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 19:44:03

exactly expat our children lived and they matter and we care.

x

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 19:46:14

Just read expat and MrsDeVere posts.

What else is there to say.

Thinking of all those on here who have lost precious children and count myself lucky every day.

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 19:49:22

I wonder are the posters who think it is odd to say Happy Birthday to a dead love one,
do you send jolly HAPPY CHRISTMAS!!! hope you have wonderful new year!!, and Have a fantastic birthday cards to bereaved people?

Because we love getting them hmm

Now that is fucking odd. Particularly in the first year.

We have all had them.

But yet again, it is the bereaved who are expected to tread carefully around the sensitivities of the non bereaved, lest we upset them. Remind them of their mortality or worse, the mortality of their children.

But of course if they were bereaved, they would do it SO much better than us.

Hulababy Wed 30-Jan-13 19:50:14

What an insensitive OP and also some insensitive posters thereafter!

How can you judge how someone grieves or remembers their lost family and friends?

Grief is not private. It has never been a private matter.

Why would you criticise what others do to help themselves deal with their own grief?

How can you not understand that some people just do things differently and accept that they are not you and there is no one right way to do things?

oldebaglady - I would ask them not to if it really bothered me or I would take myself away from the situation - i can;t really do the whole celery thing tbh - but in the case of FB - that means hiding a status, image or even a friend. Or I would just ignore - have to say that it doesn't occur daily or even weekly on the whole so not exactly hard to scroll past if you needed to surely?

exoticfruits Wed 30-Jan-13 19:51:26

It helps some people, which is all that matters- hide the posts if you don't like it.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 19:51:31

It's too late dione my friends and in particular family were determined that I remember death anniversaries so that we could remember them together that I now know em off by heart! they were well aware that it was the one thing I didn't want to remember about the people and they were reminded every year until it became pointless (as I then knew the dates I wanted to forget!)

It was not a case of them needing to be reminded, they KNEW and infact some were angry with me about it, one was close to furious as they "needed" me to remember it with them!

there's no wrong way to grieve, so long as you go with the group that is!

Wampingwillow Wed 30-Jan-13 19:53:07

Well I've been out all afternoon and never for one minute imaged the furore my post would cause. Firstly I said I didn't get the FB thing, me moi no one else I also posted earlier to say that obviously I'm in the minority as so many do get the whole fb thing. I wasn't trying to be offensive I was thinking of a particular person I know who posts happy birthday xyz when someone asks who xyz is as they've never heard of them the answer is often a relative who died long ago, and tbh I just don't see the point on her updates. I've never said that people shouldn't remember deceased relatives, everyone should do what they feel is appropriate to them. But equally the vitriol that being sent in my direction is really unpleasant.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 19:54:07

Hulababy honestly does noone read someones posts before directing replies to them? I have hidden them! I only see things I am tagged in or invited to

and it IS frequent

JustAHolyFool Wed 30-Jan-13 19:55:37

You know this reminds me of a lecturer we had at university. I didn't walk out and I should have, and I should have complained as well.

He was talking about some elegy and said "now isn't that a much better expression of grief than we manage these days. I mean, you go to a cemetery and all the dead children have teddy bear shaped graves. Is that really the only way the working classes have to express their grief?" He said the whole thing with a smug little look on his face.

Fucking cunt, eh?

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 19:56:27

You asked if they do it for the hugz type replies?

Do you not think that was an insensitive thing to post?

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 19:58:31

Yes agree he is a cunt.

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 19:58:47

You were being sneery and you know it.

People are being mean to you. Boo fucking hoo.

Hulababy Wed 30-Jan-13 19:59:21

oldebaglady - so change your FB settings so you cannot be tagged

nannyof3 Wed 30-Jan-13 19:59:25

People grieve differently

What business is it of yours?

Take the 'people' off ur news feed!!!

redpenmarks Wed 30-Jan-13 20:01:15

Tomorrow on my FB I shall put

RIP to all those who lost their lives in the sinking of the Princess Victoria 60 years ago today, especially xxx

And your issue is?

