To think this is so odd??!

(334 Posts)
curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 17:45:47

My PIL have mentioned several times over te past 8 weeks since their 2nd grandchild was born that they would love to have a canvas of the two children (my DD and new DN) to put on the wall.

With christmas coming thought this would be a great gift so sent a message to BIL and his fiancée to ask if we could get the kids together to do this for them. DH has a brilliant camera and is quite into photography so wouldn't cost them anything and wouldn't take long.

BIL sent a message straight back saying great idea, they'll love that, lets set it up.

3 hours later and she sends me a message saying 'Im going to have to say no to the picture'.

Weird???! Please tell me this is completely off because I'm not really sure what on earth I'm supposed to respond to that!

Tweasels Sun 11-Nov-12 17:47:31

Just text back and say, "oh that's a shame, why?"

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 17:47:55

Ask her why?

Maybe hello mag have exclusive rights?

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 17:48:17

Teasels I just nearly said the exact same thing.

dancemom Sun 11-Nov-12 17:49:00

does SIL have any kids from a previous relationship?

I'm going to guess she's er. . besotted with her new baby and has already booked one of those Venture type sessions to give everyone a Christmas picture.

BeaWheesht Sun 11-Nov-12 17:49:03

Yes very odd - id reply 'why? Dh willing to take photo etc so no cost to you. Mil would definitely love it' grin

Only thing I can think of is if they've already done a canvas? <clutching at straws>

Text back "Why?"

McKayz Sun 11-Nov-12 17:50:01

Just ask why?

DozyDuck Sun 11-Nov-12 17:50:39

Just ask

OpheliaPayneAgain Sun 11-Nov-12 17:51:50

They have probably ordered something photographic with the new baby.

HanSolo Sun 11-Nov-12 17:52:32

Has to be because they'd think it expensive?
Or maybe SIL doesn't want limelight hogged by your DC?

Maybe they don't want a canvas (neither would I, I think they look tacky, sorry).

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 17:53:52

Okay, I asked why and said that PIL would love it, and she just sent back 'I'd rather not.'

I'm sort of mad about it now actually.

emsyj Sun 11-Nov-12 17:54:26

Do they have to explain themselves? What happened to the Mumsnet mantra, 'No is a complete sentence'? hmm

She doesn't want to. She can say no if she wants. There may be a good reason, there may be a crappy reason, there may be no reason at all. Just accept it and move on. Get your DH to do a lovely pic of your DD and give that to the ILs.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 17:57:04

I know... It's just frustrating because I know they really want one.

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 17:57:05

You'll have to leave it now but my guess is that they are doing their own.

The texts ARE a bit terse. Do you normally get on?

Yama Sun 11-Nov-12 17:57:37

Agree with Emmsyj.

RevoltingPeasant Sun 11-Nov-12 17:57:56

She sounds massively precious, but <shrug> some people are. Just do a portrait of your DC and give that to PIL - I'm sure they will love it - and next time someone wants you to do something reasonable you'd rather not, remember you are a bigger person than SIL and step up!

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:00:28

Fanjo - we do get on. We went for lunch yesterday, took the babies to rhyme time in the week, her texts are always lacking punctuation and kisses etc, its just the way they are.

I would think they were doing something like that themselves if BIL hadn't said yes right away...

Tweasels Sun 11-Nov-12 18:01:30

As a joke just text back and say "no problem, I'll get my DC photographed and I'll just draw yours in"

RuleBritannia Sun 11-Nov-12 18:02:50

What about asking BIL why she won't?

Just do one of you DC and leave it at that.

I would just do a 6ftx6ft one of your dc, as big as you can afford.
It is her decision and you can't really harass her for a reason but I would love to know what the issue is.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:05:20

It's a group iMessage so they can see each others messages but he hasn't said anything. Texting him separately feels a bit like trying to cause trouble...

Although a lot of me now wants to take the pictures of both kids I already have (though not great) and make a giant collage of them wink

BeaWheesht Sun 11-Nov-12 18:05:26

Oh I'd just reply saying 'ok that's a shame as mil has mentioned really wanting one but obviously your decision, I will let dh know as he'd already received yes text from Bol earlier. Hope you're having good weekend, see you XXXX'

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:06:10

Toughasoldboots that's brilliant! I'm doing that grin

BeaWheesht Sun 11-Nov-12 18:06:13

Cross post (and Bol = bil)

BodyOfEeyore Sun 11-Nov-12 18:08:15

That is odd.

simplesusan Sun 11-Nov-12 18:08:18

Yes just do one with your dc on it. It does sound odd, but hey ho.

How old is her DC? Can you not just get your DC to pose with some random baby of the same age and then photoshop your DN face onto it? grin

Quite clearly, op your children are far more attractive and she is worried about the comparison. Be kind grin

RubyrooUK Sun 11-Nov-12 18:10:42

Some people just hate those posed kids photos. Even as gifts for other people. I remember one friend actively laughing at another for getting some posed photos for family; she said they were naff, embarrassing and so on. Other friend was highly offended as her house is plastered with posed photos which she adores.

Both genuinely could not understand how the other could feel that way. (They are still friends btw, despite photo opinion differences!!!)

So I guess maybe she just dislikes that whole posed photo thing and there is nothing further to it, since you get on well?

SecretCervix Sun 11-Nov-12 18:12:03

Leave the poor woman alone. If she doesn't want a picture, that is her decision and you should respect that. YABU.

TheProvincialLady Sun 11-Nov-12 18:12:34

Next time your SIL wants you to do something innocuous, just text back with a 'Afraid that won't be possible.' Respectful passive aggression is the way forward. And the massive canvas. Definitely the massive canvas. Can you get baby Christmas cards done too, and one of those hideous baubles printed with a photo of your baby? And send a canvas, card and bauble to SIL as well as MIL?

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:13:27

Personally, I prefer natural pictures of my DD... But it wasn't for her or us, it was for DH & BIL parents as they'd asked for it...

fluffyraggies Sun 11-Nov-12 18:14:59

Has she got other children, from a previous relationship, as well a the new baby OP? Sorry if you've said already and i've missed it.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:14:59

TheProvincialLady - I'm thinking I can even get stamps of my DD ;)

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 11-Nov-12 18:15:27

I don't understand the bile from some of you, TBH. she's allowed to say she doesn't want to. That's called assertiveness. Just do your own picture and feel good about it.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:15:39

Fluffy - no she hasn't, this is her & BIL's first child.

puds11 Sun 11-Nov-12 18:15:53

Ooooh i really want to know why <shamelessly nosey>

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:16:39

Jamie - but the grandparents have lots of pics of DD... They asked specifically for a canvas of both children. It was their idea.

ShipwreckedAndComatose Sun 11-Nov-12 18:17:24

It's her choice if she doesn't want to, even if PILs would like it, sorry but YABU

Just do your own

StuntGirl Sun 11-Nov-12 18:17:44

As a joke just text back and say "no problem, I'll get my DC photographed and I'll just draw yours in"

grin Brilliant.

fluffyraggies Sun 11-Nov-12 18:18:06

Hmmm. I find it a bit odd then. 'Specially if you all get on well. Could it be that it's because the baby is so young? (grasping a straws a bit here smile)

Trying to think of a reason she could could have that she'd find hard to be honest about ....

It's a bit strange that she hasn't said why she doesn't want to do it but it is her choice. I don't think I'd be able to leave it though but that's because I'm a nosy cow who can't leave well alone

NatashaBee Sun 11-Nov-12 18:20:08

A bit weird - does she think you're expecting her to be in the picture and doesn't really like to be in front of the camera? Or does she not like your DH fr some reason and doesn't like the idea of him having pics of her child on his computer? Strange.

Casmama Sun 11-Nov-12 18:21:48

I would forget texting and ask her gently when you see her. Dishes does have the right to say no though.

wigglesrock Sun 11-Nov-12 18:22:07

Maybe she just doesn't like them - I don't [shrug] My mum parents have time and time again asked for a family photo to be done professionally of all of us. And I have said no for the past seven years, I don't really mind if she wants one of the kids but I don't want to be in it. So perhaps she really dislikes them and I always wondered do you replace them if there's more children or get another one done?.

TheBigJessie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:23:34

Maybe she's converting to a religious denomination that prohibits images.

missymoomoomee Sun 11-Nov-12 18:28:31

I would find it weird if a family member had a massive canvass picture of my child up in their house. I wouldn't allow it either. YABU in calling her weird she obviously isn't comfortable with the idea.

Softlysoftly Sun 11-Nov-12 18:29:53

You absolutely should leave it it's her choice.

However...

...It's bugging the crap out of me now her reasoning so drop it until you physically see her again, blather on about booking your DC in, then ask

"I don't want to pry but are you a member of the Taliban? S'ok if you are i just wanted to know so I can skip the Christmas gifts"

She will hopefully be so anxious to prove she's not she'll fess the real reason and you can tell us. smile

Softlysoftly Sun 11-Nov-12 18:30:30

X post Jessie great minds and all that

Does she realise it would be free? Could it be because she's know maternity leave & worried about money? Or worried she couldn't do.the same for her parents?

fluffyraggies Sun 11-Nov-12 18:36:58

How old is your DD OP?

