to think parents videoing school assemblies and posting the video on facebook is wrong

(193 Posts)
mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 10:36:55

Just noticed a post from a friend on facebook with a video link to a class assembly. I honestly don't think the person posting has thought through their actions, but surely it is against most school policies? If the school record something, they have to get every parent to sign to say they agree to their child being videoed. I have no problem with parents videoing their children to watch back, but posting it on social media????

What do you think and what would you do? Am I overreacting? I need a second opinion before I speak to friend or even the school about it.

GrimAndHumourless Fri 12-Oct-12 10:41:25

does school have a website that shows policies, you might be able to ascertain what the policy is on social media; have a dig through your paperwork to see if you've had to sign anything to say anyone can put stuff out there, or not.

I know some folk will say ach, the children are in the community, what does it matter, but LAC are an issue

ByTheWay1 Fri 12-Oct-12 10:43:00

I would just ask friend if they had permission from the school to post it - they probably just didn't think.....

Ours says before events that parents attend, that videos can be taken for personal use only.

DinosaurSchool Fri 12-Oct-12 10:43:50

Some parents would be up in arms about that. Personally I couldn't give a monkey's if someone put a video of my dc's on t'internet. I'd be a bit uncomfortable if they were identified by name but assuming they're not I'd not care. I assume only her facebook friends could see it?

But it is against most school's policies, some people have specific issues around child protection.

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 10:43:58

i normally think this is way OTT, BUT facebook is different, it's not just local, with other parents with kids at the school, it's PUBLIC so i would get head to send out a letter, to say this is not acceptable, i'll eat my hat if it's allowed anyway

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 10:44:50

We are always reminded by HT at assemblies etc that videos can be taken, but not posted online.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 10:45:22

NO one should trust facebook to keep anything remotely private. Their settings change all the time without warning.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 10:45:52

The school are a bit technologically backwards so probably haven't even thought through the social media side of things. I know that when my eldest dd was in a video as part of a national science experiment, the video had to go on youtube and I had to sign additional documentation. I also know there are children at our school whose parents don't want them to be in school play videos, so surely they would be mortified if their kids ended up on facebook?

SlightlyConfusedAlwaysMad Fri 12-Oct-12 10:46:52

I put videos up of my dd's class assemblys as we have family in different country's that still like to be involved but I always make it private to relatives only and delete after a week

NiffStipplesHauntsLaSenza Fri 12-Oct-12 10:47:08

Our school has a policy that any photos or videos taken in the school or to do with the school that include any child/adult that is not related to you must not be put on the Internet.
So that includes twitter, Facebook or any photo storage site where the pictures could end up in google.

Floggingmolly Fri 12-Oct-12 10:47:26

I thought all schools insisted on videos being for private use these days?
Our school(s) expressly warn parents at the start of all plays / assemblies not to upload them onto any social networking sites.
I'd be inclined to inform the school, actually, if she refused to take it down. There are good reasons why it's not allowed.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 10:48:33

I have no worries about videos and photos at school and have no problem with other parents taking videos etc. It's just the public sharing and facebook is certainly not private. I like the person whose done it and genuinely believe they have not thought it through. Maybe asking the school office to send out a reminder would be a good idea.

Floggingmolly Fri 12-Oct-12 10:48:49

Slightlyconfused. You really shouldn't, you know.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 10:49:07

If you know of anyone for whom it is likely to be an issue, contact your friend and say something like, sorry, I don't want to be a spoilsport but there's a child in this film whose parents can't risk putting them on the internet - would it be a good idea to PM people the link, so it isn't in the public domain? and just be really nice about it. Also ask the school to remind people it's not a good idea.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 10:49:16

And thanks everyone smile

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 10:49:28

FB is not PUBLIC, unless you are stupid enough to have no security settings.

If I post a video on FB, only 30 people can see it. Hardly public.

And what do you think the school can do about someone elses FB page?

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 10:50:48

Gosakura there's no need to be so rude. FB often and frequently change their security settings and make public things you think are private.

spotsdots Fri 12-Oct-12 10:54:34

Inform the school, I'm fairly sure its against the school policy (child protection). Hopefully, the school will not only tell the parents to remove the link but also they will make sure next time NO ONE will be recording during assemblies.

McHappyPants2012 Fri 12-Oct-12 10:55:14

DS school beats the parents to it, they have a facebook and twitter page.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 10:55:43

I would be very unhappy if - when she is actually at school! - someone posted a video of DD at school, because she is adopted. Even if only 30 people see it, what if one of those is a friend of her birth parents and spots her? In fact, school pictures and videos are worse than eg a birthday party, because the school uniform is a huge giveaway to where she is now living. I would not have similar concerns re footage of DS, but it's easiest and best to have a blanket policy regarding all pupils, not just the small number where there a genuine concerns.

OK, the chances of this happening are remote, but some things are too important to risk.

OP, YANBU and suggest asking the school to reiterate their social media
policy (or develop one, if they are lacking)

Floggingmolly Fri 12-Oct-12 10:56:27

only 30 people can see it
I wouldn't want 30 random strangers watching videos of my children, actually,
Gosakura, why would you want to share it with 30 people?
Of your choosing, not mine? hmm

School videos should not be uploaded to social media. Ever.

It's a massive child protection issue - I'm not talking about "ooh, paedos doing google searches" either - it's about the risk to children in the care system who are at risk of people discovering their whereabouts based on identifiable videos.

Personally, I'd report to the school.

freddiefrog Fri 12-Oct-12 11:06:47

Our head makes it very clear at the start of every assembly that we're welcome to take photos and video but we must not post anything with another child other than our own in on the Internet

Now, I'm not too fussed with my own children, but I am also a foster carer and there are all sorts of issues if someone posts a pic of them on FB

ByTheWay1 Fri 12-Oct-12 11:10:07

If you post a video/pic on facebook maybe only 30 can see it FIRSTHAND -

but it can be shared by any one of them to all their friends etc - once you have put something in the public domain it cannot be restricted.

purplehouse Fri 12-Oct-12 11:15:42

It's wrong to put a video of a class assembly on facebook.

At my DS's class assembly, one of the parents in the class had objected to photos being taken and nobody was even allowed to take a single photo of it, let alone a video!

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 11:17:26

I know of a school in my local area that had a blanket ban for a while on any photography during school events. Obviously this was unworkable and there was uproar from parents so gradually things were introduced so that photos could be taken in certain circumstances. And what was one of the first things that a parent did - put pictures from an event on facebook (which happened to have a picture of an adopted child in the background).

At the time of the ban policy the parents could not seem to get their heads around the fact that it was nothing to do with paedophiles looking at the kids, and everything to do with children in care being identified, as mimsey said above.

ReallyTired Fri 12-Oct-12 11:20:51

If parents are allowed to put videos on the facebook then it can endanger the lives of children who are in local authority care or adopted. GoSakuramachi before you comment its unlikely you know which kids are in care.

