ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT: This thread hasn't been posted on for a while.
To laugh at the UKIP party political broadcast(168 Posts)
just switched on the news to be confronted by a London cab driver (stating that he does not want foreigners human rights put above those of this country) and token Asian man (business man wanting more support for business not our tax going to Brussels)
could it have been more predictable
on a serious note Nigel Farage should not be written off
Thank you for this thread. As someone who knew little about the UKIP (but wondered if they might be basically BNP in disguise) I had been thinking about actually looking them up.
Lots of information here and great links - looks like the UKIP are actually very like the fundamentalist right in the USA.
What's their policy on things like abortion/contraception?
Oh, I see...it's perfectly fine if the foetus is diagnosed with a disability of some kind.
Sorry, should of looked it up before I asked the question.
I won't for them myself but I can understand why they appeal to people especially in the area around me where white British are technically the minority. I can even sort of see the appeal of nick griffin he comes across as honest I mean no one would pretend to be that much of a vile twat.
What I don't get is people thinking ukip and the bnp are the only options bar the big 3 I'm going to vote for a local independent candidate who lives in my constituency and will actually represent the people they ate supposed to with no curtailing to party policy. If more independents got in it would also make it harder to form another unwanted coalition
UKIP are bloody dangerous. They have a veneer of respectability that the BNP will never have. Their thinly veiled xenephobia hides a vein of disdain for anyone who is not a male WASP.
Their understanding of economics is virtually zero, and their social policies seem to have been dreamed up in a pub. I hold anyone who votes for these xenephobes in as much disdain as I do their leader.
It may well be the case that UKIP have policies that are really objectionable. (As do all parties if perhaps not to the same extent.)
But the truth is what concerns people is immigration. (It is always within the first five concerns in opinion polls.)
People who vote for UKIP do not vote for them on these other issues, (although in the council elections next week many will vote on the issue of HS2)
That is why the three main political parties have altered their position on immigration, they know perfectly well hundreds of thousands of votes could be at stake. And in fact they would not have been forced to change their position if not for the success of UKIP.
Although they are not today and never have been truthful with the electorate.
The prospects of UKIP forming a government are remote to say the least, what people really want is to give the establishment an almighty boot up the backside.
People don't trust any of the big 3 at the moment. They are looking for an alternative and UKIP are willing to jump in and target these people. They are focusing on issues that affect a large portion of the low paid and the disenfranchised.
A lot of people don't follow politics and their only knowledge of what is going on is via tv news and newspapers. So what they see are daily stories about immigrants taking jobs, housing, school places, pushing down wages and that is their view of the world, they aren't bothered about reading around the topic or doing their research about the true impact of immigration, all they know is that the jobs they once traditionally took and could provide for a family for, have gone to immigrants and they feel like the government have screwed them over.
This and the punitive welfare reforms are seriously affecting their lives and they are looking for an alternative, UKIP is speaking their language and that's why they are appealing to them. Its worrying.
Agreed meddie. I have family members who are exactly as you have described.
They have a party platform opposed to same-sex marriage. Not a few religious individuals voting "conscience", a party platform. What does that have to do with "British" people's rights? Unless you think that gay or lesbian couples who would like to stand as next of kin, recognised first-importance people to the people they love, as parents, aren't British. UKIP pick some genuine or genuinely-felt semi-economic points to push a retrograde, misanthropic agenda. Not to say that tedious left- and right-wingers don't to that all the time. Nor that decent left- and right-wingers don't mean well for everyone, just have a vision that other people don't share.
This lot want gay people to be kept out, and separate, as a party position. They are not big-hearted people and they are not in favour of the best outcomes for everyone. They can fuck right off.
I keep reading on MN that they are 'disablist', but can't find anything to back this up. Please could someone provide a link to their policies on this.
The only thing I've found was an article suggesting that they are in favour of re-introducing supported communities, but I assume that's not what people are objecting to?
They are focusing on issues that affect a large portion of the low paid and the disenfranchised.
