to wonder if the concept of a 'yummy mummy' is a feminist issue, a class issue or just my issue

(135 Posts)
IveNoIntentionOfMakingCupcakes Sat 13-Oct-12 20:24:51

Yesterday, I met a father who made a comment about me being a 'yummy mummy'. At the time I smiled, was slightly embarrassed and also slightly irritated but I wasn't all that sure why?

Maybe it was just because he was a smarmy git but maybe it was something more. I have only ever heard the term used to imply that a woman is attractive and/or that a woman is middle class. It seems to me that the whole concept of 'yummy mummies' implies that there is also a group that are not 'yummy' and that's quite insulting really. AIBU?

AnnaLiza Sat 13-Oct-12 20:26:22

YANBU
I hate the expression too and people who use it!

I think yummy mummy is a bit of an inflammatory term. It implies that most women aren't and that it is a rarity to have children and still look after yourself and look nice and be organised.

IneedAsockamnesty Sat 13-Oct-12 20:28:56

its possible you may be over thinking it, was he trying to chat you up or was it just genral chat?

AgentZigzag Sat 13-Oct-12 20:29:17

Are you attractive and middle class?

He could have been making a kack handed compliment.

I didn't think it had anything to do with class. confused

quesadilla Sat 13-Oct-12 20:31:35

Its awful but I've never heard anyone use it without irony... It tends to be used by mummies not feeling all that yummy about the ones they come into contact with who have the time/money to work on their saggy abs/get their bikini lines done/get pedicures/learn shiatsu. This guy is clearly a lech though and will clearly use any means necessary to get into your pants so you can discount everything he says... No-one uses the phrase with a straight face, certainly not about themself.

WorraLiberty Sat 13-Oct-12 20:31:58

I've never heard it in a 'class' context.

Round here it means an attractive Mother.

marriedinwhite Sat 13-Oct-12 20:32:20

I don't think it's meant as a nasty or disrespectful term. It's a term that my young children days preceded but I don't think I'd have found it offensive to be called a yummy mummy. Would have preferred to be a yummy mummy than a slummy mummy. Smacks of Nigella Lawson and I would love to be that sexy to be honest.

SirBoobAlot Sat 13-Oct-12 20:33:28

I don't think its a class thing. It irritates the shit out of me though.

WorraLiberty Sat 13-Oct-12 20:34:01

"This guy is clearly a lech though and will clearly use any means necessary to get into your pants so you can discount everything he says"

Blimey, you got all that from one phrase? shock

TwickOrTweasels Sat 13-Oct-12 20:34:34

It is meant as a compliment but it does imply that to be attractive AND a mother is unusual.

AgentZigzag Sat 13-Oct-12 20:35:18

Wasn't there a poster called scummymummy?

I'd rather be scummy than slummy.

Or yummy come to think of it.

TwickOrTweasels Sat 13-Oct-12 20:35:26

I'm a Spammy Mammy grin

WorraLiberty Sat 13-Oct-12 20:38:50

I just hate the word 'Mummy' when used by one adult to another adult (including adult offspring).

And the word 'Yummy' or 'Yum' has always grated on me for some reason.

This phrase is not for me, can anyone tell? grin

Peevish Sat 13-Oct-12 20:38:57

He may well have intended it as a compliment, and I do think people (women as well as men) use the term really loosely now, when from what I remember it started off as a slightly sloppy media shorthand for highly-groomed celebrity mothers who got back into their red carpet frocks within two minutes of giving birth. But I sometimes hear women talking jokingly about being a yummy mummy because they're out having coffee during the day or are wearing matching socks.

It is an irritating term though, like MILF. The implication seems to be that it refers to the tiny minority of women considered to retain their fuckability after having children.

To which I sigh and roll my eyes.

McHappyPants2012 Sat 13-Oct-12 20:39:04

Yummy mummy is a lot better than a MILF

Yama Sat 13-Oct-12 20:39:46

To me it is definitely about class. It is also about the ability to take care of appearance.

Yes, a class issue. Yes, a feminist issue.

I spend a lot of time thinking about both the plight of women and the plight of the poor.

My dh would never use the phrase. Because he is non ignorant.

So YANBU.

Yama Sat 13-Oct-12 20:40:02

not ignorant

AgentZigzag Sat 13-Oct-12 20:40:54

grin at spammy mammy.

Yum mum has jam making and coffee morning associations in my head, whereas MILF involve fucking.

