ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
I need some perspective on this, are they unreasonable or are we?(65 Posts)
I've kind of written about this before, then it escalated and escalated and now it's just ridiculous.
DH's brother and his (then) fiancée were getting married abroad in a big huge wedding (where she's from and where her family all live.)
After a really hard road to conceive and with help from the wonderful Mr Shehata, I was pregnant and due a few weeks before the wedding.
With the cost, the baby and the fact I was going to be having a c section, we thought it a bit difficult to attend.
Back and forths (many Many arguments) and them asking DH to be best man and our older DD to be a flower girl we thought it would be irreparable to our relationship if we didn't go, so suggested to them that we would arrive the Thursday evening, have the wedding on the Friday, then fly home Saturday morning, leaving newborn DD2 with my parents for as little time as possible.
They said this was unacceptable, and that due to a wedding rehearsal, we all had to come Tuesday.
My DH is a self employed contractor so doesn't get paid if he doesn't work, and had already planned to have some time off when the baby was born / work from home so couldn't take the piss. (And we couldn't afford it!)
They countered that they had come away to our wedding.. But we had paid for them and there hadn't been any children involved at the time.
It became ridiculous, they told everyone I had called her a bad mum (which I would never) and spread a few more rumours. Then refused to speak to us... For about three months.
During this time we didn't see them or their son, or DH's parents at all (who they were living with.)
I ended up in hospital with a few pregnancy problems and DH sent them a message saying how ill I was and that we missed them and it was all so stressful, and they ignored it.
I had my baby, and messaged them and sent them a picture, and they ignored it.
My baby has been Very difficult. And I've suffered from postnatal depression, and still do.
Two days before the wedding DH heard that a guy that hates him was now being best man and was planning to make some jokes about him in the speech and got really upset, which is totally uncharacteristic of him, so I bit the bullet, asked my mum to have my baby, and we flew there and went to the wedding.
It was awful, the jokes happened, we were seated with some of her cousins who clearly made their thoughts known and it was just a very awkward day. We told her at the reception she looked beautiful, great wedding and she said how brilliant it was that we had come.
So, once we were home, we thought everything would improve, but it's now been three more months and my baby is now 4 months old and they still hasn't spoken to us, continued to spread rumours, and make things difficult.
I got an unexpected email from her today saying that DH's parents want us to get together for a Christmas Day (a few days before as she's going home to her family.)
I replied saying that to be honest, after not seeing each other or speaking for basically three months, wouldn't it be a little strange to just all get together for a Christmas Day? What with the totally hurtful situation with my baby, the wedding and the rumours and lies (all over a rehearsal!!) if they were willing to apologise, we'll drop it and we can talk about Christmas.
She said absolutely no way will she apologise and that she'll happily go back to silence, and they'll have Christmas without us.
We uses to be so close, the fact it, I miss her, DH misses his family, our nephew has no idea who we are and my DD (and new baby) never see that side of the family.
But we feel so hurt. Over a rehearsal!!!
Should we just drop this? Go to Christmas and grit our teeth? AWBU? Or are they?
Sorry it's long!!
Your SIL has shown her true colours. You have a right to miss the person you thought was your friend. This toxic bitch is not that person. You do not need this sort of behaviour in your life. Just because they are family does not give them the right to behave towards you in this way.
Time to move on and leave them in the past. Look forward to meeting genuine people in the future.
I hope you have a lovely Christmas with your family as your dh sounds like he talks a lot of sense.
You poor thing.
I feel like drop kicking the lot of them for you.
If your side of the family are good to you, and your DH is happy to leave it... Then I would tbh. No good can come from trying. Once you actually make your decision, and stuck with it, I promise you'll feel a lot better.
I hadn't realise how much I'd been affected by it until about a month after, I think it was at Christmas as well; I realised I felt well for the first time in about 2 years. PND is horrific. Anything or anyone affecting it should be addressed sharply, and removed from your life until you are well again.
I'm sorry, OP but I can't even see what the issue is here. Why on earth would you want to remain "friends" with such vile people? If your DH say step away, and they are his family, then I really think you need to listen.