It would be desperately sad if LAC kids were not allowed to be the class assembly because there selfish parents..

HanSolo Fri 12-Oct-12 11:22:08

Gosakura - you may think it's private- it' not.
Any image loaded to FB then is owned by FB, to be used as they wish. Imagine if a child in adoptive placemnet had their nativity play videoed by some classmate's parent, idiotically posted on FB, then find themselves in a global marketing campaign?

ScaryBeardyDeadyman Fri 12-Oct-12 11:26:02

Do you all cover your kid's faces when you walk them down the street? Anyone can see your child if they pass them by and most of them are probably strangers! I really don't see the problem here.

ReallyTired Fri 12-Oct-12 11:26:53

Your "friends" should share a photo with their friends and you have no idea what their security settings are. There are been several really funny photos or videos that have gone "viral" on the internet. Personally I would not want complete strangers laughing at my child if he had done something silly.

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 11:32:03

have you read the thread scarybeardydeadyman??

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 11:32:34

Looking for a child in a fast moving, busy street is not quite as easy as looking for a static image of them online.

Really Daddyman I thought you had more sense.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 11:33:16

thats not true, at all. read the t&c's, its not even remotely true.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 11:33:59

Gosakura, you're being naive.

McHappyPants2012 Fri 12-Oct-12 11:35:07

can someone explain to me how adoptive children would be at risk with the photo/video being online.

I can understand with foster care children or those who are in social services car, but not children who has been adopted.

freddiefrog Fri 12-Oct-12 11:35:31

Yes, a member of my FC's birth family may see their face when they're walking down the street with me but thats unavoidable. Posting pics of them, in an identifiable school uniform, on the Internet is an unneccessary and completely avoidable risk

ScaryBeardyDeadyman Fri 12-Oct-12 11:37:29

Sometimes when I'm out with my kids a random stranger will come up and say hello and make a fuss of them. I have no problem with this either.

Yes I read the thread, strangers are everywhere, people who look at children must be evil and adopted children should never be seen outdoors because the person who gave them up had a change of heart and is hunting them down by looking at random people's fb photos.

ScaryBeardyDeadyman Fri 12-Oct-12 11:39:19

freddy do you remove their school uniform before they leave school? Do you never pop to the shops with them straight after school whilst they're still in uniform?

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 11:39:24

Daddyman now you're just being a git.

Do you have an experience of children in care, or adopted children, or anything remotely like that?

It doesn't sound like you know what you're talking about (and mocking)

ScaryBeardyDeadyman Fri 12-Oct-12 11:46:07

Yep I do. A friend of mine fostered a girl who's mother was an alcoholic and went missing for days at a time and failed utterly to provide for her.

Thanks for the insult btw. Very grown up.

Daddyshambles Fri 12-Oct-12 11:46:50

I'm with Beardy, what's the real risk here? Not the imagined risk, the actual risk with, you know, evidence & stuff. It's not like they're running around in swimsuits or leotards or something, it's just a bunch of kids singing songs in school uniform (presumably).

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:46:56

Even if I was TOLD not to post videos of assemblies on fb I still would. Because my family in other countries want to see them. And if that isn't liked, it's tough. What I do with photos or videos of assemblies with my DC's in is up to ME.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:48:45

I put their class photos on fb too. My settings are set to friends and family only, that's as far as I'm willing to go.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 11:50:18

Yes Couthy, but it is not up to you what you do with images of other people's children.

It is selfish attitudes like this which mean that in some schools parents cannot take any photographs at all.

I am very lax when it comes to photos of my own DS on facebook, I post loads of them! However, I ALWAYS ask permission to post photos of someone else's kids. At a basic level it is just good manners.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:51:06

It's up to the FC to decide upon the calculated risk of other people posting photos online as to whether they are happy for their FC DC to participate in school photos and assemblies.

Nobody is going to stop me from filming my DC's assemblies, and nobody is going to stop me from choosing what I post online.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 11:51:38

Couthy - do you ever tag any of your family members in said photos?

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:51:58

I'd still take photos and videos if told not to. I want a record of the assembly, and my far flung family wish to see it.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:52:33

Yep. I tag my Aunts and Uncles, my brother, my cousins, my grandparents.

ByTheWay1 Fri 12-Oct-12 11:52:37

CMWO - but what if my children are in those pictures and I don't want you to post them? You are saying that because your kids are in them, stuff me... how mean.... do you ask the parents of EVERY child in your pics and video if they want them posted??

Someone took video of a Y6 girl falling off stage at our leavers' do - it went on to youtube and is now a bully's "weapon of choice" in Y7...

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 11:53:44

So a child shouldnt be able to particiapte in any school events because they are in the unfortunate position of being fostered away from an abusive home? Nice.

Why dont you just privately email pictures and videos to family members?

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Fri 12-Oct-12 11:54:11

Couthy,
Yes it is up to you to choose what you do with images of hour dc it is not up to you to decide what to do with images of other people's children

You may set things to friends and family only but There is nothing you can do to prevent them redistributing the images

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:54:15

Seriously, it's not MY DC that are at risk, my videos focus on MY DC, others are just in the background.

If the FC doesn't want to take the risk of photos online, then they need to decide whether their FC DC can participate, because I'm NOT going without a record of the assembly that I can share with my family.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 11:54:53

So if you tag all of those people in the photos, then all of their friends will also be able to see these images. Not so private then...

My DD is adopted, and this year they had a little autumn play which some parents filmed, and we had to ask the school to ask the parents to be careful about where they put it. DD has been followed by someone who turned out to be a friend of her birth parents, and he was giving information about where she lived, in which room etc; to the birth parents.Her birth parents have seen a photo posted by my friend of the first time she met DD after she was adopted, because they commented on there. That meant she found out where she was living, and with who. My friend had private settings but one of her friends who shared it hadn't, which was how they saw it. We asked her to take it down.

A random stranger coming up and making a fuss about them is fine. The possibility that her birth parents, who have made it very clear they want her back- even though she was neglected- could try and take her if they get too much information, well I'm not risking that.

Our school asks parents not to film the play, instead there is a photo time afterwards. People get their photos, kids like DD aren't identified by birth parents.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:55:30

Because I can't go that on my phone. Fb is how we share these things. I don't need to change the way I do things.

I have BEEN the DC in FC, and I think these rules are OTT.

By the way, if everyone just took videos of their own DC, that's fine. It's people who take a longshot video of everything, so having kids like my DD not just in the background, that's the danger.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 11:58:27

Well, that's a shame that your DD has been followed by someone who knows her birth family, but it isn't going to stop me from videoing my DC's. NOTHING WILL.

Surely it is YOUR responsibility to keep her safe, not mine. It's my responsibility to do what I see best for my DC's, and that is to connect them to their absent family members by sharing things like assemblies and class photos from their childhood.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 12:03:15

McHappy - because even if the birth parents consented to the adoption, they might still want to know more about the adoptive child than the system would normally allow. They, or other family members, might want to see them face to face, which would not normally permitted. In some circumstances, there may be a real danger that the birth family will seek to find and remove the adoptive child. Knowing which school they are at makes that pretty easy.