Opposite ends of the spectrum.

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 20:45:39

I used to veer between slummy and scummy, these days it's clammy mammy.

But on an semiotic level (!) I would say that this term has evolved because being a mother signified a certain persona. If the new term was scummy mummy the signifier of 'mother' would be beautiful attractive, in demand. I can only guess that the fact that the term is yummy mummy indicates that 'mother' always signified 'a bit dowdy and under par'.

However the term is not sexist as it is a term that may be used by both men and women. On the other hand it is a term that can only ever apply to women, so it is a feminist issue - i.e. our problem.

WorraLiberty Sat 13-Oct-12 20:48:08

It's not a class thing at all here

It's just used to distinguish the dressed up/made-up mothers from those who don't bother much.

Raspberryandorangesorbet Sat 13-Oct-12 20:49:10

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TheLightPassenger Sat 13-Oct-12 21:04:48

I think it is a class issue tbh, as I always feel that being reasonably well off is kind of implicit as part of the yummy mummy thing.

ClippedPhoenix Sat 13-Oct-12 21:07:40

I've been called it and was rather flattered to be honest grin and I'm working class.

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 21:09:36

Of course, I never thought of that in my analysis - 'Mummy' is a very middle class term (when used by adults). It is also a class issue, implying that other classes aren't quite so yummy.

I hate the term, have never used it because it implies that mothers are somehow edible.

Mummiesarescary Sat 13-Oct-12 21:16:30

Don't know if it's a class issue, only see it on fb and it's not the middle class mums who are using it.

I don't like it, not sure why though.

IveNoIntentionOfMakingCupcakes Sat 13-Oct-12 21:23:26

It's not that I was offended on a personal level by that particular man. It's more about the fact that the term implies that there is an elite group of attractive mothers and that all other mothers are a bit crap.

It's a judgement based on appearance only and I find that pretty sexist.

TheOriginalSteamingNit Sat 13-Oct-12 21:24:31

It's a bit patronizing. I don't think a man who was a good egg would say it.

I got called a 'yummy mummy to be' on my ebay feedback after someone came and collected an item. Took it as a compliment. grin

SomersetONeil Sat 13-Oct-12 21:33:53

Only 4 posts in before someone's suggested you're over-thinking it - good going. grin

You're not over-thinking about it, by the way. It's a cringey term.

Mrsjay Sat 13-Oct-12 21:38:07

nothing to do with Class dont you get pretty working class mothers , I think it is condescending an attractive 'yummy' woman who happens to be a mother MEH dont take it as a compliment and I think women who do are a bit shallow,

ClippedPhoenix Sat 13-Oct-12 21:43:17

What on earth is wrong with being good looking and being a mum? It's just a saying for god sake. Blimey grin

I love being recognised as a mum. I love saying I'm a mum.

The saying that makes me go a bit ummm, is "You look well" - why did I look sick before?

IveNoIntentionOfMakingCupcakes Sat 13-Oct-12 21:44:24

Clipped and SparklyGoth, I can totally see that someone would say it harmlessly and mean it as a compliment. It's not their fault that it is a widely-used term. It's the term itself I have a problem with.

ClippedPhoenix Sat 13-Oct-12 22:02:03

IveNo - whilst I don't get offended by the term at all you're within your rights to not like it. Everyone's different.

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 22:48:22

The more I think about it, I dislike the word 'yummy'. It is the use of a child's language and there is actually something quite creepy about it being used to describe someone attractive. Reminds me of upper class buffoons like Boris Johnson trying to make a compliment but wanting to be condescending at the same time.

And yes I think I am over-thinking it, but that's the point of the thread. smile

ClippedPhoenix Sat 13-Oct-12 22:58:49

Stop it Achillea, I'm now finding it creepy

Next time someone a man says it i will have to ask him if he'd find be attractive in nappies grin

Mrsjay Sat 13-Oct-12 23:00:15

I think it is the yummy part that makes me cringe and tbh I have visions of very pretty designer clad ladies with flicky hair as 'yummy mummys' <cringe>

YouMayLogOut Sat 13-Oct-12 23:04:36

"Yummy" is an infantile word and certainly not one I'd want to hear from a complete stranger to describe me. I'd find it intrusive and patronising.

ChristineDaae Sat 13-Oct-12 23:10:20

Meh maybe I'm shallow but I was quite impressed at being called a yummy mummy on my first post baby night out. I felt fat and saggy so was nice to be complimented. Been called a milf a few times, don't mind depending on who says it. But I'm pretty laid back about that sort of stuff.

