to have fed my baby here?

(1000 Posts)
ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:08:35

Went shopping yesteerday.ds1. Jas a blu badge so we parked in a disabled space.went to shops and back to car couple of hours later. We have 4 dcs and the baby 7 mths started screaming and was hungry.by then the car park was packd. I started to feed ds while dh got other dcs in car and an elderly couple drove past and politely asked if we were leaving, dh said sorry not yet then 2 other drivers did the same but the fourth stopped got out and said please could we hurry up, I explained that when I had fed ds we would be going but she was really angry and said a disabled space is not just for sitting in that we should go immediately. I was only another ten mins fding ds it is hard enough going out as all dcs have same condition and ds2 was really screaming I had to feed him as it was a long drive home. Was I being unreasonable?

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:10:23

Sorry for lack of paragraphs and bad spelling-on blackbrry and half the keys are 'sticky'

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:10:24

Sorry for lack of paragraphs and bad spelling-on blackbrry and half the keys are 'sticky'

Well they're being illogical to com

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 11:11:15

no...its non of her business how long you will be in the parking space

Blue badges allow cars to be used as a 'refuge' as well as a transport method so yanbu at all.

quietlysuggests Mon 03-Dec-12 11:15:06

I would have pulled out of the spot and double parked to feed the baby.
You could easily doublepark where as someone coming at the start of their shop cannot.
So I dont think you were very considerate really.
Especially as you had your husband with you, why could you not just sit and feed and let your DH pull out and free up the space?

choceyes Mon 03-Dec-12 11:15:19

no YANBU in my opinion. What if you had gone into the shops to feed the baby instead? Your DH and DCs would still have to be waiting for you won't they and taking up the space? Can't see what else you could have done.

pELFicFloorClenchReminder Mon 03-Dec-12 11:15:56

YANBU - Agree it's none of her business. A screaming baby is more important than someone getting to a shop. And driving with a screaming baby is extremely stressful and probably dangerous!

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:17:06

I did not know they could also be used as a 'refuge' I did feel very vulnerable with somebody so irate with me whilst I was bf and other dcs in car.would have fed ds in a shop but h gets so distracted and over tired the dark in car park calmed him down enough after screaming to feed untill I got shouted at !

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:17:08

I did not know they could also be used as a 'refuge' I did feel very vulnerable with somebody so irate with me whilst I was bf and other dcs in car.would have fed ds in a shop but h gets so distracted and over tired the dark in car park calmed him down enough after screaming to feed untill I got shouted at !

CwtchesAndCuddles Mon 03-Dec-12 11:19:11

Sorry - as a blue badge holder I think you were unreasonable to stay there to feed, I would have moved the car so that others needing the space could have it.

I would have be annoyed if I needed that space.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:19:22

Couldn't double park-was multi storey and w would have been in the one way lane blocking every car from driving past

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:19:29

YANBU because if you had stayed inside longer in order to feed in the cafe etc then you would have vacated the space at the same time as you did by feeding in the car - possibly longer if you ordered coffees etc in order to sit in the cafe

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 11:19:34

YABU. If the car park was packed then you were preventing a disabled driver from being able to do their shopping. I agree that you could have double parked or could you not have breastfed while DH drove the car?

threesocksfullofchocs Mon 03-Dec-12 11:19:55

yabu
you should have moved

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:20:50

"YABU. If the car park was packed then you were preventing a disabled driver from being able to do their shopping."
?? but so was everyone else who was parked in the disabled spaces.. and they might have been having a REALLY leisurely lunch themselves before meandering back with a bit of window shoppping - which is not UR either!

toofattorun Mon 03-Dec-12 11:20:52

I can see both sides. I would say that if there were other spaces, I would have driven into another space but as you say, there were no spaces so I don't think YWBU.

Sorry, don't know what happened there.

Well they're being illogical to comPlain really, because if you'd fed in a supermarket cafe you'd actually take just as long, if nOt longer by the time you'd sat down, fed, then gone back to your space. Not sure how you could've pointed that out though!

SantaWearsGreen Mon 03-Dec-12 11:20:59

I do think yabu actually.

You could have driven nearer the exit and stayed there to feed. Didn't need to keep a limited space that people needed.

pELFicFloorClenchReminder Mon 03-Dec-12 11:21:05

Breastfeed a baby in a moving car?? confused

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:21:34

"YABU. If the car park was packed then you were preventing a disabled driver from being able to do their shopping."
?? but so was everyone else who was parked in the disabled spaces.. and they might have been having a REALLY leisurely lunch themselves before meandering back with a bit of window shoppping - which is not UR either!

Pootles2010 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:23:51

YANBU - can't believe people think she should bf whilst dh drives! Slightly dangerous?!

IIWY I would have told them I was waiting for someone else to get back to the car - I do that sometimes when people start getting glarey at me when I'm sitting in my car eating a sandwich, writing a text, whatever, when a car park is busy. But anyway, YANBU.

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 11:24:51

exactly twelve...plenty of spaces being occupied whilst mothers feeding babies in Starbucks, or feeding own face...

it is not the womens business what OP does whilst parked

OP shouldnt occupy space to feed baby, but should vacate so that other woman can park up and go shopping?? confused

Mrskbpw Mon 03-Dec-12 11:25:38

I don't think you were BU, but I'm shocked at the suggestion you should have fed the baby in a moving car. Surely very dangerous? Unless you can somehow feed them in a car seat, while strapped in yourself?!

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:26:41

I couldn't possibly feed ds whilst dh driving is that even allowed ? Sounds v dangerous. Any other car park w could jave double parked or moved but ev space occupied and nowhere to move to at all

squeakytoy Mon 03-Dec-12 11:27:45

I agree that you should have moved to a non-disabled space if you were going to simply be sat in the car. It would be frustrating for someone trying to park who needs to then get out of their car to get to their destination. You didnt need to get out of your car after feeding, so could have parked in any other space.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 11:27:54

I cannot believe someone has suggested you feed whilst the car was moving! Utter madness! And illegal!

Yanbu. Disabled spaces are available on a first come first served basis, just like any other space.

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 11:28:55

?? but so was everyone else who was parked in the disabled spaces.. and they might have been having a REALLY leisurely lunch themselves before meandering back with a bit of window shoppping - which is not UR either! [quote].

The point is, though, that they had finished in the shopping centre, could see the carpark was packed and they were taking up a disabled space to feed the baby. Once people started stopping and asking them if they were moving I think it would have been considerate to just move the car. If DH was driving there was nothing to stop OP from feeding the baby and the disabled space would have been freed up for another disabled driver.

WeAreSix Mon 03-Dec-12 11:29:09

Never, ever breast feed in a moving car. What an utterly ridiculous suggestion.

Tailtwister Mon 03-Dec-12 11:29:22

I don't think it's feasible or legal to bf a baby in a moving car!

YANBU OP. Double parking wasn't an option in your location and it's not really anyone's business how long you were taking. If you had stayed in the shopping centre to feed then your car would still have been taking up the space anyway.

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:31:39

no Janeatthebarre, not feeding in the car wouldn't free up the space, it would take it up for longer because the only reasonable alternative would be to get everyone back out again and head off to the cafe for however long the feed plus everyone's drinks took. So the space would be occupied for longer!

There are not convenient "pull in" lay-by type areas in any multistory car parks I've been in!

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 11:31:51

Apologies. I didn't make myself clear. I meant DH could move the car to another location and then OP could feed baby while DH would be there to move car if it was causing an obstruction or somesuch.

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:34:12

move it to where? presumably if they have a blue badge they need it, so not reasonable to expect the DH to go park it else where

they weren't causing an obstruction, they were in a designated parking space

TooManyDicksOnTheDancefloor Mon 03-Dec-12 11:34:49

YANBU, i can't believe some of the comments on this thread. Feed a baby who isn't strapped into a car seat whilst the car is being driven? Does it matter if the OP was in the car feeding the baby or in a cafe feeding the baby? The space is still being used either way.

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 11:36:29

True, I was probably a bit quick to jump in with my YABU. I suppose I was thinking of the other disabled drivers because I remember how awkward it used to be for my father if there were no spaces free, but I can see if the baby was screaming the OP didn't have much choice.
Apologies OP. YANBU.

ISeeThreadPeople Mon 03-Dec-12 11:37:38

I feed ds all the time while ds is driving. grin

squeakytoy Mon 03-Dec-12 11:37:48

"move it to where? presumably if they have a blue badge they need it, so not reasonable to expect the DH to go park it else where"

move it out of the disabled space. of course it is reasonable to park anywhere else if you are not going to be getting out of the car!

ChaoticforlifenotjustChristmas Mon 03-Dec-12 11:40:00

According to the OP all the other spaces were occupied. To double park would have inconvenienced everybody else.

YANBU

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:40:06

I don't have a blue badge, but have "taken up" many a parking space while feeding DS. Costa/starbucks is expensive! espeically if you're only spending money in there so that you can sit down for a feed! Noone else could park in my space while I was there and noone ever complained!

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:41:47

squeakytoy, the car park was full! moving would have meant moving out of the car park or blocking everyone!

EldritchCleavage Mon 03-Dec-12 11:44:21

I don't understand the mentality that says if you sit in your car in a car park you are unfairly depriving someone of a space, but if you leave the car to go off you aren't. The effect is the same-the space is occupied.

YANBU, OP. DH and I have had the same reaction when I bf'ed in the car. It is no one's business why I fed in the car and not elsewhere, and no one's business really that we are sitting in the car in the car park. As long as you are doing something immediately necessary that you couldn't do while driving, you are not being unreasonable doing it in your parking space (I say 'immediately necessary' to exclude e.g. knitting a jumper/reading newspaper cover to cover/putting nail varnish on which you should probably go and do at home).

StuckOnTopOfTheChristmasTree Mon 03-Dec-12 11:47:18

This is probably a symptom of the crazy period that is upon us - everyone wants to get to the shops with minimum fuss but its just not possible because of the time of year - and people are getting frazzled with car parks being full to brimming and they can't get a space - and the problem is with all spaces, disabled and regular.
In my view YANBU - you had a spot and you are free to use that spot as long as you are entitled to. Its not like you were doing something frivolous to prevent that space being freed up. The alternative option of feeding in the shops would have taken longer as well as being more difficult given your situation and hence the fact you are entitled to the blue badge.
Unfortunately this situation and similar ones are going to keep repeating over the next few weeks because the crowds are just going to get bigger and people are going to increasingly be more stressed. Very few seem to cope or behave well, which just leads to an ever growing circle of stress that people pay out to each other. The only answer is to take deep breaths and try and have a little circle of calm around you and your family, even if everyone else has gone crazy!

BatCave Mon 03-Dec-12 11:47:22

It is possible to feed a baby strapped into their carseat while you are belted yourself, just lean over grin it's not ideal granted.

Anyway, I think YANBU if its non limited parking then whose business is it what you do while you're parked there? I'm assuming it wasn't the case that you'd overstayed an allotted time/overrun your ticket or something.

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 11:47:48

OP had a screaming baby and 3 other disabled children with her if I understand correctly...

it is ridiculous to suggest they start moving car elsewhere/ OP heads off with baby back to cafes to feed (that could take a good hour to return, find seat in cafe/purchase beverage etc)

missymoomoomee Mon 03-Dec-12 11:48:00

YANBU, none of the people would have hunted you down in the shopping centre to move your car because they didn't approve of the way you were spending your time whilst parked there. You were busy makes no odds if you were sitting in the car or not.

Afrodizzywonders Mon 03-Dec-12 11:48:14

YANBU, I've been in a normal car parking space feeding my baby with people hassling me to get out, the options were another 20 mins of a baby screaming. Plus I preferred the privacy the car sometimes gave me to feed rather than out and about on the shopping centre.

My baby needed to eat, I've paid for my parking space. Blue badge holder or not....people sometimes have to wait, having a pop at a woman feeding her baby in a car is pretty shite if you ask me, nice society we live in.

valiumredhead Mon 03-Dec-12 11:48:42

When I go shopping I often have to go back to my car and rest/put shopping bags in the boot as I can't carry them far, before starting again. YANBU

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:52:27

"It is possible to feed a baby strapped into their carseat while you are belted yourself, just lean over it's not ideal granted"
with 3 other kids there's prob not a lot of space between the car seats to seat hop so you're in boobs reach from the baby's seat!

But yes tis the season to be a bit of a cunt to your fellow shoppers! people were literally bashing poor DS in the face in town yesterday and trying to walk through us! I ended up carrying him (he's a big heavy boy who is too old really to be carried and I am nearly 9 months pregnant)

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 11:53:23

I'm wonders what kind of contortionist you would have to be to feed a baby in a car seat whilst being safely strapped in yourself! You would need one of those zip line thingies Tom cruise has in mission impossible, to dangle you from the roof of the car!

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:54:52

go go gadget nipples!

actually I have done this myself but you are NOT safely strapped in yourself as you have to loosen your own belt in order to lean over the baby car seat

onyx72 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:55:12

YANBU to want to feed your baby ASAP, but you were BU to use the blue badge, which was issued to one of your other children, to park up in a disabled space and feed your baby.

How far away from home were you, out of interest?

OiMissus Mon 03-Dec-12 11:56:30

YANBU - what utterly ridiculous comments some have made.
Sit in your car and feed your child. If anyone complained at me for doing so, I'd have been very quick to vacate the parking space, but only so I could run the ignorant idiot over.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:57:30

No we hadn't stayed over any alloted time or similar it was just a disabled space so no time limit.I think it had a lot to do with xmas shopping and being busy tbh. We do not go out much due to dcs problems as it is very very difficult with all of them as only the eldest can manage to walk a bit so we had made such an effort to get up early in order to get a space and try and get finished before it was too busy. it was absolutely packed when we left I just knew after the first 2 people asked were we leaving that it could be an issue bf but dh said "don't worry it'll be fine" it was a 25 min drive home and ds would have screamed the whole way if I hadn't fed him. We only went to get some socks and a coat for ds2 and for the others to see father xmas thoight itd b quick and relatively painless!

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 11:57:33

No we hadn't stayed over any alloted time or similar it was just a disabled space so no time limit.I think it had a lot to do with xmas shopping and being busy tbh. We do not go out much due to dcs problems as it is very very difficult with all of them as only the eldest can manage to walk a bit so we had made such an effort to get up early in order to get a space and try and get finished before it was too busy. it was absolutely packed when we left I just knew after the first 2 people asked were we leaving that it could be an issue bf but dh said "don't worry it'll be fine" it was a 25 min drive home and ds would have screamed the whole way if I hadn't fed him. We only went to get some socks and a coat for ds2 and for the others to see father xmas thoight itd b quick and relatively painless!

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 11:57:34

what is reasonable use of a blue badge space onyx?
are they only for shopping for items for the person it's issued for? no! you can go to the cinema, go for a walk, window shop, sip gingerbread lattes, chat to people on the street, take the non disabled DCs to the toilet, feed your baby...

Pandemoniaa Mon 03-Dec-12 11:59:50

I don't think the OP was being U given the circumstances. The OP could have spent the same time away from the car shopping or feeding her baby and the space would have remained just as unavailable for anyone else. Sure, it'd have been more convenient if she'd been able to vacate the space but actually, that's tough because right then it wasn't practical or possible.

YANBU

You have paid to use the space, you can use it in whichever fashion you like (within reason wink)

And feeding a baby in a moving car?! Even if you are both in seatbelts this isn't a very safe position in case of an accident!

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 12:04:14

She had all her children with her onyx! Should they have parked up in a disabled space, got ds 1 out left him there then parked elsewhere in a normal space to get the other 3 out, because on ds1 has a badge! Seriously?? Have you read the thread???!

LRDtheFeministDude Mon 03-Dec-12 12:06:11

Even if it were safe to feed a baby in a moving car, surely part of the point of having a blue badge is to alert people to the fact you may not actually be quite so able as the average person, and may find some physical things difficult ... like getting your shopping packed away and your baby fed, pronto, while others hover for the space!

FeckOffCup Mon 03-Dec-12 12:07:00

YANBU, it's pretty dangerous and distracting to drive with a screaming child in the car. You had a blue badge, you were entitled to use that space for however long you needed to.

nightowlmostly Mon 03-Dec-12 12:08:14

YANBU OP

GreenPetals Mon 03-Dec-12 12:08:30

YANBU.
This is actually NOT an issue with using a disabled place. Whether it was or not is irrelevant here. You had a space, hadn't finished using it (for what it takes, you could have been waiting for an older child who had gone to the toilet or whatever) so you waited and left when you were ready.

Asking if yu were ready to leave was a fair question. Having a go at you because you weren't ready to do so was BU.

GreenPetals Mon 03-Dec-12 12:09:41

obyx the person who was issued with the disabled badge was in the car....

MrsHoarder Mon 03-Dec-12 12:12:47

YANBU

People suggesting feeding a baby in a moving car ABVU. You might be in legal restraints, but in the event of a crash the mother is liable to crush the baby in the car seat. Even a bottle or sippy cup can kill a rear facing baby, so an adult definitely could.

THe people asking WNBU as long as they were polite: if you were about to leave it would make sense for them to wait rather than drive around endlessly looking for a space. If they were being impatient/rude then TWBU.

