To want dd to have an operation for 'vanity' reasons.(176 Posts)
My daughter has cryptic tonsils. This means she suffers terrible from tonsil stones or tonsilloths. They can range from the size of a bit of sweetcorn, to a big wad of chewed gum. And they stink. Really stink. They're basically calcified bacteria, saliva and mucus. (Sorry if you're having your tea!)
Whenever she has a huge one in her tonsil (which is at least once a month), she goes off food for a few days due to the rotten taste in her mouth. And she also says it's uncomfortable as she can feel it. This carries on until it eventually falls out. I've tried on one occassion to nudge it out with a cotton bud. It worked, but dd didn't like it, so i'll not be doing it again.
The smaller stones are almost a daily occurence.
The doctor has been frank. The only way to get rid of the tonsil stones is to get rid of the tonsils. He's assured me that the crypts in her tonsils will reduce by the time she's an adult, but they'll always be unaturally large thus she'll always have tonsil stones.
He said he'd refer me to an ENT specialist, but dd is unlikely to be a canditate
for the operation just because she has 'bad breath'. She's never had tonsilitis and only gets a throat infection once a year. The GP said i should consider if
i want to subject my child to the risks of an operation just for 'vanity reasons.'
DD is 5 so i think now is a good age, if ever she was going to get her tonsils out. I'm also worried that as she gets older, children will begin to pick on her for having bad breath. And i'm not exaggerating the smell. When she has a giant tonsil stone, even the doctor agreed it makes her have halitosis.
However, when i voiced my fears, he said that all children get bullied for a variety of reasons at school. If it's not bad breath, it's colour of hair, skin, clothes etc.
He seemed really reluctant to give me the referral tbh. And i've come home feeling like a terrible mum. Am i being unreasonable to want her to have this operation?
Not at all unreasonable, must be miserable for her. I'd want my DD to have it sooner rather than later .
it doesn't sound like just for vanity reasons to me - she has a problem, you want to solve it for her and getting tonsils removed seems to be the way to do so?
It is better to do it now than as an adult.
\Do it poor kid sounds miserable my husband had the same apparently when he was a child and had to get them out It isnt vanity though she is miserable her tonsils are rank by the sound of it, <bleurgh> get them removed
It is short sighted of the doctor, as this will affect her as she gets older.
I don't think that it is a vanity reason, as having these changes the way that her mouth works and that has an effect on her appatite and will cause her to be self conscious.
Anything that causes physical changes, is not just vanity.
I'd do it too.
And I don't agree it's for vanity reasons either, it sounds like a very unpleasant condition that can be cured by a simple operation.
Find another GP.
Is this really "vanity reasons"? Her throat is uncomfortable, her appetite goes? Does the doctor not appreciate that there is a little bit more to it than bad breath?
I know there's been a general reaction against whipping tonsils, wisdom teeth etc out for no reason, but blimey. YANBU.
I'd do it. My 4 yr old DS is also having an op next year for cosmetic reasons (his eyes) and though I have pangs of guilt, I know its what is best in the long run.
I'd do it. I used to get quinsy (abcess on tonsils) and had to have the pus drained. I had my tonsils out and can completely relate to the vile taste she must have in her mouth. It makes you very self conscious especially if you are school age.
He's only reluctant to give you the referral because she doesn't fulfil the criteria to have a tonsillectomy on the NHS. If you were prepared to pay for the op privately he'll write you a referral letter quite happily I would imagine.
they dont really refer much these days but keep pushing for it ,
if there are no underlying health issues, i'd do it too
quality of life is not the same as vanity - good luck with the referral
The gp said it's getting harder nowadays to persuade surgeons to remove tonsils. Apparantly there's stricter criteria to be met, and he feels dd will not meet it because she doesn't suffer from any pain. Bad breath and potential bullying doesn't count according to him.
He suggested i should keep checking her tonsils each morning and try and keep nudging the bigger ones out with an earbud and she'll 'get used to it'.
He made me feel unreasonable and shallow.
I would do it too. Is it really a vanity reason of it makes her go off her food? I think that they can hurt too.
It's health not vanity - I'd do it.
Oh and the Dr tried to mak eme feel bad about agreeing to DS's surgery! He even put in the notes that I had declined, when I had not (grr)
oh Ms that sounds awful no push for the referral the ENT consultant can decide ,
I'd do it in a shot. Doesn't sound like vanity to me.
Do it. 100% do it. Children will make her life hell otherwise.
You have said that she goes off her food when the taste is really bad; I don't think then that this is purely vanity, a young child not eating for a few days is v unhealthy, so it's a health matter as well. And she has said it's uncomfortable. Therefore she is suffering. The op is a no brainer, surely.
My ex DP's little boy had his ears pinned back when he was eight after suffering a couple of years of bullying. As soon as he had the op, the bullying stopped and he was a happy child again.
I'd do it too. It's not for vanity, either - she's not eating for days at a time, and that's not good!
It's not that it's hard to find a surgeon who will perform the op it's just that you would have to take the funding decision to an exceptional funding panel as she doesn't fulfil the criteria for an automatic NHS op.
I'd ask the GP to fill in the exceptional funding forms myself, you never know they might decide in your favour. If they don't then you're going to have to pay for it.