Proudnscary Sat 13-Oct-12 23:11:03

Oh for cripes sake, it's only 'yummy' because it rhymes with mummy. It really is not offensive unless said in scornful/sex pesty way.

scarlettsmummy2 Sat 13-Oct-12 23:13:51

To me it represents attractive, well off mums breast feeding in Starbucks with other women of a similar ilk.

PropertyNightmare Sat 13-Oct-12 23:16:52

There are some ugly mothers though. I don't get unduly upset by MILF etc. DILF is a now a recognised term (I believe that Gary Barlow is one).

One of the school gate mafia dons at my ds's school used it on me once. It wasn't meant as a compliment!

More of a "you're a bimbo and because you're wearing make-up and heels you're a shit mum" type thing.

Helltotheno Sat 13-Oct-12 23:20:24

Irritating in the extreme... I'd sooner be called a milf than a 'yummy mummy'. I hate the word 'mummy' or even 'mum'... mum tum etc... boak sad

I know without a shadow of a doubt that I could nevah, evah be friends with someone who described herself as a 'yummy mummy' and wasn't being tongue in cheek about it... nah, we just wouldn't gel!

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 23:27:11

Perhaps we need to invent some new terms for men, like DILF

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 23:28:16

Oh, too late!

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 23:28:55

Ok then, FILF.

WinkySlink Sat 13-Oct-12 23:30:11

My perception of the term is both a feminist and a class thing. I deem it to refer to women who are 'wealthy enough' to 'sit around' in coffee shops or restaurants, well dressed, with expensive buggys, clothes etc. Very much 'chattering classes' with the implication being that the chatting and image are more important than the baby, except where the 'chattering' is about schools/ bf/ agonising over child rearing. I think it is generally an offensive, condescending term. It seems to have transformed into a general 'fit mums' thing, which I actually find much less offensive.

LittleTyga Sat 13-Oct-12 23:34:46

A feminist issue - where are all the laddy Daddy comments? Oh wait a minute there aren't any!

LittleTyga Sat 13-Oct-12 23:35:52

FILF - grin

Mrsjay Sat 13-Oct-12 23:37:25

what about a Dishy daddy sounds just as eww as yummy mummy though

McHappyPants2012 Sat 13-Oct-12 23:37:34

Sugar daddy I would say was the same as a yummy mummy

WinkySlink Sat 13-Oct-12 23:40:12

Different in that Sugar Daddy is generally used to criticise the women he is involved with, rather than the man himself.

SheppySheepdog Sat 13-Oct-12 23:42:25

Have seen bibs, babygrows etc with "My mummy is yummy" on around here hmm

If anything "yummy mummy" is a term the mothers in tracksuits and hair extensions would use to describe themselves so possibly a class thing but not in the way you are thinking.

Me, I'm just an attractive woman who happens to now be a mother too... grin

Mrsjay Sat 13-Oct-12 23:43:23

SUgar daddy is an older rich man who loves to spoil his princess it is a bit different

Viviennemary Sat 13-Oct-12 23:44:46

I've never actually heard the expression spoken. Only read it. A lot! I don't think it's a class thing but it is a bit sexist. Is there an equal expression for a man. I always think it's somebody who is attractive and always wears up-to-the minute fashionable clothes and make up and hair always done.

achillea Sat 13-Oct-12 23:57:52

Sheppy trouble with those bibs and things is they are made in China by people that have vaguely heard the term and have no concept of its meaning on any other level than that it's what people say in the UK. Same way you get 'Sugar Babe' emblazoned on the rear of kids tracksuit bottoms and such.

So people do actually use the term about themselves - in general conversation or just in an online dating kind of way to describe themselves?

UltraBOF Sat 13-Oct-12 23:59:32

I think it's a feminist issue, yes. It's about being judged as a woman on your shag-worthiness, the implication being that most mothers automatically become asexual. Further to that, there's the offensiveness of perfect strangers feeling quite entitled to pronounce on your attractiveness to them. Newsflash: women don't exist just to be graded (degraded?) into categories based on whether you'd shag them or not. It's rude and belittling, I think.

WinkySlink Sun 14-Oct-12 00:03:16

In my understanding a Sugar Daddy is an older man who spoils his young girlfriend, not his daughter..not sure if that was wht you meant by princess, MrsJ?