ISeeThreadPeople Mon 03-Dec-12 12:13:59

It's surprisingly easy to feed a baby in a moving car but depends on family set up and type of car/carseat. I have the clingiest boy in the world and he screams blue murder in his carseat. He's rear facing, I sit next to him in the middle seat with a lapstrap on and lean v slightly to the right, unclip my bra and he latches on. It's not ideal but better than dh crashing due to ds's ear splitting screaming.

StanleyLambchop Mon 03-Dec-12 12:14:12

I don't think you were BU. Sometimes though I think there is an element of 'competitive blue badging' going on, so one person deems themselves to be more worthy of the disabled space than another. This is especially the case if the badge holders appear to be young, there is a misconception that somehow only older people can be disabled. I would just put it down to the stresses of the time of year and forget about it. I can't see you have done anything wrong!

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 12:14:51

Yes ds1 was with us also dd1 has a badge too and she was with us-would NEVER use dcs badges if they were not with us

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 12:14:53

Yes ds1 was with us also dd1 has a badge too and she was with us-would NEVER use dcs badges if they were not with us

GreenPetals Mon 03-Dec-12 12:17:00

Well with 2 people having a blue badge, I am sure the OP wins the competition of who is in more need!

Fairylea Mon 03-Dec-12 12:17:05

Yanbu.

You could have gone into a cafe to feed and space would have been unavailable anyway.

First come first serve and all that really...

OP, there is no way you are being unreasonable - however it can be hard to explain to some people that your baby needs feeding NOW regardless of space etc.

I've fed baby in a moving car runs and hides - We were moving very slowly, maybe 5 miles an hour, from one tiny carpark in a village to another. Took about 3 minutes.

Otherwise though, baby stays in seat whilst driving. So glad he takes a bottle!! I've expressed whilst OH is driving too - straight into a bottle to give to LO.

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 12:22:02

anyway the people in the OP didn't know who the badge was for, it might have been for the mum for all they know!

Cantbelieveitsnotbutter Mon 03-Dec-12 12:27:40

Not being unreasonable at all.
If you'd feed your child in a cafe your car would still be taking the space up so I wouldn't worry. Just the silly selfish season kicking in

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 12:28:31

YANBU

SixFeetUnder Mon 03-Dec-12 12:38:48

YANBU you were using the space and that's all there is to it.
You did the right thing being up and out early to ensure you would get the space you needed so you wouldn't need to deal with any more unnecessary stress when you are already aware of how difficult getting out and about can be for you.
As others have said, OK to ask if you're leaving, not OK to get huffy about it.

sashh Mon 03-Dec-12 12:44:46

YANBU

Let me guess, the last car was an older couple.

Don't you know that Blue Badges are pensioner prizes, they get them from living to old age. It gives them a right to complain about anyone under 60 using it.

As for a child! well how dare someone have a disability as a child.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 12:47:57

Yes they were an older couple but to be fair so were the first (v polite) people that asked

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 12:48:02

Yes they were an older couple but to be fair so were the first (v polite) people that asked

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 12:48:43

thats a bit ageist sash shock

threesocksfullofchocs Mon 03-Dec-12 12:50:14

it doesn't matter if they were old or young, you cannot use a BB bay just to sit in.
I would have asked you to move too.

BuntysFestiveCollocks Mon 03-Dec-12 12:51:55

could you not have breastfed while DH drove the car?

Apart from it being ILLEGAL to not have a child in a car seat in a moving car, what part of you thinks that breastfeeding in a car is a good idea?

OP, YANBU. You have a disabled badge, you can use the space any way you please as far as I'm aware.

threesocksfullofchocs Mon 03-Dec-12 12:54:41

I think you will find that you can use the BB if the person with the BB is getting out.
so if the person with the BB is sitting in the car they should move.

Pandemoniaa Mon 03-Dec-12 12:55:21

it doesn't matter if they were old or young, you cannot use a BB bay just to sit in.

Who says? I don't think that any legislation has yet been re-enacted that suggests one is now prohibited to sit in one's Blue Badged car in a Blue Badge space. Let alone sit in the car in order to do something as essential as feed a baby.

threesocksfullofchocs Mon 03-Dec-12 12:56:42

well will hide the thread now as IMO the op should have moved to an ordinary space.

Pandemoniaa Mon 03-Dec-12 12:57:33

That's your opinion though, isn't it? Not a legal direction.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 12:58:19

Really threesocks? What if the disabled driver of a car needs to sit still for five minutes to get their breath back after a shopping trip, before heading off on a motorway? Is there a rule saying that's not allowed?
The people asking weren't concerned about the rights and wrongs of it, they just wanted to get a space and get in to the shops. They weren't going in and demanding others with cars parked there hurried up and got out!

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 13:03:03

There was no other space to move to threesocks it was absolutely packed.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 13:03:04

There was no other space to move to threesocks it was absolutely packed.

valiumredhead Mon 03-Dec-12 13:03:14

Actually there is something in the rules that come with the blue badge iirc BUT it's about the owner of the BB not being allowed just to sit in the car while some one else goes off to do the shopping.

But this wasn't the case as everyone was in the car, driver and bb holder.

Hopeforever Mon 03-Dec-12 13:04:44

YANBU, there was no other option. The other people who wanted that space had no more right to it than you.

gail734 Mon 03-Dec-12 13:06:02

A BFing woman in a blue-badged car, parked in a disabled spot? That is a political-correctness nightmare just waiting to happen! The woman who challenged you must have been insane. As far as I'm concerned, a breastfeeding mum is sacred and can do her thing anytime, anywhere and people should praise her lavishly while she's doing it. But then, I'm a breastfeeding mum! When I, very occasionally and very discreetly, BF in public, I mentally dare anyone to challenge me. I would savage them!

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 13:09:42

YANBU, I don't see what better options there were anyway.

If you'd fed the baby before you got in the car, then you'd still have been taking up the space.

If you'd got all the children out of the car and gone back in the shopping centre to feed the baby (so as to avoid sitting in a car hmm) you'd have occupied the space for at least twice as long.

Shelby2010 Mon 03-Dec-12 13:11:40

YANBU

Much quicker to feed the baby in the car, than the alternative of getting all the DCs out & going to a cafe etc

The drivers wanting the space were NBU to ask if you were leaving but were U to get stroppy. In fact if you are in Scotland it would be a criminal offence to try & stop you feeding your baby.

notso Mon 03-Dec-12 13:13:36

I don't think YABU but I can see how it would be annoying to others in a busy car park, doesn't excuse the rudeness though.

On another note I cannot see how anyone could BF while their baby is strapped into a car seat. My poor old breasts are particularly saggy after four DC and they won't reach, I have tried!

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 13:17:25

"On another note I cannot see how anyone could BF while their baby is strapped into a car seat. My poor old breasts are particularly saggy after four DC and they won't reach, I have tried!"

you have to loosen your belt and lean over them, its not safe! god knows what your body would do to the baby in an impact as you are not properly belted in even though the clasp is still in IYKWIM. Have done it when stuck but its not something I'd recommend

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 13:21:07

I just wanted to reinforce the message about not moving the car while someone is breastfeeding or holding a baby on their lap.

Once the engine is switched on the airbag is activated. It can only take a tiny bump to set the airbag off. The car could be going very slowly and everyone else may be totally unaffected but the baby may well be dead. Airbags explode with a dangerous force.

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 13:24:49

Well if everyone was back in the car ready to depart, then in effect the disabled space was no longer needed.

But, if there´s nowhere else to park-there isn´t.

It´s all very well saying go off to find somewhere-you could have travvelled half/all the way home with a screaming baby by that time!

I´m sure if OP could have given up the space she would.

I´ve bfed & we´ve all had lunch in a parking space before-maybe when you pay no one cares how long you stayhmm

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 13:27:25

YANBU. You could have sat in the cafe and taken longer to get back, or you could have sat in your car. All other people need to know is that the space isn't free yet. And I wouldn't have fed the baby while dh was driving either. Are people insane? All for the sake of ten minutes for a space that isn't free yet. My dh is a blue badge holder, he wouldn't dream of asking someone, who has a blue badge, that is sitting in their car feeding their baby to move. I wouldn't dream of asking either. I'd just wait or keep driving round until something came up.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 13:28:26

You still pay for disabled parking at my shopping centre. Is that unusual? It's not a council car park.

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 13:29:03

gold I think the idea is that the baby is in their car seat but you lean over them
.. which is still dangerous because your body could be lurched onto them in an impact

GoldQuintessenceAndMyhrr Mon 03-Dec-12 13:30:28

Yanbu - The alternative would have been to feed the baby in the shopping center prior to going to the car or returning to the shopping center. Feeding baby in the car was therefore actually quicker, as you were feeding while your dh sorted shopping, etc.

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 13:32:42

I'd imagine that they are lots of reasons why a BB holder may need to sit for a bit before moving off.

Arthritis sufferers might need a quick rest between the walk to the car and going over speed bumps to get out if its really flairing up. Breathing issues might need to be calmed, the driver might want to make sure the disabled person with breathing issues is okay before taking off and being distracted, and probably many other reasons which I can't think of because I do not know why every BB holder has a BB, and neither does anyone else wanting to park there

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 13:34:55

"You still pay for disabled parking at my shopping centre. Is that unusual?"

No idea-is it because you have to use a ticket to get through a barrier?

That´s terrible imo-there should be an attendant who can just open the barrier.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 13:38:45

Yes we still had to pay as it was multi storey park, the disabled spaces are just nearest to the shop entrance but same parking fees apply.

Pandemoniaa Mon 03-Dec-12 13:39:14

Unfortunately, shopping centres are usually privately run with car parks operated by commercial operators. They can, and do, charge for disabled parking in some cases although I think it is a shocking practice.

A few years back I was on a committee that oversaw the development of a shopping mall and was horrified by the attitude of the developers/owners and worse, by someone on the local council who treated the provision of disabled parking spaces as an "awful waste of potential revenue".

nannyl Mon 03-Dec-12 13:40:16

Yanbu

You have the right to bf your baby wherever you like
You were entitled to park in that space.

Would a non disabled person be expected to vacate a normal space?

I have bf in a car park several times.

No one else's buisness

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 13:47:11

I think that´s awful as spaces are usually so limited.

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 13:49:29

I think, in this case, it was okay as there were no other spaces available. In general, though, if you're in a disabled space and there are no other such spaces free, I think it would be unfair to hold on to one to feed the baby and manners and consideration should compel you to move to an ordinary space so that a disabled shopper isn't prevented from using the car space.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 13:58:17

I don't know as I'm not a bb holder. I went to the centre with a friend and her ds who has a bb and was surprised when she had to pay at the machine when we were leaving. But yes it's a take a ticket job and pay on he way out.

valiumredhead Mon 03-Dec-12 14:04:32

If the OP fed her baby before coming back to the car the space would STILL be taken.

Lots of car parks make BB pay - the only advantage is that sometimes the bays are closer to the entrance.

JuliaScurr Mon 03-Dec-12 14:05:50

I've ended up late for things because all disabled spaces were taken, some by people in the car when they could easily let someone else park there and wait about 5 metres away. It is legal, but it is selfish.

BridgetBidet Mon 03-Dec-12 14:45:50

YABU my Dad has a blue badge and have been out with him a lot while my baby has been small. We would have moved to a non-blue badge space while I fed the baby.

My Dad needs the space of a disabled space to get the wheelchair sorted if he is using it that day (has MS) and also needs to be close to the centre if he is not using it. If someone was blocking a space feeding a baby he would probably have to turn round and go home. So I wouldn't block the space feeding.

Sorry, I wouldn't have done it, I think it's rude and you should have more understanding of the situation for other badge holders.

TheSunIsShining Mon 03-Dec-12 14:50:24

So the lesson here is that you would be better take all the time you need feeding your baby in a comfortable place where no one can see you rather than try and do it as quickly as possible in your car where people expect you to leave asap so that you can leave a space for people quickly.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 14:51:28

But there wasn't another space Bridget.

MrsMushroom Mon 03-Dec-12 14:54:10

Of course YANBU. Ridiculous people.

EldritchCleavage Mon 03-Dec-12 14:54:29

you should have more understanding of the situation for other badge holders

Seriously?
2 of OP's children are badge holders. Overall, her family has a high level of need and in this instance, no other easy means of getting baby fed (and certainly none quicker than doing it in the car). Perhaps they should just not go out as a family so other badge holders don't get annoyed.

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 14:56:36

Well, unfortunately that's life TheSun. If people are circling a car park in need of a disabled space in the run up to Christmas they will feel a bit agrieved if they see someone sitting in one of these spaces feeding their baby. It mightn't be logical but there's an assumption that once you've finished using the shops and restaurants you no longer have need of a parking space.

ChestnutsRoastingonaWitchesTit Mon 03-Dec-12 15:02:56

If OP has a blue badge for her car and she wants to sit in it in a disabled space to read Take a Break and eat cheesy wotsits that's her business.

This other woman was being massively inconsiderate to look through the car window and see a woman trying to breastfeed her crying child while her partner wrangled 3 children into the car and even open her mouth to say anything other than, "is there any way I can help?"

I've stopped in dark country lane laybys with truckers shining their headlights through my windscreen and dodgy dogging types pulling up alongside me so I can feed my baby. You do it where you can.

TheSunIsShining Mon 03-Dec-12 15:04:18

Yep that's life.
Everyone should know that there is nothing else you can do in a car apart from driving it, even when you have a baby on board, a disabled child or an elderly person that needs a few minutes to recover from their outings before getting moving again.
If you ever have to do something else than drive the car, you should do it out of the car, if possible far away enough that no one knows you have an empty car waiting for you to climb in.

That's the rule.

Because the most important thing is that people get annoyed and angry because they haven't got up early enough to find some space easily can't find a space so you need to do your utmost to help them not getting annoyed.

sadsad

Janeatthebarre Mon 03-Dec-12 15:07:22

If OP has a blue badge for her car and she wants to sit in it in a disabled space to read Take a Break and eat cheesy wotsits that's her business. Quote

Yes, but a bit inconsiderate to other disabled drivers.(and absolutely not on a par with what OP was actually doing, which was essential and justified her using the space).

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 15:45:21

But you could use a disabled space to go and sit in a cafe eating cheesy wotsits and reading take a break..

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 16:36:52

I consider that iam very understanding of the needs of other bb holders and not 'rude' at all. I know how difficult it is going anywhere when you have health issues and I would not want to make things difficult for others.we rarely go out and I really didn't like being shouted at.

Abbicob Mon 03-Dec-12 16:41:42

YANBU - and why should you have left the spot to double park and potentially put yourself at risk of getting hit by another car.

People should have a bit more patience. Christmas shopping brings out the worst in people.

BridgetBidet Mon 03-Dec-12 16:51:25

The way I had read it they had finished getting the children into the car and were just sitting feeding the baby. In the same situation (and I have been in it) once the disabled person was safely seated I would have buckled the baby in, moved the car to a none disabled space and continued the feed.

I'm very concious that the space is needed for getting in and out of the car and for distance to the shops the space is needed. I'm not disabled and neither is the OP, it's not their for our convenience, it's there for the convenience of the blue badge holder.

It takes a few minutes to do. I've been in the same situation and I'm sorry I just wouldn't have done it.

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 16:55:15

OP say that there were no spaces to move to.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 16:59:34

The car park was full.NO disabled or non disabled spaces at all.traffic backed up with people driving round looking for spaces it was either stay in space or drive home and the baby was just too hungry and screaming.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 16:59:35

The car park was full.NO disabled or non disabled spaces at all.traffic backed up with people driving round looking for spaces it was either stay in space or drive home and the baby was just too hungry and screaming.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 17:12:15

No, as others have said, you wouldn't have been taking up less of a car parking space by sitting in a cafe feeding.

You aren't in a position to judge whether somebody else would have been more or less in need of the space for whatever reason - that's not how disabled badges work ("Before occupying this space, please fill in this form detailing your disabilities and the reason for your journey, you will be called back to your car should a more deserving driver require it...") .

However, I think waiting for 10 minutes, rather than attempting to drive a car out of a crowded car park with a screaming baby and 3 children with their own difficulties was much the most sensible decision.

Rudolphstolemycarrots Mon 03-Dec-12 17:14:57

you are entitled to use the space - can't see the problem.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 17:57:31

As a lifelong permanent wheelchair user, I think YWBVVVU and possibly a little bit PLB, surely the baby could have waited for a few minutes to feed whilst you moved somewhere else. (I presume you would not BF when standing in the middle of the road) As for your comments about people ONLY waiting to do their shopping, how do you know? They could have needed the loo (I have been this person), and depending on their disability they may not have been able to wait long, or perhaps they needed to take medication-- which cannot wait in certain cases. Moreover, contrary to popular belief, not all disabled people 'look' disabled, so saying you would have moved if someone needed it does Not make it reasonable. IMO you should have known and behaved better, seeing as your DS has SN.

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 18:07:12

OP I think you just learned a valuable lesson here.