God, take the ENT appt if you can get it, go in and kick up an enormous fuss etc - my dd (soon to be 5), has recurrent throat infections and I'm trying to get referral to get tonsils out - my GP has told me that we haven't a snowballs chance in hell, but has been very proactive logging GP visits, antibiotics etc and the advice she gave me was to make a big fuss and start to get very insistent. I had dd at GP this morning, for the 3rd time this summer holidays , on account of her waking up crying at 3am with the pain and she's really stoic so it must have been feckin' sore.
it's probably not so bad doing that procedure now, but after a few years of every day? and what happens if she wants to go on a residential trip or a sleep over?
can you get a 2nd opinion?
i would do it too. I don't think that's vanity...it's a quality of life issue IMO.
i had my tonsils out when i was 21 and it was horrendous. It gets much worse the older you get...
i had to clean out the craters in my tonisls with an ear bud - trust me it's no fun even if you do 'get used to it'.
What about potential for harming mental health (because of aforementioned potential bullying)? Would she not meet it on those grounds.
I'd let her have the surgery done, I think it might make her life a bit unbearable when she gets older especially with such smelly breath...teenagers can be very cruel and I think your doctor is being a bit old school but obviously there are always risks with any form of surgery
If she's in discomfort and there's something you can do to alleviate it then go ahead. Tonsil stones are rotten (literally), the constant feeling you've got something in your throat, the taste...bleugh. You don't want to be waiting until the first time she comes home from school and says someone told her she smells when she talks.
I would do it if we're my child. And I bet the doctor would be having a tonsillectomy tomorrow, if he were suffering from this condition.
YADNBU. It's not vanity at all, poor girl. Hope she gets it sorted.
I'd do it. Doesn't sound like vanity to me - they are intrusive enough to give her discomfort and put her off eating, not to mention the bad breath.
She will become more and more aware of them and the smell as she gets older - it could well affect her confidence.
I'd push for the referral to the ENT who will be able to give you a better informed opinion (i'm not disrespecting your gp, just that the ent will have a great deal more relevant experience)
I'd do it without a second's hesitation.
I'm surprised your GP voiced his own opinion so strongly. The consultant you see will probably give you a more rounded view of the risks/benefits and be able to tell you about what would be involved in the op in more detail than your GP.
My DS had a noticeable though not huge lump on his eye. The consultant was very happy to remove it if I wanted. It would have been purely for 'cosmetic' reasons. (Surprisingly, it spontaneously reduced in size anyway so it stopped being an issue).
Tonsillectomies aren't done as often as they used to be, but your consultant should be happy to advise you on what the options for your DD are.
Poor you - not a nice position to be in. Good luck.
I'd do it. Doesn't sound like vanity reasons to me.
How's his personal hygiene then? Does he have a condition that makes part of him stink?
Tonsil stones are horrid.
I had them from aged 15 ish) to around 28
Stinky nasty things.
They are really uncomfortable. I used to fish them out with a cotton bud.
Strangely when I had my first child, that was it never had another tonsil stone
Can you get a private referral? I wish I had the courage to get my tonsils removed. You should try your doctor again.
Definitely push for a referral and hopefully the consultant will see things differently. If the gp won't refer, see a different gp.
Personally I don't consider it a case of vanity -there's a genuine medical need.
I'd do it too.
Does the GP not consider a growing child being unable to eat properly for a few days each month a health issue??
It sounds like more than a vanity/cosmetic issue to me too, if it feels uncomfortable for her and is affecting her appetite. And if there's an offensive smell that can't be very pleasant for her, never mind anyone else.
I assume it's up to the ENT specialist to decide, not the GP, so get the referral and see what they say. Is it a problem that's likely to resolve itself as she gets older if left alone (that's the only reason I can think to not do the surgery).
I'll go to the ENT and see what they say.
He just kept going on and on about the risks of surgery, and then made out like i was willing to risk my dd's life just to cure a bout of bad breath. (probably me being paranoid but i'm sure that was what he was thinking). He certainly called it 'vanity' reasons though.
Hi Ephiny. Yes the GP has said that the crypts will reduce in size as she gets older, thus less things can sneak inside and less tonsil stones will occur.
My mum had them badly when she was little too, but they went away in her teen years.
However, i've done a lot of research and there are people who have them their whole lives.
I don't think that is for vanity reasons. I used to get tonsil stones when I was younger and they really are horrible. Your mouth tastes disgusting and they can be very uncomfortable.
Does she have allergies or sinusitis? They can caused by acid reflux or post nasal drip so if that were sorted surgery would not be needed.
Don't let him make you feel shallow, I would do it, even if bad breath was the only symptom. It's not vanity. Having bad breath could give your DD problems with confidence and she can't spend every morning having her tonsils checked and having earbuds poked in to nudge things out.
Keep pushing for referral.
apparently flossing and cleaning tongue really helps
You can just see this on Embarrassing Bodies, can't you? 'Well yes, this condition is distressing, and degrading, and is making your life a misery, but we won't do anything to help you because that would be just pandering to your vanity'.
msbrown I know exactly how you feel as my dd who is 9 next month also suffers from these. I first noticed them when she was around 4 and thought she had tonsillitis but then realised this wasn't the case as she had no sore throat.