To those who say, well, you let them walk down the street without covering their faces, yes, because it's about balancing risk with giving them a normal life. Eg we would never take DD to where we know most of her birth family live. DH doesn't have a picture of her up in his office because a large number of his colleagues live where they do. But of course she goes to the park, talks to people we meet and other normal stuff. it's just that we make sure we manage the risk as best we can.

And those of you who don't care about the risk to other children, so long as you can show off your children on social media (which, however you set your privacy settings is essentially publishing it) I feel both angry that my child's safety is not apparently worthy of your consideration and sad that you have that attitude.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:03:25

I only take video where my DC's are talking/singing. I don't video the whole thing. So it's a 2 minute max video each time, where my DC's are the focus.

If other people don't want me to post pics or videos with their DC's in the background, then they need to ensure that they are moved when I'm videoing.

I don't see why I should ask ANYONE whether I can post a 2 minute video of MY child, just because shock horror there might be other DC in the background.

And as for that fall - if it wasn't MY DC, I'd edit it out. Easy to do on an iPhone.

Narked Fri 12-Oct-12 12:03:27

You're never going to make selfish people care about anything but what they want to do.

They could record footage and burn it onto a disc for family, or show it to them on their phone/laptop but why go to that bother for the sake of someone else's child.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 12:03:41

If you can facebook from your phone then you can email pics from your phone. You are just being deliberately controversial.

I don't want you to stop videoing your DCs. As long as you're doing it focusing on your children, which you are, that's fine because they are your DCs and you have a right to video them. In the post before that, you said other children were in the background- that's what I want. If everyone did that, there wouldn't be a problem. People doing longshots of the whole play, and not focusing on their DCs, instead often having detail on my DD or other people's, that's a problem if they are posting it on facebook.

I take video of my DD. I send it to my family. I, like you, want to connect her to my family, especially as many of them have never properly met her. However, I won't put it on facebook because I don't know what will happen, unless all my family have promised never to share it and understand why.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:08:06

I decide what I do with MY pictures if MY DC's, YOU decide what you do with YOUR pictures of your DC's.

The person who takes the picture holds the rights over it, I'm afraid.

And if it's MY picture, I get to choose where I put it.

Yes, your DD might have problems for this - maybe you are living too close to her birth family, and that might be something for YOU to consider.

I focus the shots on my DC's, tbh I don't even notice other people in the background.

Plus our school doesn't even say we can't video or put it online.

I wouldn't send my DC's to a school with a rule like that because the ability to share things like this on fb with my family is so important to me.

McHappyPants2012 Fri 12-Oct-12 12:08:19

couthy, show some empathy.

If you want to show the video send the Video via email, make a dvd and post it or have a movie night buy popcorn and invite family to come and see the play.

why put other children at risk jsut because you are being selfish.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:11:11

Well maybe I'm too technologically shite then. I can't figure out a way to email pics from my phone. Fb I just click a button. Probably would be more private to email them, but I do what I know how to do!

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:12:23

I think America, Germany, Hawaii, Scotland and Italy might be a bit too far to come for a film night and can't afford postage needs to be something free. Hence using fb.

Narked Fri 12-Oct-12 12:13:02

You see! It's actually your fault for not moving! Not that moving would help when selfish people post stuff on Facebook that easily identifies your child and their location.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:13:12

Would consider other options if they were easy and free.

Narked Fri 12-Oct-12 12:13:55

Or ... email

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:15:43

If I choose a school based on their policies, and making sure that they don't stop me from sharing my videos and pics of my DC's in a way that I deem fit is one of the things I particularly look for, if they changed the policy I would ignore it tbh, of it was one of the reasons I chose the school. My reasons are no less valid than anyone else's. my choices are no less valid than anyone else's.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:16:28

Just said, don't know how to email pics and videos. Have sent a total of 4 emails in my life.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Fri 12-Oct-12 12:17:05

Email is easy and free, you can just add emails and videos as attachments.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 12:20:29

Couthy, even if we lived the other side of the world from DD's birth parents, they could still track her down using the information you have decided to broadcast to the world (because anything on social media is in the public domain). Thanks for that.

There are other ways to share pictures and film with friends and family (which we use). And as oopsy says, there are ways of capturing your Dc without including everyone else.

I'm going to assume that you are being deliberately provocative, because surely no one would be that selfish that genuine child protection issues were of lesser importance than being able to post pictures of your children's school play on Facebook.

Maybe you could have a blog? Give it a name like '(whatever your DC's name is) Blog' and give it an odd url, and no one will find it apart from your family. I started a blog ages ago, and no one outside my family found it. Then you can do whatever you want on there. The reason that's better, albeit only slightly, is that someone has to specifically search the name of the blog, and as DD's birth parents won't know your DC's name, then it should hopefully be safer. Wordpress or google Blogger are good ways to make a free blog.

I don't know how to email videos from phones though. And by the way, we live on the opposite side of the UK to them. We moved specifically after the incident, when we were already divided by two cities, and they were really that desperate to find her.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 12:24:51
filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 12:24:52

So you would rather that kids in foster care (who lets face it have probably had a bit of a shitty time of it up to now) are not allowed to participate in any photographed school events than you take five minutes out of your life to learn how to send an email? Really?

I am with families - you are just being deliberately provocative. You went too far because no one believes that anyone would be that much of a selfish and lazy twat.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 12:25:48

flickr?

Better link

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 12:27:42

i give up

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 12:30:52

You know Couthy, you are coming across as extraordinarily selfish on this thread.

What you are saying is "I can do what I like, and if your children get hurt, I don't care". Do you really not care at all?

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 12:34:57

Daddyman, it was a flippant insult and I said it because I was offended by your apparent arrogance towards and dismissal of the very real issues which a lot of adoptive or foster parents face.

I don't think you show any understanding of how serious it can be when pictures are put in the public domain, for these families and these children.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 12:39:19

This:

'Yes I read the thread, strangers are everywhere, people who look at children must be evil and adopted children should never be seen outdoors because the person who gave them up had a change of heart and is hunting them down by looking at random people's fb photos. '

If I'm wrong then I apologise, but to me it sounded like you were being really sarcastic.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 12:40:51

I'm not remotely naive and work in a social media job. I can assure you I know far more about it than you. Facebook can not take your videos and use them in a global marketing campaign, that is a fact. Though why you would imagine anyone would be interested in your, no doubt cute to you, home videos of badly singing children on a wonkily held camera phone is a mystery.

titchy Fri 12-Oct-12 12:42:12

Couthy you posted in some distress ages agao when your (AS?) ds was dragged across a field with his trousers round his ankles.

Imagine some little shit child had filmed that, and their stupid fuckwit indulgent parents had posted their little 'joke' on FB for just their 'friends' to see, and their friends, and their friends. And suddetnly EVERYONE has seen your child being publically humiliated....