Don't put yourself in a position where people feel free to judge you. I am sure that plenty of people with blue badges go to shopping centres on busy days and sit around having a drink or a sandwich in a coffee shop. Following the logic of previous posters this is unacceptable and any drinks or food should be taken and consumed elsewhere in case another person entitled to the accessible parking space comes along.

Your only mistake was to be feeding your baby in a place where people would see you and feel entitled to expect you to move.

Next time go back into the shopping centre and find a nice coffee shop where you can feed in comfort while having a cuppa. It will make you take up the space for longer but nobody will judge you for it.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 18:07:20

Iam very well aware that not all people look disabled as my own dcs do notlook 'ill'.I do not understand your comparison to me bf in the car to somebody bf in middle of road?

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 18:07:21

Iam very well aware that not all people look disabled as my own dcs do notlook 'ill'.I do not understand your comparison to me bf in the car to somebody bf in middle of road?

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 18:14:02

What does "PLB" mean?

To be honest, I don't think a hungry 7 month old necessarily can wait 20 minutes to to fed if they're distressed. I would expect an adult (even a disabled one) to be able to wait 10 minutes for a parking space. If the car park was busy then not everyone was going to get a space anyway, even if the OP wasn't there.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 18:21:52

OP, my point was simply that I assumed that you would be happy for your baby to wait for however long it took you to cross the road, so why could they not wait for you to move the car to a different spot. Goldmandra, your points are ridiculous, people consuming food and sitting for a time in places where they have paid to do so are using the service to which the carparking facilities are attached, as OP was when she was shopping, but not when she was feeding the baby. Anyhow, I still think OP was BVVU and should have known better. I assume OP would have been very angry had your Dss had any embarrassment/ indignity if they hadn't been able to use the loo when needed or problems from not being able to take or recieve meds when needed.

Offred Mon 03-Dec-12 18:25:39

If you needed the loo that desperately. you'd have to be extremely stupid to go into the multi storey car park of a shopping centre....

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 18:27:24

Some people clearly have never been in a multi-storey carpark. Where is there to just move over to to have the feed? And those who persist in saying move to another parking space, need to read the thread.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 18:28:24

NolittleBuddhas - there were no other spaces hmm If it had been the case that the OP simply had to move a few feet away into another space I'm sure she would have. Her only alternative in the situation to feeding in the car would have been getting all the children out, back into the shopping centre and feeding the baby there, thus taking up the space for even longer. Would you have preferred that?

LynetteScavo Mon 03-Dec-12 18:28:50

YANBU.

If you had fed the baby around the corner, or simply spent longer in the shops your car would have still been parked there, and people wouldn't have been able to give you grief.

It makes no difference that you were in a BB space. If someone had got angry with you for feeding in an ordinary space, that would have been just as bad.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 18:29:04

Nolittlebuddha perhaps the OP and her family had better just stay at home in case someone with more needs wants to park?

MrsHoarder Mon 03-Dec-12 18:29:09

But the op could easily have fed the baby on a bench/chair in the shops. Would probably have been harder for everyone including the dcs with disabilities.

And big shopping centres near motorways often take you straight from your parking spot and try to feed you away from any chance to stop asap. So moving the car might not be trivial if there's no nearby obvious spaces.

YANBU as others have said, you could have sat BF somewhere other than the car and they still wouldn't have had your space.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 18:30:16

Goldmandra - exactly.

having a pop at a woman feeding her baby in a car is pretty shite if you ask me

ITA

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 18:36:00

I should have known better?... Actually I think I did quite well in anticipating that there may be an issu with parking this near to xmas that's why we planned our trip and struggled to get 4 dcs with health issues up early enough to ensure we got a space and trust me it was HARD (that's why we don't go to places like that often). It is not my fault if other pople got there when it was full?? And crossing th road takes a minute-driving the baby home would have taken us 25 mins assuming there was no traffic then it could be longer.Iam not heartless I do really know how hard it is whn you cannot get a space and really need one.I do not really want to go into medical histories but I can sympathise as myself and dh also have the genetic condition dcs have (although not as sverly-they are badly affected as sadly inherited from both of us but that's a long story).

BegoniaBampot Mon 03-Dec-12 18:36:52

YANBU if there were no spaces anywhere else to move to. Don't think this is just a disabled parking space thing, it can be the same with any spaces. Am I the only one who can't help but get annoyed when you're endlessly cruising a busy car park, you finally see someone heading to their car, you indicate, waiting at last for a space and they get in and faff about or start reading their paper without even a nod when they could see you we're waiting. I might be unreasonable but it is bloody annoying.

LaCiccolina Mon 03-Dec-12 18:38:10

This thread is ridiculous and hysterical funny and just hysterical. I can only assume its Christmas nuttery taking hold!!!

Op - not bu, not in the slightest. Ur space. I don't care of the type if space, I think it's pretty irrelevant tbh. Take all the time u want, feed all four and return to the shops whatever.

If any one of these are truly suggesting they would have left it I just don't believe them. Looks good on a post but judging by every car park I've ever entered then possession is law. Ive seen phonecslls taken, dumping bags returning to shops, feeding, takeaway lunches all sorts. if ur in space its urs for the day! End of!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 18:42:47

plb = Perfect Last Born.

Wtf do you mean by 'even a disabled one' I don't like your tone there at all, and for what it's worth I and many others with limited bladder sensation/ control would not be able to wait for anything like 20mins to use the loo, yes adults BTW I didn't say that I expected a baby to wait 20 mins for anything at any point.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 18:43:04

Good point, they could have easily just been feeding the baby in the privacy of the car and then going back in to continue shopping/have lunch.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 18:55:24

Where else should someone park/ go to the loo when out when the use a large elec chair? As I have already said, I have very limited bladder sensation and do not always know when I am going to need the loo, however, I could just be very stupid I suppose hmm I never implied that the OP should stay at home in case of the needs of others, or certainly never meant to if I did. However, I do not think the difficulties OP has taking out her family have anything to do with this issue. Living with a disability is HARD I know! But you shoulld still be mindful of the needs of others. As for your point about realising a shopping centre of all places would be busy in the run up to Christmas, go figure, not sure what that is meant to add.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 18:56:20

Should you not be mindful of the need of a little baby to be fed then?

baublesandbaileys Mon 03-Dec-12 19:00:27

isn't it great when people just turn on each other rather than realising who the real enemy is! if you were to get held up/caught short because the wait for a disabled space is too long, it is because the car park provider didn't provide enough disabled spaces - THEY are the ones who need to be reminded to be mindful of people's needs!

Viviennemary Mon 03-Dec-12 19:03:32

YABU and selfish to use the space that somebody else needed. It was a car park not a feeding station.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:04:34

Once again, I am not suggesting the baby was left hungry for a prolonged period of time, just a short while whilst the parents left the car park/ space and pull in at the side of the road somewhere. I am sure OP could have found somewhere to double park in a town reasonably quickly.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:05:42

VivianneMary have these on me thanks!!!

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 19:05:47

Well if OP was paying by the hr-why shouldn´t she use it for whatever & as long as she wants-it´s not her fault that there aren´t enough spaces.

Would anyone have tried to oust her were it not a disabled space?

JuliaScurr Mon 03-Dec-12 19:08:30

Anyway, the main point is - there aren't enough disabled parking spaces. Ever.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 19:10:17

NolittleBuddhas - would it have been ok if the OP had sat on a bench and fed the baby before returning to the car?
How about feeding the baby in the car, then going back into the shopping centre to finish shopping?

DowagersHump Mon 03-Dec-12 19:11:11

What you should have done was stayed in the shopping centre and fed the baby there - it's the only way to stop some people you're selfish - if they can't see you basically hmm

CalamityJ Mon 03-Dec-12 19:14:03

For me the question seems to be who decides who needs the space more? A mother feeding her child (who got there first) or another person wanting to park up and shop/do whatever they want to do with the space. OP got there first, still needed it and therefore had every right to keep the space. I don't have a blue badge but my understanding of the system is that it is designed to give those with disabilities an accessible place to park so they can do whatever they want. So that's what the OP was doing!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:21:27

SamSmalaidh both of those situations would be fine, as if the OP was not in the car she wouldn't have been able to move it, in this scenario she could have. I don't this what if she was going to continue shopping point? if that were the case, she could have fed in the shopping centre --no diferent than a baby being fed from a Jar IMHO

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 19:24:13

It wouldn't have made any difference to people with disabilities waiting for a space if she took 10 minutes to feed in the shopping centre or 10 in the car though - they would still have to wait 10 minutes.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:25:44

CalamityJ babies need to be fed, BF or otherwise, regardless of SN so I'm not sure what your point is. From OP's details DS feeding is not effected by his SN-- apologies if I missed any reference.

CwtchesAndCuddles Mon 03-Dec-12 19:27:21

The op is not the badge holder the older children are.The rules say that the badge is for the sole benefit of the holder.

Taken from the website of the The Disabled Motorist Federation :-

Do NOT use the badge to allow non-disabled people to take advantage of the benefits whilst you sit in the car.

The OP knows how hard it is to find a disabled parking place and should have moved once they were all back in the car to allow another disabled person to use the space.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 19:27:57

The shopping centre was too busy there was no space to sit down anywhere and the baby was screaming and overtired which in turn was upsetting dd2 and I was stressed so had to go to car

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 19:27:58

The shopping centre was too busy there was no space to sit down anywhere and the baby was screaming and overtired which in turn was upsetting dd2 and I was stressed so had to go to car

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:29:23

SamSmalaidh: Yes they would have had to wait, but because OP was not there and so not able to move the car, rather than being too self centred to do so. I am not saying that I expect people to stop shopping/ eating and return to their cars.

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 19:32:44

cuddles you are taking that too literally. Obviously that doesn't apply here, as the badge holder can't actually drive the car.

Mins best interests, is clearly dcs best interest. This kind of situation, is not what that guidance was written for

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 19:37:12

So is the idea that people can only use disabled parking spaces in an emergency, and they must vacate them as quickly as possible? If thats the case I'm not sure why my local shopping centre has them at all - generally people are quite frivolous there - most of the shops sell things that you could perfectly well do without and there is an entire floor just dedicated to eating quite unnecessary food (sushi, muffins, pizza etc.)

I wonder what the other blue badge holders were doing? Some of them might have been hanging out at the gadget shop, or even just enjoying the novelty Christmas goings on in the main atrium. Surely this kind of activity goes beyond their basic needs?

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 19:40:23

Tbh the way I saw it a bb space was not guaranted hence us trying to get there early to get on knowing it would b hard and that possibly we wouldn't get one and would hav to go home iam not so entitled as to expect somebody else to move like the lady who shouted at me.it is hard dealing with disabilities but a disabled space is a privelege not an automatic right we could have had to just go home if we hadn't gpot one but I wouldn't have blamed other bb holders.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:41:14

Actually, I agree with Cuddles. If DS SN have no implications for feeding, the info Cuddles cites applies. The badge is not for Op's benefit! Its is to make it easier for her children to experience as 'normal' a life as possible, by being able to get out more easily. If Ds SN effected his ability to Bf then it would be for his benefit and therefore valid.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 19:41:43

It's my understanding that they don't hand out blue badges like lollipops. If the OP has a blue badge I would guess that her other children's disability/ies make it rather difficult to hang out in a busy shopping centre while feeding a baby or sit being beeped at while they double parks in the centre of town for 10 minutes on one of the busiest shopping days of the year.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 19:43:48

I don't think the baby is the badge holder.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:44:17

merrymouse: I think you'll find that a lot of people who (ab)use the spaces like this have no entitlement, thus explaining why people like me and I'm sure OP on occaision, so angry

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 19:47:09

Do you not think it is of benefit to the disabled badge holder to be sitting comfortably in a car for 10 minutes while the baby is fed rather than having to stand/sit on the floor in busy shopping centre then?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:48:15

No, the baby is not the badge holder, the badge is granted for the use of the children of the family with SN, of which the baby is one as he has SN. Your pendantry is astounding merrymouse wink

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:50:52

I'm sure OP wouldn't have made the others stand if they were unable to SamSmalaidh, she only seems to think that it's OK to inconvenience others with disabilities from what I gather.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 19:52:11

But nolittle would you shout at a bfing woman that she was hogging a bb space if there wasn't one there for you? That is the question here. Op was well within her rights to do what she did. The first couple were well within their rights to ask if they were just about to leave, and accepted ops answer that they were not. The second couple however, were rude and entitled and had absolutely no right to abuse the op just because she wasn't doing what they wanted her to. They are the ones who were being unreasonable, not the op.

OP you do not need to justify yourself any further. You have done nothing wrong.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 19:54:05

The badge we used yest was ds1.dd1 also has bb.dd2 and ds2 have same condition but no bb yet as only 7 months and we have only just applied for dd2 dla now that she is 3 and still in buggy all the time with other significant problems.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:57:38

I wouldn't have shouted at OP, but I would have expressed my feelings of annoyance either by asking her to move politely (and if I knew the area politely suggest somewhere that she could park) or by shooting her a look. I cannot use a 'normal' parking bay btw.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 19:59:00

Amazed that anyone could call this OP self-centred or selfish, as I've seen two posters do!
It is madness to suggest you put a crying baby into its seat and drive away in order to double park on a road somewhere - where no doubt you'd be shouted at by a bus driver or cautioned by the police! (Who would be somewhat hmm at your excuse that you'd had to leave a parking space to give it to someone else).
The disabled children in the car benefitted from not hanging around the shops whilst sibling was fed, or from being exposed to risk through parking on a road unnecessarily.
Reasonable for passer to ask if space would soon be free. Completely unreasonable to demand or shout about it.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 19:59:32

If baby DS has SN, my point still stands.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 20:00:58

Nolittle - I would not want to inconvenience ANYBODY with a disability. That wasn't what I set out to do I was simply trying to juggle the very demanding needs of 4 disabled dcs whilst out on a very rare shopping trip.perhaps bb should be redesigned a bit like top trumps cards then at least we would know who had priority?? Would that suit you then you could force us out of the space.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 20:01:23

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:01:54

You sound very entitled NolittleBuddahs, if you think your need to have a parking space is more important than 4 children with disabilities.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:04:01

OP's baby is not the centre of everyone else's world, MistressIggi as for having to drive so fast that she would be stopped by the police, get real!!! It does not kill a child to wait 5 mins and 5mins only. I did say I would ask politely Btw.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:05:48

It doesn't kill other drivers to wait for a space to become free either.

MsElleTow Mon 03-Dec-12 20:06:12

I am disabled and have a blue badge and I think you were being selfish. I wouldn't sit in the car while the DC or DH ate lunch, taking up a disabled space that was obviously desperately needed by other people. You could have put the DC in the car and moved off some where else, it didn't need to be in the car park, or to go all the way home, there must have been somewhere else in the vicinity.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:09:23

SamSmalaidh: I did not say that my need was greater than anybodies, I would have no problems if OP had been attending to a disability related need! As I have said all babies need feeding. The reason have such strong views on matters like this is because I get so annoyed by parents of DCs with SN who belief they are 'entiltled' to behave in a certain way because of it! I view myself as a 'person with a disability' and not a 'disabled person' so yeah I'm dead entitled me. grin

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:11:38

SamSmalaidh: I'll wait as long as you want and sit in pissed up clothes all day, is that better? (FWIW I can't change independently) angry

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 20:12:34

<bangs head against brick wall>

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:15:07

MsElleTow - would it have been better to find somewhere in the shopping centre to sit and feed before going back to the car? Given that there was nowhere to move off to the OP's other option would have been to get all the children back out of the car and into the shopping centre. Neither of these options would have freed up a space any quicker confused

Nolittle, you come across as very entitled if you believe your desire to park quickly is more important than the needs of the people who have already paid for and are using a space.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:15:48

OP the top trumps idea is FAB, must tell my MP grin wink

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:16:44

Nolittle - the carpark was very busy, so whether the OP fed the baby in the shopping centre or in the car (or took an extra 10 minutes over shopping) would make no difference to the amount of spaces available.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:19:06

Again if OP was attending to a disability related need of the DCs then all power to her, but otherwise she was being selfish and UBER entitled (as you guys seem to love that word) IMHO. Also I think the need to access a loo urgently is quite pressing myself.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:23:21

What if the OP was just walking round the shops slowly? 10 minutes is 10 minutes, she had paid for a parking space, just like every other person in a space who was shopping, eating etc.

StarOfLightMcKings3 Mon 03-Dec-12 20:23:23

OP. they would have had to wait if you had delayed your return to your car to feed the baby. There is no rules about what you can and can't use the space for. YANBU.

If it was possible to move it woukd have been considerate and kind to do so of course but it is for YOU to weigh up wrt needs of your family and no-one has the right to harass you for it.

squeakytoy Mon 03-Dec-12 20:23:32

What would you have done if you didnt have a blue badge?

The reason for sitting there in the car while others were clearly waiting for the space was not disability related from what i understand. I can also see that it must have been very frustrating for the other disabled drivers waiting to park while you sat there feeding a baby.

