to be angry that she's changed her mind about going back to work

(345 Posts)
Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 13:42:05

OK. I'm a man, (so that immediately probably makes me disliked here ;) But, I'd genuniely like a female perspective on this.
I wasn't fussed about having a baby, but my partner was so desperate that I wanted to make her happy. Now baby is here I'm glad I did. BUT. As we are both on low-incomes I said I'd be happy to have a child on the understanding that when our child started nursery she would return to work.
Now our kid has, she's arbitrarily decided that no, she enjoys being a stay at home mum, and if I don't like it I can go shit. No discussion, no compromise.
We will now struggle to survive financially. I'm unhappy about the sexism angle as well: why can't I stay at home having coffee mornings and walks in the park with friends whilst the kid spends the day at the nursery? Why do I have to be the one to go back to work?
Am I being out of order to feel mislead and pissed off?
Thanks for listening, I just needed to vent somewhere...

OrmIrian Mon 27-Feb-12 13:43:45

No, you aren't.

MamaMary Mon 27-Feb-12 13:45:26

Your feelings are understandable.

It would be best to sit down and have a calm talk with her. Tell her how much you appreciate the way she's looked after your child, and then talk about finances. There needs to be discussion.

YANBU based on what information you have given.

annalovesmrbates Mon 27-Feb-12 13:46:20

No, YANBU especially as baby is in nursery.

annalovesmrbates Mon 27-Feb-12 13:46:20

No, YANBU especially as baby is in nursery.

Haziedoll Mon 27-Feb-12 13:46:44

"Why can't I stay at home having coffee mornings and walks in the parks with friends whilst the baby is in nursery".

Why are you paying nursery fees?

OnlyWantsOne Mon 27-Feb-12 13:47:22

Essentially YABU

But less because she wants to be a a SAHM and more because you say she refuses to discuss this matter. This is not a good thing at all and would concern me more.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 13:47:35

Thanks. I don't think I'm being unreasonable either smile

Gumby Mon 27-Feb-12 13:47:50

why is your child at nursery? how old is he/she?

CalmaLlamaDown Mon 27-Feb-12 13:47:50

Both go time and share the childcare (coffee mornings)

How old is child? How many days per week at nursery? It's not easy to get a job for 15 hours a week. Although she could work more and you could get tax credits for extra nursery time so YANBU really. It should be s joint decision.

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 13:48:51

Odd not to discuss it with you.

Is she planning to go back when your DC starts school? Is it a childcare issue - she not happy with the options when your DC is not at,what I assume is 15 hours free nursery placement, and she'd have to work? Is she lacking confidence having not worked for a while?

Basically is there more than she doesn't want to work?

WhiteTrash Mon 27-Feb-12 13:49:08

How old is your child? How often is she in nusery? And are you paying for it?

CalmaLlamaDown Mon 27-Feb-12 13:49:38

Meant both go PART TIME, sorry

noinspiration Mon 27-Feb-12 13:49:52

No you aren't out of order, you are completely in the right. You need to talk to her - she is not being fair to you. This is not the 1950s.

prettyfly1 Mon 27-Feb-12 13:50:00

I think that sounds totally fair - women wanted equality and that means sharing the load on both sides. If you need to earn more to pay the bills and you are already working full time then she needs to go back to work, at least part time to support her family. Many women would like to stay at home all the time with their kids but the simple fact of modern life is that for many it is too expensive and you have to try and balance. Based on the info you have given YANBU

PurplePidjin Mon 27-Feb-12 13:50:10

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

timetoask Mon 27-Feb-12 13:50:35

Hi Zealey,
Has she given you reason why she doesn't want to go back to work? has she explained herself? might be worth having an open discussion (calmly) for her to explain her feelings.

By your OP, it sounds to be that your concerns are not 100% financial, but more a little bit of resentment about her "coffee mornings". Trust me, looking after a child is hard work.

NeedlesCuties Mon 27-Feb-12 13:50:58

There are plenty of men on here, doesn't make you automatically disliked.

Does she intend to work part-time hours while the child is at nursery? Or just doesn't want to work at all?

You need to gently talk to her about it, DO NOT whatever you do use your not-so-charming line you said in your OP, "why can't I stay at home having coffee mornings and walks in the park with friends whilst the kid spends the day at the nursery?" as that will straight away get her on the defensive. I can sort of see what you're saying, but don't think she'd want you to tell her that so bluntly!

I can see it from your perspective that you think she wants to have her cake and eat it and that the £ worries are a big weight on your mind.

It might help to write down everything you need to spend £ on in a month - bills, rent, groceries etc and show it to her so that she can see clearly that 2 incomes are needed in your household.

bobbledunk Mon 27-Feb-12 13:51:24

She is being very selfish to drag the whole family into borderline poverty because she likes playing mommy. Tell her to grow up or she's on her own, her 'mummy' friend's won't want to know her when she's on benefitswink.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 13:52:23

Essentially it is that she hated her job and although had a maternity agreement to go back she's now decided that she doesn't want to. Our daughter is I6 months and currently only goes to the nursery for a few hours in the morning, but she wants to increase the time in the coming months. Basically she feels that she was born to be a 'mother' and now doesn't want to be anything else. It's her and the baby and I'm just there to do the tough things like make money, do the cooking, house jobs etc... Grrrrrrrr

cumbria81 Mon 27-Feb-12 13:52:33

but she's not looking after the child? It's in nursery

OP, YANBU

igggi Mon 27-Feb-12 13:53:47

Assuming the child is at nursery for the free 2.5 hours per day, I think you are somewhat overestimating the amount of free time your wife has.
I do agree it should be discussed, and a compromise probably reached, but it's ridiculous to imply she is staying home to meet friends etc. Some more info about age of child etc would help.

WhiteTrash Mon 27-Feb-12 13:54:10

Then its quite simple, take the chd out of nursery.

If she wants to be a mum, and you cant afford nursery then let her be a mum and stop nursery. It seems quite obvious to me?

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 13:56:09

You have a low income, a SAHP and are paying Nursury fees for a 16 month old?

Is this a wind up?

If she hated her job - she try looking round for another one. Has she?

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 13:56:41

If she was to come on here and put her side of the situation forward to convince us YABU, OP, what do you think she'd day?

Northey Mon 27-Feb-12 13:56:42

He's not dismissing what his wife does, purplepidgin. He's questioning whether she's being unreasonable in insisting that she stays at home to do it without discussing it with him (the one who is financing it). Maye he would like to stay a home full/part time instead? Maybe they will be better off (even allowing for childcare costs) if his wife goes back. The point is, she can't just decide this on her own. It doesn't jus affect her.

TheCrunchUnderfoot Mon 27-Feb-12 13:57:38

I see your point entirely.

You can't force her to work - but you certainly CAN lay the law down about paying for nursery care while your wife is at home!!

She was born to be a mother and wants to be one full time? - you are both on low incomes - then she needs to BE a mother full time and save on nursery costs AT THE VERY LEAST.

YANBU.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 13:58:14

Igggi the child isnt old enough for free nursery.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 13:59:43

@ViviPru. I think she'd say 'it's no one else's business' and get very defensive because deep down she knows she's in the wrong. (Not to be a SAHM, but because she changed our agreement)

CagneyNLacey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:00:14

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:00:42

@Northey. Thanks, I just ignored Purplepigeon comments as they were too judgmental and ill-informed to bother responding too.

TeWihara Mon 27-Feb-12 14:00:44

Try not to be too cross, but sit down and show her the maths, if you were on low wages I can't imagine you can afford to keep paying nursery fees and also have a parent at home.

It is really hard work being a full time stay at home parent to a toddler, and in a lot of situations it doesn't make much difference income wise between doing that and having a second wage so if she does decide to take your child out of nursery and be a SAHP full time I wouldn't be so sure she's got the better deal!

In terms of who is doing what jobs around the house a good measure is whether you have the same amount of free time at the end of the week.

AgnesBligg Mon 27-Feb-12 14:01:10

I thought the free nursery hours were when the child is three.

maybenow Mon 27-Feb-12 14:01:34

yabu being angry at her not wanting to go back to work... nobody can tell how they'll feel until they are parents. and if her job is low paid she probably won't make much money out of if (if any) once childcare is paid for

yanbu to not want to pay for nursery fees though, unless your wife is really struggling, a 16mnth old doesn't 'need' nursery if they have a stay at home parent and local toddler groups etc.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 14:01:46

Your op made it sound as though your child was in full time nursery while you wife was at home. In fact the child goes a few hours a morning . . . time that goes very fast.

Exactly how many hours a week?

Bellstar Mon 27-Feb-12 14:02:11

I cant believe some of the nasty replies on this thread-oh no wait yes I can because I forgot we have moved on from benefit bashing to sahm bashing this month on mnhmm

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 14:02:50

It is AgnesBligg expect-in in deprived areas with families on low incomes where funding can be applied for at 2.

Labootin Mon 27-Feb-12 14:03:02

the nursery aspect is puzzling...
What would have been the childcare arrangements had your wife gone back to work as planned?

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:03:17

Was is an agreement though? Or was she so consumed with the desire to have a baby she'd have agreed with anything? In your OP it sounds as though you TOLD her your conditions, and now she's TELLING you hers, not much give-and-take on either side. While I appreciate at the time you felt like your 'give' was agreeing to have the baby. She probably won't have seen it that way.

FWIW, I think YANBremotelyU, but I think there is value in trying to get a handle on her perspective.

MamaMary Mon 27-Feb-12 14:03:41

I'm assuming the child is 3 and at a pre-school-type government-funded nursery. OP, is that right? There is some confusion here.

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:04:15

'was it'* not 'was is'.

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 14:04:51

Exactly what maybenow said! She should of course be "allowed" to stay at home - it really is impossible to know how you'll feel about that before you have a child. But I think you're within your rights to say no to nursery. It is not needed. There are heaps and heaps of free and fantastic surestart and parent and toddler groups she can go to with your baby for social interaction and everything.

WhiteTrash Mon 27-Feb-12 14:05:13

Why is the child in nursery? Why?

Labootin Mon 27-Feb-12 14:05:45

Personally I can't see the need for a 16 month old to be in nursery for a few hours if either parent is at home especially if money is tight

( mind you I would have chewed my arm off to get a few free hours when my children were that age)

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:05:47

OK. Thanks for the insights. I'll show her this thread, hopefully as a starting point for a discussion.

TeWihara Mon 27-Feb-12 14:05:52

Mama - No the OP said the baby is only 16mths, so definately not funded.

LingDiLong Mon 27-Feb-12 14:06:02

Ok, there MUST be more to this than meets the eye. Why is she not taking any financial responsibility? Does she not realise you can't survive without her working? Why doesn't she realise that, have you shown her in black and white?

I agree you are very dismissive of her role though. I'm at home with a 20 month old and believe me a life of coffee mornings and swanning about with friends it ain't! I'm assuming you're having some big problems in your relationship generally for you both to dismiss each other's point of view so angrily?

CamperFan Mon 27-Feb-12 14:06:35

Agree with maybenow. From what you have said I find it odd that your DW would want to increase a 16 month olds nursery hours further though if she already goes in the morning - how often exactly does she go?

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 14:06:47

MamaMary no it is not the free government 15 hours funding as 16 months is too young for that.

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:06:47

Hode up a minute OP. Before you do one, you're not having our YABUs without at least answering a few of the questions posed, that's not cricket.

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 14:07:00

Also, as an ex-sahm (for a year - mat leave) and now the fulltime earner while DH is a SAHD... do not underestimate being at home. Bloody hard work, honestly, it is.... being at work in a office is a far easier ride!

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:07:08

YANBUs even. Fucksake.

TeWihara Mon 27-Feb-12 14:08:44

Don't show her the thread, you'll just have a row about posting your troubles on the internet.

Work out the finances for the two options, of her going back to work and not going back to work, (or the two of you both being part time if that's something you'd consider) then sit down together and talk - calmly! - about whether it could feasibly work or not. Remember that if she doesn't go back to work she may find it harder to go back to work or get as well paid a job later, and also the cost of fulltime childcare and cover for sick days if she does.

LikeAnAdventCandleButNotQuite Mon 27-Feb-12 14:08:49

Zealey, in order for posters to give their opinions, you need to tell us, does your DD go to nursery for free, or is it paid for by you?

If it is the free 15 hours a week, then your wife finding a job for just those hours will be a challenge. Alternatively, if your DD was to go 40 hours a week childcare, and you and your DW worked, would you be able to afford the costs?

