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AIBU?

to be utterly shocked and appalled

76 replies

assessment · 02/03/2015 08:59

at this, from the BBC...

www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-31688942

Sorry I can't link properly, but an LAPD officer has shot dead a homeless man in an altercation on the street in LA.

The guy was unarmed, was tasered and shot dead as he lay on the floor.

What the actual fuck does this broken fucking country think it's doing with it's ridiculous gun laws?

If there isn't rioting on the street after this then I shall be extremely disappointed. This should be treated with the exact same seriousness as those appalling shootings last year of the unarmed black boys.

How can a country call itself a first world country when it's police go round shooting anyone they fancy dead? When was the last random middle class white guy shot dead in the street? Never? It's always the second class citizen on the sharp end of it.

How they can defend the right of ANY person to bear arms is utterly beyond me. It's sickening.

That police officer should be dismissed immediately and Obama needs a serious look at that ridiculous constitution.

OP posts:
VoyageOfDad · 02/03/2015 09:06

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assessment · 02/03/2015 09:11

The police are coming across as trigger happy thugs who believe that God not only gave them a gun but also the right to dispense rough justice on the mean streets of America.

I notice they don't seem half as keen to shoot dead white doctors, lawyers or middle aged women. Odd that.

The idea is the US that anyone you meet could be carrying a weapon makes the police much, much quicker on the draw.

Fuck me you take your life into your hands just walking down the street over there if your face "doesn't fit"!

Who are these "various non white people" of which you speak Voyage? Do you mean fatalities caused by the police or general victims of shooting?

OP posts:
MrsWolowitz · 02/03/2015 09:20

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MrsWolowitz · 02/03/2015 09:22

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Toughasoldboots · 02/03/2015 09:25

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countessmarkyabitch · 02/03/2015 09:27

A bystander alleged the man was unarmed, although police were heard to say drop the gun 4 times, and have not confirmed whether he was armed or not.

If you are going to talk about a story, try not to totally misrepresent it before you start. I'm against all guns, but the truth is always the place to start.

luckygirl322 · 02/03/2015 09:42

'That ridiculous Constitution'? Really?

SurlyCue · 02/03/2015 09:53

although police were heard to say drop the gun 4 times,

Havent read the story but the "drop the weapon/gun" is a pretty basic 'cover your ass' move (before they even have seen anything that could be a weapon) that has been known to be used before so the police have witnesses saying the police "must have thought they saw a gun"

sliceofsoup · 02/03/2015 09:59

The guy was unarmed, was tasered and shot dead as he lay on the floor.

While I agree it is shocking and completely unacceptable, your description is rather misleading. The man was actively resisting police and was attempting to grab an officers weapon. Both he and the officer were on the floor in a scuffle and the taser did not deter the man.

The article says there was no other gun recovered from the scene, so he was unarmed.

I think we need to remember that police are humans too, and in a fraught situation, where things are happening very quickly, there is a very short window in which to make a decision. If one officer says "drop the gun" then all his colleagues will automatically have to act as if there is a gun, and if there is an officer in a vulnerable position (on the ground in a scuffle for example) then a split second decision has to be made.

cashewnutty · 02/03/2015 10:01

It says on the BBC news the homeless man tried to grab a gun from a police officer and wouldn't stop. They had tried to taser him but he kept 'fighting and resisting'.

I am not condoning this. I hate the US guns laws, however we weren't there and can only go by what is reported.

Hoppinggreen · 02/03/2015 10:04

We don't really know what happened but if I as carrying a Gun ( very unlikely) and someone was trying to take it off me to possibly use against me then I would shoot them - better them than me.
Very glad we don't have guns here like they do in America

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 10:05

Tasting should be enough. I see what everyone is saying here, but it should have been enough to taser him. He didn't need to be shot dead while lying on the ground, incapacitated.

Didn't a police officer recently shoot dead a child in a playground who he claimed had a weapon? Of course the child was black so somehow that made it alright HmmConfused

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 10:06

Tasering. Autocorrect is being an ass.