Just like your dd these aren't painful but a couple of kids have commented on her breath , I took her to the gp a few months ago who prescribed her a nasal steroid spray to try and shrink her adenoids as they looked enlarged. Touch wood she hasn't had any since. I can still see her tonsils are very large but none of these revolting suckers at the moment! The gp said to take her back if no improvement and they would refer herr to ENT. I'm not sure I would want her to go through having her tonsils out but as she gets older it would be her decision. They are vile horrible things but the gp advised that it may improve naturally with time.
I get tonsil stones too. They are nasty and they drive me insane, gps don't understand/never heard of them, I went to an ent specialist and they just told me they can't do anything about it. I saw it on embarrassing bodies once and the woman got her tonsils removed. I'd go for it, save her loads of pain, embarrassment I'm also prone to infections because of them
Do it. Please. I get these & they're horrendous. I wish i'd had mine out as a child.
Why is your GP minimising this by describing it as a vanity thing? Those tonsil stones are hideous - I had them in my thirties (so much for the thing getting better as you age) and had my tonsils out (also had recurring tonsillitis so not quite the same issue).
I was in Belgium at the time so didn't have to pass arbitrary NHS tests. I would fight for this if I were you. My son didn't pass the NHS's definition of needing grommets either because he could "sometimes" hear (ie, one out of three times that he had a hearing test, he could hear something and therefore failed). He was also below the standard age for the NHS (2). The fact that he had had 15 prescriptions for antibiotics in one year was not counted as evidence that he needed grommets. I fought (and cried) for him to have grommets and one year on he can talk properly and has not had a single infection.
Your GP sounds very tick-box oriented. Luckily in the end our consultant decided to make the op happen for us so my son got what he needed.
I'd do it, good luck, your poor dd x
I guess even if they do go away when she's a teenager, that's a long time to have to live with a problem like this. Obviously there's always some risk involved in surgery, but that has to be balanced against the impact on quality of life of doing nothing, and your GP doesn't seem to be taking that side of it very seriously.
Hopefully the specialist will be able to make a better assessment and advise what the appropriate thing is to do in your DD's particular case.
You might be able to ask for a second opinion if you need to, or, if it comes down to an NHS funding issue, would going private be an option?
Definitely not vanity. Poor wee thing. Can you see another GP?
It's not vanity at all, don't let him make you feel you like that. It's a genuine health and well-being concern.
If there are actual facts and contra-indications then the specialist can present them to you and you can then make an informed decision accordingly. It's not the GP's job to pre-empt that.
We all know there are risks involved with general anesthesia and I'm quite sure the option of an operation not something you have take lightly. If you are concerned enough to be considering a surgical procedure I can't see how he can be so dismissive of her obvious distress.
It doesn't sound like 'vanity' to me, the symptoms you've given sound like perfectly valid reasons to have a corrective operation.
hmm. GPs can be total to**ers. one i went to refused to refer me to a gynae "just because you get in a bad mood when you get your period" eventual diagnosis was chronic endemetriosis.
you've got three choices. go and see a different GP (which is your right i believe) or make yourself such a pita to said GP that its easier to refer you. ie. keep on going in with every stone and ache and pain related to it - ie. is there anything dear doctor you can do stop the taste, to boost her appetite, to reduce the pain.he'll soon want to get rid of you. or go private. obviously i have no idea what financial situation but its worth at least thinking about.
I get these and they are grosse. They are not necessarily going to shrink as she gets older.
I'd be taking her every time and asking for the referral, it's the specialist that will decide if she can have it done.
It isn't vanity, it's oral hygiene and body image etc.
id do it now whilst shes young ,i had mine out at 30 was horrible
Doesn't sound like vanity to me either. I'd say what Dr really means is it's not life threatening, therefore not neceassery to operate, therefore it comes under "vanity reasons"
I'd get it done and agree you should push for it it to be done.
def get the referral. the ent might have a totally different view.
i disagree that it's just bad breath. it's socially debilitating and may affect her confidence.
i had my tonsils out at 7. wasn't pleasant but i was over it in a few days.
I'd def ask for a referal and do it!
a girl at my school wasn't allowed a similar op by her parents because it was "cosmetic". She spent quite some time crying in the toilets
this was on embarrassing bodies, a young woman had it and had to pick things out with a cotton bud, she was advised on the show to have them out, and did!
GPs, like everyone else, can be wrong and insensitive. I would do it too. Good luck.
Forgive me if I am teaching you how to suck eggs but does she gargle with salt water 3x a day?
There was a girl with this on Embarassing Bodies - she was about 15 I think, and she had a whole routine with a little mirror and a stick to pop the stones out.
She was so happy when they got it sorted (by whipping them out) for her.
Do it. It's not Vanity, it's health and wellbeing.
You can use a Water Pic to get the stones out.
I have tiny ones every now and again and they are disgusting. My GP said to gargle with hydrogen peroxide and it seems to help.
I think you should insist on a referral and then discuss it sensibly with someone at ent.
15 and still not resolved for her.
It seems like more than a vanity problem to me. If she can feel it, it makes her feel uncomfortable and it gives her a funny taste in her mouth then it is not just about vanity
I would do it as well. I have experience of these and very unpleasant, your daughter will thank you for it one day. Could you see another GP at all?