If your DD goes to nursery and you are paying for it, I would be cross for you. Struggling to manage financially means everyone tightening their belts, and your wife should be covering the childcare herself, as she is out of work.

It does seem unfair of your DW to renege on an agreement, but being a parent can consume you completely, and maybe she is so overwhelmed with the pleasure of being with your DD that she can't imagine leaving her? If this is the case, she needs to work with you to discuss methods to help ease the financial issue - are there ways she can cut back on costs, say reducing the amount of times she has her haircut, or a subscription to something she doesnt really need or use? As she is the one who is not prepared to return to work, she needs to prove to you that you can all manage without her wage.

OrmIrian Mon 27-Feb-12 14:08:52

" it really is impossible to know how you'll feel about that before you have a child"

And?

Sometimes it doesn't matter how you feel, you just have to get on with it. If money is short then both parents may well have to work. Tough shit. I would imagine a lot of parents would like to stay at home with their babies, but many of us can't.

DoMeDon Mon 27-Feb-12 14:09:01

I'm unhappy about the sexism angle as well: why can't I stay at home having coffee mornings and walks in the park with friends whilst the kid spends the day at the nursery?

So am I- SAHP do not just do coffee mornings and walks in the park. You say your 'kid' is at nursery for a few hours one morning not all day too. Maybe you are upset about this and exaggerating or being emotive for effect??

Anyway most SAHP look after the child, do lion's share of housework, cook, shop, wash, bank, bills - it's a trade off. Maybe compromise on each side and valuing each other's unique contribution is in order.

MrsKittyFane Mon 27-Feb-12 14:09:02

YANBU to be annoyed.
If you can't afford it, let her know that there is no choice as the bills need to be paid.
If you can afford it at a push, look at a more agreeable division of labour.

porcamiseria Mon 27-Feb-12 14:09:07

is she mad! how will you survive financially? YANBU

tomverlaine Mon 27-Feb-12 14:09:50

LegallyBlond - why should she be allowed to stay at home? why shouldn't he?

if they were better off as a family if she goes back (regardless of childcare) why is it only her choice?

PomBearAtTheGatesOfDoom Mon 27-Feb-12 14:10:00

Why do say "why do I have to be the one to go back to work" OP? are you both at home, or did you have paternity leave and then go back to work? Maybe your wife was hoping that once your first child arrived you'd love being a parent and she was hoping to start trying for another baby about now. If she has been hoping/dreaming this then you just putting you big manly breadwinning foot down and telling her she HAS to go back to work in no uncertain terms might be really upsetting for her. Have you sat down and talked to each other, calmly, without getting angry/defensive/being rude to each other at all? Have either of you actually worked out how much money she could expect to earn, and how much childcare and her work expenses would be, to see if you would actually be better off with her working?
You sound a bit like you feel like she trapped/forced you into fatherhood against your wishes and now you want to punish her because she is enjoying motherhood and you aren't getting anything out of fatherhood?

MamaMary Mon 27-Feb-12 14:10:07

Oh, sorry. I missed that the child is 16 months. That changes things a lot. Why on earth enrol the DC in a nursery if finances are tight and DW is a SAHM? confused

juneau Mon 27-Feb-12 14:10:23

YANBU at all. And why is your DD in nursery if your wife is a SAHM (who was 'born to be a mother'), and you're on a low income? Fair enough if you get free nursery provision, but I'm pretty sure you don't get it for 16-month-olds. I think, if it was me, I'd say to her that she can either be a mother (so no nursery), or she can go back to work, but putting DD in nursery when you can't afford it and pleasing herself is not being a SAHM. And if she hates her job so much, why doesn't she look for a different one?

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:10:47

Good post AdventCandle I concur.

The OP doesn't seem particularly keen to come back and discuss the fundamentals of the issue though.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 14:10:50

You say shes in the wrong to change her mind . . . New parents cant always predict how they will feel once their first baby is born. It turns the world upside down.
I think its unfair to hold her to an agreement you made before the baby was born. lots of people change their minds about all sorts of things once they are parents and the realities kick in. up until then it is hyperthetical

scuse sp. etc. on new phone

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 14:11:01

YANBU
I have a nearly 15month old, a five year old and a six year old. I work 16 (extremely) unsociable hours a week as well as cooking, cleaning, shopping and looking after the baby all day (and the odd coffee morning :p).
We need the money I don't have a choice.
I would like to be a SAHM too but I would be unreasonable in insisting on being one....

Can you afford for her to SAH, OP? Or is this actually causing you major financial hardship? Either way, she should have discussed this with you.

chandellina Mon 27-Feb-12 14:12:06

Tough one because these decisions should be made jointly, yet it is hard to know how you'll feel until you're in it.

Would full time child care and her working make better sense financially? Or is it just the principle of her not working that bothers you?

I don't think it is odd though for mums with any age children to want some time to themselves. One reason I enjoyed going back to work frankly.

TheFeministsWife Mon 27-Feb-12 14:14:30

I agree with CagneyNLacey I smell BS!

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 14:14:38

I also don't understand enrolling a 16mo in nursery unless you are working BUT could your OH be a bit down / depressed, does she have a job? It's hard out there and sometimes it's very hard to actually get your confidence back and get out there after being off with a baby for a year or more....

blackeyedsusan Mon 27-Feb-12 14:14:40

I am struggling to understand.

baby 16 months.
sahm
baby in nursery that needs paying for.
the family is short of money.

at first glance, either the sahm needs to change to part time wok, or nursery needs to stop.

how much cooking and cleaning? are you sure you do it all because lots of things that happen don't get seen. (unless they are not done)

AvonCallingBarksdale Mon 27-Feb-12 14:15:04

OP if your child (nicer than "the kid" btw) is 16 months old and you are on low incomes and your DP feels she's born to be a mum, then there is no need/reason for your daughter to be at nursery. I'm a SAHM who left a pretty well paid career for various reasons, but as soon as I did, both DC came out of childcare until such a time as it became free. However, I'm wondering if you feel like you've been taken for a ride seeing as, in your words, you weren't fussed about having a baby. It's the unequal side to the way you describe the relationship that bothers me. My DH works all hours but is happy for me to be at home - currently studying. He knows that he doesn't have to worry about all the extras like plays, appointments, sickness as I'm there to do it all and, essetially, keep the house ticking over. But I think if you feel that this wasn't what you signed up for, then that's a problem. I think you need to have a calm conversation with your DP, and get it all out in the open.

MrsKittyFane Mon 27-Feb-12 14:15:07

DomeDon
Why is it sexist to think that time spent in the park with DC, meet ups with other mums, cooking meals, washing, ironing are more enjoyable compared to going out to work?
These activities/ chores are more enjoyable IMO. I've done both (SAH/work FT & PT) and I know which I prefer to spend my time doing.

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 14:16:51

Are you sure she not just having a wobble?

Going back to a job your unhappy with and leaving a baby you love to do so must be very hard. Perhaps she just needs some support and a bit of reassurance?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:17:22

To those who've asked for more info: I have to pay for the nursery at the moment as we don't get it free and partner has no independent income. DD stays for two hours a day, five days a week. While I agree it can come across as provocative to say 'coffee mornings and walks in the park' (and swimming with large lattés afterwards) - this is actually the state of affairs, unless she's lying to me about what she gets up to with her circle of new mums whilst I'm grinding away at the salt mine ;)

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:17:49

OP. The good ladies of AIBU have taken the trouble to read your thread and ask intelligent questions. The least you can do is answer them. I have made it easy for you. <Thoughtful like that>

Does your DD go to nursery for free, or is it paid for by you?

Can you afford for her to SAH, OP? Or is this actually causing you major financial hardship?

Would full time child care and her working make better sense financially? Or is it just the principle of her not working that bothers you?

Why on earth enrol the DC in a nursery if finances are tight and DW is a SAHM?

What would have been the childcare arrangements had your wife gone back to work as planned?

Is she planning to go back when your DC starts school?

Is this a wind up?

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 14:19:04

@viviPru good post smile

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:19:05

OK x post. You can still answer them though.

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 14:19:10

I don't get the paying for nursery unless they put the DC there to get use to the people and place before the mother started back at work.

CagneyNLacey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:19:33

So why are you paying for it, if you're on low income like you say? And if she's on mat leave?

Lotkinsgonecurly Mon 27-Feb-12 14:20:22

But surely at 16 months for your dd then one of you is either a SAHP or when she's in nursery you're both working?

AvonCallingBarksdale Mon 27-Feb-12 14:20:44

OP please come back and answer the questions and stop with all the passive aggressive stuff in brackets. You're pissed off, you've asked for opinions, you're getting them and requests for clarification. No-one is asking for more info/telling you YABU (in fact many have said YANBU) because you're a man, it's because it's easier to offer a measured opinion when you have all the facts smile

MrsKittyFane Mon 27-Feb-12 14:20:52

Ha OP I agree with you but playing the martyr card is irritating!

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 14:21:07

Sriously OP - is this for real? You (plural - I work ft while DH is a SAHD - money is ours) pay for nursery 2 hours a day?! If you didn't, could you afford for your DP/DW to be at home then? Serously, paying for nursery when a parent is a SAHP with a 16 month old is CRAZY.

Personally, I get that she doesn't want to go back to work and put your child in a nursery fulltime. We didn't want to do that either. A priority for us was having DD at home with a parent. So DH is now at home (as that is the best for us financially).

If she feels like this and you can afford it, just drop the 2 hours of nursery a day. Not rocket science. Go to surestart groups instead. confused

OP, assuming you are paying for the nursery fees.... stop!

if she doesn't want to go back to work because she wantz to be a SAHM that's fine. but she needs to be a SAHM, not have the child in nursery every day.

i'd love to put my 2 year old in nursery a couple of mornings a week, but I don't because we can't afford to.

you need to sit down and talk to her. it is perfectly normal for people to find that actually they really don't want to return to work while their children are small, and if this is financially viable i don't see why she shouldn't do that. however if you cannot afford to have the baby in nursery then you need to stop that now

LikeAnAdventCandleButNotQuite Mon 27-Feb-12 14:22:40

Well, I think, OP, that you are well within your rights to stop paying for nursery. You say to your wife, "I know how much you want to stay at home, but in order for that to work, we need to be cutting back by X amount a month. Nursery fees make up (say) half of that amount, so our DD will have to stop going". See what her response is!

CailinDana Mon 27-Feb-12 14:23:08

So your DC is in nursery 10 hours a week while your wife is at home??? That's utter madness! What a complete waste of money. If she's so delighted at being a mummy then why isn't she actually looking after her child?

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 14:23:12

OP answered the paying for nursery and how much thing at 14.17.22 above!

KatAndKit Mon 27-Feb-12 14:25:17

Well, if you are paying for nursery hours that you can't afford then cut them and no more nursery until you get the free government funded hours. Or, if your daughter enjoys it there, cut it to one or two days a week if you could afford that.

If you are in financial difficulty then she should be looking for a job. But bear in mind that then you would have to find 40 hours worth of childcare if she works full time. Childcare for a baby under 2 is very expensive. Perhaps when the baby is a bit older, and you get the 15 hours funded childcare, you would jointly make more of a "profit" from her going back to work. I don't know if she went back now, would you get any government help with childcare? Probably having two incomes would mean that no you wouldn't.

Can't she do the coffee and the walks with the baby? I'm not sure why you need to have the child in nursery, she could walk around the park with the baby!

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:25:28

Yes but he's still not answered the other questions which would give a fairer view of the situation in context.

igggi Mon 27-Feb-12 14:25:45

These are separate issues: your dw wants to be sahp; and she also wants to put LO into nursery while she's at home.
That looks like your obvious compromise: propose she doesn't go back to work, but there is to be no childcare.

ViviPru Mon 27-Feb-12 14:26:38

Yes igggi. It's simple as that, OP.

KatAndKit Mon 27-Feb-12 14:26:51

Surestart groups is a good suggestion, there are plenty of things going on in childrens centres where she can spend time with new mums and babies without having to pay nursery rates.

HillyWallaby Mon 27-Feb-12 14:26:53

OK, just re-read the thread, and I see the woman in question was of 'Mediterranean/Indian' appearance. So he didn't say 'coloured' because he was afraid to say black, he said it because she was not black, but he was not sure exactly what her ethnicity was. So, I can see why he did it, he would have been better to say 'the dark skinned lady' or the Asian-looking woman.'

