Calling Social Services or not?

(262 Posts)
CrocsAreJustPlainUgly Thu 17-Jul-14 17:06:36

Having this discussion with my DP he thinks SS should be called, I however am not sure and think it may be acting hastily.

I have a friend who has a DD she's 2.4 We've been friends for 7+ years had our DC's a week apart they see each other every day nearly. however I've been noticing things steadily going down hill.

Say for instance her DD runs off she'll tell her to come her and she won't she'll carry on running after a couple more times of her saying it she'll go get her whether that means running or walking a few steps when she gets there she'll crouch down to her hight grab both her arms by her shoulders and you can see how tightly she has her and she'll shout Don't run away. She'll then either grab her wrist and take her to the car but she'll be walking so fast her DD's legs will be moving so fast and barely touching the ground and not keeping up or she'll pick her up carry her and chuck/drop her into the car seat and her DD will be crying.

Not going to lie her DD cries an awful lot, and practically at anything and everything if she isn't given a sweet when someone else it, or if someone else has a toy and she wants one, if someone has a drink and she doesn't IYSWIM.. So when she does this she'll push her away, she'll fall over and cry more so she'll push her again and the same will happen. She'll tell her to 'shut up' or to 'go away' sometimes to 'fuck off'

These are only a few things she does sometimes if she's climbing on her, the table, sofa's etc she'll give her what I cam only describes as a 'Gibbs' Slap, Like in NCIS when Gibbs slapps DiNossa on the back of the head.

But she's now started to do these things outside of the home, we went to the beach the other day and her DD didn't want to walk (we'd only been walking 10 minutes) she was texting and her DD was just standing there screaming, crying and shouting at her to pick her up, she stood their for 10 minutes and told her to 'get here now' and of course she didn't so in the end she went over and grabbed her and was pratically dragging her by the wrist, her DD's legs couldn't keep up telling her to 'fucking walk properly'. It's embarrassing and people stair at her and I just took my DD up ahead and was talking to her.

All the while she carried on texting, WWYD? AIBU? Should she be reported? I wouldn't want her to know it was me and I don't think she deserves to have her DD taken off of her and she does love her but I get worried about going out with her in case she does this and people stare cause when they stare she just goes What?! Take a picture or something

I don't know what to do

Greyhound Thu 17-Jul-14 17:11:17

Yes, I think you should definitely report this. We all have our limits and toddlers can be trying, but swearing, hitting and other aggressive behaviour is not on at all.

SS don't like taking children from their families and they will probably contact her and see if she needs some support etc, but it is important that they are aware of the situation. For one thing, the child will probably end up copying the swearing / hitting etc and that will cause problems at nursery, school etc.

littlewhitebag Thu 17-Jul-14 17:11:18

Children should never ever be hit to the head. It is abusive and one day she might do it too hard and really hurt her DD.

Have you ever seen bruises or marks on her DD from the way she handles her? If it goes too far it would be considered a child protection issue.

It sounds like she is struggling to manage her DD and needs help. Are you able to sit down with her and tell her that you are worried about her relationship with her DD and urge her to go to her HV for support?

Oh that sounds so sad and to me (no expert) it sounds like abuse. Your friend needs help and support and I definitely wouldn't be comfortable with the pushing, grabbing, hitting etc. If it were me I think I'd ring SS. This is what she does in front of you, so I would be very concerned about how she deals with her DD in her own home when they are alone.

FederationPresidentBarryFife Thu 17-Jul-14 17:13:17

This sounds to me like she is resentful of her daughter and exhausted and just not parenting properly. Only you really know if it is serious enough for SS but if it were mw I would say something to her - be brave - and say "are you OK, you seem to be very on edge with your DD" or even "you need to control your anger responses". She is in her own bubble of anger and needs to see her behaviour from the outside. You could even video it and show her. I bet she would be ashamed - she needs some help.

NoodleOodle Thu 17-Jul-14 17:14:21

Sounds like she's struggling with a child she's finding difficult. I think getting her to talk about what she's finding difficult, and listening without judging, then guide (get her to) her towards getting some help with parenting classes and some support from someone like a home start visitor would be helpful things to do. Their relationship doesn't sound healthy.

If you are worried for the child's (or mother) safety then yes, do phone SS.

CultureSucksDownWords Thu 17-Jul-14 17:14:40

If you aren't sure then try calling the NSPCC for advice as they can give you an idea of where you stand.

What I would say though, is can't you intervene at the time that it happens? Do you think you could say to her that it's not ok to swear, drag and hit? Ask her if she's alright and if she wants to talk to you about anything. Your embarrassment should not stop you acting to protect the child. Could you not say to her "look, stop for a minute, this isn't right" and confront her about the way she's treating her child. I would also be worried about what she does to her DD when no one else is around - if she's dragging, swearing and slapping in public, what will she be doing in private?

Does she have a DP/DH that you can talk to about this?

MrsSquirrel Thu 17-Jul-14 17:16:16

Yes phone as and tell them what you have seen. You don't need to give them your name. It will then be up to them to look into it and decide what action to take.

I don't watch NCIS, but hitting a child on the head just seems wrong.

CrocsAreJustPlainUgly Thu 17-Jul-14 17:16:32

She hasn't seen her HV since her DD was a year old has moved since and despite reminding from myself she won't ring up the new one and get seen.