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 20:01:30

Not only is he a cunt, he is ignorant.

If he spent five minutes in any large cemetery he would find many, many children's memorials from decades ago. They might not be teddy bears but the Victorian equivalent, the weeping angel or the cherub.

Mind you, they wouldn't have been working class. In those days we had to shove our dead children in common graves, suck it up and get on with life.

Much the way some would have us do it today...

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 20:03:44

oh FGS hulababy I shouldn't have to!!

people should have the common sense to get that anyone who WANTS to join in with the facebook grief will have the groups and posts visable so no need to tag

they are tagging so that people who DON'T have the posts visable can see em.. err.. T.H.I.N.K. A.B.O.U.T. I.T......

JustAHolyFool Wed 30-Jan-13 20:04:25

Still happens, doesn't it MrsDV ? Weren't the Evening Standard doing a campaign to stop common burials?

Of course, it's fine to shit on the working classes, always has been.

Hulababy Wed 30-Jan-13 20:08:06

oldebaglady - no, you should't have to if you have asked people not to tag you. However, your friends have not taken this on board. Therefore you have two choices - allow it to continue and just not read them or make changes to your own settings so that they are unable to tag you. If your friends will not listen then surely you have to take your own action if it bothers you.

GirlOutNumbered Wed 30-Jan-13 20:12:15

Oldbaglady, just untag yourself. It takes seconds.

Sidge Wed 30-Jan-13 20:15:02

Last week was the 4th anniversary of my Dad's death.

I posted on FB that it was 4 years since he died and I was remembering him.

Did I do it for the hugz and hunz? Yeah, to a degree I did. My marriage broke down last year, my family live between 250 and 12,000 miles away. I live alone with my young children and had no-one to hug me, share my grief or to dry my tears.

Posting on FB was a way of sharing my grief with my friends and family who couldn't be there in person but who could give me 'virtual' support. I cherished every 'hugs' and 'xxx' post I got and won't apologise for that.

Enigmosaurus Wed 30-Jan-13 20:19:25

In April it will be my eldest daughter's 8th birthday. She was born and died on the same day. We will take cards and balloons to the cemetery. We'll sing happy birthday. I'll post on FB too. Not for shits and giggles, not for hugz or hunz, not for attention. I just like to acknowledge a life that was real but far, far too short. If it offends well tough shit. I have to live a lifetime of missing her with the entire world acting like she was nothing, for one day I will shout about her from the bloody rooftops.

Greensleeves Wed 30-Jan-13 20:22:08

Yes they are tagging you because they want you to share it, that's what social networking sites are about isn't it, sharing what is going on in our lives?

If spending a few seconds being aware of someone else's feelings is too big an ask for you, you've got bigger problems than not being able to work out how to use your privacy settings hmm

Its 31 years ago since one of my twin babies died (aged 7 months) and its 21 years ago since my DS3 (aged 7 years) was knocked down and killed by a lorry. I have friend requested them on FBook - every now and then I go on and think how crazy that may seem to others.....but, I dont care. Every birthday I write a full status to both of them - I tell them how much I love and miss them and how I would like to see them just one more time - even if just for a few minutes.

My twin baby didn't live long enough to have 'friends.' My DS3 had been to nursery and was in primary school. I love seeing his friends (now grown men with families of their own) writing on my status. 'Miss you, wish you were still here.....or 'Do you remember the time you kissed Becky at school and got in trouble from the teacher.' or 'Still forever in my thoughts, love Becky' - YABU OP - totally unreasonable.

I also put this song on every year (in fact several times per year) to celebrate my DS3's love of music and especially of this song....OP - hope you enjoy!!!

My lads song

thebody Wed 30-Jan-13 20:23:50

Just because someone had died it doesn't mean they have never lived op, never loved or been loved.

Commemorate and celebrate their lives.

It just is a mark of respect and love and reminder of them.

