To suggest ds being moved away from a certain child in class

(88 Posts)
bubalou Tue 22-Oct-13 15:11:03

Advice needed from more experiences parents please smile

Ds is 5 and in year 1 of school. In reception we had no problems with any other children, we know there are some that misbehave more then others but that's children.

He has obviously moved teachers now and since being in year 1 they have 'assigned seating'. It seems like she changed the tables around a bit the first few weeks I'm guessing to establish which kids sit and work well together or to move friends so they don't mess around etc.

I don't overreact so when ds has come home and said that this particular child - lets called him 'Damien' (wink) has pushed him over today - I cuddle him, talk about it and we let it go. The next week Damien hit him and told ds he hated him but ds also told me that Damien got sent to the office for this. Since then it has been 1-2 times a week of pushing, stabbing in the arm with a pencil!!! And yesterday ds had black felt tip all over the back of his sweater - Damien again! I found out that poor ds has had to sit next to Damien every day - probably why this is occurring so often.

It's parents evening tomorrow - Aibu to being this up with teacher?

SunshineMMum Fri 25-Oct-13 21:44:51

... oops wine ASD

SunshineMMum Fri 25-Oct-13 21:44:26

It is really tough Ds has ADS so we have been on both sides of the fence in terms of the scribbling etc, which is pretty tough to take for a child who is conscientious. the violence is another matter entirely too. Stick to your guns, I hope that child gets the intervention he needs to be able to integrate, there must be some issues, be it behavioural or something else. Awful for those suffering! flowers

bubalou Fri 25-Oct-13 21:39:22

Thank you all - sunshinemmum - I have thought about this and as I said I'm not a mum that beloved her child is the messiah and incapable of doing anything wrong but he really isn't like that.

Even at 5 he takes work, school and being in class quote seriously. He comes back daily and tells me how he can't believe 'so and so' wasn't listening to the teacher etc.

He is an only child and honestly is just so gentle and sweet with other children and the teacher did day this. I suppose I can't be 100% sure though but this kid has caused problems for lots of other people I know too and has had bad behaviour issues since he started reception with ds over a year ago.

confused

toobreathless Fri 25-Oct-13 18:51:55

.....don't want their child sat next to Damien. If necessary Daniem needs to sit at a table by himself if every other reasonable measure had failed. It is not acceptable for another child to put up with aggressive behaviour on a regular basis.

toobreathless Fri 25-Oct-13 18:49:52

YANBU & you sound lovely and very sensible.

I would ask the teacher to try and address matters, although to be fair it does sound as though they are trying. If things don't improve Ineoukd want DS moved. Tough if other parents d

LEMisafucker Fri 25-Oct-13 18:43:38

Ask him round for a play date - then check his scalp for the mark of the devil thlgrin

SunshineMMum Fri 25-Oct-13 18:39:13

Bullying is horrendous, we are going through this at the moment at a new secondary school after two years solid of it at primary. It does sound like you are on the case, with the right amount of assertiveness, that behaviour is unacceptable. They really need to have a behaviour plan for strategies, but of course it wouldn't be appropriate for the teacher to discuss that with you.

Is it at all possible, that your child is goading this child verbally in any way. It doesn't make bullying right, but is the teacher indicated some sort of tit for tat behaviour. Kids can be cruel to children with behavioural issue, not that I am suggesting for one moment, that your child is.

Vivacia Fri 25-Oct-13 16:24:39

Meant to say, I think you've handled this great and sem to have the outcome you wanted.

Vivacia Fri 25-Oct-13 16:23:52

I haven't read through that post OP, but I wasn't referring to your situation, just in general and in response to colder's question.

bubalou Fri 25-Oct-13 16:21:53

I'm confused Vivacia

You would 'remove your child from the teachers care if you felt you had enough evidence they were in danger and the teacher inept'

yet you think that if this continues me asking the teacher to move him is over stepping the mark?

I have left this for over a month and left her to handle it. She has pretty much brushed off the issue when I bought it up. The conversation went like this (shorter version)

'I am concerned about ds and a certain child' - yes I know, you mean (childs name). 'yes, ds has been coming home 1-2 times a week for over a month now with various issues and reasons for being upset (listed them) and i know he is having to sit next to this child every day' - yes but DS does say things back to him, they do it to each other, it's backwards and forwards.

So I said - Oh OK, has DS spat on this child - No
Has he stabbed this child with a pencil or any other instruments - no
Has he pushed him over in the play ground - no
Has he drawn over his clothes - no

(these are all things he has done to my ds)
I asked what he does and apparently ds 'says things back' to this child when they bicker - NO SHIT!

If it's writing on the book or saying something then I might let it slip but if DS gets hurt one more time by this child I have given teacher enough notice I think to insist - quite fairly that he is moved!

Vivacia Fri 25-Oct-13 16:01:50

Yes colder. I respect the teacher's professionalism, their experience and the fact that they are actually there. I know this isn't a popular opinion but it's one I expect in my profession and a courtesy I extend to others.

What's the alternative colder?

If I felt I had enough evidence that my child was in any kind of "danger" and the teacher inept, I have the option of removing my child from their care.

bubalou Fri 25-Oct-13 15:08:15

Bloody spell check - I meant 'run out' and 'potentially' another ten years!! confused

bubalou Fri 25-Oct-13 15:06:47

Thank all.

Funnily enough the thing that the other child does that upsets ds the most is drawing on his work books.

Ds has a little bit of OCD - not taking this phrase lightly, it's not diagnosed or particularly bad like hand washing etc but he likes certain things to be neat and gets upset for example if he has to cross something out rather then run it out in his book etc.