LittleTyga Sun 14-Oct-12 00:14:25

UltraBof you put it much more eloquently than me - Why does how I look have any bearing on being a mum? We don't judge men on their looks as to what type of parent they are.

LittleTyga Sun 14-Oct-12 00:16:54

Achillea - TBH its usually the Daily Wail reporting on the latest model/actress who had a baby 5 mins ago and then struts about in her bikini showing us her curves (bones to the rest of us!)

WorraLiberty Sun 14-Oct-12 00:18:21

It doesn't have any bearing on you being a Mum

It's just stating the fact that you're attractive and a Mum.

WorraLiberty Sun 14-Oct-12 00:20:30

And I have to say (well I don't really but I will...LOL) that whenever I've heard the phrase 'Yummy Mummy' said by a man, it's always been meant as a compliment.

But when ever (without exception) I've heard it from a woman, it's been meant as a catty comment.

Strange but true confused

ravenAK Sun 14-Oct-12 00:26:51

I think it's inherently condescending - whenever I've heard it, it's been in a mildly pejorative tone, to refer to someone who has too much time on their hands in the speaker's opinion, & is perhaps conceited about/overly concerned with their own attractiveness.

Actually, I've mostly heard it used of SAHMs, by WOHMs, I think. Which is depressing.

In our house dh does the school run & he's certainly aware of which of the mothers he thinks are attractive (ie. he'll say to me 'Oh you know Ella's mum - she's the smiley redhead who wears biker boots' or whatever) but he wouldn't use that term - it's belittling, as BOF said.

UltraBOF Sun 14-Oct-12 00:28:03

Yes, that is probably true. I still think its one of those 'compliments' that is double-edged though: it kind of presumes that the sender feels that it's completely reasonable to assess whether they'd "do you". I find that arrogant and rude.

Quadrangle Sun 14-Oct-12 00:51:24

I think of it as pretty much the same as saying "You look good/are good looking."

Quadrangle Sun 14-Oct-12 00:52:20

When said by a man I mean.

LucieMay Sun 14-Oct-12 01:12:44

I prefer just to be judged as a woman and not a mother. My role as a mother is not linked to my attractiveness or sexiness, the two are quite separate. I've dated since ds was very young and younger men have called me a milf, made me wanna puke. Never come across an older man, ie 30 odd and above, calling it me.

FreudiansGoldSlipper Sun 14-Oct-12 01:27:23

I do not think of it as being a middle class thing at all well not round here. I think it started that way when about the time I was pregnant I am sure I was given a book how to be a yummy mummy

Maybe it depends where you live. I do not like it never have though have been called a few times I think they were being nice

If anything I find it a little creepy and those that have to tell others they are a little sad

Proudnscary Sun 14-Oct-12 07:56:58

Of course there are similar compliments for dads. David Beckham is often referred to us a 'hot dad'. At the dc's old school there was a man only known as Sexy Dad by the mums - so shoot us! It wasn't sexist, or sex pesty, or disrespectful.

People are waaaay overthinking this one.

I'm a feminist but I just can't see why I would be anything than a bit chuffed if referred to as yummy mummy or seen as 'a mum but still attractive' - yes okay if you overthink it 'why the hell shouldn't I be a mum and sexy blah blah' but it's a harmless, lighthearted observation.

Maybe that's because I am confident in myself and my choices - I feel so much more than just a mother. I've never felt like 'just a mum' - I'm a woman with a fulfilling, successful career, a wife etc...so it wouldn't cross my mind to me offended.

TandB Sun 14-Oct-12 08:28:43

I've only ever heard it used in a class/derogatory way to refer to middle class/wealthy women who are obsessed with designer baby clothes, posh prams and are always dressed up to the nines about 5 minutes after having a baby. I've never heard it used as a compliment.

When I lived in SW London people would generally say things like "that cafe is where all the yummy mummy types hang out" or "I went to that baby class but it was all yummy mummy sorts."

Alliwantisaroomsomewhere Sun 14-Oct-12 08:42:37

I see it as a feminist issue. It comments on women and how they look after having had kids. Saying one mummy is "yummy" implies that others are lesser mothers.

snooter Sun 14-Oct-12 08:52:36

At the school gate my friend & I refer to the mums who don't work but spend all day beautifying themselves, having tennis lessons, driving badly in huge unnecessary cars etc etc as the yummy mummies. We both go to work part-time, scrub up nicely when required & are happy to look normal in jeans & flat footwear most of the time.