WhiteTrash Mon 27-Feb-12 14:27:10

I have absolutely no sympathy for you.

YOU are paying thr nursery fees there fore this is YOUR doing.

QuintessentialyHollow Mon 27-Feb-12 14:30:43

To be honest, I agree AND disagree with you.

2 hours in the nursery is not a long time. Pretty much just enough time to maybe pop to the gym, or get a few chores done.
2 hours in playgroup is NOT the same as childcare, it is mostly a chance for the baby to socialize and learn socializing skills.

Coffee morning is par for the course for a stay at home parent, it is the new support network, and a chance to meet others who have just embarked on the new life changing situation that is parenthood.

The rest of the time will be spent on caring for your child, her food, her naps, her nappy changes, laundry for both the child and the family.

The fact that you do not see this, give me the impression that you are a very hands off not to very present father figure, nor husband figure in the whole state of affairs.

I would imagine your wife is pretty pissed off that you have such attitude to the baby and how this has changed your lives.

This brings me to the question:

How much of YOUR life has changed since you became a father?

The part I agree with is that whether or nor your wife goes back to work and your child stays in nursery full time, or your wife stays at home is a joint decision which should be based on you and her talking about your life and your expectations.

Part of this is measuring up the cost of full time child care (I paid £800 per month for a full time nursery place in London 5 years ago), and whether it is worth it from both a financial perspective and the perspective of yours and your wives career progression.

TeWihara Mon 27-Feb-12 14:30:49

take home pay calculator

benefits calculator (as a guide most families with one child and an income over 26k will not get any tax credits from April, families with 1 parent not working or working low hours also won't qualify for various TC elements including childcare costs)

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:31:05

OK. Once again, thanks to all who responded. It's given me an extra insight, much needed.
I'm out. x

dancingonthinice Mon 27-Feb-12 14:31:31

YANBU. Why is your baby at nursery if she doesn't work unless you have agreed this? I'm guessing as you are on a low income you can't afford the luxury?

everlong Mon 27-Feb-12 14:32:15

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 14:32:39

So on the one hand you are being unreasonable, ill informed etc to think that looking after a child is easy. It so is not!

On the other the child should not be going to nursery if you cant afford it.

I personally think that if she wants to be a sahm then fine as you might not make a profit after nursery costs if she was working anyway. But i do think that isnt the issue so much. You sound very unappreciative of the job she does as a mum and rather resentful. This is common in dads who havent been experiencing for themselves what being a sahp is actually like.

Im also wondering if you are one of those people who only see a persons worth and contribution in terms of the amount of money they bring in.

fatlazymummy Mon 27-Feb-12 14:32:53

If she wants to be a SAHP how about she looks about for some evening work or some kind of work she can do at home. That way she can be with her child all day long and still bring in some income. Plus there is no need for paid childcare as the child will be looked after by both parents.
This is what quite a few families do.

TeWihara Mon 27-Feb-12 14:33:08

Bit boring if so.

HillyWallaby Mon 27-Feb-12 14:33:58

Actually I think for a couple on one income, without much spare cash, it's jolly good of him to agree to five days a week of two hours a time nursery, while his DP stays at home full time. This child is only 16 months old remember. I don't know how long she's been going to nursery, but most children don't usually go until they are 2 and half, and even then maybe only for three days a week.

If she loves being a SAHM so much perhaps so should try doing a bit more of it. I think she is having her cake and eating it. I don't blame him for being a bit miffed.

(and I say that as a dyed-in-the wool SAHM of almost 20 years)

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 14:34:46

I don't know many nurseries that would even do two hours five days a week for a 16month old.... None round here would sessional care is only available from 2, Nursery is full days or at the very least half days.

QuintessentialyHollow Mon 27-Feb-12 14:35:12

2 hours in nursery is not a long time. It is hardly worth the hassle of getting the child ready, going there, and picking her up again!

letseatgrandma Mon 27-Feb-12 14:35:22

To the person above who said that 2 hours whilst the child is in nursery is ok as it gives her time to go to the gym and get the chores done; that's fine as a luxury IF money isn't tight.

If it is tight, then surely that's one of the first thing that needs to go. Also, a 16 month old will get just as much socialising out of going to a toddler group twice a week!

dancingonthinice Mon 27-Feb-12 14:35:26

Cake and eat it spring to mind about DW.grin <disclaimer my DD went to nursery since 6 months and I am a SAHM but can just afford it>

QuintessentialyHollow Mon 27-Feb-12 14:36:34

I guess that depends on how much each session cost, though?

But I agree that playgroup once or twice a week, or gymboree or monkey music serve the same purpose. As do coffee mornings. grin

crashdoll Mon 27-Feb-12 14:37:14

undercoverPrincess I worked at 2 nurseries that ran short sessions for children from the ages of 6 months up.

dancingonthinice Mon 27-Feb-12 14:37:21

Jeez op, your out? What like dragon's den? grin no sticking power

letseatgrandma Mon 27-Feb-12 14:37:57

Absolutely, QuintessentiallyHollow!

OP-out of interest; how much are you paying for the child's nursery fees?

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 14:38:42

Monkey music is expensive.

PuffPants Mon 27-Feb-12 14:38:58

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

expatinscotland Mon 27-Feb-12 14:39:07

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

malinois Mon 27-Feb-12 14:39:15

@WhiteTrash: My understanding was that he is paying for nursery fees on the understanding that his DP would go back to work P/T, ramping up to F/T (hence more hours in nursery as he discusses)

She has now changed her mind and wants to SAH with DC still in nursery (and increase the hours), and won't engage with him on any alternatives.

It doesn't sound remotely unbelievable to me, I know of a few women who have done the same - the moaning in the pub after work by various wimpy hard-done-by husbands has to be heard to be believed. It's usually concurrent with an enforced move out of London leaving the poor sap with a massive commute while his DW plays home counties Boden lady.

I usually nod sympathetically while thinking "grow some you mug."

redridingwolf Mon 27-Feb-12 14:39:21

'the kid' isn't a very charming way to talk about your child. I find that U.

Gribble Mon 27-Feb-12 14:39:31

Im confused OP, did she have an extended maternity agreement with work? I thought mat leave ended when the child is 12 months so how come the kid is 16 months and she has only recently decided she doesnt want to go back?

Damn decent of the company to hold her role open for that long innit?

<chinny bifter>

crashdoll Mon 27-Feb-12 14:39:49

YANBU in that you feel angry she's not taking your feelings into account by making this decision alone. Also, I agree with those who say the nursery is a luxury you cannot afford and not neccesary with a 16 month old. However, YABU in saying stay at home parenting is all 'swimming and lattes'. If you were the SAHP, I think you'd find the reality a lot different.

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 14:40:05

crashdoll sorry I didn't realise I wish some round here would my only option if I wanted a few hours out is full day care of childminders....

QuintessentialyHollow Mon 27-Feb-12 14:40:42

But, playing devils advocate (and going in a time machine back to the fifties wink )

How about if the OP ensures he finds better paid work that will enable his wife to luxuriate in sahm-hood in style!? Why stay in a low-income job?
Why not suggest you retrain, better your career prospects, while she also works, so you can get a bigger house, lunches out, days at the hairdressers, etc? Then for the NEXT child, she can become a real sahm...

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 14:41:26

You need to talk to each other.

Perhaps her understanding of your financial situation is vastly different to yours? Perhaps she's not happy with the nursery and reluctant to leave her DC there all day - and needs to look at what other options there are? Perhaps she needs to ask for part-time hours especially if she goes back initially or at least know that is an option which might work out better financially with childcare costs? Perhaps she need to look for a different job? Perhaps she in such a state about going back she she can't see beyond her fear?

I suggest you put aside your anger and try an non confrontational talk and try and find out what is going on and point out the implications of her current thinking ie not doing nursery, being short of money, you feeling resentful ect.

BeattieBow Mon 27-Feb-12 14:43:20

well if money's tight and she's at home, she should be looking after the baby full time imo.

As for whether she's entitled to stay at home, this is something for both of you to discuss. I do go out to work, and one of the factors in the pressure my partner feels under if he is the sole wage earner in the family. I am currently pg, and me and my partner had an understanding from before I got pg that I won't take much unpaid maternity leave as we can't really afford it. I would understand that he would be pissed off if I changed my mind.

LineRunner Mon 27-Feb-12 14:44:56

Message deleted by Mumsnet.

TheCrackFox Mon 27-Feb-12 14:46:49

Something doesn't add up here.

If you are a low income how can you possibly afford nursery? If your DW was desperate for some time to herself would it not make more sense to wait a few months until your child us old enough for playgroup which works out far, Far cheaper.

Also if you both gave badly paid jobs it would make more sense for your DP to look for evening and weekend work ther or negating the need for paid childcare altogether.

Pozzled Mon 27-Feb-12 14:47:37

All very strange... You say money is tight, but you're funding ten hours of nursery on only one low income. I struggle to see how you could do this. Are you sure your idea of 'tight' is the same as your dp's?

I think you need to go through your finances together, in an open and honest way. As things stand, how much disposable income do you have each month after all bills and nursery fees are paid? Can you both live happily on that amount? If so, nothing needs to change. If not, look at what the financial effect would be of stopping the nursery place. Then as a last resort look at your wife returning to work, but bear in mind childcare costs.

AvonCallingBarksdale Mon 27-Feb-12 14:47:58

OK, then, OP, in the spirit of your thread, I, too, am out! confused

crashdoll Mon 27-Feb-12 14:48:09

undercoverPrincess Where abouts are you? Approximately I mean, not your home address. smile

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep Mon 27-Feb-12 14:51:23

OK... I have a 16mo at home with me. Putting him in nursery 10hrs a week would absolutely fuck our finances, and DH is on what I'd describe as quite a good salary.

So how are you doing it at the minute? Either your income isn't as low as you say, or you have v. low rent/bills... you wouldn't get tax credits with an SAHP presumably? confused

everlong Mon 27-Feb-12 14:52:29

Bit confused why my message was deleted..

wannaBe Mon 27-Feb-12 14:53:10

where are these nurseries that take babies for only two hours a morning? All the nurseries I've ever encountered tend to run a session-based service where they will take a child for a morning, or afternoon. confused

Op - are you writing an article or a book?

choceyes Mon 27-Feb-12 14:53:58

Another one here struggling to understand why on earth are you paying for your 16 month old DC to go to nursery while your DW doesn't go to work??
If you had the money fair enough, it is nice to get a break (although even then, every day?), but when you are struggling financially?
This is a wind up, it has to be.

naturalbaby Mon 27-Feb-12 14:57:25

it's your money, stop paying for the nursery.
if she wants to be a sahm then tell her to stay at home and be a mum because you won't pay for someone else to do it for her.
unless she has really can't cope with being a mum for those extra few hours a week, in which case she should go back to work.

it's not rocket science, sit her down and go through your finances. point out that once your wage has covered the essentials e.g food, bills, rent/mortgage there is £xx left for clothes, toddler group, baby swimming, savings for a holiday, new washine machine, whatever..... and does she really think the majority of what's left should be spent on paying someone else to look after her child that she wants to stay at home to look after?

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 14:57:39

Well if the "I'm out comment" is indicative of your general style my sympathies lie with your wife, although TBH if this is real I'll eat my hat.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 14:58:13

@Malinois - ha I liked your comment ;)

How come this is only coming to a head when your DC is 16 months? Surely mat leave is only 12?

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep Mon 27-Feb-12 15:00:29

Oh right.

Fair enough then.

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 15:03:00

OP is back.

OP, why did you agree to nursery for 2 hours a day in the first place? Can you afford it? What reasons did your partner give? What has changed? Above all, WHY oh why would you need nursery for a 16 month old when a parent is at home and finances are tight?!?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:04:55

Just want to respond to a couple of comments that put my back up. I am on a relatively low income but am lucky in that my grandparents left me a house so we don't have rent/mortgage.
This is how we afford to pay the ten hours pw nursery. I'm in Holloway North London where plenty of nurseries/playgroups offer a few hours a day in the morning or afternoon.
Also, this is not a wind up, but I'd like to know why some think it is?
I said 'I'm out' because I'd received enough replies to get a feel for the general view.
Thanks.

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 15:06:53

So you can afford for your wife to be at home and have 2 hours a day break while your child is in nursery?

Right. That's different.

I expect DH (DAHD) would love a couple of hours off like that! Fair enough!

