What exactly is the advantage of circumcision and why is their such insistence?

(663 Posts)
FrigginRexManningDay Tue 06-Aug-13 09:35:52

I was watching 'What to expect when you're expecting' last night and one of the male characters was insisting on circumcision for his unborn son,which turned out to be a girl.

One of the reasons he agreed with was making the penis less sensitive. I don't understand the reasons behind it. AFAIK its not healthier or cleaner. I understand it being done for medical reasons of course,but it just seems unnecessary to be so routine in America.

TheRealFellatio Tue 13-Aug-13 06:55:21

I think loads of things people do to children are wrong, but as they're not being forced on me I don't insist that they're banned.

Oh, the irony. So it's ok for you and your religious/cultural community to force circumcision onto your sons, but only when someone tries to force something onto you does it become a potential concern.

The effect of the ban you seem to be suggesting would be to cause immense difficulties to the Jewish and Muslim communities, damage communal relations and cause all sorts of problems for the NHS having to repair the damage done by people having it done abroad.

Really? I thought you all seemed to be quite vociferously in agreement that it was perfectly safe, relatively painless, and with very few damaging side effects. confused

Or should we amend that to 'Circumcision in the UK in 2013 is perfectly safe etc.' because clearly you seem to be implying that it is a potential problem everywhere else.'

So it's ok to cut your sons so long as you do it in a nice cosy first world country. OK. got it now. confused

curlew Tue 13-Aug-13 07:20:50

Olivia, if you are watching this thread, please could you clarify your warning?

SamG76 Tue 13-Aug-13 07:49:05

TRF - It's quite safe when it's done by someone who knows what they're doing and with sterile instruments (as with britot in the UK and elsewhere). It's clearly less likely to be ok when done unofficially, underground, or by someone using the same knife in some initiation ceremony for 50 kids at a time.

TheRealFellatio Tue 13-Aug-13 08:02:12

Yes I understand that, thank you.

So are you saying circumcision is only safe some of the time? Because I think you'll find that worldwide there are quite a few poor babies who are 49th in that queue of 50.

curlew Tue 13-Aug-13 09:01:37

Would whoever reported this thread have the courage to explain themselves?

OliviaMMumsnet (MNHQ) Tue 13-Aug-13 09:19:04

curlew

Olivia, if you are watching this thread, please could you clarify your warning?

It's not really a warning - more a case of we know that emotions run high when matters of faith and religion are involved and well, peace and love really.

As we say at the top of this topic, whilst AIBU does canvass opinions, it is not a fight club. You may disagree with other posters but we do ask you please to stick to our Talk Guidelines and to be civil.

hth
smile

TheRealFellatio Tue 13-Aug-13 10:27:40

The trouble is with threads like these, any custom or practice that one finds reprehensible can only be criticized if it is not directly linked to a specific religion or ethnic minority. You can froth over the act all you like, but the second someone says 'I do this because it's an intrinsic part of my culture, my upbringing, my faith and my identity' you are deemed to have lost the argument and will forever be labelled a racist and a bigot. It's incredibly frustrating.

I once said that I was appalled and disgusted by certain aspects of Irish Traveller and Gypsy culture (specifically the 'grabbing' i.e. the sexually motivated groping and physical overpowering of teenaged girls) and the organised fist fights between men, women and children, witnessed by children from as young as two, who are encouraged to embrace this as a viable way or solving disputes in the community.

I don't think anyone could deny that the premeditated sexual assault of young women, and deliberately exposing young children to organised physical violence is ever a good idea or something to condone.

But dare to say out loud that you think less of a specific race or culture for doing it, and suddenly it must not be said.

Someone reported me and I was deleted, presumably for sentiments deemed to be racist.

curlew Tue 13-Aug-13 10:57:47

Just as someone appears to have reported something on this thread for anti semitism. Or something. Outrageous.

SamG76 Tue 13-Aug-13 11:00:55

I've never reported anyone. I do think, though, that saying, at the start of the thread, that all people who have their kids circumcised for non-medical reasons are bad parents is sailing close to the wind. So that's millions of bad parents just in this country.

Similarly, some of the grabbing shown on the telly didn't look very good, but it might have been set up, and much of it probably isn't much different from what goes on in nightclubs around the country on a Friday night.

You can say that you don't approve of certain parts of Gypsy culture but if you said "All Gypsy Travellers are bad people", or "all teenage Gypsy boys are sexual predators" it would be racist. And the Gypsy Travellers probably consider it weird that others sleep around, or live with their BF without being married.

Namechangingnorma Tue 13-Aug-13 11:12:37

Neither have I reported anyone! Perfectly capable of stating my views openly

Namechangingnorma Tue 13-Aug-13 11:13:44

Perhaps Curlew MN was making their own judgement without any reporting, paranoid much

Sallyingforth Tue 13-Aug-13 11:23:47

I left this thread because it was going on circles, but TRF's note this morning is important and I wanted to comment.

It's so difficult to talk about any subject that touches on a religion because either it gets used by someone to insult peoples' beliefs or someone of that belief accuses it of being such an insult as an easy way of discounting/reporting it. I have great sympathy with MNHQ when they have to arbitrate such topics!
Personally I have great respect for many aspects of Judaism, and I get very upset, not to say angry, if I'm accused of being anti-semitic when I disagree with just one aspect of it.

Strangely enough though, if an atheist pops up and makes the most scathing remarks about ALL religious belief, that seems to be acceptable. I have never worked out why that is sad

With particular reference to circumcision, I would hope that peoples' objections to the practice are not subverted to an attack on one of the religions that use it. It's done to children because their parents' religions require it, and it's done to many non-religious people particularly in the US because greedy surgeons dictate it. It's the act of MGM that is in question.

Amazonia Fri 25-Apr-14 09:03:52

Curiously ion the UK, circumcision is now a matter of social class. While the "ordinary" folks rarely circumcise, circumcision is prevalent in the upper class as well as the Royal family.

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