I understand you may miss the friendship you had with this woman but I can't imagine it will ever get to be on the same level it was again. Cut your losses, move on to make new friends and concentrate on those who genuinely do care about you, I.e. Your family, dh and dc.
I know it sounds simplistic but life doesn't have to be that complicated.
Thanks everyone, you're all right.
I do have lots of other friends, I just loved spending time with her / them.. As did DH before all this.
DH has a big extended family of lots of cousins the same age as us, with children the same age, lots of lovely aunts & uncles, it's just ruining family occasions because of her. (And BIL to some extent, though I suppose you should always stand by your wife.)
I know an apology would mean nothing, that's why I don't understand why she won't just do it, even just to placate DH.
It makes me feel heartbroken because it feels like no one gives a shit about my baby, her aunt & uncle, her grandparents... They didn't care when I was ill and pregnant, they didn't care when she was born and they don't care now. I really think all this has contributed to how hard it's been with her and I do hate them for that. I suppose I feel more than anything that I just want her to take some responsibility for how shit this how situation is and that she caused it.
I think you need to stop trying.
We don't speak to dh's brother and his wife. Her behaviour has been very similar and they have become so nasty and horrible that 4 years has been bliss without them. I know they miss us more than we miss them.
Family isn't always about blood, it's about the people who you want in your life. Do you really want to constantly be on edge about, what they may do next.
Listen to your dh, stop trying and enjoy what you do have. Invite the inlaws over more and if they ignore you, then you know where you stand.
Didn't see the other threads so I don't know the whole story, but they sound nightmarish.
I had difficult family relations with my Dad around the time I had my DC; he was basically really disappointed with me that I'd 'gotten myself pregnant'. DH and I were married, had a nice house and both had good jobs. He was generally awful; berating me and putting me down; I'm convinced it had a role to play in my PND, which was horrendous btw. Eventually, we had to cut contact for a while, and see the pair of them only about 3 times a year so that DC have a choice about the relationship.
My point being; we all have 'those people' in our families. My DH was very much 'mrsziggie. I know they are your parents, but they are horrible, vindictive people. We need to stop seeing them so you can not be bothered by it any more.' I was just so desperate to fix the situation, I really couldn't see his POV. It caused a few ructions between us.
I do feel better now with them more or less out of our lives though. A few months after I moved on; I felt so much better I was able to stop taking my anti depressants. It had been affecting me that much
They sound like rude, spoiled little people. Hunker down a little bit with the people who like you best. You don't need the friendship of people like that. Why would you want it? What are they actually bringing to the table here? Apart from being your DH's family?
Sorry if this has already been said but next time your PILs say they can't take about it because they don't want to be involved it would be worth pointing out that they are already involved and have clearly taken sides since they are continuing a good relationship with them but not with you.
I wouldn't ever speak to them again. But I'm a stubborn mofo.
I remember your house sharing and bonkers in law thread.
Cut them out, they're all selfish and entitled wankers who add nothing to your life.
You have valued sil more than she ever valued you and the fact that your bil let the best man make jokes about his own brother at the wedding is just dispicable.
Enjoy your life with your dh and children.
I think your dh is right. If you are lonely and miss her then start making an effort to meet other people. Being lonely doesn't mean you have to put up with people treating you like shit.
Your dh is the only person thinking reasonably in this whole saga.
I agree with your DH. I understand that you are hurt, and burning with the injustice that has been meted out to you and your DH, but this woman has not only shat on you and your family personally, but also got all of DH's family to do the same!
HOW can you want to be "friends" with this shallow bitch? Seriously?
Let it go.
Re. DH's family - well, they've made their choice. They are losing out. Your DC don't need pathetic people like that in their lives - they need honest decent people who actually care about them, which clearly your DH's family don't, or they wouldn't have behaved so badly and would have stood up to the selfish bitch.
Go out! Find new friends, forget about this one, she's no friend to you or your family.
You know, I had not picked up the fact that your DH just wants to let them go. Since they are his family and it's just causing you to fight, I think I would go with his preference, at least for a while -- maybe down the road he and you and they will feel differently.
"our arguing is more about DH being fed up of trying anymore and how much it gets to me."
