AIBU to expect my ex to pay child support - he thinks he shouldn't need to

(57 Posts)
glitternanny Sun 05-May-13 19:50:37

Does anyone have experience of ex partners arguing over maintenance

Yesterday my ex informed me he couldn't afford to pay maintenance (£140pm) - and wants it scrapped/reduced. He's spoken to the CAB and they've told him that he doesn't need to pay anything, and a court would agree with him. I told him to let me know what he thought was reasonable amount but that I would be speaking to the CAB and getting legal advice.

He then posted on FB that he needed some advice - whether to be an arsehole or not - not quite sure what his decision is.

He pays me £140 a month on maintenance - and another £360 in money he owed me (cant transfer to his name) He's due to pay me on Friday when he gets paid. This is the amount the CSA says i should have given the amount of nights he has him.

Our access at the moment relates to his shifts - he works 4 nights, has our LB 2 nights normally - he has 2 more days off and then works 4 days and has him 3 nights. When he has overtime (2/3/4 a month) I have our LB instead - can be anything upto 2 extra days depend on whether its an extra night or an extra day

I need to try and speak to CAB on Tuesday and child options I think my friend suggested and maybe a solicitor if I need to sad

any thoughts/suggestions welcome

;( I can cope with no maintenance until september when my hours change then I'm screwed and if he decides to pay me nothing then I'll probably have to either rent out or sell my flat and move sad

IneedAsockamnesty Mon 06-May-13 11:48:34

If the sum he pays is based on what the csa would expect him to pay taking into account the reduction for contact then don't even get into it with him.

Child maintenance is a different issue to debt repayments. And unless he has lost his job then he has not taking advice regarding this from the cab he is either lying or is misinterpreting what they have said.

Dont even get into it with him just use the csa ( don't bother if he's self employed) then tackle the debt as a totally separate issue but be prepared for him to try and claim the debt payments are actually child maintenance and go back on his agreement.

1Catherine1 Mon 06-May-13 12:07:43

I think niceguy2 has a very good point. Unless you want to get screwed for the money he owes you, it would be best to play nice and sympathetic and agree to reducing some payments (for his loan - over a longer period) in exchange for something signed. I would seek legal advice though.

I only say this as I have also fallen victim to an ex using my overdrafts and spending my student loans to start up his business and then after we split said that he did no such thing. I spoke to CAB who told me that it wasn't worth pursuing because the cost of the case was about equal to what he owed me and the chance of winning wasn't great. 10 years later, I'm still paying for the student loan I was pushed into taking out.

bunchamunchycrunchycarrots Mon 06-May-13 12:15:53

I get the feeling there is a bit of 'muddied waters' here with regard to the money your ex is paying you, and the advice he's had from CAB. I suspect they have told him he doesn't have to pay you the debt, if its a loan in your name with no tangible link to him at all. He's possibly asked them about both the debt and maintenance and has come up with a confused inaccurate conclusion. The maintenance you can sort thru CSA but the debt? That could be a whole lot more difficult to resolve especially if he isn't legally liable for that debt. I've been in a similar situation re debt/maintenance/ex and while the maintenance is now paid via CSA the debt I've had to write off as I couldn't force him to pay it back. If there is anyway to enforce the debt, get advice as someone else has said. It sounds messy and unsustainable long term for him to pay £500 p/m even if he does owe you for the debt, if he can't afford it.

fabinacab Mon 06-May-13 12:42:40

The csa can take someone to court for maintenance but joe public cant now unless there has been a default on a consent order at time of seperation or divorce and its under a year old.we got referred back to the csa.

fabinacab Mon 06-May-13 12:49:35

The law has recently changed because I was going to close the csa case and take my ex to court.the solicitor said I could not.courts do not deal with it now .unless as previously stated it was within a divorce.if there any solicitor s on here that know different I would be glad to know because im owed 5 grand so far.

IneedAsockamnesty Mon 06-May-13 12:55:58

If those built up whilst because of a csa none payment then they can and should enforce it.

fabinacab Mon 06-May-13 14:18:02

Yes they should , but he has no assests, hes put his vehicle in someone elses name, and will work cash in hand to avoid payment.its a no win situation.

1Catherine1 Mon 06-May-13 14:29:41

Then Fabinacab, he has to live with being officially a complete arsehole. I wonder if he intends to do this forever? What a life to live... "I will never have anything or work an honest day in my life just to avoid paying a penny to my ex".. There are many words to describe men like him, I'm sure you've used most of them.

Out of curiosity, when you child/children grow up and he hasn't paid you this money, does he still owe it to you ans will the CSA still try to take it?

fabinacab Mon 06-May-13 14:47:53

Yes the debt is still there even when they finish education.he will always owe it.the latest calculation I had on his earnings was £63 a week for our 3 kids, but he gets £80 discount for her three. Its disgusting , but like my mum said , I didnt get much from him when we were married so nothings changed.his priorities will always be alcohol, drugs and other women. I pity his wife in a way, but then as a long standing friend of ours she knew what she was getting into.