Would you be up in arms? Or supporting those parents who posted the original video as their right to post a visoe of their child?

It's a massive headache for schools. Our HT always says, 'You are welcome to take photos or videos, but these are for your own use only. If you want to post them on social media sites, please make sure you have permission from the parents of every child in your photo or video.' People ignore her, mind you. hmm However, if she finds out there is one on fb, she approaches that parent directly to ask them if they have permission.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 12:42:16

I can't talk to you if you're going to be so snarky. I really can't. You seem to think we're all stupid.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 12:42:28

Thatwas to Gosakura btw.

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 12:43:24

is everyone on drugs today? or has someone slipped some in my tea, cos normally cool posters are acting v.weird

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 12:45:11

I was thinking that Alien.

Unless you're talking about me of course.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 12:49:06

Gosh, just been out working for a couple of hours and returned to find I've opened a can of worms. I can see both side of the arguments and as I have said, I have no objections to parents videoing my kids and sharing with their family. However, I really don't think facebook or any other social media is the way to do that. I would hate for the school to ban parents from taking any sort of photos or videos, but it will happen if people are going to post them in a way which could endanger the safety of children in care. And if people aren't up to scratch with managing privacy settings (which I believe to the case for the majority of facebook users), then they should not be doing this.

I have never been worried about this from the angle of some random paedo seeing the pictures, it is purely in the interest of following policies to safeguard children.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 12:53:25

I don't think anyone is stupid, except for those asserting complete rubbish about FB stealing your videos and pictures to use for nefarious purposes.

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 12:54:20

No ed, not you.
the compromise, is email ffs LEARN don't brush off genuine concerns, proven to be founded, with total knobbish... it's MY KID my choice wtf?

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 12:55:03

good point titchy, our kids should be our choice too.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 12:55:59

That would be different. A bullying incident is not comparable to my child standing in front of an audience singing.

If they had posted a video of that, it would be cyber bullying. It's not cyber bullying to post an innocuous short video of a school assembly, a pleasant occurrence.

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 13:00:09

But the result can be even worse for some children that bullying by their peers.

Do you accept that some birth families stalk the internet, looking for evidence of their children, and trying to find where they are? Because it is becoming increasingly a problem for adopted children.

GoSakamura, for me this is nothing to do with evil Facebook selling anything, or about evil unknown paedos. This is real danger, for real children, from people who are living not very far away.

UltraBOF Fri 12-Oct-12 13:08:16

Emailing video on an iPhone is just as easy as posting to Facebook.

Click on the video, click the arrow at the bottom of the screen, then it takes you to a screen to email, post to Facebook, sent as a text message, all sorts. Just click the email button instead of the Facebook one.

stoatie Fri 12-Oct-12 13:09:52

Some years ago (thankfully pre facebook) a family who were at the same school as my children were on the witness protection scheme had been relocated etc because of a real danger. I only knew because I was involved with the family through work. If another parent had included video of that family it would have immediately identified their location.........

The reality is most of us (quite rightly) know very little about our children's classmates, and therefore have no idea of the potential implications of posting videos and where that video might end up or the ramifications that may have.

EasilyBored Fri 12-Oct-12 13:11:07

I thought it was just manners that you don't post photos of any children that are not your own (even if they are in the background of a school photo) on FB without the other parent's permission?

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 13:11:19

I care, but IMO, it is ridiculous to state that I can't share pictures with my DC in as I see fit. And fb is how I choose to do that.

I can see that this might seem selfish, but my far flung family were the ones who fostered me. It is VERY important to me to keep them involved in my DC's lives by posting these videos and pictures. And it's very important for me that my DC's have a strong connection with these people because if anything happens to me, it will be one of them that takes care of them.

Why are my valid concerns somehow less than the FC/adoptive parent's concerns?

Ok, so I now know that some people don't like these videos on fb. But fb is how my family communicate. We don't email, it's not instant enough. We do fb chat and Skype. I want something where they can see it as soon as I post it, WHILE I'm chatting to them!

Why is that so wrong?

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 13:13:37

The reason you should be more careful is that you have many, many alternatives to Facebook.

A video doesn't have to be instant confused, send it and then ring them.

Surely you can't only talk to them at specific times.

I think you are making excuses, and haven't really thought it through.

dd is 16 now, and is still afraid that her birth family will turn up at the school gate. She has worried about it a lot in the past. Some children aren't just worried, they are terrified sad.

UltraBOF Fri 12-Oct-12 13:13:53

But email is every bit as instant. If you have an iPhone, the button to open email is there just like the Facebook button. As it is on every laptop.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 13:16:05

I can't afford to phone abroad. We WANT to see the video at the same time as we are chatting on fb. Why is that not a valid choice?!

Ok, what about if I tried to find a way on the iPhone to blur out the faces of everyone but my DC? Would that be acceptable? If all the other faces were cropped out maybe? I can do the cropping I think on photoshop.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 13:17:21

And yes, of course I can only talk to them at specific times - America and the UK are different time zones, my Aunt works, I have to look after the DC's.

spotsdots Fri 12-Oct-12 13:18:45

For those who are happy to post THEIR CHILDREN'S pictures on any social media go for it. But please DO NOT TAKE A PICTURE/VIDEO OF A CHILD WHO ISN'T YOURS! Is that too difficult for a grown person to understand???

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 13:19:24

An email is as instant as a FB update. A blog or Flickr account is also updated pretty much straightaway, and people can get email prompts when there is new activity on a blog so they know that the school assembly video is up there to see. FB is really not the only way to communicate with your family. And it's still fine when it's a single shot of your DC, or DC with their friends if you have checked if their parents have said it's fine. It's including other children in your footage and photos (and i don't mean the back of their head, or their elbow etc, just when you can tell who it is) that's not OK on social media

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 13:20:05

Yes, but you can email them today, and talk to them tomorrow, can't you?

Facebook isn't essential you know. Generations of people survived perfectly well by taking a photograph, getting it developed, putting it into an envelop and posting it.

Of course it isn't a problem if there are no children in the background.

Or if you have personally checked with every other parent if they mind, which would be easy to do in a small class - talk to the parents. Don't just automatically dismiss them as loons if they have a genuine reason to not want you to do it.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 13:20:44

I'm never going to stop posting videos of my DC's on fb, but I take on board your concerns and can try to crop the photo's, and find some way if disguising other people's DC's in the background.

Surely nobody can have an issue with that?

I will take on board what has been said, but my videos of my DC's will STILL be shared on fb, even if I have to disguise the identity of DC's in the background. Fb is what works for my family.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 13:23:23

Couthy, yes, cropping or blurring so that no one could identify the other children would be fine, as long as you can "lock" it so that it can't be undone by other viewers (not a technical expert, so sorry can't advise how to either blur or prevent others unblurring)

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 13:23:42

Well that's fine then smile

There is an adoptive parent on here who is very open about the fact that her son's birth mother stalks him on Facebook by looking at the Facebook pages of anyone she can find who has children in the school. She then downloads those photographs (her birth son and all the other children in the picture) and puts them on her extraordinarily inappropriate Facebook page (alongside pornography and some very dodgy stuff).

