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To agree with David Cameron

(127 Posts)
McNewPants2013 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:23:04

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/health-22209634

I think it is a good way to ensure that the patients get good quality nurses.

A year as a HCP before commencing a degree in nursing sound a brilliant policy.

McNewPants2013 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:23:19
scarlettsmummy2 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:25:42

Well as nursing really is a vocation I think this would be a good way to make sure you cut the mustard before embarking on a degree course.

BrianCoxandTheTempleofDOOM Mon 22-Apr-13 20:26:39

YANBU, I don't think I have agreed with him before but this makea sense.

I come from a family of nurses (general, mental health and auxiliary's) they all think its good idea

timidviper Mon 22-Apr-13 20:26:40

I kind of agree that something needs to be done to make some nurses more aware of general care but who will pay for all these HCAs and who will train/supervise them?

It's just another bandwagon for Shiny Dave to jump on. YABU to ever agree with him. EVER.

McNewPants2013 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:29:06

I never thought I would see the day I would.

NoWayPedro Mon 22-Apr-13 20:30:23

Has anyone experienced the arrogant 'telling' bedside manners of some doctors recently? Funny how there doesn't seem to be any suggestion of communications skills training/a year as a HCA for them.

Nurses do a great job

AtYourCervix Mon 22-Apr-13 20:30:38

Who's going to pay for them? Or will they be expected to work for nothing?

Hospitals have no money to magically create new posts.

Students won't be able to afford to work full time with no bursary or grant.

Who will give these new HCAs trainig? The overstretched nurses who already have to do hours of student mentoring in their own time?

marjproops Mon 22-Apr-13 20:31:38

If Scameron put more money INTO the NHS then yes. but he doesnt .

too many cutbacks and not enough staff/resources/training/pay.

AtYourCervix Mon 22-Apr-13 20:32:56

If there was more money Trusts could employ HCAs who actually want to be HCAs and train them properly.

NoWayPedro Mon 22-Apr-13 20:33:26

I'm loving this - Shiny Dave and Scameron (grin). Two new names I've learned today

McNewPants2013 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:33:50

I agree, of course in all jobs you get the good and the bad, but my experience generally nurses do a good job.

I think by being a HCP it would mean perhaps a years nursery isn't wasted by people who have made an error in choosing a career.

fatfingers Mon 22-Apr-13 20:34:16

I agree with this idea too. Why can't they look at encouraging existing HCAs to train as nurses? This will free up HCA jobs for potential nurses to take up. At the moment though, nurse training seems to be too focused on the academic, which is preventing people who would make good nurses from entering the profession.

McNewPants2013 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:36:29

The money could come from scrapping the access to nursing course

Plus3 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:37:23

Well I don't agree. It is a fantastic way to devalue the job that health care assistants do - many need & should be qualified to do their job properly.

Better nurse - patient ratios are the way forward, then nurses would have time to do all aspects of the job.

I am delighted the RCN have spoken out about this. I work in Intensive care deliberately in order to deliver a high standard of one to one nursing care.

AtYourCervix Mon 22-Apr-13 20:41:09

The point of nursing being academic is so nurses can continually develop their practice by using research and up to date information (very basically).

You wouldn't want to be nursed by someone who qualified in 1970 and who has done nothing since.

Scrap access courses and wipe out a large amount of people who are able to do a degree but who are mature and gaven't been in education for years.

Pobblewhohasnotoes Mon 22-Apr-13 20:42:46

It's going to be free nursing care. Why pay for more HCAs when you can use students.

What we need is more staff. But that costs money.

AtYourCervix Mon 22-Apr-13 20:45:39

But nobody is going to be able to work for free.

Most student nurses work to pay bills and survive (on top of the practical and academic stuff). Who is going to be able to do full time HCA-in and work for pay?

flangledoodle Mon 22-Apr-13 20:47:18

Nursing is not a vocation, it is a career like any other. Nursing degrees take 4 yrs, so with this extra year training would effectively take 5 years - the same time it takes to train as a doctor.

I am a nurse - a good one too although I say so myself - and if that had been the rule when I was considering training I prob would have done something else. That said I did have a lot of experience caring prior to doing my training (student w/end and holiday jobs). Maybe could be an idea if experience like that could be counted rather than having to do a formal year in a hospital. Having said that, you would have thought that if the recriutment process was good enough suitability for the role would have been assessed at thst stage rendering this extra year unnecessary.

ivehadaverybadday Mon 22-Apr-13 20:47:38

It's another Tory policy that seems to make sense, aka the bedroom tax, which will be a disaster as no thought, and more importantly, money and support, will be given to implement it. I just wish they would think, just for one second, about the reality of the things that they propose, and see what the real issues are - lack of money and staff are they main problem. This will just add to that.

Samu2 Mon 22-Apr-13 20:48:24

I want to be a HCA but the hospital near me turns me down every single time sad

I want to be a HCA more than anything but I can't get my break.

marjproops Mon 22-Apr-13 20:49:20

noway Scameron? that came up a few threads ago about him. a witty mnetter thought that one up. can't remmebr who though.

AtYourCervix Mon 22-Apr-13 20:49:53

And it would be another wedge between fundamental patient care (will be done by HCAs) and 'nursing' computering, paperwork, arguing with bed managers and social workers.

nenevomito Mon 22-Apr-13 20:53:07

What about the people who are already employed as HCA's or want to work as an HCA without going on to do nursing? Surely hospitals want people who are going to come in wanting to do the job and stick it out rather than just see it as a taster and then feck off to do nursing.

Why not just make sure that there's an emphasis on care etc as part of the nursing degree and training.

Why do politicians think that they know better than nurses and their statutory bodies at what needs to be done?

pointythings Mon 22-Apr-13 20:54:52

I don't trust the government on this, I'm afraid. I see this as a way for them to get free HCAs - a nice shiny new cohort every year, and of course they won't need to be paid as they have a vocation, don't y'know, and shoudl be grateful for the opportunity. As a result, thousands of HCAs will lose their already low-paid job. Win-win for the government, lose-lose for everyone else.

By all means let nurses in training do real hands-on work on the wards (and I find it hard to believe that they don't already, I mistrust the government on this too). But not this subtle devaluation of yet another profession.

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