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AIBU?

To tell you all what Alan Titchmarch thinks of 12-15 year old girls who dress 'inappropriately'

311 replies

RiffyWammal · 17/09/2014 16:14

I'm so angry. On his show today in a discussion about sexual harassment and sexism he said something really vile. I will transcribe what he said exactly;

"A lot of 12, 13, 14, 15 year old girls are now walking down the street barely covered. I see crop tops on girls of 12 and skirts up here, in a way now I hate to say that thing which men say 'they are asking for it' but it strikes me that if a girl of 14 walks past a building site in a crop top and short skirt she's probably going to get whistled at and worse."

I'm disgusted as was Laura Bates from Everyday Sexism who stayed remarkably controlled as she countered this. The victim blaming, the implication that girls should jolly well cover up if they don't want to be harrassed, the attitude of 'how else do we expect men to react if they see a girl's legs and belly'? I could hardly believe my ears. The audience applauded him FFS Sad

I think I am going to make a complaint to ITV. I just wanted to bring it to the attention of anyone else who might wish to do the same.

OP posts:
TheOpaqueAndJelliedTruth · 17/09/2014 16:16

Oh, yuck. Sad

That's horrible.

Writerwannabe83 · 17/09/2014 16:21

The girls aren't asking for it but builders will do 'their thing' of hollering or whistling if women walk past them dressed like that.

He worded it very badly but he was just making a point that is well known anyway.

The problems lie with the attitudes of the builders not the women but that doesn't change the fact that revealing clothes will attract comments in some circumstances.

Women shouldn't change the way they dress, how they dress is completely up to them but at the same time they shouldn't be surprised when chauvinistic types shout out at them or behave Inappropriately by whistling.

DealForTheKids · 17/09/2014 16:27

That's awful. A few months ago I witnessed some workers for a well-known construction company (on a site with a board, and wearing logo-ed company jackets) shout some incredibly vile stuff to a bunch of girls who were wearing denim shorts. The girls were visibly freaked out and I complained to the workmen (was called uptight) and wrote a letter (got a standard 'we'll revise our training' letter back).

Stuff like this makes me absolutely livid. I wouldn't usually watch this show, but will watch it on catch up. If your transcribing is accurate* I will also make a complaint - thanks.

*not doubting your transcription, just wouldn't dream of complaining without seeing/hearing the offending thing in question!

DealForTheKids · 17/09/2014 16:29

Writer - I'm not countering your point there, but I would point out that young teenage girls will be surprised when they get those kinds of comments, because they are teenage girls who haven't been worn down by years of that shit, unlike us older ones.

FreudiansSlipper · 17/09/2014 16:31

Not surprised from him

What was he saying then if not well they choose to wear these clothes this is the attention they will get Looking at pictures of my family in the late 60's the teenage girls were all heavily made up wearing short skits it is not a new thing

PenisesAreNotPink · 17/09/2014 16:32

Obviously totally disagree with him.

But it's not victim blaming to say that they are dressed inappropriately.

Wearing adult clothes designed to be sexually alluring is not appropriate on young girls.

It is a confusing message to wear clothes that are designed to attract sexual attention for adults and not expect people to think they are older than they are.

Obviously just because you're older doesn't mean you should suffer comments but revealing clothing is there for a purpose - to attract a mate, to attract sexual attention.

I'm far more pissed off that this society demands that women be sexually alluring and then the market creates the demand by women buying it. Stupid 4 inch heels, skirts that don't cover your arse.

Children shouldn't be wearing them. They're for adults. And if you find them in children's ranges it's because they've been designed by some idiot designer with probably dubious intentions.

Greyhound · 17/09/2014 16:33

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AngelsWithSilverWings · 17/09/2014 16:44

That's awful! Does he honestly think that if young girls and women dress modestly they will not experience being wolf whistled or sexually harassed in public?

I'm a very conservative dresser but I can think of numerous occasions when I have had men ( all sorts of men - it isn't only men on building sites who do this) say or shout inappropriate stuff at me.

I was once walking down a street in London dressed in a business suit and a high neck blouse when a middle aged man in a suit turned and said "fantastic tits" . Another time , again completely covered head to toe and pushing my dd in her buggy a car slowed down and the driver leant out and shouted "Cor look at the size of those tits!"

It's the men who have to change not us.

BornToFolk · 17/09/2014 16:44

Oh, FFS! Women and girls get harrassed regardless of what they are wearing. The fault lies with the wolf-whistling builders.