LolaDontCryOverSpiltBleach Sun 14-Oct-12 09:08:55

Well go you snooter , your properly impressive you are.

snooter Sun 14-Oct-12 09:22:19

Glad you think so lola. Your spelling isn't.

I do think the term implies someone with too much time on their hands.

SirBoobAlot Sun 14-Oct-12 09:31:00

Think BOF covers every angle of why this is both annoying and insulting.

It makes my skin itch a little. Because I was a "young mum", it was a term thrown around a lot in the groups I went to for a short while. Every time I heard it I wanted to vomit.

YouMayLogOut Sun 14-Oct-12 09:53:22

SirBoobAlot I've been put in the group "young mum" even at over 40! It's as if being a mum of young children makes a woman "young" not in terms of age but in being an easy target to be patronised.

LolaDontCryOverSpiltBleach Sun 14-Oct-12 09:56:02

Nice to see your insulting nature covers the internet too.

I can't stand people who think they are superior to others, especially when there only crimes are doing something differently, Never mind someone who works full time probably thinks your inferior too.

How sad.

achillea Sun 14-Oct-12 10:01:36

Judging by appearance is wrong and says more about you than about anyone else.

Judging people by their spelling is much the same thing.

Mrsjay Sun 14-Oct-12 10:09:49

WinkySlink Sun 14-Oct-12 00:03:16
In my understanding a Sugar Daddy is an older man who spoils his young girlfriend, not his daughter..not sure if that was wht you meant by princess, MrsJ

yes that is what I meant

wheresmespecs Sun 14-Oct-12 10:12:02

def a class thing (as well as being sexist, obvs - 'she's had a baby and you'd STILL want to do her! Cor!' etc)

A 'yummy' is the opposite of a 'pramface', to use an even more unpleasant term. Both might take time and effort to do hair/make up/organise a 'look', but you'd know the difference. It's money and class.

monkeysbignuts Sun 14-Oct-12 10:14:22

I bloody hate that expression!

LadyFlumpalot Sun 14-Oct-12 10:17:34

I hate it, because it is taken out of context. It should be Yummi Mummy and it means:

Young Upwardly Mobile Multiple Income.

Not, that the mummy in question is attractive.

wheresmespecs Sun 14-Oct-12 10:21:12

That's interesting Flumpalot - is that where the expression came from? I never think of a yummy as working, whether they are on mat leave or being a SAHM - just as having a wealthy family or high earning partner.

LadyFlumpalot Sun 14-Oct-12 10:25:51

I believe so Wheresmespecs. I seem to recall learning that the phrase originated in the 80's to describe families where they weren't necessarily married, maybe had two mortgages on the house, in their own names and both had affluent, maybe city, jobs.

Soditall Sun 14-Oct-12 11:18:39

I'm not middle class and get called it a lot by men and women.Some women say it as if I'm doing them some diservice hmm I'm not keen on the term to be honest.

I have no idea why being a Mum comes into how you look?

ithaka Sun 14-Oct-12 11:28:31

I always thought of it as referring to middle class women who don't need to work - that it how it is used in my village (not by me, I hasten to add).

Sort of like a 'Boden mum' - the kind who makes being a mum her 'job' and is always going for runs/to lovely lunches/coffee shops while the rest of us schlep off to work.

The yummy mum will mature into a 'lady who lunches' of which there are many in my area.
I have to say, it all sounds lovely to me and I am proper jealous while I work my fingers to the bone for a meagre crust (snivel).

freddiefrog Sun 14-Oct-12 11:29:59

Round here it's used to distinguish the mums who make an effort with their appearance from those who don't, are SAHMs, meet their friends for lunch, go to their hairdressers, etc

But, it's not meant as a compliment, more of a you are a bimbo who is neglecting your children by spending a couple of hours getting your hair done and depriving them by buying yourself pretty clothes. It's usually used sneeringly towards the better off mums

Personally, the word 'yummy' is at the top of my shit list

snooter Sun 14-Oct-12 12:04:59

I judge people by behaviour rather than appearance. As for working full-time / part-time - whatever works & suits is fine - I have worked full-time in the past & will again when I have fewer responsibilities. Most of the yummies round here look down upon those of us normal folk who can't be bothered to straighten our hair & get tarted up for the school run. One even had her full face on & stiletto heels at 6am when a load of the kids were dropped off for a school trip - ridiculous. The rest of us were barely dressed.

