to think that pub garden after 8.30 should be adults only?

(87 Posts)
lessonsintightropes Thu 25-Jul-13 01:11:39

Prepared for a flaming here and am really not sure what the right answer is, so would be keen to know what others think.

There's a naice pub about 10 mins walk from us. It is v kid friendly which is lovely. There's a nice garden at the back which includes a little playground for the kids. I was in there with DH this evening having dinner. At about 8.30 we'd finished eating - we were sat at the table nearest the adventure playground. There were a lot of kids when we arrived at 7 but had pretty much gone by 8.30, but there were a few - five, say? - all between 3 and 6. They were fairly unsupervised - parents and friends sat drinking about 20 yards away at the other side of the garden, kids were running around, scooting on scooters, and bumping into tables where other people were eating.

I wanted to have a cigarette after dinner and looked around, saw the kids were a little way from us, and lit up, blowing it away from where the kids were playing. One mum lurched over to our table (she really was a bit pissed) and told me off for smoking near her kids. Several people at the table she was sitting at were smoking.

AIBU to think that a) she shouldn't have been that drunk in charge of DCs, b) that they should have been better supervised anyway and c) shouldn't they have been in bed at that point?

I totally get that it's a kid-friendly pub - especially during the day throughout the week - but AIBU to have a fag after dinner in an open garden?

(Hoisting up judgy pants. No DCs myself yet so really don't know if IWBU).

NoComet Thu 25-Jul-13 01:23:44

Sorry, some of us don't have babysitters and will have our DDs in tow if we dare to socialise with friends or family, by the time food has arrived and been eaten it will be past 8.30 and DDs will be running about in the garden while adults have a final drink or cup of coffee.

Oh and give up the fags, I'm watching that habit kill my DDad by inches and you don't want to go there.

bellabelly Thu 25-Jul-13 01:30:25

YANBU. Since the smoking ban, parents with kids can have a smoke-free environment INSIDE the pub. I have 4 small children and, at any time of day, I would expect smokers to be smoking in the beer garden, given that they are not allowed to smoke indoors!

HarrietSchulenberg Thu 25-Jul-13 01:31:11

YABU re kids in beer garden at 8.30 (it's summer hols ffs) BUT parents have to remember that it's a pub environment and not Jolly Jim's Jungle or whatever and not expect everyone else to be child-friendly at that time. And parents should be capable of looking after their children too.

bellabelly Thu 25-Jul-13 01:31:57

And, ideally, parents should be sober when in charge of their kids! But I'm old-fashioned like that. grin

mynameisslimshady Thu 25-Jul-13 01:32:35

You are right, its illegal to be drunk and have responsibility for a child. You were well within your rights to smoke where you did, she should have called the children away rather than tell you off. Does the pub not have rules about the time kids stay until, most child friendly pubs I know have?

bellabelly Thu 25-Jul-13 01:34:30

It's lovely when pubs cater to families, with play areas etc. But most people (reasonable people) would recognise that pubs are primarily for adults.

bellabelly Thu 25-Jul-13 01:35:22

What did you say to the drunken mum, out of nosiness interest?

softlysoftly Thu 25-Jul-13 01:35:41

YABU

Children don't have to be in bed by 7 especially when Fir once they can be out enjoying the late sunny evenings.

If however you had come on and asked if ywbu to think parents should stop kids annoying others diners by bumping tables, supervise their dcs, not all get pissed on duty and accept people in beer gardens will smoke then I would have said yanbu.

I now hate smoking and drinking around kids but that's why I choose to steer clear of pub's. My choice not all parents.

IneedAyoniNickname Thu 25-Jul-13 01:36:14

Well your title and your post ask different questions,

So the title, Aibu to think that pub garden after 8.30 should be adults only? yes you are. It's the summer holidays, its hot. I've taken the dc to the park this late as its cooler. (Not the pub as the one near us has no play area) However, on the rare occasion my step dad looks after the dc, he takes them to his local, family friendly pub. They love it, and I can't see the problem.

And your post, AIBU to think that a) she shouldn't have been that drunk in charge of DCs, hard to say without knowing how drunk she was, and if there was someone else in charge who was more sober. I'd have a couple of drinks and look after my dc, because I know my limits. b) that they should have been better supervised anyway possibly. Bumping into other people's tables is not on! and c) shouldn't they have been in bed at that point? like I said above, its the summer holidays (at least it is here) and tbh its been so hot my dc haven't been asleep much before 10pm.

Finally AIBU to have a fag after dinner in an open garden? I guess not, although I hate smoking myself.

IneedAyoniNickname Thu 25-Jul-13 01:38:35

Slimshady my db used to own a pub, children weren't allowed in the bar after 10pm (or was it 9?) Nothing to say they weren't allowed outside though.

lessonsintightropes Thu 25-Jul-13 01:42:41

Fair enough chaps - thanks, I think I phrased it badly. I'm not really suggesting that kids should not be in the pub at that time, just that the parents should have control of them and also expect that it's an adult environment.

