measles at nursery

(67 Posts)
innermuddle Thu 11-Apr-13 10:22:56

I'm not sure if I'm being overcautious and justifiably cross or not, so hoping you can set me straight.
My 4 year old attends nursery, and I also have a 3 month old. I have just found out that two children in the nursery have measles. The nursery have not informed parents, i was told by another mother. When i asked the nursery staff, they fobbed me off, being vague and not confirming anything, then said the nursery manager would call me. When she called, she said there was only one case, and the child had not been at nursery while contagious.
This is not the full story, i have now spoken to two mums who both have children with measles, both of whom have informed the nursery. AIBU to be furious that nursery are being so vague & not fully informing parent?
Both children with measles were in a different age range and room to my 4 year old. Am i being overcatious in keeping her away from the nursery? My worry is more about exposing my 3 month old to measles, my 4 year old has been immunised.

narmada Thu 11-Apr-13 13:21:06

what quoteunquote says. I would be furious with the nursery. Measles is a notifiable disease and it is common practice for unvaccinated siblings/ babies to be brought in at collection and drop-off time.

I wonder how the nursery can be sure that the infected child was not there when s/he was contagious? Unless said child was on holiday at the time or something.

nannynick Thu 11-Apr-13 13:35:06

I would expect there tombe a sign on the door once there was a confirmed case.
Incubation period of 2 weeks, with contageous period of around 4 days before rash, means that children can be in nursery and contageous without anyone knowing. Going into an environment with lots of children will expose you to lots of viruses, thus why children starting nursery often become ill.

Other than putting a sign on the door, what would you expect the nursery to do?

MyDarlingClementine Thu 11-Apr-13 14:52:41

people who have an outbreak can you say roughly where you are in the UK? many thanks thanks

LoveWine Thu 11-Apr-13 14:58:46

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

LoveWine Thu 11-Apr-13 15:00:48

Ugh I posted to the wrong thread...how do I delete my message??

CSIJanner Thu 11-Apr-13 15:41:03

lovewine report your post for admin to delete.

A horrified that they've filmed flamed on letting people know, especially if it happened over Easter. I would have at least expected a notice on the door warning that some of the children were confirmed wit measles over the Easter holiday and there's a 2 week incubation period.

nametakenagain Thu 11-Apr-13 18:28:48

OP, please come back and tell us the full story when you've found it out

ChairmanWow Thu 11-Apr-13 18:46:02

clementine I'd be interested to know too. I'm in Manchester. I read about quite a large outbreak in South Wales recently.

MyDarlingClementine Thu 11-Apr-13 19:32:26

Thanks Chairman,

I heard its spreading, gone to north east as well?

I would be interested to know from here who is reporting out breaks.

exoticfruits Thu 11-Apr-13 20:18:38

I heard today that there are lots of cases all over the country- not just Swansea.

DuelingFanjo Thu 11-Apr-13 20:22:01

They shouldn't have misled you but why would the be worried about an empty nursery, they get paid regardless don't they?

meditrina Thu 11-Apr-13 20:27:15

YABU

There are fixed, absolutely fixed, procedures for handling outbreaks of contagious diseases at nurseries (or indeed other settings) and the managers have no discretion to act until a case is laboratory confirmed at which point they will notify in exactly the way proscribed by the HPA.

Groovee Thu 11-Apr-13 20:29:25

When I worked in the private nursery, (back in the 90's) we informed parents of a measles and mumps outbreak. Both happened on Christmas day and we found out a few days after. The Owner was away, so we contacted the Manager at the other nursery and she got in touch with enviromental health who gave guidance and she came and informed each member of staff and notices on the door of what to say. Both children had been fully immunised.

We only had one parent who caused a scene and she shot herself in the foot as her main argument was "Why do you allow children who haven't been immunised into nursery!" Turns out she hadn't had her child immunised confused.