I'm wracking my brains over this!

Remembering when my eldest DD was very small - I can imagine i might have been the same about it actually.

Reasons - I might have felt my 8 week old baby would looked a bit of a blob in a big photo lying next to an older child. Plus the niece and nephew weres spoilt brats and i couldn't bare them! So wouldn't have relished the thought of having my baby laying in their arms for a photo.

Not suggesting for one moment your child is a spoilt brat OP, i promise grin Just saying how it would have been for me back then.

SantasComingFace Sun 11-Nov-12 18:38:21

Does she get on well with pil? Could that be the reason? It Is very odd.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:40:16

My DD just turned 2... And is really small for her age as well.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:41:12

Yeah, gets on great with PIL, maybe better than me grin

TheBigJessie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:45:36

8 weeks old? Baby won't go without feeds for long enough? She doesn't want to take the baby in the car somewhere? She doesn't want anyone over, because the house is a tip?

She thinks her baby isn't that cute looking at the moment, and wants to wait until the baby possesses (more) hair? She doesn't want a picture of her nine-week-old hanging up on PILs' wall to humilate her child upon the 18th birthday?

lljkk Sun 11-Nov-12 18:46:34

I bet it's to do with control of her child's image and what the studio will do with it, how it might be unleashed on the Internet for who knows what to photoshop in who knows what way. Coz these things happen all the time, you know.

Viviennemary Sun 11-Nov-12 18:47:25

Well if she doesn't want to then there isn't much you can do about it. But you could say something like, oh I thought it would be a nice idea' and let her tell you why she doesn't like it. I'd just go ahead with the canvas of your own DC.

5Foot5 Sun 11-Nov-12 18:47:38

I don't think it is weird. Maybe she just doesn't like them. End of. Don't hassle the poor woman, she said she would rather not so leave it at that.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 11-Nov-12 18:49:56

TBJ

All reasons I could imagine. It was a headache trying to get a passport photo of DS2 at this age. He was either asleep or crying.

Whatever, she's not being deliberately hurtful, she may be being a bit irrational, who knows. She's got a right to say no without being hassled.

LaLaGabby Sun 11-Nov-12 18:50:22

I would be annoyed by this, not your asking but the fact that the PIL have requested it. Not extremely annoyed, but just annoyed enough not to want to do it.

It just seems like they are treating the kids as lifestyle accessories and not really considering what anyone else wants. Can't they wait for a nice photo of each child and see what they get? Isn't 8 weeks a little bit young to be arranging sittings and poses?

I understand this may make me a 'Baby Scrooge' and many people do not feel like I do. I'm not criticizing them. But this is how I feel.

Practically as soon as my children were born my PILs were pointing their phones at them and videoing them. The whole thing makes me feel like, rather than try to interact with the child as a person, they are trying to create something they can use to show off to their friends how 'cute' their progeny are.

thefirstmrsrochester Sun 11-Nov-12 18:51:19

softly grin

Think that it is odd but its SILs choice. For the sake of my nosiness, find out why from your brother & update.

And absolutely get the stamps with your dd on them.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar Sun 11-Nov-12 18:52:53

Heaven forbid grandparents might want to show off their grandchildren confused

YANBU OP.

TheBigJessie Sun 11-Nov-12 18:55:42

I think I nearly exploded with projected-stress at a photographer, who had approached me in the town centre, and started the hard sell for their studio, when mine were young. I've never fobbed off someone so fast!

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 11-Nov-12 18:56:54

I'm not criticising the grandparents. To many the "big canvas" is a fine idea. Just not for all. I doubt very much she won't be supplying any photos at all.

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 19:04:23

Giant photo canvases are hugely tacky in my opinion but if it's what the grandparents want I think she is being massively precious in her refusal.

The tone of her texts are very rude too.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 19:04:54

Just to add, it's not a studio photo. It would just be us taking pictures of them at home. (DH)

Well, when babies are very new, they're quite ugly. Maybe she doesn't want to immortalise her PFB looking like cat's arse. grin I took50 quite a few pics at the hospital before I manage to take one that wasn't too embarrassing. It took 6 months to get better.

HecatePropylaea Sun 11-Nov-12 19:09:45

I bet she doesn't want to share the limelight grin Just wants it to be her baby.

She'll cringe about it in a few years grin

LadyMargolotta Sun 11-Nov-12 19:17:48

Is it possible that your sil thinks your dd may be rough with her baby while they are posing for the photo? Has your dd held the baby yet?

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 19:19:18

Yes, she's held the baby on her lap a few times and SIL has taken pics! hmm

Ilovecake1 Sun 11-Nov-12 19:29:57

How odd?? But also such a pity!!

Funnyface89 Sun 11-Nov-12 19:34:01

Does SIL get on with PIL? I don't get on with mine because of things that happened when my DS was born and their actions towards me when he was younger and so if I was asked I would say no.

ZeldaUpNorth Sun 11-Nov-12 19:38:14

Maybe SIL was planning on getting a professional pic done of her dd as a surprise to everyone (inc her dp) so now you've "spoilt the surprise" as she's had to tell her dp?

tittytittyhanghang Sun 11-Nov-12 19:42:13

Cant you just get hold of one of the pics of your dd holding her cousin or have one of your own, and photoshop the background?

Personally i cant imagine any reason she could give that wouldn't make her come across as petty and selfish, given that you have said this would be free, and would be for your parents/he pils, whom you both get on with.

MorrisZapp Sun 11-Nov-12 19:46:40

I knew it.

When push comes to shove, no is not a complete sentence.

and only an idiot would say it was

CremeEggThief Sun 11-Nov-12 19:48:30

YANBU. Seems very strange to me confused.

emsyj Sun 11-Nov-12 19:50:54

I am really shock at some of the suggestions on here, especially those saying the OP should just produce a canvas anyway from an existing photo.

The thing is, we all have our own thoughts and opinions. Some of them are reasonable, some are irrational, some are just plain silly. BUT - as long as the SIL isn't doing any harm or hurting anyone by saying no (and I don't think I would categorise mild disappointment for the grandparents at not getting the giant canvas that they like the idea of as 'doing harm' or hurting them) she must be allowed the right to do so without being harassed and without passive aggressive comments, actions or railroading.

Who knows, she may think about it/discuss it with her friends/DH/other mums and come to the conclusion that she's being a bit precious and change her mind - she may not. But ffs, the OP can't just totally ignore her 'no' and make a canvas anyway. There are tons of posters on here who have slightly pfb/precious/irrational moments about stuff (especially with a new, first baby - remember this baby is only 8 weeks old) and the general sway of things is that they're told that they have the right to determine what happens to their baby regardless of what anyone else wants. I happen to agree with this sentiment. So why does it go out of the window now??

<baffled at double standards>

emsyj Sun 11-Nov-12 19:52:34

"Personally i cant imagine any reason she could give that wouldn't make her come across as petty and selfish"

Well, there may be a reason that you can't imagine or haven't thought of. Or maybe her reason is petty and selfish. But it's her baby, so that's okay. She can be petty and selfish about her 8 week old teeny tiny first ever baby. Really, she can. It's fine.

honeytea Sun 11-Nov-12 19:54:20

I wouldn't want my PFB to be held by a 2 year old, maybe SIL wasn't 100% happy when your DD held the baby and doesn't want to do it again.

8 week old babies are not cute, not compared to a 2 year old, maybe suggest you do a photo next year when DN is a little more robust and cute looking.

diddl Sun 11-Nov-12 19:57:26

Maybe they already know what they are going to give ILs for Christmas?

whatsleep Sun 11-Nov-12 20:02:53

Maybe they have already got the perfect picture of the two children and are planning on having a canvas made for PIL and one for your Christmas present too?

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 20:06:52

Honeytea - just wanted to say that DD holding DN was 100% SIL's idea...

And DD isn't a rowdy or rough child, she's only just started walking, can't run or jump and isn't very strong due to hypermobility and hypertonia... She's very gentle.

SIL may have a problem of some kind but I'm sure it's not my DD, positive.

emsyj Sun 11-Nov-12 20:14:13

She might have just had an instant, 'no way' reaction (induced by newborn exhaustion/anxiety?) and may change her mind, OP. I have learned my lesson when it comes to guessing why people do things that seem mean/irrational - I won't go into it, but I have had very dark thoughts about people that have subsequently proved totally unfair as I simply haven't been aware of their circumstances (even people I have known very well and been close to). So don't guess why she has reacted this way - you may find out one day, you may not - but either way, don't poison a positive relationship with prying and hassling as some folk have suggested. It's lovely that your DD and DN are close in age, they may well end up best of friends and that will be such a nice thing for their grandparents to see - much more so than a tacky canvas.

honeytea Sun 11-Nov-12 20:14:14

Oh I didn't mean at all that your DD was to blame at all, I just can't see the need for a toddler to hold a baby but that is my opinion. As your SIL instigated that can't be the issue.