I was quite shocked by pissed Mummy bellabelly but pointed out quite calmly that it was getting on in the evening, we were out of doors and that I thought it was okay. She (I think) regretted approaching us and backed off.

I do think the pub really is at fault here - it's that old chestnut about people having different expectations of the space. The pub itself was hosting the pub quiz but was fairly quiet so there would have been room (and would be cool enough) for them to have moved inside earlier in the evening. The pub however doesn't state that children should have left by such and such a time, but also doesn't state that it's ok to smoke in the garden (although does provide ashtrays - including on the only vacant table when we arrived which is right next to the playgarden!) Setting people up to be pissed off I think?

To reword my AIBU - AIBU expecting to not be harassed for having a (legal) fag in a pub garden at 8.30 in the evening?

WafflyVersatile Thu 25-Jul-13 01:42:50

YABU about kids being there.

The woman was a twat, a twat with double standards at that.

Monty27 Thu 25-Jul-13 01:43:49

Isn't it supposed to be 'well behaved and supervised children' in beer gardens?

YANBU to smoke, particularly as the dm's df's were smoking nearby too.

MidniteScribbler Thu 25-Jul-13 02:01:09

I wouldn't smoke next to a playground with children using it, regardless of whether it were in a pub or not.

lessonsintightropes Thu 25-Jul-13 02:16:00

Sorry Midnitescribbler that is almost exactly my point. I think, given it's legal (and the Mum in question was sat with smokers) that I should be allowed to smoke, given that it is still legal? I tbh think the pub is being unreasonable given the fact they haven't made the rules clear.

Totally happy to accept IABU about kids in pubs at later hours than I'm used to, that's one of the reasons I asked. My DPs were very clear about bedtimes regardless of time of year (spent many a bored evening writing stories in my bedroom) and both my sisters enforce pretty strict bedtimes so they can spend adult time with their DHs, but realise this is unusual/different and wanted to know if it isn't typical - definitely have my answer there, thanks to all.

Answers seem pretty mixed though on whether it was alright for her to challenge me. It is a large, open garden, without clear rules.

Monty27 Thu 25-Jul-13 02:24:00

It's not just a public place, it's a beer garden, in a pub, where adults can smoke and drink alcohol if they wish. It is not a playyground and it is a free country. dam the nanny state. So free in fact, that parents can take their dc's home or for a picnic in the country if they want to be out drinking with their friends where the dc's can play but not near smokers in beer gardens. (which actually these dc's were, as the dm was sitting at a table with smokers}

YANBU

MidniteScribbler Thu 25-Jul-13 02:34:27

Yes, you may be entitled to smoke, but I still wouldn't light up near children. Where I live it is against the law to smoke within ten metres of a children's playground.

WafflyVersatile Thu 25-Jul-13 02:38:29

This isn't where you live.

It's reasonable to be allowed to smoke in a smoking area at a time when the proprietors say no children should still be there.

It's also reasonable to smoke if the children's own adult companions are smoking.

lessonsintightropes Thu 25-Jul-13 02:39:35

Where do you live Midnitescribbler? This is a UK based question and understand the rules are different elsewhere. Also this is not a publicly accessible playground, but a little area of a pub garden (where adults are expected to consume alcohol and food) primarily aimed at adults if that helps.

MidniteScribbler Thu 25-Jul-13 02:44:06

I didn't say anything about whether the woman was rude, or whether children should be in a pub after 8.30. Nor did I even say that you were rude for smoking there. I said that I wouldn't smoke a cigarette near a children's playground. This is still a forum for discussion isn't it? That includes people who may have a differing opinion to yours.

I really wish people would just say that they only want people who agree with them to respond. It's really rather boring when people ask if they are unreasonable then get upset when they get the response they are looking for.

Monty27 Thu 25-Jul-13 02:49:36

I don't agree with you Midnite, in this country a pub is a pub, some have beer gardens where adults can smoke if they wish (some have beer gardens that do not allow smoking).

This beer garden allow smoking and has a play area for kids.

Choices.

lessonsintightropes Thu 25-Jul-13 02:49:41

Fair enough leaves to skulk just wanted to actually have a debate about why you'd posted what you had, hence the questions, rather than a closing-off "this is what I would do, you are being unreasonable." Perhaps I have misunderstood the purpose of a discussion, apologies.

MidniteScribbler Thu 25-Jul-13 02:57:15

I posted what I had because it was my opinion. I don't like smoking around children, it's as simple as that. I think the pub is silly to have a children's playground right next to a smoking section. You were perfectly within your rights to smoke there, I'm not debating that point. Doesn't mean I have to think it's a fantastic thing to have happen and it would be nice if management could look at the layout and see if there is a way to move either the playground or provide a buffer zone around it, which would be the sensible approach.

Monty27 Thu 25-Jul-13 03:02:58

Fair enough MS but the OP did say she was aware dc's were around and gave consideration to that.

Very few people would be happy about smoking around dc's these days, now we know what we know. And it was outdoors in a pub garden where smokers are permitted to smoke.

As OP says, the dc's could have been taken inside to the non smoking zone.

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