Why not.

purpleflower123 Wed 30-Jan-13 20:24:54

I saw this and thought it might be about me sad I posted a picture of my mum today. It's 13 years since I lost her when I was 13 1/2.

I miss her everyday, just one day of the year I say it out loud to all of my friends and family.

I asked my dds about this thread in the car just now. Dd1 is nearly 15 and her view was that it didn't bother her what people put on facebook and 'facebook is for sharing your thoughts, if that's your thoughts (about a person who has died) then you should post it'. I think she is absolutely right.

Op - never mind bleating about the response you've got. I think the phrase you're groping for is 'I'm repeat that I'm sorry about this thread. I have been thoughtless and offensive. I've learned something from this thread.'

5madthings Wed 30-Jan-13 20:29:05

Surely anything that makes the grieving feel a tiny bit better is completely understandable and NotToBeJudged?

Let them be, please.

This from chaos on p1 and what northernlurkersaid on p4.

What a bloody vile, insensitive op.

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 20:30:03

Say it out loud, purple.

Say it as many times as you want x.

Purple rosemary for remembrance for your mum.

frustratedworkingmum Wed 30-Jan-13 20:36:19

What a narrow minded OP

There are many many attention seeking posts on FB and you don't have to comment on them - i am far more annoyed by "oh my life is perfect today I had a perfect day with my perfect family doing perfect things because i am a perfect mother with a perfect home and perfect hair, my dog is perfect to, in fact i have the best life in the world" type shit.

An expression of grief that you share with friends that may not have remembered the date of someone's passing or birthday elicits support and shared memories. I posted something about my dad once and one of the guys who he worked with who i only really knew vaguely posted a lovely memory about the laughs they used to have at work. It probably didn't mean that much to the guy who responded but it helped me so much to know that people remembered my dad and tht he was so well thought of.

OliviaMumsnet (MNHQ) Wed 30-Jan-13 20:47:58

PEACE AND LOVE

FreePeaceSweet Wed 30-Jan-13 20:48:15

'people enjoy getting attention from RIPing on the internet '

Wrong. Wrong. Wrong.

I lost my wonderful dad when I was 9. I am now 34 and I'm not ashamed to say that not a day goes by when I don't think of him. I don't often post sentimental stuff on FB but I like to think that if and when I do those who want to be supportive are and those who don't can shut the fuck up. I get no pleasure from reminiscing about my dad but remembering him helps me. I'm certainly not looking for attention. sad

DioneTheDiabolist Wed 30-Jan-13 20:54:12

Oldebaglady I am sad that your family and friends don't respect your right to grieve as you see fit. They are as insensitive to you as the OP is to those who do need to share their experiences.

And similarly I think they should be taken to task foe the upset they cause, just as has happened with the OP.

People should be free to grieve as they see fit without others making them feel worse at a very difficult time.

Growlithe Wed 30-Jan-13 21:02:21

I'm strangely comforted when my DBro mentions my Mum and Dad on FB. He doesn't speak of them much in RL you see, or visit their grave on anniversaries and birthdays.

I used to think he didn't care before he joined FB. Now I know better. I think he probably finds it easier when he's not face to face with us.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 21:03:51

"If spending a few seconds being aware of someone else's feelings is too big an ask for you, you've got bigger problems than not being able to work out how to use your privacy settings"

why doesnt it work the otherway? why can't they spend a few seconds considering who they are about to tag? It takes more than a few seconds to forget about it once you've been tagged by someone who should know better AGAIN

forgetmenots Wed 30-Jan-13 21:08:29

It does work the other way oldebaglady. I'm sorry your friends are disrespectful of your wishes. YABU that this means all such posts on FB are wrong!

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 21:11:29

I don't know why they need to tag you oldbaglady. I have never done that although I post a lot about DD on FB.

Sometimes I set up an event and invite people but I wouldn't tag them in a post.

That isn't why I post about her. I do it for me. If others want to join in it brings me comfort but I wouldn't force them by tagging them.