Is it that you would rather be at home and she works?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:07:51

Also, the reason why I agreed to nursery was so she could have a break for a few hours as she was finding it all a bit overwhelming at first. She was only on Maternity leave for 9 months but decided not to go back despite all her training (which to my mind is a nail in the coffin why small business' are wary of employing women of my partner's age - but I know that IS controversial and for a seperate discussion) ;)

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:08:40

Right, I really MUST stop now as I'll get in trouble here at work, and if I lose my job then that'll REALLY be the cherry on the cake ;)

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 15:09:26

People think it is a wind up becasue the way it was originally preseneted was improbable (you being on ow income and not able to afford nursery and yet your wife insisting on staying at home and putting your child in nursery for two hours).

Now it is something different: you can afford for your wife to be at home but have a couple of hours a day break (ie pay for nursery), but don't want her to/resent her being at home.

Is that right?

naturalbaby Mon 27-Feb-12 15:12:46

well either you can afford it or you can't. if you can't then you can't.
if she has no other support to help her look after your child then a few hours in childcare can be a good thing so what about cutting back to just a couple of days a week?

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 15:13:52

crashdoll I am in fairly rural Essex, I'm sure the childcare availability is better if I was to drive to the nearby town but that would defeat the object for me for a couple of hours 11months until preschool, also as she is my last I am enjoying spending time at home with her I just don't get much done what with school runs, working evenings and wasting time on the -www- smile

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:14:00

@Legallyblond, partly right. But money is so tight without her second income when our child gets free fifteen hour nursery in a few months time, we will struggle to cover the basics. I am resentful of the way that she feels she can change her mind and for all her new mum friends (who are a lot richer than us) see it as a god-given right to have all of the good times with a kid and expect to be provided for like it is the '50s, but in every other respect they take the piss out of us 'men' for being useless and only breadwinners. If this was how she felt all along then I would have questioned whether having kids at this particular point in time was a good idea.

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 15:17:27

Zealey the preschool funding is available the term after the child turns three, I believe there is some form of two year old funding but only available to families on income support in certain areas (postcode lottery).

IainDuncanShit Mon 27-Feb-12 15:18:14

OP I wish I could have a job which involved reading MN and posting eight times since about 1 O'clock util three.

It's hardly the "salt mines" you have spoken of, now, is it?

CagneyNLacey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:18:45

Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz I, too, am out.

WibblyBibble Mon 27-Feb-12 15:19:48

Do you count having a human being excruciatingly pushed through your genitals causing permanent physical damage to your body as 'good times with a kid' or is that bit just 'natural justice'/the 'god given right of men' that women should take the bad bits and then you get to share the good bits equally as you seem to want?

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 15:21:32

People think it is a wind up because no one in their right mind pays for nursery they don't need when they can't afford it.

But you can afford it which makes this entire threa rather pointless no?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:21:55

@WibblyBibble, our daughter was born by C-Section.

fabwoman Mon 27-Feb-12 15:22:06

If she was born to be a mother why is she sending the baby for more hours at nursery? confused

legallyblond Mon 27-Feb-12 15:23:06

@OP - word from the wise..... I would bow out fairly fast now if I were you....

crashdoll Mon 27-Feb-12 15:24:25

Why does she want to increase nursery hours if she was born to be a mother? If she wants to be a SAHM, then the nursery HAS to go as you clearly cannot afford it. She sounds like she wants her cake and eat it too.

IainDuncanShit Mon 27-Feb-12 15:27:56

Your response to wibbly - are you trying to say that a c-section isn't a real birth? That major abdominal surgery isn't serious or painful? confused

crashdoll Mon 27-Feb-12 15:31:09

I don't see what giving birth has to do with the price of eggs. This is about a woman insisting on wanting to be a SAHM yet wanting her partner to stump up even more money (which he said he cannot afford) to send the toddler she was 'born to mother' off to nursery for even longer! They made an agreement and she is backing out of it without any real reason as to why.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 15:32:07

Well, you do sound a bit of an arse, but actually yanbu. She doesn't have a god-given right to be a SAHP while you go out to work, and the two of you need to negotiate a mutually agreeable way forward.

You'll probably get further with this by talking to her about it than posting on here wink but if she refuses to have the discussion, then she is BVU and I guess you have a decision to make - either suck it up, or walk away. But even if you walk away, you will still have to support your child financially, so it would be in both your interests to reach a compromise.

Mind you, it sounds like there is no respect on either side in this relationship, so you might be better walking away after all.

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 15:34:25

Actually, I really feel for the OP. Firstly - she's gone back on their agreement, and secondly, I'd be bloody pissed off if I was paying for my child to be in nursery whilst the SAHP was having coffee with yummy mummies hmm

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 15:37:28

Here we go.... the man gets the battering as usual. Do you think it would be acceptable were it the other way around? The mother works outside the home full time, and it's ok for her to be paying for nursery fees while the SAHD has a couple of hours off every day to play xBox? I think not!

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 15:37:41

@Legallyblonde. Thanks for the advice. Bowing out. All the best x

lynniep Mon 27-Feb-12 15:39:47

http://www.mumsnet.com/Talk/going_back_to_work/1415913-Childcare-costs-are-incredible-how-do-so-many-women-afford-to-work

undercoverPrincess Mon 27-Feb-12 15:48:56

@lynniep - now i'm totally confused :-o

toomanycakestomake Mon 27-Feb-12 15:52:46

Eugh, you sound like an arse and a vile husband. particularly the way you refer to your child as 'the kid'.

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep Mon 27-Feb-12 15:55:24

AbbyAbsinthe virtually everyone has said it's not acceptable this way round, so I'm not sure where you see the man-bashing?

LineRunner Mon 27-Feb-12 15:56:15

To me it comes across as a wind up to me because the OP expresses no affection whatsoever (it seems to me) for his child or his partner.

LineRunner Mon 27-Feb-12 15:57:03

I think I may have added one too many 'to me'.... smile

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep Mon 27-Feb-12 15:58:53

There is a bit of a problem with the OP's slightly twattish way of expressing the situation, but I think we are mostly able to see past that?

Gribble Mon 27-Feb-12 16:02:47

somethings not right no shit sherlock

You are saying it will now be a struggle, mat leave is 12 months in totaL, and she has been off for 16, and she has now only jusT decided she doesnt want to go back confused

Surely you knew she wasnt going back at 12 months?? She must have told work she had quit??

Gribble Mon 27-Feb-12 16:04:15

not sure why he is getting a bashing for "the kid" tho. I call my DCs "the kiddies" as that is what they are.

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 16:05:08

Boulevard - I can't find the post now - I'm also at work wink - but there was something about him not understanding her situation as she was the one that suffered excruciating pain pushing a baby out of her vagina, and all that jazz. And then when he mentioned that she'd had a section, he was jumped on for that as well!

I know most people are in agreement on this thread. And fwiw, I do think the OP is coming across as a little bit of a twat wink. But in principle, he is right.

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 16:05:47

If the wife hates her job and will earn less than nursery fees, which judging from her being on a low income and them living in London she will then her going back to work will cost the OP even more which makes his point moot.

He is trying to start a fight.

Yabu for saying that having a c-section does not damage a person's body.

Pozzled Mon 27-Feb-12 16:07:49

You're saying that when your child getsthe free nursery funding, you will struggle to make ends meet? But you can cope now? Again, I don't understand how that can be.

You may have a genuine point here, and I would guess you're trying not to give too much away, but you can't expect posters to respond sensibly If you're not prepared to engage and answer questions.

I still say that if you're unhappy with the situation you need a frank conversation with your DP. But you need to be clear about what the problem is- is it finances? Is it that your DP gets more free time than you? Is it that you feel taken for granted? Either way, talk to her.

squeakytoy Mon 27-Feb-12 16:09:54

I dont think the OP is being unreasonable at all. I know quite a few of my husband's mates who have found themselves in almost the same situation.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 16:14:22

Yabu for saying that having a c-section does not damage a person's body.

Where did the OP say that? confused

And in any case, WTF does giving birth have to do with the decision to SAH or WOH? I had a c-section, but don't regard it as a license not to contribute equally to family life.

Nothing about the OP has flashed up my troll radar.

My ds is 3 in April. As he misses the cut off for a funded place by 16 days (grr!) he isn;t going to nursery till Sept.

I am a sahm out of agreement as we have 3 children & childcare for 2 in the holidays was expensive enough without a 3rd.

Is your dp depressed? I am wondering why your child is in nursery for 2 hours 5 days a week.

Toddler groups & going to the park will happen though if you're a sahm. And being a sahm isn't always a walk in the park either.

Try & talk to her. Ask her why she isn't going back to work. Your child is settled in nursery & would therefore ne no problems settling when your dp goes back to work.

I'll be honest, wouldn't even occur to me to put my child in paid for childcare if I wasn't working!

tomverlaine Mon 27-Feb-12 16:20:01

I posted a while back with the reverse situation - DP is SAHD but DS is in nursery 2 days a week (and goes to sports centre creche as well!)
MN conclusion was that DP was cocklodger waste of space etc... obviously i didn't realise that giving birth gave a completely different answer...

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 16:21:23

Youre not skint! Dont believe a word of it. When my first was born i was very ill for the first few years but couldnt afford to pay for even an hours childcare even though i was desperate and not coping at all . . . now THAT is skint.

If you were really skint you would have used the nursery one or two days a week, not everyday!

Having a free house to live in will massively reduce your out goings so youd have to be earning a seriously piss poor wage to struggle as you make out you are.

I suspect that you are not that poor but are having trouble adjusting to having a bit less to spend on luxuries or whatever and so you blame your wife. Who by the sounds of it hasnt coped that well the last 16 months.

You resent her lifestyle that is clear. Two hours goes very quickly though you know. How many of those days does she spend cleaning and shopping ironing and running errands etc (bet some of them are yours) and how many doing things for herself like swimming?

Its a shame that you see no value in the job she does as a mum and that you see no benefit in her being with you daughter during the day. You havent actually mentioned that at all . . . just gone on about how tough you have it and how lazy she is. You sound rather like a spoilt child and i wonder if thats why she wont discuss it with you . . . she knows theres no point.

igggi Mon 27-Feb-12 16:21:31

Glad to hear c sections involve no excruciating pain or long recovery times!

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 16:26:41

He didn't say that.

And, tomverlaine - precisely my point.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 16:28:10

TOMVER your situation sounds different if only for the fact that with the child in nursery for two full days he could go out to work. Try fitting a job into two hours!

OrmIrian Mon 27-Feb-12 16:28:45

I agree the OP sounds a bit resentful and petulant. But I can't say I entirely blame him. The baby is 16m old so there is no reason for his partner not to go back to work - apart from the fact that she doesn't want to. Well, guess what! Lots of people would rather not, but have to. And because of this unilateral decision the family will be short of money - and whether you think that is a problem depends I think of whether you;ve ever experienced it. Worrying about money can take over your life.

I'd be feeling resentful and petulant if I felt I had been railroaded into a position I didn't want to occupy,

This subject needs to be discussed. And it may well end up being clear that both parents working full-time isn't going to be worthwhile fi you factor in childcare costs. In which case you can decide between you who is going to wrk, or whether one or both of you work parttime. It shouldn't be a fait accompli just because one partner says it is.

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 16:34:52

Orm there is a very good reason for the OP's wife not going back to work and that is her income v the cost of child care.

I simply do not believe that someone on a "low income" can earn enough to pay FT London nursery fees.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 16:35:55

I dont think its that though ORM. Theres a good chance that her wages wouldnt cover the nursery fees so there would be no benefit in her returning to work right now.

I think the op is just resentful unappreciative and jealous. I bet he knows they wont be any or much better off if she goes back to work but like a spoilt child would want her to go back anyway. Just so that he doesnt feel so hard done by . . . because of course providing childcare is so easy hmm especially for a mum who hasnt been coping.

OrmIrian Mon 27-Feb-12 16:42:02

As I said, there should still be discussion on the subject. And the possibility looked into that perhaps there is a different way of doing this than the OP working full-time and the mother not working at all.

How would you feel if you had been pushed into that situation and then told the goal posts had been moved?