I would just take a really nice photo of your DD and print it on a medium sized canvas and add to it each year, probably once your SIL sees the picture up on the wall and her child has grown a little she will probably be willing to do the joint photo.

CrapBag Sun 11-Nov-12 20:16:59

YANBU.

It is odd. Its what PILs want, I cannot think of a single reason for her saying no to this.

Please try and find out, it will bug me. "just don't" is a shit reason. She must have an actual reason otherwise she wouldn't say no.

If my children had cousins I would be more than happy for them to have pictures together for someone in the family.

Helltotheno Sun 11-Nov-12 20:18:05

Get over it folks, she doesn't wanna do the picture. Jog on...

<Sheesh... pushy much???!>

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 20:18:34

Selfish? Precious? Treating her baby like a lifestyle accessory? Odd?

Seriously people?

Jeezo!

I think it would look quite shit to be honest, a toddler and a newborn posed where? On the sofa? A snap taken on dad's camera and blown up to mammoth proportions? Nah.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 20:19:39

Does she really have to give a reason?

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 11-Nov-12 20:19:44

Morris

My thoughts exactly.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 11-Nov-12 20:21:04

and yes, I think people are being bitches about the SIL

TidyDancer Sun 11-Nov-12 20:27:04

This is weird.

Some people are weird, your SIL may just be one of those.

My guess is she's either thinking about image rights, therefore maybe pointing out it would be a private DH photo would help, or she thinks she's being asked to be in it, which again pointing out the truth would help.

It's hard to believe she would say no otherwise, unless she is (as above) just plain weird.

It's a shame if she's just a stroppy cow wanting to take a lovely present away from the GPs.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 20:31:06

Stroppy cow? Weird?

Why? I don't get it.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 20:31:51

Canvas print for Christmas? I would definitely say no if someone wanted my DS on it because i think they're awful, tacky and revolting.
Can't understand why this is confusing for some people.

She has a perfect right to say no, without having to justify herself.
OP YABU, just let it go and get on with your life, not everyone's going to like what you like.

wigglesrock Sun 11-Nov-12 20:31:53

She doesn't want to do it, she doesn't like the whole idea, even if she's just being contrary does it bloody matter?

Tbh the OP is beginning to sound "odd" letting someone elses choices irritate her so much.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 20:35:33

TidyDancer, she's not weird or a stroppy cow.

It's her child, her right to say no.

Let. It. Go.
It's no big deal.

TidyDancer Sun 11-Nov-12 20:36:56

It's not her that would be putting it on her wall is it? Presumably this same woman has a problem with GPs putting photos of her PFB up as well?

I just think she's being weird about it. It doesn't even affect her. It's just a photograph.

TidyDancer Sun 11-Nov-12 20:37:29

Don't tell me what to do, I'm as entitled to my opinion as you are. hmm

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 20:37:39

I think next year when they are one and three it'll look much better.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 20:39:07

TittyTittyHangHang do you know how inappropriate it would be to photoshop the baby in? Total lack of respect..

MrsCampbellBlack Sun 11-Nov-12 20:39:18

No is not a complete sentence its one bloody word and leads to confusion.

HKat Sun 11-Nov-12 20:43:59

It wouldn't be for me, to be honest. I feel a bit sorry for SIL

googleberry Sun 11-Nov-12 20:45:53

Is it because she wants more children and would rather wait till they can all go on the picture??

diddl Sun 11-Nov-12 20:49:17

Sounds awful to me as well tbh.

I don´t see why SIL should do it just because it´s what ILs want, either.

Maybe she´s pissed off if they´ve been talking about it more or less since she gave birth.

Anyway, there´s nothing to stop ILs taking their own pic & doing it, is there?

cumfy Sun 11-Nov-12 20:51:07

Possibly barney with BIL ?

Just being contrary to spite him ?

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 20:53:06

Whatever her reasons for saying no I think her manners as demonstrated by her texts are sorely lacking.

By all means she can refuse but would it have hurt her to have employed some politeness when doing so.

The 'oddness' is the lack of explanation to her SIL.

Let's hope she comes on and starts a thread saying that her sil is asking her to do think and she doesn't want to because xyz - andthen we will know why!

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 21:01:04

Does she like your DH? Could she be uncomfortable about a man she's not close to photographing her PFB?

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:03:00

TheAccidentalExhibitionist clearly didn't read the thread.

It isn't about what I like. It's about PIL asking for something from both of us hmm

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:04:02

MrsCantSayAnything - she likes DH. We all go out all the time, he's godfather to DN and is going to be best man at the wedding.

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 21:07:12

Did you ask her why?

InNeedOfBrandy Sun 11-Nov-12 21:08:34

This is really odd... not other word for it... Unless she thinks she has to contribute cost of canvas and doesn't have the funds?

BillyBollyBandy Sun 11-Nov-12 21:11:43

Hmm if my SIL asked me to do this I don't know if I would say yes. She is a nag, a well meaning one, but a nag. She would go on and on and on... Arranging anything with her drives me scatty, she just won't take no for an answer and acts like a steamroller.

I'm not saying you are like that as you clearly get on and I want to throttle sometimes get irritated with SIL, but it could be a family dynamic somewhere that is causing the problem?

MistyB Sun 11-Nov-12 21:12:04

Maybe she has already ordered a canvas from one of the photos she has taken of the two children and it is a surprise Christmas present for you too.

Wuxiapian Sun 11-Nov-12 21:17:42

She's not happy about it for whatever reason.

Respect her decision and move on.

Socialassassin Sun 11-Nov-12 21:19:22

Maybe she's just hormonal and tired. Could be annoyed with her partner for agreeing without asking her? Pissed off with PIL since birth of her baby? I don't think I'd like it either TBH. Tacky.

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 21:23:58

I'm sure once she locates her manners she'll tell you why she isn't into the idea.

combinearvester Sun 11-Nov-12 21:24:47

Hmmm. When my first baby was 8 weeks old he did nothing but scream (and I mean hair standing up on the back of his neck scream, arch his back, choke and feed all the time. I did not want to go anywhere where there were people I didn't know well as for some insane reason I thought everyone thought this was because I was a bad mum.

Clearly he had reflux and other health problems, but I could literally only cope with my own family or complete strangers, not judgy ILs or acquaintances.

It is her PFB, give her a break, she's probably feeding 24-7 and losing her marbles.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 21:26:06

CuriousGeorge I did read the thread,
I wouldn't want my DS to be on a canvas photo for whomever it was for. It's not a present I would want to give and it sounds like it's not a present she wants to give - for whatever reason.

It is about what you like though isn't it? You'd like to give the present wouldn't you? If you hated the idea, would you still do it?

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:30:00

Actually, I probably would. Because DH's parents are almost 70, are lovely people and its not much to ask.

I personally loathe newborn babies in football kits... But PIL love Chelsea and wanted my PFB aged 2 weeks to wear one while they all watched football one afternoon - and I did it. Because sometimes its about making other people happy.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 21:31:10

Eww...

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:31:23

And my DD is 2 and I don't have a single canvas of her in my house btw....

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 21:32:11

Aesthetic differences aside I don't think it's unreasonable of the GPs to think this is a reasonable request.

The child wouldn't be demeaned by appearing on an oh so tacky canvas on their grandparents wall.

What if they made their own canvas from a pre existing photo? Would you request they remove it from their wall??

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 21:32:14

Yes it's lovely to make someone happy but what if it makes a person feel uncomfortable or unhappy, should they still do it then?

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 21:33:43

What's so traumatising about it being canvas in someone else's house!!

Jeeeeeeeze.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:34:40

Your child appearing in a photo at a much loved grandparents house would make you uncomfortable??

Are you my SIL??

peppapiggy Sun 11-Nov-12 21:35:36

Maybe she just doesn't like them, know I can't stand them and even dumped someone as they had one of their son on the wall grin

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 21:36:07

My mother got a hooooooge photo of me in my graduation which I find quite embarrassing, but I wouldn't dream of making a fuss of it.

Fair enough if sil dosent want to do it but let's gets some perspective!

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 21:36:39

But why should they have to do something they don't want to do? Perhaps it would make them unhappy to feel forced and not have a choice.

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 21:37:55

It's a photo! That's all!

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 21:38:32

It'll look shit, awkward and cheap - Is what she might be thinking...

And maybe she's too polite to say it's a ridiculous idea at this age and is avoiding making up far fetched excuses and maybe, you should just accept she's not up for it right now, back off the new mum and think of something else to give them!

PoppyWearer Sun 11-Nov-12 21:39:23

What about an alternative - a pottery item with both child's hand/foot prints. We did this with MIL's GCs and it's very cute.

What about if the photo went onto a bag or other product? Would she feel the same then?

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:40:42

You have no point to make. I've already answered that. It's just a photo... At the child's grandparents house??! How is that an insane or uncomfortable request?

It's not like I'm asking if I can dress him up in something crazy and take the photo on the edge of a cliff.... Jeez.

