To think that going abroad for surrogacy should be far more controlled

(137 Posts)
ReallyTired Mon 28-Oct-13 21:29:18

This couple are planning to bring back FOUR babies from India.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-24670212

No one in the right mind diliberately choose to have quads. I feel that the family have not thought through the logistics of bringing up four babies. I feel shocked at the utter contempt the wife has for her two surrogate.

There are laws to prevent unsuitable people adopting from abroad and I feel that there should be laws to prevent unsuitable people using surrogates to get hold of a baby/babies.

WooWooOwl Mon 28-Oct-13 21:36:14

If you want laws to prevent unsuitable people from using surrogates, then you have to have laws preventing unsuitable people from becoming pregnant or fathering children. And that's clearly not going to happen.

You do have a point in that there's something wrong with this story, but I think the mistake made was by the Indian clinic that allowed the couple to use two surrogates at the same time.

MisForMumNotMaid Mon 28-Oct-13 21:36:18

I wish the couple in question much luck. Who knows how any newspaper article gets twisted to dramatise the story. They are now in the situation they're in and credit to them they're already looking out for the babies they've made with a positive outlook.

How many parents would have been so enthusiastic about the whole process if they'd really know all the ins and outs?

I do feel there should be regulation of the use of foreign surrogates market and like with IVF maybe a limit to implanted embryos at any one time.

Grennie Mon 28-Oct-13 21:41:10

Totally agree. There have been stories in the press about women forced to be surrogates abroad. It should be much more tightly controlled.

bearleftmonkeyright Mon 28-Oct-13 21:43:30

I find the comparison of a surrogate to a builder or a gardener a very jarring. I just think it shows a lack of compassion. The surrogates are merely incubators to the mother in this instance.

FortyDoorsToNowhere Mon 28-Oct-13 21:43:45

I wish them luck.

Thank god I have never been in the situation of wanting a baby so much that I will willing for another women to carry my unborn baby.

She is not bringing 4 random babies home, she is bringing home her 4 biological children home.

It's rare as the article says.

SomethingOnce Mon 28-Oct-13 21:47:50

I wondered what would happen if one or more or the babies turned out to have serious health problems.

The whole thing makes me feel very uncomfortable.

candlelight2012 Mon 28-Oct-13 21:58:56

The mother does not come across well in this article.

She may or may not have been misquoted but regarding someone who will be your surrogate akin to a tradesman is highly offensive.

Also too many women in India are forced into this situation, it should be regulated to stop exploitation

DevilsRoulette Mon 28-Oct-13 22:06:13

Having read articles about the treatment of women in some countries, where they are basically treated like cattle and kept to produce baby after baby, I would be concerned about anyone who was using a surrogate in order to have a baby and would hope that they would ensure that the woman was doing it freely and was treated well. It's a booming business and women are being exploited in it. And the more popular it becomes, the more women will be at risk. Perhaps even held and coerced to the point where you think is this any different from being forced? This worries me a great deal.

ReallyTired Mon 28-Oct-13 22:14:06

"She is not bringing 4 random babies home, she is bringing home her 4 biological children home.

It's rare as the article says."

The babies may have her biological material, but at this moment in time that does not make her the mother. I feel that indian women who are carrying these babies are as much the babies' mother. It would be pretty offensive to suggest that a woman who uses donor eggs is not the mother of her baby.

Men and women donate sperm and ova all the time and this does not give them rights over a baby born in the UK. In the UK the surrogate is considered to be the baby's mother on the birth certificate. People go to India because the law is in favour of the parents and unlike the UK the surrogate cannot change her mind.

I feel that the couple should have a home study from a UK social worker before they are allowed to bring the babies home. If the parents are deemed unsuitable then I would like to see the babies adopted in the UK rather than rot in an Indian orphanage. Ideally the home study should be completed before the surrogacy process starts.

Bogeyface Mon 28-Oct-13 22:23:13

IMO neither if them is coming out well.

"We had six embryos in the fridge and typically you would use one surrogate, but I thought get me two surrogates and implant three in each," says the husband

Get me two surrogates! Like they are lottery tickets.

"She's doing a job for us, how often do you communicate with your builder or your gardener?"

