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AIBU?

Landlord rights

51 replies

Derpess · 19/04/2013 19:53

Moving out in just over a week and landlord is arranging viewings. Me and DH have said that we would rather one of us is present as it's our home etc and could he do them evenings or weekends. Landlord has now said basically he will try but if there are any he can't then he is going to do them whether we are there or like it or not.

Am I right in thinking that he needs permission and can't let himself in if we have said we're not happy? Is it trespass?

Also we feel we have been very accommodating so far by taking time off when he has wanted to do viewings at 9am, but we don't want to use up any more leave to do this.

Thanks in advance for any advice.

OP posts:

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JazzAnnNonMouse · 19/04/2013 19:55

He has no right and must give 24 hours notice beforehand anyway.

If you refuse you have every right to do so.

nocake · 19/04/2013 19:57

If that's his attitude I'd tell him that you're refusing all viewings, as you have every right to do. I say that as a landlord who would never treat my tenants like that.

Derpess · 19/04/2013 20:09

Thanks nocake and jazzannnonmouse I feel reassured now!

Just getting really peed off with his attitude, feel like we have been more than reasonable and accommodating and he doesn't get it.

Didn't really want to have an argument this close to us leaving (we have until now had a good relationship) but tempted to now just say you can come on these days/times with 24 hours notice any other viewings outside of what we specify will be refused permission.

OP posts:

UnexpectedItemInShaggingArea · 19/04/2013 20:15

He is being unreasonable. I am also a landlord. I give tenants 48 hours notice and will rearrange if it is inconvenient for them.

Stick to your guns.

LimitedEditionLady · 19/04/2013 20:19

He just has to give 24 hours notice to enter his property,you cant refuse him it.he is only trying to get new tenants if he messes viewers about he might lose them,cut him a bit of slack he might be stressed that youre going too x

thecatneuterer · 19/04/2013 20:42

I am also a landlord. My contracts say that once notice has been given the tenants must allow reasonable access for viewings (I'm afraid I can't be bothered to look for the exact wording), but it basically means that normal rules about notice of visiting doesn't apply during the notice period and they can't insist on being there. May be your contract says something similar?

Regardless it's hard enough to arrange viewings when it's only the landlord and the viewer to co-ordinate, for you to impose even more restrictions seems unreasonable in my opinion.

CloudsAndTrees · 19/04/2013 20:43

If he has said he will try to get viewings at times that suit you, then that's a good thing. I think it would be quite mean of you to refuse to let him give viewings tbh, especially if he's trying to get convenient times for you. It would be a bit crap for him to have to lose out on new tenants just because you want to be there and won't be flexible about times.

Good relationships between a landlord and tenant works both ways. If he's been a good landlord, I'd make the effort. You are only going to be there for another week.

Hissy · 19/04/2013 20:50

LimitedEdition, with respect, why would you post that when clearly you don't know the rights here at all!

The tenant's right to quiet enjoyment means that NOBODY can enter their home without their express permission.

The LL can show as many people as he likes round next week when the OP is gone!

The LL is NOT allowed to just use his key.

OP, If you're happy giving the LL set times, otherwise with 24 hours notice, that's fine, if not, you do have the right to deny all viewings.

Ok it may not endear you to the LL, but it is your home, and you DO get final say sas to who gains access.

Hissy · 19/04/2013 20:54

Normal notice ALWAYS applies, and reasonable access is STILL only with permission of the tenant.

OP, post on Legal Matters, you'll be told a load af rubbish otherwise.

CloudsAndTrees · 19/04/2013 20:55

Lots of rental contracts state that tenants have to allow access for viewings during the notice period, it really isn't that unusual. Why have you picked up on one poster saying that the LL might have the right when he really might have the right, instead of picking up on the posters that say he has no right when they could be wrong?

ReluctantlyBeingYoniMassaged · 19/04/2013 20:56

He cannot show people around without your permission.

raspberryroop · 19/04/2013 21:03

It doesn't matter what contract the tenant has signed, it cannot overrule the actual legal rights that are set out for tenants in this country. He has no right of entry except for emergencies. The OP has paid her rent till next week its HER house until then with a right top to quiet enjoyment.