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 21:42:48

I did a lovely one for my mum with my nephew in. Really nice with a wood frame. Doesn't look shit or ridiculous.

Of course she doesn't have to do it, I'd make a nice one if your own dd instead.

TheAccidentalExhibitionist Sun 11-Nov-12 21:42:55

It's not an insane request, but it's not for everyone. The point I'm trying to make is that she has the perfect right to say no, for whatever reason.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:42:56

It's fine... I'm not going to kidnap him and force a photo on them. I just think its absolutely ridiculous to deny your fiancés parents a present they really want when it's not going to cost you anything but 20 mins of your time.

exoticfruits Sun 11-Nov-12 21:43:31

Just do it for your own DC.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:44:26

And I probably will do one of DD, just so she can see how happy they are, but also so she can hear when they say how nice it would have been if he had also been in it...

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 21:45:09

Some places do really nice smallish box frames.

Crikey it doesn't have to be some great monstrosity across a whole wall!

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 21:46:57

You sound charming

ShipwreckedAndComatose Sun 11-Nov-12 21:48:45

Really do understand why you have got so worked up about this op!!!

You are sounding positively bitter over nothing

tittytittyhanghang Sun 11-Nov-12 21:49:04

Sheez, I didn't suggest photoshopping the baby in, but using a pre existing photo of the two childen together if the op already has one, and just change the background, please read what i actually wrote.

exoticfruits Sun 11-Nov-12 21:49:56

I don't see why they need to come into it. You thought of the idea, they don't want to do it so just go ahead without-simple! (there is no need to use it to score points)

emsyj Sun 11-Nov-12 21:51:26

"You sound charming"

I'm with you mrskeith.

ShipwreckedAndComatose Sun 11-Nov-12 21:52:29

Sorry...I missed out a really important not in my last post grin

tittytittyhanghang Sun 11-Nov-12 21:52:54

curious georgie, i agree with you, imo if you sil had a genuine reason for this that didn't come across as selfish or petty, then she would have probably gave it.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 21:53:04

There will be plenty time to get a photo of them. She hasn't said no, not now not ever!

Do you not think it would look better when the baby is a bit older? How would your husband set up the shot? I can't see a pose that would work. It would be your dd holding the baby. Wait a few months when baby can smile and be propped up and they can share the shot more equally.

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 21:53:22

I can't believe this thread has gone pear shaped!

It started off so innocent.

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 21:55:41

Mrs k, when my nephew came to see my ds for the first time I got a beautiful photo of them on the sofa, just snapped with the iPhone.

It was so lucky, it was a beautiful photo, ds had a finger on his chin and was looking angelic.

I think it might be quite hard to pose them, that small.

Maybe waiting is no bad thing you might be lucky and get a good shot without having to use a photographer.

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 21:55:42

Give the op a break, she doesn't sound bitter, just irked by some of the snooty comments.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:57:26

Im 'charming' because I wanted to give my PIL the present they asked for for Christmas?? hmm

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 21:59:27

We were going to recreate a picture my SIL (on my families side) has of her two children of roughly the same age, where her youngest is lying on the footstool and her oldest was kneeling at the head of it looking at him. It's beautiful.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:00:56

No, you had a nice idea, it's not going to happen. So you build a bridge and get over it.

This is what makes you charming.

And I probably will do one of DD, just so she can see how happy they are, but also so she can hear when they say how nice it would have been if he had also been in it...

Just get your dd done in all her canvas glory, don't be a bitch about it!

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 22:03:13

And picking the one slightly off thing I've said is what makes you 'charming'.

We all get on great, it's just a photo. Get some perspective??

missymoomoomee Sun 11-Nov-12 22:03:36

But its not your business curious you asked she said no (as I would have done because its tacky) and now you are calling her weird and doing a picture of your DD to teach her a lesson and try and guilt trip her into it.

You can make whatever choice you want for your child, as she can about hers, imo grandparents wants don't come into something if a parent disagrees with it.

BooyhooRemembering Sun 11-Nov-12 22:04:01

only got to page 4 so sorry if it's already been suggested, but could it be that she doesn't agree with you that your DH is that good with a camera and doesn't a badly taken photo of her child blown up and hung on the wall of a house she visits often?

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:05:26

I think that's exactly what you're lacking, perspective!

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 22:06:00

Hmmm, you don't exactly emerge cloaked in glory either MrsRichards. You might want to reread your own comments, once you're finished chastising.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 22:06:42

Missy - if your elderly parents had asked for a picture of your children for Christmas you would have said no?

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 22:07:42

I have to concur there have been a few mean comments on both sides of the canvas fence!

missymoomoomee Sun 11-Nov-12 22:09:01

I would give them a little picture in a nice frame. If they want a canvass thing hanging from their wall then I would say no.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:10:13

I've had a look thanks, am confident I am my usual charming self grin

Just don't see why the sil should be taking pelters for saying no to something!

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 22:10:25

Well, I'm seriously trying to come from a good place. PIL wanted it, BIL said yes it was a great idea, BIL and SIL are paying for their wedding and are pretty broke so it would have been something they could give PIL for free.

It sounded win win.

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 22:11:35

Fair enough on the sil but there was a bit if canvas hatin' going on.

I can see why op got a bit defensive.

OhDearSpareHeadTwo Sun 11-Nov-12 22:13:10

You can make whatever choice you want for your child, as she can about hers,

Blimey. It's not as if they're chosing a religion or veganism is it ? It's only a bloody photo.

I can't see what the issue is myself - but then i've always taken the line of least resistance and am firmly in the "keep everyone happy for family harmony" camp

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 22:14:44

Maybe when you see her face to face she'll tell you why.

I bet she's gone a Canvas Crime further and commissioned one of those photos where the baby is sleeping inside a flower!

InNeedOfBrandy Sun 11-Nov-12 22:15:35

OP it was a nice thought to give your parents/pil a christmas present they want instead of a bottle of bubble bath or some equal shit.

Has been quite a horrible comments either side <gets up with pickled on the canvas fence>

Narked Sun 11-Nov-12 22:15:42

Could it not be as simple as her already having bought your PIL their Christmas present?

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 22:18:34

OP...get one of your DC on a nice big canvass...and cut a small pic of your niece out and stick it on with pritt stick...that'll learn her! grin

akaemmafrost Sun 11-Nov-12 22:22:06

I don't think it's tacky.

However I also think it's up to SIL and I wouldn't give this anymore thought than "miserable cow, ruining my fab present idea!"

Vix286 Sun 11-Nov-12 22:23:18

I am hoping you aren't my SIL with some details changed OP!

My SIL suggested that we got FIL a picture of DD and her DS for Christmas as he said he wanted one and I said no, and my DH was not happy.

I said no because I gave FIL a framed picture of DD last year for Christmas and it has been propped up on a bookshelf with our nephews picture over it!

So I have said no as I am not going to pay for (another) picture of our nephew for FIL's house to go with the 3 foot high framed pictures on the wall if he can't display one picture of my DD on her own.

So maybe your SIL would like her child to be regarded in it's own right rather than added onto the "group"?

I am not saying I am right or I am proud of my behaviour but there you go.

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 22:26:26

Vix are you serious?? I prop pictures over others ALL the time! I hope DD1 isn't like you as she's currently blocked by DD2 and a watercolour!

Narked Sun 11-Nov-12 22:28:57

Try reading all the words - the only picture of her DD has been covered by yet another picture of her nephew.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:29:01

I was thinking along the same lines vix. I can't help but think no matter how it's done the op's dd will be the main person with cuteness and smiles whereas 8 week old babies can't do much.

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 22:30:20

Narked so what? Only the pic of my DD has been covered! It's not deliberate. Sometimes I dust and then can't be bothered replacing things.

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 22:31:27

I honestly can't believe people THINK like that *MrsKieth "The main person"

WTF???

They're children...it's a photo...not the bloody Oscars!

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 22:32:16

Mrs Keith Richards, did you read what we were planning to do? If anything the baby would be the focus of the photo.

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 22:33:31

I never dust but I always stick things around and forget to move them!

Oh dear it's a minefield it seems.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 22:33:58

This is getting a bit crazy.

Just to clarify, I'm not vying for my DD to have top billing on my PIL's wall wink

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 22:34:19

On my photo of ds and dn they were the sane size and ds looked very cute <pfb>

It's one we all love.

BooyhooRemembering Sun 11-Nov-12 22:36:23

i asked but was ignored so i'll ask again.

is it possible SIL doesn't think your DH is that good with a camera and doesn't want a badly taken photo of her baby blown up and hung on a wall of a house she visit's regularly?

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:37:01

I just can't help thinking that pose is nice for siblings but cousins?

And that it would be nice to wait and get them together when there's smiles etc from the baby, you know? A wee bit personality! Maybe sil has already got newborn photos which are lovely in their own right, to give as presents? Her bounty photos or something?

InNeedOfBrandy Sun 11-Nov-12 22:38:36

I am so glad out of me dsis and dbro and my 6 cousins I am the only one with children. It sounds like a minefield having top dc and main people.

