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did everyone know this was a racist song? (am i the only one who didnt?)

(147 Posts)
deakymom Mon 12-May-14 00:39:56

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-devon-27360884

okay so basically the sun has got his hat on has the n word in it i never knew that i spoke to someone about it and they gave me the look hmm "everyone knows that don't they?" no i didnt blush we used to sing it in school i really dont remember that word being there?

am i the only one who didnt know?

CorusKate Wed 14-May-14 14:54:21

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

vickibee Wed 14-May-14 14:51:46

I watched Dambusters the other week and was shocked to hear the pilot's dog was called the N word. Different times I guess....

CorusKate Wed 14-May-14 14:50:22

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

TillyTellTale Wed 14-May-14 14:41:04

CorusKate It's okay. The 'original' wording, isn't actually the 'original'. Eenie, Meenie isn't inherently racist. The racist version is believed to have developed in America, and happens to have been popularised in print in the early 20th century. But it is not the 'proper' version.

Just use the version you liked when you were a child, or spend your life trying to research which of the early 19th century versions came first. But don't let the racism of some New York children in the 1888 taint your memories!

Hey, here's a Cornish version from 1882:

Ena, mena, mona, mite,
Bascalora, bora, bite,
Hugga, bucca, bau,
Eggs, butter, cheese, bread.
Stick, stock, stone dead - OUT

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eeny,_meeny,_miny,_moe

AdoraBell Wed 14-May-14 03:16:55

I grew up with the original version, and I'm not that old - 46 - and grew up in London. But I am able to separate what kids said when I was young from what I taught my DDs. I've never heard anyone else use that rhym (why can't I spell that tonightconfused ?) here in Chile, so maybe that helps.

CorusKate Wed 14-May-14 02:13:38

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

CorusKate Wed 14-May-14 01:53:32

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AdoraBell Wed 14-May-14 01:26:33

Rufus I knew about eanie meanie, but I've always used tiger with my DDs.

Is that acceptable? Serious question, I've been abroad so long I genuinely don't know if alternatives are okay or the entire rhym is considered wrong.

AdoraBell Wed 14-May-14 01:19:19

I didn't but then I've never heard more than "the sun has got his hat on, hip hip hip hip hurray" or maye it's 3 hip's, I don't know.

TillyTellTale Wed 14-May-14 00:54:03

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K1q9Ntcr5g
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutschlandlied#Lyrics_and_translation
From top to bottom, in order of nicest to most-accurate-record-of-public-feelings-a-few-centuries ago. grin

Germany
UK
France

It's like Eurovision all over again. France at the bottom, the UK being her mediocre self and placing in the middle, and a German-speaking country winning by a mile. La Marseillaise is terribly graphic!

Caitlin17 Wed 14-May-14 00:33:50

I was wondering when someone would bring up the second verse of God Save the Queen. No-one sings it, no-one knows it, few care.

If you want to criticise God save the Queen then fair enough to say it's a terrible dirge compared to Le Marseillaise or Deutschland über Alles.

PolkadotsAndMoonbeams Tue 13-May-14 23:59:50

That's because that verse was restricted to a very small section of its history, before the song became the accepted national anthem if I remember correctly. Besides, there wouldn't be any point in having it in now, would there? He's long dead.

I think there might have been an additional verse from the other side too though.

parentalunit Tue 13-May-14 20:36:11

Poor man, what a shame. This. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NAUgCm-3Tc

0blio Tue 13-May-14 20:23:07

what's wrong with god save the queen?

"Lord grant that Marshal Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring.
May he sedition hush,
And like a torrent rush,
Rebellious Scots to crush.
God save the Queen"

Supposed to be Britain's national anthem hmm

A verse almost nobody knows or sings - much like the sun has got his hat on.

Alisvolatpropiis Mon 12-May-14 22:30:43

Like many others, I wasn't aware there was more than one verse

Hulababy Mon 12-May-14 20:52:54

Heard this news over the weekend and no, I had no idea there was an old version using the n word, or it was in any way racist. Neither did the 3 other adults in the house with me.

PolkadotsAndMoonbeams Mon 12-May-14 20:46:12

Agree about re-claiming (or in some cases, claiming, words). If they have an original non-offensive meaning then they can be used in both senses, for example 'queer' is a much more atmospheric word than strange.

Nigger however, is probably one of the words I'd happily leave to the history books (and songs!). Although I do think it sometimes goes a bit too far - at school I remember seeing the "The Nigger of the Narcissus" in the library, and somebody had crossed out the word and put "The Coloured Gentleman". I actually thought that was worse.

RufusTheReindeer Mon 12-May-14 15:02:42

I had no idea, but I only know the first verse

Didn't know about the eenie meanie one either

I'm 44...and apparently verrrrry stupid

ilovemywestie Mon 12-May-14 14:43:05

I love this song its from the musicals "Me and my Girl". I saw it years ago in London with Robert Lindsay in the lead role. They sing "he's been roasting peanuts......"
I had no idea the N word was ever in the lyrics.

partialderivative Mon 12-May-14 14:19:34

I remember singing "He's been tanning tourists down in Timbuctoo" in a pub back in the 70's, someone had handed out a song sheet and we were all having a knees up.

I hadn't realised these weren't the original lyrics, though they did strike me as being a little odd.

CorusKate Mon 12-May-14 14:18:34

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

AgaPanthers Mon 12-May-14 14:10:19

I think Bill Cosby has it pretty well. Rappers calling themselves niggas are perpetuating negative stereotypes, not dispelling them. How is it reclaiming the word, when the people singing 'nigga nigga nigga' have criminal records as long as your arm and many end up dead in pointless killings?

Montegomongoose Mon 12-May-14 14:05:40

Compos you sound far more tolerant than I! grin

Caitlin17 Mon 12-May-14 14:01:34

On the reclaiming of the n word maybe rappers really want to reclaim it as a word to describe 19th century minstrel troupes but it seems unlikely.

I don't think it neutralises the word. I understand the reasons behind calling a band NWA but also feel continued use of the word is trying to be shocking just for the sake of it rather than being genuinely shocking to make people think.

I tend to agree that if a word isn't suitable for 1 group to use then it isn't suitable for anyone.

Gay is completely unobjectionable whether one is or isn't homosexual and/or cheerful.It's a good word in either of its meanings and should be reclaimed from idiots who use it as an insult.

AgaPanthers Mon 12-May-14 13:49:15

And Two Little Boys has very little to do with Rolf Harris, predating him by decades

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Little_Boys

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