But they should keep you in the loop and if not, I would take it further with who ever inspects them.

innermuddle Thu 11-Apr-13 20:31:35

Second attempt to update you, lost mtmy last massive post..grr! Have been busy all day, apologies for disappearing!
Had numerous conversations with nursery manager, will try to be brief with full update.
There are 2 children in nursery who have had measles, both been hospitalized. Child 1 was ill over Easter, and was probably away from nursery when contagious. Child 2 is currently ill, in hospital since Monday, last at nursery Thursday, so possibly was in nursery while contagious. Both sets of parents informed nursery at time. Child 2's parents were told a notice had been put up telling other parents (not true though). I know this from speaking to parents.
The nursery manager initially said there were 2 unconfirmed cases. In our final conversation she said one case has been confirmed, but I don't know which. Nursery manager (NM) said the nursery were waiting for the health protection agency to contact them to advise on when to inform parents & what to say. NM also said the HPA advised her not to tell parents until the cases were confirmed, to avoid scaremongering. The nursery have now (this evening) put out a memo to parents from the HPA. I have not seen this, because we have not been to nursery, but NM told me & so did other parents.
So, it seems nursery were aware at Easter that a child was hospitalized & treated for measles, but it seemed unlikely that the child had been at nursery while contagious. A second child was hospitalized & treated for measles on Monday, & in this case there was some reason to suspect the child may have attended while contagious. Their response to this was to do nothing, but hait for contact &advice from HPA. When a parent asked about the measles cases (me) they denied it & then contacted the HPA, finally informing parents on Thursday evening.
I should point out both cases are children in the baby room, baby room is all under 20month, many will not have been vaccinated yet.
I think they should have put out the waning of suspected measles, with info about symptoms to look out for on Monday or Tuesday.
To be clear, o don't think my children are at risk particularly, but have grave concerns about the nurseries handling of this, and am seriously considering removing my child & reporting nursery to ofsted.
Anyone with any experience of HPA? Are they likely to have advised withholding info?

OneLittleToddleTerror Thu 11-Apr-13 20:31:35

OP you aren't being too precious. I assume your 4yo has only one MMR jab? That makes your toddler about 90% (or is it 95%) immune. After the booster they get just before starting school, it will be 99% immunity.

innermuddle Thu 11-Apr-13 20:32:18

Clementine, we are in west yorks.

innermuddle Thu 11-Apr-13 20:38:17

Meditrina, that is good to know. I've worked myself up about this & was starting to think the nursery manager was not being honest. So she probably was told not to tell parents until it was confirmed.
Is confirmation different to diagnosis? Confused about both children having treatment but not confirmation? ?

bumbleymummy Thu 11-Apr-13 20:38:37

OLTT, it's not that an individual child has a certain percentage of immunity - it's that 90% of children who are given the first jab will have full immunity ie. it will be effective in 90% of children. The booster is to catch the 10% that aren't immune after the first one. So after 2 injections 99% of children should be immune. There are still cases in children who have been fully vaccinated though as well as some 'measles-like viruses' hmm so it may not be quite as effective as that.

Tanyaaah Thu 11-Apr-13 20:39:12

Please can you tell me where in W. Yorks, I'm worried now!

OneLittleToddleTerror Thu 11-Apr-13 20:40:30

bumble that's what I meant. Probably didn't come through well from my post. 90% will develop an immunity via the vaccine. I think it's like from the real sickness isn't it? I know for example, you might not develop a chicken pox immunity even if you have got it previously. That's why we hear about children who got it twice.

bumbleymummy Thu 11-Apr-13 20:44:34

A higher percentage will have immunity after catching it naturally, same with chickenpox. Very few people will contract CP twice and even fewer will contract measles twice.

dribbleface Thu 11-Apr-13 20:50:51

Standard procedure is to inform Hpa and await their guidance, however I was thinking about this the other day and as a nursery manager I would prewarn about suspected measles. As a parent I would want to know. However if nursery have indeed just followed how advice reporting to Ofsted will be pointless.

orangepudding Thu 11-Apr-13 20:56:50

Two of my children and I had measles a few years ago. The Dr was sure that's what it was bit still be had to wait a few days for the testing kit to arrive from the HPA and then a couple of weeks for the test results for it to be confirmed.
Even if that is still the way it works there should have been a notice stating there were cases of suspected measles, look out for the following symptoms.

Altinkum Thu 11-Apr-13 21:02:31

Measels should be reported, to the authority and the parents.

If a child has chicken pox, etc then the parent does not need to know who the child is, as the child was already contagious 10 days prior to the spots coming out, same as a child being sick parents do not need to be notified as it may be simply the child's lunch does not agree with them, they may have a bug, but that's part and parcel of nursery surroundings.

dribbleface Thu 11-Apr-13 21:18:03

Ndna (national day nurseries association) say to inform parents of confirmed cases, issues then arise as a parent you would want to know so you can make informed choices, but cases may not be confirmed. I would inform of suspected cases but wouldn't have to until confirmed

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