to be surprised by how many women don't seem to realise that we are conditioned to think certain looks are attractive?

(228 Posts)

Inspired by a few recent threads.

High heels.
Exposed cleavage.
Cinched waists.
Exposed legs (in skirts or tight trousers).
Tight/skimming clothing.
Lipstick.
Eyeliner.
Hairless legs/armpits.

All these are in order to attract heterosexual males. Dress like it if you want to (I certainly feel I look better if I utilise a few of the above) but don't fool yourself that it has nothing to do with socialisation.

I'm sure someone else can put it far more eloquently but I needed to let this out before I have another argument with a friend!

FobblyWoof Tue 22-Jan-13 20:39:23

YANBU.

At all

FlouncingMintyy Tue 22-Jan-13 20:41:20

What does she think then? What is her argument?

DrCoconut Tue 22-Jan-13 20:41:43

Definitely true. If you look at how the ideal woman or indeed an has changed over the years it is definitely social/fashion rather than nature.

goingsgood Tue 22-Jan-13 20:42:11

How do you know they fool themselves?

FabulousFreaks Tue 22-Jan-13 20:42:52

It blows my mind that some people don't grasp this and never question it.

My friend argues that she dresses for herself because she thinks it looks good. She disagrees that she thinks it looks good because we're conditioned to think so; she thinks that 'it just looks better'.

I get quite frustrated with her sometimes.

Ragwort Tue 22-Jan-13 20:45:40

confused - what are you trying to say, you don't approve of this way of dressing but you do it anyway - errr ................. what is your point?

FWIW I have never embraced any of the above but never seemed to have a problem 'attracting' heterosexual males <when I wanted to> grin

GothAnneGeddes Tue 22-Jan-13 20:45:43

Bring race into and then see people fail to understand why they think Beyonce is considered more attractive then Alex Wek.

Clue: social constructs.

CloudsAndTrees Tue 22-Jan-13 20:46:10

What makes you think they don't know? I realise that I am conditioned to think certain things are attractive, and that other things are unattractive, but I don't care.

If I lived in another time and another place, I may well think that hairy armpits and fat to the point of having no shape is the prettiest way to be. But I live here and now so social conditioning or not, I like what I like. I don't see that it matters why.

Not at all Ragwort! It just surprises me how many women don't seem to realise why they think certain things make them look more attractive or better.

BeanJuice Tue 22-Jan-13 20:47:45

I know what you mean grin

People are like "I'm not influenced by society - I do it because I like it!"

Anyone who thinks they aren't influenced by society in any way is deluded

Ragwort Tue 22-Jan-13 20:48:20

Did anyone just see that programme on the 'Really' channel or something like that about peoples' attitude to money - there were some girls dressed up with the sole intention of attracting footballers or other 'rich' men, it was hideous. sad

I wouldn't have such low self esteem if these social constraints hadn't been thrust everywhere when I was in my teens.

YANBU.

cantspel Tue 22-Jan-13 20:50:45

And how is it different for men?

You dont find many short, fat balding men with an overdose of builders bum on show being called attractive either.

Chunderella Tue 22-Jan-13 20:52:40

YANBU.

I'd go to the wall for any woman's right to do whatever she wants with her body, which includes the way she dresses it. But call it what it is. I like wearing mascara, I didn't organically come up with the idea myself with no influence from wider society. I find it hard to believe that any of the millions of other British women who like wearing mascara did, either.

Regarding the body hair, you're going to get posters telling you that lots of cultures see it as unclean for both men and women, which is true, and saying that means it isn't a gender thing here, which isn't. If all of us who remove body hair were doing so because we're influenced by Middle Eastern culture, they'd be right. We're not- that isn't why I do it- so they aren't.

goingsgood Tue 22-Jan-13 20:52:58

Don't men have a more narrow choice of how to dress than women do?

goingsgood Tue 22-Jan-13 20:53:33

In terms of what is socially acceptable

All different people think all different looks are attractive, and lots of women have a look that they prefer.

Why is it 'conditioning' if someone thinks that look is attractive but not when they prefer to be/to like lots of tattoos or tracksuits and trainers and no makeup or any other of the millions of different looks there are?

I never really conformed to the look that you describe above and I never had any problems attracting anyone.

Missy I'm not saying that you can't attract a man unless you dress this way. I'm saying that women who dress this way are (often unconsciously) doing it because it conforms to what we are conditioned to believe most men find attractive.

Procrastinating Tue 22-Jan-13 20:58:05

YANBU.
It surprises me too.

TheDoctrineOfSnatch Tue 22-Jan-13 21:01:20

YANBU.

ICBINEG Tue 22-Jan-13 21:03:55

YAsoooNBU.

I can just imagine some of the "but I just happen to like high heels" gang walking round the national portrait gallery all "wtf with all the pictures of uggos?".

So if a woman dresses that way its conditioning, she can't possibly think it looks nicer? So what about the women who don't dress that way? Are they not subject to the same adverts/magazines/tv/other influences that everyone else is?

Missy my point is that some women don't seem to understand why they think it looks nicer. Like my friend.

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