"She'll get paid…we don't need to see her. As long as she's healthy and delivers my babies healthily, she's done a job for us," says the wife.

This is a couple far too used to paying to get things done, and they did it to get a family. Except that with 4 babies at home I wonder how it will play out. Frankly I think that Daddy will have buggered off within a year.

SomethingOnce Mon 28-Oct-13 22:28:44

The clinic's "They asked us - is this what you want? Otherwise tell us now and we'll do the necessary." was a bit grim too. I mean, surely they must've considered the possibility that all of them might stick.

Bogeyface Mon 28-Oct-13 22:32:23

I wonder if they are going to have the babies parenting ascertained via DNA testing. If I was taking advantage of such lax regulation then I would also be worrying about the consequences of using a clinic that was more interested in profit than morals.

There is no guarantee that the babies are actually theirs.

ReallyTired Mon 28-Oct-13 22:32:40

I feel its morally repugent to implant three babies into a woman. What would have happened if the babies were disabled. Would they be left to rot in an Indian orphanage?

Surrogacy is completely different to a natural birth. It is far harder for biological parents to bugger off and leave their disabled child in India. At the moment parents who use surrogacy abroad have all the advantages of adoption and the advantages of a natural conception.

I feel that laws on surrogacy and bringing children into the UK from abroad need to be tighted.

Bogeyface Mon 28-Oct-13 22:38:07

I totally agree Really

As it stands then can "refuse delivery" as it were, if any of the children are not up to standard ie; are disabled or ill. Having read their comments, I very much doubt that they have considered having a disabled child, and given the mothers comments, wouldnt accept that child into their lives. It also implies that if any of the children are not born 100% healthy then the mother will not be paid.

It also questions the bond they will have with their children if they feel no need to have any contact during pregnancy. If I needed a surrogate in order to have a baby, I would be in daily contact, she would be sick of me!

Seems you can outsource anything. Those poor poor women sad

hettienne Mon 28-Oct-13 22:38:34

I agree actually. Does some paperwork need to be done for the babies to become legally the children of the biological parents? If so maybe it should not be possible unless they have been assessed by social workers as adoptive parents are.

Grennie Mon 28-Oct-13 22:39:03

And this craetes bigger health risks for the women who are surrogates as well.

Bogeyface Mon 28-Oct-13 22:49:48

Grennie it really does but I very much doubt that they are financially compensated for that, so that if anything happens then their families will still be ok.

Its a disgusting practice, I am struggling to articulate how I feel about this.

Grennie Mon 28-Oct-13 22:54:11

Yes I think there is so much wrong with paid inter country surrogacy. I think it is about well off couples, exploiting much poorer disadvantaged women.

And anyone who can afford international surrogacy, is well off relative to the women they are paying.

2468Motorway Mon 28-Oct-13 22:54:38

I really hope the couple were misquoted. They exhibit such a repellent attitude to the women helping them have children. Also haven't they heard of epigenetics? It really isn't like using a carpenter.

Bogeyface Mon 28-Oct-13 22:55:27

You know what, I think I can articulate it actually.

There was a time in history when people from other cultures and continents were seen as inferior to those in the west. That led to slavery.

I see no difference in that point of view than the points of view that have led to this.

There are women throughout the world that are surrogates because they want to give a gift. They have an inner strength that allows them to carry another womans child, and in some cases their own child, and give that child away at birth. The Indian women in these baby farms are led to surrogacy by sheer financial need and some of the customers give no more thought to them than they would a brood mare. It is slavery by any other name.

SomethingOnce Mon 28-Oct-13 22:55:42

Sadly, t's just another of the - arguably ugly - consequences of global economic inequality.

Bogeyface Mon 28-Oct-13 22:58:35

2468 I have heard of epigenetics but I dont fully understand it. Could you explain? I am guessing it is to do with the biology of a child created with the genetic information of its parents being altered by its surrogate mother.

SomethingOnce Mon 28-Oct-13 22:58:36

2468, can you explain a bit about what you mean about epigenetics in the context of surrogacy?

Grennie Mon 28-Oct-13 23:00:49

Bogeyface - That is a brilliant comment. And I totally agree.

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