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Wed 30-Jan-13 21:11:46

Eliza - because the OP has said herself that she isn't interested in having her pov changed, she just threw the grenade and ran... leaving a lot of bereaved people upset. You can't be 'rude and agressive' to thin air...

usualsuspect Wed 30-Jan-13 21:16:42

I can't believe someone reported MrsDVs post.

I'm not bothered that mines been deleted but pretty low to report MrsDVs.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

FreePeaceSweet Wed 30-Jan-13 21:21:48

Also some of my dad's family with held details about his death and funeral from me and my siblings. I have no idea where he is buried or whether he was cremated. All I can do is light a candle when I'm feeling low. I'm 34 and have little fantasies that he might still be alive somewhere as in my mind I have no proof that he died.

feministefatale Wed 30-Jan-13 21:25:24

I don't get it, but surely funerals are the same or memorials or those memorials in the paper? Its for the bereaved not the person who died.

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 21:26:27

So the description of my DD's birthday has been deleted.
The OP stands. The 'attention seeking' posts stands.

But my DD has been wiped off.

How was that a personal attack?

I hope you are all proud of yourselves.

Nice one.

feministefatale Wed 30-Jan-13 21:26:41

I don't get it, but surely funerals are the same or memorials or those memorials in the paper? Its for the bereaved not the person who died.

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Wed 30-Jan-13 21:28:10

FreePeaceSweet - you could find out now where he's burried if you wanted to (in the UK at least).

I'm not surprised you have those thoughts, what they did to you was cruel and I suspect as you still don't know, it wasn't done in a misguided way with your best interest at heart sad

It wasn't a personal attack Mrs D. <<sigh>> I dont get MN sometimes - really dont xxxxxx

MrsD I'm shocked and disgusted your post got deleted sad

MyHeadWasInTheSandNowNot Wed 30-Jan-13 21:33:53

MrsDV sad Pretty crap isn't it. I don't know what you said, I think it might have ended in 'off' though? Apparently we aren't even allowed to tell utter imbiciles to Fuck Off now sad

I think what you do on Billie's birthday is lovely smile I think of her on her birthday every year, her birthday is sandwiched between two in our family x

5madthings Wed 30-Jan-13 21:37:08

gray lady I have fob set up so I am notified if I am tagged and I can then choose to ha be it stand iyswim? Have a look at your settings.

mrsdevere I didn't see the post about Billies bday bit would have loved to have read about your special day for her xxxx

FreePeaceSweet Wed 30-Jan-13 21:43:13

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 21:43:17

"YABU that this means all such posts on FB are wrong!"

again with the not reading posts before directing replies about them!! my very first post said that the posts don't bother me so long as I'm not tagged in them but that apparently made me a low life because "there's no wrong way to grieve".. so long as it's the same way as the majority of the posters and not they way I perfer to do it (i.e. by myself)!!

Sparklyblue Wed 30-Jan-13 21:43:57

My brother died at the age of 27 two weeks ago, I find it very comforting reading his FB page, seeing how much he was loved by all his friends and our family on his wall.
I have wrote on his wall too and will probably do so on his birthday.
If it helps people, then what is the harm?

OliviaMumsnet (MNHQ) Wed 30-Jan-13 21:44:37

MEA CULPA Mrs DV.
We have reinstated your post.
May I reiterate my earlier request of peace and love

MrsDeVere Wed 30-Jan-13 21:50:59

Thank you OliviaMN.

Follyfoot Wed 30-Jan-13 21:57:13

Today is my lovely late Dad's birthday. I may or I may not commemorate his birthday on Facebook. Or maybe I'll do it on here....

But you know what (and I'm not normally a swearer on here) I find your "Is it just so they can get loads of 'sending you hugz Hun' messages and while we are at it why to people like the status' comment" fucking insulting. Its about me remembering someone so special in my life and wanting to mark what used to be a special day for my family.