I told the teacher this and that it really upsets Ds that he's working and this child draws on his book and his work.

Her reply was that 'it's only a little line he draws when he does this and in fairness I have told 'ds' to do it back to him - which may or may not be the right thing' confusedconfusedconfused

Ds as I have said is not perfect but he isn't like that - as I have said above about his neatness - he would never do that to another child, even when provoked.

The funny thing is this child being called a bully - he is much smaller then ds (ds is the youngest in the year but he is also one of the tallest). I know it's not about how tall they are.

I'm not looking forward to pot trolley another 10+ years of school drama. wine

missinglalaland Fri 25-Oct-13 14:54:39

Definitely say something! You can be very polite and sensitive about how you say it, but do say something. Otherwise the teacher may not be aware. Also, if this escalates, you need to be on record early.

ColderThanAWitchsTitty Fri 25-Oct-13 14:50:27

I think it's right to share your concerns. I thinks it's right that the teacher has the final say.

So if your child was being bullied daily...and nothing was being done by the teacher (despite her obviously being aware that this child is a problem)

You'd just trust trust the teacher to have final say? Hmmm, I guess that's one way of doing it.

zipzap Fri 25-Oct-13 12:51:27

Oh and if this continues - regardless of where the bully sits next half term, get it down in writing that they are failing in their duty of care to keep your son safe and you want to know what they are going to do about it - within say 5 days for a response.

I think that's the phrase that should make them sit up and take notice; if not hopefully somebody else on here will know!

zipzap Fri 25-Oct-13 12:48:15

If the teacher is waiting until half term to move everyone around then I can see why she wouldn't do it a couple of days before half term - but I would have expected her to tell you that this is what is happening and reassure you that they will be on a very short leash in the mean time. But if it is just because she can't be bothered or thinks that she shouldn't have to do this at your request then that is very different and I wouldn't be happy.

I wouldn't be happy about her equating your ds saying things back to the bully as equivalent to the bullies actions. I would say that your ds knows not to hit back if somebody attacks him, even if he is hurt and/or his property damaged. Instead you have told him to talk loudly to the perpetrator to let them know that what they are doing is unacceptable. If this strategy is unacceptable to her then what does she want your ds to do when this bully strikes again (history suggests he will unfortunately) - as you would like to give your ds a strategy for dealing with the problem.

If she says that ds needs to come and tell her then you need to get it pinned down - what if it happens at a point when she is talking and has just said not to interrupt her for example? You don't want your ds getting hurt by the bully and then told off because he tried to tell the teacher!

I'd also ask to see the accident report / something official for when your ds was stabbed by a pencil by the bully and when the jumper was covered in pen. It's reasonable to ask for confirmation that the bully was dealt with, even if they can't tell you how, and that the bully knows that it was an unacceptable thing to do. How permanently damaged was the jumper - if it all washed out then that's one thing; if it is damaged then it is reasonable to ask that the bully (or his parents!) replace it. Even if they don't - doesn't make it any less reasonable for you to ask. Also the boy should be apologising after every incident. Bit late to do it for previous events but should be expected going forwards. An fit they don't have anything written down then that shows the difference between how you expect them to deal ith these incidents and how they actually do treat them. I don't know if it is possible to actually get them to retrospectively document some of the more serious incidents for the records?

Vivacia Fri 25-Oct-13 09:18:48

I think it's right to share your concerns. I thinks it's right that the teacher has the final say.

bubalou Fri 25-Oct-13 08:32:45

I just mean ask the teacher and say that I am not happy for ds to sit next to someone who repeatedly draws on, spits at, stabs with pencils.

That's fair isn't it? A 5 year old shouldn't have to put up with this at school, which he loves so much.
smile

Vivacia Fri 25-Oct-13 07:48:42

I am going to insist that he is moved

How does that work?

bubalou Fri 25-Oct-13 07:18:29

Thanks all.

I agree with now mentioning to her every time something happens and will make sure I do this.

To be honest I think she might not want to look like she's not handling it so I suspect that she has left it but that now I have said it, it won't be long until he is moved.

Last day of school before half term today do we will see where he sits once they start back.

smile

trinity0097 Fri 25-Oct-13 06:27:27

A teacher cannot see everything, some children can be very discreet about things and if the child it is done to does not tell the teacher.... Having said that most of the time I am aware of what is going on, however I choose to deal with it how I as a professional sees best not in whatever way a Parent comes to tell me to do it. For example I move my seating plans every half term, so if a parent came to demand a child be moved a week before half term I wouldn't move them before my scheduled move. I would however keep a special eye on what was going on an punish any bad behaviour (from either child).

ColderThanAWitchsTitty Fri 25-Oct-13 04:04:42

There was a poster upthread who said they'd prefer to be told that there was a problem and left to deal with it...

But surely a decent teacher should know there is a problem in the first place?

Op if teacher already knows there are issues and hasn't bothered to do anything I would go to the head next. This child clearly needs to sit alone. I realise that isn't nice for him but getting stabbed with pencils isn't nice either.

Scarymuff Thu 24-Oct-13 18:55:51

Now you need to just keep on top of it. If anything happens, speak to the teacher. Every single time. Just say, ds told me that (x) happened, can you tell me about it.

Every time. Seriously. The teacher will either a) move your ds so that he is not next to this child or b) realise that the child has some very serious issues that need more strategies to deal with.

Venushasrisen Thu 24-Oct-13 18:17:48

Huh, not very reassuring bubalou. But at least teacher now knows you will not stand idly by whilst the other child stabs yours, so hopefully she will keep them apart in the future. Fingers crossed.

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