So bear that in mind if you haven't checked the identity of all the children in the photograph. Your children could end up on sites you don't want them on too.

McHappyPants2012 Fri 12-Oct-12 13:23:53

I take on board your concerns and can try to crop the photo's, and find some way if disguising other people's DC's in the background

i think that is perfect, if the other children are blurred out it means they can not been seen.

FamilyStress Fri 12-Oct-12 13:33:16

Couthy, really, emailing the picture would be much, much more simple than all this photoshopping and cropping and blurring malarkey! If you're technologically competent enough to photoshop/edit from your phone then you're technologically competent enough to email it.

People underestimate the power of FB & other social media .

As said upthread once the photo or video is on the FB page IT IS THEIRS

You can delete it from your page but they still have the images & can & will use them for advertising. My profile pic popped up on an advert shortly after I first went on it, hence I now use only that one, or other pics from t'internet.

It's a useful communication tool but as for privacy .....nope.

(& I speak as one who has privacy so tight I tick nothing & no-one finds me on search)

Hulababy Fri 12-Oct-12 13:39:14

I agree - it shouldn't be on FB, not if it shows other people's children, not without their permission.

As a school we get permission at the start of the year to allow children to be in photographs or videos. If a parent declines then that child never appears on anything we use for outside of school - adverts, school website, etc. They are still allowed to be photographed/videod for within school use.

I maintain our school year group pages and do add videos and the site is not password protected - but there is no school name or location on the site, no back link to the school (although can access them from the school main website), no childrens names.

We actually currently have no children we cannot have on our sites but only because of the way it is set up.

UltraBOF Fri 12-Oct-12 13:40:23

I don't know how you would crop or blur a video- surely you'd have to it frame-by-frame? It is relatively simple on a still photo, but I don't think the iPhone app lets you blur, just crop.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 13:41:27

Again, rubbish.

Taken from FB's data policy pages, TODAY;

While you are allowing us to use the information we receive about you, you always own all of your information. Your trust is important to us, which is why we don't share information we receive about you with others

and
When you delete an account, it is permanently deleted from Facebook. It typically takes about one month to delete an account, but some information may remain in backup copies and logs for up to 90 days. You should only delete your account if you are sure you never want to reactivate it.

You always own your pictures, FB does not. When you delete them, there are no copies kept.
You need to understand what you are talking about before you advise others, wrongly.

honeytea Fri 12-Oct-12 13:41:53

I'm usually very pro personal choice regarding posting pics of people on facebook, I'd post a photo of my dc at tge park even if there were kids in the background accidentally.

I can really sympathise with the issues of posting a school play pic/video because it is very identifiable and it is taken on the schools premises. I wouldn't post a school video.

Couthymow you are coming across as fairly unhinged, I'm don't think anyone is even that interested in a video of someone else's kid singing badly, you need to share videos of you children is being portrayed by you as some kind of vital birth right.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 13:42:19

I've been into school as I was passing at lunchtime. Luckily, the head was in the office at the time and he was very grateful for being informed and confirmed it is a serious child safeguarding issue. They are sending a letter out ASAP to remind parents not to upload videos/images onto social media sites and explaining why. Thanks for all your input - I really hope it makes some people think more about safeguarding issues

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 13:48:18

GoSakura, what happens when you have deleted your account to all the messages you have sent to people and all the photographs you have shared?

Do they all get deleted when you delete your account?

I thought the pictures would stay on other people's pages, and would therefore only be as secure as their security settings, not yours.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 13:48:30

GoSaku - but do you agree that if you post a photo or video on Facebook and tag people in it, then the audience is not just limited to your friends? And not through anything particularly sinister, it's just how Facebook works?

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 13:49:13

Oh, and if you delete your half of a private conversation, have you only deleted it from your site, or have you also deleted it from the person you "talked to"? Because if they still have it, it isn't really deleted is it?

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 13:54:27

Private messages remain, without your name or photo attached, just the bare message. Shared photos are deleted, wall messages disappear. You are the owner and they disappear with you.

If you post a photo or video and CHOOSE to tag people, thereby CHOOSING to share with others and letting them override your security settings, that is up to YOU, not FB. There is no need to do so, and you can easily prevent others from tagging you in their photos or tagging themselves in yours. You can also easily prevent anyone sharing your photos or videos.

If I put a picture on FB, 30 people can see it (unless I have restricted it further). None of their friends can, they can't share it on their walls, they can't download it.
This is not public. Unless you CHOOSE to make your media public, it isn't.

I know what I am talking about, this is my job.

marquesas Fri 12-Oct-12 13:58:06

GoSakura - can I ask you as a FB expert (which I'm not by any means) how you set a photo or video so that it can't be "shared" by any of your friends please. I am happy for the people I choose to see my photos but not all of their friends as well and I can't work out how to restrict this.

Couthy - I'm rather lost for words at your toatlly selfish attitude. I only hope that you are lucky enough never to put any of the other children in any kind of difficulty or danger. I also hope that my children and yours are never at the same school.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 13:59:26

I agree with Go - if you are careful with Facebook then it doesnt have to mean that all your photos are available to all and sundry. Although tagging friends in them does mean that they are seen by their friends etc which creates other issues.

However, I still dont think that this means that you can go around putting photos containing other people's kids on your profile. I would have thought that it would be common sense and good manners to ask permission before doing so. However, this thread has proved to me that some people are lacking in both of these things.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 14:00:12

Gosaku - that's fair enough - it's your job so you understand. The bulk of people out there have no idea about privacy settings. The video I mentioned to start this thread off has been tagged and shared. Unless you can be sure everyone understands facebook privacy settings inside and out, they should not be posting school videos at all.

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 14:00:22

That's good to know, GoSakuramachi.

dd never tags photos, she used to ask people not to tag her and at one point had her setting set so they couldn't (and then for some reason the privacy setting changed and for a while she could).

I'm seriously considering making my children delete their entire teenage facebook history, and start again with a new email address when they get to 18. I'm not sure they will want it all there forever (I certainly don't).

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 14:02:09

Couthy - yes cropping or blurring the photos would be acceptable as then no one would be able to identify anyone else's children. However, that all seems like a lot of hard work when you could just as easily send a photo/video instantly at the click of a button as a private email.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:09:01

If you have your photo/video set to friends only (not friends of friends, which is what most people have) then no matter who clicks share, it won't be visible to someone who is not already friends with you.

Example, you put up a pic.
your Friend, A, clicks share.
Her friend B (not friends with you) sees "A has shared a photo" but instead of the pic is a message that the content is not available to them.
Friend C, who is both your friend and A's friend, can see it on both your wall and her wall, but only because they are both on your friends list.

marquesas Fri 12-Oct-12 14:15:17

Thanks GoSakura, I do have my settings to friends only and hadn't appreciated that would restrict the sharing as well.