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 16:42:26

Sara you are right. I earn an ok wage but with the cost of travelling to work and work clothes etc i would actually make a loss in london where i live if i were to pay nursery as well.

igggi Mon 27-Feb-12 16:43:15

His c section comment was completely irrelevant, and was intended as a come back to the comment about his wife having had to go through labour.

toomanycakestomake Mon 27-Feb-12 16:43:57

He sounds like he doesn't like his wife very much.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 16:44:40

I don't think the OP is being at all unreasonable. She's gone back on the agreement without any room for negotiation. She said she'd return to work and she's simply refusing to consider any means by which she could do this. If she's "born to be a mother" she can look after the child f/t. She sounds like a freeloader to me and I don't blame him for being pissed off. I'd like to know why he's doing the cooking if she gets two child free hours a day while he's working.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 16:45:56

Orm I think its unfair to say the op was pushed into having a child. He made a decision of his own free will and needs to deal with whatever that brings. As for the goal posts being moved . . . i would roll with the punches so to speak as that is what all parents have to do.

TheCrackFox Mon 27-Feb-12 16:47:57

They dont have a mortgage or rent so realistically you are filthy rich compared with most people with small children.

Op - has your DP thought about retraining as it seems she can't stand get job or at least going part-time?

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 16:48:12

needs to deal with whatever that brings

including the dishonesty of his partner?

ENormaSnob Mon 27-Feb-12 16:48:24

Agree with orm.

Yanbu

OriginalJamie Mon 27-Feb-12 16:49:07

She is looking after the child. The nursery is very part time.

OP you need to talk realistically about this. If money is the issue then fair enough. I am disliking your tone about being a Sahm being easy peasy, though.

I understand your resentment that the goal posts eem to have changed, but unless you start from a position of valuing what she does then this discussion will go badly

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 17:01:06

Ilovesooty what dishonesty? rolling with the punches means realising that you might not know how you are going to feel after the baby comes and dealing with unexpected things like the mother not coping well. was she being dishonest not to be able to predict her feelings or by not coping? things which happen to many parents.

I wonder whether she had pnd?

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 17:02:01

Oh FFS she hasnt been "dishonest" she has changed her mind. Lots of women do after they've actually had a baby.

This whole discussion is pointless without the OP confirming what his wife earns and the cost of childcare. Which he won't because it'll show him up for the arse he is.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 17:02:02

Original he clearly does not value it.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 17:07:49

she's arbitrarily decided that no, she enjoys being a stay at home mum, and if I don't like it I can go shit. No discussion, no compromise

Changing your mind is one thing. refusal to discuss or renegotiate a previously discussed arrangement is dishonest in my view.

OrmIrian Mon 27-Feb-12 17:09:45

But 'changing her mind' is not a valid reason if the results are financially problematic.

If she has severe PND I could understand that there is more in play than merely not wanting to go back to work. But the OP hasn't said that. Finding it difficult does not neccessarily = PND.

I agree that we don't know all the whys and wherefores, and the sums may well not work out, and I also think the OP's tone is a bit off. But I take issue with the assumption that a woman can just decide unilaterally that she will just stay at home with a child and that's OK because she's a mother, and the other partner just has to suck it up.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 17:11:58

I take issue with the assumption that a woman can just decide unilaterally that she will just stay at home with a child and that's OK because she's a mother, and the other partner just has to suck it up

So do I. And I agree with the earlier poster who wondered if some of the responses would be different if the genders were reversed.

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 17:14:51

I would strongly suspect that the OP's wife has a far better understanding of the fact that her "low income" won't get anywhere near covering the cost of a London nursery and is therefore sick to death of the OP banging on about how sexist it is that she gets to go for a coffee with her "mummy friends", and thus refuses to engage.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 17:15:04

Ilovesooty nothing in the way op has been on here suggests to me that he would be open to discussion. i would bet money that he just keeps repeating the agreement and doesnt listen to a word she says.

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 17:15:21

Exactly! It would be an entirely different story if the genders were reversed. If the father of the child had agreed to be WAHD after a certain period and then point blank refused to go back to work, and left his DW to pick up the tab financially... he would definitely be classed as lazy.

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 17:16:03

Orm the trouble is that the OP hasn't actually said much at all hmm

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 17:16:48

Orm but the finances may very well not be better if she were at work. you keep assuming that they will.

Chandon Mon 27-Feb-12 17:17:10

but sara, it would surely be better, financially to work AND have kid in nursery, than to have kids in nursery and not work????

Guess it depends on the amount of hours.

guess it also depends on how much responsibility the OP takes for childcare and housework if DP goes back to work.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 17:18:27

He says she's refused to discuss it. We have no knowledge whatever of what has actually taken place and it doesn't seem appropriate to make the assumption that she's tried to engage in discussion while he's refused to listen.

AbbyAbsinthe - exactly.

SaraBellumHertz Mon 27-Feb-12 17:21:13

Chandon exactly it depends on the hours.

And the OP's not saying so we shall all just argue hypotheticals amongst ourselves.

toddlerama Mon 27-Feb-12 17:26:09

Anyone think the OP might have actively encouraged 'the kid' starting nursery because he assumed that it would mean DW going back to work? Except DW isn't ready, and now he resents the nursery fees? More communication needed between you both and on the the thread. We can't judge hard enough help without more details!

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 17:38:06

Ilovesooty i can assume that he wouldnt be open to discussion based on the things hes written on here.

NowThenWreck Mon 27-Feb-12 17:40:41

See, if the OP and his wife have a house in Holloway which they don't have to pay for, I think that they should be able to afford, even on one wage to have a child in nursery a but, say 6 hours a week.
Housing costs are so massive, espeically in London, that that must free up some money.

I don't think it's fair if OP's wife won't discuss the matter, of course it's not.
But, he is coming over as rather nasty.
If I do reverse the situation, and I think, OK, I am a working mother, with a 16 month old baby and no mortgage.
My Partner is at home with the baby all the time, except for two hours a day. I come home to, presumably a clean house, with the laundry done, the dinner made (in London few working people get home before 6 pm),the shopping done etc, I really don't think I would resent that.

In fact, I would bloody love it! (Where so I sign?!)

OP's attitude to looking after a child in general is a bit odd, and it strikes me that he may never have done it himself for a whole day.

If my fantasy partner did spend some of his time having coffee with other parents of small children, and going to the park, then great! I wouldnt want my partner to be miserable and without friends.

Imo, it the lack of communication about this that is the issue, not the money.

ilovebabytv Mon 27-Feb-12 17:41:08

YANBU, you and your dp agreed to have a child and the understanding was that she would go back to work after maternity leave. For her now to say she doesnt want to go back to work is unfair. Its not about whether you can afford it or not imo but what you both agree is fair. I get that you are on a low income but can afford some luxuries (childcare for 10 hours a week) because you dont have any rent/mortgage to pay. If you both agreed to it then great, she could be a SAHM but you made your feelings clear at the start what was expected. And I dont believe anyone who says that being a SAHM is hard work. I was off on maternity leave for 13 months and I enjoyed every minute of it, and it was coffee mornings, walks in the park etc. Imo since your wife cant financially support herself by being a SAHM, and you don't agree to be the sole financial provider, i think she needs to suck it up and go back to work.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 17:42:55

But I take issue with the assumption that a woman can just decide unilaterally that she will just stay at home with a child and that's OK because she's a mother, and the other partner just has to suck it up.

Well said.

ilovebabytv Mon 27-Feb-12 17:44:52

^^I agree with this also.

callmemrs Mon 27-Feb-12 17:47:15

She sounds really selfish and unreasonable.

However- I think you were wrong to have a child with this woman if you 'weren't really fussed' about it. Having a child is a huge commitment and you should have not agreed to have one until you were totally sure you wanted one, and until you had agreement in advance about how to manage the caring and earning

You are not at all unreasonable in wanting to share the earning- I think being sole earner must be an enormous burden. I wouldn't want it myself so have never foisted it on my husband. Often being sole earner pushes that person higher up the ladder with longer hours and more stress, so they have less time to enjoy the home stuff anyway.

So YANBU in wanting a better and fairer balance in your life.

ComposHat Mon 27-Feb-12 17:47:56

If the situation is as the OP describes it seems he is quite frankly being played for a twat. It seems that his wife wants little more from him than his sperm and to continue paying the bills.

This isn't an 'anti-SAHP' thing (not on my part anyway.) Of course I can see the value in their work, but I would expect that the minimum that a 'Stay at home parent' would do is to stay at home and err...parent, rather than dumping their child in a nursery on someone else's dollar.

Iteotwawki Mon 27-Feb-12 18:01:40

There's a lot of assuming that the DW does other things during the day like cooking, cleaning etc while the OP is at work - I assume because most functional families who think of themselves as a team split life this way (if one person woh, the other does the house work).

However upthread the OP made a comment that it was just "her and the baby" while he was expected to "earn money, do the cooking and the house jobs" - this is more about fair division of labour.

OP, I don't think you're being unreasonable to want your partner to pull her weight, whether that's by getting back into paid employment or picking up the slack at home so you don't have to.

If the genders were reversed you'd be advised to stop washing her clothes, stop cooking for her (just you & baby) and only clean up your own areas.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 18:06:13

Well said nowthenwreck

OriginalJamie Mon 27-Feb-12 18:06:21

I agree with Quint

OP - surprising to be out at such an early stage?

OriginalJamie Mon 27-Feb-12 18:07:12

This all just pissing in the wind because the OP has no interest in engaging properly.

Wonder if he is like this with his wife?

ENormaSnob Mon 27-Feb-12 18:08:03

If she had a penis she would be a cock lodger.

Leave her.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 18:10:30

If the situation is as the OP describes it seems he is quite frankly being played for a twat. It seems that his wife wants little more from him than his sperm and to continue paying the bills

I'm afraid that's how I read it too, and if the OP isn't coming over too well I suspect that's because he's pissed off. And don't forget the fact that she's nicely set up in a rent and mortgate free house that came out of his money, while she's doing precious little to contribute, if he does cooking and housework as well as working full time.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 18:11:51

If she had a penis she would be a cock lodger

Yes, I suspect that's what most posters would be saying.

OriginalJamie Mon 27-Feb-12 18:12:51

He's not coming over at all. He does the classic posting of a few short, implicatory (is that a word?) posts, then says he's buggering off .

I suspect we are being had.

garlicbutter Mon 27-Feb-12 18:20:43

Considering he only posted at lunchtime, then said around 3pm he'd better get off Mumsnet as at work, isn't it a bit soon to assume he's flounced and/or retired giggling?

YANBU in my opinion, either, Zealey. I agree with the many replies pointing out that possession of a vagina doesn't entitle one to waft around at home all day, especially if you're doing your fair share of the home stuff. I think you need to go a bit gently with her though. Shared responsibilities and all that ... Have you spent much time alone with your daughter? Perhaps the missus feels she is doing too much as things are; small children are a full-time job and you don't get to clock off in the evening.

Good luck with this. It would be nice to hear how things go!

LineRunner Mon 27-Feb-12 19:13:52

OP says he's off.

If the genders were reversed....

and a woman came on here saying she wasn't that bothered about having the 'kid', was lacking in affection about the child's other parent and all their efforts, was acting resentful about cooking ...

Yeah, she'd get a really easy ride.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 19:31:00

Originaljamie . . . yes i would imagine this is how he is with his wife.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 19:36:53

Finished work now, so had time to bath our DD and put her to bed. I've enjoyed reading the comments in the break, some totally judgmental (which says more about the commentor's personal unhappiness), some genuinely fair, others really generous and helpful.
Thanks for all of them.
I'd just like to point out, now I have a glass of wine in my hand, that my partner is a lovely person who I deeply care for, it is just this one issue of the unfairness of it all that the dice seems always to be loaded in the mother's favour when it comes to any sacred issue involving what's best for the child, and the father is just a simpleton who could never hope to understand the complexity.
I'm happy to provide for my little family, but I just resent the implication that she can have it all and if I complain then I'm somehow innately sexist, brutish or being unreasonable. I know parenthood is not business (thank god) but breaking a contract after you've got what you want seems unfair in any sphere of existance.
Zealey x

LineRunner Mon 27-Feb-12 19:42:36

Have you shown her the thread?

callmemrs Mon 27-Feb-12 19:45:19

Yes, entirely agree. You are equal parents, and there is no more reason why she should get to swan about choosing how she spends her time, than you should. I think you need to sit down and spell things out. Tell her you want to go part time and share earning and caring responsibilities. She's taking the piss at the moment and not only is that unfair on you, but it's also not a great role model for your child, to see one parent choosing the life style they want at the expense of the other parent

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 19:46:04

@LineRunner. No, like I say, now I have a glass of wine in hand and it's all gone silent upstairs, I think it would be unnecessarily provocative. I was just glad of the insight from a group of random 'mums' to see if I was being an arse or whether she had a case to answer too.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 19:46:28

I find it bizaar for it to be referred to as breaking a contract. What a strange way to think about starting a family.