Happy Birthday Dad wine

feministefatale Wed 30-Jan-13 21:59:06

Old bag seems to just be responding to rude posts. Greensleves especially, why shouldn't her right to grieve her way be respected

mrsjay Wed 30-Jan-13 21:59:35

I have friend s who have lost parents etc and they are bloody sad facebook is all about attention perhaps they just need to air how they are feeling, If people were not attention seeking to a degree there would be no facebook, and tbh I wouldn't do it but it is their facebook and they can wish whoever they want a happy birthday ,

neveronamonday Wed 30-Jan-13 22:03:39

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

zeronilnowt Wed 30-Jan-13 22:07:14

What a mean and ill thought out OP.

Would you have had a go at your Grandmother for posting a memorial notice in the paper about her husband?

Incase you are interested, I post about my mum because I feel it is the only way I can. She killed herself 20years ago next month, I was a teenager. She never saw me become an adult, a mother, a wife, so yes I do get something out ofwriting about her on birthdays Mothers Days and anniversaries (you would hate me even more, she has 3, yes 3 anniversaries of the day she died -is that ok with you? Shrove Tuesday - which changes every year, the day she died and the day we found her)

Most years I put a simple "thinking of you mum" status but last year I put a longer one. I think it was funny yet heartfelt, about if she was here she would be interfering and pissing me off and taking over, it made me smile to remember her like that, it made my family and her friends smile to remember her like that - as a real person and not someone who became a saint just because she died. I also posted how we would eat her infamous fucking awful pasta dish in memory of her - is that ok with you?

I don;t put a notice in the paper (DH still does for his mum even though she died when he was 10 - it his way and I accept that) for one it is soo bloody expensive and I know mum would kick my arse for wasting money doing it also I don;t know anyone who reads the local paper anymore, nor do I have a grave where I can lay flowers. So FB is what I have and is what I will continue to use. And screw anyone who thinks it is attention seeking.

Sorry about the rant (blush)

Altinkum Wed 30-Jan-13 22:13:01

So do you take the same stance with gone too soon OP also, after all its a public website for all to see.

If not why not?

mrsbunnylove Wed 30-Jan-13 22:13:56

you still want to talk to them, even if they aren't available in the way they used to be.
i think that's probably behind it.

forgetmenots Wed 30-Jan-13 22:15:47

I did read it oldebaglady, I may not have been clear. I meant all such posts even if you are tagged in them. Once you asked not to be, that should have been respected. When it wasn't you should unfriend, or hide them.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 22:20:42

well sorry I disagree! I think before tagging anyone in a post about someone who has died the poster should give a second thought to who they're tagging and why they are tagging them

once again, anyone who wants to be involved, won't NEED to be tagged as they'll have the page on their feed! So if you think about it, tagging it will only bring it to the attention of people who have set their FB so they are not involved, as anyone who hasn't hidden the page will see it anyway even if not tagged!

So I think a second thought is appropriate, even if you haven't been asked not to by any of the potential tagees yet!

By all means post it, but tagging I think should involve some consideration when it comes to sensitive issues!

5madthings Wed 30-Jan-13 22:23:31

If you don't want to be tagged yhedn either tell the person tagging you that or change your settings on Feb so you can't be tagged its quite simple smile

5madthings Wed 30-Jan-13 22:23:46

Fb not Feb...

Tigerbomb Wed 30-Jan-13 22:25:56

My xDH wasn't on facebook - so me and his kids created a page for him. People put photo's up so that we could share our memories of him

He has only been gone 12 months but god we miss him every second of the day. We couldnt afford a grave site to go and visit so a Fb page is our memorial.

We "talk" to him on his page - happy Birthday, merry Christmas etc - his friends do too - it's a way we still connect with each other even though the main connection is no long here

I dont give a Flying fuck if other people dont ... in fact I dont give a flying fuck - full stop. This thread has been really upsetting.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 22:29:00

I have no problem with "normal" tagging

tagging someone into something about someone close to them who has died should warrant a second thought about whether it's something they might like or not! it's not hard to tell - have they previously posted similar stuff? if no, then they probably won't like it! do just don't! the people who want to share it with you will see it and reply anyway!

it's like photos of other people's kids, if they don't have any pics of their own kids on their profile, they probably won't like you posting pics of their kids! I don't see why people can't give these things a second's thought before they get tagging/posting diarrhoea!

