To wonder why a thread about an ex soldier STARVING to death here in the UK

(99 Posts)
NickiFury Tue 29-Jul-14 01:15:24

gets far less interest and response than any "shall I report my friend for benefit fraud" thread to be found here in AIBU.

People are only interested in the benefits system when they are able to attack those who rely on it, it seems, then they're all over it. No one cares when it utterly fails an individual such as this man.

David Clapson

Please note that a pile of CV's and job applications were found by David's body, he was actually searching for work when he starved to death here in one of the worlds wealthiest nations.

ICanSeeTheSun Tue 29-Jul-14 01:19:58

I didn't want to read and run, I am speechless.

D0oinMeCleanin Tue 29-Jul-14 01:21:59

YANBU.

But the frothers would have to froth at the people with the power to change things rather than those less fortunate than themselves, which is unthinkable. Society as a whole is too used to the media dictating the status quo. Government = bad. Poor people = bad. People on benefits = worse than bad, utter scum.

Poor man. It's ridiculous that this could be allowed to happen in this day and age and this country. It's happened before and will no doubt happen again.

SqueakySqueak Tue 29-Jul-14 01:22:44

It's hard to have a discussion on something that everyone is in agreement about. I don't think you'll find someone disagreeing that a veteran shouldn't have his benefits cut because he missed a meeting (most likely to MH issues).

Benefit fraud has two sides not really that people can argue back and forth, and generate a dialogue.

JaceLancs Tue 29-Jul-14 01:24:12

I work for a charity who supports people such as this gentleman - the current benefits system is not fit for purpose - his story is sadly not unusual
My only hope is this type of publicity instead of benefits bashing may be the vehicle for change

NickiFury Tue 29-Jul-14 01:24:53

Its more acknowledgement I am after I guess. I am an ex serving soldier and have been around the army all my life. It could be any of the men that I knew. Its the lack of comment and seeming apathy about it. If we don't comment and acknowledge then it just disappears doesn't it and then it will keep on happening.

Lally112 Tue 29-Jul-14 01:35:29

I think if I'm honest people don't really know what to say, I didn't when I read it so I didn't comment. The truth is - with the current benefits system you don't get far if you served your country for X amount of years, worked your arse off and paid your taxes since highschool or never so much as asked for a penny till you were desperate.

The only way you get on is if you are a nasty stinky junkie who had their children taken away like my mother or a drug dealing, woman beating car thief fresh out of jail like my father.

This is what causes the outrage with people and I can see what you mean, the man had filled out applications got his CV done etc and nothing, the two jokers that brought me into this world get people to do that for them when they are released from prison (time and time again), they get a house, they get someone to tell them which benefits to apply for and someone to fill in the facking form for them because theyre never straight or sober enough to hold a pen.

I can acknowledge I read it but what can I do about it? nothing sadly, the people that have the power to do something have never experienced a day of hardship in their lives.

Darkesteyes Tue 29-Jul-14 01:42:22

What happened to him is disgusting. And shouldn't be happening in a civilised society.

RIP David.

JakeBullet Tue 29-Jul-14 02:02:22

Utterly dreadful.

It is far too easy for benefits to be sanctioned.

I am in a position where I meet many families in difficulties.

I have seen benefits sanctioned for the most spurious reasons. The worst of these cases was for a father of four children who had always worked up until he had a massive stroke. He was sanctioned because he couldn't attend an appointment with ATOS 30 miles away.

Fucking hell....he has a set of medical records a foot high....why in earth does a sodding ATOS non medically qualified assessor need to decide if he is fir for work. Here's a clue...he bloody well isn't.

Didn't stop em applying benefit sanctions which affected the family for several weeks and which they are still experiencing the knock in effects months later.

Hateful.

Nobody should have to starve on this country.

Where are the safeguards for those with mental health issues?

OP YANBU about asking why so little attention is paid to this while a "benefit fraud" thread gets hundreds of responses.

ArsenicFaceCream Tue 29-Jul-14 02:08:57

YANBU to wonder.

I'm not sure that the fact the poor man was ex army is the most relevant factor.

His transition to civvy street seems to have been fairly smooth (job etc).

It was the suddeness with which he was tipped from Carer's Allowance on to JSA (with no grace period to find a job) and then the brutality of the current JSA regime that caused him to be left without money and food.

But what happened to him should never happen to anyone.

Matildasmam22 Tue 29-Jul-14 02:11:06

My mam works for citizens advice. She thinks the only people suffering with the cutbacks are the people who really need the help. And shows like benefit street show extreme cases and create bad feeling against said benefits. It is a tragic case but I doubt it will be the last. RIP poor man sad

salsmum Tue 29-Jul-14 03:23:36

The sad thing is that leaving no assets he may even have a paupers funeral. Such a sad,sad end to a man who fought for his country and even sadder to think that his is not an isolated case. sad

Jux Tue 29-Jul-14 04:11:54

I didn't know what to say, so I said nothing. This is not how I was brought up, and I am ashamed of myself for it.

