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AIBU?

To ask people to please stop conflating two education related issues which are in no way linked?

66 replies

DrSeuss · 09/10/2013 12:59

If you choose to take your child on holiday during term time, you may be fined. The fine is issued by the local authority acting under instructions from the Department for Education. The local authority has no say in this, it must follow directives. The school has no part at all in this. If you wish to complain, you should contact the local authority, the DFE or your M.P. There is no point in contacting the school, they have no part in the matter.

Teachers were on strike in some areas last week and will be on strike in some areas next week. They have a right under law to do this as do most employees in this country, the most noteworthy exception being the police. Teachers voted to do this and made a personal choice to strike or not to strike. It is therefore entirely reasonable for others to state that they disagree with this decision.

Many people are currently circulating pictures, photos and messages stating that, if they can be fined for removing children from school, schools should be fined for closing on strike days. These Messages etc show that posters do not understand the two issues. They are concurrent but in no way linked.

Thank you.

OP posts:

Report

2madboys · 09/10/2013 13:01

If there is no point contacting the school about fines, then why was I told by a teacher at my Dss school that whether people are fined will be up to the new head teacher?

EatingAllTheCrumpets · 09/10/2013 13:04

Pah! Facts mean bugger all, to the DM and readers. Unfortunately teacher bashing seems like the done thing these days

Growlithe · 09/10/2013 13:05

In fact, you could be forgiven for thinking that one situation has been created in order to rile and detract proper attention, and potential support, from the other.

DrSeuss · 09/10/2013 13:09

www.education.gov.uk/schools/pupilsupport/behaviour/attendance/a00223868/regulations-amendments

OP posts:

meditrina · 09/10/2013 13:11

2madboys if the absence is authorised, it means you won't get fined.

The only person who decides if your absence will be authorised is the HT, so to that extent it is up to them. (HT's total discretion is written into law, btw. LEAs or Governors who try to say it's anything to do with them are misrepresenting the legal position).

2madboys · 09/10/2013 13:17

The conversation was after we'd been told any holiday would be unauthorised (in a newsletter). I was specifically told that it was at the head's discretion as to whether people get fined.

Tweasels · 09/10/2013 13:29

Teachers can't win. They are under pressure from every angle, I really feel for them. It astounds me the amount of people who don't understand strike action and why people do it. I don't expect all people to support it but just understand the basic facts.

If you cannot understand the difference between the absence policy and strike action then that makes you sound extremely stupid.

meditrina · 09/10/2013 13:42

That probably means that HT will be the one who decides when and at what level of unauthorised absence the school should notify the LA for fines action.

DrSeuss · 09/10/2013 14:39

Teasels-and yet, constant on going FB posts of "the school fines me so I'll fine them".

OP posts:

pixiepotter · 09/10/2013 14:51

The result is the same -the children miss a days education.One is terribly bad though and the other not so bad apparently

pixiepotter · 09/10/2013 14:53

..or at least that is what we are being asked to believe.

JustinBsMum · 09/10/2013 14:57

It's a bit like complaints about the police - 'why are they wasting their time on this (small issue in complainants eyes)' 'have they nothing better to do with their time' 'they could have spoken to the school / parent/ child and sorted the whole thing'

If someone complains to the police about something it must be followed up according to strict guidelines, unfortunately it is not in the polices' power to decide that this or that is wasting their and everyone else's time. There are laws and regulations that must be adhered to.

Whingers seem unaware of this.

GeorgianMumto5 · 09/10/2013 14:57

Thank you! The fb 'letter' is driving me crackers.

earlesswonder · 09/10/2013 15:00

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

curlew · 09/10/2013 15:00

"In fact, you could be forgiven for thinking that one situation has been created in order to rile and detract proper attention, and potential support, from the other."

Surely not...........

zeeboo · 09/10/2013 15:02

Pixiepotter is right. Yes, they are two distinct issues and have different causes but both mean a child missing a days education and it is hypocritical that central government allow teachers to strike and ban parents from choosing to take their child out of school for a few days. But then I can't ever take striking seriously, it is foot stamping, tantruming, childish blackmail for people to try and get their own way.

motherinferior · 09/10/2013 15:16

What do you mean 'allow teachers to strike'? The whole point of a strike is that your labour is withdrawn. I mean, you could shoot the strikers, but that's a bit extreme.

motherinferior · 09/10/2013 15:21

Incidentally, women strikers were instrumental in (a) getting decent working conditions in the Bryant and May factory in 1888 (b) getting the Equal Pay Act passed 80 years later. Neither of which I consider 'foot stamping, tantruming, childish blackmail'.

ThingsThatMakeYouGoHmmmmmmmmm · 09/10/2013 16:14

Yep, teachers pay, conditions and pensions directly comparable with women in a Victorian match factory........

landrover · 09/10/2013 16:42

Sorry so what does conflating mean?

Jinsei · 09/10/2013 16:48

As someone who has taken dd out of school in term time several times (thankfully authorised on every occasion but I'd have taken her and paid the fine even if not), and as someone who had to take a day off work due to strike action at an extremely inconvenient time of year, I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. These issues are not connected in any way, and anyone who thinks they are must be somewhat lacking in intelligence.

The teachers do not go on strike because they fancy a day off work, but because of fundamental changes to the terms of their employment.

Jinsei · 09/10/2013 16:50

As someone who has taken dd out of school in term time several times (thankfully authorised on every occasion but I'd have taken her and paid the fine even if not), and as someone who had to take a day off work due to strike action at an extremely inconvenient time of year, I wholeheartedly agree with the OP. These issues are not connected in any way, and anyone who thinks they are must be somewhat lacking in intelligence.

The teachers do not go on strike because they fancy a day off work, but because of fundamental changes to the terms of their employment.

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CleverWittyUsername · 09/10/2013 17:11

Well said Jinsei. I just wish it was that clear to everybody!

motherinferior · 09/10/2013 17:17

No, of course it's not the same situation. I was taking issue with the idea that strikers were all childish foot-stampers.

Landrover: conflating means 'merging into one'. So people are merging, or confusing, two issues that aren't the same.

landrover · 09/10/2013 18:37

Thanks mother, you learn something new every day! I need to start using conflating in my conversation!

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