"Family long term finances" - sorry, it's a long one

(56 Posts)
Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 10:26:37

I've just logged onto the email account that DH and I share.

In the inbox, there is an email to DH from FIL with two things in the subject heading, and this is the second one.

I looked at the email (not particularly snooping - it's a shared account so please don't flame me) and it's obvious that there has been a conversation where bits have been deleted iyswim.

To give a bit of background, FIL especially is one of the most money grabbing gits I've ever met. He convinced his mother before she died to change her will so that he was favoured over his siblings. He openly admits this. MIL's father died last year, and he keeps going on and on about how they haven't received anything from the estate (MIL's mother is thankfully still with us so I just assumed that it would go to her? Not that it's any of my business of course)

Also, so as not to drip feed, before DH and I got together, FIL had an agreement with DH that, when buying a property, whatever DH put in as a deposit he would match. FIL insisted that this was a written agreement. When we bought the house (which I ploughed all my savings into and my mum and dad helped massively too) FIL announced over dinner that if we split up he wanted his money back with interest. Completely understandable, but actually it had fuck all to do with me - our finances were separate until we got married (which wasn't for years). It wasn't what he said, more the way he said it (he previously told me that DH and I weren't suited and he was surprised that we lasted more than a month - that was 14 years ago).

When my own grandparents passed he wanted to know the ins and outs of their wills. In addition, DH's brother "bought a share" of the family home and DH didn't find out about this until 3 years later.

I don't know why I'm posting. I suppose I'm asking aibu to be a bit pissed off, especially as I dread another onslaught by FIL to find out about our finances. Also DH and I have no secrets whatsoever, aibu to feel a bit hurt/confused as to why this appears to have been covered up?

Reading back, I think I probably am bu. I dislike PILs immensely - that is probably clouding my judgement.

Wibu to ask DH what it's all about? I know for a fact that, if he has covered anything up, it would be because he knows they upset me.

PancakesAndMapleSyrup Tue 24-Jun-14 10:33:32

It sounds like a complrtly oppressive relationship between you, dh and your fil. What is actually in the written agreement? Have you seen it? Would it be possible for you to remortgage and buy him out at the price he put in bearing in mind you havent sold, just to get him away from your finances etc.

The first thing you need to do is tell DH you saw the email. Then ask what it was he felt he needed to delete.

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 10:39:56

I've tried to convince DH but he won't. According to him, an agreement is an agreement.

We had a deed of trust drawn up by a solicitor (between DH and I as we weren't married at the time) - FIL "took the liberty of writing one for us". It stated exactly how much interest he would be entitled to and what share of the house he would own if we split up.

It was a very, very oppressive relationship. It's taken the best part of a decade for DH to realise that his father isn't the be all and end all.....

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 10:44:23

I feel a bit embarrassed about having to ask iyswim? We are completely open about everything else, so this has come as a bit of a surprise.

DH has however been increasingly miserable about his parents recently (his grandmother was admitted to hospital and PiLs refused to return from their "new home" - FILs deceased parents place - to see her. "Well it's not as if she's dying". This is the almost 91 year old lady who was diagnosed with breast cancer and lost her husband within 2 days last year sad )

Looking back, it seems that DH has got more miserable about it since the date of the initial email sad

ajandjjmum Tue 24-Jun-14 10:49:18

If he still has an interest in your home, can you not buy him out now? It's actually quite an interesting point - how situations change, and how something that seems logical at one point in life, becomes inappropriate over the years.

Maybe your DH is just seeing the light as far as his DPs are concerned - which is bound to make him sad.

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 10:52:50

I'm still working on DH re buying him out - he's being bloody stubborn about it though sad

Perhaps the more pissed off he gets with them the more likely it will be that he starts to agree?

Kamer Tue 24-Jun-14 10:54:40

Any chance you can remortgage so that you can return FIL the deposit he put into your house (with interest agreed)? You and your DH could then put the distance between yourselves and your PIL that sounds much needed! And yes YANBU to be upset with your DH that he is having secretive email exchanges about your joint finances.

KatraAllandra Tue 24-Jun-14 10:59:03

Does your mortgage lender know someone else has an interest in your house? Part of the small print for most mortgages is that you can't have another "lender" without the express permission of the mortgage lender.

So, you could remortgage without selling and explain to FIL that lender won't permit his ongoing stake IYSWIM. It could be a way out without actually breaking the agreement with FIL.

sparechange Tue 24-Jun-14 11:04:01

I think you need to concentrate your efforts on persuading DH to buy your FIL out.
Have you got children? Perhaps talking to him about what would happen to their home if something happened to you. Or even what would happen to you if something happened to your DH.
Park the other issues for now. This is the main thing that needs to be sorted...

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 11:06:28

That's very interesting.......

About 3 years ago FIL was banging on about us moving - his instigation, neither DH or I want to move.... confused

In terms of interest in the house, there isn't (supposed to ) be one......according to DH it was a "gift" confused

Fuck I was being naive, wasn't i?

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 11:09:42

What would happen in a worst case scenario - we both have life insurance which is for 150% of the current mortgage - I would settle with PILs and he would settle with my parents (although mum and dad would take a bit of persuading)

No DC but we are trying. Ironically it's PILs who have been sole contributors to pressure on that front hmm

Preciousbane Tue 24-Jun-14 11:12:09

There was another poster whose Mother offered some deposit and wanted a share in the house yesterday. Many warnings about stuff like your situation, I hope she finds your thread.

I would get FIL bought out of his share if at all possible.