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 22:39:23

Oh bollocks. It's incredibly precious of SIL. It's real PFB behaviour. OP...tell PILS why you're not doing it. Silly moo she sounds.

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:41:35

To clarify, my use of 'main person' refers to the photo, the actual set up and how it may look.

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 22:41:45

Your motivation was sound anyway, thinking of a cost free present for them to give at a time when they're saving for a wedding.

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 22:42:07

I guess that could be possible but they asked us to bring DH's camera to the christening and take photos ( difficult as DH was godfather and I was holding DD, so didn't take a lot)

And also, BIL jumped at the chance to have DH take photos of DN when it's been brought up before, (in a non canvas way). My DH is actually a graphic designer but works a lot with pictures and does a lot with them on the computer afterwards etc.

He's my husband so obviously I'm biased but we've given friends pictures of their children he's done before and they've always loved them. Put them on walls, asked for a copy to give to family, made Facebook profile etc.

BooyhooRemembering Sun 11-Nov-12 22:43:03

grin

inneed my nana has over 40 grandchildren and great-grandchildren. her walls are covered in photos!

MrsCantSayAnything Sun 11-Nov-12 22:44:28

MrsKeith does it matter!? Of course it doesn't matter...unless the older child sits on the baby and obscures it totally!

BooyhooRemembering Sun 11-Nov-12 22:44:43

ah well , then my guess is she has arranged something alreday photowise of just her baby and doesn't want to say.maybe she is going to give the photo to you aswell as a gift and doesn't want to spoil it.

squoosh Sun 11-Nov-12 22:46:01

She'd need super sized walls for 40 canvases!

mrskeithrichards Sun 11-Nov-12 22:47:02

Does it matter? Well maybe to sil who might like newborn pictures of her baby alone before group shots start! Who knows?

InNeedOfBrandy Sun 11-Nov-12 22:47:07

boo they're not covered by other photos though are they? wink

tbh if my sister had a baby I would feel slightly jealous as mine are almost to old to be cute now whereas a newborn to 3 yr old is cute.

tittytittyhanghang Sun 11-Nov-12 22:49:54

Oh bollocks. It's incredibly precious of SIL. It's real PFB behaviour. OP...tell PILS why you're not doing it. Silly moo she sounds. s

o true, but your allowed to be pfb if its a teeny baby apparently, . not in my books

BooyhooRemembering Sun 11-Nov-12 22:50:06

grin no, they all just about have their own space.

i'd love it if my sister had a baby (my dcs are the only gcs so far), it would take that 'if they were my kids' look right off her face grin

Narked Sun 11-Nov-12 22:51:11

Could she not just have already sorted a present for them though? Just because her DP doesn't know/she hadn't told him yet/ he has forgotten about it doesn't mean she's rejecting your idea, just that she has other plans.

LynetteScavo Sun 11-Nov-12 22:52:32

Wow, so much over thinking on one thread!

Some really crazy responses to a simple OP.

curiousgeorgie What ever the reason your SIL doesn't want to do the canvas, I don't think it should stop you making one of your DD and giving it to the PILs.

I was wondering if the baby has milk spots or something atm, and SIL doesn't want the baby forever looking spotty on the wall of someone else house?

However, we may never know.

InNeedOfBrandy Sun 11-Nov-12 22:53:03

Oh my sister has that look to, that oh I would get down and play imaginary games all day with them instead og MNing all day look LOL.

Narked Sun 11-Nov-12 22:54:36

Or that, as they're tight for cash, she didn't get the message about the cost. Or that she feels it wouldn't be fair to her parents because they can't afford to get them a picture.

BooyhooRemembering Sun 11-Nov-12 22:57:12

oh no! my sister's is more of the "they'd get a good hard slap and no supper" look. she'll learn, one day. i cant wait!!

PickledFanjoCat Sun 11-Nov-12 23:00:09

Maybe the baby is really sir cliff Richards love child and she worries that a large photo will give the game away?

Op go and sing a few verses of "saviours day" and see if the baby joins in.

InNeedOfBrandy Sun 11-Nov-12 23:02:08

I think OP your sisIL is doing hand prints or something and doesn't want you to steal her idea wink

Oh boo I'll swap you my sis although she does have them for a day out every school holidays...

piprabbit Sun 11-Nov-12 23:07:16

The really odd bit is that BIL seemed more than happy for his DC to be photographed for the grandparents, he agreed to the suggestion but SIL has subsequently put her foot down with absolutely no explanation.

Surely BIL would have known if they couldn't afford it, or if they had planned their own version, or if his DW had a long-standing objection to canvas photos in people's houses. But no, he says "OK". But it seems like his opinion doesn't count, nor do the wishes of the OP and her DH, nor the GPs who asked for the gift. The only opinion that matters is SIL's, and she's giving nothing away.

HoolioHallio Sun 11-Nov-12 23:11:57

My DD was the ugliest baby in the world at 8 weeks. Patchy hair falling out in clumps, god awful cradle cap, milk spots and ferocious red cheeks (first tooth at 10 weeks) She looked like an angry ferret She is stunningly beautiful now of course but i would have been horrified at the prospect of capturing her 'unique' beauty for posterity on someone elses wall grin

curiousgeorgie Sun 11-Nov-12 23:20:22

DN is really cute, he was quite big when he was born so he's got nice chubby cheeks and really clear skin...

Not much hair though but would that really be a massive issue?

Narked Sun 11-Nov-12 23:25:47

There are people who don't think! It could well be that the BIL knew something else was planned but didn't remember it at the time!

I have to make sure DH tells one of his sisters no in writing after she's suggested something daft, because he's ridiculously polite and unless you actually use the word 'no' she hears 'yes' and she's got it bought/booked/organised an hour after the conversation. Her latest was 'PIL could really use an ipad and we've (her and her DP) been thinking the family could get them one for Christmas.' Which would actually mean feckless siblings not contributing and DH and I coughing up half the cash - £300 or so. It's cost us a lot of money over the years and often the presents aren't particularly appreciated.

piprabbit Sun 11-Nov-12 23:29:50

In which case you'd expect BIL to say "Oops, my mistake" - not keep schtum while SIL makes like Secret Squirrel.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Sun 11-Nov-12 23:59:05

I agree with Lynette

I think what's odd is how narked you are. You like her, she gets on with the PIL. It's no skin off your nose (really) if they don't get a canvas, they'll probably get some other photo at some stage. We don't know her reasons. She's entitled to say no (isn't she?)

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 12-Nov-12 00:00:31

SIL isn't making like secret squirrel

One text has been exchanged in the SILs customary brief style.

Blimey this is not a very interesting conundrum

IMVHO

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 12-Nov-12 00:03:51

I also don't think it's terribly helpful when dealing with family members to get narked on someone else's behalf.

If your PIL care that much, I'm sure they can express their own opinions

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Mon 12-Nov-12 00:32:06

It does seem a bit rude to offer no explanation, when she knew her DH had said yes, and you were excited about it, but only the no explanation part, she does have the right to say no.

I think it's more likely she wants the baby to look a bit cuter before having such a statement photo done? But who knows.

GhoulWithADragonTattoo Mon 12-Nov-12 00:57:54

Your suggestion is lovely and it is a bit odd of SIL to veto it without explanation. However, I think Allen has hit the nail on the head. At 8 weeks old babies haven't really grown into themselves and are not at their cutest.

I had professional pictures of my babies done when they were tiny and was told by the photographer that the earliest they'd do them was 4 months. Before that they couldn't focus well enough for a good picture. Obviously taking normal photos is fine but I'd want my baby to look their best on a canvass that will hopefully be displayed for many years.

BewitchedBotheredandBewildered Mon 12-Nov-12 01:02:41

Sheesh! curiousgeorgie I think you seem truly charming and thoughtful and I can quite understand your questioning your SIL's decision
What I don't understand is your serenity and calm in the face of some of the shit flinging on your thread!
{thanks] wine grin

BewitchedBotheredandBewildered Mon 12-Nov-12 01:03:49

Bollocks! I meant thanks

ChippingInLovesAutumn Mon 12-Nov-12 01:21:16

I have only read your posts, so I'm probably repeating what lots of other people have said, but...