This is exactly what the BNP do. It's frightening.
I don't think they do have actual policies about disability, Amicissimma. But they may have refused to condemn the remarks made by some of their members that were pretty awful about disability, hang on a minute...
amicissimma they took down from their website the most worrying proposals, those that you have found are in slightly gentler terms.
They have appointed a new disabled policy person...
It is Star Etheridge, she and her husband got suspended and then resigned from the conservatives after posing with golliwogs and then posting the pics on facebook, they are also behind the 'campaign against political correctness' Star is a wheelchair user who refers to herself and other wheelcair users as 'Daleks' amongst other things.
They did have policies about disabililty and SEN education, but they took them down from their website quite recently.
After appointing Star Etheridge, I expect they are making up a whole new set of disability policies at the moment.
Comments of Geoffrey Clark is what has most MNers abuzz. To be fair, UKIP apologised & suspended him from their party (did the media fail to pick on that?)
UKIP takes a hard line about benefit claimants; some would say too unsympathetic (the disabled claim more benefits than other groups).
As a general outlook, UKIP is against things like legislation that prohibits discrimination (on basis of race, gender, etc.) So assume they would like to revoke laws that prohibit discrimination against the disabled, too. The are on record as opposing legislation that requires employers to try to seek cultural diversity in the workplace.
UKIP claims to be party that protects the elderly & disabled (I think their supporters are much older than average, and most the elderly are disabled, so would be foolhardy if they weren't atune to needs of the disabled).
In regard to Gay people, I have always supported them in overcoming oppression.
I do not really understand why they are so keen to support marriage as an institution because in my opinion marriage has historically through out the world mainly been used to pass inherited wealth to the next generation, nearly always to the male first born so keeping women in their place.
As to the idea that UKIP voters should F--k off, the people will make their choice in a democratic election next week.
I said the party could fuck off, not the people who might vote for them. I thought that was clear but sorry if it wasn't.
Not all "Gay" or indeed gay people want to get married. Why should those who do be protected from this evil patriarchal institution by being forbidden to enter into it by law? Don't women deserve this protection? Please try to make sense.
So segregating disabled people into congregate communities is acceptable then?
Oh I should put my kids in care riiiight now...
We are moving onto other issues here, however I have no objection to gay people getting married.
I also accept that people who have religious beliefs should not be made to officiate. (I am an atheist myself.)
There is little doubt that in many areas of the world marriage is still a patriarchal institution, eg Saudi Arabia, and women in the west fought for many generations not for instance to allow their husbands to beat them.
It's the economy. Every time there's a recession, the first handy group of people to take out on are the immigrants. If he has a job and I have a job, no problem. If I don't have a job but he still has a job, wtf, why does that foreigner have that job? I could have that job!
If people in my home country were slathering over their version of UKIP, people here would be laughing at the rednecks and how backward Americans can be. UKIPers just have suits and better accents. They're selling you the same hatred, just in a fancier package. It's very dangerous, and when I see these adverts I'm worried that we've settled over here. It's not a good place to be foreign, and it's only going to get worse before it gets better. (It will follow the economy, basically, and that hasn't hit bottom yet)
Farage is a bigot in sheep's clothing. More dangerous than an obvious, unfriendly-looking bigot IMHO. A charismatic bigot is the worst sort.
I was in Greece not so long ago and got to hear their version of UKIP blithering on about immigrants and jews. Its Europe wide this awfulness.
Farage is a bigot in sheep's clothing
I'd say he was a bigot in 'Man at C&A' clothing.
Quoting you: "I do not really understand why they are so keen to support marriage as an institution because in my opinion marriage has historically through out the world mainly been used to pass inherited wealth to the next generation, nearly always to the male first born so keeping women in their place."
I'm not surprised you don't understand.
It explains why you don't understand a number of things, including why supporting UKIP is wrong.
It's not "wrong" at all. Demonising UKIP just helps to keep the establied parties in power.
If UKIP is the alternative, that's no bad thing at all.
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