All the he is horrible about money, you won't change that all you can do is not link your finances to him in any way whatsoever.

MIL will be coming in to some money within the next year, not sure how much really but probably 150 to 200k. SIL immediatly asked for some, we have actually said no its yours don't feel obliged. Money brings out the very worst in some.

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 11:17:25

shock at your SIL - how bloody entitled!

Unfortunately I know that he will never change. I just, deep down, thoroughly dislike them so much. I feel like I've bent over backwards (ferrying MIL around, thoughtful presents, batch cooking for them when DHs grandfather died, seeing DHs nan on a regular basis (they can't be bothered to visit - probably because there is nothing in it for them) sad

But nothing is going to change them.

My sister got married recently. Her ILs are the personification of lovely. I'm so jealous sad

ChelsyHandy Tue 24-Jun-14 12:38:32

You have my sympathies as my FIL is like this. He hasn't worked for decades hence is obsessed with inheritances as its been his main means of "earning" a living. He constantly talks about it when its a subject I would rather not touch on at all. He assumes I'm after DH's money when in fact I have a better paid job than him.

It seems to be getting worse as they get older. He fails to see the irony in living off inherited wealth himself and telling us (who have no interest in inheriting anything from him and quite positively would rather not) that "there will be nothing left to inherit, don't expect anything from us). Its just awful. DH's siblings and more, so their husband and wife, hang around in the hope of inheriting. There isn't even that much - just an average house.

I don't know what to suggest. DH and I avoid them now. They don't appreciate us for not being interested in their money and the people we are, so stuff them!

diddl Tue 24-Jun-14 14:11:46

When your GPs died he wanted to know the contents of their wills?

Did you tell him to fuck off??

If it's in writing about the deposit, get it paid back.

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 14:32:56

Not only the contents of their wills, but also how things in the house were divided - ie "who got the family silver"

FIL and MIL both cornered DH repeatedly to try to find out how my sister and her then BF got a deposit together for their house - as it was, yes, DSis and I were the only grandchildren on both sides and, yes, they left us the same amount of money each. Then they wanted to know what my mum and aunt had been left, what assets there were, you name it. Until DH finally snapped and said "I don't know, it's none of my business and you shouldn't be asking". Huge, huge step for him.

FIL was most put out when, following DHs grandfathers death, he was not consulted on how to go about the legal bit. He was an accountant, thinks he knows the lot, especially since he dealt with all the legal side following his own parents passing. He wanted access to all the accounts etc. Still whinges about it now.

Spoken to DH and he hasn't a clue why it was in the subject heading. The email conversation was around something totally different.

I'm going to redouble my efforts with DH - we've got the money in the bank, we're really very fortunate, it amounts to about half our savings. It would be worth it to try to get a bit of distance between us and them.

diddl Tue 24-Jun-14 15:01:23

Is he likely to just ask for it back on a whim?

Chippednailvarnish Tue 24-Jun-14 15:06:37

Get a solicitor to double check the agreement and then buy him out as quick as you can. Especially before you have kids.

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 15:36:00

We've not got access to the agreement that FIL drew up with DH. FIL has the only copy.

Not sure if he'd ask for it back on a whim or not. Tbh it's there, so worst case scenario is, if he did, we could give it back to him in a matter of days at the most.

The kids thing is worrying me a bit. I know that they are going to want everything their own way, FIL will be oppressive, MIL (who is as thick as pig shit anyway) will insist that everything is done her way. Because "she's done it before". When we got engaged she wore her engagement ring for the first time in years, to demonstrate (and I quote) "well I've done this all before of course, I know what it's all about - it's nothing special". I mean, wtaf?

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 15:36:51

Sorry, may be evident that I don't have a particularly high opinion of them blush

diddl Tue 24-Jun-14 15:39:09

You need to move far, far away.
<helpful>

NickyEds Tue 24-Jun-14 15:41:16

Who asks about the contents of someone else's will???He sounds like a nightmaresad. Buy him out or suck it up (sorry!). Whilst you still have his cash he will still think he's entitled to stick his nose in where it isn't wanted. if you've got the money then why on earth would your DH want to carry on like this?? Just insist on it then you can move on.

ChelsyHandy Tue 24-Jun-14 15:43:42

Is it only me who is thinking that your DH is doing rather well out of all this?

When we bought the house (which I ploughed all my savings into and my mum and dad helped massively too) FIL announced over dinner that if we split up he wanted his money back with interest

I'm sure he doesn't mean to, but perhaps he has some traits of your FIL in him? The FIL, if he is at all like my FIL, views you less as your husband's partner and more in terms of a cash cow coming into the family.

I would be pretty mad at DH for not resolving this situation caused by his Father. Its clearly making you very uncomfortable and I'd get him off the title deeds pdq by buying him out, especially since you have savings. I think you should go and see a solicitor.

Justfuckitupagain Tue 24-Jun-14 15:50:57

Oh there's no perhaps about it - he is definitely his fathers son sad

But he is getting better - much better

Ironically, PILs see me as a money grabber - never mind that, although I'm 5 years younger than DH, I'm far better educated than he is, earn the same, and in the time it took DH to save a deposit I worked my arse off, doing 40 hours per week whilst doing my first degree full time, to save enough for the solicitor/stamp duty etc. and refused to take out any loan of any kind - I'm still after their second favourite son's money. And yes, MiL has openly admitted that DH's elder brother is the favourite sad

In terms of moving, we moved 10 miles away (NW London) and they then moved to Essex! They did the majority of it for us! grin

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