SaintVera Wed 30-Jan-13 22:30:16

Going slightly off-piste here, I wish we had a day of the dead in our culture. I would like to be with others in collective grief, as I remember my beautiful son who died in July.

Death gets hidden away in our society. That is the thing that is wrong, not the Facebook tributes. We all of us grieve one day...

olde why don't you go and tell the people who are doing it again instead of going on and on and on about it here. No-one has disagreed with you, many people have given suggestions which you are dismissing. Whats the point in arguing with everyone here when we arent the ones doing it?

5madthings Wed 30-Jan-13 22:33:19

Or you van change your settings to be notified of tagging and then allow it or not our tell the person who is annoying you by tagging you not to do it.

Its not massively relevant to this op tho which quite frankly was poorly thought out and us massiuvely insensitive.

Maybe whoever is tagging you is just clicking tag on a group you are in is friends and or family and is not thinking that much or maybe they think you would like to see it? If you haven't told therm not to tag you you cant expect them to be psychic.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 22:33:58

"olde why don't you go and tell the people who are doing it again instead of going on and on and on about it here"

FFS how many times... I HAVE TOLD THEM!!!!
If you're going to reply directly so someone at least read their posts first!

SaintVera Wed 30-Jan-13 22:34:08

oh, and Tiger, you are quite right. When my XP died 20 years ago, we couldn't afford a grave. It is difficult for our DD not having a grave to visit and difficult for me. It might have been more comforting for us if FB had existed then

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 22:36:21

"Maybe whoever is tagging you is just clicking tag on a group you are in is friends and or family"
well they shouldn't IMO!

"No-one has disagreed with you" - err, yes they have!

5madthings Wed 30-Jan-13 22:37:24

Well delete or block them then you have plenty if options but moaning about it on here wont help and actually seems insensitive to people who have been upset by this thread IMO.

rayeames Wed 30-Jan-13 22:37:58

I hate it. My Dad died a couple of years ago. My aunt now acts like Dad (her brother) never existed and has cut my Mum out of her life (e.g. she'll invite the family over but not my Mum). But on FB she is always posting those generic 'I'm lighting a candle for someone I love' posts on significant dates. It really pisses me off that she does all the 'pay attention to my grief' stuff on FB but isn't a decent person in RL. Maybe she has coloured my views a bit, but I think even in less extreme cases public displays of grief can be upsetting for those who prefer to grieve privately but whose emotions run just as deep.

no-one has said you should be tagged and you shouldn't be upset about getting tagged in posts when you have asked not to be (unless I missed one somewhere) many people have given you helpful suggestions with you more or less saying 'why should I'. confused You are making your point (over and over again) to the wrong people.

Also olde I did read your post, you will note I used the word again - maybe you shoud read the posts you are directly quoting.

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 22:44:40

forgetmenots posted that its okay to tag without thinking twice unless you have been asked not to

I disagree and think a moment's thought is apt before tagging someone on a post about a dead person, and tagging whole groups without thinking about it is selfish!

oldebaglady Wed 30-Jan-13 22:45:59

argh! I DID read it

didn't you read that I said I had told them REPEATEDLY? that means I told them "again!"

ffs hmm

Yes I did, so tell them again, there is no point ranting at us, we aren't doing it, forget was quite sympathetic to your distress at being tagged from what I can see.

expatinscotland Wed 30-Jan-13 22:56:57

There's a block function on FB.

I will sometimes post something on Facebook about a relative I found dead when I was a young teenager. Over 10 years on and I still struggle to contain the grief and sometimes writing it on Fb helps me, it's cathartic writing a message to a loved one.

On the other hand, I never post about my daughter. That is my inward grief.