In your example if I have settings as friends only there is no point in friend A sharing the photo as her friends (who aren't mine) won't be allowed to see it so in fact she hasn't shared it at all. Have I got that right?

Just to complicate matters I actually only share photos with a subset of friends so if friend A and I share a mutual friend D but D isn't in my subset would she see it on the share?

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:17:02

If you see someone has posted a photo/vid of your children without your permission, report it to FB and they will nearly always remove it. You can also do it for children who are not your own, ie a school performance where policies have been broken, although that isn't as clear cut as to removal.

But you are much better off doing that than simply telling people not to do it. You can't stop them, whether or not you are in the right. Report it after the fact as a usage violation (when you upload vids or pics you are telling FB you have full permissions, if you don't they will remove)

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:19:46

Marquesas, yes thats true.

Subsets is more complicated. If you share with "close friends" say and A is in that subset and D is not, will D see the share? I think yes, since the subsets are not recognised in privacy terms as such, so I think A could share your photo and D would see it.

I can't swear to that though so I will check and come back to you.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 14:23:19

But Go if you post a picture and tag someone in it, then that photo will be seen by all of that person's friends, even if you are not friends with them? And that will happen even if you have that picture/album set to 'friends only'?

But I guess that is differenct because, as you say, you have chosen to tag that person.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:24:43

Yes, tagging over-rides your own security settings. In essence tagging makes it as much their picture as yours, and FB then treats it under their settings.

YouMayLogOut Fri 12-Oct-12 14:28:28

YANBU. Well done for informing the school, and the head's response sounds exactly right.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 14:29:50

Can I check the impact of tagging, though?

I post a photo and tag Friend A in it (either because it's them, or because they know someone in it and I want to alert them to the photo)

Friend A can view the photo

Friend B can see that Friend A has been tagged in a picture, is my friend too and can see and share the picture

Friend C can see that Friend A has been tagged. She isn't my friend, but she can also see and share the photo (yes??)

Friend D is not my friend, but is a friend of C, and she sees the photo when C shares it. And she can share it further if she so wishes. (yes??)

Which is how a photo seemingly shared just with 30 Facebook friends actually has a potential much wider audience.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 14:30:40

x-post with file!

BreconBeBuggered Fri 12-Oct-12 14:31:08

Can you tag children though, and people who aren't on Facebook? Genuine question; I don't have a Facebook account and don't know how it works, so apologies if it sounds desperately thick.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:34:37

Yes thats true Families.
But as I said you CHOOSE to tag people, and widening your audience, possibly exponentially.

But I don't tag, and don't have any facility for tagging, so my photo is not seemingly shared with 30 people, it is only shared with 30 people.

YOU are in control of your privacy. If you CHOOSE not to take it seriously, that is up to you, but don't assume everyone is the same. There is no need for anyone's info/media to be public, unless they want it to be.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 14:35:46

So say, for example, that someone puts a picture on facebook of their child with someone else's child and tags their aunt/sister/mum in the picture. That picture is then available for all of the tagged people's friends to see and if one of those people tagged has a public profile, then that picture effectively becomes public?

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:37:40

Yep.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 14:37:49

You can tag anyone, but it doesn't show up as a link to their FB account if they don't have one (for obvious reasons!). Ditto if they are on Facebook but you aren't their friend.

I see quite a lot of baby photos tagged with their parents' names, presumably so that they get a prompt that the photo has been posted. I think that's why Couthy, for example, tags her family members in the photos of her DC that she has posted. It's a shorthand way of letting people know that there's something online that they will want to see, but also then allows the photo to be treated according to the tagged person's settings (which may be tight, or wide open)

So I could post a picture of David Cameron and annotate it so people know who it is. I would have to be his Facebook friend to tag it so that he - and his friends - knew it was there.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 14:39:49

But Go, I dont think many people are quite as savvy as you when it comes to facebook, and many people dont realise quite how far their photos are going. Yes, it is the personal responsibility of those using facebook to learn about how it works, but it is quite scary that people might be tagging pictures willy nilly with other people's children in.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 14:41:07

The 'tagging a child' as their parent thing really makes me fume. A lot of people I know do this with photos taken at parties. If the photo has several tags, then all of those people's friends will see my child tagged as me. Total lack of privacy and damned rude!

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 14:42:12

Go, I don't want my media to be public, and am pretty uptight about it (for good reason, as set out upthread). But I don't get to CHOOSE if other people take photos of me or my family, post them on Facebook and tag 10 other people in them. No choice at all that it has been sent to potentially a very large audience. Hence the simplest approach is for schools to not allow parents to post photos of school events online, and for parents to follow them.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:42:44

I know that. But people should learn. Or not, if they don't want to. I only get annoyed when I see people telling others things that are totally untrue.

If you want to share personal things online, learn about privacy and security. If you don't you only have yourself to blame. It's very easy to learn all this in the FB help centre.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 14:43:57

Families, no, but you can choose to click report and get FB to take it down.

Schools can ASK parents not to post online, but how do you imagine they can actually stop them? Of course they should do as asked, but you can't make them.

Kewcumber Fri 12-Oct-12 14:49:32

This thread is bizarre. Though possibly because some people have never had cause to worry about their children being identified by people who want to find them.

Why does the view of a foster carer/adoptive parent trump the view of the parent who took the photos? Because the ramifications are more serious than not being able to show Johnny in a wide angle shot in his school nativity play to grandma. If you want to share photos then take photos of your own child. It may not be illegal to put whom-evers photo you like on FB and not give a stuff about the others but its hardly polite.

When I made photo montage of DS for my blog I consulted every parent of any child in the photos, explained where it would be shown.

And yes we adoptive parents do take our children out in public - I would be very concerned with anyone obviously photographing or videoing him though. Social media is one of the most concerning developments for adoptive children and many of the older children are themselves extremely cautious about identifying themselves online.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 14:51:15

But Go, I would have to be friends with the person doing the posting to see that they had put something inappropriate up there in order to report it. Hence why self regulation is the only realistic approach, which means parents have to follow the school policy even if they personally find it a PITA. Because it would be a real shame if schools felt that the only option was that they had to ban all photos and filming of school events by parents <eyes phone screensaver of DS as 4th icicle in last year's Xmas show>

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Fri 12-Oct-12 14:51:28

I'm pretty sure there is a Facebook setting where you can disallow you being tagged..

Kewcumber Fri 12-Oct-12 14:52:07

"If you want to share personal things online, learn about privacy and security" - I know plenty but what at issue here is people who know very little, posting photos of my child who tag third parties or don't have good security settings that I have no control over.

In fact I have few issues and would generally give consent but I know people who wouldn't - for extremely good reasons.