MsElleTow Mon 03-Dec-12 20:23:32

The point is Sam that the baby started screaming when they got back to the car, so the OP fed him. She could have got her DH to have moved the car.
Obviously had she have fed him in the shopping centre the opportunity to move the car wouldn't have arisen, but it did, so they should have IMVHO!

kickassangel Mon 03-Dec-12 20:24:28

So, if the op had found somewhere in the shopping center where she could feed her kids quietly, THEN walked to the car, she may well have been even longer than by bf the youngest in the car.

Driving while you have a baby screaming can be very distracting so not a good idea either.

And even if she was being a bit U, still no reason for other people to yell at her.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:24:50

MsElleTow - moved the car where? There was nowhere to move the car to, so she either feeds in the car or gets back out again and goes to find a cafe/bench to feed on.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 20:25:11

Nolittle I did not suggest they would be driving fast enough to be stopped by the police, I was referring to what might happen if they double-parked somwhere as you suggested to feed the baby.

I don't get the idea that the blue badges are only to be used for the sole needs of the person with the disability - by that I mean in practical terms. So my SIL takes my brother shopping (he is disabled). They look in shops for men's stuff - but if she wants to buy some tampons, she should go back out, move the car, and then return? Of course that won't happen.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:25:41

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf I might not be very nice IYO but so what. I just don't think that producing a DC or DCs with disabilities should nominate you for sainthood or allow you to do what you want regardless of others. My DM feels the same and has brought me up accordingly, to be proactive, do as much as I can for myself and not blame my problems on others. BTW not all people with disabilities are nice you know! grin

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 20:26:23

If OP wasn´t in a blue badge space, I doubt it would have been an issue.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:28:16

MistressIggi, what you describe would be incidental to her helping your brother, unless the pharmacy was in a different city or something hmm

SJisontheway Mon 03-Dec-12 20:28:22

YANBU. 95% of posters agree with you - certainly the overwhelming majority. Try not to take to heart what a small minority are preaching. You do not sound selfish at all.

MsElleTow Mon 03-Dec-12 20:29:14

Sam there must have been somewhere else in the vicinity, not necessarily in the car park, but within a couple of minutes drive.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:29:53

diddl, no it wouldn't have been because the 'normal' drivers would have just filled the bb spaces!!! grin

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:32:43

Really MsElleTow? Have you not seen how busy it is on a weekend in the run up to Christmas - not exactly loads of car parking spaces. Bit much to expect a family with several children with disabilities, including a screaming hungry baby, to drive around a busy town centre in search of a parking space just so someone doesn't have to wait 10 minutes for a space. If I was the OP I would have got everyone out of the car and gone to a cafe rather than risk not being able to find anywhere.

MsElleTow Mon 03-Dec-12 20:32:55

Probably not diddl because there are a lot more non BB spaces. Also, most people who are not disabled can get out of the car without having to open the doors wide, don't need extra room for walking aids, or wheelchairs and don't need to be near the shops or lifts!

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Mon 03-Dec-12 20:32:57

Mselletow, why "must" there have been? If the multi storey car park was so packed, I'm sure that all other street parking etc was pretty busy on a weekend in December.

I think the OP acted in the interests of the blue badge holders by not getting them all back out of the car and into the shopping centre once the baby needed feeding but staying parked somewhere safe.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 20:33:12

Presumably if the OP didn't have a blue badge she would have been sitting in a non-disabled parking space feeding her baby.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 20:34:04

In the city I live in everywhere is controlled parking - so to stop somewhere else would mean finding another (disabled?) space to park in! Don't know where op is. I would think it cruel to my baby to make him wait for a quick feed until we had found another place to stop. If feeding in cars was not possible, then I'd have fed in the shops, not made baby wait. So, end result, still no freed-up space.
Not sure what you mean about my SIL shopping being incidental to DB's needs - same is surely the case for these kids' sibling's need for milk.

MsElleTow Mon 03-Dec-12 20:36:52

Yes, Sam I have seen how busy town centres are, hence why I don't go in the run up to Christmas because being disabled I can't cope with crowds and I need a disabled space otherwise I can't get out of the car!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:36:58

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Op could have pulled up anywhere that it was safe, not necessarily a Parking space. SamSmalaidh: re walking round slowly, if OP wasn't in the car she couldn't and wouldn't have been expecting to move it!

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:38:49

And hence why the OP planned ahead and went early enough to get a parking space to accomodate the needs of her children.

IneedAsockamnesty Mon 03-Dec-12 20:39:08

The reason have such strong views on matters like this is because I get so annoyed by parents of DCs with SN who belief they are 'entiltled' to behave in a certain way because of it! I view myself as a 'person with a disability' and not a 'disabled person' so yeah I'm dead entitled me.

nolittle so you define yourself as a person with a disability,but your happy to refer to children with disabilities as dc's SN. Great bit of minimising,

How do you know what the impact of the baby screaming would have been on all of the passengers with a disability, how do you know if it would have had a impact or increased impact due to the disability all three of them have,you also don't know if the baby themselves who also has this disability could have been impacted more than a person without that disability by being hungry.

To decide a person is selfish based on information you don't have about a disability they do have is idiotic

Minimising someone else's disability by referring to it as sn whilst calling your issue a disability is also pretty piss poor

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:39:29

Again it's fine to make a baby wait for 5 mins, what if OP and her DP needed to attend to one of the older DC's, the baby would have to wait then. Kids are not the centre of the universe! Not mine anyway.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:39:56

OK Nolittle, so it is just about whether other drivers can see the OP in the car. If she is out of sight, she can have the space all day, but if they can see her then even waiting 10 minutes is too much?

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 20:40:46

Iam by no means selfish if there had been a 'normal' space nearby we could have moved but there Wasn't.w couldn't double park in the car park and it lads straight to a bust road many crossings and then dual carriageway so no option to evn stop nearby.the lady who shouted at me could prob see for herself there was nowhre we could move to-she just wantd us to leave 'immediately'.sorry spelling bad as on blackberry

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 20:41:53

Yes but they didn't need to make the baby wait, and has been said a million times OP could have fed in the shops without anyone thinking they'd the right to shout at her.
Doubt it would have been five minutes tbh.

GreenEggsAndNichts Mon 03-Dec-12 20:42:01

so. If she'd stayed inside and fed the baby, that would be okay, but because she came outside and fed the baby, it's not okay to some of you. confused Either way, the space would not be available for others to use.

diddl Mon 03-Dec-12 20:44:42

Thing is if a car park was full & I was in a non-disabled space & I wasn´t about to leave & said so-no one would be telling me that I had to & that the space I had paid for wasn´t for me to just sit in!

So why is acceptable to say that about a disabled space?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:46:14

Sorry what is offensive about SN? the kids have 'special needs', as do I, but as an adult I have made a socio political choice and statement about how I define my special needs. I assume OPs have not so I did not make that decision for them so I think that your understanding of disability culture and politcs is 'pretty piss poor' TBH Sockreturningpixie. Also I have said that if OP was attending to a disability related need, as the scenarios you describe would be then that's fine, but she hasn't.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:49:59

SamSmalaidh: For the last time if she's not in the car she can't move it! If she is she can! I support BF for those who want to, I couldn't give a shiny shite if I could see her BFing or not. I just don't think she should have hogged the space to feed the baby if it was not SN related.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 20:53:04

You're not making sense though nolittle - you don't mind her hogging the space (which she has paid for) to feed the baby inside the shopping centre, but you do mind her hogging the space for exactly the same amount of time in the car.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:53:35

FWIW I don't think OP would be right to hog any space for feeding, it's a car park not a feeding park afterall

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 20:56:45

If that is th case then I choose to define my family as a 'disabled family' therefore feeding ds2 was attending to a need of a member of my disabled family.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 20:57:23

If she's in the shops she Can't move the car, unless she's magic! Out of the shops she could move out of the space, park on the verge, feed and go home!! I don't get what you don't understand. If she hadn't finished shopping she could have fed him inside and I would have supported her in that. If she's not in the car holding up as space I couldn't give a monkies what she was doing!

LemonBreeland Mon 03-Dec-12 21:00:29

I can't believe anyone can say YABU to this.

So next time the OP should sit on a bench inside the shopping centre to feed her baby just so nobody can see her taking up the parking space for longer than necessary? Ludicrous.

OP YANBU at all.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 21:01:09

Well there you go OP - if this happens again and the baby needs a feed just as you've got to the car, get everyone out and go back inside to feed so you won't be "holding up a space". And take your time wink

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:01:12

ariane5 He would need to be fed disabled or not, and I am offended that you, as a parent think it's ok to trivialise such an important and hard fought for distinction TBH. You have not said or suggested he has feeding issues so 'disabled family' or not makes no difference. Read up on disability politics and culture then will talk, you won't think it's so funny when your DCs are older angry

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:01:40

we'll not willl

YoHoHoAndABottleOfSherry Mon 03-Dec-12 21:01:46

But she couldn't move the car, because there was nowhere to move it to. The family still needed the space.

And for all anyone knew, the family could have just arrived, and were feeding the baby in the calm privacy of their own car rather than the crowded, overstimulating shopping centrebefore going into the shops. Would that have been OK?

It is extremely stressful to drive with a baby who is screaming to be fed, and much more sensible and much safer to feed before moving off.

And comments like it's not a feeding park are breathtakingly offensive.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:02:31

Nolittle-THERE WAS NOWHERE INSIDE TO FEED.it was packed.benches full.cafes full.we have a double buggy a single and have to watch dd1 very carefully as she often collapses it was just too busy for us inside the shopping centre and ds2 was v grumpy.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:02:33

Nolittle-THERE WAS NOWHERE INSIDE TO FEED.it was packed.benches full.cafes full.we have a double buggy a single and have to watch dd1 very carefully as she often collapses it was just too busy for us inside the shopping centre and ds2 was v grumpy.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 21:03:14

Disabled parking spaces aren't just for doing disabled activities hmm

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:04:06

SamSmalaidh: I have a feeling that you are being deliberately obtuse and I likke it! grin

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 21:04:21

What verge?

I can't understand the logic that its better for BB holder A to sit in a cafe and take up a space for half an hour to feed a baby (because that kind of thing never takes 10 minutes with 3 other children) than it is for BB holder B to sit in a car for 10 minutes.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:06:48

but it's not a feeding park, and she had finished her transaction with the facility which provides the car park. Genuine question, what is so offensive about 'it's not a feeding park' let alone, breathtakingly so?

The woman who got all shouty wouldn't have got the space if she had moved anyway, it would have been the polite couple.

OP, you are fine, someone got their knickers in a twist. The shouty lady had no idea what your DCs issues are and was overstepping... especially when you had to pay for the space.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:08:39

Pedantry strikes again merrymouse: kerb, edge, most car parks have such things, a space not used for parking.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 21:09:46

I would imagine that the disabilities of her children impact on all areas of ariane5's life, including when and where she can feed her baby.

YoHoHoAndABottleOfSherry Mon 03-Dec-12 21:10:33

She hadn't "finished her transaction with the facility."
She still needed to use it.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:11:04

Iam not trivialising it at all.dd1 is 11 so I have some idea what it is like to have an older disabled child and it is no fun.It is irrelevant exactly what any of the dcs issues are, they all have serious problems due to their condition and I don't feel comfortabl going through their whole medical history, they have serious mobility issues and other problems one of which does affect their digestive tract but that is not th point.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:11:06

Iam not trivialising it at all.dd1 is 11 so I have some idea what it is like to have an older disabled child and it is no fun.It is irrelevant exactly what any of the dcs issues are, they all have serious problems due to their condition and I don't feel comfortabl going through their whole medical history, they have serious mobility issues and other problems one of which does affect their digestive tract but that is not th point.

we have a double buggy a single and have to watch dd1 very carefully as she often collapses it was just too busy for us inside the shopping centre

So there, she had a disabled reason to feed in the car, to help keep her blue badge holding DD safe. Happy now?!

FGS.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:11:38

SamSmalaidh: Firstly, wtaf is a disabled activity an activity that doesn't do what other activities do? Secondly, if they aren't designated to attend to the needs of the disabled, why designated them at all [confuse]

I don't feel comfortabl going through their whole medical history

You shouldn't have to! Noone should have to trot out their medical history to justify themselves.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 21:14:08

Nolittle - if the OP's children didn't have disabilities, then it may well have been possible for her to feed the baby sitting on the floor of the shopping centre out of sight of drivers. As they do have disabilities, she needed to feed the baby in the car. Isn't this kind of thing exactly what blue badges are for? To ensure people who are especially in need of a parking space get it?

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 21:14:37

Do you know there is a law that allows women to bf anywhere unhindered. And they cannot be moved on. For example. Couple 2, unhappy with op hogging the bb space, go to car park management to complain. Car park management would be breaking the law to ask op to move.

Or does your disability trump ops right to bf her child in her own car, in a parking space she I'd entitled to park in??

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 21:17:10

You say pedantry, I call it trying to make sense of what you are saying. Can't think of a single verge near my nearest multi-storey, except in the middle of the 6 lane A road that runs past it. You are either paying for a space or you are parking illegally, possibly dangerously.

As far as I understand, as long as you pay for parking, most car parks aren't overly fussed about what you do in your car as long its legal.

Chunkychicken Mon 03-Dec-12 21:21:13

Nolittle you say that the OP is BU because it could (potentially) stop another BB holder like yourself getting a space urgently as you may need to use the toilet suddenly? So, if she had been in the shopping centre, & therefore, still using the space, leaving no disabled spaces available, what would you do?!!! Clearly your disability has unfortunate consequences and I do appreciate that you are therefore entitled to the (relative) ease of parking closer to the entrance etc but how does it mitigate for there being NO spaces available? You state you can't use a "normal" space so I can see that you would have only 2 options if there were no spaces; go home, or piss yourself waiting for another BB holder to return to their car & vacate the space.

Why does your urgent need to use the toilet over-ride another BB's "need" to continue their shopping at their own pace? Which is essentially what you're implying, by suggesting that the OP not feed her baby when he needs it, you are saying their needs are secondary to yours. If she hadn't been doing something essential, then maybe be miffed, but how do you know that every other BB holder parked in those spaces is doing something essential?!!!

If you want to be annoyed, be annoyed at non-BB holders "waiting" in disabled bays or at the planners not putting enough spaces in...

OP YANBU at all.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:23:29

This is precisely why we rarely go out! It is just too difficult what with dcs problems, everywhere being so busy and people with no patience shouting.99 per cent of the time I order everything online it was mainly to take dcs to see father christmas that we went out Iam glad tbh that we don't have to go more often !

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:25:30

I still say pedantry, and actually you can bring cases for wrongful use of blue badge spaces under the EA, same as with wheelchair spaces on trains, which is what I tell any moron who insists that their precious babykins has a right to sit in it even though I have booked and paid for my seat! Maybe your local multi storey is badly designed, many have pullover space, particularly where there is bb parking, in case of emergency/ illness on the way in or out.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:27:28

I have the world's smallest violin here for you OP, this was not a disability issue just one of you being selfish and entitled.

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 21:27:40

i think OP you need to develop a sense of entitlement, and a 'fuck you' attitude...you need to get the rage!! and dont feel obliged to explain your dcs needs. The blue-badge-giverers have deemed you worthy, and that is all people need to know

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 21:27:50

Good post chunkychicken. Summed up rather nicely there.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 21:29:36

So it would have been better for them to block an emergency parking space that the space that they were legally occupying...

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 21:30:23

nolittle the OP has 4 children with health issues

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 21:33:49

But this wasn't wrongful use of a bb! Unless you have any facts to back up your opinion that it is.

You are entitled to your opinion, as the rest of us are, I don't happen to agree with you, as does the majority of the thread. Yet you continue to argue your point as if we are all going to have an epiphany and completely change our minds!

And to suggest op uses "an incase of an emergency space" is really clutching at straws. It wasn't an emergency, there was no one ill.

However I wouldn't begrudge you using the emergency space if you were about to piss your pants. That is an emergency IMO. So there is your solution for future reference. And you thought that up all by yourself.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:35:01

ChunkyChicken, if there is no way to move the car from the space, then that is unfortunate, though in such situations we (me and PA) would find someone and ask them if we could leave the car to one side, go to the loo and then comeback. However, in this scenario I would have ask OP to move, I understand there are unavoidable situations when I can't get the loo and accidents happen, but as an adult I find it degrading and embarrassing and a reminder of the nature of my condition so I try to avoid them at all costs. I couldn't pee on a verge if I wanted to. blush

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:35:07

Thankyou to everybody who has been kind.I have to say I am quite hurt by the attitude towards me from nolittle-iam neither selfish or entitled and what does worlds smallest violin mean? Is that directd at my ds2?? Bit harsh sad

YoHoHoAndABottleOfSherry Mon 03-Dec-12 21:35:31

NoLittle you really can't see how saying "it's not a feeding park" is rude? Belittling the OP for wanting to respond to her small baby's needs? Implying that sitting comfortably in a car is somehow an inappropriate place to feed a baby - and perhaps that feeding a baby should only be done in some sort of "feeding park".

You're very keen for everyone to consider your needs, but you are utterly dismissive of the needs of a tiny baby, who is still at an age where nearly all his nourishment will be coming from milk. Saying things like "it won't kill the baby to wait 5 minutes" (you don't know how long he has had to wait while his family got back to the car, got everyone else safely strapped in, stowed everything in the boot etc etc - probably more than 5 minutes).