TheRealFellatio Mon 06-May-13 14:52:26

am no expert on htese things but as far as I can tell from what you've said so far, he has pretty much 50:50 care so I guess the CSA are telling him he does not need to pay you money for the child's keep if you both keep him equally?

mummyddoll Mon 06-May-13 15:04:33

Hi sorry always just lurked but felt i should comment as going through a similar thing unfortunately I have been going thru csa for 7 years & as ex dp was self employed & lied through his teeth regularly he managed to mess me & csa around all those years however th csa has recently been taken over by dept work & pensions & all of a sudden I hv regular payments all so far so good smileI would def contact csa let them deal with it & make sure you have proof of debts he is paying as he could use proof of bank transfer but say it was for cs,been here also! good luck grin

OpheliasWeepingWillow Mon 06-May-13 15:15:52

CSA

Ignore all else. He's a prat.

IneedAsockamnesty Mon 06-May-13 16:59:53

Real.

Even with a 50:50 the csa will still normally make a assessment. Its just the usual assessment with the largest contact deduction taken out.

glitternanny Tue 07-May-13 21:33:08

I spoke to them - I am entitled to something - he has to have our boy for 176+ nights a month for it to qualify as shared care - and yes they'd still ask for a token amount.

Cut a long story short I'm entitled for £117 a month - so less than I was getting but much better than nothing at all.

So i emailed him that and he said 'that's fine' am sure he wasn't expecting to get an extra £23 a month - not gonna make that much difference to him really

He's since asked for a list of other bills he's paying me for - my answer was 'nothing else has changed' which is true - his car, his share of the loan, his mobile/internet etc. Dunno what he wanted that for....

1Catherine1 Wed 08-May-13 06:55:09

I think he's about to try and swindle you out of that money owed too. Depending on what the total amount of that remaining debt is, I would be seeking legal advice soon.

Perhaps he should try to get a loan to pay you back, would be less than ideal for him but he could spread the cost over a longer period of time and you would be 100% paid back.

StuntGirl Wed 08-May-13 08:03:49

Go to CSA.

BillMasen Wed 08-May-13 09:11:49

Just a quick enquiry. Does everyone feel its fair that there are still payments due even though care is 50:50 (and all associated costs like food, clothes etc are also split)? I'm in a similar position (however paying the CSA calculated amount with no argument at all). It just feels a touch inequitable.

MoominsYonisAreScary Wed 08-May-13 09:24:28

fab do we have the same ex grin mine just goes SE or gets jobs paying cash in hand if the csa catch up with him.

I've had less than two years payment since we split up when ds was 4, he's 18 now. In the end I just had to let it go, it was causing me too much anger and resentment.

Op I'd see if you can get something in writing. What exactly is he paying you for? You mention car, mobile Internet and loan? Are all these things in your name?

glitternanny Wed 08-May-13 09:37:38

yes everything is in my name idiot tho his car is too and he's been told if he stops paying me ill take the car

he can't get finance

MoominsYonisAreScary Wed 08-May-13 09:43:10

I guess at least if he does stop paying you you can take car/ mobile Internet back (cancel the Internet as soon as you can!)

I did the same, took out a loan for a car. I got stuck with the car in the end, can't even drive and it sold for a lot less than I took out

1Catherine1 Wed 08-May-13 10:30:45

BillMasen - I think it all depends on the circumstances. For instance, if my DH and I were to split (Which we are not considering but just for example). I would expect him to take our DD 50:50 of the time. He simply loves her to pieces but works shifts so would take her in a similar fashion as the OP has described.

I've thought much about your question, and wrote a very long detailed answer - then decided it was far too personal so have simplified it. IMO as long as the child has a main home and a second home, then there are some things the RP will pay for and the NRP won't even think about. Days the child is off sick for one - it will be the RP who ends up losing a days pay, in preference to the NRP. Clothing essentials, rather than luxuries is another. So child maintenance should be paid - some months the NRP will overpay, and other months the NRP will underpay but eventually it should even out. Feel free to disagree with me, politely of course.

If it could be balanced so a child has no main home or second home, and two RP (albeit in different homes) and no NRP, then no child maintenance should be paid, but I struggle to see how that would work though.

BillMasen Wed 08-May-13 10:41:11

catherine thanks. Not so much a disagreement, more a clarification smile. Say neither parent was working for a while, care was exactly 50:50 and kids were not at school. I don't see what costs the RP has that the NRP does not.

From my pov it looks like its all semantics around there being technically a NRP.

Please don't take this as a whine about paying for kids, it's not. It's a small whine about the starting assumption that NRPs (dads) need to be forced to pay RPs (mums).

MoominsYonisAreScary Wed 08-May-13 10:57:11

It's a tricky one I guess, if everything is split 50/50 (which would be difficult) what happens if one parent is earning less, is this because they stayed at home with the dc when they were younger, did this hinder their progression at work? Is the other person doing well because they didn't have to worry about childcare as there was a sahp around.

BillMasen Wed 08-May-13 10:59:26

moomins that would be a separate debate about whether maintenance is due to the parent. Not about what is needed for the children.

That's a whole new thread....

MoominsYonisAreScary Wed 08-May-13 11:20:53

Well that depends, if you were never married and not entitled to maintenance yourself and the dc spend half the week living in a 4 bed detached house in a nice area and the other half in a 2 bed flat in a not so nice area then maybe extra child support should be paid.

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