I would never wish to belittle someone's right to grieve how they feel they need to. Grief is personal, not private.

fioled Wed 30-Jan-13 23:35:52

Things that have struck me on this thread:

MrsDV "But yet again, it is the bereaved who are expected to tread carefully around the sensitivities of the non bereaved, lest we upset them. Remind them of their mortality or worse, the mortality of their children."

SaintVera "Death gets hidden away in our society. That is the thing that is wrong, not the Facebook tributes."

Yup, that and everything NorthernLurker has said. Pretty much sums up how I'm feeling tonight between this shite and nonsense I've been involved with elsewhere about the lack or warning about bereaved parents and rainbow babies on OBEM.

Apparently my life needs a warning sticker and I shouldn't mention my dead child on FB...

expatinscotland Thu 31-Jan-13 00:52:12

We have celebrations, bake cakes and have picnics . . . for dead people. Even years after they've died. Yes, the whole family, even my little kids, ages 7 and 4. We have picnics at their sister's grave and let off balloons for other, dead children she knew from her unit when we can't make it to their services. I post photos of this on FB, too! I posted photos of my kids on a memorial bench created for their dead sister.

Sometimes my 7-year-old finds it hard to fall asleep and talks about her dead sister. I tell her she is still her sister, and that she loves her very much, and to never, ever be afraid of feeling her for that reason and to listen to her if she can hear her. She sleeps with the last school photo of her sister, the two of them taken together.

She grows up understanding that everyone dies, some younger than others, and that death is part of life, and there is nothing shameful about it and nothing to be hidden about it and that if she encounters people who tell her otherwise, that they are wrong.

forgetmenots Thu 31-Jan-13 07:52:26

Oldebaglady - no, I said people can tag you and should then respect it if you ask not to be. I didn't suggest it was done without thought. They maybe thought you would very much appreciate it - who knows? No one (as far as I can see) thinks you're being unreasonable to ask not to be tagged, or that they being fair by continuing to do so. After they've disrespected your expressed wishes, then of course YANBU. You can block/unfriend/ask again, whatever you think appropriate. The first time it happens though it's not fair to assume thoughtlessness or malice, but afterwards they should listen to you and not tag. Everyone's rights respected, and only minor inconvenience and awkwardness caused?

Anyway - I really (honestly) hope you've dealt with the people who are doing this either way, so you can all get on with grieving.

forgetmenots Thu 31-Jan-13 07:52:58

(Was means to be thanks at the end there blush)

forgetmenots Thu 31-Jan-13 07:56:21

Fioled by the way I completely agree about OBEM - not helpful at all sad

ssd Thu 31-Jan-13 08:13:59

do you know what op, the worst thing when someone you love dies is the feeling everyone else has forgotten them, except you and you are stuck in a limbo grieving for someone who was huge in your life and no one else is bothering

I'd love a fb page for my mum with messages randomly left by people who knew her and I wouldnt grudge anyone that at all

I honestly don't get why some people find this hard to grasp. I have three children and I adore them of course. If, God forbid, one of them dies before me and my friends and family stop mentioning them it would repeatedly break my heart. It's unbearable. It only takes an ounce of imagination to to work that through and put yourself in that place. I don't find it very easy to mention my friends lost children but you know what - a couple of times a year I can manage it. That's not a lot to ask from people is it?

ssd Thu 31-Jan-13 08:15:38

in fact I go on fb all the time in the hope someone has mentioned my mum (relatives all live far away)

but its never happened

I'm closing fb because of this, it brings me nothing but pain

When James died, FB was a way for all of us to express our collective shock and grief.

We all post on his wall as a way of keeping him close and his memory alive.

I love my son, I can't hug him on his birthday, christmas, easter whatever. I can't tell him about a film I have seen that he would love. I can't tell him good/bad/trivial news because he isn't here. I can't talk to him about music or a gig we have been to. His brother can't talk to him about girls/love/life etc.

We put these things on FB, because we can, because it is the only way we can 'connect' with him.

If the OP doesn't get that, then lucky her. She obviously has her children here, she can hold them, talk to them and tell them she loves them.

I wish I didn't have to post on FB to tell my son how much he means to me. I wish he was here for me to tell him.