I'd do it too, I'm 33 and have had these since my late teens. They have only got worse over the years and can knock my confidence. I'd get mine sorted in an instant if I could afford a private operation (unlikely to get it on the NHS)
IME your gp is correct in that the criteria for tonsillectomies seem more strict than they once were.
Dd had her tonsils out at 7.
She didn't have recurrent tonsillitis. However her tonsils were very large. Met at middle. She had stinky breath because she was ver nasal and mouth breathing. She had occasional sleep apnoea.
Got a referral to private consultant (had work BUPA - they initially said that because was not related to infection, would not be covered, but because gp letter mentioned apnoea it was).
Saw the consultant who felt that they should come out. So big that if she did get tonsillitis, her airway might have blocked. Op done, dd much better, sleeps well, doesn't snore and nose breathes now.
At the follow up I asked what the course of action would be if we had gone via nhs (am very pro nhs but awa of funding limitations). He said that the pct would have required a sleep survey over several months and that she would have been unlikely to have met the pct criteria.
As it was, we went from initial consultation to op within 2 weeks.
We are very glad we had it done. Immediately after op the consultant came and said was the right tng to do - her airway had blocked when she was being induced/anaesthetised. So clearly there was an issue with them blocking her airway.
Tonsillitis are grim. I never had tonsillitis as a child, got first bout about 5 years ago and it scarred and pitted my tonsils so am prone to them now. Also have been getting tonsillitis once or twice a year, the last bout lasted 6 weeks. But as an adult the criteria are way more stringent I think and the op is much more tricky because of the size and extent of the tonsils.
I'm in my
late thirties and still get these. Get them out!
The thing is the tonsils stop infection and other nasties spreading to the rest of your body, so really they are doing their job properly in the OP's dd's case.
See the ENT specialist and see what they say. It's not just a case of whipping out your tonsils it can be quite a nasty operation, my niece was very poorly and ended up with a secondary infection and back in hospital. Obviously the younger it's done the better though.
I used to get it badly but with full blown tonsilittus as well - my mum begged to have it done and was turned down.
I kept it under control with constant salt water gargling and mouth wash and very thorough oral hygiene.
Even though my tonsils are crater now I don't get any of the stones - do dd might not always have this problem.
My ds has had one or two which we have cleared with warm water and salt gargling.
Don't pin your hopes on getting it done on the NHS, my dh went to see about getting his veins done as they are bleeding and was told the NHS no longer does this op.
He is being a twat. Have you seen another GP?
I get these on a smaller scale and they are awful - and the size you describe, in a small child, sounds awful. Surely you can mention the choking hazard aspect? A wad of chewing gum in a 5 y/old?!
It's not just 'vanity' at all; what a bloody idiot. N.B. I often get them if a bit run down, haven't slept well or haven't drunk enough - also some foods can aggravate it - bananas, sugar/sweets, some types of toothpaste.
i wouldn't think twice about it! it's not vanity as far as i can see.
Iirc you can insist on a referral.
YANBU, I'd be pushing for this to happen before she gets much older and it turns into a major op.
Its not just for vanity reasons though is it. Bad breath can affect her work life when she's older, relationships. Who's going to want to snog a girl with an odd taste in her mouth?
I'd get it done, plus I think its meant to be safer operation as a child rather than as an adult.
My brother has this. He used to get horrendous tonsillitis too, although this has calmed down since he has hit his 30s.
Now the infections have stopped, his GP won't consider removing the tonsils, although when they were still happening, DB wanted them out because he was disciplined at work for having too much time off sick.
DB occasionally performs minor surgery on himself, if the stones get very big. His MIL (nurse) has told him that he'll only get the operation if he really, really exaggerates his symptoms, as it isn't now considered routine surgery.
I'd do it - I certainly wouldn't call it vanity reasons though if she's not eating when she gets them. Poor thing, sounds awful!
YANBU. I disagree thats its for vanity. Bad breath could really affect DDs life, the specialist may ahve a different view to GP. If not any possibility of going private. DD had hers out nearly 8 years it was 2,500.
I was told I wanted my sons eyelid operated on for 'vanity reasons' too. Er, no, to save the sight in that eye!
I saw this on Embarrassing Bodies and it looked horrible. Try to push for it to be done, not for vanity, but for her health and even mental wellbeing!
I'd have it done like a shot. It's not vanity when your kid is getting the piss taken out of them because they look/sound/smell different!
I had a large cyst under my eye at about the same age, I got picked on a lot by other kids in my class, my life was hell for almost a year whilst the doctors fannied around trying to decide if it warranted an operation. Finally they took it off, and by the time the stitches were out the bullying had stopped.
For different reasons, I pushed and pushed for my son to have his tonsils out at the same age. Even 20 years ago the GP was very reluctant (whereas 40 years ago they'd whip them out as soon as look at you). But ES was constantly on antibiotics for a sore throat, lacking energy and they were so huge sometimes he could hardly swallow and had to eat pureed food.
Within a week of the op he was scoffing huge platefuls of food, running round the garden and was a different child.
Don't be fobbed off - or guilt-tripped- by the GP at this stage. Push hard for a referral to a specialist and see what they have to say.
I don't see why everyone is blaming the GP in this situation. He said he'd refer you and made sure you were aware of the risks of surgery, and the likelihood that surgery will not be recommended by an ENT surgeon on the NHS. He gave you the facts, and you need to make a decision about whether you want to go and have the conversation again with a specialist. Where is the problem here?