UncleT · 17/09/2014 16:47

Penises makes the point well. It actually isn't appropriate for children to be wearing clothes intended for adults and designed to be alluring. That's a different consideration from the fact that any inappropriate reaction to them is the responsibility/fault of the perpetrator rather than the child.

ArabellaTarantella · 17/09/2014 16:47

Wearing adult clothes designed to be sexually alluring is not appropriate on young girls

I agree with ^^ what Penises said. It is NOT 'victim blaming'.

primarynoodle · 17/09/2014 16:48

the worst is men in family cars WITH car seats in the back who beep and leer and girls as they drive past... I hope they dont have daughters or wives who would accept that kind of behaviour if they recieved it or sons who would behave that way!

SourSweets · 17/09/2014 16:50

Yep. I recently had a van with 3 men in the front turn and follow me down the road shouting and whistling at me.

What was a wearing? Baggy trousers and a loose t-shirt. And my son was asleep in his buggy.

The thought that anyone other than the perpetrators are to blame is ridiculous.

Lottapianos · 17/09/2014 16:55

Ugh, how disgusting. What a creep. Glad to hear that Laura Bates was able to keep her cool.

And yes, we bloody well should be surprised when women or girls gets leered at or whistled at or shouted at. Men are perfectly capable of behaving in a civilised fashion when they choose to and we need to expect better from them.

Writerwannabe83 · 17/09/2014 16:59

I feel disappointed when they do it (with regards to men thinking they can behave like this) but I'm never surprised.

FreeSpirit89 · 17/09/2014 17:02

As a young girl of 14, I wouldn't dream about wearing a short skirt and crop top. And I hated walking past a builders yard full stop.

But the point is if you wear that kind of outfit your going to draw unwanted attention to yourself. Men shouldn't rape women but they do. There's no harm in saying that you 'can' help protect yourself by not wearing provocative clothes.

To me it isn't victim blaming but sensible, men who are going to raps woman will do so regardless but why make yourself more of a target if you don't have too.

usualsuspect333 · 17/09/2014 17:02

Whistling at young girls is never appropriate

BitchPeas · 17/09/2014 17:02

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ouryve · 17/09/2014 17:03

Urgh.

usualsuspect333 · 17/09/2014 17:05

Shall we all walk about covered from head to toe because the poor men can't control themselves?

gertiegusset · 17/09/2014 17:07

I wonder how he knows how old these girls all are.
Isn't it funny how you never hear of women harassing young boys who have their pants on show and their shirts off in the summer.
He's a creep.

Lottapianos · 17/09/2014 17:07

Good point usualsuspect. And guess what - even women who cover themselves head to toe in public still get harassed and assaulted! Hmmmm.....

Whiskwarrior · 17/09/2014 17:10

Jesus wept, some of the posters on this thread need to get over to the FWR board and also check out the Everyday Sexism website.

Fwiw, rapists will rape because they can, NOT because someone was wearing the wrong thing. Ever heard of the slut walks? Objecting to this sort of crap.

A rapist is always, always 100% to blame for raping someone.

They don't look for a particular type - they're generally known to their victim prior to the attack. It is victim blaming to say someone was raped because of the way they were dressed.

It is not up to women to prevent men from raping them. It is down to men to not rape women. They are fully able to not do it.

BeattieBow · 17/09/2014 17:14

freespirit, I got crude comments from 2 young men on a motorbike yesterday. I am a 44 year old woman, and I was on my way back from work in my conservative office clothes. It doesn't take much to draw unwanted attention to yourself. In fact, all it takes is to be female and in a public place.

While I agree that young girls shouldn't wear clothes designed for older women, I agree that it is the men that are at fault here 100%.

Cornettoninja · 17/09/2014 17:14

The point is it doesn't matter what you are/aren't wearing, your public presentation is never an invitation for a random individual to engage someone in a sexual dialogue. Flirting doesn't really cover shouting lewd comments.

The problem is not with the clothes, it's with societies belief that someone exposing their body is able to completely hinder someone else's capability to control themselves.

I don't mind being accused of hyperbole by pointing out the case of the BBC journalist who was assaulted in Egypt who was blamed for not covering up and so the men around her could not be expected to control their own actions.

To argue that's not bollocks is alien to me.

Fwiw I have witnessed women do it to, to guys out running or wearing tight fit jeans. It's just as unacceptable and the purportrator should be expecting to take a 'fuck off' in good grace.

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