If you can't show any compassion or consideration for other people - other disabled people no less, who are just as entitled to use the BB space as you are - how can you expect them to show consideration for you? You're basically saying you don't care how much difficulty the family has to put themselves through, as long as they vacate their space immediately in case you need it.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:36:44

But feeding is not a health issue for Baby ds as I've understood it, so it was wrongful use under the guidelines for the bb

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 21:38:31

What guidelines! Link please because if cannot find anything online that suggest the op has misused the bb at all.

aufaniae Mon 03-Dec-12 21:40:57

YANBU! Anyone who think you were is having a logic bypass!

Your baby needed feeding, before you drove away. Had you found a cafe to sit in for example, while you BF your baby, you would have taken longer but no one would have had any idea how you were spending your time.

I imagine feeding your baby in the car was probably the quickest way to get your baby fed and the car started. And anyway, there are no conditions on how fast you must shop or how, while in a parking space. (Can you imagine?! "No browsing, or chatting! Or stopping to feed your baby! Essential items only!")

Anyone who thinks you WBU is probably a bit dim really hasn't thought it through IMO.

merrymouse Mon 03-Dec-12 21:42:42

Presumably going to the shopping centre and seeing father christmas wasn't a disability issue either. They could all have stayed at home and left the space free for somebody who apparently needed to use the shopping centre for a less frivolous purpose. [hmmm]

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 21:42:43

Isn't it in the best interests of the OP's older children, not to have to sit in the car with a screaming hungry baby?

The OP hasn't done anything wrong. The person at fault here (other than some of the horrid people on this thread) is the shopping centre, who have not provided enough BB spaces for their customers. I would suggest writing a sternly worded letter to them, rather than shouting at the OP.

Sometimes I go to my local shopping centre for the sole purpose of window shopping and going for a walk with the baby if it isn't raining. I don't give a rats muff if I am taking up a space that someone else needs/wants. Thems the breaks. Leave the house earlier.

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 21:43:43

If it is raining, rather.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 21:44:00

Nolittle - but having the other children (including the badge holder) safely in the car rather than for eg. sitting on the floor in a busy shopping centre while the baby is fed is a health issue.

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 21:45:40

dont be so fucking ridiculous nolittle OP said at least one of her children are liable to collapse..caring for a tiny baby has a knock on effect on the rest of the family of course...drag them back into the shopping centre/drive them round looking for a fecking 'verge' to stop on, when they might need feeding??? hmm You have no idea what *OPs kids needs even are...how dare you say she is 'entitled'

its not like she just pulled into the space to feed baby is it? that time could equally have been spend strapping other kids in/loading up bags...in fact OPs OH was doing this whilst Op was Bfing baby...other shouty woman was an impatient entitled arse

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 21:47:27

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 21:47:39

I can't see anywhere in the guidelines that says that is wrongful use. Op is using the car to keep her children who have disabilities safe.

we have a double buggy a single and have to watch dd1 very carefully as she often collapses it was just too busy for us inside the shopping centre and ds2 was v grumpy

The baby needed feeding. The children who are entitled to the badges are in the car, being kept safe in a contained environment, whilst the baby was being fed. The op had payed for the space, and it was still in use. End of.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:48:48

Feeding was not disability related! and in RL babies have to wait sometimes, Op had other options if necessary. What about my need of and right to dignity sherry, do you not see that? It's sad OP finds things hard but she is not the only one and being a lactating mother to kids with disabilities does not give her the right to do as she pleases, anymore than my disability would give me the right to eat a sandwich in the car, whilst others were waiting, even though I struggle to eat 'tidily' because of it, and would feel more comfortable doing it in private. Also why do you think all people with disabilities have to be nice/ compassionate, we are not saints and nor should we be treated as such!

OP world's smallest violin was directed at you not the DC's you have to make the best of it and have a grab the world by the balls attitude, otherwise you would feel sad forever and get nothing done or changed. That's just how I feel, you've got to reliquish sympathy from society to make your Dc's place in it more equal I've found, that's what DM has taught me,

makachu Mon 03-Dec-12 21:49:03

OP, Nolittle expects that rather than feed your screaming and distressed baby in the car, in the space that you were entitled to use, you should have waited in a queue with your disabled children for a spot in a cafe in a crowded and over stimulating environment with your baby screaming all the while getting more and more distressed. OR that you should have sat on the floor with your disabled children. OR that you should have parked dangerously and illegally to feed your baby with your disabled children and faced the possibility of having to move the car quickly with the baby not strapped in. OR you should have driven home with the baby distressed and screaming, which is not only distressing for your baby, but I can imagine would be dangerously distracting and distressing for your disabled children. The baby's condition will have a big effect on the welfare of your other children too. If they weren't with you, it would have been much easier for you to just feed somewhere else but it doesn't really work that way does it? The blue badge is there to enable your family to live as close to normality as possible and to HELP your kids get out of the house, which it did. Without having got the space so you could feed the baby you wouldn't have been able to take them out at all.

It would have been perfectly reasonable to feed the baby in the car with the kids there using it as a quiet spot then gone back to the shops to carry on with your day! It's understandable that people were frustrated that they couldn't get a space, but that's not your problem. Don't feel guilty about inconveniencing others who didn't get there as early, be proud that you managed to get the kids out for the day. I don't like the way people are suggesting you just let the baby scream for however long it takes to get somewhere safe to feed. The baby is a person too. Why should it put up with discomfort just because it's not an adult?

Also, OP, you sound like a nice considerate person. I bet that if the people waiting to use the space had let you know that there was a medical emergency you'd have moved, but that wasn't the case was it? They were just impatient to get into the space you were perfectly entitled to be using. They were no more entitled to it than you and the sane majority seem to understand that.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 21:49:59

You would think that ryledup but nolittle will be back with another post soon enough!

All bb holders are deserving of a bb space, but some more deserving than others hmm

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:51:33

Mackchu I never said they should find a cafe once. I did say, as others have, they could have moved the car! no waiting required for anyone then!

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 21:52:06

Spoke too soon

makachu Mon 03-Dec-12 21:52:14

But she's already said she couldn't move the car. Where was she supposed to move it to?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:53:34

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf never said that either, just said she shouldn't hold up the space when she could have moved away. Or is the baby Jesus?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:54:30

err out of the carpark???

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 21:55:26

But she couln't move away. There was nowhere to move the car to.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 21:55:32

Nolittle will have the google map up of where op was and will be suggesting the places she could have stopped next.

Nolittle with respect you were not there, you do not have intimate knowledge of the car park set up. We only have what the op has told us to go on. You seem to think making up scenarios constitutes fact.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:57:51

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf what is your problem, can I not express my views? That is what OP has done on a public forum no less, or can you only join in if share your view? Need to know for future posts

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 21:58:04

She couldnt move the car. She had the children in it to keep them safe whilst she fed the baby. She had nowhere else to go and she was parked in a place that they were entitled to park in. This isnt just a breastfeeding issue, its an issue about keeping her other children with disabilities safe whilst she tended to the younger one. What part of that exactly do you not understand???

makachu Mon 03-Dec-12 21:58:07

Presumably if it was that busy in the shopping centre that there was no where to park in the car park they'd have had to drive around for a long time out of it before they could park anywhere outside it on a busy shopping day close to Christmas.

Chunkychicken Mon 03-Dec-12 21:58:42

Nolittle so you would double park your car so you could use the facilities. Would you expect other people to hurl abuse at you because you were stopping them driving around the car park/getting in or out of a space because you had an essential need?!!! The baby NEEDED feeding. You obvi

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 21:59:02

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf neither were you. What made up scenarios? suggestions, yes, made up no.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 21:59:32

No I suppose feeding was not DIRECTLY disability related but ds2 is very hard to feed esp if he is overtired and crying.he was tube fed initially as was very ill at birth and still cannot have any solids so milk is his only food and whilst it is not a huge issue it is still significant to me I do get stressed when he is hungry I don't like him waiting and screaming.if we could have moved we would have but there was no option to and it does upset me to get shouted at Iam not a confrontational person at all.

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:00:44

OP world's smallest violin was directed at you not the DC's you have to make the best of it and have a grab the world by the balls attitude, otherwise you would feel sad forever and get nothing done or changed. That's just how I feel, you've got to reliquish sympathy from society to make your Dc's place in it more equal I've found, that's what DM has taught me

Your DM may have done better to have taught you a little more tolerance and compassion. You're needs do not morally override the needs of others automatically because you are an adult with a disability.

The OP would not have been using that space any less by remaining in the shopping centre to feed her baby. She would still have been using an accessible parking space for longer in order to meet the needs of someone who was not entitled to a blue badge. Where she was sitting while she fulfilled those needs is irrelevant. Whichever venue she chose she did not have the option to move the car before feeding the baby.

If it is OK to remain in a space while others consume food it is also OK to remain in the space while the baby does the same. Our society has no unwritten rules which stipulate that parking spaces in shopping centres are only to be used by people making purchases.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:01:04

Chunkychicken as I have pointed out I would ask where else to park, but yes I would do that and put up with abuse, rather than piss myself

Chunkychicken Mon 03-Dec-12 22:01:06

You obviously have never had a screaming hungry baby then - the crying goes through you like a knife, you get anxious & can't concentrate on anything else and can even end up soaked in milk & have the embarrasment of walking around in wet & stained clothing...

(Sorry for 2 posts, posting on my phone whilst bfing my DS...)

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:02:48

I have no problem, do you?

Chunkychicken Mon 03-Dec-12 22:03:20

Surely then nolittle you would think the ABUSER was BU not YOU??!! So why is the OP BU to use the space as she sees fit?

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:04:32

Hope you aren't in a bb space chunky! Nolittle might need it!

Chunkychicken Mon 03-Dec-12 22:06:03

Glaikit grin

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:06:05

Goldmandra, I never said my needs over ride anyones when there are no other options, but when there are, and were, then they do, as anyone else would override mine in a similar situation. I'd rather have guts and be ballsy than be pathetic, so I think DM has done a brilliant job, I have achieved as much and more than most of my able bodied peers, which considering my difficulties is amazing.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:06:28

Nolittle you have stated that the op was in breach of bb guidelines. Can you please provide the link that shows this.

makachu Mon 03-Dec-12 22:07:52

This could go round in circles all night hmm

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:08:27

And I'm sure that most peo

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:08:56

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf, being soaked in BM is understandable for an adult, unpleasant but understood, my problem has a great deal of stigma attached. Babies cry, I spend lots of time with them, no big deal.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:09:31

I was just thinking that makachu! But I'm waiting for the guidelines that back up nolittles argument.

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 22:09:53

And yet somehow, nolittle, amongst all those achievements, there is no medal for empathy, or reasonableness, or just general notbeingacowbagness.

There was no reasonable alternative for the OP and her family.

<will refrain from gavel-ing>

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:10:08

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf are you suggesting I'm lying? Disability law is my job!

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:10:21

At least quote the right person nolittle. I have made no mention of bm.

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:11:06

Try again....
Im sure most people would move for you if you had to use the loo quickly. And I am sure most people would be kind about it too. Unlike you, who seems to find it impossible to consider anyone elses difficulties aside from your own.

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:12:05

Disabilty law is a big part of my job too. Show me the link!

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:12:35

No I am not calling you a liar, but I cannot find anything that backs up what you are saying, That op was breaching guidelines in using the space to provide for the needs of the non bb holder.

And a guideline is just that, a guideline, not a law. You should know that, what with it being your job.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:12:44

also the guidelines are on cuddles post. The EA and disability access frameworks can be found on google.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:13:45

Right, which part?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:15:01

EA and guidelines are law btw. Its taken me years to become au fait with the subject but if you can find answers to jurisprudential issues in seconds, here have my qualifications.

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:15:38

And who is going to enforce this in the private car park?

Again I'll mention the right to feed your child in public unhindered. Who is going to move on the op? Because I cannot see how your argument can be backed up with legislation.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:15:51

which docs do you have?

makachu Mon 03-Dec-12 22:16:08

Nolittle, it must be awful for you, but show a little empathy for the OP, it's hard for her too. You must be able to see that the situation wasn't that straight forward. Surely the answer to the scenario that you or someone with similar needs were waiting for the space is that if you let the person in the space know the problem in a round about way i.e. said something along the lines of "I'm sorry but I need to use the bathroom quickly due to my disability are you going to be very long?" Then it would be clear that you or hypothetical person would have priority, but this wasn't the case so as it stands the OP had the right to use the space as her baby's needs will have had a significant effect on her other children.

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:17:40

Find me the part that says the op can't remain in her parking spot under the circumstances she has described. It says that you need to give consideration to other users wherever possible. It wasn't possible in this scenario. Care to add to that?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:21:17

As I said you are not au fait with the subject and it shows, private car parks are business and are under the same constraints as any other, under EU leg. I know the right to feed a child is unhindered, but it wasn't hindered anyway, so your point? I never said it should be, she can feed a child outside of the parking space for as long as she wants. But access to disability space and priority are legislated for and protected, just as the unhindered right to feed the child is. I will NEVER be persuaded that OP was reasonable.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:22:37

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:24:16

and it was reasonable the child has no nutritional issues and was not in immediate danger, she could have moved out of the car park

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:25:24

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf I have said numerous times that I would have asked politely!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:25:52

but I would still have asked and expected her to move

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 22:25:56

Isn't asking her to move from the space attempting to hinder her from breastfeeding though?

Chunkychicken Mon 03-Dec-12 22:25:57

Nuff said nolittle I hope that everyone that crosses your path has a great deal more empathy and, dare I say it, good will to all men at this time of year than you do. Sounds like you've been dealt a shitty hand, doesn't mean you should share it around though...

muddledmamma Mon 03-Dec-12 22:26:03

Interesting discussion. Do the disabled children in the car not have the right to be kept safe? Should the op have driven the car in highpressure conditions (a screaming baby causes high pressure, esp in a contained space). So could you not argue that the space was being used appropriately as the disabled childrens' needs were being met at the time?

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:27:20

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:27:24

How is allowing a mother to feed a child unhindered the same and not putting the child in immediate danger?

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:27:52

But by asking her to move whilst feeding her child goes against her right to feed unhindered. Which is also legislated for and protected, so which wins??

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:27:57

the same as....

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:29:45

Is jurisprudential disability law part of your job rydump or just the application of the law after the issues have been worked out? If it is Jp then you should be able to find it yourself! hmm

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 22:29:51

So legally, she has every right to breastfeed whereever she wants, and the rights of her children to use the space as a 'refuge' and to be kept safe and contained are protected? So she's actually doubly in the right to use the space, yes? {fgrin}

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 22:30:03

but I would still have asked and expected her to move

even though, you still have no idea what her or any of her childrens needs actually are??

does her breast feeding her baby, cancel out all her disability needs?

RebeccaMumsnet (MNHQ) Mon 03-Dec-12 22:30:25

<ahem>

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:30:40

your last post was not patronizing at all

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:32:15

Peace and love Rebecca, peace and love smile

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:32:16

Making a child wait a short time for food does not put them in immediate danger! It is not the same and trivializes situations where children are in real danger!

GlaikitFizzogTheChristmasElf Mon 03-Dec-12 22:35:13

Right, I'm off to bed! G'night ladies, its been ...... Interesting!

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 22:35:22

But forcing the children to hang around in a busy shopping centre (that they may find upsetting and challenging) while the baby is fed (on the floor hmm ) could be dangerous.

I think the issue is that you are starting from the point that it is entirely reasonable that the baby should have to wait an unknown period of time (until they can find another space, pull over somewhere, get stuck in traffic on the way home etc) for it's main source of nutrition, and most other people are starting from the point that the baby should not have to wait, and the OP can either feed quickly in the car or drag everyone back in to the crowded mall and feed the baby there.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:35:32

Easily bored, no. She wasn't going to go back in and the DC's had been out, so the refuge principle would not apply! There reason that DC should been in danger, they did not need to stay in the car park!

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:35:51

You really live in a bubble here don't you. With just you in the centre of it. No consideration for anyone else whatsoever.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:36:09

Hi Rebecca my first AIBU has been a lot of fun! grin

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:36:33

As stated above the mother has the right to feed her baby unhindered yet your justification for saying she should have moved instead is that it would not put the child in immediate danger.

So how is the lack of immediate danger relevant to the right to feed unhindered smile

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:37:11

Temper temper Rydum! I am what I am ....

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 22:37:53

Car park rage is only going to get worse in the run-up to Christmas isn't it?
(Thinking may take LO to a feed-in in my local multi-storey to see what happens).

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:38:17

But she wasn't prevented from feeding, she could have parked alongside me I wouldn't have minded

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:39:36

immediate danger relates to rydump's thing about consideration

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 22:40:27

What, feed near the baby near you with the attitude toward babies you've expressed in several posts on this thread? No chance!

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:41:15

Hi Rebecca my first AIBU has been a lot of fun!

I don't think the OP thought the things you were saying to her were very much fun sad

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:41:36

Takataka yep. Feeding not a disability issue here. Rydumps quote actually, used consideration in last point, not that one.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 22:42:35

Seriously if you have a breastfed baby in your arms and he/she is screaming, you put them to the breast. You do not attempt to strap them into a car seat and drive round looking for a space. Well, some people might, but not anyone I know.