My ds used to get tonsilloths too although he's not had any for a while now. My gp also said he didn't think he should have them out "if he were my boy, it's not a risk I'd take, just for smelly breath". But it wasn't just smelly, it was absolutely rancid stinking awful breath. But as I said, he seems to have stopped getting them, touch wood (hope I've not spoken too soon) but I think his tonsils will still have to come out eventually as they're huge. Mouthwash helped a tiny bit, but ultimately, it wasn't until the tonsilloths stopped forming and the ones he had fell out, the bad breath stopped.
Incidentally, my ds also has a lazy eye. He's had an op already to try to correct it, (he wasn't born with it, so they thought they might be able to fix it) but it didn't work and they've now said all they can do is when it gets bad again, tighten the muscle for cosmetic reasons. I fail to see the logic in not wanting to remove tonsils, that are not essential, but not minding doing an op on his eyes, that if they were somehow damaged during an op, would be devastating?!
It doesn't sound like vanity to me, more of an issue of quality of life.
"Vanity" - sorry - but he sounds like an idiot
My DS is 7 and gets these, I look for them with a torch when his breath starts reeking of strong Camembert. Sometimes it is tonsilitis, he used to get tonsilitis 3 times a year, often leaving him with chunks of stinky gunk stuck in his tonsils.
However, it seems to be easing off a bit, be a bit less frequent, so I am not sure whether to push for an op, or see if it will sort itself out...
hard decisions, aren't they?
squib, xpost! My son is 7, how old is yours?
Oh my god, I'd never heard of this before. Definitely not vanity, push to get them removed. I'd have it done in a heartbeat
I would do it. I have always had niggly tonsils and over the last few months I have started getting tiny tonsil stones in one of the craters. They are only the size of a pinhead and they don't make my breath smell, but they drive me absolutely insane until I can get rid of them. Its like having something permanently stuck in the back of your throat.
Defintiely do it. having tonsils out as an adult is a bigger deal than as a kid too.
First of all THANKS OP for teaching me that this is an actual medical condition! I've been getting these for years, along with terrible sore throats, bad breath, nasty rank coughing fits when they get big enough to provoke a gag reflex and I never knew it could actually be fixed, I thought it happened to everyone!
He is little and it's the best time to have his tonsils out, don't leave it until he's an adult and has to take time off work/school and suffer through it. Honestly the monthly sore throats alone are reason enough. Can you see a different GP?
Absolutely. Had a cyst on my tonsil, never tonsillitis just low grade sore throat. Feel soo much better now they've gone
I don't think it would be for vanity reasons. Nobody can see your tonsils! I definitely would go for it. Your poor DD. Sounds miserable for her. On the other hand I read that tonsils can prevent throat infection so look into it carefully first with a specialist. But that's the only thing that would stop me.
Defo do it. I suffer from this and wish I'd had it done as a kid as they won't touch them now I'm an adult.
I use sterile long swabs to hook them out and a long syringe with saline to flush out at least once a week, lots of gargling too. I had my wisdom teeth out earlier this year and it helps keep tge tonsils clearer.
It is horrible and vile and if they don't cone out I come down with viruses and as I've got older I have got tonsilitus.
It has been on embarrasing bodies and tge young lady (late teens) had laser day surgery and they blasted away the tonsils so quick and easy. You might be able to find it on you tube.
It sounds to me like she needs an operation, and not just for vanity reasons.
YADNBU - and your GP sounds like an arse.
I cannot get my head around anyone suggesting this could be related to 'vanity'. My throat is always my weak spot when stressed - I get apthous ulcers about 1cm across when I'm run down and they're excruciating but only a couple of times a year. Your poor DD having to deal with it regularly.
I think it's worth kicking up when you get to ENT. Last year I had to get my DD checked out for something and felt, for reasons too long-winded to go into, that an MRI scan would be worthwhile. I thought I would have to walk over hot coals to get one, but when I explained my reasoning to the consultant he was great. He explained that our hospital is a bit reluctant to do them, but actually exaggerated DD's symptoms on his referral form and she was scanned within a few weeks and given the all clear.
FWIW, I've just had a quick look at our local BMI hospital and you can have a tonsillectomy done privately for £2,500.
I don't know if that might be something you could/would consider, if you do hit a brick wall with it.
I've had these from time to time over the years, but no where near as bad as how you have described your daughters. This defiantly does not sound like a 'vanity' reason. I would push for it.
I used to get these, and they weren't much fun. Gargling with Corsodyl was really helpful, but you need to check with your doctor before using with children (and it stings so she may not tolerate it). Hope ENT are more helpful than your GP.
I used to get tonsil stones and the problem actually increased in adulthood. I never used to get tonsillitis as a child but then in my thirties I started to get it frequently and ended up in hospital with an abscess. The consultant decided I should have them out and it was the best thing that I could have ever done. I am more happy about the absence of tonsil stones than of getting rid of the tonsillitis.
I will say though that it is an awfull op to have as an adult o if the opportunity is there to have in done as a child then I would take it.
Sounds like a penny pinching gp, see another one if you can, and insist on seeing an ent surgeon, to get their opinion.
She's a little too young for the gargling tbh. Can't get the gist of it. But it's something we can try again as she gets older.