I would text her back and say 'Oh it's OK, I understand if you are too busy - I'll just get DH to do one and scan a photo of DN onto it, I'm sure the PIL will be fine with that - no problem smile'

ChippingInLovesAutumn Mon 12-Nov-12 01:23:11

PS Ignore any numpties. You sound lovely, it was a nice request from your PIL for an easily obliged present, your SIL is ODD to say the least.

ordinaryprincess Mon 12-Nov-12 01:59:10

It's a nice idea but you have no right to suggest your BIL is being controlled by his fiancee. That lady just went through hell to bring this child into the world and it sounds like he has the right idea - what she says goes for a lot longer than eight weeks. You must know that your BIL's willingness to go along with your idea originally doesn't mean that much. He's probably drifting around in a moronic sleep-deprived daze and anyway, if he chose to be controlled by his fiancee and subsequently say no, that would be his problem. It would be very sensible of him, considering the hormones that are flying around. The suggestions that you approach him now to find out 'why she doesn't want it' are selfish in the extreme. New parents are fragile. What right to you have to stress your BIL out (because it would) just because you can't take no for an answer? If your SIL-to-be wanted to be unreasonable about her child, that's her perogative. Her decision isn't even unreasonable, actually. How kindly do you think you'd have taken to someone suggesting that they would put your eight week old baby through some sort of photoshoot (because nobody knew you were planning to take one photo and 'leave it at that'), choose a picture (probably, let's be honest, one in which your one child looked great) and emblazon it upon her inlaw's wall (she probably has a sneaking suspicion her baby's ugly - I did), to be walked past for all time? And then tried to cause a stir with your fiancee when you didn't fancy it? I don't care how much DN's grandparents would like it because (a) it's not your gift to give (b) it's no great hardship for them to wait a year or two - they've got a new grandchild for goodness sake (c) this is not about your PIL, this is about you not liking to hear the word no (d) there's no point giving photos at Christmas when the pictures taken on the day will be the ones to spend money blowing up. Especially of cousins.

I'm just so glad you're not my SIL...there was nothing wrong with the original concept but the way you've going on and on about it in such a relentless way is just...deadly.

BleepingSooty Mon 12-Nov-12 02:45:34

I'm going to vote for 'she thinks they are tacky'. If it was something like she had already bought them a present she would have just said when op asked why.

I would text back something like 'ok, no problem. How about a regular photo of the two of them in a frame instead? Or would you rather not?'

curiousgeorgie Mon 12-Nov-12 08:18:25

Ordinaryprincess- are you quite well??!

There isn't one part of your rant that I don't need explaining... Not one part is factual and I have no idea where you got most of it from. hmm

curiousgeorgie Mon 12-Nov-12 08:29:53

Okay... I'm not sure my last message illustrated how idiotic your message was so here it is...

I never suggested BIL was being controlled by his fiancée.

Where did I say she 'went through hell to bring a child into this world' ??

You know nothing about my BIL so to suggest that he willingly goes along with any idea is purely a fabrication of your mind.

I never said I was going to approach my brother in law, in fact, I said quite the opposite as 'it would feel like causing trouble' ....quote!

They knew that my DH would quickly take a couple of photos. Where did you get that they didn't??

'Im going to choose a picture where my child looks great and DN looks ugly' Yes. Because my last message wasn't about how cute he is. Because I've stressed several times about how we don't all get on, and because that would just be a Fabulous present to look at forever wouldn't it??

"And then tried to cause a stir when your fiancée didn't fancy it". Umm... What? Anyone??

And just to finish, I'd just like to echo your last sentiment and say that I'm extremely glad you're not my sister in law too. Because you seem like a total moron and there's no way I could put up with that on a regular basis.

One last thing.... 'Deadly' ?? Had a drink by any chance?? hmm

givemeaclue Mon 12-Nov-12 09:21:04

Enough already.

Op are not going to put us out of our misery and find out from sil what her concerns are or not?

curiousgeorgie Mon 12-Nov-12 09:29:59

Apart from asking her I'm not sure what else I can do. I have a scan today but will probably see her tomorrow and report back smile

If she has already posed and taken photos of the two of them together then my money's on her having already done something similar herself.

BleepingSooty Mon 12-Nov-12 10:20:27

Excellent! Report back any news.

I would put money on her NOT saying because you are trying to make my baby look ugly.

Marks place.........

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Mon 12-Nov-12 10:51:48

Oh please ask her!! Very invested in knowing why the fuck she doesn't want it done now smile Even though, I agree she has every right to not want to, reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaalllly want to know why not!!!

and if anyone is running a book, put me down for a tenner on her wanting to wait til baby can sit up/look less like a bald,old chimp.

lljkk Mon 12-Nov-12 11:06:26

Please please ask your SIL and report back to put us out of our speculative misery? I'm quite happy for my guess to be wrong, just want to find out the truth.

Here's how you ask without making it obvious you're only asking to satisfy the collective curiousity of Internet strangers:

"Do you mind me asking why you didn't like my idea of [big photo, etc.]? Only I had some other gift ideas along those lines in future but don't want to suggest things you don't like. Cheers!"

please please ask.

curiousgeorgie Mon 12-Nov-12 11:16:18

Ill definitely ask... If not knowing why is frustrating to you, imagine how frustrating it is to me wink

ChaoticismyLife Mon 12-Nov-12 12:11:33

I'm feeling sorry for SIL. She's had a bit of a slagging off on here from some posters.

Has it occured to anyone that maybe SIL reads mn and has read some of the threads where the OP finds it hard to say no to someone who is taking advantage of their good nature. Those OP's have often been advised not to give a reason so the other person can't argue against that reason. Maybe she's took mn's advice wink

As for BIL wanting to but SIL not...

BIL sent a message straight back saying great idea, they'll love that, lets set it up.

3 hours later and she sends me a message saying 'Im going to have to say no to the picture'.

Note the fact he replied immediately. Maybe he replied before speaking to SIL about it. Maybe in those 3 hours they've (BIL and SIL) discussed it and she's given him valid reasons why she doesn't want it done and he's agreed with her not to have it done.

Yes, it's speculation, like a lot of other posts on here, just another angle to consider.

OP it was a nice idea but SIL has said no and you have to respect that even if you don't agree with it. Who knows...she may change her mind in future, or be happy to have it done next year when DN is older.

squoosh Mon 12-Nov-12 12:26:48

taking advantage of their good nature?

Pagwatch Mon 12-Nov-12 12:36:31

Hahahahahaha.

Great thread. Totally bonkers.

She doesn't want the picture done. Bit of a shame. Never mind.

InNeedOfBrandy Mon 12-Nov-12 12:38:23

My moneys on she's doing hand print casts and doesn't want her idea stolen...

AlwaysHoldingOnToStarbug Mon 12-Nov-12 12:44:40

Maybe she's doing one of her child only so she can give one to her parents too.

Text her and say mumsnet need to know why she said no!

Pagwatch Mon 12-Nov-12 12:49:29
PickledFanjoCat Mon 12-Nov-12 12:50:21

Loving the conspiracy theories on this thread!

Bonkers!

Kalisi Mon 12-Nov-12 12:51:04

Screw respect! I NEED TO KNOW! grin

Has she recently become Amish?

BartimaeusNeedsMoreSleep Mon 12-Nov-12 13:35:31

I think she's probably already sorted their Christmas present and it involves a photo of their DS.

Although if that is the case, I would be surprised she didn't just say that when she said no.

Still <shrug> to each their own. I'm not a huge fan of framed/canvas etc. photos as presents (we just send some printoffs to close family regularly so then can choose if they want to frame them, blu tac them to the fridge, put them in an album or just shove them in a drawer!) although it makes for very easy presents, especially for grandparents smile

Having said that, we're doing surprise stockings for the grandparents this year and I'm having to force myself not to buy keyrings with photos of DS in them as I think they're tacky and won't be used but they're nice and small for a stocking!

BartimaeusNeedsMoreSleep Mon 12-Nov-12 13:40:25

Oh and YANBU to think it's odd that she has given no explanation as you do seem to have a close relationship from what you've said.

YABU to think it's odd that she's refused.

ChaoticismyLife Mon 12-Nov-12 13:46:52

Pagwatch grin

nightowlmostly Mon 12-Nov-12 14:17:23

She probably thinks that canvasses are tacky, but doesn't want to say that to you in case you get offended, as presumably you like them?

I'm a bit surprised at the reaction this poor sil has had on here tbh. If she'd come on and said "my sil asked to do a big canvas print of our kids but I really hate them and don't want to do it" everyone would have said 'no is a complete sentence', don't do it if you don't want to, it's your baby blah blah blah. That's what's odd if you ask me!

Personally I'm with the sil, sounds naff.

squoosh Mon 12-Nov-12 14:21:05

nightowlmostly the OP has said that she doesn't like canvasses but that she's happy to give one to the grandparents as they specifically expressed a liking of them.

Surely the naffness only matters if you're expected to hang them in your own home?

PickledFanjoCat Mon 12-Nov-12 14:21:15

The canvas isnt going on her wall though. It's going in pils house, who clearly don't think it's tacky as they asked for it.

So I don't think it's that personally.

PickledFanjoCat Mon 12-Nov-12 14:23:10

X post squoosh!

Tweasels Mon 12-Nov-12 14:27:18

What an awful lot of insight everyone has into 2 text messages. Don't even think OP was that bothered. Just a bit of a lighthearted thread wondering why.

Some of you lot are quite literally bonkers.

OwlLady Mon 12-Nov-12 14:27:57

I can't stop laugghing at *As a joke just text back and say "no problem, I'll get my DC photographed and I'll just draw yours in"
*

PickledFanjoCat Mon 12-Nov-12 14:28:45

This thread is very serious owl lady. Crimes are being committed, terrible jealousies rage forth.