Is there no part of you which is able to see that a persons feelings might change aftet having a baby? That what seemed a good idea before the baby was born doesnt afterwards?

Do you have no flexibilty at all and no tolerance for change?

callmemrs Mon 27-Feb-12 19:58:19

Don't you think a Fathers feelings might change after having a baby too?? Maybe he doesn't want to be seen as cash machine, simply there to finance her desire to stay home.
I can't be doing with this notion that just because you have a vagina you're allowed to choose to do what you want, and if you have a penis you bankroll it.

The ops child is 16 months, well past the age when the mother could have returned to work after maternity leave. Why should she be allowed to make the decision to stop earning unilaterally? That's not a partnership- its a dictatorship i

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 20:00:11

Further more to that do you have the rest of your lives mapped out in this fashion . . .

will stay in current job until nov 2015
will buy new car only in the month of october
wifey will get a new haircut in one years time
dc will learn to hula hoop next christmas eve

. . . i honestly couldnt live with the lack of flexibility and being held to an agreement she made probably about 3 years ago now, before she even realised what she was getting into.

In her shoes if you had tried to tie me to such an inflexible agreement i would have chosen not to have a child with you.

Life isnt like this. Things change and you need to be able to change with them.

Your bitchy comment about the commentors personal happiness gives a good snap shot of what you are like and i can see why she doesnt wish to discuss things with you.

Mn on the othet hand will very often have opinions you dont agree with . . . its best not to act bratty about it. I am glad there were some posts you liked but dare say they were the ones agreeing with you.

Btw what does you wife earn when shes working? Not that i expect you to be honest about it now.

YuleingFanjo Mon 27-Feb-12 20:01:06

op, how many times have you bowed out of the thread now?

fwiw - I think yanbu but as often happens in relationships you both failed to discuss the reality of having a family. Yourr mistake is having a baby when you didn't really want to.

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep Mon 27-Feb-12 20:06:06

The thing is, for the vast majority of the mums on here, not working AND having your child in nursery is an unimaginably extravagant luxury.

So from our POV, you came on here saying, 'we are skint and DW refuses to go back to work, but we can afford to waste money on unnecessary childcare'.

Hence all the confused and hmm

You are currently running the house and funding said childcare on a single salary. So ditch the nursery, wife gets to stay at home, frees up some cash, everyone's happy.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 20:08:08

@Poostickseverywhere 'In her shoes if you had tried to tie me to such an inflexible agreement i would have chosen not to have a child with you.'

The feeling is quite mutual. You don't sound like a very happy person. sad

kitsmummy Mon 27-Feb-12 20:08:41

Jeez, the Op is now getting slated for bowing out - perhaps he has a life and cannot spend hours non-stop on MN?

Op, yanbu and I'm not surprised you're particularly pissed off with her. If you had been the one to suddenly decide you no longer want to work and be a SAHD and your wife had to go back full time, I don't think you'd be hearing many supportive comments from people here.

Tell your DW that she needs to either go back to work or to drop the nursery hours at the very least.

Oh and the assumptions about it not being worth the DW working due to nursery fees - you can't just make up assumptions to back up your argument - no-one knows how much DW earnt - £25k is a low income to many people yet I imagine it would probably cover nursery fees.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 20:12:33

I was advised to bow out by a wise poster who said I was inviting a vaginal-jihad upon myself by not towing the party line. I took that advice. But I just wanted to come back to thank everyone who offered constructive comments.

callmemrs Mon 27-Feb-12 20:13:14

The op said he's low waged, so even if the woman hasn't got a great earning capacity, it's perfectly reasonable for them to both work part time and share earning and caring .

Like kits mummy says, it a guy came on, saying since becoming a dad he wanted to ditch work, and choose to do as he wants all day, while wife has to work full time to fund it- there would be uproar.

Whatever happened to equality? Or are some people really stuck in some 1950s timewarp?

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 20:13:28

Oh dont worry i had guessed the unhappy person comment was aimed at me . . . i disagree with you and you dont like that.

Your poor wife . . .

rhondajean Mon 27-Feb-12 20:16:23

I think zealey is right.

There was an agreement between the two of them and she reneged on it.

I'd like to see MN react if a female poster said her male partner decided to give up work and it sent them into financial hardship, and didnt consilt her, he would be called feckless, thoughtless, manipulative, controlling..lBut regardless of their financial situation, they had an agreement and one of them has no right to decide to change that without the others agreement.

It's totally irrelevant who have birth as when she decided to get pregnant, unless she is sorely lacking In basic Education she knew that was down to her to do, and also, not everyone has a horrible time giving birth and physical and emotional trauma to live on for years, some of us get on with it just fine, so whoever is going on about that, please stop presuming to speak for all of us.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 20:17:04

Actually its rather bizaar to announce that someone must be an unhappy person just because they dont share your opinions!

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 20:17:33

its best not to act bratty about it. I am glad there were some posts you liked but dare say they were the ones agreeing with you

I don't think he's "acted bratty". He made a point of offering thanks for all comments.

As for the dig about only acknowledging posts which agreed with him (which I don't think he has), plenty of AIBU posters do that.

OriginalJamie Mon 27-Feb-12 20:19:09

I find the way you refer to her strange.
And I find your use of the term vaginal jihad even worse.

To coin a phrase, I'm off. All sympathy gone, mate.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 20:20:20

I'd like to see MN react if a female poster said her male partner decided to give up work and it sent them into financial hardship, and didnt consilt her, he would be called feckless, thoughtless, manipulative, controlling

Espicially if the child was at nursery two hours a day and said father used the time to amuse himself with his friends.

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 20:20:47

The bratty comment was due to him referring to the posters unhappiness . . . of the posts he doesnt agree with that is.

OldLadyKnowsNothing Mon 27-Feb-12 20:21:16

I thought "vaginal jihad" was quite funny, actually! grin

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 20:21:17

especially blush

GlueSticksEverywhere Mon 27-Feb-12 20:23:13

Im off due to being convinced by the ops tone that hes an arsehole!

ArtexMonkey Mon 27-Feb-12 20:24:29

I'm confused, don't you have to pay maternity pay back if you don't go back to work?

I think someone's having us on here.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 20:30:05

@oldladyknows - thanks. I meant it light-heartedly, but without wishing to start trolling, my issue with Gluestickseverywhere was making it personal saying she pity my wife and she herself, yes she the mighty Gluestickseverywhere would not choose to have a child with me. Oh boo-hoo, guess I'm really missing out there ;)

frankie3 Mon 27-Feb-12 20:32:23

YABU

Having a baby together is not a Contract. Many people change their minds about things when they have huge life changes. Your partner would probably have gone back to work if you were seriously having financial trouble. It does not sound like you are as you have no rent or mortgage to pay and you are paying for your "kid" to go to nursery. You only have a right to be annoyed if you told your dp that you could definitely not afford nursery every day and she still went ahead with it.

butterfingerz Mon 27-Feb-12 20:39:30

Zealot, sorry Zealey, damn iPhone!

Why don't you get a proper job then and stop whinging? It's a fathers job to provide for his family, man up! Maybe you're as guilty as your DP for seeing her as a paycheck.

Or do a runner, maybe David Cameron could do a better job of looking after your family.

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 20:43:10

LOL @ butterfingerz grin

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 20:55:00

@butterfingerz - I genuinely don't understand your post, please clarify. Are you saying it's ok for her to see ME as a paycheck?

Eurostar Mon 27-Feb-12 21:00:19

How would you like your future to look OP?

Are you married by the way?

butterfingerz Mon 27-Feb-12 21:07:32

So what if she does, from now until retirement you are a bloody paycheck whether you like it or not...

Look around you darling, that's what men do, you bring in the bacon...

You don't even have a mortgage or rent to pay!?!

What is your problem again?

Oh sorry, you wanna sit around and drink latte all day like your DP, who would you drink it with? The other men that should be working for their families.

Thank god my man isn't a fanny like you.

ChocolateIsAFoodGroup Mon 27-Feb-12 21:08:59

Am I being thick or isn't nursery covered? (I don't live in the UK). If it is, and there's no money being put towards nursery fees, doesn't it change up the argument a bit? (Sorry if this has been gone over in the earlier part of the thread).

Also, are you planning to have another DC? If you are, what arrangements do you think you might make for that child?

I still think the best plan is for the two of you to collect receipts for a month (we do this), write down what you spend, and see what money is going for what, and who need to earn what to cover your lifestyle.

Sorry if this sounds a bit simplistic, but I think starting from the basics might be worth a try?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:10:21

@Eurostar. I'd like to have enough money to be able to travel with my partner and our DD, maybe teaching English as a foreign language (TEFL) in amazingly beautiful places in the world. I'd like to get over this hump with her, and reignite what brought us together in the first place - the fact she is ffing sexy inside and out. The fact our DD could grow to be a self-confident and happy person through her travelling experiences around the world. Enough money to not have to do the things we hate and enough love to not have to get bogged down in painful conversations borne out of a lack of money.
Simple dreams of the future... I hope...

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:11:05

@Eurostar... should've added, no we are not married.

CremeEggThief Mon 27-Feb-12 21:12:55

Could you try talking to your partner about the possibility of her seeking work for 1-2 days per week? 16-20 hours with a childminder wouldn't be much more than 10 hours at Nursery, would it? I do think you need to talk to each other. This resentment isn't doing any of you any good.

Eurostar Mon 27-Feb-12 21:13:31

What's the going rate for rental for a house in Holloway these days? I seem to remember that someone I know was paying about 3k a month.

I have a solution for you OP - take your 36k a year from rental, move the family out to a small flat in a far cheaper area, get a part-time job to keep your hand in and enjoy bringing up your DC...

Eurostar Mon 27-Feb-12 21:14:45

sorry, just read your post... why not rent out your house and go travelling now then?

garlicbutter Mon 27-Feb-12 21:14:49

Well, I think butterfingerz has shown us the 1950s view of family roles, in case anybody was still in doubt.

garlicbutter Mon 27-Feb-12 21:16:29

I do like Euro's suggestion smile

It's brilliant!

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:16:40

@Butterfingerz - you sound so angry. I imagine your man probably isn't a fanny, but with a ballbuster like you he must certainly be pussy-whipped ;)

Pumpster Mon 27-Feb-12 21:19:03

So how much does nursery cost you atm? And didn't you start a thread about childcare costs?

NonnoMum Mon 27-Feb-12 21:19:49

Zealey - this isn't for real, right?

"I wasn't fussed about having children"

"the kid"

Are you really referring to your beautiful baby in that way?

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Mon 27-Feb-12 21:22:31
Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:23:01

@Eurostar. That is a good idea, I'll look into it tomorrow. BTW, I should've been more honest: it's only a flat in Holloway, but we could still get about £950 a month for it. But it isn't as simple as that, the flat is real old and we can't afford to do it up. (I'm not moaning as I really how fucking lucky I am to have it) but to rent it out there is so much that'll go wrong with it, if we are away there is no 'slush fund' to pay for repairs from broken cooker to leaky roof or electrics).

butterfingerz Mon 27-Feb-12 21:23:06

1950s or 2012, who gives a shit. Why is ok for men to have become so infantile while women pick up the slack in order to provide for their families? God, women truly have to do it all these days, is that equality?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:24:57

@Pumpster. Yes that was a thread I started this afternoon. I wanted to know how people afforded childcare when I AM FINDING IT SO TOUGH

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 21:25:46

Where did the OP or anyone else suggest that the woman should "do it all"?

MeltedChocolate Mon 27-Feb-12 21:26:38

I read through and not once thought yabu

It sounds shitty of her, YANBU

butterfingerz Mon 27-Feb-12 21:29:52

Yeah probably but he's a real man so he can take it... and hell would freeze over before he fantacised about being a SAHD.

Eurostar Mon 27-Feb-12 21:29:58

It sounds like you feel very trapped OP? Your DW going to work and then seeing all of her wages go back out on childcare wouldn't improve your financial situation or get you nearer to your dream but perhaps then you would feel less alone in your struggle?