I've decided to go to the ENT appointment and discuss the pros and cons with him/her, who will hopefully professionally assure me it's not a vanity procedure.
Going private sounds really expensive, but definitely something i'll look into if this ENT appt doesn't go well.
Thanks everyone. Glad i'm not being unreasonable.
Hi Mrs Brown.
I know other people have said this but I want to echo you should do this if your Dr advises. It's not a vanity thing at all.
I get tonsil stones from time to time but nothing like your DD. It's horrible.
Chandon, he is 8 and half. I'm hoping that's the end of the tonsilloths, he's not had one for about 6 months now, but only time will tell I guess. That said, I still reckon those huge tonsils will give him problems, so I'd still like him to have them out now really. They left my massive scarred tonsils in until I was 14 and by that point I had a constant sore throat. I never had tonsilloths tho (thank god) and would definitely push to have ds tonsils out asap if it got really bad again.
Keep us updated Op.
And Good Luck.
Don't be put off by the GP saying they won't do it. I had mine removed as an adult. I had to push for the referral because my GP was adamant they wouldn't get removed. Saw the ENT specialist who said straight away that they needed to come out.
I would do it. my Ds had his out (privately) age 2 due to severe recurrent tonsilitis and has been so much happier since. Bounced back from the op within days too.
I had tonsilitis four times a year, every year from being 12 and the infection ate away at my tonsils and left craters in them, and so I ended up with tonsil stones.
I was 19 and getting very ill for two weeks (couldn't move ill) with tonsilitis every three months - and they FINALLY agreed to take the bloody things out.
There are risks to any surgery, and tonsillectomy isn't as simple as many people think, it's also not without complications so I can appreciate why your GP may not be wanting to put your daughter through surgery if she's not becoming very ill with it.
That aside, he also needs to consider her emotional wellbeing, so I can appreciate why you would want to consider surgery.
One thing to be aware of - they can't always get all the tonsil tissue out. I have some remaining in my throat. Just a small bit on the right, but it's enough to give me tonsilitis - and I get occasional tonsil stones. So surgery may not clear the problem completely anyway.
I can usually feel when one is forming, and I get it out with a cotton bud. I also gargle with salt water every few days and mouthwash every evening which seems to help prevent them forming. It might be worth asking about non-surgical options such as mouthwash, and also speak to a dentist regarding reducing plaque so there is less of it around to form stones.
I think your doctor is being very unfair as it is not all vanity is it, it must be horribly uncomfortable - insist he refers your dd x
My dd had a gap in her eyelid closed, mainly for 'vanity' reasons. My ds will also have a cosmetic op to correct a squint. I see nothing wrong with this. But your dd's surgery is more than merely vanity. There is no question I would do it.
God, yes. I wouldn't class that as cosmetic or for reasons of vanity. It sounds utterly miserable for her. It's surprised at the doc sounding so wishy washy -I'd insist on the referral.
Having tonsils out is a lot simpler than it was in the past. The tonsils are cut out with a laser which dramatically reduces the risk of blood loss. The operation is day surgery.
I had my tonsils out at 6 years old, 30 years ago and it was quite a simple op at that age.
Definitely have them out. I suffered for years and years. It got worse and worse. I used to get stones and pick up infections regularly. By the time I finally persuaded my gp to refer me, my throat would throb if I bent down to do my shoes up. It was miserable. Having them out changed my life. However, in my 30s it was a big op. Apparently it's a breeze in comparison for a kid.
Why on earth did anyone say it was vanity? Total nonsense.
GPs seem reluctant to reffer for removal - I found once I FINALLY got reffered they were more than happy to remove. I was all set to beg my case - no need. They just looked and I explained the issues and they were in agreement.
I had bad tonsil stones - horrid horrid things. Feeling uncomfortable this often will affect her at school. Where is the proof from gp crypts will get smaller? My tonsils got worse and worse.
I agree with you giraffe I had three bouts of tonsillitis in 6 months and then ended up in hospital with an abscess. I was expecting the consultant to send me away after treAtment but he just breezily said "oh I think we'll take these out don't really want to see you again"!
Same with ds's ears took two years to get a referal but once in the ent consultant was basically happy to go ahead with without issue
That's really not vanity. She shouldn't have to have that happen that frequently, it's having a serious impact on her quality of life - definitely go for the referral.
GP aren't specialist - push to see the Consultant and see what they say.
The Consultant may have a very different view about how your DD fits the criteria and if not they are still in a much better position to advise and inform you.
I'd do it too. That's not vanity, it's quality of life. Poor thing is prob so used to having a low grade sore throat she doesn't even moan
Not having a go at you there, op, just the unsympathetic GP!
Hope the appt goes well!
But you're not doing it for vanity reasons. You said she finds it uncomfortable. She doesn't eat. Not eating is a big concern & since she has them often I'd say go for it.
everytime she finds it uncomfortable and cant eat go to gp - they need to have evidence of how odten it happening and hpw it affects her. Every time she mentions it - go to gp. You will soon be reffered! I think you will get a different opionion from an ent dr I really do.
Does not sound like vanity to me. She is suffering because of this condition. I feel bad for her, they are only saying no because they are trying to save some money.
I had this well into my late teens/early twenties. It's horrid! I'd say do it now, in case it doesn't go until her early twenties and she ends up feeling debilitated around boys.