It is no laughing matter angry

Tweasels Mon 12-Nov-12 14:32:42

<takes a bow>

Thanks OwlLady. I thought that was a spectacular piece of wit that went unnoticed in all the madness.

But pickledfanjo is right. This is no laughing matter. Deadly serious wall canvas style drama unfolding.

OwlLady Mon 12-Nov-12 14:39:12

I like the idea of the 6ft x 6ft canvas as well

There was a story on thisiskent once about a cardboard cut out being stolen of wills and kate on their wedding day and the police found it in someones lounge. They apparently looked through the lounge window and there it was, wills and kate

I suggest you do a cardboard cut out thing of your children curious, drop it off at MILs and then steal it in the night and drop it round your SILs and phone the police. That will serve her right

wildfig Mon 12-Nov-12 16:18:48

nightowl I'm enjoying the counter argument to the 'no is a complete sentence' principle too. It should be amended to 'No is a complete sentence unless I want to hear yes in which case you'll need to explain further'

GhoulWithADragonTattoo Mon 12-Nov-12 16:28:41

I often think the "no as a complete sentence" principle is actually rather rude and can lead to confusion where there doesn't need to be any. A brief explanation usually helps to smooth over the waters and stops resentment building. Of course there can be people who put unreasonable pressure on others and see any explanation as weakness where just saying "no" is a good tactic. But here where OP and her SIL have a good relationship a brief explanation is probably important.

Has anyone suggested maybe everyone in the family including OP is getting a photo of DN from SIL for Xmas and she doesn't want to spoil the surprise?

wildfig Mon 12-Nov-12 16:32:26

I think SIL is getting a 1250 piece jigsaw of her whole family, with DN at the centre.

I would like to know the reason...

squoosh Mon 12-Nov-12 16:45:51

No, no, no she's getting a 20ft x 20ft hologram of the new baby.

TheProvincialLady Mon 12-Nov-12 16:56:29

No, it's a portable laser show of the new baby lasting 5 hours. There's a lot of sleeping and a bit of posseting.

lljkk Mon 12-Nov-12 18:13:43

<<Impatient stamping of feet & wondering why OP hasn't texted or SIL hasn't replied yet>>

I would also need to know the reason, how off.

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 12-Nov-12 19:31:15

Ghoul

No, because people were far to busy saying the sil is a precious, uncaring, loopy controlling beetch wink

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 12-Nov-12 19:31:54

Bitch

LaLaGabby Mon 12-Nov-12 19:35:13

Is it possible the SIL doesn't want to do the photo because she thinks the OP is a bit of a one?

LaLaGabby Mon 12-Nov-12 19:36:44

Btw, mrskeithrichards I think you misunderstood my earlier post, although when I reread it I realized it was very unclear.

I thought the PILs were being annoying and treating their grandkids like a lifestyle accessory. The SIL has a perfect right to say no AFAIAC.

squoosh Mon 12-Nov-12 19:44:45

How does wanting a supersized photo of your grandkids equate with treating the children like lifestyle accessories?

What an odd thing to say.

LaLaGabby Mon 12-Nov-12 19:49:45

read my original post perhaps?

squoosh Mon 12-Nov-12 20:02:45

Goodness, what a charming manner you have.

I did read your original post, and it makes just as little sense second time around. You think people taking a photo of a child means they don't want to interact with the child and therefore are treating said child as an accessory? Bad, bad grandparents wanting a photo of their grandchildren.

TheBigJessie Mon 12-Nov-12 20:09:21

Wow this thread went... Far, far across the galaxy and turned left.

She said no. It's not a big deal.

curiousgeorgie Mon 12-Nov-12 20:13:12

What's 'a bit of a one'? hmm

LaLaGabby Mon 12-Nov-12 20:14:11

No, squoosh, I think not interacting with a child in any way except to take copious pictures and videos of it means that they don't want to interact with the child and therefore are treating said child as an accessory.

NewRowSees Mon 12-Nov-12 20:20:50

This is why I love Mumsnet - the seconds it takes for these (seemingly innocent) threads dissolve into hysteria and name-calling - pure comedy!

JamieandtheMagicTorch Mon 12-Nov-12 20:25:26

I like the massive amount of fodder created by 2 very short texts

nightowlmostly Mon 12-Nov-12 20:31:15

I too want to know her reasons despite myself...

nightowlmostly Mon 12-Nov-12 20:35:50

And even though it's been said that a personal dislike of big canvas pictures shouldn't matter because it won't be in the sil's home, she'd still be faced with it relatively often presumably? I don't know if I'd like that.

Did anyone watch 7 days on channel 4 ages ago? It was a short lived reality show anyway. One family had two huge canvas prints, of each of the children up in the kitchen. I'm talking 8ft square at least, these huge faces staring down at the table. Very disconcerting!

This thread is beyond brilliant. I've literally just sprayed tea on my iPhone screen at the jigsaw and hologram.

Ah, mumsnet, I've missed you.

picturesinthefirelight Mon 12-Nov-12 20:55:28

I personally think that mouse mats, mugs and other similar paraphernalia with cheesy pictures of kids are incredibly tacky and I never buy them from school photos rtc

However my mums sister phones me up and asked me to send her pics if my children and my brothers children do she can get my them made into a mouse mat for My parents Xmas present.

You know what - I'm going to do it because it means something to them. Their other sister died at the young age of 34 so having photos of people becomes poignant. You wish you had more when people are gone.

I hadn't even thought to ask my brothers permission I was just going to use one I had.

PickledFanjoCat Mon 12-Nov-12 21:18:15

Oh come on, "faced with the canvas print" grin

Whats it going to do? Punch her in the Throat?

PickledFanjoCat Mon 12-Nov-12 21:19:48

No is a complete sentence is rubbish, as is did you meeeaaaan to be so rude.

No on its own in the wrong context can come across hellish rude.

cumfy Mon 12-Nov-12 21:36:26

^Enough already.^gringrin

Why are we still in this photo ?wink

cumfy Mon 12-Nov-12 21:36:58

Enough already. gringrin

Why are we still in this photo ?wink

Has sil ever been this weird about anything else?

stookiesackhouse Mon 12-Nov-12 21:50:47

"What's it going to do? Punch her in the throat?"

This made me laugh out loud ha ha. Brilliant.

TheBigJessie Mon 12-Nov-12 23:54:11

As a proud mother, I am glad that I'm not confronted by canvas pictures of my babies at eight weeks old. Whatever I thought at the time, they simply weren't that cute!

Besides, wouldn't this hypothetical present be like giving someone last week's newspaper? The baby will look totally different come Christmas Day!

TeenageWildlife Tue 13-Nov-12 00:28:59

OP you mentioned going for a scan, how about scan pic instead of DN?

atosilis Tue 13-Nov-12 00:36:58

She doesn't want pictures of her baby stored on your computer. My sister let her new baby sit for a photo with baby's half sister. The photographer made a painting/illustration from that image about 4 years later. If your sil has heard a story like that, she might be a bit concerned. The picture could rise up at anytime.

JesusInTheCabbageVan Tue 13-Nov-12 09:23:16

atosilis Rise up and.... Take Over The WORLD?????! shock

PickledFanjoCat Tue 13-Nov-12 09:27:14

Oh my days! It's getting worse!

I've got thousands of photos on my computers and I own a canvas.

I was just thinking of blowing up my house and starting again. sad

InNeedOfBrandy Tue 13-Nov-12 09:35:50

I have a lush huge canvas in my living room, does it make a difference it's a actual painting and not a print or a photo?

I also have pictures of the dc when they were first born up and a few weeks old, I did have extremely cute babies though quite surprised at all the ugly babies being talked about on here.

atosilis Tue 13-Nov-12 09:48:21

Ok, not the best terminology :-)

The picture could rise up appear at anytime - in any format - over which you might not have control.

I did not help the situation as I can do photoshop and have created 'pictures' for birthday cards. Think of those cards you can create and order on the internet. Some were received with joy, others BOMBED. I am sitting here chewing my nails as I have made a card for my daughter's birthday. It seemed brilliant when I made it on Friday but now think it might not be so funny. sad.

That was just a thought for OP's sil as the OP mentioned earlier that her husband can work with photos on his computer.

Legal Disclaimer - I am not suggesting at any point that OP's husband would do such a thing to sil's baby photo.

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Tue 13-Nov-12 09:59:14

Jesus Christ curious What's taking so long? I demand to know SIL's problem, immediately, tell her AlienReflux needs an explanation grin

TheBigJessie Tue 13-Nov-12 10:03:26

Or simply, perhaps, that like many mothers of eight-week-olds, she would like to spend any spare tenty minute periods next week having a shower/going to the toilet/having something to eat/staring into space blankly/MNing?

TheBigJessie Tue 13-Nov-12 10:03:27

Or simply, perhaps, that like many mothers of eight-week-olds, she would like to spend any spare tenty minute periods next week having a shower/going to the toilet/having something to eat/staring into space blankly/MNing?