I can't imagine this is doing much good for your intimate relations either as it seems that your partner might want more DC and you feel in no way ready for more responsibility.

toddlerama Mon 27-Feb-12 21:30:49

Well you'd have £950 in hand immediately to add to the 'slush fund'. Even if you were renting a smaller place elsewhere for £500, you'd have £450 to put away. You'd be looking at a decent income in no time from that.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 21:31:17

So SAHDs aren't "real men"? What a peculiar POV.

aldiwhore Mon 27-Feb-12 21:33:28

Your wife wants to be a housewife, not a stay at home mum, because when there's no child in the house you're not doing the actual job of parenting.

Given that all mums are mum 100% of the time whether they work or not, as a SAHM (rather than a housewife) I look on my role as childcare provider, and if there's no child, and we're struggling financially (or even if we're not but all the burdern is on DH) then I should work.

Unfortunately reality is not as straight forward as that. Because my youngest child is only away from home between 9am and 11.30am. Try getting a job for 2 1/2 hours a day. (The reason I am a SAHM is partly choice, partly a wish to avoid childcare... my choice, there's no right or wrong) Even if I could, well my DH would still have to do the same hours, because there's no way he'd be able to reduce them.

I agree with whitetrash if being a mum is her absolute vocation, if she loves it so much, if you, as a family unit are finding it a stretch to afford nursery fees on top of all the other household bills, then either your wife has to stop the nursery, or get a job.

Please though, even though YANBU, don't dismiss how full on and hard work being a SAHM can be... okay, coffee mornings (you get a coffee break I assume) lunch (same), a timetable that's guided by a small person's needs... all lovely, all perks of the unpaid job... but we don't get sick pay, holiday pay, any pay, the day starts early and finishes late. I've had 'real' jobs too, and in some ways, this is the hardest because we're not stinking filthy rich and cannot afford luxuries (not complaining, our choice).

Chynah Mon 27-Feb-12 21:44:06

YADNBU! A child is a joint commitment and you should both be trying to provide for it as best you can. If she wants to bea mummy full time then that doesnt mean sticking it in nursery and doing house stuff. Fine if you can afford it but if not she should get a job and help support her DP - why should he be doing all the work.

Eurostar Mon 27-Feb-12 21:45:21

I'm starting to worry that butterfingerz is the OP's DP!

LineRunner Mon 27-Feb-12 21:47:08

butterfingerz is the OP's editor wanting the thread to liven up a bit before the 11pm for the reaction-to-Panorama deadline. <taps nose>

auntpetunia Mon 27-Feb-12 21:47:51

Eurostar having read all of this I was just wondering the same...

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 21:49:08

Your partner would probably have gone back to work if you were seriously having financial trouble. It does not sound like you are as you have no rent or mortgage to pay and you are paying for your "kid" to go to nursery. You only have a right to be annoyed if you told your dp that you could definitely not afford nursery every day and she still went ahead with it.

I don't really understand this point of view tbh. Of course things change, and zealey's DP might not have known how she would feel till she had the baby, but I think the OP still has every right to be annoyed at his partner's assumption that he will bankroll her lifestyle choices - regardless of whether he can afford to or not.

What if he suddenly decided, without any consultation, that he was going to quit his job and stay at home. Would his DP have a right to be annoyed? You bet she would, so why any different for the OP?

As for butterfingerz - I am genuinely confused. confused Is she for real or is she being ironic?

NowThenWreck Mon 27-Feb-12 21:49:17

Good point about the coffee break aldi.

I guess the grass is always greener. Personally I would hate to be a SAHM (even though I was one for a while, not out of choice and found it really hard. )

Going out to work is energising for me (if knackering because I do the childcare, the housework, shopping, cleaning and bring in moneyas a LP) so I find it weird when men sometimes say
"Oh she's fannying about having lovely coffee mornings and going to playgroups" when, If I had had the choice, I would have been the one at work, and had a lovely partner to do all the grunt work of parenting and making my dinner for me for when I got home
You need to have very clearly defined roles I think, and to have empathy with each other.

skybluepearl Mon 27-Feb-12 21:50:37

I think if money is tight you could look to give up the nursery place and have wife look after toddler full time. Yes this could mean attending coffee mornings and drinking tea sometimes. Don't you get a daily hour off at lunch times and fag breaks? Anyway back to the matter in hand. What is best for the kid? I wouldn't be happy for a nursery to raise my kid.

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:51:15

@butterfingerz. Sure, he sounds like a charming fellow, and I'm sure he doesn't pistol-whip you on a friday night if his dinner isn't ready when he gets home from the pub all liquored-up on his massive masculinity either? Jeez

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 21:53:52

I don't think butterfingerz is really worth getting worked up about. She's obviously being deliberately provocative.

skybluepearl Mon 27-Feb-12 21:54:16

Just read you have not rent or mortgage!!!!! That means life must be much easier financially and there is a choice about what you can do. What does the child need? What will give your child a balanced steady bonded start to life? Why don't you value child rearing?

Zealey Mon 27-Feb-12 21:54:48

In case anyone is interested I've got to sign off now because I'm going to spend some quality time with my partner. But I'll check back in the morning if I'm able so please keep the positive comments, the constructive comments, the comments I disagree with and respect and the predictable bitterness haters ;)
Thanks.

ilovesooty Mon 27-Feb-12 21:57:34

Don't you get a daily hour off at lunch times

My official lunch break is half an hour and I'm lucky if I get that.

BooMagoo Mon 27-Feb-12 21:59:37

You're dreaming of the life that my student sons will take up. YANBU for expecting DP to pull her weight,but you must have both taken on parenthood far too young. Calling yourself a SAHM doesn't cut it,when you send your 16 month child to nursery,and don't work. I do take your side in this OP,but you are both being unrealistic.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:00:21

Just an aside, but why does the issue of coffee breaks/fag breaks/lunch breaks seem to come up in every discussion about SAHPs/WOHPs? I really don't get why it's relevant!

Fwiw, I don't get coffee breaks in work & never have had them - I get in five minutes early to make a drink and then take it to my desk. Lunch is a ten-minute affair at my desk, usually taken while reading e-mails. And I don't smoke so no fag breaks. Tbh, I don't know anyone in my office who takes a lunchbreak - legally, we have to record that we have taken one, but we all know if we did, we'd just be going home later in the day.

On the positive side, I do get to go to the toilet on my own grin

Apologies for the thread hijack!

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:02:38

X post with ilovesooty

Maryz Mon 27-Feb-12 22:04:49

I assume your daughter is in nursery a couple of hours a day because the original plan was that she should be prepared for when your partner went back to work - and that would make sense.

But now she has decided to stay at home long term, I assume your dd no longer needs to go to nursery until the free place kicks in when she is three - that would save a few quid for the moment.

callmemrs Mon 27-Feb-12 22:06:10

Honeyandhaycorns- hear hear! Its hilarious when you see people banging on about how going to work is easy in comparison with the hard grind of staying at home. Coffee breaks, leisurely lunches are always mentioned- and I've even seen people claim that the daily commute is some sort of tranquil 'time off' !
Yeah right!!

aldiwhore Mon 27-Feb-12 22:11:51

Ilovesooty I'm not saying my choice is harder by any means, there's pros and cons, but for the record (and because I like Monty Python's Yorkshiremen sketch) half an hour? You're lucky, I'm lucky if I get a snot covered bite of a butty. wink

Apologies honeyandhaycorns it crops up usually in response to the old line about coffee mornings and long lunches with friends! Both equally as much bollocks as the other, I shouldn't have risen to it.

I guess its the dismissal I find offensive, it makes me stabby. The same when someone says "You're lucky, you get to go out of the house every day, you know when you'll start and when you'll stop, you get paid" etc., dismissal is offensive. I know I work hard, I know DH works hard.

Its actually getting boring now that my youngest is nearing school age. It won't be continuing when both children, and husband are 'at work'... I never had any desire to be a houewife. But being a SAHM has been fucking brilliant (for us) and also hard in many ways, and certainly not to be dismissed.

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 22:13:04

Oh come on now - I've done both, and I'm 100% certain which one is easier. I work fucking hard as well - but I'd still rather do that than stay at home all day, it's hateful.

I.M.O. wink

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 22:14:39

I'd like to know a bit more anyway, OP, when you come back tomorrow or whatever, if I may.

How is your dw's lifestyle? And how is yours? Who gets more free time? Who has more money to spend on fripperies?

IainDuncanShit Mon 27-Feb-12 22:22:13

I've done both too. Working full-time is easier.

<lights fuse>

I couldn't piss about on the internet at any time in my job either.

Perhaps, OP, your wife could get a weekend job and you could have the joy of looking after your 16 month-old every Saturday and Sunday. Whilst doing all that needs doing in the house of course. Would that be a compromise? No childcare to pay out - win win.

aldiwhore Mon 27-Feb-12 22:22:22

The husband and I do argue about this. He reckons he has it easy. BUT he has a job he loves that is his passion/hobby so a hard day at the office for him is bloody marvelous. That probably makes me a little envy at times.

BeeMyBaby Mon 27-Feb-12 22:24:02

YANBU - if she wants to stay at home then the child should not be sent to nursery if you can't afford it - nursery + afternoon nap = very little effort required, so I expect that your house is beautifully clean and that you have extravagant meals every night to give your DP something to do.

IainDuncanShit Mon 27-Feb-12 22:25:08

"I'd like to get over this hump with her, and reignite what brought us together in the first place - the fact she is ffing sexy inside and out"

hmm Priorities...

Grow up Good luck with that, OP.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:27:23

aldi, I get that it's hard, and I never make those stupid comments about coffee mornings etc. I do understand why people get defensive. Same reason as I get defensive when people talk about women going to work for a rest. I work bloody hard, and am manically busy all day, it isn't a fucking rest!!

I just think it's a pity that women on both "sides" of the debate feel forced to defend their choices. sad

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 22:30:13

Don't get me wrong - I love having days off at home with the kids, and weekends, but every day? No way. It's just not me at all. Not that I could afford to, mind, but I'd still make that choice even if I could.

Working full time is easier, hands down. It's the shit you have to do when you get home that's the problem grin

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 22:33:18

And, I don't sit around filing my nails either, btw! I work very hard in a very stressful environment. But it's a different kind of stress, iyswim.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:34:10

Working full time is easier, hands down

Not for me. grin I loved being at home on maternity leave & could easily do it FT tbh. Shame I'm the bigger earner so have to go to work. sad

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:37:01

But it's a different kind of stress, iyswim.

Yes, I think that's very true. Both can be stressful but I find it more difficult, on balance, to cope with the stress at work. I guess it's the other way around for some people.

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 22:39:24

Oh, definitely. Loads of people thrive on staying at home with or without children. But I'm not one of them, I'm afraid! What a shame you can't do the thing you want to, H&H.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:45:48

Ah well, Abby, such is life. smile I don't hate my job, I actually quite enjoy it at times, just dislike the stress that goes along with it. And though I sometimes think it would be easier to stay at home, I would probably find it very difficult to be financially dependent on someone else, and I'd also worry about my pension etc.

I think the ideal option would be to work part-time. smile

AbbyAbsinthe Mon 27-Feb-12 22:49:25

Oh, me too. A four day week would suit me down to the ground. For the same pay, obviously wink Every Wednesday off to do cleaning & shopping, and job's a good 'un.

HoneyandHaycorns Mon 27-Feb-12 22:50:38

yy, for the same pay, obviously!

ChocolateIsAFoodGroup Mon 27-Feb-12 22:53:59

I'm with aldi really like staying at home with the DC (wonder if I'll say that when I have three I wonder?!) but I will definitely be going back to p/t paid employment when they're all in school. SAHM is brill - not sure the housewife bit would work for me (though I probably would look good in those fluffy shoes grin)

aldiwhore Mon 27-Feb-12 23:02:01

A highly paid, exciting, fun job two days a week where I could gather at least a week's worth of interesting anecdotes and 'news' would be bloody marvelous.

I can't deny that.

Those jobs don't seem to advertise though - bah.

I am a bit contrary, but I'm approaching the end of my 'contract' as a SAHM and actually am more than ready to move on. I felt the same when pregnant and approaching motherhood... bring it on I'm bored now! smile

I can't imagine ever doing the same thing for the rest of my life, though I'd like to do whatever I do with some of the same people around me.

So, Zealey, does your partner earn £40,000+ pa?

I thought you said she had a low paid job? But on your other thread on the cost of childcare, you say you can't understand how people can afford to pay for childcare.

MorrisZapp Mon 27-Feb-12 23:05:10

So. Zealey. You want to go for coffee with your friends during the day.

Are they students, unemployed, or SAHDs?