Kewcumber Fri 12-Oct-12 14:53:09

you can tag anyone even someone who isn't on facebook - you just type n whatever name you like. Obviously it won't link to you if you're not on their friends list.

YouMayLogOut Fri 12-Oct-12 14:53:48

I found out I was "tagged" in a photo and I don't even use FB confused

Kewcumber Fri 12-Oct-12 14:56:23

and facebook isn't akin to people looking at your child in the street but to printing out photos and handing them out in the street to all the people you know and some of them dropping them in the bin, on the floor, passing them around at the playground etc

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Fri 12-Oct-12 14:56:31

There is a setting where you can review anything you are tagged in before it goes on your timeline.

If you are tagged in a photo you can also remove that tag.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 14:57:48

YouMay, you wouldn't have been "tagged" in the true Facebook sense of the word, but your name could appear alongside a photo. So if someone who knows you is a Facebook friend with the person who posted the photo, they might look at it and comment to you "I saw you tagged in a Facebook photo last night", but what they mean is that they saw your name listed alongside the photo.

FryOneGhoulishGhostlyManic Fri 12-Oct-12 15:00:03

Have just checked my facebook, and you can set your privacy setting to inform you if someone tries to tag you; you can disallow these individuals tags.

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 15:03:14

I'm not disagreeing with you, but expecting people who do it to stop doing it just because they get a letter from the school is a bit naive. People don't care.

mamabanana Fri 12-Oct-12 15:07:07

I disagree with you GoSaku. Yes, some might not stop, but the majority of people doing it are just being naive and underinformed re privacy and also not thinking about serious safeguarding issues. I think it would stop the majority which is better than nothing.

YouMayLogOut Fri 12-Oct-12 15:11:48

Thanks for the explanation Families! smile

BreconBeBuggered Fri 12-Oct-12 15:26:02

Thanks for your earlier explanation as well, Families
To someone not using Facebook, and I know we'll be in the minority here, having our name or our DC's names posted alongside a photograph comes to pretty much the same thing as being tagged, except we don't get to find out about it.

Sabriel Fri 12-Oct-12 17:09:26

Thanks to attitudes like some of the posters on this thread, at our school we are not allowed to take photos/ videos of our children in school. The HT enforces it too.

We were allowed to take photos at sports day because the children were not in uniform and were not at the school, so couldn't be traced so easily, but we were asked not to share on FB.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 17:09:35

Gosakura, I'm just catching up with this now so forgive me - but earlier you say that no one can share your photos even though they have access to them through facebook.

Or download them.

Well, why in that case do I have copies of quite a few of my best friend's photographs, whichshe uploaded and I saved (without her knowledge) before I deleted my account?

She's dead now so I can't ask her about her settings, but I'm almost certain there's no way to stop people who can look at your photos from right clicking them to save to their own PC.

FryOneGhoulishGhostlyManic Fri 12-Oct-12 17:11:22

Don't newspapers take photos from people facebook accounts all the time?

GoSakuramachi Fri 12-Oct-12 17:12:22

Because of the settings, as I have described in detail.

Tailtwister Fri 12-Oct-12 17:14:54

YANBU, it's a huge no no (for reasons already given). I went to see my niece's end of term show and was surprised that the Head only advised parents to 'use their discretion' when posting videos/photos. IME you have to spell it out for people, as there will always be at least one idiot who'll post something to the likes of Facebook.

ItsAllGoingToBeFine Fri 12-Oct-12 17:20:26

GoSakura - you cannot stop people who have permissions to view your photos from downloading them.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 17:37:51

So no tagging then. My privacy is set to friends only, not friends of friends. Will crop & blur, yes you can do it with video as you edit it frame by frame. If it's less than 2 mins, it's not that onerous.

I will continue to use FB to share my pictures and videos, but I will crop/blur anyone that I don't have permission from.

That's the thing, you have to come to a compromise, not just say nope, you can't do this. My compromise is that in future, I will crop/blur anyone's face that I don't have permission to post.

Though I did wonder, does that include adults in a crowd scene? When the local paper takes a picture of the crowd at the fair and publishes it and puts it online, do they get permission from everyone in that crowd?

I can't see that they do. So why is this different? A FC child in the crowd at a fair on the front page is just as out in the open as a short video of an assembly put on FB that has them not in full focus, in the background? I only ever keep them up for a week, all my family have seen it within 7 days, then they are taken down. Can't see the difference, personally.

I will however take on board what has been explained to me, and crop/blur anyone I don't have permission for, but the videos will still be going on fb.

It's called compromise. I compromise on faffing around with cropping & blurring, they compromise on the videos and pictures being on fb albeit with their DC/FC child's face obscured.

SeveredEdMcDunnough Fri 12-Oct-12 17:40:15

Sorry, I missed how you set your FB to prevent people who can already see your photos, from downloading them.

Could you possibly repeat this for me, I can't find it?

Thanks

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 17:54:45

Couthy, the difference is that adults are adults, and therefore are presumed (generally) to be able to cope with being identified.

The problem with school events is the school uniform, and (if people are tagged who don't have good privacy) the ease of finding where the school is, which makes tracing the children very easy.

When dd was small we didn't let any photographs of her go into the local newspaper. We also were careful of her in photographs with identifiable things in them - school uniform, district neckers in guides, specific sports teams etc.

Those are the things that make people identifiable. And walking down a street she meets people (generally) who live nearby. Once photographs are on Facebook they are spread over a much wider area. As many cared for children are moved area to protect them from their families, it is the people outside the area publishing them to a wider audience that is the really big problem.

People taking photographs and showing them around at the local toddler group isn't as big an issue.

Want2bSupermum Fri 12-Oct-12 18:06:58

We don't trust FB and use dropbox to share videos of DD and her friends.

freddiefrog Fri 12-Oct-12 18:10:51

The problem with school events is the school uniform, and (if people are tagged who don't have good privacy) the ease of finding where the school is, which makes tracing the children very easy.

Yes. My FC's birth parents do not know where they are. FC has been moved away from their immediate area, but a pic of them posted on FB wearing their uniform will advertise where they'll be 9.00am - 3.00pm Monday to Friday to a wide audience. From that, it's not difficult to find out where they live, where they are at certain times and what places they frequent.

My settings on my FB page are set very tightly. I have no tagging and friends only settings, but Child X's mum who takes a photo in a school assembly which includes my FC may not have such strict settings

It also applies to scout/guide uniforms, pics in newspapers, etc. Social Services will not allow it.

Our school doesn't ban posting pics on FB outright, just not pics where other children are included.

I am not fussed about my children's pics on FB, but we have to be strict about our FC's pics appearing on there. Our school is very hot on it (there are several FC/children with CP issues in the school) and fortunately the rest of the parents are supportive

WildWorld2004 Fri 12-Oct-12 18:23:56

This is the reason why i do not have any photos/videos of my dd at school. sad

Instead the school now employ a photographer who charges £10 per photo.

If i wanted my dd to be broadcast over the internet i would do it myself.