JesusInTheCabbageVan Tue 13-Nov-12 10:03:34

atilosis Oh. <Disappointed> Big letdown.

But... it could though? Admit it, it's a possibility. Once it's on the internet, it could become self-aware and launch missiles at Russia because it knows that will trigger a third world war.

TheBigJessie Tue 13-Nov-12 10:07:20

That wasn't supposed to post twice. Sorry.

fluffyraggies Tue 13-Nov-12 10:44:00

No, it's a portable laser show of the new baby lasting 5 hours. There's a lot of sleeping and a bit of posseting.

^^ great big lol.

My money's on her thinking it'll look tacky and shit. Sorry OP and everyone who feels otherwise, but i agree.

There'll be a reason. Other than the SIL just wanting to upset the OP and PILs, i mean. If she was just a prize bitch the OP would have sussed that by now. So come on - cut the SIL some slack - we just don't know what the reason is yet .....

<waits>

squoosh Tue 13-Nov-12 10:49:08

I think canvasses are hugely tacky and shit too, that's why I would not have one in my own home. If other people want them in their homes, that's another matter and I'd be happy to supply image of child for tacky and shit canvas.

lljkk Tue 13-Nov-12 11:27:24

I don't like canvas at all either, but it's not FOR SIL. It's for the ILs, if they like it then fine. I'd be pleased as punch someone had come up with a good idea & I didn't have to worry about it.

YerMaw1989 Tue 13-Nov-12 11:31:20

Hmm does seem a bit off,

Is there anyway you could go to a Kodak shop, Snapfish and do it yourself?

fluffyraggies Tue 13-Nov-12 11:59:08

1 Some of us think the canvas will be lovely.
2 Some of us think it'll be tacky and shit but wouldn't mind as long as it's not on their wall.
3 Some of us think it'll be tacky and shit and wouldn't want their baby in it on anybody's wall.

I'm a no.2 right now personally. But might have been a no.1 just 8 weeks after the birth of my first.

Does that really make me a weird, bitchy cow?

fluffyraggies Tue 13-Nov-12 12:00:18

Sorry - i meant i'd probably be a no.3 just 8 weeks after the birth of my first.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar Tue 13-Nov-12 12:04:20

I'm feeling a little offended on behalf of the OP's husband's photography grin

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Tue 13-Nov-12 12:05:02

No raggies and if you said that, coolio Inglasias, she hasn't said, and doesn't seem to want to explain, hence all the guessing.

curiousgeorgie Tue 13-Nov-12 12:06:10

Right, she's planning to do her own canvas of DN.

Her DH was also there and said 'but mum and dad want a picture of them together?' And she got a bit stroppy and said she's making them a canvas of just him.

So... 20 x 20 canvas of DD then!! grin

fluffyraggies Tue 13-Nov-12 12:07:19

coolio Inglasias grin Love it! Lay chilly alien grin

She will explain though .... fingers crossed.

fluffyraggies Tue 13-Nov-12 12:08:17

Yay! An explanation!

Now .... what do we think then?

curiousgeorgie Tue 13-Nov-12 12:08:41

I'm a bit pissed off wink

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar Tue 13-Nov-12 12:08:50

Why can't they have both?

Your husband could use three photos (your dd, their dd and the two of them together) to make a triptych <classy>

curiousgeorgie Tue 13-Nov-12 12:10:06

I suggested doing both but she thought that would take away from her present.

Zalen Tue 13-Nov-12 12:13:07

This thread is sounding a little deranged, You asked, BIL said yes, your SIL said no. She has every right to say no, she has every right to say no without giving a reason and she even has every right to say no without even knowing the reason herself.

It was a nice idea (if you like that kind of thing) but it's not going to fly, get over it and move on.

Some posters have suggested taking a photo of the two of them that you already have and using that. I'm sure you wouldn't do that and those posters who suggest it are being massively unreasonable.

If you have to know why and SIL doesn't volunteer the information the next time you're together then maybe your DH can take his brother out for a drink one evening and get the story out of him then. SIL has enough to deal with looking after the baby and probably with wedding plans, leave the poor woman in peace!

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar Tue 13-Nov-12 12:14:45

Oh how very reasonable and boring of her.

I feel a little let down sad

Zalen Tue 13-Nov-12 12:14:59

Ah, x-post, sorry

curiousgeorgie Tue 13-Nov-12 12:18:00

Well, she's having professional photos taken of him on the 27th... So sort of giving the parents an IOU a canvas hmm

So I actually don't see why she can't do the picture. wink

squoosh Tue 13-Nov-12 12:18:40

Poor grandparents are going to have to have two canvasses on their wall now! I hope their love for canvasses is as strong at Christmas time grin

She obviously doesn't want her baby being overshadowed by their cousin. Fair enough, but a teensy bit precious seeing as the GPs specifically wanted a picture of the two children together. I'm sure she'll chill out when the kid is a bit older.

ethelb Tue 13-Nov-12 12:20:41

She is going to realise how derranged she is in a couple of years time.

I feel sorry for your PIL. Is she a nightmare DIL?

fluffyraggies Tue 13-Nov-12 12:20:47

Hmmmmm. It's a sort of 'lime light' thing really then isn't it? Yes?

Someone suggested that upthread.

Awkward unwrapping moments coming up this Christmas. You are going to have to go very big OP .

squoosh Tue 13-Nov-12 12:27:06

Have your babies image projected onto the Houses of Parliament a la Gail Porter. I'm sure David Cameron would give it the nod.

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Tue 13-Nov-12 12:27:17

AAAhhhhhhh, I seeeeeee, so it's not that she thinks her baby is too chimpish for a photo then?

Well. least we know now.

It's not what your PIL's wanted but hey, leave her to it!

GhoulWithADragonTattoo Tue 13-Nov-12 12:28:42

I thought it would be something like that given SIL is lovely and kind normally. Perhaps you guys could co-ordinate complementary canvases so that PIL are not overwhelmed. I'm guessing she also wants one for her parents so the one of the two children together wouldn't really work.

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Tue 13-Nov-12 12:28:44

What size is she getting? do a 8ft x 8ft of your DD grin

Just kidding, it's a pisser, but let it go OP

CheerfulYank Tue 13-Nov-12 12:29:10

Oh Lord. She sounds...interesting. Glad to have an explanation though, it was bothering me! smile

FWIW my SIL always sets up a photo session with my DS and her two DC to get a portrait for our MIL and it always looks tacky and shit and I hate them (there are usually fake backgrounds involved, like our children just happened upon a brook with some autumn leaves and a little red wagon hmm ) but they both love them, so whatever.

mrskeithrichards Tue 13-Nov-12 12:30:12

Ah so there's a perfectly reasonable explanation then and now you know she's not adverse to all things canvas you can get one done together next year.

Don't be a mare and try to stir things by doing one of your dd. Let her have her newborn moment, I'm sure you had plenty, and get your in laws something different. I'm sure they've already got photos of your dd on her own so it would be nice for your sil to have the same for her lo.

squoosh Tue 13-Nov-12 12:33:42

OP here's some inspiration for your own photo shoot. Some absolute gems!!!

awkwardfamilyphotos.com/tag/babies/

grin shock

squoosh Tue 13-Nov-12 12:36:16
lljkk Tue 13-Nov-12 12:58:55

Ah, she's in newborn baby love. Bit mad, but could have been much worse explanation.

JenaiMarrHePlaysGuitar Tue 13-Nov-12 13:40:08

a brook with some autumn leaves and a little red wagon

Hahaha Yank I have a few of these from when ds was a baby. They're tacky and strangely don't even look like him much, but I still love them. None have been turned into canvasses however yet.

Narked Tue 13-Nov-12 13:50:11

Thought so. So many people get professional pictures taken of their PFBs - or even pay for the thing where you get a package deal of one a month! Very few do it with their second or third DC grin

Narked Tue 13-Nov-12 13:51:13

And I'd bet her parents will be getting the same 'gift.'

AlienRefluxovermypoppy Tue 13-Nov-12 14:29:21

Ha ha squoosh !!In that christening one, has that woman grabbed her kid by the hair??!!

squoosh Tue 13-Nov-12 15:01:13

Yes! And she's just slapped the little boy's face!!!

CheerfulYank Tue 13-Nov-12 17:33:50

And it's their grandmother! I know pulling hair and slapping children is not funny, but it did make me ROFL a bit. blush

tittytittyhanghang Tue 13-Nov-12 21:51:10

Knew it was either petty or selfish. And just because this is a pfb doesn't make it any less so.

stifnstav Tue 13-Nov-12 22:07:10

'ANG ABAAAAHT!

So she is having the photo done on 27 DEC? So they won't be unwrapping anything on Christmas Day?

Weird. <walks off whistling to oneself>

tittytittyhanghang Tue 13-Nov-12 22:31:50

Jeeesus, sqoosh, did you get to page three, makes grandma's slapping and hairpulling heartwarming!

Join the discussion

Join the discussion

Registering is free, easy, and means you can join in the discussion, get discounts, win prizes and lots more.

Register now