to think we should inherite larger share of MiL property?

(261 Posts)
Jellybeanz1 Thu 12-Sep-13 12:55:45

I have been caring for my very nice but sometimes difficult MIL for 3 years in her large country house. I left my job p/t teacher and we sold our small London house to move in. Over the last 3 years we have done substantial work to the house let alone a ridiculous amount of de cluttering from 2 generations of hoarders living there (not kidding couldn't get into 3 rooms). My dh has to stay away 3 nights a week commuting to his old job. We have also prevented the house being sold for nursing home fees (she has dementia and is incontinent).
So when we just had the house valued to see what our options might be for the future I was very disappointed to hear my dh say half would go to the brother. He hasn't helped out at all and we lost money on our house in London as prices have returned to 7% increase. MiL's property is now worth more now as prices are picking up and all the work and effort we have put into it. I have just had argument with dh as I don't feel he is valuing my efforts and also depriving the children of their inheritance.
Aibu and greedy or should we/I be compensated. I have looked for a nice teaching job here but cant find one (2 interviews). I feel like I don't want to carry on with the loneliness, the burden of caring and managing this large house and garden( on my own most of the time ) if it wasn't to improve our financial position. After all the brother i L. is not spending all his time doing up the house and not being able to get away and is actually financially well off. I'm also worried I've messed up my career.

FixItUpChappie Fri 13-Sep-13 16:49:39

seems that the OP is doing most of the work and has given up a lot. No judgement here.

^^This. I hardly think the OP sounds vile what with providing care for her MIL at what seems like great personal expense. Why would she pay rent? They have moved in to care for MIL...I would think it natural that be rent free confused

Of course its not nice to talk about inheritance and wills before a person passes but the reality is OP is aware of this information and I can understand why its difficult to swallow when she has been such a key figure and this brother has done nothing. Maybe not nice to feel hurt, but human nature IMO.

JustinBsMum Fri 13-Sep-13 16:41:11

It seems to be the norm that the females in the family do the caring and because neither elderly rellie or sons feel it is the males' role then the women are just expected to get on with it without any special reward or recognition.
So there is seldom any financial reward, certainly not from elderly rellies.

hellymelly Fri 13-Sep-13 16:40:33

I thought a bit more about my earlier post, and I think the key thing is to take the emotion out of the situation, and just be pragmatic and practical. She needs care, you are happy to provide it at this stage, but would like to be financially compensated for the care and it to be treated like a job (which it is). Get all the advice you can legally, and draw up a clear plan between you, your DH and BIL. Plan for what happens if things change and she needs care that you either can't or don't want to provide. Have an open honest meeting where all three of you work out a plan that everyone can live with.

Loopylala7 Fri 13-Sep-13 15:22:07

I actually feel you are not being that unreasonable, it's a bit like the tail of the prodigal son. Even though he does diddly squat, mil wants to seem faire, but of course doesn't see who is really bothering to help her in everyday life. My nose would be a little out of joint too, but it's always a little tricky dealing with IL's, you can be more honest with your own family, but it's harder being honest about DHs family. I think the best thing you can do is rise above it, try and get more job interviews lined up and press on with your career. If you're working away from home DH may notice how much you were doing once it stops and have a word with BIL about pulling his finger out and helping.

Abra1d Fri 13-Sep-13 14:57:46

I have some sympathy for you, OP. You don't want to end up with few assets for your own retirement and more vulnerable years.

Fair is fair and with less state provision for retirement in the future, women should make sure they don't lose out.

YeahWhat Fri 13-Sep-13 14:51:28

If you do want to care for your MIL in your new home but only want to do it if you are rewarded financially ou must make this clear to your DH and DBIL NOW.
There is nothing wrong with wanting this but you must be honest and upfront.

You can be the most lovely caring and kind DIL ever AND still ask for financial compensation. These things should not be mutually exclusive. Your DBIL may be more than happy to do this.

You need to learn from the mistakes you have made with your current situation.

Personally, I couldn't do what you are doing sad I love me MIL but I wouldn't look after her even to protect any inheritance.

ModeratelyObvious Fri 13-Sep-13 14:41:49

You don't need to have found another job. It is ok to say you do not want to do this anymore. It isn't going to get easier and will only get harder.

<hugs> to you, it must be hard.

Fishandjam Fri 13-Sep-13 14:19:22

forum.alzheimers.org.uk/forum.php

You could also try Talking Point on the Alzheimer's Society website (link above). They have helper moderators on there, who actively post advice. They certainly helped me a lot when my mum was first diagnosed.