I was half expecting you to suggest she had a bit of a wonky nose or something, from the thread title. I wouldn't call this vanity at all, as it sounds downright unpleasant for her. I'd go for it, so long as she's happy with the idea.
I used to get these as a teenager, I pulled them off with tweezers, they stank!!
haven't had them for a while, tend to get them when I am run down.
Not vanity at all, it's a serious issue. My DD1 has had squint surgery (is that vanity?) and is going to have jaw surgery in a couple of years time because she has an asymmetric jaw. That could possibly be construed as vanity, but if you have one side of your face considerably and noticeably longer than the other, then I think it's more a question of normality.
Keep going on at your GP, I bet the ENT consultant will be a lot more helpful. Or, find a different GP??
Didn't read the whole thread, but:
I'm not sure why this is a vanity issue, it is more of a health issue! My Dnephew had his out for the sheer hugeness of them, and he's been much better.
I would say vanity is when they won't effect your health positively, or the surgical risk is greater than the benefit. But this seems like it will be a relief for your DD!
I had my tonsils out when I was 5 or 6. I was sore for a few days but recovered really quickly. I'm so glad I had the operation - I had constant tonsillitis for about a year and missed lots of school; as soon as my tonsils were taken out, I was fine.
I'd see this operation as very much neccessary, it's not a vanity issue. Strange GP!
I had my tonsils out 4 years ago at the age of 28. It wasn't great but I had good painkillers and I would do it again in a shot for the benefits it brought me. I didn't have tonsil stones but I had had quinsy twice which can be life threatening if untreated. I feel like a different person now. I guess I'm trying to say its not an operation to be scared of in my experience.
Just thought i'd update.
That's dd finally had her appointment with ENT last week (had one booked in Sept but missed it).
I showed the Ent some photos (which were taken a week ago) of dd's tonsils when they were filled with stones. I then showed him a photo of them next to a pound coin once they'd fallen out, just to show him the size of them.
TBH, i went in there expecting to fight for dd to get an operation. I needn't have bothered! he took one look at the photos, quickly checked her tonsils and ears, asked a few questions, and then told me he was going to get them removed.
She's been put on the waiting list (2-3 months wait) for a tonsillectomy. ENT said dd would have to go for a check up beforehand, to get her nose checked and discuss whether or not she should also get her adenoids out (all i mentioned was that she sometimes sounded 'nasally'). I was totally gobsmacked. And told him so. He looked at me like i was mad. He actually said, "Well, you've tried antibiotics (for her ear infections, which he believes are caused by the tonsil stones) so this is obviously the next step'.
I'm now really scared about the prospect of my little angel being put to sleep and having an op. The ENT said she will need to stay overnight at the hospital.
However, i'm also so pleased! No more stinky tonsil stones.
Thanks for all the advice!
I am really glad your DD is going to get her operation.
Try not to worry. Everyone has a little weep when their DC goes under anesthetic, its not something you ever get used to
But she will be fine and you get to make a huge fuss of her.
Well done for pursuing this on your DD's behalf.
Def do it, I had it as a child and the relief of getting shot of them at 16 was immense. I was permanently ill or on penicillin and missed lots of school. I think we went private in the end but I've never had a problem since and I don't remember the op being too bad.
I wouldn't hesitate if it were one of my dc's.
My sister had her tonsils out last year at the age of 28. She also had manky tonsil stones but also had reoccurring tonsillitis as well. She was lucky actually - to be referred for the op she had to have had tonsillitis three times in 3 months (I think) which she did, two months later she had them out.
It was MUCH worse for her having them out at 28 than me at 15!
Just do it.
The posters above who say it's a quality of life thing make a very goodnp
Oops... Make a very good point. I feel that GPs view their role as gatekeepers to the NHS budget, if you had private health care you would get a referral in a heartbeat and I doubt the word "vanity" would feature at all. I'd do it
Sorry, I see the update. That is great news
Oh, I am glad you got the outcome you should have had without a fight or any kind of unpleasantness.
I think you have to change the title of your thread - this is in no way an operation for 'vanity' reasons.
Peeps, stop slagging the NHS, you'll miss it when it's gone - there is not doubt that a situation like this ENT assessment is needed and an operation would be offered as a matter of routine.
I had mine out at 19, after years of tonsillitis, quinsies and other throat infections.
I was permanently run down before the op; afterwards, my quality of life improved hugely. In my childhood I had repeated chest infections: I've only had one since my tonsillectomy (am now 36).
The severity of these repeated bouts of tonsillitis caused the infections to travel upwards behind my nose, scarring my adenoids, and even travelling into my sinuses. This necessitated two ops later in life, one to remove my adenoids and another to remove scar tissue from the inside of my nose so that my sinuses could drain properly.
All the antibiotics I had to take worsened my IBS, meaning a childhood where I was either feverish and ill, coughing, with a snotty nose / post nasal drip, or on the loo with constipation / diahorrea for a large part of the time. It was miserable.
What causes your daughter's bad breath? Her tonsil stones; more accurately, the bacteria growing on those tonsil stones. If these are allowed to remain she will undoubtedly get infections from them. Also, those bacteria will be the same bacteria that grow on the plaque on your teeth, which has been implicated in an increased risk of heart disease later on in life.