I am sorry that my loss and grief offends you, but its my life now, it is the life of everyone who has lost a loved one. I will keep James' memory alive for as long as I live. I don't actually care who that offends if I am being honest. Not having James here is a much bigger offence in my very humble opinion.

Just because someone had died it doesn't mean they have never lived op, never loved or been loved

the body has nailed it for me. My mum was such a beautiful soul and I never ever want her to be forgotten!!

ratspeaker Thu 31-Jan-13 09:25:30

mumof2teenboys my deepest sympathy
One of my son's friends died suddenly last year, his page is still active.
I feel the FB page gives them an outlet for their grief and a way of remembering someone who was important to them, who touched their lives. I feel it is an important way to work through their feelings of loss, many can say things in FB about how bereft they feel that they wouldn't normally say in conversation.

OP as has been said, visiting graves, lighting candles, announcements in newspaper personal columns have all been used in the past as memorials.
FB is just the modern equivalent.

OP you dont need to read or respond to posts on FB if you dont want.

You dont have the right to sit in judgement over how people feel grief and you seriously lack empathy

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Thu 31-Jan-13 10:29:34

I've come back to this thread because I've been thinking about it since yesterday and it's bothering me. It's true, we do seem to have a 'closed' culture to death in the UK. I don't know that it was always so; I've seen films and documentaries about the preservation of memories (particularly of children) and I can understand that completely. A poster further up the thread mentioned that it would be a good idea to have a 'Day of the Dead'; a proper remembrance and celebration of loved ones not with us now and I completely agree with that. We have "All Souls' Day" but it's not the same kind of thing.

I have antipathy towards Facebook having seen it always as competitive attention-seeking, on every subject - but it just a public medium for communication when I really think about it. I don't see every post or every wall and it's clear that it's unfair to make a judgement based on the tiny number of walls I've seen. I'm sorry that I did that because it's caused pain to posters on this thread and my going on about 'being free to grieve as you like' doesn't then sit very well then with my clouded judgements about Facebook.

I've peeped into the 'Bereavement' board many times, particularly when a poster mentions something here on AIBU, and it never fails to make me sad for the posters there. I'm a 'blotting out' kind of person and for me, it enables me to function but I don't actually think it's healthy. Keeping a tight control of my emotions is something I've always done, perhaps because I'm afraid of what might happen if I didn't? I don't know.

Anyway, I've posted back to clarify really, to say that there isn't one post here - or on the bereavement board - describing what the posters and their families do to get through their grief and keep their loved ones 'alive', that doesn't resonate. I would do ANYTHING to have the time back, I can't, nobody can, so what is left to do? I've smiled - and wept - at some of the descriptions of what posters here do - and their strength in posting about it. If I didn't obviously have a pole up my bum about death, I'd embrace it too and stop being so stuffy.

I really am sorry for any offence that I caused with my posts,

Lyingwitch - I know it's not very mumsnet but may I offer you a <<hug>>? What a heartfelt post. There's always loose ends and things not said. We just have to live on alongside that.

VinegarTits Thu 31-Jan-13 10:53:56

wow - op there are some things that should be left in your head and not actually said out loud, this is one of them

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe Thu 31-Jan-13 11:06:29

Very kind of you, NorthernLurker, gratefully received and reciprocated, thank you. thanks

wigglesrock Thu 31-Jan-13 18:45:04

We have Cemetery Sunday once a year (thankfully now moved from November to June) where everyone who wants to goes to a loved ones grave on a particular Sunday. Its a religious thing - Bishop is there - says a few decades (dependent on the weather), of the Rosary, a few prayers, blesses the graves. We always went - from the age of 4/5 - both my parents Dads died very young and we have loads of relatives. It sounds really morbid but its not.

I go with my friend to her daughters grave and its so important to her, that her baby was here, that she has a name and a birthday, grandparents, siblings. Other posters have said it much better than me but my friends pain is so visceral that anything that gives her comfort can't be judged.

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