Jellybeanz1 Fri 13-Sep-13 14:05:24

Thanks so much MN'er for such good advice. Today has been lucky for me. Fishandjam Fairy Fourgates Hester Cravey Thymeout Flibbery etc. I will join the dementia society today as soon as I have posted this. Good advice about elderly thread and solicitors for proper legal advice. I didn't think that SS would probably want to take money back out, or bil if we couldn't carry on caring in the new home. I don't want my children to be forced out of their home so that will need rethinking.
Yes Cravey she does wander and we have alarms on doors and neck pendant but really she shouldn't be in the garden unsupervised as its steep. She did go wandering out in the snow in her slippers and dressing gown. My dd spotted her out of the window and said 'grandmas walking in the snow' that was a horrible moment. The alarms go off after the doors have been open a while. My private plan is to start to apply for jobs in the area I want to move to so that I'm out of the equation.

ModeratelyObvious Fri 13-Sep-13 13:24:16

And people saying that she is living there rent free - I'm assuming MIL isn't paying any rent although she only owns half, and OP's DH probably has accommodation costs during the week as he works away,

ModeratelyObvious Fri 13-Sep-13 13:19:42

I'm with Hester and CrapBag.

Op probably didn't know how wearing it would be,how long it would go on etc. And she is contemplating bringing MIL with them if they move, but is worried about the financial implications of doing that, extra bedroom on ground floor etc.

OP is a saint, in my view!

Bearbehind Fri 13-Sep-13 12:26:14

It seems to me that the OP entered into this for entirely the wrong reasons (low paid DH wanted to 'protect his inheritance').

Whilst I don't doubt it is incredibly difficult caring for your MIL you should not expect to be financially rewarded for it.

It would serve your husband right if it were left to a cats home as it seems he has used you- I'd be completely pissed off with him in your situation.

Cravey Fri 13-Sep-13 12:25:56

Jelly, inheritance aside, have you joined the dementia society. They really are helpful in terms of knowing what to do next. I think you say you have a social worker. Get onto them. You need some form of respite for yourself and mil. You also need to tell your dh that this isn't working for you. Ad maybe leave the talk of inheritance to the immediate family.

Loa Fri 13-Sep-13 11:51:04

I don't think there is any point speculating about inheritances - I assume that anything left with will be spent on care home fees - (have you seen how much they cost ?)if not that is nice.

It's not yours till its in your bank account so its daft to rely or plan a future on it till it is and its often used as an future carrot to make you take a course of action that may not be in your best interest.

fluffyraggies Fri 13-Sep-13 11:46:09

longing - Personally I think this must be putting your emotional and physical health under immense strain (which will have an impact on your dc) and a nursing home would be the best option.

I was going to say this ^ ^

OP, the money is important, of course, (and i don't blame you for thinking ahead) but it sounds like the time has come for your DH to realise that the plan of you looking after his mum for as long as it takes (ie till she dies) and thereby saving the money tied up in the house, is no longer viable. It is having too much of a negative effect on you and family life to continue.

A person with dementia is on a road of deterioration, sadly. It's not like caring for someone who is simply physically impared - whos needs are quantifiable and predictable over the course of years. Dementia is not something you should be trying to cope with indefinately. Not the best for MIL or you. IMO now is the time to bring the subject of selling up, taking your quarter, using it as best you can, and letting the old lady go into quality care.

(whole other thread there re:quality care, i know)

HesterShaw Fri 13-Sep-13 11:37:00

longing of course they all speculate about inheritances. But they won't admit it. They are too hypocritical saintly.

Loa Fri 13-Sep-13 11:17:55

If you want to move for a school by x date make that clear to your DH and his DB that is what is happening. Renting is an option you haven't mentioned but could be better if you can't access the money tied up in DH share of the house.

If you want to get back to work - tell them that is what is happening. Don't ask. Then tell them what this means in term of MIL care.

Don't ask for permission if that what you want to happen. Give them rough dates that things will be happening and when things need to be sorted by.

Both your DH and his Dbro have a vested interest in you continuing doing all the care and your DH has not be considering the impact financial and otherwise on you or protecting you.

Try and keep DH and you wanting access to his share of the house a separate issue to his mother care and possibly a different conversation not involving Dbrother till later. If they want MIL to move with you make sure you point out the financial implications of this and get legal advice.