The LL is running a business and should allow for some void time between tenants

thecatneuterer · 19/04/2013 21:03

In any case this isn't the legal forum, this is AIBU. We are being asked for our opinion of what is reasonable. I personally think that the OP is being unreasonable, even if they within their legal rights to be so.

raspberryroop · 19/04/2013 21:07

Why ??? Its her house she's paid rent. You don't go to Tescos's and have to share your shopping which is effectively what the landlord is asking her to do/ Op no you ANBU

JudgeJodie · 19/04/2013 21:28

Contract law never overrides statutory law and the tenant has the right to refuse quiet enjoyment.
The ll can only go into the house without permission in an emergency such as gas leak or flood, not to show people around.
I certainly wouldn't be taking time off work to wait in or letting anyone come in whilst I wasn't there. Times that suit me I would consider but tbh the week before moving I would have more on my mind than making sure the house looked ok to have strangers in every room.

JudgeJodie · 19/04/2013 21:29

refuse entry and have quiet enjoyment

nocake · 19/04/2013 21:31

And what is the landlord going to do if they refuse to let him go in? Evict them?

MsVestibule · 19/04/2013 21:34

The first I even knew that our rented home was on the market is when a couple knocked on the door! They'd arranged a viewing with the EA for midday and been told that a MsVestibule would show them round . The EAs and landlord really couldn't see why I had a problem with this, either.

Sorry, completely unhelpful, just thought I'd share.

Hissy · 19/04/2013 21:35

Clouds, erm because I actually do know LL and tenants rights in this regard.

What JudgeJodie said.

OP, try Legal Matters. YOU have ultimate say in who enters.

Google LL right of access, try Landlordzone, this stuff is really basic Tenancy rights stuff.

Derpess · 19/04/2013 21:39

Thanks for all the replies, the contract does say we will permit the LL reasonable access in the last 28 days, I don't think it's reasonable if we have to take time off.

Also we gave over 6 weeks notice and he didn't advertise until 4 weeks had passed - he said he had procrastinated in an email now it's all a mad rush! I think we have been reasonable so far, DH took half day this week and I'm going in to work late on Tuesday as one prospective tenant cannot do any other time than 9am on this day.

Anyway, thanks for responses. I'm trying to be fair and balanced so think will mull it over overnight and send him a diplomatic email tomorrow.

And yes, posted here as wanted to know initially WIBU and also as there's more traffic.

OP posts:

Derpess · 19/04/2013 21:42

Thanks hissy will also google as you suggested.

Ms vestibule - I'd be fuming if that happened!

OP posts:

mateinthree · 19/04/2013 21:48

He just has to give 24 hours notice to enter his property,you cant refuse him it

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. Please don't post such misinformed drivel on this subject again.

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evansthebread · 19/04/2013 21:56

I'm glad you're trying to be fair. There seems to be a lot of "your rights" talk in an aggressive way in some of the posts here.

As a tenant, I wouldn't want anyone wandering around on their own, but as someone who sold a house a while back and couldn't be there for some viewings, I was okay as long as the EA was present - I would never allow someone in completely unattended.

Are you moving to a new home? Did you get viewings at a time you wanted? Your LL is probably anxious to get his property let as soon as possible - who wouldn't be? I'm hoping he'll be as reasonable to you as you're trying to be for him.

Nowt worse than bad karma.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 19/04/2013 21:58

It is correct that he can't insist on access, even with 24hrs notice.

I would write him a letter or an email (best to be formal), making it clear you know your rights and giving him a heads up if he doesn't. Eg:

'Dear LL,

We understand you would like to set up some viewings to the property. Unfortunately, we cannot consent to any viewings while we are not present (as according to the law we have the right to quiet enjoyment of our home, and we would not feel comfortable if we were not there for viewings). We would be happy to set up viewings for times one or other of us is able to be there.

Best,

Tenants'.

That way he knows you know the law and he will check it if he doesn't.

Be bloody sure to take photos at the end of the tenancy though - he can't punish you by evicting you if you're going anyway, but he could be vindictive and try to knock stuff off your deposit. This will be protected so it's not that easy, but photos to show the state of the place will help if he tries anything.

Derpess · 19/04/2013 22:38

Evans... Yes we're moving to a bigger place as I'm pregnant with twins. As I said I think we have been really flexible so far and just took umbrage at his attitude.

LRD thanks for the form of words that's really helpful. We meet him here on our last day to go through inventory etc and I thought if he had any issues about the condition he would be obliged to raise it then. Would he be allowed to say afterwards there was an issue and contest the return of our deposit? You have got me thinking anyway and will take photos to be on the safe side.

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