WorraLiberty Sun 14-Oct-12 12:07:59

Why is it ridiculous though?

It's not something I've got time for or could be bothered with but I don't understand why it's ridiculous if someone else has.

LolaDontCryOverSpiltBleach Sun 14-Oct-12 12:11:36

At the school gate my friend & I refer to the mums who don't work but spend all day beautifying themselves, having tennis lessons, driving badly in huge unnecessary cars etc etc as the yummy mummies. We both go to work part-time, scrub up nicely when required & are happy to look normal in jeans & flat footwear most of the time.

That was a very appearance based post for someone who doesn't judge that way.

You are still doing it in your last post, maybe she got up an hour early to put her full face on. Did she tell you where she was heading afterwards?
Maybe she thought the rest of you were ridiculous for being barely dressed.

And they may look down on you but, you are the one posting right now and looking down on them.

LolaDontCryOverSpiltBleach Sun 14-Oct-12 12:15:23

Because it is different to what she would do worra Sorry snooter but the way you are posting reminds me of someone who once posted how they didn't understand why the mums got all dressed up and over thought what they were wearing for school drop off and then went on to say why doesn't she just wear some nice jeans a white top a floaty cardigan a nice patterned scarf and lighter makeup and some converse ''like i do''

angeltulips Sun 14-Oct-12 12:18:47

Where I live (posh part of London) it's definitely derogatory - it means a mother who is shallow and superficial and who doesn't have much going on in her life, but is always perfectly groomed. They either don't work at all or have a vanity business (cupcakes, jewellery etc).

Good looking/well groomed mothers who work/do meaningful things are called alpha mothers, not yummies.

There are significant numbers of women who really do fit both stereotypes. I am hoping I am not one of them!

WorraLiberty Sun 14-Oct-12 12:27:20

Blimey what is it with women labelling and judging other women all the time?

And it does tend to be women who do this

I don't think I've ever heard any of these phrases uttered by men.

LolaDontCryOverSpiltBleach Sun 14-Oct-12 12:45:26

It's quite sad really, DP is personal trainer and he say's it's surprising how many women ask specifically for a male trainer because they feel more comfortable and less insecure.

And of all of his colleagues the only ones who giggle about their clients in the staff room are the females with female clients.

ilovemyteddies Sun 14-Oct-12 12:59:24

@ Proudnscary

grin at SexyDad.

chris481 Sun 14-Oct-12 13:00:27

No man should ever pay a woman a compliment, because to do so implicitly insults all women to whom that compliment does not apply.

If they are going to break that rule, they should use the highly accurate assessments of their own attractiveness for which men are renowned to ensure they only flirt with women who welcome it.

snooter Sun 14-Oct-12 13:10:35

I really couldn't give a flying fuck about what the yummies think of my appearance. One asked me once if I'd had my eyes LASERed because I was wearing my contact lenses instead of my glasses, so my appearance had obviously been clocked. It's their superior attitude that pisses me off. If you think my attitude superior then you ought to come & meet some of these shallow individuals. They rate each other by size of car & designer labels.

ilovemyteddies Sun 14-Oct-12 13:19:35

Let's see. Dad categories....

Randy Dad
Super Dad
Glassy Dad

Dresses Too Young Dad

BO Dad

Weird Dad

Tasty Dad

grin

ilovemyteddies Sun 14-Oct-12 13:23:26

The nanny and I used to call one Dad "Mr Legs". He was in pretty good shape, but he was a tall runner, and basically would drop the kids off wearing these VERY short running shorts that sort of revealed a glimpse of windswept arse cheeks as he walked.

grin

PS I'm not really too fussed what anyone calls me, I quite like a bit of banter, and I presume people ARE going to judge others, it's human nature. Long as I'm feeling confident then it's all cool.

wheresmespecs Sun 14-Oct-12 13:29:10

worraliberty - yes, that's what I think too! I don't have the time or the inclination to be super well dressed or groomed (just if I had time, there are other things I'd really want to do more) - but if someone else has the time/looks the part, that's okay, isn't it? Why would it not be? They might not want to do things I like, but that's OK!

I do think women are in a daft circus of paranoia sometimes - 'someone is different to me and must think they are superior and must be judging me for not being like them SO I WILL GET IN THERE FIRST AND JUDGE THEM THUS MAKING MYSELF SUPERIOR BUT NOT A BITCH BECAUSE THEY WERE DOING IT TO ME FIRST!!!!'

ilovemyteddies Sun 14-Oct-12 13:40:58

@ wheresmespecs. Good point there. If you're confident in yourself, it really shouldn't affect you how other women dress etc.

