awkward conversation

[caspered]

Help Needed. I have a friend who I really value, who has helped me with advice and support through 2 babies, BUT I find her children 'difficult'. My eldest (3 years) was good 'friends' with her children but now does not want to have anything to do with them as they hit, punch, kick and shove and to use my eldest words 'they are mean'. This is leading me to avoid meetings and outings, I want to tell my friend why, but without hurting her feelings - any suggestions?

[hertsnessex]

maybe ask her if she is ok, perhaps she isnt coping very well?

i had a friend whose DS was a nightmare, not to mention their parenting was way off ours - it was never going to 'work' and we 'lost' contact. i think it was for the best overall. that probably doesnt help though?!

cx

[lucyellensmum]

casper, just mention to your friend that you wonder if there is a problem between the children? If she values your friendship to, she will be happy to look into any issues. If her children have aggression issues they need to be adressed and you never know, she may value your support

[lucyellensmum]

or of course she may be mortally offended and tell you to feck off. It is a difficult one. Do you see this behaviour going on? If so, you could say to your friend, that your DD gets worried by it. She may just view it as high jinx and think its ok (some may do), so unless you say so....that way the friendship has the strongest chance of lasting, its no win if you ignore as your children will vote with their feet and your friend will be left wondering why.

[MoodyMargaret]

I think it's a good start to ask your friend how she is. That way, you open a conversation about "issues". Maybe she will open up about some of her problems (if she has any) and it might lead to the children. Meet up on your own if you can, without the kids. It all depends how much you want her to stay your friend. If you don't seem to get anywhere and are not really that bothered, maybe it is best just not to have any contact or let it "trickle out". it is very hard to see eye to eye when it comes to kids and I would be careful, approaching her straight out without any warning...she might (or will) take it personal.

[Catzy]

I've gone through a similar thing with one of my friends, it's so difficult.

The only thing I would say is my friend would confide in me saying how upset her childrens behaviour was to her and how she didn't like taking them anywhere as she was embarrassed. If she is a true friend she will need you to support her.
On the other hand she may not think there is a problem with her childrens behaviour.
I would say to her that their behaviour is upsetting your eldest and that you are not avoiding her but struggling to put your own in that situation.

The children will grow up and leave home and if you value her you will still want her friendship then.

[scotsgirl]

I had a similar situation a while back with a friend, and it made meeting up really quite stressful. It was made worse by the fact that she was suffering from PND too, so was quite fragile.
The trouble with this situation is your friend maybe doesn't have a problem with the way her children behave (my friend didn't - often she didn't even seem to notice ).
In the end I had to say something, but I played it down (i.e. I said that her children were quite hard work, my DC did sometimes get upset/scared, as he was a bit more of a gentle soul, and I felt that her parenting style was quite a bit more relaxed than mine. I said this made things a bit tricky sometimes and we kind of left it at that.
What worked more was to avoid situations where it could get out of hand. I stopped inviting them to my house (couldn't take the stress) although I'd still go to hers. I backed off a bit about playdates, and let her suggest things - so that i could make an excuse if I didn't feel comfortable with something.
At the same time, i tried my best to support her (nothing to do with her kids) and tried to arrange to see her without the kids - i.e. going for a drink in the evening or out for coffee if the kids were all at nursery/school, so that she knew i still cared about her even if i didn't click with her kids.
The friendship changed for a while, but didn't totally die, and it has started to grow a bit more again, as her DCs are getting older and therefore (a bit) better behaved. Also my DC can cope with the crappy behaviour more than he could when he was younger (he can stand up for himself a bit more).

Hope this helps - it may be a case of just letting things cool a bit and waiting it out till her DCs grow up a bit IYSWIM, but it sounds as if she's quite an important friend and it'd be worth trying to circumnavigate the children thing. Good luck.

[perpetualworrier]

When DS1 was c.12m I started going to a toddler group where a small group of us, who had all initially come on our own, became good friends.

One of the Mums had 2 boys who were slightly older than the other children, large for their age and "boisterous". As all the kids got older these two boys became a problem particularly for the girls, but this was the mum I felt I got along best with.

Anyway some of the others started making plans which excluded this family, which I felt uncomfortable with, so I went out of my way to make sure we did things with them. It turned out she had suffered from PN depression and was still suffering on and off. She was aware that this affected the quality of her parenting, but didn't know how to improve matters. She needed support from her friends.

Now 6 years on we are still great friends. She feels much better and although she still has off days, she says she feels normal again. Her boys are 8 & 10 now and the eldest is fantastic with my 4yo. She is the one person I could always call on if I needed someone to help me out with childcare at short notice. We have lost touch with the rest of the group.

So I would say, stick around if you can. If the children really can't take it, then have a break for a while and maybe just meet with the other mum, perhaps for a drink in the evening. As the children get older, the dynamic in the group will change and you may find it's yours that become the problem! This happened to me, as DS1 can be very strong willed and hers didn't want to play with him for a while, but she never judged and was always supportive.

I've waffled, but I hope you get the gist. I'm very glad I didn't give up because her boys were a problem. After all you're entitled to your friends. They don;t all have to be for the benefit of your DC's.

[scanner]

I've also had a similar situation. My friends parenting is far more 'relaxed' then mine and her ds would hit, kick my ds who is a year younger. However it passed and now they are the best of friends, so it may be worth holding on.

[WanderingTrolley]

I think whatever you say she will take it as a criticism of her parenting ( which it is)

Maybe try to meet in the evenings, without children.

If you must say anything, just say the children seem to be clashing a lot at the moment. Maybe meet up where the children can go their separate ways, and avoid each other.

Telling your friend any more will hurt her feelings. How would you feel is she said the same to you?

[caspered]

Thanks for all your suggestions I will try and give the kids meetings a break - my friend does suffer from depression occassionally and also is aware that her children get wild - her answer is for me to tell mine to 'push/kick/shove back' - don't really want to go down that route! Thanks for all your advice much appreciated