Get them out, and don't take no for an answer.
bless her. just wanted to say I am glad you got the news you wanted from the ENT - sure she will be glad in the long run!
I would do it. In a flash.
OMG - I get the occasional tonsile stone and they are horrific! Your poor DD. I don't think this is a vanity issue at all - tonsil stones make you feel horrid, so I would definitely seek the operation!
My DH had his tonsils out for this before Christmas (at the tender age of 39!) and really should have had it done years and years ago - and is so happy with the result!
I'm really very pleased for you that they are taking them out, but not surprised that is what ENT said for your DD. Don't worry, she'll be fine - just remember to keep her eating and keep on top of her pain killers afterwards, that is the key to recovery.
Definitely, I would go ahead. I don't think that is vanity at all. I teach a little girl who (for reasons her Dr doesn't know) continually has bad breath and other children have commented on it.
sorry I see you are going ahead, well done and good luck!
I had my tonsils out at 4 when they were often whipped out in children. Don't remember having lots of sore throats though before. Your poor DD, what she endures sounds awful, and definitely needs to have her Tonsils out.
It is not vanity but a medical health necessity.
I'm sorry - every month she has to endure the taste of rotten food in her mouth, plus the bullying over bad breath and he says it would be for vanity's sake when you have to ear bud her mouth every morning??!
Report the bastard! Thank goodness the ENT listening to you. What a relief! I had my tonsils out at your DD's age - bit of a sore throat the next day but ice-cream helped!! And well done you for fighting your DD's corner - it will make a difference to her quality of life
I knew this would happen - old thread gets revived (with v welcome update, thank you ) and everybody responds to the OP .
And now I've killed the poor fred too
Haha, not at all, Pacific
I shall be back to update in another three months' time when (hopefully) dd's tonsils and tonsil stones will be gone for good.
So glad you found a good consultant.
Great update! Hope all goes well
Glad to hear there's been such a positive outcome from the ENT appointment.
Afraid that DC going into hospital/having surgery etc apparently doesn't get easier with frequency/age: my parental unit still worries horribly about me & I am a proper grown-up. It's important that as well as taking stuff for DD to the hospital you take stuff to entertain/distract yourself with whilst she's in surgery/recovery.
Hope it all goes well
Good news OP.
I'm glad the ENT appointment was so helpful
And thanks for coming back with an update.
ds1 had surgery when he was 6. the op took 6 hours
he woke up at 1am after the op in the morning and said 'I'm starving, can I have some toast?' he came out the next day.
the hospital were great.
I can tell you not to worry, but as a parent you will do anyway, but it will be fine, and your dd and you will be ok. sometimes the anticipation is worse than the actual event.
That's great news
I think you should change Drs too - he's clearly a twat.
I had my tonsils out when I was 7. I have nothing but good memories of it Mum & Dad visiting my the day after, lots of colouring books etc and being allowed crisps and ice cream (I'm not sure that's what the recommend anymore, but it was in the late 70's!)
Great news. Good decision all round and good luck for the op to your DD.
So pleased to hear the update. It sounded horrible for your poor DD. I think your GP was out of order. Hope it all goes well.
I opened this thread fully expecting it to be about ear pinning or some such, although in young children I so think that the potential (probable) bullying from that would dint their self esteem so much during formtive years that I would have it done regardless of how 'vain' it appeared. Then I saw that it was about a GPs interuptation of an actual medical condition and though 'hell yeah, do it'. I am very glad to now see that it was a zombie thread and you have found someone who will listen to you and take you more seriously and that the tonsillectomy will be going ahead.
I do love it when a thread is resolved before I even finish reading it fwiw I think some people overlook the impact that tonsil problems can have on your life. I had recurrent tonsillitis as a teen and after being fobbed off 3 times when I was 14 with calpol, seriously, at bloody 14!, and eventually begrudgingly being given antibiotics I learnt coping mechanisms when they got bad again to avoid seeing the patronising GP. The result was that at 15 I got tonsillitis again and masked the symptoms so well that I could mostly carry on with life as normal except for eating. I even went to American football training one morning with a bad case and it was only when my coach mentioned to my mother that I hadn't said a word all morning that she really noticed something was up and connected it to my being off my food, so took me to the out of hours doc who had me sent straight to hospital. By then the infection was so bad that it had spread throughout my body and made me seriously unwell. They said at the time that if I had covered for it for another day or two, it might have been too late to reverse the damage, I could have died of tonsillitis. Since I was a rather vain teenager, the thought of my tombstone reading 'here lies Hoping, died from dodgy tonsils' was enough to mortify me into getting them whipped out. Honestly, who dies from tonisilitus these days? People who have had recurrent problems with them and had those problems minimised to the extent that they hide their symptoms to avoid being judged, that's who.
OP I am so glad that you have agreed to the surgery. I know any surgery has risks and of course as a parent you will always fret about your child, but I truly think that it is the best course of action for your DD and will help save her from a lifetime of bullying and self esteem and confidence problems.
I had mine out a few years ago and spent the best part of 3 months off work. Still the best op I've ever had for the relief now. Dd had hers out recently due to apnoea. She was weepy for a little while but bounced back incredibly quickly. She had 2 weeks off school but we were probably being over cautious. Neither of us snore now either which is a relief for the rest of the household!
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