OP - just re-reading your post, I think YANBU to feel irritated.

Sounds a bit hippyish, but I think we are good at picking up signals as to whether or not someone is sort of coming from a position of hostility/being condescending/A CUNTWEASEL? So we can pick up "negative energy" without actually being able to put out finger on it? And it doesn't make us paranoid or unreasonable to be able to say someone is "off" or sending us "bad vibes" without having any evidence for it?

I mean was just chatting with my chap about an encounter I had with a private dentist when I was younger, and saying how he wasn't actually directly saying anything insulting, but just the whole "tone" of the conversation was making me uncomfortable.

As in, he was being creepy and unsettling in such a way that I couldn't directly put my finger on it, but the way and the context in which he was framing certain questions/comments made me walk out thinking confusedangryhmm.

HecateLarpo Sun 14-Oct-12 13:43:09

It's really sneery, imo. I don't like it at all.

Snog Sun 14-Oct-12 13:51:36

People understand many different things by this expression it turns out so hard to make a judgement about the person who said it.

In my book it's a mother who doesn't work and spends all her time lunching, going to the gym, buying expensive clothes and having endless beauty and hair appointments.

HecateLarpo Sun 14-Oct-12 13:54:18

Yes, that's pretty much what it means round here. And not just that as a fact of someone's life, but that in a sneery way hmm. It's certainly not a compliment. That's for sure!

HecateLarpo Sun 14-Oct-12 13:55:15

oh. I hope it was clear that the hmm was at the meaning of it round here that it's as you describe but in a sneery way. and it didn't come across like I was saying you're sneery!!!

GhostShip Sun 14-Oct-12 13:57:57

Not sure about yummy mummy to be honest.

However I got called a MILF the other day.

I'm 21 and have no children.

kickassangel Sun 14-Oct-12 13:59:59

Ok, here's my two pence worth

In the 80s the phrase was yuppi (Young UPwardly mobile Person with Income. Couples were dinkies, double income no kids yet)

The phrase was first used to describe celeb mothers who didn't work and had the time for looking good and going to lunch etc. they would also appear at the school gates with beautifully hand crafted Easter bonnets for dahling Araminta type thing. The epitome of the stereotype would live in Chelsea and drive a 4 wd around town while hubby worked in the city and drove a Beemer for work and a sports car at weekends.

As with all media stereotyping there are a number of issues with the phrase.

It is infantile language which makes women seem less adult than men.
It carries connotations of class, color, area of the UK etc so it raises ALL of those issues.
It classifies/segregates one sub section of the population so is both judgemental and divisive.
It was originally a term applied by men about women with the intention judging them.

It also seems to have inspired a stream of chic lit written by media types who try to be entertaining about being "one of the people" as they write about being ditzy and cooky but charming as they fail to be a yummy mummy but still get their man.

Charlotte from SITC or the red head from Desperate Housewives would be yummy mummies. Susan in Desperate would be the ditzy media hack who wrote a book to show how real she was and understanding of the common people.

For all of these reasons it is an utterly boak worthy term.

nkf Sun 14-Oct-12 14:02:16

It's not any kind of issue. It's just a form of shorthand invented by journalists that other people have picked up on.

WorraLiberty Sun 14-Oct-12 14:09:37

I really couldn't give a flying fuck about what the yummies think of my appearance. One asked me once if I'd had my eyes LASERed because I was wearing my contact lenses instead of my glasses, so my appearance had obviously been clocked.

See I think things like that are more about self confidence...or lack of it.

If she'd said that to me, I would have thought she was just making polite conversation.

And unless she was blind, of course she 'clocked' your appearance as you put it.

GhostShip Sun 14-Oct-12 14:10:34

After thinking about it, I think it's just one of them, it depends what sense it's used in.

Like 'princess'. Love it when my stepdad says I'm 'his little princess', if any other man did we'd have to have words.

Mosman Sun 14-Oct-12 14:52:57

I'd rather be a yummy mummy than a milf, not comfortable with that turn of phrase at all

IveNoIntentionOfMakingCupcakes Sun 14-Oct-12 16:20:04

It seems like it's a phrase that is used as a compliment about an individual but often devisive and undermining when used about a group.