Seen no bruises and only cuts I've seen is when she falls over (she does that an awful lot) and I'm normally there and she isn't pushing her over

Greyhound Thu 17-Jul-14 17:18:15

To add - a lady I knew got reported to SS because her children seemed to be neglected. I honestly don't think she realised they were being neglected - she had a terrible childhood and just didn't seem to be coping. The SS didn't take her kids off her - I think she must have been given some kind of support by them.

In short - her children weren't bathed regularly and smelt of urine and sour milk because they were peeing in the bed and spilling their sippy cups. They were aged four and two at the time. Their hair was in their eyes, their teeth weren't in good condition and they weren't dressed appropriately for the weather.

There was also an issue where the children would wander in and out of the parents bedroom on a Sunday morning when the parents were having sex (under the blankets, I presume!) and the person (not me) who reported this was concerned.

AFAIK all the family are fine and well now.

CrocsAreJustPlainUgly Thu 17-Jul-14 17:22:58

this is the slap MrsSquirrel

I've tried her DD was climbing on a table the table, I said "DD get down please" She turned round and said 'Yeah I had that thanks' I said that she was texting and she could of fallen through the glass (its an old table, like the conservatory ones with rattan sides and glass in the middle) and she just said 'give me a chance I would of just slapped her and pushed her off'

She never wanted her DD only had her because her ex said she should and always say around or to her DD that she never wanted her, wish she didn't have her, never wanted kids etc

littlewhitebag Thu 17-Jul-14 17:25:46

NSPCC is a great idea. They can pass on your concerns if need be.

Your last post has me very sad sad personally I would report it, just to get her the help she obviously needs

good luck

CultureSucksDownWords Thu 17-Jul-14 17:30:08

Ok, well the comments she's saying to her DD are emotional/psychological abuse and also shouldn't be tolerated. I think you should definitely ring the NSPCC and talk through everything you've described here.

She sounds like she has got stuck into a really negative spiral with her DD and needs some outside help to deal with it. What happens when she pushes her off a table and she falls awkwardly and gets hurt?

She seems a bit detached from her as well.

I would call the NSPCC or SS because it is a damaging environment for a child to be in.

MrsSquirrel Thu 17-Jul-14 17:40:54

OK if that is what she does to her child, Crocs, then yes I agree it is physical abuse. Please tell someone who can help.

You can phone ss directly - call your local council and ask to be put through to the duty social worker for children. Or you can phone NSPCC and they will pass the information on to ss. Whichever you feel more comfortable with.

CrocsAreJustPlainUgly Thu 17-Jul-14 17:48:17

She's pushed her before and she's had a toy in her hand and she's cut her lip/ she pushed her and she's bit her tongue and she seems sorry or sometimes will say don't be so stupid then but will ultimately pick her up otherwise she wont stop crying and that annoys her

I wouldn't want her to know it was me whatsoever

Fixitagaintomorrow Thu 17-Jul-14 17:50:00

If she does all that in front of you I hate to think what goes on behind closed doors. I also suggest you ring nspcc.

Topaz25 Thu 17-Jul-14 17:54:01

How would you feel if someone treated your child that way? You know it's wrong. Hopefully if you report it your friend will get some help but her daughter's safety is the priority.

Topaz25 Thu 17-Jul-14 17:55:45

She probably won't know it is you because she seems to openly show contempt for her daughter and treat her cruelly in front of others, other people, such as neighbours, friends and acquaintances could have noticed. Anyway she has no one but herself to blame.

annielouisa Thu 17-Jul-14 18:07:14

When I initially read your post I thought the SS maybe a step too far but now I think its a must. What could be happening to that poor DD when you are not there to witness it?

It sounds like your friends resentment toward her ex is being transferred to her DD. Whatever the reason for the behaviour it needs to be stopped or this will be a very damaged little girl.

littlemisssarcastic Thu 17-Jul-14 18:22:51

Sounds like your friend is struggling and needs support.
How much support does she have from her xp, family and friends?

The physical dragging and the emotional abuse are definitely something SS will be interested in but the swearing at her DD isn't breaking any laws despite it being inappropriate to you and me.

I really can't see SS removing her DD over the things you have said, although they may be able to direct your friend towards accessing some support.

CrocsAreJustPlainUgly Thu 17-Jul-14 18:24:04

I believe that what she does in front of me is the same as when she's alone. She shows no/very little remorse for her actions when in front of me as if it's a normal thing to do

oldgrandmama Thu 17-Jul-14 18:28:33

That's awful. Especially the slapping the head - potentially very very dangerous. At the very least, if I were you, I'd phone the NSPCC, as suggested up thread ^ Poor little kid. And as others have pointed out, if she behaves like that to the child in front of you, what does she do when alone with her?

AllThatGlistens Thu 17-Jul-14 18:41:23

Oh my sad

I understand that she's your friend, but surely you must see that her behaviour is absolutely abusive?

If she can't cope with her child then she needs support.

The child, the single most important person in this situation, needs protecting.

This is abuse, and that poor, poor little girl needs someone to step up and speak out for her.

Your DP is absolutely right that she needs to be reported, I'm appalled that this is being allowed to carry on under your noses.

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