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 22:43:40

I know it's AIBU but it's not a game sad Not meant to be 'fun'. And, it's not meant to be one person's show either (especially when that person is not even the OP!)

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:43:43

Goldmara, why did she come on a forum then? Anyhow, I've enjoyed the banter you guys are too ridiculously self righteous about child bearing and rearing at times! IMOH

EasilyBored Mon 03-Dec-12 22:45:16

Charming nolittle. Merry fucking Christmas to you too.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:45:39

Mistress, I would, does your point mean that if you FF and run out you are a terrible parent as you can't feed immediately ?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:46:12

re one persons show, why did you keep responding then?

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:46:58

Goldmara, why did she come on a forum then?

For support and reassurance after someone behaved aggressively towards her at a stressful time.

I'm sorry that you have taken this as an opportunity for a bit of sport. That isn't really what MN is for.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:47:01

Thanks so much Easily, hope you have a good'un xx

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 22:47:22

I only did what I thought was best for the dcs. I can see how it could be frustrating for somebody with bowel/bladder issues as part of their disability for example, I imagine th possibiloty of having an accident could cause you to become anxious about such a situation arising.I never set out to deprive anybody of a space and in the circumstances I do not think I was in the wrong as many others have agreed with what I did.I am not saying for one minute that having 4 disabled dcs makes me any more entitled to a bb space but it does make things very very difficult when something like this happens.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:48:29

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:50:38

OP shall we shake hands? I have massive respect for any parents of DC's with issues, sometimes stuff gets under my skin and I have to let rip grin

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:52:14

and the rest gave me a lot of oxygen, but OH is happy, you've given him a break grin

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 22:54:29

its has nothing to do with being 'self righteous about child bearing/rearing'

its about OP being entitled to stay in the parking space for as long as she needs it, and not be hurried out of it by some gob-shite

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 22:55:16

Am loving your attempt to introduce a ff/bf element, are you getting bored?
I'd be surprised if a ff parent ran out completely of formula to be honest, not great planning when you know you have a baby to be fed.
I have been unable to feed baby (driving on motorway) for some time and it was an awful feeling, wouldn't do that if I could help it.
You're right, shouldn't reply to you but so hard when you keep saying things I disagree with.

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:56:41

I think you should find a different way to vent your frustrations in future NoLittle

Your need to 'let rip' should be fulfilled at the expense of others in this way.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:56:45

TakkaTakka come on, I agree she shouldn't have been shouted at, sorry but you guys do seem to be quite self righteous on the whole. BTW am I a gobshite? wink

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 22:57:17

shouldn't be.... blush

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 22:57:34

I have no problem with you nolittle-like you said you are entitld to an opinion.I understand how some things can be a massiv sore point when you have a disability and sometimes I get angry on dcs behalf. You sound like you have a really hard time of it too.hand shaken.

ariane5 Mon 03-Dec-12 22:57:36

I have no problem with you nolittle-like you said you are entitld to an opinion.I understand how some things can be a massiv sore point when you have a disability and sometimes I get angry on dcs behalf. You sound like you have a really hard time of it too.hand shaken.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 22:58:36

MistressIggi I am pro choice when it comes to feeding methods, and that did seem to be your implication, whether you meant it or not.

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 22:59:03

my first AIBU has been a lot of fun!

oh yes, super fun. Because you are just a big barrel of laughs. Delightful to meet you for sure.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:00:05

Come on you guys you don't really tall this seriously do you? I thought that was just Daily Fail propaganda wink

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 23:00:42

you appear to be the self-righteous one here IMO

what exactly do you perceive people to be getting self-righteous about?

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 23:00:53

Only if you are looking for controversy, as you clearly are. I wrote about bf as the OP's baby was bf. Feeding a baby this way is instant, unlike if she had had to get hot water to make up formula. Many (not all) bf babies are used to feeding on demand hence the screaming.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:01:00

I've enjoyed are time together RyleDup xx

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:01:39

RyleDup are you the only one who can get ryled then?

MistressIggi Mon 03-Dec-12 23:02:08

And on this I am going to bed... we don't take it seriously? Do you mean the OP was joking? Wasn't upset? Hasn't got disabled children? Is a troll?
Or just that we shouldn't consider our responses to her question as being directed at a real human being who deserves some respect?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:04:55

MistressIggi you've proved my point wonderfully, by revealing how seriously you take yourself! I still enjoyed it!

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 23:06:29

Goodness, you've actually managed to get my name right after about 1 billion posts. And in answer to your point, of course everyone is entitled to an opinion. All part of the rich tapestry and all that. But your rudeness at some points has been uncalled for.

Goldmandra Mon 03-Dec-12 23:07:01

Nolittle I suggest you go back and read the talk guidelines, not in the spirit of one who enjoys finding a loophole to justify their behaviour because that would be pointless. Perhaps you could look at the intention of the guidelines and acknowledge that there are those who are genuinely asking for affirmation and support on this forum.

There are regularly light hearted threads on here. Perhaps your need for sport could be fulfilled on those in future.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:08:14

So were your patronizing attempts to tell me what I do!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:09:40

Gold, I'm really not fussed TBH

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:10:51

Ryled up, I don't think I was rude to anyone TBH

ginnybag Mon 03-Dec-12 23:11:56

Nolittle - do you have children? What research have you done into demand feeding, prolonged crying etc?

There's a fair body of research out there now showing that crying is a very lte sign of hunger in a baby and that ignoring baby's crying leads to some serious physiological effects, including raised intercranial pressure, raised blood pressure, blood flow changes, reduces blood volume to the heart, as well as the obvious overheating from exertion etc.

Then there's the fact that getting a stressed out screaming infant to latch and take a full feed is nigh on impossible, leading to a vicious cycle.

OP has said that this is a child with disabilities, with feeding issues. We don't know (because she rightly hasn't told us) what those are, but I'm struggling to think of any physical disability that's improved by being hungry and stressed out?

Do you feel better starving and stressed? Or do you have side effects? How long would they last?

Shall we contemplate the negative effects of listening to their sibling scream for half an hour - baby cries are designed to be stress causing to those listening to them. The eldest DD - prone to collapsing - would have been served well by that.

The OP did exactly what you say she should do - dealt with the needs of her children - her disabled children - first and did not look for sympathy from anyone. She's clearly and repeatedly stated that there was nowhere to move to, and nowhere to stop on her way home, so no other option.

If other BB holders had to wait, that's unfortunate, but perhaps they, like the OP, should have planned better. It's not her fault they didn't.

But, whatever the reason, whatever the rhyme, shouting at someone else in public, especially in front of their children is truly out of order. Now, you say you'd be nice if you'd been there, but you've been anything but on here. So are you only a rude, judgmental madam from safe anonymity or are you lying and are actually horribly rude in person, too??

The SN boards of MN are a phenomenal place - full of stunningly smart, generous women who face life with grace and compassion in the face of some astonishingly trying circumstances. Go, read, learn.

RyleDup Mon 03-Dec-12 23:14:02

No, not patronising. You failed to back up your arguments and responded with rudeness instead. An attempt to muddy the waters no doubt. Anyway, I'm leaving this thread now and off for a wander round the vast rooms of mumsnet. I don't think theres much more to be said here and I don't want to get into a petty squable.

Welcome to AIBU by the way. smile

Afrodizzywonders Mon 03-Dec-12 23:16:54

OP, I think it's fair to say you have the overwhelming support from people on this thread. Don't dwell on certain peoples posts who'se arguments were pretty crap and who chose to ignore whatever you said......they have come across pretty badly to the overwhelming empathetic majority.

Get yourself a nice cocoa and forget about this, I hope your children enjoyed meeting Santa......

Wouldn't it be nice to have a 'hide poster' button!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:18:37

I have done no research into feeding and never claimed to have done, I never said I agreed with Op being shouted at. I am neither rude nor horrible and do a great deal of work into disability rights and awareness and know exactly how smart and generous people with disabilities are. Please don't ever patronize me like that again Ginnybags.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:20:48

Would have linked, but didn't see the point as is all REALLY heavy and indepth, the stuff I have, takes hours to read. Thanks for the welcome! grin

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Mon 03-Dec-12 23:22:08

Afrodizzywonders glad I produced such a reaction

CoolaYuleA Mon 03-Dec-12 23:27:13

Back to the OP....

You should not have been shouted at. That was wrong.

But, I am the driver for a BB holder, and the booklet clearly states that the BB can only be used to meet the needs of the BB holder. Your baby isn't the BB holder. You aren't the BB holder. Therefore using the BB to continue to occupy a space to provide care to a non BB holder is against the rules,

Your two children who are the BB holders were strapped in the car, their needs were met and that would not have changed regardless of whether you stayed or went. You didn't continue to occupy the space to provide them with care - you continued to occupy the space because you happened to be in it when your non BB holding child required care. This was unreasonable, and against the rules.

That said I do appreciate it was a difficult circumstance, and I can see why you did it. But as you said it was "not directly disability related" (or words to that effect) so you were being unreasonable to continue to use the space.

As for what you should have done instead - if you did want to use the BB you could have parked on double yellow lines, so you could have pulled over the minute you were out of the carpark. This would have been outside the rules as well, but it would have caused less problems and wouldn't have inconvenienced other BB holders wanting to use their badges within the rules.

I am sorry that you were shouted at, and sorry that you were put in this position. But when taken back to the very basics - the baby you were feeding isn't a BB holder so is therefore not entitled to use a BB space to have his needs met.

I am not going to berate you for it though, because I'm sure you were having a difficult enough morning as it is, and I'm sure most of us would have thought "just do it quick" too, and done as you did. I would have, although I would have moved the first time I was asked (whilst feeling horrible listening to my LO's indignant "I wasn't finished!" wails). You were understandably stressed and flustered, so personally I would chalk this one up to experience and move on.

Still think the other woman was wrong to have shouted at you though!

Afrodizzywonders Mon 03-Dec-12 23:30:30

FFS - petty people.

I shall hide thread immediately.

takataka Mon 03-Dec-12 23:42:57

Good post ginny smile

tittytittyhanghang Mon 03-Dec-12 23:51:10

Your two children who are the BB holders were strapped in the car, their needs were met and that would not have changed regardless of whether you stayed or went

But that statements not true is it. If the op had strapped the screaming baby in and moved off, it quite well could have impacted on the two children who were BB holders. Only op knows if her unsettled screaming baby strapped presumably in the back with the other children would have had a negative/detrimental affect on her other two children.

SamSmalaidh Mon 03-Dec-12 23:54:23

CoolaYuleA - actually, I don't think this:
Your two children who are the BB holders were strapped in the car, their needs were met and that would not have changed regardless of whether you stayed or went. You didn't continue to occupy the space to provide them with care - you continued to occupy the space because you happened to be in it when your non BB holding child required care. This was unreasonable, and against the rules.
is true.

The OP's only other option would have been to get the children (including the BB holders) out of the car and go back into the busy shopping centre, sit them on the floor while she fed the baby. As at least one of the children is prone to collapsing, this wasn't a safe and comfortable option for them - sitting in the car was better for the BB holders and blocked the space for less time than going back inside would.

muddledmamma Tue 04-Dec-12 00:15:15

tittytittyhanghang, hear, hear!

Now try saying that 10 times fast smile

CoolaYuleA Tue 04-Dec-12 00:32:12

titty - you're assuming that it's not true. The OP hasn't actually said what disability her children have (and nor should she have to) but to state what I have said isn't true is an assumption. Having a disability doesn't automatically mean that a person will be upset by a baby crying and as they live in the same house as the baby, who the OP states cries when tired and hungry, it's unlikely to be an unknown sound to them, particularly the oldest (one of the BB holders) who has three younger siblings who will all have cried as babies. I suggested a move that would have taken a couple of minutes - I wouldn't expect anyone to do 25 minutes with a screaming baby. I've done it through necessity (we lived 45 mins from children's A&E and were told to take DD in - she screamed all the way) and it was horrendous.

Sam with a BB she did have the option of parking on any double yellow lines outside the carpark as long as they weren't loading. So saying her only other option was to go back inside isn't actually the case. She could have asked her DH to drive out the carpark, pulled over almost immediately, on double yellows if necessary (because BB holders are allowed to) and then fed the baby. The only difference being that the baby might have cried for a couple of minutes. No getting out of the car for anyone.

I totally agree that sitting in the car was better for the BB holders - my option doesn't suggest that they get out. The baby might have had a couple of minutes wait but the feeding situation for everyone else would have been the same. The only difference would have been the space would have been freed.

That's what I would have done if I was out with my BB holder and my DD needed feeding.

LDNmummy Tue 04-Dec-12 00:45:18

I would have been patient and waited.

What is the world coming too sad

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Tue 04-Dec-12 00:54:04

But Coola, don't the same rules apply re double yellow lines ie if OP was parked there for something deemed not to be for the BB holders' needs, she shouldn't be stopped there. And if it is ok for her to be there for the sake of the BB holders, then it's surely ok for her to remain in her current space.

Or are the rules different re double yellow lines?

IneedAsockamnesty Tue 04-Dec-12 00:58:19

Coola as your insisting she misused the badge by parking in the bay why on earth would it not be a misuse to use it on a double yellow line for exactly the same thing?

And it's not misusing it unless the badge holder is being left in the car whilst the person who is not a bb holder goes off on a jolly. If all the people are in the car and its stopped whilst one person tends to the direct needs of another providing it either directly or indirectly contributes to the needs or comfort of the blue badge holder it's perfectly legal.

It's very obvious that the 2 bb holders in the car were having there needs met by not having to exit the car to find a suitable feeding place and not have to listen to the screaming.

I have several bb holders in my household inc myself I also have a baby at least 2 of the bb holders in my household would have extream problems being stuck in a car with a screaming baby one of them would quite possibly wet themselves or start trying to escape the car by kicking out ect. This would be as a direct result of her disability. For all we know it could be something that was relevant to the ops situation it's most certainly not a random strangers place to ask this the blue badge being correctly displayed should be enough.

IneedAsockamnesty Tue 04-Dec-12 01:04:17

Feeding was not disability related! and in RL babies have to wait sometimes, Op had other options if necessary. What about my need of and right to dignity sherry, do you not see that? It's sad OP finds things hard but she is not the only one and being a lactating mother to kids with disabilities does not give her the right to do as she pleases, anymore than my disability would give me the right to eat a sandwich in the car, whilst others were waiting, even though I struggle to eat 'tidily' because of it, and would feel more comfortable doing it in private. Also why do you think all people with disabilities have to be nice/ compassionate, we are not saints and nor should we be treated as such!

Your bb does give you the right to use the space even to eat your lunch. If you require your car to be parked to do so,its a correct use of a parking space by a bb holder

CoolaYuleA Tue 04-Dec-12 01:09:20

The rules are the same TheDoctrine - this was what I put in my first post:

"This would have been outside the rules as well, but it would have caused less problems and wouldn't have inconvenienced other BB holders wanting to use their badges within the rules."

The point I was making was that the OP wasn't entitled to use the BB for feeding her baby as the baby isn't a BB holder but if she felt the baby couldn't wait to get home to be fed, and that going back in wasn't an option and she was happy to use the BB to enable her to feed then there was an alternative which wouldn't have stopped other BB holders using their BB's within the rules.

I'm not saying it would have been right to do so, rather that it would have been a better "wrong" if the BB was going to be used outside the rules as it wouldn't have impacted on others.

I think another point that is worth mentioning is that if any of the people who asked her to move decided to report the OP (which I would hope they wouldn't because that's just petty) she could actually lose her two children's very necessary BBs because she was misusing them. There are consequences for not following the rules, and one of them is removal of BB. I doubt they would do it for one transgression, but the chance is there. My BB holder is terrified of this happening so is adamant we stick rigidly to every single rule hence why I have read the regs repeatedly.

IneedAsockamnesty Tue 04-Dec-12 01:22:00

Not if it was needed to prevent a issue with the bb holder she wouldn't

MollyMurphy Tue 04-Dec-12 02:25:38

YANBU OP, nobody's business what your doing and getting out of the car to tell you to hurry up was rude and OTT.

I am the driver for a BB holder, and the booklet clearly states that the BB can only be used to meet the needs of the BB holder. Your baby isn't the BB holder. You aren't the BB holder. Therefore using the BB to continue to occupy a space to provide care to a non BB holder is against the rules,

That is like saying that as the driver of a BB holder if you go shoe shopping for you with the BB holder accompanying you that you should park in a regular space because the shoes are for you (which is silly).