As it happens, in one way I fit the stereotype; I am middle class and a SAHM, but I am also skint, wear old clothes and, with a newborn and a toddler, I don't do much grooming. Like most people, regardless of parental status, I have good days and bad days. I'm pretty confident but I certainly don't think I am any better or any worse than anyone else. Please don't shout at me for any of this, it's neither self-congratulating nor self-pity, it's just the back-story to my original post...I still think it's a rubbish phrase -probably more than ever now - but have been reading your thoughts with much interest.

kickassangel Sun 14-Oct-12 20:54:48

Those saying that it's just a kind of short-hand are pretty much hitting the nail on the head for WHY it's an issue. Cos stereotyping is short hand and lazy, so it relies on commonly perceived views. ie, MOST mums let themselves go, look grubby etc. Therefore those who don't are 'yummy mummies'.

There is lots more to this phrase than that one aspect, but that is WHY such stereotypes need to be challenged.

Pendeen Mon 15-Oct-12 15:11:04

"...driving badly in huge unnecessary cars etc..."

Wonder what an unnecessary car is?

Jusfloatingby Mon 15-Oct-12 15:35:20

I hate that expression. It makes me think of dyed blonde airheads in 4x4s who put their name on waiting lists for designer handbags that cost £1,000s and dress up to go to Tesco.

chris481 Mon 15-Oct-12 15:40:38

A Range Rover is unnecessary, a Golf could do the same job.

Woozley Mon 15-Oct-12 16:28:13

I find it a naff expression, especially when people use it about themselves. At least he didn't say you were a MILF...

I got called a MILF outside Asda by a group of lads hmm

IveNoIntentionOfMakingCupcakes Tue 16-Oct-12 21:40:49

Do people really use it about themselves? That's just strange...

MoomieAndFreddie Tue 16-Oct-12 21:42:44

yanbu i hate it

pippibluestocking Tue 16-Oct-12 22:00:07

what's a MILF?

IveNoIntentionOfMakingCupcakes Tue 16-Oct-12 22:13:14

MILF is mother I'd like to f**k

snooter Wed 17-Oct-12 08:23:38

I'd rather be known as a MILF than a Yummy Mummy.

UltraBOF Wed 17-Oct-12 08:29:49

Why? That sounds like an odd thing to say. They are both pretty disparaging, but I would have thought that was even worse.

snooter Wed 17-Oct-12 08:35:13

I'd rather be thought sexy than a decorative airhead. Agree neither is flattering - just thinking if I had to choose

furrygoldone Wed 17-Oct-12 09:22:55

I thought the phrase came from a book about how to be a yummy mummy, I saw the women who wrote it in breakfast years ago, it stuck in my mind because she made some comment about how working mothers couldn't be yummy mummies and I decided she was an arse and that it was a dreadful phrase.

thekidsrule Wed 17-Oct-12 09:32:26

well i could think of worse names to be called wink

hell do people really get upset about this

pongysticks Wed 17-Oct-12 09:43:22

McHappyPants2012 i'm with you the MILF one was said to me once I was a bit hmm seeing as my eldest DS is 9. I did have to ask what it meant though so having it explained was a bit embarrassing - Yummy mummy annoys me a bit, it sort of leans towards saying that there isn;t much going on between the ears, just coffees, shopping and driving round in a nice car.

MoomieAndFreddie Wed 17-Oct-12 10:48:54

someone bought me that how to be a yummy mummy hmm book before i had DC1

it made me really angry, it was the most shallow load of shit i had ever read

there is loads of really offensive shit in it, and at one point she says you are doomed to a bucket fanny if you have a natural birth. (i paraphrase, but thats the gist of it)

WitchesTit Wed 17-Oct-12 11:04:20

It's a media invention.

First choose a rhyme. Then think up a demographic that it could apply to.

"Ummm what does 'daddy' rhyme with? Oh yeah, 'Laddy'. Lets have 'Laddy Daddies' who are like, lads who are also dads!"
They're all over the place, haven't you seen them?? They're the ones resting their pint on their babybjorn while wiping dribble off their skinny jeans.

Someone once said that witch burning could have been made more appealing if there'd been a rhyming slogan behind the campaign, "Snitch on a witch and we'll burn the bitch" was the example given i believe (thanks Ian Hislop).

You can coose whether you want to be part of it. Or not.

WitchesTit Wed 17-Oct-12 11:14:15

choose although coose away if that's what floats yer boat. grin

It's just another crap media driven 'stereotype' - I ignore it completely.

apart from this thread obviously grin

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