You have your DC schooling and your career to consider and after 3 years you are right to start prioritizing these and getting your DH and his brother thinking about MIL care and future much more indepthly than just expecting you to sort it and cope.

longingforsomesleep Fri 13-Sep-13 10:54:41

Do MNers really not speculate on potential inheritances? I love my 90 year old mum dearly but I can't help occasionally wondering what her house is worth. My PIL have also told us that they are skipping a generation and leaving everything to grandkids which, while the rational part of me thinks, it's their money, they can do what they want with it, I can't help feeling slightly peeved! Isn't that normal? Or am I vile, grasping, evil etc as well?

Jelly - I have only skimmed this thread but it seems to me that the most important person in this whole scenario is you. You talk about what your dh and his brother want and what is best for your MIL. I think you've done your bit and it's entirely reasonable now for you to want to reclaim your life and let them decide how THEY are going to look after THEIR mother or pay for her care.

Personally I think this must be putting your emotional and physical health under immense strain (which will have an impact on your dc) and a nursing home would be the best option.

I am not sure about this but there is something called a 'lifetime interest' in the house probably provided for mil by fils will when he left 1/4 each to his sons.

Op were you expecting that when you move you would get mils 1/2 to out towards any property - I understand your position but that does seem a bit unreasonable expectation. She can't agree for herself and if you take more then that is going against fils will. Also if she does have to go into a home anytime after buying jointly with you, you could still be done for deprivation of assets and end up in a terrible financial mess if SS want mils share of the jointly owned house.

You really need to get specialist legal/financial advice on all options before the family meeting.
but make it clear that YOU are not happy having given up work to be isolated from family and friends, and ask what the brothers will be doing regards care when you get a job. [cat among the pigeons type emoticon]

Personally my own solution would be for you to go back into well paid teaching and your dh to give up his badly paid job to care for your mother if he wants the money protected so badly. Work out what his travel and work accom is paying and see how much income he has left over after that. If its less than you could get teaching then he can pack in work.

Don't despair after 2 interviews- you got interviews, they didn't chuck your application in the bin! Perhaps you failed at interview because your heart was not really in it, what with not knowing who would pick up the slack re mil or how much support you would get with the kids etc.

Thymeout Fri 13-Sep-13 08:18:03

I think you need a neutral 3rd party to advise and mediate over this, e.g. the family solicitor?

There would be legal issues anyway if DH and BIL wanted to exercise their PA to sell the house, whether to pay carehome fees or to enable her to relocate with you. And, if you used her money to buy a bigger property so she could live with you, what would happen after she died? Would BIL have any right to inherit a share of MIL's money that is now tied up in your new home?

If a solicitor felt that there should be some recognition of your financial sacrifice over the last 3 years - I've no idea if he/she would - your BIL is likely to be more receptive than if the subject is broached by DH.

Fishandjam Fri 13-Sep-13 08:06:39

jelly, you could try posting in the Elderly Parents board. You'd get good advice and some handholding, without abuse from fuckwits.

diddl Fri 13-Sep-13 07:58:05

But what if a time comes when you are not able to give her the care she needs, OP?

If MIL has dementia, is that likely to happen?

I see that your husband & BIL own half the house between them-but what does that mean if MIL needs to sell her half?

Sirzy Fri 13-Sep-13 07:47:38

Jelly if the burden of care is being left to you then it certainly isn't just the brothers decision what happens next, you have had the role of primary carer for 3 years and probably know better than them what her current health is like, this is unfortunatly only going to get worse over time so you need to speak up and say that you are not happy to continue and what you think should happen next. Make it clear that you will carry on supporting your MIL but you can no longer have such a large caring role. Thats not selfish, that is sensible.

Saminthemiddle Fri 13-Sep-13 07:45:57

sorry, meant I don't see how people can say such things....

Saminthemiddle Fri 13-Sep-13 07:43:33

I read this thread with interest OP as just had a similar conversation with a close friend. I stopped reading other poster's comments when they became abusive - I don't see how people saying can say such things when they don't have the full story.

Firstly, I think you are a saint, a very caring person to look after your MIL with dementia, especially after the biscuit tin incident. I am sure there are loads of other incidents but it seems like you just have to cope and carry on as you are caring for her on your own. It sounds as if both your DH and BIL have buried their heads in the sand and don't want to make a decision so you are going to have to become very strong and have a plan to make things change.

I hope you are claiming carers allowance and this is going in your pocket. Also, you will be entitled to help, check with your MIL's GP surgery.
It sounds as though you need to plan now as her dementia and care needs are only going to get worse.

Obviously I don't know how she is, but it seems the best way is to sell her house and take your share and use her share to put her in a nursing home, wherever that is, is your DH and BIL decision.
You need to get your life back on track for you and your DCs sake.

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