It isn't who the errand or trip is for that makes it a BB moment (ma-gic mo-mements... anyone else fancying Quality street?), it is the fact that a BB holder is with you and using the space will make the trip more accessible. Being able to feed the baby while making sure the BB holders are safe makes the mall more accessible for the BB holder and the driver thereof.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Tue 04-Dec-12 06:46:25

To me, it seems that both the OP and the person queuing for the space had a reasonable case to be in the space and whether you think it's 60:40 in favour of the OP or vice versa is a matter of opinion. I would be awfully surprised if any official interpretation resulted in a judgment of misuse of the badge. Personally I think that interpretation would be more likely if she had moved to double yellow lines specifically to tend to the baby rather than simply staying a little longer in a space where they had been parked for the clear benefit of the BB holders.

merrymouse Tue 04-Dec-12 06:50:10

I would imagine that there are many times when the parent of a BB holder has need of a disabled space to do something that is purely for their own personal benefit because they can't leave their child alone at home or alone in the car. As with children who don't require a BB, it is difficult to differentiate between the child's needs and the parent's needs.

Generally double yellow lines aren't painted on the road randomly. They are there because if you park there you are blocking traffic or parking dangerously.

ariane5 Tue 04-Dec-12 08:51:24

It is very difficult for me to try and explain my decision as to why we stayed in bb space without giving full details of all dcs medical problems which would for one take a while and I would feel a little uncomfortable doing so.they all have sam genetic cond but othr related problems to do with it and also sp issues they all have different needs it is very difficult to fully explain but be reassured it was the only option we had given our circumstances. I do hope I did not break bb rules I would be devastated if we lost bb because of an incident like this ever occuring again.

ariane5 Tue 04-Dec-12 08:51:26

It is very difficult for me to try and explain my decision as to why we stayed in bb space without giving full details of all dcs medical problems which would for one take a while and I would feel a little uncomfortable doing so.they all have sam genetic cond but othr related problems to do with it and also sp issues they all have different needs it is very difficult to fully explain but be reassured it was the only option we had given our circumstances. I do hope I did not break bb rules I would be devastated if we lost bb because of an incident like this ever occuring again.

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 09:18:06

Ariane5 please don't let these individual posters comments eat at you, honestly, everyone except a handful is with you which says it all. I cannot believe some of the posts on here that have had a pop, completely petty minded, it just got hijacked by people who were bored and out to stir if you ask me. You have done nothing wrong and the fact that you are now being scared about having your BB taken away is unforgivable, so please do ignore those comments.

You sound a very considerate person, any one I know would have waited for you to feed the baby and would have fully understood your predicament. My DS would never feed in a busy hectic environment so I'd nip to the car to feed him as well, plus it was more private, it's no one else's business it really is. You could have just been popping back to do that before embarking on round 2 of shopping.

No need to justify yourself, just realise there are people out there who are impatient and self centred who think they are more deserving than you are and thankfully to date you've not run into many of them. Not very nice people who will have a go at woman feeding her baby's who think you should park on double yellow lines FFS??? Or leave your baby cry because they can't wait. people who hijack a genuine thread for support as 'sport' - don't waste any more head space on these people, no one will take your blue badge away.

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 09:20:17

There is no reason why you should explain any further OP.

The rules of BBs state that you are parking your car in a particular place for the benefit of the holder. You did exactly that. There is nothing in the rules which says that the needs of another family member may not delay departure from the space.

Your children need a family life. Part of family life is going on shopping trips together. If the needs of a baby could not be met appropriately on that trip your older children's need for a family life cannot be met.

There is no question that the badge would be removed for this as the requirement is that the badge is used in order to enable the holder to gain access to the facilities. That is exactly what it was used for. Nowhere does it state that the trip must not also meet any needs of others in the party.

Blue badges get withdrawn when people abuse them by brazenly using them without the holder present. You are clearly not the sort of person to do this. Don't let a couple of people who are up for a good old ding-dong cause you to doubt yourself.

aufaniae Tue 04-Dec-12 09:30:41

Those of you who are saying the OP is BU -

Are you saying the OP shouldn't ever feed her DCs while on a shopping trip while using the BB to park?

What if she had gone to a cafe for example, to sit down and feed her DD? Do you have a problem with that? No one would have got upset then, as they wouldn't have known what she was doing but it would have taken longer!

It's totally illogical to say she can't feed her baby in the car, (not to mention staggeringly unkind) as it's the quickest solution by far. Unless you think that BB holders should only meet the need of the BB holder on a shopping trip, so no buying anything for anyone else in the group, for example? Also no stopping for a cup of tea, unless it's specifically the BB holder who needs one.

Is this how you think it should be?!

diddl Tue 04-Dec-12 09:33:04

I´m still gobsmacked that OP paid for the ticket!

Why can´t she then do what she wants in the space that she is entitled to be in-like anyone one else who is paying for a parking space?

ariane5 Tue 04-Dec-12 09:34:02

Thankyou afro and gold. I just feel down about the whole thing we so rarely go out as a family because it is so so difficult and to be shouted at was just horrible. I am going to try and forget about it and keep looking at the photo of dcs with father christmas!

ariane5 Tue 04-Dec-12 09:34:04

Thankyou afro and gold. I just feel down about the whole thing we so rarely go out as a family because it is so so difficult and to be shouted at was just horrible. I am going to try and forget about it and keep looking at the photo of dcs with father christmas!

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 09:44:05

You do that, don't let it put you off going out like that again or feeding your baby in the car. You have done nothing wrong.

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 10:03:44

I think it is despicable that anyone is putting the idea that you could lose your BB into your head, Ariane5. It is rubbish.
Follow anyone who has parked with a badge round the shops. You'll see their friends/family going to the toilet! Or buying a coffee to drink even if the BB holder doesn't want one! Or gazing into the window of a shop that the BB holder has no interest in! These must all be abuses of the BB system, if your action was.

diddl Tue 04-Dec-12 10:06:09

Not only that-is was in the interests of the other children-including the BB holder that the feeding happened in the car.

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 10:07:38

True, and also the baby's right to be fed is protected by law, unlike the right to a Starbucks.

mummytime Tue 04-Dec-12 10:08:51

MistressIggi I love your post.
OP you were not BU!

Its Christmas, which as well as good will to all men, also means: stress, grumpiness, crowded car parks, and normally reasonable people totally losing it.

threesocksfullofchocs Tue 04-Dec-12 10:43:16

I wonder what the posts would be like on this thread if it had been a P&T space

starfishmummy Tue 04-Dec-12 10:51:30

The terms of the blue badge I use (for ds) are quite clear in that if the disabled person is sitting in the car it is a breech of the conditions for the blue badge.
So YABU

starfishmummy Tue 04-Dec-12 10:56:05

I mean that if the person is just sitting in the car while it is parked. If they are just sitting in the car then they don't need a disabled parking space.

aufaniae Tue 04-Dec-12 11:17:07

starfish but they weren't just sitting <bangs head on wall>
They were doing something essential (and which is protected by law!) which needed doing before they left.

The alternative is for them to go find somewhere else to feed before coming back to the car, which would take longer. How does that make sense for anyone?!

EldritchCleavage Tue 04-Dec-12 11:30:39

The degree of hostility or at least dismissiveness to babies and children (and their needs) shown by some of the posters who disagree with the OP is deeply unpalatable.

Realistically, if the very strict interpretation of the BB rules that some posters are contending for is correct, then OP and her DH probably can't ever go out as a family, with all 4 children, and use BB spaces to sort out the kids, which I'm guessing would severely limit their ability to go out together at all. For that to be the case for a family with 4 disabled children seems a complete nonsense to me.

And baubles and other posters who have pointed out the aggression is misdirected are absolutely right. There are too few disabled spaces, especially in private car parks. That ought to be a spur to solidarity and commiseration, even in the stressful run-up to Christmas, not an occasion for people with disabilities to fight like cats in a sack for what is there and be utterly horrible to and about a woman with FOUR DISABLED CHILDREN who just wanted a family outing, for once.

myfirstkitchen Tue 04-Dec-12 11:36:42

YANBU

glad your DCs got to see Santa.

There are some right sour lemons about, who are very unreasonable and obviously have some really bad issues which are nothing to do with someone feeding their tiny child in a car who has 4 disabled dcs.

Please don't let these horrid psychotic gits put you off going out as a family!

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 11:37:37

To be fair Eldritch, if there were no normal parking spaces for the OP to pull into to feed, the issue isn't lack of accessible spaces. It's just that this is a very busy time of the year and all parking is under pressure.

It would only be reasonable to direct criticism at the car park company if there are regularly plenty of normal spaces free while the accessible spaces are in short supply. If that is the case fair enough.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 11:39:09

Well said eldritch.

I also find it extremely hard to believe that a person with difficulty judging the capacity of or sensation in their bladder, when they did find themselves desperate for a wee, would choose to drive into the multi-storey carpark of a shopping centre in the run up to Christmas so they could find a disabled space deep inside, get out and then go in search of the toilet rather than utilising their bb to park near to a pub or public toilet. Surely even if the urge came on suddenly as you drove into the carpark it would still be quicker to leave the car park and park somewhere near to a loo nearby than faff around trying to locate a parking space in a multi-storey and then a toilet in the shopping centre?

EldritchCleavage Tue 04-Dec-12 11:39:44

True, Goldmandra.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 11:43:59

And at least if it is your bladder you still have the best information available as to its status even if it is not under full control, when it is a baby as the mother you can't really predict accurately when it will need feeding and especially not when you have a number of other demanding dc to concentrate on, it means you will likely only catch the baby's need for a feed at the last minute anyway.

baublesandbaileys Tue 04-Dec-12 11:44:30

OP you're not going to loose your BB over this!

"The terms of the blue badge I use (for ds) are quite clear in that if the disabled person is sitting in the car it is a breech of the conditions for the blue badge"
- that quite obviously refers to when the disabled person doesn't get out of the car and just waits there while others do! The children that the BB was issued for did get in and out of the car in the OPs situation

threesocksfullofchocs Tue 04-Dec-12 11:46:02

it was probably also essential for the other people who needed that space.
perhaps they wanted to go out and do something nice.
the op was just sitting in her car, she was not using the bb as intended.
it is bot a baby feeding space. it is a space to allow disabled people to go out and about. not to sit in a car.

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 11:48:28

Anywhere a baby is allowed to be, it is allowed to be fed.

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 11:56:12

it is a space to allow disabled people to go out

...which is exactly what they did! confused

When the family returned to the car should they also not have loaded the shopping, strapped the baby into the car seat, put on their own seat belts and folded up the pushchair? These things took time and were not for the direct benefit of the BB holder.

It is about drawing the line at where reasonable becomes unreasonable. Most people would say it is reasonable to stay for a short time to feed a baby. A few others would not agree and in this case some elements of this minority were rude and unpleasant in expressing their opinions.

Whatever the issue there are usually some dissenters on MN. The opinion of the majority should reassure the OP that she acted reasonably smile

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:03:05

offered, there aren't that many public toilets, let alone accessible ones to accomodate my chair, PA and awkwardly positioned lower limbs. Maybe, I should never go out in case the urge comes, and certainly not to a shopping centre as I am obviously too dense to plan around my condition. I reapt, IMO OPs situation had nothing to do with her DCs SN

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:03:33

*repeat

IneedAsockamnesty Tue 04-Dec-12 12:05:22

I just phoned 2 LA's who in my area issue bb's and actually asked the question.

I phrased it as the op's situation and the baby or mother not being bb holders and both informed me that as long as the bb holder/s are not being left in the car whilst other people go out and that is the reason for the journey then it is not a misuse, one also added but you sock are a bb holder so why are you asking,because many moons ago she used to be my admin assist and recognised my voice.

So I told her why she laughed at me and said who ever said its a misuse is scaremongering and probably a bit dim.

megandraper Tue 04-Dec-12 12:08:48

OP, the people criticising you are being unpleasant and silly.

I have a Blue Badge. There have been quite a few times where I have sat in the car, in a disabled space feeding DC3 (either before or after getting out of the car and going into shops/wherever). Usually takes about 10 minutes. She's older now, so I rarely need to do that any more.

But there are times where I check my phone for messages, fiddle about with the satnav to get it operational, turn around and give children in the back a stern talking to before we set off. Etc. etc. etc. I don't pull out of the parking space before I do any of those things.

(Actually I don't pull out of it at all, because my BB is for blindness, so it is DH who does the actual driving).

In order for your disabled children (who qualify for the BB) to go out and about, you as their carer must also care for your other children appropriately. If you could not do this, then your disabled children would never go anywhere.

Disability is a part of life, and people with disabilities need to live their lives. We need to be as considerate of others as anyone else. If you had a sensible option, I am sure you'd have moved your car a few yards to allow the other person to park. And that would have been kind of you, but not obligatory. But you didn't have that option. You did the best thing you could in the situation, and you should not be criticised for it in the slightest.

You sound like a lovely person, OP. I am really sad that you have been upset by this incident and some posters on this thread. I hope you can pay more attention to the (much larger number of) supportive voices. Your family deserve nice days out as much as any other, and the BB is there to help (in a very small way) with that.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:09:11

As a person with 4 small children who often have to queue in busy ladies' toilets for a wee I am extremely aware of the lack of public toilets. The op's childrens' disabilities very definitely affect her ability to feed the baby in another place or at another time. This is a baby who, let us not forget, has the same condition the others do but does not yet have a bb. I don't think it is unreasonable to expect someone to manage their own bladder no, disabled or not, however it is quite a big ask to expect one or two people to manage the complex needs of four disabled children including some (all?) who are non-verbal...

MsElleTow Tue 04-Dec-12 12:10:00

The opinion of the majority should reassure the OP that she acted reasonably

That is not necessarily true. Some of us have blue badges and know the rules. You should not occupy a space for 15/20 minutes with everyone in the car, having no intention of getting out, doing something completely unrelated to the BB holder!

megandraper Tue 04-Dec-12 12:11:33

'having no intention of getting out'

You are factually incorrect MissElleTow. They did get out, and they had just got back in.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:12:53

The fact that Op is worried about losing the BB suggests this and similar has happened before methinks... I never said she would lose the BB, but I would argue [based on my wide JP knowledge and research] that it italics could be seen as a misuse if reported.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:15:05

MSElleTow is right and the LA's if you explained it without bias wink and artful tone of voice, Socks, would agree.

MsElleTow Tue 04-Dec-12 12:15:17

Exactly bedhopper, they had got back in and had no intention of getting back out again. I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't even dream of doing it. I think it is selfish!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:16:18

behopper, they got back into leave, not return to the shops, so Ms is correct

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:18:35

Offered if you are so aware, why make it seem so easy?

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:18:58

She is worried because people like you are trying to frighten her deliberately and calculatedly saying one minute it is "knowledge" and another it is "opinion". It is very clear you do not understand about feeding or children and therefore are missing a huge gap in your "knowledge" which is essential to determining "need" not even mentioning that you don't actually know about the op's children's condition which is the most essential piece of info in determining the need. If you don't want to be scrutinised over which toilet you choose to use why do you get to judge the op's family on such limited information.

megandraper Tue 04-Dec-12 12:19:24

Feeding a baby is a necessary part of any shopping trip MissElleTow(if you have a baby, obviously, not suggesting childless people should go and find a baby to feed grin). To take her DCs (with BB) shopping, the OP needs to keep the baby fed. As I said, I have a BB, and have fed my baby in my car when necessary.

I will go further. If the OP had a toddler who was caught short on the return to the car, she would be justified in staying in the BB space a few minutes longer while she whipped out a potty and got the toddler on to it. I have done this too!

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 12:20:33

Read the thread nolittle, others are suggesting she could lose her BB. You're like a dog with a bone.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:20:35

btw, the existing BB would apply the baby's DX as well, so if he has no feeding difficulties as was suggested then Op should stilll have moved IMHO

megandraper Tue 04-Dec-12 12:21:16

Nolittle, the phrase in the BB guidelines about staying in the car is about the situation where the BB person does not get out of the car at all (ie the trip is actually for someone else's benefit). It is not for the case where the BB person sits in the car for a brief period before or after getting out

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:21:23

Woof woof!!! wink My points are still valid

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:21:24

And I'm not saying it is easy. I'm saying that in the circumstances it could be assumed that it would not be possible to find a toilet urgently and that as it is your bladder it is reasonable to expect you to plan for this and not expect your need to trump anyone else's (without even bothering to find out what their needs are).

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:23:11

Offered, I know it's my bladder, and make adjustments to my fluid intake accordingly, but thanks for the reminder.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:24:15

So what is your point about your bladder then?

MsElleTow Tue 04-Dec-12 12:24:25

And to a many a disabled person a BB space is a necessary part of getting out. Some people would have to go home of they can't find one. The OP's DH could have moved the car because they didn't need that space for those 20 mins! Yes it could be argued that had she have stayed in the shops she couldn't have moved, but she didn't so she could!

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:25:20

Except she did need that space because there wasn't anywhere else for her to move to.

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 12:26:58

To you perhaps, but not to the majority on here.

Perhaps it's time to not give NoLittle any more 'sport' wink

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:27:33

Offered, my point is that after living with my condition all of my life, I am well aware of what I can do to try to reduce the impact of it, however, I will only ever be able to reduce that impact.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:27:49

I think people forget that being fed is extremely essential to a 7 month old, in all likelihood much more essential than any reason any person would ever go to a shopping centre.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:28:21

So how is that relevant to the op?

megandraper Tue 04-Dec-12 12:28:53

Ha ha, think Socrates would struggle with some on here! Logic is not for everyone. I agree, Afro, time to bow out.