So stop trying. Your DH is right to be fed up, his entire family are shits. he accepts that and now it is time for you to accept it. Read your own OP, how can you not see them for what they are? Stop arguing and start agreeing with your DH. I know you said that you miss her, but IMO the person you miss may have existed once but does not currently exist and is unlikely to exist ever again. And as for his parents - you are well rid of them as well. I remember your 'remodelling the house for a party' thread; they are, as someone has already pointed out, batshit crazy.
I am always amazed at how much the idea of faaaaamily has a hold over people, where they will move heaven and earth to facilitate a relationship between their DC and (usually toxic) grandparents/wider family, without considering whether that relationship will be healthy for their DC or whether it will in time turn out to be the total headfuck that their (the parents) relationship with these toxic relations already is.
Step away from the crazy people.
Cut the toxic bil/sil out. I would cultivate some sort of relationship with the pil for dh and dc sake possibly.
Very much on your terms and very much that they remain neutral and that that neutrality is demonstrated. I.e not by saying they aren't taking sides but then not visiting for weeks.
I too think your DH is right here.
Listen to your husband. He's got a point.
Think of it this way - is this the type of people you want your children being exposed to? Do you want them growing up thinking that this is normal?
Holy crap! I did NOT realize those PILs who wanted to move in and that SIL who was having the wedding abroad were the same family. Okay, they are just ridiculous people. On both those threads they sounded just madly entitled and completely lacking in perspective.
Putting together their (again, madly entitled) behavior on each separate topic, it's clear imo. that the four of them are all really overinvested in each other's happiness, to the point of supporting each other in really unreasonable and downright mean behavior no matter how extreme, and not at all invested in your happiness. Whereas you and your DH are taking the sort of normal friendly family approach of everyone being invested in everyone else's happiness in a caring-but-still-have-reasonable-boundaries sort of way.
Of course you must miss them. It really must be a big hole. But their behavior has been awful. Do you think perhaps your DH could write them a letter just setting out how and why you both found their actions so unnecessary and so hurtful, closing it saying that you both miss them very much but you're not able to be the family scapegoats or the family doormats? I just wonder, if the letter were very calm, very simple in laying out the facts and your feelings, no inflammatory language, firm but regretful, etc., it might really strike them what they have been acting like.
B/c reconciliation will only work out if they can see how unreasonable they've been. And they just can't seem to see or hear it at all. But the experience of reading that letter might lay it bare to them in a way they couldn't avoid.
Btw. I'm sorry you had such a hard time after your DD was born. I hope you're feeling okay now, and her too.
Listen to DH; he's speaking sense. It is horrible and you are right but being right is not any comfort and won't change her mind or make your PiL back you up or change that the lot of them have let you down. Going over and over it in your mind won't change how dreadful it all seems and won't change the outcome. You are definitely right but it won't do you any good, won't help you fill the hole in your life and won't persuade anyone of anything except you that you are terribly hurt upset, and it won't help you fill the hole in your life.
So what can you do, given that you can't change anyone's mind or behaviour?
I think you're DH is right to want rid. She might have left a hole but you'll find other, nicer people to hang out with. Honestly, she sounds vile.
You've got a wonderful 4 month old baby to enjoy, you shouldn't be dealing with their shit, you should be making the most of your little one. They are being utterly unreasonable.
That's what I thought too... But our arguing is more about DH being fed up of trying anymore and how much it gets to me.
SIL and I were both shift workers for a few years and spent all our days off together during the week, watching movies and having lunch etc..then when I had DD1 and she became pregnant with our nephew we all went to rhyme time and walked around the shops / did baby groups... That's why this has left something of a hole in my life.
DH undoubtedly misses his family but is so completely pissed off with her (that she's essentially kept him from his family for 6 months) that he wants to give up.
This is going to sound really weird and I'm not underestimating the crap you've already been through, but (am ready to be flamed here) if its causing trouble between you and dh could you use this 'christmas' to say to him that you will try one more last last time and if they continue to be like this that he must never expect you to do what they want again? I partly say that because it is coming between you and partly because you said you miss them? (Gets coat and slinks away)
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