SukieTuesday · 02/03/2015 10:09

Guns can cause more problems. In the England in the same situation the police wouldn't have had guns for him to grab which escalated the situation.

sliceofsoup · 02/03/2015 10:12

Tasting should be enough. I see what everyone is saying here, but it should have been enough to taser him. He didn't need to be shot dead while lying on the ground, incapacitated.

But the taser didn't incapacitate him. He continued to resist, and tried to grab the officers gun after he was tasered.

As for bringing other cases in to it, if the playground incident was also in the U.S, the U.S is a very large country with various police agencies in each county of each state. It is just not relevant to compare across states and across separate incidents.

ragged · 02/03/2015 10:27

American cops are notoriously trigger happy & you are a first class idiot to mess with them. Sorry for the homeless man, but every adult American knows that you don't fuck around with cops. This is what they do.

I hate crime drama where you see cops pointing a gun at somebody else with a gun repeatedly screaming "Drop it" and loads of sustained dramatic tension while nobody shoots, or much worse negotiating for ages and trying to talk the armed person into dropping weapon. I wonder if irresponsible TV & film drama has made police shootings more likely.

Real American cops don't hesitate and only maybe sometimes negotiate if the gun is always pointed at the ground. They are trained to shoot to kill the moment they perceive anyone's life might be in danger from a firearm. Just twitching at a gun on the ground is enough to make them shoot & courts will always back them up for it.

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 10:27

Sliceofsoup, from the video clip I've seen it didn't look like that to me. However I appreciate that different people have different perceptions. Hopefully the analysis of the video will establish exactly what happened.

I mentioned the other shooting as i thought, from memory, that it occurred in LA. It may not have, but I can't check as my phone is playing up.

The LA police do not have a great reputation amongst black and other ethnic communities, the Rodney King shooting has never been forgotten or forgiven and more incidents have happened over the years since.

sliceofsoup · 02/03/2015 10:35

Don't get me wrong, I don't agree with the gun culture over there. I find it completely crazy, especially when we keep hearing of all these young children shooting their parents or other children with guns that are within their reach.

But as ragged says, its pretty well known that the police over there aren't to be messed with. Maybe the man wasn't grabbing for the gun, maybe the police are just covering themselves, but I just can't automatically assume that the police are terrible and go around shooting people who are no threat. (I realise it has happened though, and will again sadly.) I am much more inclined to err on the side of human error in a fraught situation.

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 11:01

But slice, you are making the assumption that everyone will have the mental capacity to not 'twitch' at a gun as ragged has phrased it. Unfortunately this man had mental health problems. It's pretty awful that the people who are most at risk and disadvantaged in society are also the most at risk from those who are paid and trained to protect them.

MrsWolowitz · 02/03/2015 11:08

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sliceofsoup · 02/03/2015 11:14

I agree, but a threat is a threat. The police do not have psychiatrists reports in front of them at the time.

The police are paid and trained to protect innocent citizens, this mans actions moved beyond that. If he had got the gun and shot an innocent bystander the police would have been criticised for not having him under control sooner.

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 11:16

I've watched the video MrsW and I didn't think he was going for the gun when he was on the ground having been tasered. That was when he was shot. It looked like he may have been moving towards the dropped baton, but obviously that's a matter for analysis.

I would actually feel less troubled by the video if it had been as clear cut as you suggest. If he had gone for the gun and been shot in defence, then it's fair enough under the laws of the country. However being tasered then shot while on the ground, probably moving and twitching involuntarily due to the voltage that just coursed through your body, doesn't strike me as clear cut at all.

nancy75 · 02/03/2015 11:22

Scrambled, Rodney king was not shot, so I doubt if his never forgotten shooting is relevant

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 11:27

Grin I know, I'm not sure why I wrote that. Lack of sleep? I'm amazed I got away with it for so long before someone noticed! Ty Thanks

ScrambledSmegs · 02/03/2015 11:28

Anyway, must go and do something useful instead of mucking about on here all day.

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