Tailtwister Fri 12-Oct-12 19:02:03

For those who really find FB useful for family and friends, why not create a blog. You can password protect it. Several of our family members have them and it's really nice to see what people are up to.

YouMayLogOut Fri 12-Oct-12 19:16:09

I just email photos to family and friends. Cut out the middle man/woman!

MaryZed Fri 12-Oct-12 19:22:32

That is the problem, isn't it WildWorld.

If parents would stop putting things on Facebook, then schools could allow photographs/videos to be made.

Because of parents breaking the privacy rules and requests, it is getting to the stage that schools ban photography completely sad.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 20:34:09

So I won't upset people if I crop out/ blur background faces, but keep my DS's face clear?

And how come my DD's friend in FC is on fb and posting pictures of her and her friends in uniform then? Should I tell her Foster Carers that she does this? I didn't know that this would be an issue, because all the FC DC's that I know are on fb and post 100's of pictures of them and their friends every day.

So I didn't really think of this as an issue I guess.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 20:39:30

Can you do a blog from an iPhone? And can you post it on fb so that every one of your family can know that I have posted something up? I can't use the laptop now because of my joint issues, I need to use touchscreen typing.

So I have to be able to do everything on my iPhone. If I can't do it on the iPhone, I can't do it. And I can't use Safari for more than 15 minutes a month because MN and fb use my dongle Internet but Safari uses my Internet from my phone provider.

That's why I do EVERYTHING through Apps and fb, because I can't physically use the laptop, and can't afford to use Safari.

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 20:40:49

Couthy, even with the issue of foster kids aside, to me posting pictures of other people's children on the internet without their permission is just plain bad manners.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 20:50:41

I guess now my pain meds have kicked in, I can see your point. I don't even notice whether there IS anyone in the background of pictures of my DC's - I'm only looking at MY DC's, not what's going on around them.

I still stand by the fact that if I wish to post pictures or videos of my DC's assemblies on fb, then I will, but I can see why it might be best if I crop/blur the people in the background's faces.

I was a bit too combative earlier, for that I apologise. My only defence is that I had run out of my pain meds and was in a shitty, ouchy, spiky mood.

Probably best to lay off MN next time I feel like that. blush

filetheflightoffancy Fri 12-Oct-12 20:54:32

And when I say 'internet' I am talking about potentially public sites such a facebook. A completely private blog or email is different as then only the select few family members you want to see the photos can see them.

Please look into other ways of sharing these photos, Facebook really isnt the be all and end all, there are sites devoted to just sharing photos (like Flickr maybe - not an expert I am afraid!).

I still think emailing is by far the easiest way, especially if you have an iphone, it really is a piece of piss! And if you must use facebook, just send them a quick private message to let them know that you have emailed some pics.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 20:54:58

Couthy, it's not necessarily an issue for your DD's friend to be posting pictures of herself, it really depends on her circumstances. If you know her FC to speak to, it might be worth mentioning though.

I believe you can blog with an iPhone (not got one myself, but think they operate very similarly to an iPad, which you can definitely use to blog)

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 20:57:31

PS, Couthy, thank you for thinking about this issue differently now (I really don't mean that in a patronising way)

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 20:59:19

I will try to find out. I am guessing it might not be an issue right now, while no family are available to search these things out, but might be in a few months.

I think I might mention it. Her FC's are not really of a generation to understand fb, tbh.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 21:02:39

I think a lot of it might have been that I was having a very bad day, less than 3 hrs sleep due to DS3, yet again, altercation with DS1's SM where she was trying to tell me what I should do with my DC's, then I came on here to feel like someone else was telling me what I can and can't do wrt my DC's, on top of a SN dx for DS3 (already got DD & DS2 with SN's) yesterday, plus fuck up at pharmacy with pain meds.

None of which made me my usual empathetic self. blush

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 21:03:28

Very, VERY bad day.

FamiliesShareGerms Fri 12-Oct-12 21:05:29

Couthy, hope your weekend is better than your day today smile

freddiefrog Fri 12-Oct-12 21:14:26

I think it depends on the care order.

My FC is in danger from their birth parents so they are not allowed to know FCs whereabouts. FC is not allowed on FB either, they understand this as their last placement broke down when someone posted a pic on FB and their parents found it and attempted to contact them, so FC is really good about it.

I know other FC's who are on FB, they're over 13 so there's not much their carer can do about it and their circumstances are different. It depends on social services, but as a rule we are not allowed to post an FC's pics on FB, but the FC can if they so wish

With an iPhone, it's dead easy to email. If you go into your photo stream, find the photo/video, touch the little icon that looks like a box with an arrow popping out and choose the email option.

marquesas Fri 12-Oct-12 21:19:48

Sorry you've had a bad day Couthy and thanks for coming back and reconsidering.

Photos on the internet won't be a problem for all fostered children but for many they could be. A school policy of only publishing photos of your own children make sense all round imo. Parents can still make a record of important events but do in considerately.

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 21:21:06

Ah, DD's friend IS over 13. And right now, family seeing the pictures isn't an issue. Might be soon though, so maybe a word to the FC?

alienreflux Fri 12-Oct-12 21:26:25

couthy fuck sake,i thought i had a bad day thanks and loads of wine << she slurringly types >>and if there was a pain meds emoticon,loads of them too

CouthyMowWearingOrange Fri 12-Oct-12 21:31:11

grin I didn't post everything that was shite today there either... Thank fuck for pain meds.

freddiefrog Fri 12-Oct-12 21:36:23

Couthy Maybe have a word (even if just to double check security settings) it really depends why your DD's friend is in care. My FC's circumstances are fairly exceptional although, unfortunately, not unusual.

It'll probably be addressed during supervision should it ever become an issue

I hope you're feeling better!!

HanSolo Sat 13-Oct-12 01:45:26

gosakuramachi - please could you explain what this part of Facebook's T&Cs means?

>>2. Sharing Your Content and Information

You own all of the content and information you post on Facebook, and you can control how it is shared through your privacy and application settings. In addition:
For content that is covered by intellectual property rights, like photos and videos (IP content), you specifically give us the following permission, subject to your privacy and application settings: you grant us a non-exclusive, transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license to use any IP content that you post on or in connection with Facebook (IP License). This IP License ends when you delete your IP content or your account unless your content has been shared with others, and they have not deleted it.

[my emboldening]

The piece you quoted upthread mentioned information, i.e. personal data not content, which of course they cannot share without contravening the DPA I should have thought.

Surely the paragraph above states they may use your content as they wish? and then sub-licence that content to whomever they want? and the absolve themselves from any comeback from others using your content after one has deleted one's FB account too.

pigletmania Sat 13-Oct-12 07:43:59

YANBU that is wrong. Some people on here are very naive about FB privacy setting that are not all that private as they make out to be.

YouMayLogOut Sat 13-Oct-12 11:43:01

> Facebook really isnt the be all and end all

Well said filetheflightoffancy.

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