AIBU to think that aid and helping other nations is left to the west?

(20 Posts)
avacat Mon 18-Nov-13 14:39:07

"Aid" comes in many different forms, over many years and the burden of many humanitarian crises is borne by many non-western countries. Pakistan has the largest Afghan refugee population in the world and this has been the case for years. They aren't exactly rich and a well-developed country. India has many hundreds of thousands of Bangladeshis, Burmese, Tibetan and Sri Lankan Tamil refugees. India has, as far as I know, sent some aid to the Philippines via the Air Force and will be sending a naval ship there shortly.

flipchart Mon 18-Nov-13 14:31:27

venus. Have you any stats on Russia's contributing.
I may have missed it but can't recall seeing it?

According to the BBC, the following has been given in Aid (as of last Saturday) -

Asian Development Bank: $500m (£312m) emergency loans and $23m in grants

Australia: A$30m ($28m, £17m) package, including aircraft, medical staff, shelter materials, water containers and hygiene kits

China: 10m yuan ($1.6m; £1m) in relief goods plus $200,000 (£120,000) from government and Red Cross

European Commission: $11m (£6.8m)

Indonesia: Logistical aid including aircraft, food, generators and medicine

Israel: 148-person team, including search, rescue and medical services; field hospital with 100 tonnes of aid

Japan: $50m (£31m), including tents and blankets. Pledged up to 1,000 soldiers, 25-person medical team already sent

South Korea: $5m (£3.1m) plus a 40-strong medical team

UAE: $10m (£6.2m) in humanitarian aid

UK: $32m (£20m) aid package, sending aircraft carrier, destroyer and large transport aircraft

US: $20m (£12.4m) in humanitarian aid, 300 military personnel, aircraft carrier and other ships, military aircraft plus logistics support

So no, it's not just been left to the West. Though China's contribution is pretty poor, particularly as they have the worlds largest currency reserve (at 3.6 trillion USD - three times that of Japan who has the worlds second largest currency reserve at 1.2 trillion USD).

RevelsRoulette Mon 18-Nov-13 13:56:10

And they employ 11,000 people in the uk. There's a benefit to the UK.

iFad Mon 18-Nov-13 13:40:23

The British no longer own Landrover, they sold it to Tata, an Indian company. We do still manufacture it, but don't own it.

KoalaFace Mon 18-Nov-13 10:41:49

shock that's horrifying!

RevelsRoulette Mon 18-Nov-13 10:39:17

And if we are talking about personal donations - I refer you to the companies that put bags through your door or send bags home in your children's school bags, requesting donations of clothing for the 'poor people'. complete with picture of wide eyed child.

Do you think they give those clothes to them?

Nope.

They sell them.

They make a profit. Some are charities, some are businesses, but they'er all making money out of it.

They damage the local economy by putting local people out of business. The local clothes maker can't provide clothes that are as cheap as the second hand tshirt you gave and which the company sold. It is killing the local textile industries. you are hurting the people you think you are helping.

article here that describes the harm it has done

RevelsRoulette Mon 18-Nov-13 10:32:26

Well, as to what we get - who do you think will go in and do the rebuilding after a disaster? And not for free either.

The countries who gave the aid on that condition!

You only get free cheese in a mousetrap.

AbbyRue Mon 18-Nov-13 10:24:45

Agree, there's no such thing as aid! See how Justine Greening has been tweeting pictures of Landrovers being sent to the Philippines? "Aid" whilst championing the way for Brit businesses wink

All aid comes with conditions.

KoalaFace Mon 18-Nov-13 09:00:55

Is it just money from the government that has strings? What about the millions normal people like us have donated? I'd hate to think the money we could little afford to donate isn't being given to the victims in the spirit in which it was donated.

wanderings Mon 18-Nov-13 08:17:25

Is it these strings that the Daily Fail fails to mention?

sashh Mon 18-Nov-13 07:53:58

Well the ship was in the area and has the band on, which means they have a load of medics.

I think it would be a bit mean to not divert a ship, that we are already paying for, mull of medics, away from a disaster area.

Aid is not just money. The richest countries in the world are giving the most money, with strings attached. And the world's richest countries should be giving more.

Neighboring countries often give aid in other ways, the west has not be over run with Syrian refugees because other countries have taken them in

flipchart Mon 18-Nov-13 07:41:43

China have apparently reluctantly given £1 million according to figures and that wasn't a popular decision by a lot of Chinese people. Some thought they shouldn't get a pound!

China and the Philipines don't have a good relationship to say the least.

JCDenton Mon 18-Nov-13 07:38:32

Indonesia have given logistical aid including aircraft, food and medicine, not nothing. It's around the same level as the Philippines in terms of development so I didn't expect them to send x million dollars in cash.

iFad Sun 17-Nov-13 23:41:30

Plus, surely if there is something to be had then logistically it's neighbours including China would have been straight in their with aid to secure any deals?

iFad Sun 17-Nov-13 23:40:39

That all sounds a bit Don Corleone Revels and InThe. A bit, we will do this for you but one day I will ask you to repay the favour!

The total cynic in me agrees with you but at the same time, what could we possibly get from the Philippines and if there are things to be had, isn't there a queue (USA, UK, Japan, Australia). The only thing that the UK seems to benefit from the PH is their foreign talent, that we hire in the UK. I've done work in the Philippines and have managed staff remotely there and it is a minefield crippled with unions and nothing ever gets done. I don't remember it having rich resources so I don't think we will be dragging any deep sea oil rigs there just yet. My DH does a lot of work in the region with risk and contracts and he says that the PH is a basket case that could have been great, but it's politics stop it from bring any kind of player.

Not disagreeing with you, just interested what we will get in return.

RevelsRoulette Sun 17-Nov-13 07:28:34

True, InTheFace. When you think of what strings 'aid' comes with, you realise it's not help but a millstone round their neck!

It's like me giving you £50 and telling you that because I gave you £50, you have to hire my son to be your cleaner at £80 and you can't cash the cheque unless you do x, y, z and in future, you always have to hire your cleaner from me. And buy all your cleaning materials from my aunt. grin

InTheFace Sun 17-Nov-13 03:09:19

Unreasonable if you think that aid is just, and only, aid.

The politics of aid are so grim as to harden the hardest soul. No country giving aid does it for free. Not one. It's the donor countries that will ultimately (indirectly and, sometimes even directly) end up the winners.

Surely neighbouring countries help directly. They did for syria

iFad Sun 17-Nov-13 01:04:30

I am a bit shock about the amount of aid that has been donated to the Philippine disaster. I believe it is 50 million plus other aid e.g. sent naval ship, supplies and a transport plane.

On one hand I am thinking, gosh that is a lot of money when the people in the UK are really feeling the squeeze, but then on the other hand I am very proud that we help others in need.

This is why I am pissed off. I live in SE Asia, have visited the Philippines many times, I know loads of Filippinas and so I understand that these people get the sh!t end of the stick quite a lot. This typhoon is just one of many. When I lived in HK we had regular typhoons which were very strong, but before they landed with us, they had to come through the Philippines first. Those people have it tough on a day to day basis, never mind one with a disaster.

Anyway, where I live, one of the richest countries in the world, a neighbour to the Philippines has donated a couple of hundred thousand USD, China upped their donation to a million I believe, Indonesia - nothing, but we can sail our ship through their seas and maybe pay to use a port or 2. The west and Japan are the ones who have donated immediately and the rest of the world has sat on it's hands once more.

AIBU to be pissed off with this?

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