OP, you acted rightly. Please don't be put off future outings.

Allonsy Tue 04-Dec-12 12:28:58

Not read all the posts but YANBU you clearly needed to use the space it made no odds if you were in the shops still or in the car either way the space was occupied. Everyone is ratty at the time of year finding any spaces are a nightmare for everyone you have no reason to feel guilty.

Any suggestion that a baby should be fed while moving is ridicuous, be it breast or bottle its dangerous.

MsElleTow Tue 04-Dec-12 12:29:49

I don't believe that within a 3or 4 minute drive there wasn't anywhere else where she could have fed the baby, TBH. Had the baby started screaming when the DC were seeing Santa she would have made it wait, if they had been speeding down the motorway it would have had to wait.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:31:00

Afro, why spoil my fun. I can't help people getting wound up and overly involved in stuff they don't understand, but feel the need to go on about to make themselves seem all lefty, tolerant and accepting whilst at the same time slagging people off for feeding their kids a Pot Noodle.

EldritchCleavage Tue 04-Dec-12 12:31:45

It is bizarre that people are still saying the OP and her DH should have moved the car, when really the whole point of the thread is that there wasn't anywhere to move the car.

The OP has always accepted that if there had been an alternative to remaining in the disabled space they would have taken it. However, there were no spaces, and nowhere to pull over once they had left the car park.

I think to one or two dissenting posters this thread has been about having a ruck, not debating the issue.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:32:27

Then you don't understand that it is a. Dangerous to drive with a screaming baby unnecessarily and b. may be impossible to feed a baby (even one who does not have special needs) once it reaches screaming levels c. The damage letting a baby get to screaming level can do.

In reality these people were annoyed because they wanted to do their Christmas shopping and there were no spaces, if they had a need they would have stated it if they were willing to shout at the op.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:33:11

Offered, I was using my situation to explain to Op why I thought she unreasonable to hold up a space. The only unreasonable opinion is an unexplained one.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:34:27

Offered, how do you know why other people were annoyed, are you psychic?

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:34:31

Ironic nolittle ironic, just how have you managed to assess the needs of the op's children from the Internet with no knowledge of breastfeeding and no knowledge of the genetic condition which they all suffer from?

threesocksfullofchocs Tue 04-Dec-12 12:35:25

why is it bizarre to say the op and her dh should have moved the car?
there were no other spaces, so they were hogging a needed BB bay.
I do love the way the people needing the bay are judge as "just want to do their christmas shopping" how do you know that?

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 12:35:41

It takes me 3 or 4 minutes to drive out of the bloody carpark, usually.
If baby cried while waiting for Santa, I imagine she would have fed him, why not?

(off to cuddle my baby, as all this "make them wait!" talk is making me sad!)

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 12:39:53

MistressIggi - I agree.

Carry on with you're 'fun' nolittle, you must be very bored!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:39:53

Offered, from the information Op chose to give, and how the af do you know I have no knowledge of BF confused I never claimed to know about the individual DX, but the OP's info was enough to judge the scenario. Or is the point of AIBU not to canvas opininions and judgement anymore?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:40:42

As must you Afro to reply ....wink

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 12:40:46

Sorry that was to MrsElleTow.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:41:26

Because they shouted at the op but didnt mention a disability related need for the space and because I can't see why anyone would need to go right into a busy shopping centre multi-storey in the run up to Christmas for any other reason. It would make sense to try and avoid being dependent on going there for anything else at that time if you had difficulty travelling/moving around.

JugglingWithPossibilities Tue 04-Dec-12 12:41:47

YANBU - you have a blue badge and can do anything you please whilst parked there. Also agree would be dangerous to BF whilst DH was driving, and slightly dangerous to drive with a screaming and hungry baby in the car. She should have minded her own business really, though I guess fair enough to ask, but she should def have accepted your perfectly reasonable answer, and been more understanding and supportive.

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 12:42:32

(Thought this was NoLittle's first AIBU?)

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:42:38

No little because when someone asked you up thread about your knowledge of the research you weren't aware and because of your consistent insistence that the op could move.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 12:43:35

And if you don't know the dx you cannot state, as you have repeatedly done, that the need was not a disability related need can you?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:44:23

Offered, just how have you assesed my knowledge of Bfing btw? What if the couple waiting were not Christian, should they not go out and do othings over Christmas? grin

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:46:13

The DC does not have feeding issues, he would be fed regardless, but if the DX complicated matters and required positioning and or equipment I would have understood!

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 12:46:37

Difference is nolittle, I don't come on here to patronise and frighten posters in respect ofmlosing their BB for feeding their baby in a parking bay after they've taken their children with disabilities out to see Santa. Takes a certain sort of person I think to do that and thankfully, no many are on this thread....just. Teeny weeny minority of wind up merchants. biscuit

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:47:11

Mistress it is, why

TuftyFinch Tue 04-Dec-12 12:47:43

Really with this? Still?
It was fine to feed your baby.

Afrodizzywonders Tue 04-Dec-12 12:48:57

MistriasIggi - it's just sport remember! At the expense of a decent person who went out for the day with their kids.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:48:58

offered, so because I haven't done academeic research into BF, I have no knowledge for alll you know I could live in a shoe and have EBF all my DCs!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:51:33

Afro, it is sport, when it's so easy. It's not a OP's expense, we shookk hands last night and I have more adquately explained my position to her and she graciously saw it. If you guys give the rope, what do you expect?

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:54:04

Afro, I thinkk you are VVV patronising myself [OP is brave and decent she has DCs with SN llets canonise her immediatelly yadah yadah] and I never said she would lose the BB

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 12:55:40

Mistress stilll don't get you 1st AIBU comment

MistressIggi Tue 04-Dec-12 12:56:31

Nolittle - this is trollish behaviour. Which is not allowed on MN, I believe. Perhaps you should read talk guidelines. (Which also state not to trollhunt, but I hope I am merely giving a fellow mumsnetter some friendly advice).

squeakytoy Tue 04-Dec-12 12:59:03

The main problem here is that this was in a busy carpark at the busiest shopping time of year.

The next person wanting to use the bay could not have just "waited", as this would have held up a long queue of traffic. Would anyone else have wanted to spend 15 minutes clocking up parking fees while someone sat in their car feeding a baby.

Disability is not the issue here, consideration for others is.

Lots of cars milling around a car park trying to spot spaces when it is difficult to find one, and one car and it's occupants are sat there would be frustrating for everyone. Much easier to drive off and find somewhere to pull up outside the car park.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:00:42

No nolittle I'm saying know the limitations of your knowledge and I apply that comment very widely to all you say.

I think you have behaved appallingly on this thread btw. To make your points it was completely unnecessary to be so joyful about causing others to be upset and frightened.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:01:47

I am no Troll, I just have strong and passionate beliefs, as many of you seem to. I have not attacked OP, we shookk hands and she tookk my points. I have explained all of my reasons as to why I think she was wrong, if anything I think I have been the one being attacked. Having my professionall knowlledge questioned and ridiculed in some cases. Thank you for the advice though [smille]

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:02:06

Squeaky - you can't say that disability was not the issue. You don't know what condition the dcs have.

musicismylife Tue 04-Dec-12 13:03:59

OP, why didn't you just move out of the car park? I don't understand why you would not get your husband to move the car, park up anywhere else and feed the baby. I just don't get it...

squeakytoy Tue 04-Dec-12 13:04:55

The disability wasnt the issue. The same would have applied to any of the parking spaces on a very busy day.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:06:38

Offered, I repeat, the OP and I shook hands and she took my point, if she had expressed fright I woulld have apologised. Re my knowledge I woulld bet my llas penny that my knowlledge of the jp of disabillity law is a darn sight broader and deeper than yours. I thinkk you just don't like me as I don't share your views. Que sera sera

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:07:23

It is the person using the space's judgement that we need to trust btw. I can't see why anybody should have to indulge in, as the op says, "disability top trumps" over spaces. Can we not assume that someone in the space has a reason for being in it? Can we not express politely if we have a need they might need to consider above theirs and leave them alone if they don't move at the very worst? Why is shouting at a bf'ding mother with four children in a disabled bay ever ok?

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:09:40

I'm not talking to you about your knowledge of disability law though nolittle, although your written posts do show some common mistakes in interpretation of the law. If you were really all that knowledgeable you would know it is almost always a mistake to describe a piece of law as "clear" especially when it actually isn't.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:11:49

Shouting is never Ok, asking pollitely is always ok, as is politelly being told no. FWIW, I thinkkk you have behaved apallingly too, Offered.

ariane5 Tue 04-Dec-12 13:12:41

It was subsequent posts where people were saying I jad breached bb rules and could technically lose bb for this if reported. Even leaving the car park was lengthy it was so packed took a good 5 mins to get out of ther when we did finally leave.ds2 was starving and crying when we got to car that 5 mins out of car park plus journey home would have made him even worse. I understand it is hard to work out why I did this without knowing what condition my dcs have but their medical info is very complicated I do not feel able to go into that sort of personal and upsetting detail here.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:16:00

No more details needed OP, and I hope you can see I was not attacking you or your DC's. If I made you feel awkward, then I apologise, that was never intended, but I stand by my opinions and posts.

theonewiththenoisychild Tue 04-Dec-12 13:17:00

yanbu you dont have to leave the space as soon as you get back to the car

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:17:12

I never said you should or would lose the BB btw.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Tue 04-Dec-12 13:17:48

ariane, you were not being unreasonable.

I would just trust in the majority of posters responses here, and Sock's reassurance that you didn't break the BB rules, and put the whole incident out of your mind.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:18:16

Theone, stop stirring the shit now, we've been over that point a hundred times!

MsElleTow Tue 04-Dec-12 13:18:57

To whoever said I have no knowledge of BF hmm I do actually! I BF both my DC, and unfortunately at times they both did have to wait occasionally for a feed. It is not always humanly possible to feed them right away, every time! And my DC are now almost 16 & 18 next week and are completely undamaged from having to wait for their dinner every now and then!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:19:47

SabrinaMulhollandJjones OP was NU IYHO!

theonewiththenoisychild Tue 04-Dec-12 13:20:47

ive only just logged in and this was on the front page of the app hardly stiring havent even read the whole thread yet

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:20:49

MS have these on me thanks

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:21:48

theonewiththenoisychild then don't post til you know what has already been covered simples!

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:24:37

How have I behaved appallingly then nolittle. None of my posts have been deleted.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:26:03

Elle - the baby had to wait until they got back to the car. You can't expect a baby that is already screaming to wait half an hour, that is way more than "a little".

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:27:23

True, but you have attacked and belittled my hard earned professional knowledge.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:31:21

No I haven't, I have taken exception to you using some knowledge in one specific area to deliberately and calculatedly attack a vulnerable person of the kind your "professional knowledge" is meant to be used to help and further than that, your glib expression that doing so is fun for you.

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 13:31:27

OP you've had your answer from a clear majority and some added reassurance from someone who administers this system.

The fact that the matter is close to the edge of being reasonable is the reason why you cake here to ask for clarification and reassurance and the reason why some people feel they need to disagree with the majority.

Don't feel obliged to clarify anything else. It is far more important to protect your children's anonymity than it is to pacify people who are getting pleasure from arguing.

I think you should consider hiding this thread because I am sure you have quite enough on your plate without the added stress of reading the kind of comments being made on here.

Please don't let this thread or the idiot who shouted at you put you off taking your children out again. Also don't let them put you off doing what you feel is right in order to meet the needs of all of your children.

theonewiththenoisychild Tue 04-Dec-12 13:31:38

not going to argue about it dont have time to read a long thread right now just popped on here to destresshmm

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:31:40

Elle woulld make her own kids wait though, so she's not expecting OP to have done something she wouldn't

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:34:22

Her own special needs kids, all four of them who all suffer from the same condition as the op's children and she would have made them wait half an hour a minimum of 5mins after they started screaming?

It isn't the same situation. I don't know why you and Elle can't leave it to the op, who is the only one in full possession of the facts, to make decisions about what is best for her children and family.

MsElleTow Tue 04-Dec-12 13:35:51

I didn't say make him wait for half an hour, I said I would have found somewhere else in the vicinity. I have had to make my DC wait when we were travelling on the motorway, because you can't just pull over.

I think the OP would have had other options, but she just didn't explore them. I think what she did was selfish, you don't.

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 13:35:53

I should destress elsewhere if I were you, theone. You'll just add to it if you stick around and read the rest of the thread.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Tue 04-Dec-12 13:36:31

OP I would echo what Goldmantra has said too - you don't need to explain yourself to posters on here who are gleefully using your thread as 'sport' and unashamedly admitting it.

QuickLookBusy Tue 04-Dec-12 13:38:19

Yanbu

The alternative was for you to have all got back out of the car and fed the baby in the shopping centre-so you wouldn't have freed the space up anyway.

Or you could have followed one of the other stupid suggestions, feed whilst driving alongangry, park on a double yellow line, meaning you are parking in a very busy, dangerous spot. Both very silly suggestions, to be ignored.

OP you made the right decision to feed your DS, whilst ensuring the rest of the family were calm and safe. Don't feel guilty about this, you did the correct thing.

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:38:38

Ok so can you accept that there was not anywhere else to fees because that is what the op said?

Offred Tue 04-Dec-12 13:40:57

The other place to feed would have been going back into the shopping centre with all the children or alternatively not going to the car in the first place with nowhere to stop which is perfectly possible as many shopping centres are off main routes with no stopping.

5madthings Tue 04-Dec-12 13:47:09

Yanbu at all! You had paid for the space, you have a blue badge and your baby needed to be fed.

I have sat in the car loads to bfeed after shopping, fussy babies that wouldnt feed with distractions.

If yoi had gone to a cafe etc you woild have been longer, as it is there was no alternative.

Op you did nothing wrong!

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 13:48:56

Offered, how do you know what I use my knowledge for? I have explained myself to OP. FWIW I use my knowledge to get rid of the condescing attitudes to persons with disabilities, as often expressed on here, and to push for full equality, which means fighting against the abuse of the societal structures that are put in place to help people to be equal, and to stand against people who interpret things one way when it suits them and complain when it doesn't. Moreover, I am not sure that it is entirely justifiable to called an indepth knowledge of the JP implications of Disability Law across all strands of the UK and EU frameworks a limited area. I have a family and living with a disability, I probably know more about the day to day impllications of it than most TBH. I still thinkk you have behaved appalinglly.

Tis the season of goodwill to all... hmm

Poor op - ywnbu - I am sorry you have got such a drubbing from some rather embittered sounding individuals. Some really jaw-dropping harsh and horrible comments on this thread - I just could not read it all and not post even at the risk of continuing the 'debate'.

I used to work in a London Borough issuing parking permits and badges - the central London Orange badges as well as Blue Badges. If anyone had called in to complain about the circumstances described in the OP - the Council would not have requested the return of the badge. It is cruel and scare-mongering to suggest it.

I am well aware that parking seems to bring out the worst in people, as soon as any commodity is made rare, spaces for Blue badge holders are definitely in that category, all empathy for others needs seems to go out of the window. The op was forced to feed her baby in the car by circumstance, the other spaces were occupied so the people looking for a space questioned the continued presence of op's car. If spaces were available no one would have given them a second glance. I very much doubt even NoLittleBuddha, having found a parking space would have tapped on the op car window saying 'move beeyatch your time is up!'. The issue was the crowded car park not the op.

But having been shouted by so many people for parking related frustrations - (even celebrities I had "don't you know who I am!" shouted at me by a furious non driving pop star wanting a resident's parking permit) - abosolutely nothing should surprise me about this debate.sad

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 14:04:22

Thank you for that bigmouth.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 14:12:15

I would, Bigmouth, but I would have said:

"Excuse me, if you are not going to be shopping would it be possible for you to pull out of the space to allow me to pull in as I need to get out urgentlly due to my heallth issues."

Then OP would have been perfectly justified to say something allong the lines of:

"We will be here for a little while longer I'm afraid, my DS has health issues too and I need to attend to them."

Me: "I see, do you mind if we wait for you to leave? or [there is a pulll in spot over there, that might be more comfortable for you, as there are lots of people waitng you can take as long as is needed."]* If I knew the area

OP: "Yes/No I'm not comfortable with that, we won't be very long.

NolittleBuddahsorTigerMomshere Tue 04-Dec-12 14:20:44

Hopefullly in the scenario Op described, if the above exchange had occured the Op would come to the conclusion that she was being unreasonable as feeding was not SN related and moved, no need for rudeness from anybody

SabrinaMulhollandJjones Tue 04-Dec-12 14:28:07

Nolittle, do I conclude from that that you'd be happy to wait for the space then, until the op had finished bf her baby?

Goldmandra Tue 04-Dec-12 14:30:51

Bigmouth said

"I very much doubt even NoLittleBuddha, having found a parking space would have tapped on the op car window saying 'move beeyatch your time is up!'"

You missed her point entirely.

Nolittle - In the imaginary scenario I described you have a parking space and I was positing it was unlikely you would disturb the op as you had parked in a space - in the situation the op described there were no parking spaces available - that was the problem - not the op's actions but the lack of alternative spaces.