ChocolateIsAFoodGroup Tue 28-Feb-12 00:46:57

aldi I'm the same.... like to mix it up a bit... when shall we be going into business with our new, exciting, highly-paid part-time job then?

grin

SaraBellumHertz Tue 28-Feb-12 03:50:10

Zealy what is this job that your partner hates and is "low income" but enough to cover nursery fees and the commute?

I'm intrigued.

I also think any man that would make his wife return to a job she hates when it makes little difference to their current financial situation so that his dreams can be fulfilled is an arse.

Blx2thelotofem Tue 28-Feb-12 04:16:08

Zealey, I am sorry that you are getting such a hard time on here, honestly this place is such a nest of vipers. I think YANBU given your limited income.

Just to give you a different perspective, after the birth of our DS, my DH loved him so much, he didn't ever want to leave him. So we decided that I would go back to work and DH would stay home. At first, DH loved it. He loved looking after our DS and the house, taking him to the park, shopping... he was really happy. Then one evening when DS was about 8 months old, I looked on our internet history and saw that he had been searching "depression". I asked him about it and he just burst into tears. He said he felt completely lonely and isolated. He missed his work colleagues and the banter of his workplace, he had no-one to talk to, he felt thoroughly miserable. I am just telling you this in case you are feeling that you are missing out by not being a SAHD.

differentnameforthis Tue 28-Feb-12 05:48:59

It's a fathers job to provide for his family

I think you mean it is the parent's (i.e both of them) job to provide for their family!

callmemrs Tue 28-Feb-12 07:01:12

Yes- you would think that wouldn't you? That in 2012 parents would view themselves as equal, rather than defining themselves by having a penis or a vagina.

Sadly a minority really do seem to think a father 'should' earn and a mother 'should' stay home. Perhaps they are living in a 1950s timewarp. Or perhaps they arent very confident in their own capacity to be flexible enough to have the skills to earn and care. Either way, it's their children i feel sorry for- imagine being a boy or girl raised in a family where the parents believe they should only have one fixed role. My son would be horrified to think it is his future duty to provide for a wife who might decide she just doesnt 'like' working, and my dd would be equally horrified to think she would be expected to not be taken seriously as an earner

HoneyandHaycorns Tue 28-Feb-12 07:50:02

I'm amazed actually that so many people think the wife has an automatic right to stay at home if she wants to. Even if her salary wouldn't be enough to cover childcare costs, that doesn't necessarily mean that she should become a SAHM - what if the OP would prefer for them both to go PT and share the childcare, for example.

The OP is getting hammered for not wanting to support his partner's lifestyle choices, whereas she seems to get away without even considering what he wants. Why do her wishes trump his? Can people really not see how unfair they are being?

Odd, very odd.

HillyWallaby Tue 28-Feb-12 07:57:10

Completely agree Honey.

redridingwolf Tue 28-Feb-12 08:20:09

I think everyone is missing the point here. The important point is the child, and both parents should be supporting each other in doing the best they can for their child. For some families, that is one parent staying at home, for others it is full-time childcare while both parents work, and for yet others it is a balance between the two.

'Lifestyle choice' is a somewhat pejorative way of describing this. It sounds rather sad that OP and his wife cannot talk to each other to work out what's best for their family as a whole. From OP's post, it sounds as if his wife is trying to get a cushy ride, and he is resentful and jealous. It sounds as if neither of them are sparing 'the kid' (as he describes his child) a thought.

I cannot believe this is really true - if it is, then I feel very sorry for their child. I would suggest that they just talk. Family life is all about adjustment and change. And compromise.

HoneyandHaycorns Tue 28-Feb-12 08:26:38

But redriding, if there is no actual discussion of what is best for the child, or for the family as a whole, and the wife just says that she is going to SAH because she hated her job and was "born to be a mother", then surely that is a lifestyle choice. She clearly has no ethical concerns about childcare as the child already goes to nursery two hours a day, and she wants to increase this. hmm

Anyway, it isn't just for a mother to decide what is right for her child, it is for both parents to discuss and decide together.

So I don't think people are missing the point.

ToothbrushThief Tue 28-Feb-12 08:35:30

YANBU - I'd call her bluff and say you understand - your views have changed as well and you're going to pack up work so that you can both be at home and enjoy this special time. Tell her that you will both have to make sacrifices financially but it will be worth it

redridingwolf Tue 28-Feb-12 09:03:53

Honey I don't think I said it was just for a mother to decide at all. And I agree that from the OP, the mother sounds as if she is just going for an easy life without regard for her child.

But, the OP doesn't sound at all concerned about his child either, only about his own lifestyle. So either they are both rather unpleasant people (poor child) or the OP doesn't fully represent the true situation. In which case, they need to sit down and talk about their chlld and what's best for the family as a whole.

I think what I'm saying is that the OP is criticising his wife for being selfish, but also sounds selfish himself. Still can't get over his reference to 'the kid'.

HoneyandHaycorns Tue 28-Feb-12 09:17:25

Well yes, he does sound a bit of an arse as I said in my first post on this thread. grin

In RL, though, I think it can be tricky to separate the interests of the child from those of the parents. Women who want to stay at home are far more likely to feel that childcare is damaging than women who want to go to work. And women who want to go to work are far more likely to feel that their kids will benefit from time socialisation at nursery/the extra income than women who don't want to go to work.

Perhaps it's those who genuinely have no choice about the matter who see it the most clearly, and who will acknowledge that there are pros and cons for the children on both sides. smile

BoulevardOfBrokenSleep Tue 28-Feb-12 09:25:09

I've re-read the OP's posts, and not once does he say he wishes he could spend more time with his DD or anything like that. The only thing he does is complain about his wife's easy life, and how they need more money (though can afford, what, £80 a week for unnecessary nursery? That'd feed a family of 4!)

Now I realise different things are important to different people, but if your priorities are that way round, I suggest you'd get more sympathy on the Money-Saving Expert boards than on Mumsnet?

shagmundfreud Tue 28-Feb-12 09:31:06

"Even if her salary wouldn't be enough to cover childcare costs, that doesn't necessarily mean that she should become a SAHM - what if the OP would prefer for them both to go PT and share the childcare, for example."

Is that an option OP?

redridingwolf Tue 28-Feb-12 09:34:26

Honey I think we are of the same opinion! grin

boulevard 'if your priorities are that way round, I suggest you'd get more sympathy on the Money-Saving Expert boards than on Mumsnet?' grin think you have hit the nail on the head there.

I don't think he's taken a hammering.

Compromise is what's needed. The nursery at this point is not an essential. Maybe you will be better off than you think with tax credits if low paid or maybe she could get a PT job.

perceptionreality Tue 28-Feb-12 09:46:28

I've not read the whole thread but I don't think you're being unreasonable going by your OP. A couple has a joint responsibility to care for a child and make sure there is enough money. She can't just throw the towel in because she's decided she prefers not working.

I have no idea how you are managing the nursery fees - they are as expensive as private school fees these days, if not more. Most people I know who are stay at home mums don't send their children to nursery until the SS funding kicks in after the child's 3rd birthday.

If I were you I would say that if she doesn't want to go back to work then your child needs to come out of nursery - that's just common sense. I can understand your frustration as in the current climate she has a job to go back to and is refusing it.

Warmwoollenmittens Tue 28-Feb-12 09:53:50

Haven't read the whole post so maybe I'm jumping in here!! No YANBU - all the parenting decisions my DH and I have been made have been made together. I don't think one parent is more "entitled" than the other - parenting is a joint venture. We are in the fortunate position that I only work part time and so assume the role of primary carer and housekeeper smile. In my experience these things have to be negotiated, not imposed. It's not about right and wrong, it's about a joint decision. She has removed this - and she is wrong.

legallyblond Tue 28-Feb-12 10:04:17

I was on this thread yesterday and have followed the OP's posts.... I find it very telling that at no point in any of the discussion has he or, according to him, his wife, considered or made their choice based on what they feel is best for their DD. Its all about their lifestyles etc.

Surely surely we make decisions as parents by first thinking about what is best for our DC and what our priorities are in terms of child rearing, then together, we think through the practicalities of how the "parenting team", between them, can make that work....

So, if you decide that a SAHP is important and what you think is best for your DC, you decide between you how that could work and, if it can't financially, you work out how to get as close to what you think is best for your children as possible?! (e.g. one of you working p/t etc) No?

I don't get the OP's attitude frankly. He cares about whether his wife is expecting to be supported and getting an easy ride (which incidentally is an understandable annoyance)... but is that really the point? I also don't understand his wife needing a to send a 16 month old to nursery when she is at home f/t, but perhaps my DH (a SAHD) would!

OP - what do you think is best for your DD and, given the realities of life, finances etc, how can you, between you, get close to that?

Seriously - isn't this what everyone does?

Gribble Tue 28-Feb-12 10:15:12

OP, I am still mighty confused about the apparant extended mat leave she has been granted, but I do just want to say that YANBU at all.

Shes being a cheeky cow putting the kid into nursery when she is at home anyway - dont get me wrong, if its affordable then I think nursery is a great thing for youngsters, gets them used to being with different people and it can be a great start for them (I am currently on mat leave with DS2 and DS1 is still in nursery part time because its so good for him). But if it means money is tight then its totally not on.

I understand those saying womens feelings can change when baby is here, but sadly feelings dont earn money. Ive chnged totally from being career minded to longing to be a SAHM but we cant afford it, Id never dream of disrespecting DP by just 'announcing' that I wasnt going back to work.

Shes taking the piss big time, and Id be tempted to just stop paying the nursery bill tbh

legallyblond Tue 28-Feb-12 10:21:25

Totally - I do get the real desire to have or be a SAHP despite being convinced that you wouldn't want that before having a baby (this was me and DH - DH is now a SAHD)! BUT, if money is tight then putting your DD in nursery while your wife is at home f/t is a joke and is an unfair demand.

As I said upthread, if the issue is that, for instance, you too want to be at home with DD (although your posts do not suggest this), then you need to figure out a way to make it work between you as a team.

If the issue is simply that you don't like the way she has "announced" that this is what she wants so it is happening, I would say that is a valid gripe and you need some sort of marriage counselling as this is a wholly inadequate way for a marriage partnership to work.

tomverlaine Tue 28-Feb-12 12:36:22

I do understand where you are coming from in terms of having agreed how things were going to work out. Myself and DP had always agreed that he would stay off with the baby and I would be back at work (bit of a no brainer given respective salaries) - I 'd also said I would go back at 6 months.
In the event I did do this but I felt a lot more ambigous about it and I did feel that i had to fulfill my part of the bargain (even before the baby arrived he was concerned that I would resent the fact that he could stay off and I couldn't- I said I'd be fine - I wasn't!) - and to be fair it was still my call rather than his.

I do think a lot of it depends on whether your partner takes up the rest of the slack- she should be responsible (given the baby is in nursery) for the household chores/cooking/shopping etc as well - then you'll feel you will get some benefit.
But it is tricky - the easy thing is that because she is at home you work more and then it becomes a lot more entrenched (esp if you have more children)- you work/she is at home - which I think doesn't work for some couples especially where they have always worked equally

1944girl Tue 28-Feb-12 12:52:04

I have not read all of this thread, but I wish I could have had my children in a nursery so I could meet my friends for coffee mornings.
I always wanted to be a mother and enjoy being one.I gave up work all together when pregnant with my first child and stayed at home with him, no nursery, and managed on my DHs wage.When the second was born I had both of them at home until the older was 3 years.We were fortunate in having a free state nursery then and older child went there as I wanted to prepare him for school, but I was at home with his brother.When DS2 was 2.5 years things were getting desparate money wise.I went back to work and put him in nursery.
We all want to be mothers but we cant have it all.

theDevilHasTheBestMNNames Tue 28-Feb-12 13:26:08

"OP, I am still mighty about the apparant extended mat leave she has been granted,"

I do know someone who worked in a big retail company who has been granted 2 years leave obviously with no pay - and as long as she goes back in that time they give her an equivalent job where they have a vacancy ie it could be in another department.

ilovebabytv Tue 28-Feb-12 13:46:10

Yes, i had two years off with my eldest, although this was over 10 years ago, the first year was basic maternity leave, the second year was with no pay. And this was with big retail company.

KatAndKit Tue 28-Feb-12 13:47:27

A friend of mine who worked for the civil service was able to take a 2 year "career break" instead of just 12 months maternity leave. They didn't guarantee her old job back though, just that they would find her employment at her grade.

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