We have all been subjected to propaganda for years, to despise benefit claimants, to regard them as little better than thieves and to assume that they are all manipulating the system, claiming fraudulently.

I get DLA, and I am almost afraid to go out, as my disability is invisible and I am just waiting for someone to 'shop' me. Apparently, I am entitled to other benefits too, but I don't claim them; I'm too scared to do it, I don't want to draw attention to myself.

I was disgusted when a food bank opened in my small town - not because it was a food bank, but because this is the UK in the 21st century and we shouldn't bloody well need them.

We have been told for years that people must get off benefits and into jobs. What jobs? Until very recently there were very few jobs, and so the few there were, were chased after by hundreds.

Meanwhile, the top tiny % of the population who earn the most get a tax cut.

So people die. People die of starvation in this country in the 21st century. It is so shocking that words are inadequate (but I'll rant anyway).

But we, we who don't earn much, or who have to rely on benefits, we are the dregs, we don't count, we are not sufficiently productive, or we are negatively productive.

Man's inhumanity to man, eh? Cameron, that's your legacy.

RIP David Clapson.

AnAirOfHope82 Tue 29-Jul-14 04:29:31

I have posted and I see what has happened and why and blame the government.

The cuts hurt the weak and the voiceless and leave men dead. Who will stand up for the poor, the disabled and the people in need that can not stand up for themselves?

Who will start a political party for the people by the people to put this shit right.

Donot cut money provide help, rehab, workshops, work experoance but dont kill people.

Staryyeyedsurprise Tue 29-Jul-14 09:40:48

I read this this morning.

"the procedure was followed correctly" apparently. And yep, that would absolutley seem to be the problem.

Yes, I will bash the Daily Mail and the Sun etc over this as their bile has fed this whole "benefit scum" feeling.

MrsWinnibago Tue 29-Jul-14 09:44:20

This is devastating. I can't even read the article.

dawndonnaagain Tue 29-Jul-14 10:04:53

In developing the PIP assessment we were aware that the vast majority of recipients of DLA were individuals with genuine health conditions and disabilities and genuine need, and that removing or reducing that benefit may affect their daily lives. DWP
This is how little the government thinks of those on benefits.

NickiFury Tue 29-Jul-14 11:49:43

Jux I have two dc with autism and to the untrained eye they look fine and they are mostly, until they're not and then no one who is not living it could comprehend how hard it is. I claim benefits for my oldest and am in the process of claiming for my second and I couldn't care less. I will claim every single penny that that need and you should too. Don't not claim what you need. Screw what anyone else thinks.

That said, I certainly don't openly admit to being on benefits because I sense that instant judgement and feeling of slipping a few notches in the opinion of the person you tell. My life is hard enough without dealing with that kind of hostile shit too.

phantomnamechanger Tue 29-Jul-14 12:02:59

RIP David, such a sad sad case

What a sad state of affairs that this can happen in this country.
The town I work in has an army camp, and is a magnet for many ex-army personel, many of whom end up on the streets. It is a disgrace that these people are not better looked after by the forces, by the state and by our society.

RiverTam Tue 29-Jul-14 12:13:18

the thing that annoys me the most with this case is that it sums up how the army/state do not take care of their own. Many ex-forces people don't know or understand life on civvy street at all - how can you, if you joined up at 18? This is why FIL (who rarely advised his DC on anything at all) advised his DC not to join the army - you are not looked after when you leave.

I actually think this case is as much, if not more, about this than the current state of welfare cuts.

OneSkinnyChip Tue 29-Jul-14 12:13:23

Awful, awful story sad

I think the reason people 'benefit bash' is because EVERYONE knows someone who is exploiting the benefits system to avoid working, which means they drain the money we pay in good faith to support people who really need it - like David. And on the other thread the woman in question was fraudulently claiming benefits but the OP was called spiteful and jealous for suggesting reporting her. Of course she should be reporting her - she's a thief, stealing our taxes which we paid to help people like David.

The benefits system needs a complete overhaul to make sure the right people are getting the right benefit.

OneSkinnyChip Tue 29-Jul-14 12:16:00

I agree with Tam too - the army needs to do more to look after veterans. About half of the veterans I know went into the army from very dysfunctional homes or the care system. The army gave them a home, a 'family' and a sense of pride and purpose. Some of them used the army as a springboard into further work and training, met partners and made their own families but the ones who didn't really struggled afterwards.

NickiFury Tue 29-Jul-14 12:25:58

rivertam I agree that the forces don't look after people as well as they should on leaving but I don't think that's the main issue.

autistic man starves to death after benefits are cut

We are failing the vulnerable in our society whatever their background.

RiverTam Tue 29-Jul-14 12:31:29

oh, I agree, but this particular should have had the additional support of the army, and didn't.

RiverTam Tue 29-Jul-14 12:31:41

particular man, sorry

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